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Thread: 4 Card Blind

  1. #481
    Hymn-Slinger
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by apple713 View Post
    I dont know about anyone else hut im struggling to find a new deck that ill be happy with.
    Yeah, me too. I just have so many bad ideas and I can only submit one. It's hard to know what is just bad and what is worse,
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
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  2. #482
    GrimGrin and Glissa are in a boat...

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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    Yeah, me too. I just have so many bad ideas and I can only submit one. It's hard to know what is just bad and what is worse,
    My tech is to allways calculate the score of my new deck vs the last round meta. If it does well enough, i make sure that it is good vs the decks that were good vs the decks that topped the round. it really helps dismissing bad ideas.
    I also try to look at hte decks that were good vs the top decks because if people metagame they are going to play those and also check the result of a match between my new deck and one of these.
    Yes, it's a lot of work :)

    Also i refuse to post the exact same deck everytime :)
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  3. #483
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Tylert View Post
    My tech is to allways calculate the score of my new deck vs the last round meta. If it does well enough, i make sure that it is good vs the decks that were good vs the decks that topped the round. it really helps dismissing bad ideas.
    I also try to look at hte decks that were good vs the top decks because if people metagame they are going to play those and also check the result of a match between my new deck and one of these.
    Yes, it's a lot of work :)

    Also i refuse to post the exact same deck everytime :)
    Yeah, I don't do math. Gross.

    This time, I just picked the worst possible deck from the ones I could think of, because I too am not going to play the same deck again.
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
    Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order

  4. #484

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Tylert View Post
    Also i refuse to post the exact same deck everytime :)
    I have a really bad habit of trying to brute force Elspeth, Sun's Champion when I can't think of anything, but planeswalkers are really bad in the current metagame so I should be fine.

    That reminds me, I was in discussion with the players at NGA to start a CB-related blog, but that never went anywhere. Curious if that is still worth pursuing...

  5. #485
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Eight-ish hours until the deadline now.

    But anyway, time for... Standings for round 4 (assuming the scores in the Google doc are correct):

    1. Wrath of Pie: 58, 5 season points
    2. Tylert: 57, 3 season points
    3. kombatkiwi: 51, 2 season points
    4. apple713: 50, 1 season point
    5. FTW: 48
    6. Ace/Homebrew: 42
    7. JackaBo: 41
    8. H: 41
    9. spirit of the wretch: 37
    10. CptHaddock: 27
    11. Strawberry Dwarf: 24
    12. Whoshim: 25
    13. Asthereal: 20
    14. PirateKing: 3

    This means JackaBo holds the number one spot for this season, but Wrath of Pie jumps to second place, just 2 season points behind the leader.

  6. #486
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    DECKS FOR ROUND 5:

    1. Asthereal (TO): Sandstone Needle, City of Traitors, Boldwyr Heavyweights, Aftershock
    2. Wrath of Pie: Field of Ruin, Phyrexian Revoker, Steel Overseer, Ancient Tomb
    3. CptHaddock: Form of the Dragon, Dwarven Hold, Maze of Ith, Pithing Needle
    4. Whoshim: Plains, Mother of Runes, Student of Warfare, Gideon's Lawkeeper
    5. spirit of the wretch: Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Chalice of the Void, Eater of Days
    6. JackaBo: Bayou, Elves of the deep shadow, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    7. Ace/Homebrew: Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, Radiant Fountain, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    8. FTW: Force of Will, Misthollow Griffin, Saprazzan Cove, Web of Inertia
    9. Strawberry Dwarf: Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Blazing Shoal, Blazing Shoal
    10. Tylert: City of traitors, Field of ruin, Phyrexian revoker, Chronomaton
    11. H: Chalice of the Void, Rackling, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors
    12. apple713: Magus of the Moon, Rift Bolt, Simian Spirit Guide, City of Traitors

    Please post and cross-check your scores.
    I have updated the Google Spreadsheet, so you can enter your scores there as well: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

    Please also let me know if you would like to see one or more cards banned.
    We've given Field of Ruin an extra round to see how damaging it is, so I'll be watching how well it does, but perhaps other cards deserve a look as well.

  7. #487
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Asthereal scores for round 5:

    1. Asthereal (TO): that's me, revisiting my first ever 4CB deck: Sandstone Needle, City of Traitors, Boldwyr Heavyweights, Aftershock
    2. Wrath of Pie: OTP I Aftershock your first land and Heavyweights win the race. OTD you Ruin my first land and any threat will do. 3-3
    3. CptHaddock: T2 Heavyweights, T3 Aftershock Maze and attack. Heavyweights race the Dwarven Hold tick-up. 6-0
    4. Whoshim: Aftershock the Plains as soon as possible. Heavyweights are better than your dudes if you don't have mana to tap or level up. 6-0
    5. spirit of the wretch: Eater of Days, awesome!! Not great against my deck, though. Aftershock Eater, Heavyweights get there. 6-0
    6. JackaBo: OTP Aftershock Elves and the Heavyweights kill you. OTD I have to wait. You just attack with Elves and only use Smallpox if I play a land. I can't afford to lose a land, so Elves take the day. 3-3
    7. Ace/Homebrew: OTP Aftershock your first land, Heavyweights kill you. OTD I play nothing. When you Pox, I discard Heavyweights and then start to play lands. Since you draw your deck in the most awkward order (Emry, then Pox, then Fountain), I am fast enough to Aftershock the Urborg for the draw. 4-1
    8. FTW: If you play Cove and start to tick up, I Aftershock it, you have to Force it, and then I win the race, even OTD, as I have Needle and Aftershock in the yard to exile to Web. So you have to keep Cove in hand. I can't cast Heavyweights, because you will just Force it and I can't win anymore. So you don't play anything, and I drop my lands but also don't cast anything. Two draws. 2-2
    9. Strawberry Dwarf: Heavyweights blocks and kills one token, Shoal is enough to kill Heavyweights. Aftershock takes care of the other token. Two draws. 2-2
    10. Tylert: OTP I Aftershock your first land and Heavyweights win the race. OTD you Ruin my first land and any threat will do. 3-3
    11. H: Aftershock the Rackling, Heavyweights kill you. 6-0
    12. apple713: Magus of the Moon > my deck. 0-6

    Total: 41 points.
    Last edited by Asthereal; 03-20-2019 at 10:09 AM.

  8. #488
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    FTW: Force of Will, Misthollow Griffin, Saprazzan Cove, Web of Inertia

    1. Asthereal (TO): I can't establish Web lock in time, so I have to Force Heavyweights and lose my land into a draw. 2-2
    2. Wrath of Pie: Field of Ruin + 2 threats wrecks me. 0-6
    3. CptHaddock: Maze of Ith stops Griffin, but I FoW Form of the Dragon. 2-2
    4. Whoshim: Web of Inertia FTW. Lawkeeper holds off Griffin, I can't Force it pitching Griffin if you hold it back, so I can never play Griffin. 2-2
    5. spirit of the wretch: FoW pitching Web on Eater, Griffin FTW. 6-0
    6. JackaBo: FoW pitching Web on Elves, you can't cast anything else, Griffin FTW. 6-0
    7. Ace/Homebrew: FoW pitching Web on Smallpox, you never get to recycle, Griffin FTW. 6-0
    8. FTW: Me
    9. Strawberry Dwarf: I can Force one Shoal, but the other works. OTP Web locks you with me at 1 life. OTD both Griffin and Web are 1 turn too slow. 3-3
    10. Tylert: Field of Ruin + 2 threats wrecks me. 0-6
    11. H: FoW pitching Web on Rackling, Griffin FTW. 6-0
    12. apple713: FoW pitching Web on Magus, no more red for Rift Bolt, Griffin FTW. (If you hold and use SSG for Bolt, I Force that instead). 6-0

    Total points: 39

    Turns out Propaganda would have won me more games than Web, beating Strawberry Dwarf (no lands) but still losing to Field of Ruins decks and drawing with CptHaddock and Whoshim. I forget why I thought Web was good. Maybe City of Traitors -> Lupine Prototype, but that's banned.

  9. #489
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    5. spirit of the wretch: Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Chalice of the Void, Eater of Days

    1. Asthereal (TO): Sandstone Needle, City of Traitors, Boldwyr Heavyweights, Aftershock
    - I can't beat Aftershock 0-6

    2. Wrath of Pie: Field of Ruin, Phyrexian Revoker, Steel Overseer, Ancient Tomb
    OTD you get to use field and I can't win. OTP Overseer races me 0-6

    3. CptHaddock: Form of the Dragon, Dwarven Hold, Maze of Ith, Pithing Needle
    I can't beat Maze 0-6

    4. Whoshim: Plains, Mother of Runes, Student of Warfare, Gideon's Lawkeeper
    OTP I play Chalice for 1 and win. OTD you drop Lawkeeper before I drop Chalice and we draw. 4-1

    6. JackaBo: Bayou, Elves of the deep shadow, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    OTP I get down Chalice for 1 and win. OTD you get down the Elf before I drop Chalice. You have to Smallpox, can't replay the Elf and we draw. 4-1

    7. Ace/Homebrew: Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, Radiant Fountain, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    OTP I get down Chalice for 2 and win. OTD I do nothing. When you Pox, I discard Eater and then start to play lands. Since you draw your deck in the most awkward order (Emry, then Pox, then Fountain), I am fast enough to land Chalice for the draw 4-1

    8. FTW: Force of Will, Misthollow Griffin, Saprazzan Cove, Web of Inertia
    I can't beat Force 0-6

    9. Strawberry Dwarf: Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Blazing Shoal, Blazing Shoal
    Wow, this is nice! I can't beat Shoal 0-6

    10. Tylert: City of traitors, Field of ruin, Phyrexian revoker, Chronomaton
    OTP I go Chalice into Eater and that is good enough. OTD Field ruins me 3-3

    11. H: Chalice of the Void, Rackling, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors
    Eater > Rackling in this Matchup 6-0

    12. apple713: Magus of the Moon, Rift Bolt, Simian Spirit Guide, City of Traitors
    I can't beat Magus 0-6

    Total 21 wow, that was bad. And I had such high hopes for the Eater...
    Last edited by spirit of the wretch; 03-20-2019 at 10:57 AM.
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by spirit of the wretch View Post
    5. spirit of the wretch: Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Chalice of the Void, Eater of Days
    vs
    2. Wrath of Pie: Field of Ruin, Phyrexian Revoker, Steel Overseer, Ancient Tomb
    OTD you get to use field and I can't win. OTP Overseer races me 0-6
    You should win OTP. Did you forget his Ancient Tomb damage?

    You - Tomb
    Him - Tomb, Overseer [him=18]

    You - City, Eater [you=18]
    Him - Revoker. Tap Overseer: 2/2 and 3/2 [him =16]
    Him - Tap Overseer: 3/3 and 4/3
    Him - Tap Overseer: 4/4 and 5/4

    You - Attack 9 flying trample [him=7]
    Him - Attack for 9 [you = 9]

    You - Attack FTW

  11. #491
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    H: Chalice of the Void, Rackling, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors

    1. Asthereal (TO): (Sandstone Needle, City of Traitors, Boldwyr Heavyweights, Aftershock)
    Lose in any case, can't beat either payoff. 0-6
    2. Wrath of Pie: (Field of Ruin, Phyrexian Revoker, Steel Overseer, Ancient Tomb)
    I lose this race even on the play, definitely on the draw. 0-6
    3. CptHaddock: (Form of the Dragon, Dwarven Hold, Maze of Ith, Pithing Needle)
    Looks like another race I lose, since Form and Needle can stay in hand. 0-6
    4. Whoshim: Plains, Mother of Runes, Student of Warfare, Gideon's Lawkeeper
    On the play, Calice for 1 wins. On the draw, he has to lead with Student, but he'll keep 2 cards in hand and I lose the race. 3-3 (3)
    5. spirit of the wretch: Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Chalice of the Void, Eater of Days
    Well, that is a better payoff. 0-6 (3)
    6. JackaBo: (Bayou, Elves of the deep shadow, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn)
    On the play, Chlice for 1 means he can't can't Smallpox. On the draw, SotW points out in his post above, we draw, since we can Chalice on 1 and you can't ever replay the Elf. 4-1 (7)
    7. Ace/Homebrew: Urborg, (Tomb of Yawgmoth, Radiant Fountain, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn)
    Chalice on 2 wins in both cases, I think. 4-1 (11)
    8. FTW: (Force of Will, Misthollow Griffin, Saprazzan Cove, Web of Inertia)
    Can't beat Force of Will. 0-6 (11)
    9. Strawberry Dwarf: (Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Blazing Shoal, Blazing Shoal)
    Way too fast, lose in any case. 0-6 (11)
    10. Tylert: (City of traitors, Field of ruin, Phyrexian revoker, Chronomaton)
    Chalice does enough on the play, does nothing on the draw. 3-3 (14)
    11. H: Bye, myself.
    12. apple713: Magus of the Moon, Rift Bolt, Simian Spirit Guide, City of Traitors
    Lose to Magus in any case. 0-6 (14)

    Well, I figured my deck was bad, but it was actually even worse.
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  12. #492
    GrimGrin and Glissa are in a boat...

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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    H: Chalice of the Void, Rackling, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors

    10. Tylert: (City of traitors, Field of ruin, Phyrexian revoker, Chronomaton)
    Chalice does enough on the play, does nothing on the draw. 0-6 (13)
    OTP, you cast Chalice T1 I can't cast chronomaton. I cast Revoker T1.
    Then I don't do anything else so i take 1 per turn If i attack, you don't block and i die because you do 3 per turn. If i don't attack i die to rackling damage. so 3-3???
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  13. #493
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    H, don't we draw when I'm OTP? What are you discarding to Smallpox?

  14. #494
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Opponent Deck OTP OTD Explanation
    1. Asthereal (TO) *Sandstone Needle,*City of Traitors,*Boldwyr Heavyweights,*Aftershock W W Mountains :)
    2. Wrath of Pie *Field of Ruin,*Phyrexian Revoker,*Steel Overseer,*Ancient Tomb D L Magus then rift bolt the overseer before revoker gets bigger than x/2. We draw both. OTD revoker gets too big.
    3. CptHaddock *Form of the Dragon,*Dwarven Hold,*Maze of Ith,*Pithing Needle W W Mountains :)
    4. Whoshim *Plains,*Mother of Runes,*Student of Warfare,*Gideon's Lawkeeper L L The only basic land deck in the bunch…. Mom protects against rift bolt and magus….
    5. spirit of the wretch *Ancient Tomb,*City of Traitors,*Chalice of the Void,*Eater of Days W W Mountains :)
    6. JackaBo *Bayou,*Elves of the deep shadow,*Smallpox,*Emrakul, the Aeons Torn W W Mountains :)
    7. Ace/Homebrew *Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth,*Radiant Fountain,*Smallpox,*Emrakul, the Aeons Torn W W Mountains :)
    8. FTW *Force of Will,*Misthollow Griffin,*Saprazzan Cove,*Web of Inertia L L Force. This was a gamble, I figured that T1 Magus would win more than than running Caverns and making him uncounterable.
    9. Strawberry Dwarf *Chancellor of the Forge,*Chancellor of the Forge,*Blazing Shoal,*Blazing Shoal D D I don’t know when you choose to blaze so I have to keep magus open to block. Rift bolt gets the other.
    10. Tylert *City of traitors,*Field of ruin,*Phyrexian revoker,*Chronomaton D D Rift the chronomaton, block and trade with revoker.
    11. H *Chalice of the Void,*Rackling,*Ancient Tomb,*City of Traitors W W Mountains :)
    12. apple713 *Magus of the Moon,*Rift Bolt,*Simian Spirit Guide,*City of Traitors X X

    12 w
    5 D

    Total = 41

    I'm pretty sure there is a better card to use instead of rift bolt but I'm not sure. I went with rift bolt over regular bolt to be able to pay for sphere in case it was in play. That said, this deck did much better than expected by scooping up 62% of all possible points.
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  15. #495
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Tylert View Post
    OTP, you cast Chalice T1 I can't cast chronomaton. I cast Revoker T1.
    Then I don't do anything else so i take 1 per turn If i attack, you don't block and i die because you do 3 per turn. If i don't attack i die to rackling damage. so 3-3???
    Yeah, that is what I meant to put as the score, but messed up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew View Post
    H, don't we draw when I'm OTP? What are you discarding to Smallpox?
    Hmm, yeah, I don't think we'd draw, I actually think you win on the play. I can't get to 4 mana to have Chalice on 2 so I can't draw.
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  16. #496
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by spirit of the wretch View Post
    (...) And I had such high hopes for the Eater...
    Actually, I think Eater of Days wasn't that bad. Chalice just didn't do enough.

  17. #497
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    1. Asthereal (TO): Sandstone Needle, City of Traitors, Boldwyr Heavyweights, Aftershock
    2. Wrath of Pie: Field of Ruin, Phyrexian Revoker, Steel Overseer, Ancient Tomb
    3. CptHaddock: Form of the Dragon, Dwarven Hold, Maze of Ith, Pithing Needle
    4. Whoshim: Plains, Mother of Runes, Student of Warfare, Gideon's Lawkeeper
    5. spirit of the wretch: Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, Chalice of the Void, Eater of Days
    6. JackaBo: Bayou, Elves of the deep shadow, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    7. Ace/Homebrew: Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, Radiant Fountain, Smallpox, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    8. FTW: Force of Will, Misthollow Griffin, Saprazzan Cove, Web of Inertia
    9. Strawberry Dwarf: Chancellor of the Forge, Chancellor of the Forge, Blazing Shoal, Blazing Shoal
    10. Tylert: City of traitors, Field of ruin, Phyrexian revoker, Chronomaton
    11. H: Chalice of the Void, Rackling, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors
    12. apple713: Magus of the Moon, Rift Bolt, Simian Spirit Guide, City of Traitors

    1. Asthereal: OTP: I can field of ruin one land before you do anything. OTD: boldwyr races anything i play. 3-3 --> 3
    2. Wrath of Pie: OTP: You can only play 1 threat before i field of ruins your land and i will have 2 threats on my side. so i win the first one. second game is a draw because you can land both threats. 4-1 --> 7
    3. CptHaddock: OTP: I can destroy dwarven hold before you land Pithing Needle. and win because i will have 2 threats vs maze if ith. OTD: Same story. 6-0 --> 13
    4. Whoshim: OTP: I win on the Play because my i can stabilize at 9 life and that allows me to not block student while you have to chump block to avoid dying. OTD: Your doublestriking student comes online one turn before and i die to a triple attack at some point 3-3 --> 16
    5. spirit of the wretch: OTP: I play chrono T1 and Destroy your 1 of your land T2 = win. OTD: You T1 chalice, and revoker is not fast enough to kill you before eater of days can attack. 3-3 --> 19
    6. Jackabo: If i T1 phyrexian revoker (otp or otd), you can't smallpox. Win 6-0 --> 25
    7. Ace/Homebrew: OTD: I win because you can't play smallpox (I destroy one of your lands). OTP: It's a draw. If i don't play anything, you can't smallpox because if you do i discard a threat, and destroy one of your lands on T3. 4-1 --> 29
    8. FTW: I destroy your land and win both games because i have 2 threats. 6-0 --> 35
    9. Strawberry dwarf: Standoff both games. I have two threats that will block yours before you kill me. 2-2 --> 37
    10. me
    11. H: OTP i win because i kill your land before you can play rackling. OTD: can't cast chronomaton and phyrexian revoker can't race rackling. 3-3 --> 40
    12. apple713: OTP or OTD, You can't kill both of my threats and i'll be able to play both so stand off. 2-2 --> 42.

    Total = 42.

    I should not have changed my deck :) Sphere of resistance seems way better than phyrexian revoker. or maybe my deck should be the one of Wrath of Pie. With Sphere I would have scored 47 points.

    Sphere of resistance + field of ruins seems strong. Lots of decks fold to the mana denial package and lands decks can't win because of field of ruin.
    If it's not banned next round, i'll play a variation of it. so please guys prove me that it's not too much oppressive by metagaming against me :)
    Last edited by Tylert; 03-20-2019 at 03:22 PM.
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  18. #498
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew View Post
    H, don't we draw when I'm OTP? What are you discarding to Smallpox?
    More importantly, he has to sacrifice a land too, which prevents him from casting either Rackling or Chalice @ 2 no matter what he discards. Then you would win.

    He can force a draw by playing 0 lands. If you Smallpox, he discards Rackling and can drop Chalice @ 2 before the random reshuffle gives you Smallpox back. Otherwise you both stare at each other and do nothing.

  19. #499
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    More importantly, he has to sacrifice a land too, which prevents him from casting either Rackling or Chalice @ 2 no matter what he discards. Then you would win. He can force a draw by playing 0 lands.
    I always forget about the "do nothing" option...
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by apple713 View Post
    2. Wrath of Pie *Field of Ruin,*Phyrexian Revoker,*Steel Overseer,*Ancient Tomb D D Magus then rift bolt the overseer before revoker gets bigger than x/2. We draw both

    I'm pretty sure there is a better card to use instead of rift bolt but I'm not sure. I went with rift bolt over regular bolt to be able to pay for sphere in case it was in play. That said, this deck did much better than expected by scooping up 64% of all possible points.
    Doesn't this go wrong on the draw?
    As in:
    T1: Tomb, Overseer
    T1: Magus
    T2: Field, Revoker. Tap Overseer (O=2/2, R=3/2)
    T2: Suspend Rift Bolt
    T3: Tap Overseer (O=3/3, R=4/3)
    T3: Rift Bolt resolves.

    I think you could maybe have gone for Dismember.
    Regular Bolt runs into both Chalice and Sphere, but Dismember at least dodges Chalice.
    Or you could have gone über meta and try Lava Dart. Perhaps a tad too meta though.

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