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Thread: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

  1. #1

    Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    I played a version of this last Tuesday going 2-2 but want to change a lot of it. I included a pattern of rebirth package and it's been pointed out that I have an unhealthy relationship with 4 drops. The core of the deck is using entomb to either get death's shadow and make a big varolz (or other creature as giving something with evasion +13/+13 seems good too), just entomb and reanimate a fatty, or use entomb for utility like with cabal therapy. An important note is that entombing something and immediately scavenging it doesn't allow death rite shaman to interact with it. So the only card that drs can stop in the list should be reanimate.

    The core of the deck is below, but I'm torn on how to fill out the rest of the deck. I know I don't want to play cards besides reanimate that can be stopped by drs, and I want to avoid cards that are dead on their on like phyrexian dreadnought.

    Core:
    4 deathrite shaman
    3 varolz, the scar-striped
    4 death's shadow
    4 entomb
    4 reanimate
    1 cabal therapy (entomb target)
    2 fatty (some entomb/reanimate that can ideally be hard casted realistically like spiritmonger or grave titan)

    I'm going to try out some version tomorrow at pub fun legacy testing. Thoughts?

    Ideas I've had to fill out the deck:

    Interaction - abrupt decay/thoughtseize/fatal push/collective brutality?

    Red - vexing devil plays well with varolz and lightning bolt is pretty good

    Other creatures: Having only death's shadow to work with varolz isn't great. Tarmogoyf is the obvious choice as it retains its p/t in the yard but I don't have any . So this might take some creativity...steel leef champion seems interesting but tough on the mana base. Eternal scourge has an interesting interaction with varolz and entomb but it's bad without varolz.

    Evasion - Varolz can scavenge onto flyers or other evasion creatures. Berserk could work too.

    Non varolz friendly threats: Bitterblossom provides another angle of attack, pumps death's shadow, creatures to scavenge onto with evasion, and protects varolz from sac effects or non white removal (varolz can regenerate). Big fish or tombstalker. Green sun zenith package plus natural order is possible, though again I'm trying to avoid 4 drops.

    Card selection/filtering: Grisly salvage or green sun zenith?

  2. #2
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    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    When varolz was spoiled I had built a BUG stiflenought list that I played in a few tournaments. I dislike playing bad cards to make other cards playable, especially when it can be avoided. Deaths shadow, unless built around for example, is just a bad pump spell that requires varolz. Having blue access lets you play like a tempo deck, so that's a good place to start. You just need to protect a single play and it can get there. That was the idea behind stiflenought. It gave me a backup plan in varolz and allowed me to use stifles aggressively.

    I think I have that list somewhere if you would like to see it.
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  3. #3

    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    Quote Originally Posted by Weapon X View Post
    I think I have that list somewhere if you would like to see it.
    Yeah thanks.

  4. #4
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    Lunchables

    Here is my "Lunchables" list


    3 varolz, the scar striped
    2 trinket mage
    4 tarmogoyf
    4 augur of bolas
    4 deathrite shaman
    4 stifle
    2 trickbind
    4 phyrexian dreadnought
    4 force of will
    3 spell pierce
    4 brainstorm
    3 abrupt decay

    4 polluted delta
    3 underground sea
    2 verdant catacombs
    2 bayou
    2 misty rainforest
    2 tropical island
    2 island
    1 forest
    1 swamp


    I want to say this is around 4 years old of a list. The forums I posted it to should have it labeled as lunchables. It did perform well but there have been a host of new cards since I played it. As a skeleton I think it's on the right track
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    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    Ralf has a deck with deaths shadow and cruel bargain. It's a good way to refill your hand and make death shadow more of a threat.
    -rob

  6. #6

    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    Ralf has a deck with deaths shadow and cruel bargain. It's a good way to refill your hand and make death shadow more of a threat.
    Interesting, I might pick up bargains and try that.

    I tried the list below, it was OK...split games with food chain lands and pox. Miracles was rough. I'd cut the asylum visitor and a therapy for the second sylvan library and something. The reanimate package boarded out nicely for the NO one.

    4 Drs
    3 Varolz
    3 deaths shadow
    4 entomb
    4 reanimate
    3 cabal therapy
    4 thoughtseize
    2 bitterblossom
    2 abyssal persecutor
    1 grave titan
    1 drana kalastria blood chief (I don't own spirit monger it seems)
    3 abrupt decay
    1 sylvan library
    2 berserk
    1 asylum visitor
    1 tombstalker

    4 verdant catacombs
    1 Windswept Heath
    3 marsh flats
    2 overgrown tomb
    5 swamp
    1 forest
    1 phyrexian tower
    1 dryad arbor
    3 Llanowar Wastes

    SB:
    4 Leyline of the Void
    3 natural order
    1 terrastodon
    1 ruric thar
    2 Green Sun's Zenith
    1 xantid swarm
    1 carpet of flowers
    1 sylvan library
    1 choke

  7. #7

    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    Ralf has a deck with deaths shadow and cruel bargain. It's a good way to refill your hand and make death shadow more of a threat.
    I played Ralf's deck some time ago, very cool and fun deck, although more of a control deck than an aggro deck. Also played Soul Spike.

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    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    @Weapon X your list kind of just takes Dreadnought and Stifle and injects some blue into a Black/Green shell. While the deck has Dreadnoughts in it, it isn't a Dreadnought deck (no specialized tools). This becomes quickly apparent when we go Dreadnought swapped to Death's Shadow, Stifle to Thoughtseize, and start cutting extraneous blue cards as we build around [probably] 3 copies of Sylvan Library...keep going and we're adding P-Fire/Grove by the time the last blue card is cut and we're on what is probably bad Jund with some scavenge. Jund in turn is bad Shardless, and Shardless is bad Czech Pile.

    As a general Stiflenought rule, if you see Abrupt Decay in a deck then it shouldn't have Dreadnought in it. It is possible to do, but Decay has to play like Entomb (which means you are stealing creatures with Reanimate). Still, this is a pretty questionable choice to as you'd be destroying your mana base away from blue, which is really the color you need to do (and support) the whole Dreadnought thing. The real key there though is that Decay kills a guy, gives you a guy [Reanimate], and then opponent has to discard a removal spell. It's actually quite hard to extract ~2-3 cards worth of, largely indirect, value out of scenarios like this...at this point you'd probably need a delve creature followup to begin justifying that sequence. If you ever have an opponent who isn't really running creatures and isn't doing "A then B then C" Decay'able combo, then Abrupt Decay's card in hand penalty is why you can't reliably enact Dreadnought plan to any effect. I get the whole backup idea of Varolz, but this is a card that gets worse in multiples and you're either getting your Dreadnought StP'd to exile or the opponent is sitting behind DRS eating Dreadnought with a wall of SCM/removal spells. Before you've sat at the table you're favored to lose against the most prevalent fair deck removal strategies; adding in Dreadnought tips the match even further in the opponents' favor. As a side note, don't play Stifle without Wasteland; this is a primary form of interaction in Dreadnought decks.

    @kinda there are significant problems with the toolbox Entomb deck and the main one is enemy DRS, specifically the 2 toughness. Yes DRS will impede everything you do, but the bigger issue is that you kinda have to kill the DRS; which means you're adding cards opposed to just about everything you're trying to do with Entomb. In terms of the fun stuff, right after Grisel/Reanimate you have Darkblast (this allows you to play Tasigur rather than Gurmag/Tombstalker), Vengeful Pharaoh/Predict, Cabal Pit/Loam, Jace, Vryn's Prodigy/Shallow Grave (bonus points if you return Gin Gitaxias on their end step), Dakmor Salvage (really interesting with JVP and clearing Brainstorm lock, also Stax-style effects), Bloodghast, and if you're ambitious you can roll legacy knights with Haakon, Stromgald Scourge/Nameless Inversion (notice how it kills Haakon to protect from exile/Terminus/bounce) + Court Hussar + Cavern of Souls + pro-white pump knights to adress the whole bad vs Tundra issue. The best planeswalker for such strategies is Liliana, the Last Hope.

    As long as DRS is legal, you kind of need to control his modes with Wasteland. You're probably going to need access to 2-3 sideboard Dread of Night. At all points I'd rather have Skill Borrower, Volrath's Shapeshifter, or even boring old Leovold before running a single Varolz. Whatever you plan on doing to get to the mid-game, it has to plug the holes made by DRS, JVP, and Grisel which I'd consider core strategy (unless you're trolling with knights + Sinkhole; another strategy where JVP is a must include). A possible approach to reaching the mid-game could be incorporating Punishing Fire/Grove/Dack. After solving this mid-game problem would be the first time you should be looking at whether or not Death's Shadow could find a home there; that said, reanimator strategies are more complimented by Dreadnought tech than 1-for-1 normal Shadow magic.

    If you're just looking to add a little of the Entomb stuff to a deck (i.e. non-Grisel), I'd look at either Zombardment or making room for 2x Entomb, 1x Darkblast, 1x Loam, and 1x Vengeful Pharaoh to UBg Standstill.

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    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    @fox sorry I'm not following your rambling. I will reiterate that that list is close to 4 years old again. Counter top was played heavily and decay gives a removal spell for easily 80% of cards.
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  10. #10

    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    I'm playing a B/g Entomb-deck as well, maybe you'll find this interesting.

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?32246-Vigor-Mortis



    Red would give you Faithless Looting, which certainly could be a thing. Especially with Anger. Also makes Punishing Grove -combo very tempting.

    Generally I have doubts about Varolz being Legacy-playable. (Have plans for it in Modern, though.) Pairing it with Death's Shadow is probably your best bet however. I wish you luck with this!

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    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    Quote Originally Posted by Weapon X View Post
    @fox sorry I'm not following your rambling. I will reiterate that that list is close to 4 years old again. Counter top was played heavily and decay gives a removal spell for easily 80% of cards.
    The brief synopsis is that your list is using Dreadnought as a Death's Shadow, except unlike Shadow you're playing 1-for-1 magic with a built in [self] 2-for-1. The deck as submitted is trying to lose to itself because it added Dreadnoughts but does not have adequate build-around. At the same time your list self-sabotages with Decay's inclusion and the failure to combine Wasteland with Stifle.

    The only trick is the back-end Varolz scavenge, and that's just not really good enough for legacy, then or now (playing multiple copies exacerbates this problem). Your deck did however have DRS and Goyf so it's still bound to win an amount of games; then vs combo sometimes the counterspells will get there.

    Yes Decay can kill stuff, but you're still never beating miracles (especially pre-ban miracles). Killing a thing cost you a card in hand, which means you are slowing down immensely when you need two whole other cards to generate any forward momentum [that means you're losing] - cut the extra card requirement and run Shadow instead, with the Libraries and Thoughtseizes that come with it.
    ----

    To bring this back on topic, Decay is less secretly bad when you can get access to the effect without letting it blight your hand (i.e. cascade). In the proposed Entomb toolbox deck it can also make more sense because it offensively Entombs a target you could potentially steal....but, unlike UB Reanimator (a deck with much higher homology with Delver decks) you are not likely to gain wins off of the DRS you *had* to kill, then stole, because this deck construction can't mimic as effectively. Proof of this can be witnessed in legacy by watching UB reanimator and BR reanimator vs a deck like Grixis Delver; only one of these decks can consistently translate playing their opponent's deck into a win (within the context that Grixis Delver is still going to win a higher % of overall games/matches).
    Last edited by Fox; 06-11-2018 at 11:37 AM.

  12. #12

    Re: Entomb Toolbox Aggro (Varolz/Entomb/Death's Shadow/Reanimate)

    Went 2-2 splashing blue...needs work.

    4 gemstone mine
    4 city of brass
    4 mana confluence
    4 Ancient Tomb
    2 verdant catacombs
    1 overgrown tomb
    1 watery grave
    1 forest
    1 dryad arbor

    4 entomb
    4 reanimate
    3 natural order
    4 show and tell

    2 careful study

    3 unmask

    2 gsz
    4 xantid swarm
    3 deaths shadow
    2 Varolz
    1 Birds of Paradise
    4 griselbrand
    1 elderscale wurm
    1 progenitus

    SB:
    4 summoning trap
    3 abrupt decay
    2 boseiju
    2 choke
    2 birds of paradise
    1 Varolz
    1 ruric thar

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