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Thread: Legacy playables from recent sets

  1. #21
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    We should mention the cards that revitalize the artifact archetypes too. I think this is past the purpose of the thread by now but it's fun to list cards so here they are:

    Sai, Master Thopterist
    Whir of Invention
    The Antiquities War

  2. #22
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by pettdan View Post
    We should mention the cards that revitalize the artifact archetypes too. I think this is past the purpose of the thread by now but it's fun to list cards so here they are:

    Sai, Master Thopterist
    Whir of Invention
    The Antiquities War
    Are they played in a competitive deck? :)

  3. #23
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    @Tylert: yes they are, doing well on a few occasions recently, you'll have to find the examples yourself but I think it was a recent GP (EW perhaps) and MTGO, I don't keep track of it, just notice..

  4. #24
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Tylert View Post
    Are they played in a competitive deck? :)
    Antiques War was a very potent wincon in artifact decks at EW. It was pretty much game over after two turns.

    Sure artifact decks weren't everywhere, but AW was heavily talked about between rounds
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhale View Post
    Gross, other formats. I puked in my mouth a little.

  5. #25
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by bruizar View Post
    Revitalize isn't played in legacy yet, but I can see this is control sideboards against burn.
    If Burn becomes a large enough share of the meta for control to run Revitalize, then the meta has reached an unhealthy state...

  6. #26

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew View Post
    If Burn becomes a large enough share of the meta for control to run Revitalize, then the meta has reached an unhealthy state...
    If Burn becomes a large share of the meta, I’m still not sure I’d run Revitalize.
    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    I'll take "things that mean the same thing" for 200, Alec.

  7. #27

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
    If Burn becomes a large share of the meta, I’m still not sure I’d run Revitalize.
    Revitalize would be a maindeck hedge vs burn/aggro, and it's not significantly better in that regard than Renewed Faith.
    As a SB card in a white deck you would want something like COP:R that actually says 'you can't lose' rather than 1W counter target lava spike draw a card

  8. #28

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Fog > Reviltalize

  9. #29

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Fog > Reviltalize
    Legacy and this forum being what they are, when someone writes that Fog is better against burn than lifegain, I hesitate between a joke, a mistake, or a complex combat trick involving Sarpadian Empires, Vol VII.
    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    I'll take "things that mean the same thing" for 200, Alec.

  10. #30
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Fog > Reviltalize
    Lone Missionary > Revitalize > Squire > Chub Toad > Fog

    Edit: For real though, if someone's actually considering Revitalize as an anti-aggro sideboard, Missionary is probably better. You gain more life and get a body to trade with an attacker, which is on average better tempo than cantripping into a random card.

  11. #31

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    You're being attacked by a pair of two power creatures, you can cast fog and prevent four damage or you can gain 3 life. Your call.

  12. #32

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    You're being attacked by a pair of two power creatures, you can cast fog and prevent four damage or you can gain 3 life. Your call.
    You're being targeted by two lightning bolts. You can cast a fog that does literally nothing or gain 3 life. Your call.

  13. #33

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Why run Fog over Moment's Peace?

  14. #34

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Seth View Post
    Why run Fog over Moment's Peace?
    A couple lightning bolts illuminating a rolling fog is dramatic and cool. A bunch of goblins ruining a moment's peace is annoying.
    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    I'll take "things that mean the same thing" for 200, Alec.

  15. #35

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaono View Post
    You're being targeted by two lightning bolts. You can cast a fog that does literally nothing or gain 3 life. Your call.
    My call is the more versatile fog which I can use in other matchups.
    Never underestimate the fog->crackback turnaround.

  16. #36

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Seth View Post
    Why run Fog over Moment's Peace?
    Because fog is a placeholder for any number of "prevent all damage effects" which are more versatile and useful than gaining a small chunk of life. That white one that does all black and red damage would be one such example.

  17. #37

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    My call is the more versatile fog which I can use in other matchups.
    Never underestimate the fog->crackback turnaround.
    Well, if we’re really gonna have this discussion, the original argument was to have a white answer to Burn. I don’t know a lot of white decks that have problems dealing with creatures, so we’re talking about dealing with the actual burning, and fog is out. Except maybe Dawn Charm, if we really, REALLY want to play a fog effect that does something against burn.
    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    I'll take "things that mean the same thing" for 200, Alec.

  18. #38
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Reading this thread like

    Quote Originally Posted by Dice_Box View Post
    You don't get to play the most powerful cards in the format and then bitch when someone finally says no. You also don't get to bitch that it's not fun when someone finally tells you no instead of voyeuristicly watching you masturbate with Cantrips.

  19. #39
    bruizar
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    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Lone Missionary > Revitalize > Squire > Chub Toad > Fog

    Edit: For real though, if someone's actually considering Revitalize as an anti-aggro sideboard, Missionary is probably better. You gain more life and get a body to trade with an attacker, which is on average better tempo than cantripping into a random card.
    The reason why I mentioned Revitalize is that it is a maindeck 4-off in standard Jeskai control lists precisely for buying time to make land drops, essentially working as a bad pseudo time walk.

    Why I think Revitalize (but also Renewed Faith) is interesting, is because life gain is historically either bad, or results in an infinite combo. Why is it bad? Because of the opportunity cost of a dedicated life gain card. Kind of similar to why Auras are often bad because if the creature is removed, you also lose the aura so you don't get ahead. However, since the Amonkhet cycle they have started experimenting with auras that have a enters the battlefield effect such as drawing a card or giving a -1/-1 counter on a target creature in order to offset that limitation of the card's inherent weakness. I believe that inherent weakness for lifegain cards is that they cost a card, and it seems that Wizards has also identified this, thus slapping a card draw on life gain cards. The power level is already creeping, going from +2 life to +3 life for 1W. It is only going to be a matter of time until this effect will be gain 4 life draw a card for 1CC at which point I would gladly run 4 of them in the sideboard and perhaps even in the maindeck to off-set bolt snap bolt or to kill a Death's Shadow (if the life gain spell can target a player).

    I think you will see this card design more often in new sets and it warrants a reevaluation of what life is worth in Magic. We know 1 cc is worth more than 2 life due to the power level or Phyrexian mana cards and Ancient Tomb and that making a spell uncounterable or giving a creature haste is worth less than 3 life unless the spell or creature is part of a combo/finisher (Bosejiu and Hall of the Bandit Warlord)


    Also, I think Lone Emissary isn't that bad. Timely Reinforcement is currently seen as better but I'm not sure that's true. Lone Emissary comes down a turn earlier preventing an extra from a Goblin Guide so you could essentially also gain 6 life with it. The 1 extra mana to have 3 tokens split up does not seem like the best deal although you can use 2 tokens to block a Goblin Guide and still have 1 left to chump something else. Both of them do not have a card draw attached unfortunately. (And yes, the bodies could be better than a random card)

  20. #40

    Re: Legacy playables from recent sets

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
    Well, if we’re really gonna have this discussion, the original argument was to have a white answer to Burn. I don’t know a lot of white decks that have problems dealing with creatures, so we’re talking about dealing with the actual burning, and fog is out. Except maybe Dawn Charm, if we really, REALLY want to play a fog effect that does something against burn.
    fog is a placeholder for any number of "prevent all damage effects" which are more versatile and useful than gaining a small chunk of life. That white one that does all black and red damage would be one such example.

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