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Thread: 4 Card Blind

  1. #2301

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Yes, I was hoping to catch everyone off guard once with Bayou, Young Wolf, Mind Swords, Snuff Out before you realized Mind Swords was conspicuously not banned with the Hymn effects :(

    But now the Sacred Cat is out of the bag.

    Mind Swords is completely different from the other 2-mana discard 2 cards. It hits your own hand as well, which is really awkward. It also exiles, which is more powerful, but it makes the symmetry harder to break, as opposed to Delerium Skeins which allowed you to discard your Nether Spirit. I was excited for taking a round by surprise with Mind Swords, and I absolutely had my chance. I'm not sure that it needs banning, but now that it's just another corner case to worry about, I'm fine with banning it.

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Yes, I was hoping to catch everyone off guard once with Bayou, Young Wolf, Mind Swords, Snuff Out before you realized Mind Swords was conspicuously not banned with the Hymn effects :(

    But now the Sacred Cat is out of the bag.
    I guess the old becomes new. H played Bayou, Young Wolf, Mind Swords, Encroach back in the day, and I see that several of you were witness to it. Shelldock + Ulamog took the round, though, so there might not have been much attention paid to the Mind Swords.
    Last edited by silkster; 06-05-2020 at 02:04 AM.

  2. #2302
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by silkster View Post
    H played Bayou, Young Wolf, Mind Swords, Encroach back in the day, and I see that several of you were witness to it. Shelldock + Ulamog took the round, though, so there might not have been much attention paid to the Mind Swords.
    This is exactly the thing. It has never dominated a round, so it never stuck in our minds as a particularly dangerous card.
    Maybe it doesn't even really deserve a ban (yet), as the round it would have dominated has just been finished.
    Maybe we should let it prove itself first. I'll leave it up to you guys.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  3. #2303
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    This is exactly the thing. It has never dominated a round, so it never stuck in our minds as a particularly dangerous card.
    Maybe it doesn't even really deserve a ban (yet), as the round it would have dominated has just been finished.
    Maybe we should let it prove itself first. I'll leave it up to you guys.
    Oh it stuck in my mind. I remembered H's deck and have been waiting to use Mind Swords+Young Wolf for the right round (I think Snuff Out is better because OTD it answers their turn 1 play). I didn't want to use it in some earlier rounds when other interactions were possible, especially with mass discard and Leyline+Karakas. It beats Storm Crow (illegal), and I missed the Nether Spirit interaction for the block format, but I was hoping to use it eventually.

    But tbh I think it should be banned. The deckbuilding restrictions aren't that much tighter than Hymn (which requires 2 mana sources and only leaves one other open spot). It comes online turn 1, which is powerful OTD too.

  4. #2304
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    I think in the vein of how we've been banning multiple discard, it should probably go. Its easier to cast than Hymn and arguably more powerful, especially with the alternate cost.

  5. #2305
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Alright, I've given it some more thought, and Mind Swords is out.
    It just doesn't make sense to keep it if we ban the other CMC2 discard 2 cards.

    I'll be brewing my deck, and I expect to open the next round within the hour.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  6. #2306
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    ROUND 10 of SEASON 6: DEVIANT LEGACY has started.

    This round we will play Life Support - Your starting life total is the total converted mana cost of all cards in your deck. (NB: For split cards both halves count, just like when you flip one with Dark Confidant. But is this really going to make you play one?)
    No additional bannings.

    I have PM'ed myself my deck for round 10, so you can start sending me your decks.

    DEADLINE: Wednesday the 10th of June, at 11:00AM Central European Time.
    (That's my time zone. Pacific Time it'll probably be something like Tuesday night a bit past midnight, so keep that in mind.)

    PLEASE NOTE:
    The way you send your deck to me matters. Please send it in the way described below, so it doesn't cost me an hour of editing before I can post all the decks.
    Please send your deck as follows: Swamp, Quicksand, Funeral Charm, Fallen Askari (starting total: 3 life).
    So with card tags around each card, and not above eachother, and with your Username and 4CB S06R10 in the topic.
    Don't forget to keep an eye on the banned list. You'll find it in the second post of the thread, or in our Google Spreadsheet.

    After the deadline has passed, I will post all decks on the forum here, and you can start puzzling out your scores.
    If you have any questions, please read the first two posts of this thread first. If you can't find the answer there, drop a message here. We'll answer a.s.a.p.

    Also, if you've been lurking on this thread and looking to join, you can step in anytime, any round. That's no problem at all. Just send me your deck before the deadline, and I'll add you to the competition.

    Happy deck designing everybody!
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  7. #2307
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    The deadline has passed, and I'm missing one of the regulars.
    I'll do some work stuff first and give you a few more hours.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  8. #2308
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    The deadline has passed, and I'm missing one of the regulars.
    I'll do some work stuff first and give you a few more hours.
    Did you receive my submission?

  9. #2309
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Tylert View Post
    Did you receive my submission?
    Yup, you're good.

    I usually try not to name names in these cases, but perhaps I kinda H-ave to.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  10. #2310
    GrimGrin and Glissa are in a boat...

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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Yup, you're good.

    I usually try not to name names in these cases, but perhaps I kinda H-ave to.
    It's not like we would s-H-ame anyone... go ahead name him!

  11. #2311
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Yeah, new work schedule has me constantly forgetting what day it actually is...
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
    Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order

  12. #2312
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    It's cool, don't sweat it.

    DECKS FOR ROUND 10 OF SEASON 6: Life Support

    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life)
    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Subterranean Hangar, Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Dross, Unmask (18 life)
    3. alphastryk: Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Tangle, Aether Vial, Unmask (19 life)
    4. Wrath of Pie: City of Traitors, Hangarback Walker, Blinkmoth Infusion, Force of Negation (17 life)
    5. Moosedog: City of traitors, Chancellor of the Tangle, Chancellor of the Tangle, Thrun, the last troll (18 life)
    6. FTW: Saprazzan Cove, Force of Negation, Misthollow Griffin, Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (10 life)
    7. Tylert: Chancellor of the tangle, Chancellor of the tangle, City of traitors, Eureka (18 life)
    8. silkster: Lion's Eye Diamond, Lion's Eye Diamond, Incorrigible Youths, Incorrigible Youths (10 life)
    9. H: Saltcrusted Steppe, Forest, Mayor of Avabruck, Thragtusk (7 life)

    Please post your scores and cross-check with the opponents.
    I'll update the Google Spreadsheet for the season, so you can enter your scores there as well: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing
    Last edited by Asthereal; 06-10-2020 at 09:37 AM.
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  13. #2313
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Asthereal's scores for round Chancellor of the Takeyourpick:

    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life)
    That's me. I almost played Eureka, but decided I'd want to beat that in epic fashion rather than lose in that epic fashion.
    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Subterranean Hangar, Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Dross, Unmask (18 life)
    My dudes are fast. Kill on turn 4 despite the high starting life total and the 6 leech from the Drosses. Cool idea though. I'm sorry you didn't get a free win against a greedy deck! 6-0
    3. alphastryk: Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Tangle, Aether Vial, Unmask (19 life)
    I'm fast again. 6-0
    4. Wrath of Pie: City of Traitors, Hangarback Walker, Blinkmoth Infusion, Force of Negation (17 life)
    EDIT: Walker tokens also get +1/+1. OTP: att (11) | Walk | att (5) | Walk 2/2 | att block one, get 2 2/2 flyers (1) and we have a staredown. OTD: Walk | att (11) | Walk 2/2 | att, block one (7) get 2 2/2 flyers, still staredown? 2-2
    5. Moosedog: City of traitors, Chancellor of the Tangle, Chancellor of the Tangle, Thrun, the last troll (18 life)
    Don't drop that Thrun! I can't attack past Thrun for the win, but you can't attack either so we draw both. 2-2
    6. FTW: Saprazzan Cove, Force of Negation, Misthollow Griffin, Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (10 life)
    10 life means T2 kill. You don't have things before then. 6-0
    7. Tylert: Chancellor of the tangle, Chancellor of the tangle, City of traitors, Eureka (18 life)
    Weeeee! I win the turn after you Eureka because my Forges forge many gobbos that attack for way more than I need. Or you do nothing and I win on T3. 6-0
    8. silkster: Lion's Eye Diamond, Lion's Eye Diamond, Incorrigible Youths, Incorrigible Youths (10 life)
    If you attack with one, I double-block and we're left with a 2/2 vs a 4/4, but you're way lower on life so you have to keep defending. Two draws, I think. 2-2
    9. H: Saltcrusted Steppe, Forest, Mayor of Avabruck, Thragtusk (7 life)
    Ooph... 7 life is tight. You die on T2 so even when you begin Mayor can't go nuts. 6-0

    Total: 36 points. How did that happen with one of the most obvious decks I could think of?

    EDIT1: Missed a few things in the Wrath games.
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  14. #2314
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    6. FTW: Saprazzan Cove, Force of Negation, Misthollow Griffin, Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (10 life)


    1. Asthereal (TO): Uncounterable 6 power haste kills me before I can cast anything. LL 0-6
    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Double Dross makes it 4 life vs 24. If you try Unmask Mu, I Force pitching Griffin. Mu makes 2 4/4s by the time you get T9 Dross. Then Mu keeps Dross a 4/6 nonflying. Before the 2nd Dross comes down 8 turns later, I get Griffin and can swing in the air while leaving up 2 blockers. WW 6-0
    3. alphastryk: Dross makes it 7 life vs 22. You Unmask me to stop Force on Vial. I Force Unmask, pitching Griffin, and you get Vial. Then Mu makes 2 4/4s to lock out your T8 Chancellor. WW 6-0
    4. Wrath of Pie: I can't cast Mu with UUU floating (hardcast FoN on your FoN) until too late. Hangarback kills me first. LL 0-6
    5. Moosedog: Thrun kills me before I can play anything. LL 0-6
    7. Tylert: This is the version I was ready for. FoN trumps Eureka. WW 6-0
    8. silkster: FoN on LED slows down your clock, but a single 4/3 haste still kills me before Mu comes down. LL 0-6
    9. H: Mayor wrecks me before I get anything going. LL 0-6

    18 points (6 wins)

    Silkster's deck looks really well thought out. It clocks the slow decks, has 10 life to beat triple Dross, and has double threat to beat discard, counters and removal.

    My other deck was much faster but folded to disruption or multiple Drosses:
    Karakas, Serra Ascendant, Autochthon Wurm, Nourishing Shoal (18 life, but really 33 life)
    Last edited by FTW; 06-10-2020 at 02:26 PM.

  15. #2315

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    4. Wrath of Pie: City of Traitors, Hangarback Walker, Blinkmoth Infusion, Force of Negation (17 life) - I start at 17, not 15.

    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life) DD - Bad news: I start at 17 life, not 15. Worse news: Leyline of the Meek is symmetrical, so my Thopter tokens get the boost, and thus I always block with a 2/2 Walker.
    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Subterranean Hangar, Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Dross, Unmask (18 life) LL
    3. alphastryk: Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Tangle, Aether Vial, Unmask (19 life) WW
    5. Moosedog: City of traitors, Chancellor of the Tangle, Chancellor of the Tangle, Thrun, the last troll (18 life) WW - I was worried about t1 Iona and played something that didn't lose to quad Dross. Turns out starting at 17 life has other benefits too!
    6. FTW: Saprazzan Cove, Force of Negation, Misthollow Griffin, Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (10 life) WW
    7. Tylert: Chancellor of the tangle, Chancellor of the tangle, City of traitors, Eureka (18 life) WW
    8. silkster: Lion's Eye Diamond, Lion's Eye Diamond, Incorrigible Youths, Incorrigible Youths (10 life) WW
    9. H: Saltcrusted Steppe, Forest, Mayor of Avabruck, Thragtusk (7 life) LL

    10w2d = 32 points

  16. #2316
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie View Post
    4. Wrath of Pie: City of Traitors, Hangarback Walker, Blinkmoth Infusion, Force of Negation (17 life) - I start at 17, not 15.

    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life) DD - Bad news: I start at 17 life, not 15. Worse news: Leyline of the Meek is symmetrical, so my Thopter tokens get the boost, and thus I always block with a 2/2 Walker.
    Wrath is right of course. I can't count, and I also can't read. Two more life and larger Thopters ruin my win, and OTD I'm lucky to get the draw.


    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Silkster's deck looks really well thought out. It clocks the slow decks, has 10 life to beat triple Dross, and has double threat to beat discard, counters and removal.
    Fun fact: silk's deck was the only one that made me go: "Wait, can't you just go [insert Roar o/t Wurm + 2-costing madness dude / Arrogant Wurm for being a tad bigger / Flashback reanimate plus HUGE fattie]?"
    So to be brutally honest, I thought silk was the only one to submit an "oh crap the deadline is in two minutes"-deck. Though H's was probably also invented under similar stress.
    And it ended up being one of the top contenders. How wrong I am sometimes.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  17. #2317

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Me: silkster: Lion's Eye Diamond, Lion's Eye Diamond, Incorrigible Youths, Incorrigible Youths (10 life)

    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life)
    As Asthereal noted, I don't have the life to be able to race. DD, 2 points

    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Subterranean Hangar, Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Dross, Unmask (18 life)
    I looked at this deck exactly. Even on the draw, I have 8 turns to attack, and 32 damage is plenty. WW, 6 points

    3. alphastryk: Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Tangle, Aether Vial, Unmask (19 life)
    On the draw, I have 7 turns to attack, which is plenty.WW, 6 points

    4. Wrath of Pie: City of Traitors, Hangarback Walker, Blinkmoth Infusion, Force of Negation (17 life)
    By your third turn, you can trade successfully, and Blinkmoth Infusion gives you the buffer. LL

    5. Moosedog: City of traitors, Chancellor of the Tangle, Chancellor of the Tangle, Thrun, the last troll (18 life)
    I had this as a draw until I realized you can't regenerate. WW, 6 points

    6. FTW: Saprazzan Cove, Force of Negation, Misthollow Griffin, Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (10 life)
    The kids these days are really fast. WW, 6 points

    7. Tylert: Chancellor of the tangle, Chancellor of the tangle, City of traitors, Eureka (18 life)
    I misread that as Hypergenesis at first because I didn't think of Eureka. Um, yeah, those are too big and vigilant. LL

    9. H: Saltcrusted Steppe, Forest, Mayor of Avabruck, Thragtusk (7 life)
    Rarr, speedy. WW, 6 points

    10w, 2d, 4L, 32 points

    For once, I actually had a decent read on the meta. I looked at all the Chancellors, Aether Vial, Unmask, Force of Negation, and even Blinkmoth Infusion and City+Hangarback. I briefly considered Hypergenesis, but it was bad, and I missed Eureka. I knew I was weak to all the vertical growth creatures, but I hoped their low mana costs would keep them out, and they mostly did.

    I'm glad we waited for H. There's something comforting about all nine of us showing up each week.

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Asthereal's scores for round Chancellor of the Takeyourpick:

    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life)
    That's me. I almost played Eureka, but decided I'd want to beat that in epic fashion rather than lose in that epic fashion.

    7. Tylert: Chancellor of the tangle, Chancellor of the tangle, City of traitors, Eureka (18 life)
    Weeeee! I win the turn after you Eureka because my Forges forge many gobbos that attack for way more than I need. Or you do nothing and I win on T3. 6-0

    Total: 36 points. How did that happen with one of the most obvious decks I could think of?
    I didn't even notice this interaction when reading through the lists. I'm glad you got to live the dream. Going pure aggro was a good call here, and you found a way to do it that completely dodges both Force of Negation and Unmask. My starting point for this round was that I would either play Force or Unmask, but then I stumbled onto dumb aggro and it just kept winning even through the disruption. But you found an even better way to do it. I did not think of consider Leyline of the Meek, despite looking through the Leylines. Congrats!

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    My other deck was much faster but folded to disruption or multiple Drosses:
    Karakas, Serra Ascendant, Autochthon Wurm, Nourishing Shoal (18 life, but really 33 life)
    I missed Serra Ascendant again! I like how this takes advantage of the life mechanic in way that isn't just aggro. This is actually WL against Dross, Dross, Unmask, Subterranean Hangar, cause you can afford 3 turns lifelinking up to 33.

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Fun fact: silk's deck was the only one that made me go: "Wait, can't you just go [insert Roar o/t Wurm + 2-costing madness dude / Arrogant Wurm for being a tad bigger / Flashback reanimate plus HUGE fattie]?"
    So to be brutally honest, I thought silk was the only one to submit an "oh crap the deadline is in two minutes"-deck. Though H's was probably also invented under similar stress.
    And it ended up being one of the top contenders. How wrong I am sometimes.
    I looked through all of the madness cards and all of the flashback cards. I considered Roar of the Wurm + Lingering Souls. Somehow I did not think to combine Roar + madness! I was also counting on beating Unmask/Force decks that give me 7 turns with half my clock.

  18. #2318
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by silkster View Post
    I'm glad we waited for H. There's something comforting about all nine of us showing up each week.
    Yeah, if I can, I always wait. I think having more players is more important than having a super tight schedule.
    I think I've had to post decks before the last regular submitted just once in recent months. Sorry, Gobbo. Had some personal crap that week!
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  19. #2319
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    This was a really cool, creative round. Fun to see what looks like 9 completely different decks this time around.


    1. Asthereal (TO): Leyline of the Meek, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge (25 life)

    My Unmask doesn't interact with your deck, and I die from 22 (19 + chancellor drain) before I can produce a creature. LL

    0-6

    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Subterranean Hangar, Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Dross, Unmask (18 life)

    OTP: I Unmask your Unmask to preserve my Vial and Chancellor of the Tangle (who wins in combat). W
    OTD: You Unmask my Vial, then I Unmask you back to take your remaining threat, forcing a draw. (thanks to silkster for the line). D

    4-1

    3. alphastryk: Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Tangle, Aether Vial, Unmask (19 life)

    This is me

    4. Wrath of Pie: City of Traitors, Hangarback Walker, Blinkmoth Infusion, Force of Negation (17 life)

    I will always Unmask your Force to be able to resolve Vial, so it will come down to if Hangarback Walker can race Chancellor of the Tangle via Vial, or more if Hangarback can grow to 7/7 before I can kill you, which seems like it will always happen. If I instead aim to Unmask your Hangarback, you always can Force the Unmask. LL

    0-6

    5. Moosedog: City of traitors, Chancellor of the Tangle, Chancellor of the Tangle, Thrun, the last troll (18 life)

    OTP: I Unmask Thrun and you do nothing. W
    OTD: You land Thrun and I land Vial, so it comes down to Thrun killing my from 22 (19 + Chancellor drain) before I can land a chancellor to block on my turn 8. Thrun deals 24 in 6 attacks, so I'll always die first. L

    3-3

    6. FTW: Saprazzan Cove, Force of Negation, Misthollow Griffin, Mu Yanling, Sky Dancer (10 life)

    I always have to Unmask so I can resolve Vial, and I think you always Force it pitching the Griffin to keep access to both your threats. It then comes down to whether my turn 8 Chancellor of the Tangle can race the combination of Mu Yanling and the Griffin. I'll be starting at 22 life to your 7 after the Chancellor drain, so this might actually be pretty close. If you go for Mu Yanling on your turn 4, you can make a 4/4 on your turn 5 and a second 4/4 on your turn 7 or 8 (to keep your walker), before I can attack with my Chancellor on my turn 9. 2 4/4s is enough to keep me from attacking, and you only generate more threats from there. LL.

    0-6

    7. Tylert: Chancellor of the tangle, Chancellor of the tangle, City of traitors, Eureka (18 life)

    OTP: I Unmask Eureka and you do nothing. W
    OTD: You resolve Eureka, and we both dump our guys, but neither of us ever has profitable attacks so we just stare at each other. D

    4-1

    8. silkster: Lion's Eye Diamond, Lion's Eye Diamond, Incorrigible Youths, Incorrigible Youths (10 life)
    Wow, cool direction to go under everybody here. Your *two youts* kill me before I do much, even when I get to Unmask one of them the other kills me before I land a blocker. LL

    0-6

    9. H: Saltcrusted Steppe, Forest, Mayor of Avabruck, Thragtusk (7 life)

    I'm always able to Unmask the Mayor before you can play it, and I think it always makes sense to do that. After that, its a question of whether the tusk can kill me before I land my Chancellor. I'll be at 22 life, and you're able to land your tusk on your turn 6, which is too slow always. WW

    6-0


    Total: 17 points
    Last edited by alphastryk; 06-11-2020 at 08:58 AM.

  20. #2320

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by alphastryk View Post
    This was a really cool, creative round. Fun to see what looks like 9 completely different decks this time around.

    2. GoblinSmashmaster: Subterranean Hangar, Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Dross, Unmask (18 life)

    OTP: I wish I could Unmask your land, but I cannot. Unmasking one of your chancellors means losing my lifelink one which seems not ideal, but it would prevent you from Unmasking me back without pitching your last guy, so that seems like it makes sense, then Chancellor of the Tangle wins in combat vs Chancellor of the Dross (yay for Vigilance and Reach). W
    OTD: You Unmask my Vial and I do nothing. L

    3-3

    3. alphastryk: Chancellor of the Dross, Chancellor of the Tangle, Aether Vial, Unmask (19 life)

    This is me
    This match up is really weird. Chancellor of the Tangle is the important card here, cause it wins the Chancellor-mirror against one Dross. 6/7 vigilance reach is really the perfect counter to 6/6 flying lifelink.
    OTP, you have to Unmask the Unmask to protect your Tangler, and then your Tangler will have 8 turns to punch through the Dross.
    OTD, after Vial gets Unmasked, you can Unmask back to remove the only threat.
    WD, I think.
    Last edited by silkster; 06-10-2020 at 07:35 PM.

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