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Thread: Modern Horizons Spoilers

  1. #281

    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Barook View Post
    ....
    This could do some fun stuff with Dreadhorde Arcanist and Brainstorm/Faithless Looting:
    ...
    In modern people are going to try it with Baral/Electromancer and Jeskai Ascendancy.

  2. #282
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    Do you think this will make the cut for zombardment?
    No idea, I don't play Zombardment. But this card seems almost tailor-made for it (although, most likely, it was made with some kind of Aristrocrats deck in mind).

  3. #283

    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers



    Force of Despair

    If it’s not your turn, you may exile a black card from your hand rather than pay this spell’s mana cost. Destroy all creatures that entered the battlefield this turn

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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBleiweiss View Post


    Force of Despair

    If it’s not your turn, you may exile a black card from your hand rather than pay this spell’s mana cost. Destroy all creatures that entered the battlefield this turn
    Am I the only one that thinks this card kind of blows?
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Huh, a Black pseudo-Cradle to Grave wrath. This is actually rather interesting, but ultimately I think it just doesn't have enough utility. Except maybe vs something like Elves.
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
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  6. #286
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Cool vs elves as mentioned, but also a good out vs empty the warrens. Looks like a sb card at best, also kills true name.
    -rob

  7. #287
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    Am I the only one that thinks this card kind of blows?
    Nope. The upside of removal vs. countermagic is that removal can be saved until it's relevant. This is a removal spell with the restriction of a counterspell. It would be good against decks that play multiple threats a turn, but that isn't typical in any format really. I suppose it could be good against D&T and Goblins in legacy, but forcing yourself into card disadvantage against decks with inherent card advantage? Yeah, good luck with that. EDIT: even as a sideboard card it seems too narrow.

    I think 'blows' is too generous.
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    Nope. The upside of removal vs. countermagic is that removal can be saved until it's relevant. This is a removal spell with the restriction of a counterspell.

    I think 'blows' is too generous.
    Well, I think that is a sort of false analog there. I mean, indeed, in a sense, if you are looking to stop one creature then yes, this sucks vs. a traditional counter. However, the "utility" of this spell is in cases like vs. Elves or Empty or something else, where you can catch multiple creatures. I'm not saying this card is great, just that I don't think it is terrible. It's just a niche card, which, is different to me.
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Pretty funny against Flickerwisp/DnT stuff. Beware of your local Pox players.

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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Don't they just vial on your turn and then if you tapped down your card has no text? Doesn't even do anything to the Collected Company decks in modern because they just Coco on your turn.
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
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    Top quality german restraint there.

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  11. #291
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    It strikes me as a unexpectedly strong pivot from rewarding you for playing on your opponent's turn with alternate casting to pretty much exclusively playing on your opponent's turn.
    There are lots of games where the blue and green one will be hardcast, but this one seems much more unlikely.

    It isn't just an old card stuffed into this cycle's templating though, so that's something at least
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhale View Post
    Gross, other formats. I puked in my mouth a little.

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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    Don't they just vial on your turn and then if you tapped down your card has no text? Doesn't even do anything to the Collected Company decks in modern because they just Coco on your turn.
    Probably, but it does stop some of the hardcast Flickerwisp lines. It's probably about as effective as Rock the Croc (Bontu's Last Reckoning). Is this new card an instant if hardcast?

  13. #293

    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers



    Trample, Haste

    Whenever Lightning Skelemental deals combat damage to a player, that player discards two cards.

    At the beginning of the end step, sacrifice Lightning Skelemental.
    Hnngggg, dat art!

  14. #294
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    Well, I think that is a sort of false analog there. I mean, indeed, in a sense, if you are looking to stop one creature then yes, this sucks vs. a traditional counter. However, the "utility" of this spell is in cases like vs. Elves or Empty or something else, where you can catch multiple creatures. I'm not saying this card is great, just that I don't think it is terrible. It's just a niche card, which, is different to me.
    It was only part of the analysis. The other part is the card disadvantage. If you are attempting to deal with multiple creatures, lets say you at least want to get 2 creatures with this 'niche' card, then you are getting a 2-for-2. This isn't bad, but as I said you are facing decks with inherent card advantage (Elves has Glimpse, D&T has SFM/Recruiter, and Goblins has Matron/Ringleader.) It's already going to be hard to keep up with their 2-for-1's already and this card puts you even further behind. If you hardcast it (reasonable at 3 mana) it should be fine, but to do that in a reasonable amount of time against those decks is pushing the boundaries.

    While I don't think it is terrible in design I think it will be poor in practice. It seems like a trap card outside of extremely niche decks like Manaless Dredge. Once it lands in niche decks it becomes part of the plan to work around what they have available. I guess I'll slow roll my threats to ensure you always 2-for-1 yourself, or in best case it's an inefficient removal spell at 3 mana (by legacy and modern standards.)

    I think the real issue is the floor is high enough to be testable, but the ceiling isn't high enough to make the cut.
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    While I don't think it is terrible in design I think it will be poor in practice. It seems like a trap card outside of extremely niche decks like Manaless Dredge.
    Well, I actually think it's a rather "poor" design and it's really quite limited in a way that severely hurts it's playability. That said, I guess this is a way that some sort of Black but non-Blue deck could try to "not lose" to Sneak and Show or Elves, but in the end, it's still not great (because in the case of GBrand, they likely draw 14). But it isn't really terrible, but it's also really not very good.

    So, I think we essentially agree, except I find a tiny amount of utility, where you don't. In the end, it's unlikely to see much play in Legacy.
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    Well, I actually think it's a rather "poor" design and it's really quite limited in a way that severely hurts it's playability. That said, I guess this is a way that some sort of Black but non-Blue deck could try to "not lose" to Sneak and Show or Elves, but in the end, it's still not great (because in the case of GBrand, they likely draw 14). But it isn't really terrible, but it's also really not very good.

    So, I think we essentially agree, except I find a tiny amount of utility, where you don't. In the end, it's unlikely to see much play in Legacy.
    Well stated, and we're just speculating anyways. I could be completely wrong and it could be an excellent card.

    I think they were worried it would be too powerful so they gave it the 'entered this turn' clause. This is again just speculation, but I think they were planning on the ceiling being 'you get a 2-card payout out of your 2 card cost.' In legacy's higher threshold of power we expect more than that.
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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Force of Despair probably would have been more interesting if it was 2-3cmc (+pitch option) and made a No Mercy effect. [also kills TNN]

  18. #298

    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Am I the only one who thinks this exists as an answer to stuff like Through the Breach/Goryo's?

    It's relevant in Legacy for the same reasons, but this set was primarily designed for modern. And there it does answer a lot of "haste kill" plans, whether that be Titan/Illharg/Emrakul, or whatever.

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    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by morgan_coke View Post
    Am I the only one who thinks this exists as an answer to stuff like Through the Breach/Goryo's?

    It's relevant in Legacy for the same reasons, but this set was primarily designed for modern. And there it does answer a lot of "haste kill" plans, whether that be Titan/Illharg/Emrakul, or whatever.
    I mean, on one hand, you are likely right, but on the other, it's not a very good solution.

    Because if they put in GBrand, they likely draw 7, 14 cards, so they actually 14-2 you. If they put in Worldspine, they get 15 power. So, it could stop you from dying right now, but likely not in the long term.
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
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  20. #300

    Re: Modern Horizons Spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by bruizar View Post
    it's a myth called promissory estoppel
    I, too, read that article that ignored the fact they already printed cards on the reserved list.

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