Results 1 to 20 of 33

Thread: Esper Legends

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Bald. Bearded. Moderator.
    Mr. Safety's Avatar
    Join Date

    Nov 2010
    Location

    Hell in a Nutshell
    Posts

    5,246

    Esper Delve

    Another new direction for modern, after having gotten a disappointing 3-3 finish with Jeskai Delver at my last big event. There is a Modern 1K at the local in July, and here is the deck I'm looking to take. It has the best removal, really good threats, and I feel lingering souls is one of the best cards in modern ATM. It foregoes t1 delver for discard or cantrips, setting up a curve to stall the early game until a Tasigur/Geist/souls/Gurmag/Tombstalker can be deployed. With the incredible removal Geist gets through very consistently, whereas with jeskai the burn spells occasionally didn't do the job. Having discard available is better in the metagame than burn, in my opinion, because Geist/Tasigur are so good at closing games by themselves. 7/25/18 - Thought Scour really powers up the deck, making the 4th Souls a smart change. Discard main, counters side, focus on big, cheap threats and a low-to-the ground curve.

    Updated list 6/18/18 (Collective Brutality, Polluted Delta, Hidden Stockpile)
    Updated list 6/25/18 (Sorin, Solemn Visitor, up Remand, add Deprive, take out Mana Leak, -1 Iok/+1 Thoughtseize)
    Updated list 7/11/18 (-2 Remand, -1 Deprive, +2 Spell Snare, +1 Liliana, the Last Hope, -1 Glacial Fortress, +1 Drowned Catacomb)
    Updated list 7/25/18 (complete rework, based on delve threats, Thought Scour, discard-based disruption main, sideboard counterspells.)

    3x Snapcaster Mage
    3x Geist of Saint Traft
    2x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
    1x Tombstalker
    2x Gurmag Angler

    4x Serum Visions
    4x Thought Scour
    3x Inquisition of Kozilek
    3x Thoughtseize
    4x Fatal Push
    3x Path to Exile
    2x Collective Brutality
    4x Lingering Souls
    2x Liliana of the Veil

    4x Flooded Strand
    2x Polluted Delta
    1x Marsh Flats
    1x Hallowed Fountain
    1x Watery Grave
    1x Godless Shrine
    2x Island
    2x Swamp
    1x Plains
    1x Concealed Courtyard
    1x Seachrome Coast
    1x Darkslick Shores
    1x Shambling Vent
    1x Creeping Tar Pit


    Sideboard
    2x Blessed Alliance
    2x Stony Silence
    1x Countersquall
    1x Stubborn Denial
    1x Nihil Spellbomb
    1x Engineered Explosives
    1x Disenchant
    2x Ceremonious Rejection
    1x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    1x Liliana, the Last Hope
    1x Zealous Persecution
    Last edited by Mr. Safety; 07-25-2018 at 11:37 AM.
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  2. #2
    The Fire of Justice Burns Like Nothing Else
    Seraphix's Avatar
    Join Date

    Jun 2014
    Location

    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts

    283

    Re: Esper Legends

    I like the concept of this deck a lot. Geist is one of my favorite cards and is waaaayyy past its prime in Legacy so I'm happy to see it played in Modern. Some of my thoughts:

    • Collective Brutality is a must-include in the 75 of any fair deck with Black due to its versatility. You're tapping out a lot with this deck anyway so I don't think being a 2-mana Sorcery is a significant reason not to play it.
    • Is Shambling Vent really the manland of choice? Not Tar-Pit or Colonnade? I'm guessing you're concerned about lifeloss?
    • Seachrome Coast/Darkslick Shores might be better than Glacial Fortress/Drowned Catacombs here.
    • Snapcaster is great in this deck - I can't imagine playing <4.
    • Cryptic Command is a bit demanding on the manabase, but I'd want to find away to accomodate 2 - just a very good card.
    Quote Originally Posted by wonderPreaux View Post
    Gronder sounds like a dating app for people who play Knight of the Reliquary.

  3. #3
    Bald. Bearded. Moderator.
    Mr. Safety's Avatar
    Join Date

    Nov 2010
    Location

    Hell in a Nutshell
    Posts

    5,246

    Re: Esper Legends

    All good points, ones that I have been tossing around in my head. Line by line:

    -Collective Brutality, YES, especially with Lingering Souls. Once I get 2 copies they replace Esper Charm.
    -Shambling Vent was indeed for lifegain due to Thoughtseize/resource balancing. Brutality helps offset that, but more than anything I wonder how many tapped lands I can play with only 20 and a focus on the early game. Ideally it would be 1/1 Vent/Tarpit, It's on the testing list. Colonnade I think just costs too much to really do anything relevant before I should be closing out games.
    -Definitely testing out Seachrome Coast/Darkslick Shores after I test the buddy lands. I think you're probably correct, especially whereas I cut 2 fetchlands to fit in Shizo/Eiganjo. The buddy lands really need around 8 fetches to be more advantageous than the fastlands.
    -I think 3 snapcaster mage is fine, although I understand that playing 4 of your best cards is correct. I'm 1 snapcaster short, but I don't think it's a deal-breaker. I'm considering 1x Restoration Angel as well, which can be quite good with snapcaster.
    -I have a love/hate relationship with Cryptic Command. It warps the mana-base, not unbearably so, but it still makes it a little harder to achieve. I think even 1-2 Cryptics would cause trouble with Eiganjo/Shizo not producing blue mana (see 3rd point above about lands.) I think I would get more bang for my slots with the PW's (Jace and Sorin) in the 4-mana slots. I'm also trying to get under the Cryptic decks like UWx control, so I really want the cheap discard to work around Cryptic.

    Thanks for the comments! You nailed exactly why I want to do this deck: play the best removal (Path/Push) to get Geist through. Initial playtesting has been very positive; Geist and Tasigur close games super fast and even Souls provides an enormous amount of pressure.
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  4. #4
    The Fire of Justice Burns Like Nothing Else
    Seraphix's Avatar
    Join Date

    Jun 2014
    Location

    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts

    283

    Re: Esper Legends

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    All good points, ones that I have been tossing around in my head. Line by line:

    -Collective Brutality, YES, especially with Lingering Souls. Once I get 2 copies they replace Esper Charm.
    -Shambling Vent was indeed for lifegain due to Thoughtseize/resource balancing. Brutality helps offset that, but more than anything I wonder how many tapped lands I can play with only 20 and a focus on the early game. Ideally it would be 1/1 Vent/Tarpit, It's on the testing list. Colonnade I think just costs too much to really do anything relevant before I should be closing out games.
    -Definitely testing out Seachrome Coast/Darkslick Shores after I test the buddy lands. I think you're probably correct, especially whereas I cut 2 fetchlands to fit in Shizo/Eiganjo. The buddy lands really need around 8 fetches to be more advantageous than the fastlands.
    -I think 3 snapcaster mage is fine, although I understand that playing 4 of your best cards is correct. I'm 1 snapcaster short, but I don't think it's a deal-breaker. I'm considering 1x Restoration Angel as well, which can be quite good with snapcaster.
    -I have a love/hate relationship with Cryptic Command. It warps the mana-base, not unbearably so, but it still makes it a little harder to achieve. I think even 1-2 Cryptics would cause trouble with Eiganjo/Shizo not producing blue mana (see 3rd point above about lands.) I think I would get more bang for my slots with the PW's (Jace and Sorin) in the 4-mana slots. I'm also trying to get under the Cryptic decks like UWx control, so I really want the cheap discard to work around Cryptic.

    Thanks for the comments! You nailed exactly why I want to do this deck: play the best removal (Path/Push) to get Geist through. Initial playtesting has been very positive; Geist and Tasigur close games super fast and even Souls provides an enormous amount of pressure.
    I didn't realize you were playing so few lands. As Legacy players our instinct is to cut lands for cantrips, but I don't think that's a good idea in Modern because the cantrips are so awful. I would want 23-25 lands in this deck (depending on the number of 4 CMC spells), you want to hit all your land drops and reach 5-6 mana every game.

    If you don't have access to a 4th Snapcaster, I'd give Jace, Vryn's Prodigy a shot. I've played him in Esper Stoneblade/Deathblade before and found he was decent. Dark Confidant could fit in this slot as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by wonderPreaux View Post
    Gronder sounds like a dating app for people who play Knight of the Reliquary.

  5. #5
    Bald. Bearded. Moderator.
    Mr. Safety's Avatar
    Join Date

    Nov 2010
    Location

    Hell in a Nutshell
    Posts

    5,246

    Re: Esper Legends

    I respectfully disagree, especially when considering I top out at 4 mana for only 2 cards (Jace/Sorin, Verdict in the board.) I was playing Jeskai Delver for over a year with only 18 lands, with basically the same curve, and I almost never faced mana issues. Yes the cantrips are weaker than Legacy but when it comes to finding lands and smoothing out draws, Serum Visions is at least as good as Preordain. Opt isn't as great, but I am also getting the land count up to 20. Testing will find out if I'm wrong, but this is another reason for avoiding Cryptic. That 5-6 mana is to flashback Cryptic with Snapcaster. The most I'd ever need is 5 mana to flash back an Esper Charm with Snapcaster, and I'd rather hedge against flooding than hedge against mana screw. Twenty seems to be fine to me.

    *shrug* Maybe you're right and testing will reveal that I need more lands. I would cap out at 22 probably, but if I did that it would be another Ghost Quarter and a fetchland.

    EDIT: When I'm drawing cards off Esper Charm and Remand the lands tend to find their way into my hand as well. If I get too pinched on 20 lands I'll squeeze in another Opt + Land, or two lands.

    Dark Confidant is an idea I have toyed with, but I don't know if that's the direction I want to take. I'd probably do something disruptive like Tidehollow Sculler before I did Confidant. Confidant is just a different deck, and playing 6 drops like Tasigur is risky. Yes cantrips, but I can't always avoid it.
    Brainstorm Realist

    I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner

  6. #6
    The Fire of Justice Burns Like Nothing Else
    Seraphix's Avatar
    Join Date

    Jun 2014
    Location

    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts

    283

    Re: Esper Legends

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    I respectfully disagree, especially when considering I top out at 4 mana for only 2 cards (Jace/Sorin, Verdict in the board.) I was playing Jeskai Delver for over a year with only 18 lands, with basically the same curve, and I almost never faced mana issues. Yes the cantrips are weaker than Legacy but when it comes to finding lands and smoothing out draws, Serum Visions is at least as good as Preordain. Opt isn't as great, but I am also getting the land count up to 20. Testing will find out if I'm wrong, but this is another reason for avoiding Cryptic. That 5-6 mana is to flashback Cryptic with Snapcaster. The most I'd ever need is 5 mana to flash back an Esper Charm with Snapcaster, and I'd rather hedge against flooding than hedge against mana screw. Twenty seems to be fine to me.

    *shrug* Maybe you're right and testing will reveal that I need more lands. I would cap out at 22 probably, but if I did that it would be another Ghost Quarter and a fetchland.

    EDIT: When I'm drawing cards off Esper Charm and Remand the lands tend to find their way into my hand as well. If I get too pinched on 20 lands I'll squeeze in another Opt + Land, or two lands.

    Dark Confidant is an idea I have toyed with, but I don't know if that's the direction I want to take. I'd probably do something disruptive like Tidehollow Sculler before I did Confidant. Confidant is just a different deck, and playing 6 drops like Tasigur is risky. Yes cantrips, but I can't always avoid it.
    Truthfully I've only resolved Serum Visions and Opt on Cockatrice, so you likely know better . I should clarify that I wouldn't play say 24 lands without including 4 manlands/utility lands, which kind of let you have your cake and eat it by being lands that can do other stuff in the event of flooding.

    I forgot about Tasigur when suggesting Bobby - I wouldn't have a problem playing them together in Legacy, but that's a way worse proposition in a format with shocklands.

    I'm still inclined to believe that due to its sheer versatility the first few copies of Cryptic are more valuable than any 4-mana walker. Jace just hasn't been that impressive in Modern from what I've seen.

    You mention playing UWR before...Esper has plenty of good cards, but in terms of a Geist-based deck you don't think UWR is a better fit since you have access to spot removal that also goes upstairs?
    Quote Originally Posted by wonderPreaux View Post
    Gronder sounds like a dating app for people who play Knight of the Reliquary.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)