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Thread: Legacy Innovations and Brews

  1. #21
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
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  2. #22
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Quote Originally Posted by colo View Post
    Retrofitter Foundry is an awesome anti-control card that I've enjoyed in various Painter lists, and I'd love to build a deck around it some time.However, in this particular list, I think that you simply MUST run The Antiquities War.
    yea i agree. i think antiquities war probably has a place in this list somewhere.

    it's possible that the esper deck wants to do everything, that's kind of where i think the "focus" or lack there of is.

    it wants the delver + daze + force to close out games vs combo, but it wants to also be able to run the slow game vs the control decks. there's a bunch of things that are awkward in it, i don't think anyone is disputing that!

    i'm not sure liliana's triumph is strictly worse than diabolic edict.

    both are instants, one allows you to target yourself, the other gets around leyline of sanctity. he's also running 1 liliana in the sb fwiw.
    -rob

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  4. #24
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Looks like a deck that has been refined. I'm not really into stone forge decks, but I do like that daretti. :)

    Maybe we can get that guy to comment.
    -rob

  5. #25
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    I think this thopter deck could gain a lot from urza and could even justify running a cradle in there.

    Play an ornithopter, get a token with Sai and net +UU mana. Not sure if that's just Christmasland, but seems like an easy 1 of.
    -rob

  6. #26
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    The Retrofitter deck is intriguing! But where do you want to go from here? Just post links to ideas? IMO, we need a dedicated thread to something like this. On the other hand the Development forum is full of such decks, so what's the point?

    @Retrofitter deck:
    - I think it needs more disruption like Tangle Wire.
    - Roterothopter seems too weak for me, weaker than Hope of Ghirapur
    - I'd take it into an Artificer Tribal deck, with Stoneforge to search all these singleton equipments and Thopter Engineer to give your constructs haste.
    - Or maybe more control with Thopter Foundry combo
    - Urza fits very well, I agree

  7. #27

    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Ran a Retrofitter deck with Antiquities War and Sai some months back and went 4-0 and another 4-0 in side events at an SCG Open.

  8. #28
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Sounds awesome. Do you have your lists from back then? Wondering how it compares with this list.
    -rob

  9. #29

    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    I don't have a list as it was a deck I played against, but here are some of the cards I saw:

    Sol Lands (tomb/city)
    Karn, Scion of Urza
    Urza's/Mishra's Bauble
    LED
    Walking Ballista
    Monastery Mentor
    Auriok Salvagers

    LED and Slavagers = infinite mana, which powered out the ballista or gave infinite prowess with mentor. I don't know if that deck is established or not but a search here didn't yield anything on the first page.

    That was all I saw of the list and I think it was mono white + colorless. I meant to follow up with him to see how he did. Couldn't remember what removal he had as I didn't see any (I was running ruby storm against him so he basically got to goldfish until I went off or died).
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  10. #30

    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Quote Originally Posted by ronco View Post
    I don't have a list as it was a deck I played against, but here are some of the cards I saw:

    Sol Lands (tomb/city)
    Karn, Scion of Urza
    Urza's/Mishra's Bauble
    LED
    Walking Ballista
    Monastery Mentor
    Auriok Salvagers

    LED and Slavagers = infinite mana, which powered out the ballista or gave infinite prowess with mentor. I don't know if that deck is established or not but a search here didn't yield anything on the first page.

    That was all I saw of the list and I think it was mono white + colorless. I meant to follow up with him to see how he did. Couldn't remember what removal he had as I didn't see any (I was running ruby storm against him so he basically got to goldfish until I went off or died).
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  11. #31
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    I was referencing Michael's post about his thopter deck.
    -rob

  12. #32

    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    artifact decks will always be subpar in a world of Null Rod Karn and B2B Moon

    a Null Rod against that list is virtually unbeatable

  13. #33
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    fortunately i think a person playing reterothopters doesn't really care about what other people are playing! :)

    i would be super excited to play this with contamination or opposition.
    -rob

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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    @mistercakes on the Foil/Narset/Draw 7 deck. I forgot about Foil's Island requirement so probably land base 10 Island, 4 Vista, 4 Tomb, pick 2 utility land. I will say though that being able to profitably pitch Echo of Eons backed up by Day's Undoing + Narset playset is probably the main source of 'powerful enough to compete in legacy.' I think you have to back it up with Chalice's 'oops, I win.'

    The main issue is that you need to be able to win the game, particularly against things on board. I think you run out of slots here. If Dev Tide was instant (or could be set up) it might work better, but Thing in the Ice is probably more realistic (just lack slots to play it). This is where As Foretold outclasses the Narset cheese strategy, b/c they play Balance and more walkers that win games (JTMS full of Chandra).

    I think any Narset strat is going to run into this issue where you kinda need Narset and new Teferi on board at same time to do something interesting which exploits bounce threats/shuffle away/draw 6 more than opponent + Time Stop aspect of Day's Undoing (on your turn) with Teferi's +1 instant speed. Just to illustrate how slot intensive the jank is: use the new PW Piper (2/2 that sneaks in walkers), dump a mostly uncastable superfriend into play on their EoT -> begin your turn, +1 Teferi -> EoT exile trigger = Day's Undoing as Time Stop. Once you realize how many slots you're going to need, you probably back off the Narset plan and maximize Day's Undoing~Time Stop with Teferi +1; here though you still need something fundamentally broken you're either drawing into on their EoT (w/o risk of interaction) or something heroic with Time Stop mode.

    There is certainly something there with Narset/Echo/Foil core, it's just hard to see what the endgame is. You're definitely on Tomb (thus Chalice mandatory), but board control and wincon parts are a little too fuzzy. One thing for sure though is that kind of deck can definitely prey on Hymn/SCM recursion nonsense, and it also randomly has an amazingly hilarious gameplan vs yard combo in all games. On countermagic, I don't think FoN has any place in such a deck b/c you need to be able to kill creatures on the stack; as submitted you'd basically auto-lose to resolved YP or Mentor if they ever made a token.

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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    I was referencing Michael's post about his thopter deck.
    I'll message you the list, I think it wasn't published here, iirc, so I'll leave that up to the great creator (not sarcasm, just a reverent pun) to decide on that. ;)

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  17. #37
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    I don't think there needs to be strict requirements on if it qualified to be a brew or not. For me it should just generate some interest from the members of the forum on a general scale.

    It has a lot of fun cards in there and probably wins a lot of the non combo matchup.

    Where'd ya find the list, and can you put tags around the deck?
    -rob

  18. #38
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    I know mistercakes and some of the Painter crew have seen this, but it's definitely a brew and something I've been tinkering with since the printing of Karn.

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    Land (20)
    1x Ancient Den
    4x Ancient Tomb
    4x Arid Mesa
    3x City of Traitors
    1x Great Furnace
    2x Mountain
    2x Plains
    3x Plateau

    Instant (2)
    2x Enlightened Tutor

    Planeswalker (4)
    4x Karn, the Great Creator

    Artifact (18)
    3x Grindstone
    3x Lion's Eye Diamond
    1x Lodestone Bauble
    4x Lotus Petal
    4x Mishra's Bauble
    3x Mox Opal

    Creature (16)
    3x Auriok Salvagers
    2x Ethersworn Canonist
    3x Goblin Welder
    4x Imperial Recruiter
    3x Painter's Servant
    1x Walking Ballista

    Sideboard (15)
    1x Abrade
    1x Ensnaring Bridge
    1x Ethersworn Canonist
    1x Grindstone
    1x Lion's Eye Diamond
    1x Magus of the Moon
    1x Mycosynth Lattice
    1x Painter's Servant
    1x Pithing Needle
    1x Pyroblast
    1x Red Elemental Blast
    2x Surgical Extraction
    1x Tormod's Crypt
    1x Walking Ballista

  19. #39
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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    i like this list. my only concern is painter doesn't add a lot of value without the red blasts. (of course it's another combo, which is cool)
    -rob

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    Re: Legacy Innovations and Brews

    This is very rough, but do we have enough gas with Dreadhorde Arcanist to keep working on Mardu Pyromancer?

    Arcanist is good with cantrips, but what about free looting's and thought seizes?
    "eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"

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