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Thread: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

  1. #821

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    I don't understand. Relic of Progenitus is a good card in what situations? I have replaced it with a Faerie Macabre, that is tutorable on turn 1 with Imperial Recruiter.
    For me personally, I had Grafdigger's Cage in the board as an additional tool for Storm, but I've since cut it because of Goblin Engineer. There's a little more dependency on the graveyard, and even though it's a sideboard slot, I still have doubts about it. I think a pair of Extractions with a Crypt is fine; Welder and Engineer can recur it, and Karn and Tutor can find it (if it's brought in).
    The Night HE Came Home.

  2. #822
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    I don't understand. Relic of Progenitus is a good card in what situations? I have replaced it with a Faerie Macabre, that is tutorable on turn 1 with Imperial Recruiter.
    If I were going to replace one of the current graveyard cards with a macabre, it would probably be a surgical; not a relic. I understand the desire to be able to tutor for a graveyard hater with recruiter, but you do really want two artifact hate cards so that you can keep one in the board for karn to fetch and bring one into the deck for e.tutor and engineer to fetch. Relic is good against certain strategies where they are depending on a critical mass of cards in the graveyard such as gurmag, snapcaster and dreadhorde as well as the whole dredge deck. It is also nice because you can exile one of your own cards to fetch with karn or to dodge an opponent's surgical.

    Personally, I do think one could make an argument for Grafdigger's Cage as a replacement to relic. The benefit being that it does a better job of shutting off dreadhorde and snapcaster and has value against elves and other green sun decks. Then again, relic is way better against lands. Cage can sometimes get in the way of our own welder effects.

  3. #823
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    @Scott- HAHA sorry, yeah I was just confused there. the list is fairly well tuned at this point. I figure we might have a few adjustments as teh meta works itself out, but in general it is rounding up nicely. I wanted to post it on here, as I want to get the next version of the primer, but I am slow at that shit.

    @Lands- I have not found teh match up to be that difficult. I would def rate it is favorable for us, both the depth and teh RG variants. Blood Moon id ok here, but Karn and the rest are really strong. Having Copter to attack their life while you assemble the combo o go for Karn makes it hard for them as they are not built to fight on two fronts.

    @Gravehate- Initially we ere on 1 Crypt, 1 Relic, and 2 Surgical. In general this felt great, but tehre were times when a second turn Karn getting and resolving Gravehate would be something that could have won a game. Against fast decks you really want teh Crypt main so that you can easily get it with E tutor. This forced us to consider adding an additional Crypt to the board. Now the plan is bring in the 1 Crypt, 1 Relic, and 2 surgical and leave the 1 Crypt in the board. This has worked ok I think. Of note we are basically not doing this to address BR Reanimator. Jack and I are of teh mind that we are just so bad there that giving up space to fight it better isnt worth it at this time. You can beat it with the current list, it is just unfavorable. I would not add the Macabra in place of a Surgical. While the both are turn zero plays the big thing Surgical does is allow you to remove shit like FoW or STP from the game whihc can be back breaking against Miracles, Stoneblade, and other decks.

    @Relic- It is generally just a good value spell. Yes Crypt is faster, but relic has more utility. Many times you just need to grind out a position in a game. Relic allows for this. It exiles your yard and itself to make Karn loops a real thing. It replaces itself which actually allows you te get ahead of your opponent while disrupting them. So while it isnt the fastest or most elegant solution to graveyards, it has really nice utility with the way we have built the deck. Just for its ability to exile our yard and itself is worth playing as it creates a round about way for Karn to get Painter. Hopefully this helps and clears ups why it is really a spell you need to have access to.

    Seth
    …no matter how much you think you love somebody, you’ll step back when the pool of their blood edges up too close.

  4. #824

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by sroncor1 View Post
    @Gravehate- Initially we ere on 1 Crypt, 1 Relic, and 2 Surgical. In general this felt great, but tehre were times when a second turn Karn getting and resolving Gravehate would be something that could have won a game. Against fast decks you really want teh Crypt main so that you can easily get it with E tutor. This forced us to consider adding an additional Crypt to the board. Now the plan is bring in the 1 Crypt, 1 Relic, and 2 surgical and leave the 1 Crypt in the board. This has worked ok I think. Of note we are basically not doing this to address BR Reanimator. Jack and I are of teh mind that we are just so bad there that giving up space to fight it better isnt worth it at this time. You can beat it with the current list, it is just unfavorable. I would not add the Macabra in place of a Surgical. While the both are turn zero plays the big thing Surgical does is allow you to remove shit like FoW or STP from the game whihc can be back breaking against Miracles, Stoneblade, and other decks.

    @Relic- It is generally just a good value spell. Yes Crypt is faster, but relic has more utility. Many times you just need to grind out a position in a game. Relic allows for this. It exiles your yard and itself to make Karn loops a real thing. It replaces itself which actually allows you te get ahead of your opponent while disrupting them. So while it isnt the fastest or most elegant solution to graveyards, it has really nice utility with the way we have built the deck. Just for its ability to exile our yard and itself is worth playing as it creates a round about way for Karn to get Painter. Hopefully this helps and clears ups why it is really a spell you need to have access to.

    Seth
    If you need a second grave hate during the same game, we have also Goblin Engineer to increase the possibility to do so, after the first Tormod's Crypt.

  5. #825
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    @ Alex- I can not tell if you are just trolling with that comment or trying to share an insight. The need to get a second grave yard interaction wasn't any part of the reason why the card should be in the board. It does help that Karn by himself can destroy graveyards without the need of Welder effects, but that was not what I was talking with Karn loops. By using Relic you can exile all your already used artifacts, this allows for added utility with Karn which helps to get Painters, Bridges, and Ballistas back from the yard for either the times you don't have a welder or bc welder doesn't work the cards (Ballista). You are free to run whatever cards in the board that you want, I mearly shared my list and tried to give my reasons.

    Seth
    …no matter how much you think you love somebody, you’ll step back when the pool of their blood edges up too close.

  6. #826

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by sroncor1 View Post
    @ Alex- I can not tell if you are just trolling with that comment or trying to share an insight. The need to get a second grave yard interaction wasn't any part of the reason why the card should be in the board. It does help that Karn by himself can destroy graveyards without the need of Welder effects, but that was not what I was talking with Karn loops. By using Relic you can exile all your already used artifacts, this allows for added utility with Karn which helps to get Painters, Bridges, and Ballistas back from the yard for either the times you don't have a welder or bc welder doesn't work the cards (Ballista). You are free to run whatever cards in the board that you want, I mearly shared my list and tried to give my reasons.

    Seth
    I was serious, but I think that the approach of using so much times the second ability of Karn, the Great Creator is too slow to make Relic of Progenitus whorty of a spot in the sideboard. I think that a turn 1 tutorable Faerie Macare helps with some bad match-ups, but it depends on metagames.
    Grafidgger's Cage is just terrible with Goblin Welder and Goblin Engineer.

  7. #827
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    I was serious, but I think that the approach of using so much times the second ability of Karn, the Great Creator is too slow to make Relic of Progenitus whorty of a spot in the sideboard. I think that a turn 1 tutorable Faerie Macare helps with some bad match-ups, but it depends on metagames.
    Grafidgger's Cage is just terrible with Goblin Welder and Goblin Engineer.
    Are you taking about playing a turn 1 recruiter too get macabre? Because that's a corner case at best. You are basically taking about a 3 cards combo turn 1 to remove two cards from the graveyard. Not impossible but probably not more likely than just tutoring for relic to use on turn 2. Cage isn't that terrible as you can just weeks or the cage if you need a creature from the yard. I would assume the creature would be a painter to just win but sometimes it can be awkward.

  8. #828

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    Are you taking about playing a turn 1 recruiter too get macabre? Because that's a corner case at best. You are basically taking about a 3 cards combo turn 1 to remove two cards from the graveyard. Not impossible but probably not more likely than just tutoring for relic to use on turn 2.
    Maybe it's little less a corner case with the new mulligan rule, and you can anyway tutor a Faerie Macabre on turn 2. I think that Faerie Macabre is a very good card to evaluate in a deck that can make a recruiter on turn 1 or 2, furthermore sometimes is unexpected and nearly impossibile to counter.


    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    Cage isn't that terrible as you can just weeks or the cage if you need a creature from the yard. I would assume the creature would be a painter to just win but sometimes it can be awkward.
    Grafdigger's Cage is more synergistic with Goblin Engineer, because it requires to sacrifice an artifact before the switch, but a card like that sounds more like a metagame choice than a "stable" sideboard card.


    Quote Originally Posted by sroncor1 View Post
    Cratermaker is still there Bc he has upside. He still kills things on demand, can remove troublesome artifacts and serves as an answer to opposing Karn. We initially tried to cut him but in the end that utility was just something we need.
    Regarding Goblin Cratermaker, with Painter's Servant on the board, it can't destroy opponent's Karn, artifacts or Eldrazi. Yes, it can destroy an annoying creature, so most likely I will continue to test it, but seems that hasn't a good synergy with the deck, like Grafidgger's Cage.
    Last edited by Alex_UNLIMITED; 06-18-2019 at 11:00 AM.

  9. #829
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    @Cratermaker- Yes I understand that he doesnt work as well with Painter on the table but that is ok. His ability to kill colorless things is very helpful. With the increase in Welders in the deck you can also work to control if Painter is on the table. It isnt perfect, but its good enough I think and likely the most versitile options we have.

    @ Faerie Macabre- Maybe getting to tutor it on turn two is ok, but BR reanimator is usually too fast and can easily reset especially when you see all the resources you use to do that. It also has little to no effect on Show and Tell and Dredge, not to mention little to no value against Snapcaster lists. I dont think you should waste time and space with the card.

    @Relic- I am still not understanding what your question about the card is. We are not using it as a Karn target against graveyard decks. You would tutor it against Miracles, Lands, and Grixis game one in some situations. Against decks like Dredge, Reanimator, and opps no lands you would board it in as its viable to play turn one. In those situations, you leave one of the Crypts in the board to allow for speedy interaction and maximum utility with our tutors.

    Seth
    …no matter how much you think you love somebody, you’ll step back when the pool of their blood edges up too close.

  10. #830

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Hey guys,

    With the new cards and the rejuvenation of the deck, I am back. The SDT ban coincided with my divorce and the years of instability that ensue, being a single dad (and now primary carer) grinding out games at the LGS was not something I could do and not feel selfish. And now the new cards are out and I am stable again and hitting the LGS is an option my partner is happy to indulge, better than going out for drinks with the boys!!!

    So, firstly, I want to thank you guys for keeping it alive. Truly watching the deck's tribulations over the last few years looked tough. It gave me an out when I did get time to talk to my old legacy friends but I felt for you guys seeing the deck I had grown to love fall so hard.

    I am now assembling the cards for the deck, which is a little harder than normal as the deck is a painter tribute with all cards unique, signed, miscut, altered etc. I have posted it before but picking up new cards has always been tough. But they are on their way from around the world and I can't wait!!! I am fish bowling with proxies ftm.

    Any tips you guys have for getting back into it would be great. It seems that whilst the deck was complex before, it is levelling up and having only played edh since SDT, I am kind of worried about getting up to legacy standard and not making some common misplays... My last result was a good one and that was the last time I played. Hoping to get back into things and not make a complete fool of myself.

    Looking forward to contribute where I can and participating in the community again.

  11. #831
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Good to see you back homie. The deck is probably even more powerful than before so I'm sure you'll love the new lists. Biggest tip is just start jamming games.

    Your signed welder also continues to put in work. Got me the match winning weld against grixis in the starcity top 8.
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

  12. #832

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Hey Jack,

    Thanks for the advice, and love how the new list is shaping up. Are you twitching?

    Good to hear the welder is doing well! One of my proudest geek moments is seeing it hit the table against Dan Musser, not something you brag to your tinder date about though!!!

    I still have that signed grindstone (not in silver ) if you want it. Let me know and I'll post it to you.

  13. #833
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    New fixed lotus value good enough? It's a nonbo with blood moon though, but it's great with blood sun
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  14. #834
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    New fixed lotus value good enough? It's a nonbo with blood moon though, but it's great with blood sun

    I don't think this deck can utilize it well, being currently very light on moon effects, it would be better like you say in a blood sun-centered deck. I think Imperial painter would be closer to running blood suns. It actually may be worth testing the card again, in some unknown deck that wants it, since basic land heavy decks have gained popularity and blood sun actually messes with them.

    A disadvantage of the land is that it requires two other lands in play, if you've been wastelanded or just have a land-light starting hand that can be difficult. Cip tapped is too slow. It's pretty nice that it allows you to cash in a city of traitors that'd be sacrificed to itself otherwise and city also synergizes with blood sun.. Maybe there's enough to play with that..

  15. #835
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    BEHOLD!!! THE POWER OF TANGLE WIRE!!! :)

    https://youtu.be/5ezCFzdF-CY

  16. #836

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    BEHOLD!!! THE POWER OF TANGLE WIRE!!! :)

    https://youtu.be/5ezCFzdF-CY
    Lol! Beheld!!!!

    Was a pretty nuts draw but must have hurt to be on the other side of it. Welder is so underestimated by opponents.

  17. #837

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    I snagged one for funsies. Tangle Wire in an Engineer/Welder shell seems fun.
    The Night HE Came Home.

  18. #838

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Went 3-0 in an 8-man tonight with Engineer/Welder.

    2-0: vs. Burn
    2-0: vs. Lands
    2-1: vs. RUG Delver

    Pretty standard stuff - four Karn, LED was awesome, still locked in to Coating (awesome with Engineer - made City an artifact with the sacrifice trigger on the stack and sacrificed it to Engineer).

    LED was good, I ran one.
    The Night HE Came Home.

  19. #839

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Keller View Post
    Went 3-0 in an 8-man tonight with Engineer/Welder.

    2-0: vs. Burn
    2-0: vs. Lands
    2-1: vs. RUG Delver

    Pretty standard stuff - four Karn, LED was awesome, still locked in to Coating (awesome with Engineer - made City an artifact with the sacrifice trigger on the stack and sacrificed it to Engineer).

    LED was good, I ran one.
    What was your actual list? I’m trying to find space for the led, engineers, karns, and coatings. So far, I have 2 coatings main, but I’m on 62 cards. Dunno what to cut. I’m edging on going down to 1 canonist, but no idea what else to cut.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Legacy decks: mono U painter, strawberry shortcake, imperial painter, solidarity, burn
    EDH decks: zedruu voltron, rakdos the defiler, persistent petitioners, blind seer

  20. #840
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Played actual shortcake and not imperial painter at our local quarterly big team event. Went 3-2 with pretty much Capn Cooks updated list from his report.

    Lost to UR Delver
    Beat UW Stoneblade
    Beat UW Stoneblade
    Lost to Maverick
    Beat Grixis Control

    First time playing actual shortcake and I don't think I love it personally after 5 games (obviously small sample size). The one time I cast my one blood moon it was really good. ETutor was fine nothing special for me.
    Welder over performed. Seriously debating a 4th if I play shortcake again.
    Engineer was fine. I don't think I ever actually activated it, but there were times when it threatened to win the game if I had just drawn another artifact.
    I don't think I cast a Karn all day. Just never drew them and when I did I already had combo assembled.
    Canonist was generally alright. I see the appeal.
    After a while 5 rounds of playing my first thought is that maybe we have too many Tutors? Like I said, Everytime I drew Karn I already was doing what I needed to be doing. I think for now I'm personally going back to imperial since with recruiter, engineer, and Karn I think there's enough there. Canonist really helped against Grixis though. Hell of a fun deck though Jack. People were flocking to see what was going on and my teammates couldn't help me because they no idea what I was doing
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

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