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Thread: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

  1. #61

    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    I don't know, one thing I like about Legacy is that players are really attached to their decks and the format. In Modern it isn't like this, the decks are ugly and players play them just because they win. I'm pretty young (19 yo) but I managed to save money and spend it to build Legacy decks and I have almost 4 completed decks, so if it was possible for me it could be possible for others. I think the only problem is the limited print run of some cards of the first expansions, but for now it shouldn't be a concern since on mkm the card availability is high

  2. #62
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    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    One of my LGS just approved is to start having a 20 proxy legacy weekly. Weekly legacy has been dead here about a year but here's to hoping the upcoming GP drums up interest
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  3. #63

    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    Legacy is a diverse format with the largest number of viable strategies of any format in magic’s history. Thats the formats appeal. Thats why people are switching from modern to legacy...

    https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/c...ern_to_legacy/

    Why force people to sick to only one deck to experience? That gets boring. Let them us proxies and try out a number of different decks.

    Also those trying to buy into legacy now would have to sell their car to afford the dual lands. Not many people would be willing to invest a small fortune to switch from Modern to Legacy. Atleast allow MPC proxies of the lands.

  4. #64
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    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    Although i think obvious proxies are ok (such as writing on an official card) or something, i understand wotc’s position and respect it. Also, i dont really want to sit across the table from someone who has a bunch of proxies in their deck as the pictures can be misleading.

    Accurate looking proxies are bad for everyone. People will get harmed and it’s really difficult to police. This is one of the reasons wotc is so strict about not sanctioning proxied tournaments as it incentivizes their creation.

    People who dont know they are proxies are likely to trade for them at some point and even if “you” would never do that, someone will. If a standard player is trying to get int legacy and he Gets burned for a few hundred dollars by unknowingly trading for fake cards, he probably quits the game all together and wotc loses business.




    One of the issues with card prices and tournament attendance are people like me who were once active, trading and attending tournaments, but are now not. Ive gotten older and moved away from the community I grew up with. It is also less appealing to sit in a smelly card shop on a weekend when I have a family who fights for my time and I'm working 60+ hours a week. So the cards i have in my collection are effectively permanently removed from the card pool. 2-3 complete playsets of duals and fetchlands along with countless other reserve list staples. I know there are others like me and this adds up.



    Also, Id like to point out that legacy isnt as hard to get into as its made out to be. If you add up the money standard players spend over the course of a year they could probably afford a handful of duals to get in to the format. I feel like they spend more frequently but smaller amounts and they never do the math. 3x booster boxes a year at @ $100 each plus maybe an extra box on something like modern masters $250?

    How many drafts do they play in? How many prereleases?
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  5. #65
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    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    Maybe a more applicable question is whether or not the expectation that players at certain levels even need to bring their own cards is even reasonable? FNM is one thing but like - at a certain point I don't know if it should even be on the player to bring their own cards. When I kept case with competitive players I didn't know anyone who didn't practice with a matrix. You can get gud with a deck without owning a single card.

    I wonder how different or how much more inclusive high-level play would be if at a certain REL you could just register a decklist and have it provided by the venue. Could do away with logistical dumbfuckery like deck-checks, cut down on theft, even reduce the need to even ask if proxies are a necessary evil because ultimately you can rely on WotC to provide your 75 at high level events...

    I mean - lately I've been following FF:TCG and at this weekend's event there was a dude who turned himself in for running 5 copies of a card in his deck (the max in Final Fantasy is 3 and decks are 50 cards so it's a huge deal). Now the community is up in arms about whether it was intentional or not, whether dude should advance or not, etc etc. And the offender is a relatively new player too, so the question of whether it was a legit mistake by a n00b is being floated - and it sucks if that is all that it is, because now that new player is starting out with a tarnished reputation. Whole thing could have been avoided if an overseeing committee were providing the game pieces.

    It isn't that weird, right - how many professional sportsball people provide their own equipment? How often do Texas Hold 'em players bring their own cards to events, probably never? If we just talk high-level play, what makes Magic so special that we're expected to own 100% of the game pieces we intend to use? The further I get from the game, the less sense it makes.
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  6. #66

    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post

    It isn't that weird, right - how many professional sportsball people provide their own equipment? How often do Texas Hold 'em players bring their own cards to events, probably never? If we just talk high-level play, what makes Magic so special that we're expected to own 100% of the game pieces we intend to use? The further I get from the game, the less sense it makes.
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  7. #67
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    Re: Should we embrace the use of MPC proxies in order to prevent legacy’s death?

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    Maybe a more applicable question is whether or not the expectation that players at certain levels even need to bring their own cards is even reasonable? FNM is one thing but like - at a certain point I don't know if it should even be on the player to bring their own cards. When I kept case with competitive players I didn't know anyone who didn't practice with a matrix. You can get gud with a deck without owning a single card.

    I wonder how different or how much more inclusive high-level play would be if at a certain REL you could just register a decklist and have it provided by the venue. Could do away with logistical dumbfuckery like deck-checks, cut down on theft, even reduce the need to even ask if proxies are a necessary evil because ultimately you can rely on WotC to provide your 75 at high level events...
    So the issue here is that if WOTC provides cards at high level events its presents a conflict of interest because they want to sell cards. If people didn't have to buy cards to compete in an event why would anyone buy them? Sure local events may require them but you still...

    Also, how would WOTC be able to provide all of the cards for the events? Would they buy them from the open market? Would they print everything they need? If they printed all these extra cards, do they destroy them all after the tournament? do they require that they are returned? What if someone steals the cards that WOTC lent them? Maybe they do a special tournament printing? Who sleeves all the decks?

    The point here is that there are lots of questions that need to be answered. I'm sure they could be figured out but its going to incur an additional cost and players are going to have to pay it.

    However, if WOTC was not involved in the process and lets say someone like SCG who has tons of extra fucking cards started "renting" decks for their events that would allow other players to participate at a much more affordable cost. Hell, I wish I could rent out my collection. There is actually a company that does this and it's genius. check them out. They seem to be having issues with their paper rental service at the moment and I dont know that it was ever working right but conceptually it's a good idea.

    Wouldn't it be great if players who have extra cards not being used could loan their card out on consignment to a service like this?
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    why cards are so expensive...hoarders

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