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Thread: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

  1. #21

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Eternal Dragon in 2019...

    I love you, mtgthesource.
    - 'Pathy' on MTGO
    - Eastern PA player

  2. #22

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    This deck is so spicy! Immediately made me excited to start thinking of possible inclusions. Right off the bat I can say that there is a strictly better Planar Cleansing in the form of Hour of Revelation.

  3. #23
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    MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    A few points about:

    It is obviously very good against counterspells when you want reslove your bomb but it has so many aplications.

    One of the most common plays will be:
    - in your opponents upkeep to prevent him from playing Ponders, discard, activating plainswalkers and fetchlands
    - In response to Snapcaster Mage’s trigger
    - In response to trigger of Entreat the Angels or Terminus
    - If opponent has an active Mother of Runes or Karakas and Thalia in play so you can Swords his creatures as you please; in respons to SG Commander to prevent sacrificing goblins for damage; against Walking Ballista; in respons to your opponent activating Mystic to prevent equiping Sword of Fire and Ice or Jitte; to prevent Batterskull bounce in lategame when Disenchanting;
    - To force Infect player to make the first move
    - To laugh at Phyrexian Dreadnaught (you dont really need Abeyance for that)
    - When opponent is casting Monastery Mentor, Young Pyromancer you can then cleanly answer it with Swords to Plowshares
    - In respons to Sneak Attack activation (often they have just one R mana), in respons to Show and Tell or when opponent casts reanimation spell then you can safely Swords to Plowshares Grizzly; doesent work on Emrakul obviously
    - Total blowout against storm, TES, High Tide, Tin Finns (probably too slow at two mana but after board with Leylines and Surgicals golden)
    - Close to timewalk against lands; same against dredge early game
    - To protect Gideon against his Swords to Plowshares, Karakas (spicy when stp is his only protection of Jace)
    - Saving Eternal Dragon against Nihil Spellbomb or Surgical in your upkeep
    - Making your Wrath of God safe when facing vials
    - EE, Deed, Stifle, Brightling and twenty others are really akward
    ...



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Koplinchen; 02-14-2019 at 05:36 AM.

  4. #24

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Hello, sorry for the late reponse.

    It's nice to hear that you did well with the deck. Your descriptions really show that you put a lot thought into your list and that you have tested them as well. I can't contribute too much right now because I can't play that much but I was able to play a list very similiar to yours for a bit online and I liked it a lot. Palace Jailer in particular has been a very positive surprise to me, I think we can build on that card a bit more.

    You don't have to sell me on Abeyance because I'm absolutely with you about how useful and versatile it is. I was initially comparing it to Orim's Chant since that is cheaper and can also prevent your opponent from becoming the monarch for a turn but the ability part and the cantrip think outweigh this. Why not increase it to 4 if you haven't been too satisfied with Mana Tithe anyways (which I can totally understand, these seem rather out of place)?

    One problem you mentioned was that despite all the draw and E.Dragons you sometimes didn't draw enough lands. I've also had this issue of not even drawing 2 lands for cycling or cantripping and so getting stuck on 1 land with otherwise perfect hands. This is part of the reason why I liked Cast Out so much since it's a very cheap filter card and thus helps to make the deck more consistent and reliable. Together with T.Inspector you'd get 8 virtual one drops which makes the deck a lot faster and efficient in my experience. However it won't work with Cleansing of course so I guess the decision is to be made between O-Ring-like cards and Cleansing in the role of noncreature removal. The O-Ring cards are at least rather efficient in dealing with Planeswalkers which according to you seem to have been a problem (?).

    One last thing I was wondering about are the Unexpectedly Absents. How good have these been for you? My concern is that it's only a temporary solution if you don't cast it in response to a fetchland or Field of Ruin. Don't you think that Council's Judgements would have been better?

    The Sword/Path doesn't seem like a terrible idea either because your removal has at least some use then in noncreature matchups.

    At this point I'm more listening to you and relying on your assessments because like I said I was very pleasantly surprised with your decklist. It played better than most of my approaches I could come up with so far and I'm really looking forward to further improve the deck.

    See/read yall soon!

  5. #25

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Koplinchen View Post
    A few points about:

    It is obviously very good against counterspells when you want reslove your bomb but it has so many aplications.

    One of the most common plays will be:
    - in your opponents upkeep to prevent him from playing Ponders, discard, activating plainswalkers and fetchlands
    - In response to Snapcaster Mage’s trigger
    - In response to trigger of Entreat the Angels or Terminus
    - If opponent has an active Mother of Runes or Karakas and Thalia in play so you can Swords his creatures as you please; in respons to SG Commander to prevent sacrificing goblins for damage; against Walking Ballista; in respons to your opponent activating Mystic to prevent equiping Sword of Fire and Ice or Jitte; to prevent Batterskull bounce in lategame when Disenchanting;
    - To force Infect player to make the first move
    - To laugh at Phyrexian Dreadnaught (you dont really need Abeyance for that)
    - When opponent is casting Monastery Mentor, Young Pyromancer you can then cleanly answer it with Swords to Plowshares
    - In respons to Sneak Attack activation (often they have just one R mana), in respons to Show and Tell or when opponent casts reanimation spell then you can safely Swords to Plowshares Grizzly; doesent work on Emrakul obviously
    - Total blowout against storm, TES, High Tide, Tin Finns (probably too slow at two mana but after board with Leylines and Surgicals golden)
    - Close to timewalk against lands; same against dredge early game
    - To protect Gideon against his Swords to Plowshares, Karakas (spicy when stp is his only protection of Jace)
    - Saving Eternal Dragon against Nihil Spellbomb or Surgical in your upkeep
    - Making your Wrath of God safe when facing vials
    - EE, Deed, Stifle, Brightling and twenty others are really akward
    ...



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Excellent post, I always enjoyed running abeyance in the mighty quinn/sylvan quinn. Don't forget it's incredible on isochron scepter. Shuts down planes walkers and sorceries then protects your bombs when you need it to. Playing it on your opponents turn two in their upkeep stops fetches and can be a pseudo time walk vs a lot of decks. Small critique...don't think it does anything vs sneak attack. It can't counter anything.

    Also if you're list is running Scrying sheets feel free to post in the mighty Quinn thread. Would be nice to get a bump.

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...y-Quinn/page68

    .
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  6. #26
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Hello,

    Nice to see a mono white control thread.

    I have been working on a project for several months that I'm sharing today.

    The path I took is different as it is a Control - Aggro deck and the results are pretty encouraging.


    Mono white - Angels - by Ralf

    14 Plains
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Field of Ruin
    1 Karakas
    1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin

    1 Bruna, the Fading Light
    1 Lyra Dawnbringer
    2 Palace Jailer
    2 Gisela, the Broken Blade
    2 Baneslayer Angel
    3 Angel of Sanctions
    3 Archangel of Tithes
    3 Eternal Dragon
    3 Phyrexian Revoker

    1 Tithe
    2 Dawn Charm
    4 Abeyance
    4 Swords to Plowshares

    1 Sorcerous Spyglass
    4 Phyrexian Furnace

    SB: 1 Containment Priest
    SB: 4 Leyline of Sanctity
    SB: 1 Sanctum Prelate
    SB: 2 Faerie Macabre
    SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
    SB: 1 Porphyry Nodes
    SB: 1 Council's Judgment
    SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
    SB: 1 xXx (currently using a shining shoal)

    This deck is pretty well tuned for the actual meta. Its resiliency is above average.

    The idea (as expressed here) is to make land drops every turn and get to a point where all your threats must be answered.
    Each creature has been thoroughly chosen:

    Archangel of Tithes -> usually hinders long enough aggro deck so that you can turn the tides
    Angel of Sanctions -> Oblivion ring on a stick. The embalm ability is ice on the cake. It cannot be countered except for stifle.
    Baneslayer + Lyra + Gisela -> beatdowns. Period
    Phyrexian furnace -> this is not for GRV (but yes it happens...). I picked it up because it messes with so many game plans for so many decks.
    Dawn charm -> usually buys you a turn or can save one creature. Sometimes you get to screw a nasty discard spell.

    Bruna could be something else. You don't get to cast it every game (7 mana you know) but if you do and pair it Gisela...well Oh boy...

    Phyrexian revoker were Sorcerous spyglass for a long time (4) but I came across Storm and without Revoker you cannot expect to win G1. Abeyance is a very nice card but can't do shit vs 8+ discard spells.


    The deck is soft to discard (as many control decks) justifying the inclusion of 4 Leyline in SB.
    SB is unfinished yet as it takes a very long time to test against every Tiers 1/2 decks in the Legacy scene but I'll eventually get there.

    If you are willing to give it a try, then happy testing !

    Ralf
    Last edited by Ralf; 02-16-2019 at 06:17 AM.

  7. #27
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Isn't Relic of Progenitus just better than Phyrexian Furnace?

  8. #28
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralf View Post
    Hello,

    Nice to see a mono white control thread.

    I have been working on a project for several months that I'm sharing today.

    The path I took is different as it is a Control - Aggro deck and the results are pretty encouraging.


    Mono white - Angels - by Ralf

    14 Plains
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Field of Ruin
    1 Karakas
    1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin

    1 Bruna, the Fading Light
    1 Lyra Dawnbringer
    2 Palace Jailer
    2 Gisela, the Broken Blade
    2 Baneslayer Angel
    3 Angel of Sanctions
    3 Archangel of Tithes
    3 Eternal Dragon
    3 Phyrexian Revoker

    1 Tithe
    2 Dawn Charm
    4 Abeyance
    4 Swords to Plowshares

    1 Sorcerous Spyglass
    4 Phyrexian Furnace

    SB: 1 Containment Priest
    SB: 4 Leyline of Sanctity
    SB: 1 Sanctum Prelate
    SB: 2 Faerie Macabre
    SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
    SB: 1 Porphyry Nodes
    SB: 1 Council's Judgment
    SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
    SB: 1 xXx (currently using a shining shoal)


    Ralf
    Hi Ralf, I think this deck is for a different thread. I would try Ancient Tomb, Chalice of the Void, Tinisphere, Stoneforge Mystic if I were you. As you present the deck I think it is not good. I know we are talking mono W control here so we are not really talking T1 or even T1,5 here but we want to have fun and win at least some games and I think this angels deck does nothing. Good luck!

  9. #29

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahab View Post
    Isn't Relic of Progenitus just better than Phyrexian Furnace?
    Not if you want to avoid getting your own E.Dragon or Angel of Sanctions (cool card btw) exiled.

    The angel list doesn't even look that bad in my view tbh and can certainly stands its ground against other fair decks...

    As for Koplinchen's list I'm currently reconsidering the Mind Stones. The ramp didn't feel too necessary and it's also not too good with Planar Cleansing. It doesn't fit into the curve too well either but I'm still testing.

  10. #30

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Not sure how good it would be but looking into potential card draw options I've stumbled into Sacred Guide.
    Also I realize that in the original post Erdvermampfa has dismissed Endless Atlas but Koplinchen is running Scrying Sheets, which have the same cost of 2 mana per turn but don't even guarantee a draw. Is Atlas not worth at least a single copy? Does one being a land versus the other being a 2 mana artifact matter that much?

  11. #31

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Glass House View Post
    Not sure how good it would be but looking into potential card draw options I've stumbled into Sacred Guide.
    Also I realize that in the original post Erdvermampfa has dismissed Endless Atlas but Koplinchen is running Scrying Sheets, which have the same cost of 2 mana per turn but don't even guarantee a draw. Is Atlas not worth at least a single copy? Does one being a land versus the other being a 2 mana artifact matter that much?
    Atlas is fine and if you're running e-tutor probably merits inclusion. I didn't know this card existed. However, the benefit of scrying sheets is it's good on turn one (well when top was legal ...now turn 2 I guess) and on turn 22. Atlas is a dead card until at least turn 4, probably later.
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  12. #32

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Endless Atlas always felt kinda janky to me. I admit it looks good on paper but tapping two mana each turn will often decrease your reactive capabilities which is why I actually switched to Coercive Portal from Atlas because the continous cost was too much and it also sets certain requirements to your manabase on top of that.. Aside from the disadvantages you guys have already pointed you have to add that against decks where CA matters (Miracles, Grixis Control and similiar stuff) Sheets is a lot harder to answer than Atlas too and since it's land with inbuilt draw engine it allows to safe deck space. And in these days of Kologahan's Command, Cratermaker etc. artifacts simply have lost a lot of their reliability.

  13. #33
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Erdvermampfa View Post
    Not if you want to avoid getting your own E.Dragon or Angel of Sanctions (cool card btw) exiled.

    The angel list doesn't even look that bad in my view tbh and can certainly stands its ground against other fair decks...

    As for Koplinchen's list I'm currently reconsidering the Mind Stones. The ramp didn't feel too necessary and it's also not too good with Planar Cleansing. It doesn't fit into the curve too well either but I'm still testing.
    I am waiting for your testing outcome but I felt we need some early game. Mind Stone is very good in Wrath of God T3, T3 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar or even if you Cleansing it away it means your opponent is losing a lot. I really like how it alows us to do important things earlier.
    Using Scrying Sheets - draw or you know whats on top so you can a)draw the card with Stone and use the other Sheets b)shuffle it away with Thawing Glaciers of Dragon... Same function has clue from Inspector. But you blow that T2 ususally.

    4 Tharben Inspector
    3 Eternal Dragon
    1 Palace Jailer
    1 Emrakul, the Promised End

    1 Gideon of Trials
    2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
    3 Decree of Justice

    3 Mind Stone

    4 Swords to Plowshares
    2 Path to Exile
    1 Unexpectedly Absent
    2 Pulse of the Fields
    3 Wrath of God
    3 Planar Cleansing
    2 Council's Judgement
    2 Abeyance

    1 Thawing Glaciers
    2 Field of Ruin
    4 Scrying Sheets
    16 Snow-Covered Plains

    Sideboard:
    3 Leyline of Sancticity
    3 Surgical Extraction
    2 Ethersworn Canonist
    2 Disenchant
    2 Containment Priest
    1 Teferi's Protection
    1 Boseju, Who Shelters Us All
    1 Karakas

    Considering second Emrakul because of the blue decks. Or second Boseju main deck. (Mind Stone helps to cast it)
    I will play the deck again tomorrow.

  14. #34
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Koplinchen View Post
    Hi Ralf, I think this deck is for a different thread. I would try Ancient Tomb, Chalice of the Void, Tinisphere, Stoneforge Mystic if I were you. As you present the deck I think it is not good. I know we are talking mono W control here so we are not really talking T1 or even T1,5 here but we want to have fun and win at least some games and I think this angels deck does nothing. Good luck!
    Well, I do have a few records of sanctioned events and sideboard tables.
    Yes we are talking about MWC and not of any other stompy decks outta there.

    I guess it is for another thread.

    Good luck with your expectations :p

  15. #35
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    i've played some of ralf's decks and i would at least encourage you to try them. he's one of the better deckbuilders on this forum.
    -rob

  16. #36

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralf View Post
    Well, I do have a few records of sanctioned events and sideboard tables.
    Yes we are talking about MWC and not of any other stompy decks outta there.

    I guess it is for another thread.

    Good luck with your expectations :p
    I'll bite, could you do a quick tournament report?

    Also could you expand on your analysis of phyrexian furnace?
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  17. #37
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by kinda View Post
    I'll bite, could you do a quick tournament report?

    Also could you expand on your analysis of phyrexian furnace?
    I'll PM you for the details if you are interested (I won't pollute this thread).

    Phyrexian Furnace was chosen over Relic of Progenitus for many reasons:


    Pros:

    1) Your opponent do not get to choose. Graveyards are treated as a stack. Vs miracle for example, you want to keep your furnace almost the entire game to mess with SCM. With Relic, your oppo will always choose not to exile cards that matters (STP mainly). So in both cases you can lose your artifact and prevent 1 SCM use, but if you want to keep it (because there is a high chance that the second one would be countered -> counterspell/counterbalance/FOW), with relic you will never get the chance to eat the said STP. With furnace, you eventually will.

    2) Corner case vs Reanimator on the draw -> without a fetch/petal, on a T1 entomb + grisel, you get to eat Grisel with T1 + furnace. You don't with Relic.

    3) Furnace doesn't eat your own Eternal dragon/food for Bruna/Emeria. Relic does.

    4) GRV


    Cons

    1) Relic is better as an emergency use when you desperately need to exile all graveyards but most of the time you don't need this effect (save maybe dredge).
    2) Relic doesn't grow Tarmo. But with relic your opponent will always choose the card to keep their tarmo the biggest possible.

    All in all, I chose to play Furnace.

  18. #38

    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralf View Post
    I'll PM you for the details if you are interested (I won't pollute this thread).

    Phyrexian Furnace was chosen over Relic of Progenitus for many reasons:


    Pros:

    ...

    4) GRV
    I hope there is a story here ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  19. #39
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    Re: MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by kinda View Post
    I hope there is a story here ?
    Ah ah ah. No, not yet.
    No competitive tournament with this deck yet.
    But I have seen it before. So I listed it as a proish thing.
    Not that I'm encouraging anyone to look for GRV...but well it happens.

  20. #40
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    MWC - Mono White Control 2019

    So I played the deck yesterday and went decent 3-1. I played one Boseju main and one side. The cards was fantastic. Cut Absent.

    R1:
    Girxis
    I lost the first but the second and third were with Leyline in the opener and that was pretty much it. I could play a long game and in the end I killed him one game with Eternal Dragon and in the other he just conceded to Emrakul. He cant deal with Enchantments. His only win with Leyline in play is ultimate Liliana.

    R2:
    Esper helm combo. We cant realistical win G1. G2 he played Bitterblossom, Rip, Tsabos Web (!), Clique... I had to Cleansing and kill my own Leyline. Then I could pass with untapped lands and get 4 soliders (he was on 10 no board) or play another Leyline I just drew. I put Leyline into his FoW he then ripped Hymn from the top... I never drew anything really although my opp was playing incredibaly bad.

    R3:
    Unexperienced miracles player. I just put both Gideons and that was enough. In the second he was unable to deal with Boseju keeping the board clean and solider tokens.

    R4:
    Best games of the tournament. In the first I never saw any stp/path and was playing around Wasteland I put my Boseju on board too late. G2 was hilarious as my opp mulled and then put Winter Orb against my double Mind Stone! (Mind Stones were great all day) I played Jailer on an empty board and drew all the cards. In the decider I drew three Tharben Inspector and Path keeping his goyfs away from my lifetotals. Then at some point I was facing three creatures with my gideon of trials, I got an emblem and went down to 2 with my Boseju and Wrath of God the board. He eventually got bolt but it was only good enough to kill my gideon (he took like 7 dmg), Had to cleansing my board with double mindstone but I at least sworded my own Dragon going to 6. Played Eternal Dragon - fow; returned it and played it again. He was on 10... Victory! :-)

    Pulse never really did anything for me but I feel we need it. Inspectors, Emrakul are amazing. The deck's land engine works pretty well!

    Tom

    best moment:

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