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Thread: Dark Depth-Hogaak

  1. #81
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    Re: DarkDepth-Hogaak

    Quote Originally Posted by non-inflammable View Post
    is there another avenue to tweak this? hivemind engaged.
    MatsOle got 7th in yesterday's MTGO Challenge with the list below.

    Also, DNSolver got 6th and Sharkcaster_Mage got 20th with lists more typical of this thread.

    // Creature (14)
    4 Elvish Reclaimer
    1 Fierce Empath
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis
    1 Ramunap Excavator
    1 Reclamation Sage
    3 Satyr Wayfinder
    1 Sylvan Safekeeper
    1 Titania, Protector of Argoth

    // Sorcery (11)
    3 Cabal Therapy
    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    4 Thoughtseize

    // Instant (4)
    4 Crop Rotation

    // Artifact (4)
    4 Mox Diamond

    // Land (27)
    3 Ancient Tomb
    2 Bayou
    1 Bojuka Bog
    4 Dark Depths
    1 Dryad Arbor
    1 Forest
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Khalni Garden
    1 Misty Rainforest
    1 Savannah
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    1 Swamp
    4 Thespian's Stage
    4 Verdant Catacombs
    1 Wasteland

    // Sideboard
    SB: 3 Abrupt Decay
    SB: 2 Assassin's Trophy
    SB: 1 Karakas
    SB: 1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
    SB: 1 Mindbreak Trap
    SB: 2 Plague Engineer
    SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
    SB: 2 Thorn of Amethyst
    SB: 1 Toxic Deluge

  2. #82

    Re: DarkDepth-Hogaak

    I checked out twitch just a bit ago to see what streams were going on and come to find out Eternal Weekend Asia is this weekend. I tuned in just as the Legacy Finals had wrapped up and asked in the chat about what was in the finals and what the turnout was. For a an event with 663 players the finals was Hogaak Depths vs Dark Depths. While Hogaak Depths didn't win it, it still is a very respectable result for it.

  3. #83

    Re: DarkDepth-Hogaak

    T8 of EW Asia was 5!! Depths with at least 2 Hogaak Depths. I guess the word is out of the insaneness of Hogaak & Depths :)

  4. #84

    Re: DarkDepth-Hogaak

    I'm new to Depths (sort of, used to have Hexmage/Depths as random combo way back in the days) and these Hogaak/Depths lists look great. They have so many cards I want to play for ages but couldn't put together yet. Hogaak seems to be the perfect link.

    So what do you guys think of this list? It's been a blast putting it together and playtesting it so far.
    Bloodghasts are really nice to flashback therapy and get back Hogaak. Also really decent for the backup beatdown plan.
    When reading around here and in the discord in the depths topics I see Loam being slow, but it's just stupid consistant so I added one. Almost always happy to find it to fill up the grave and get back manaland or the combo.
    Sejiri Steppe to the side since it felt really "meh" main but I can see it have it's use side.
    Thoughtseize to SB since you'll be getting more flashbacks out of Therapy by having more Satyrs and Bloodghasts. Feel like you only actually need it in combo matchups.

    I feel like the deck wants one more Bayou instead of a fetch since you "dregde" alot of cards away. It's a bummer if you randomly put your Bayou/basics in the grave.

    Creature (24)
    4 Stitcher's Supplier
    4 Satyr Wayfinder
    4 Bloodghast

    4 Vampire Hexmage
    4 Elvish Reclaimer
    4 Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis

    Spells (9)
    4 Cabal Therapy
    1 Life from the Loam
    4 Crop Rotation

    Land (27)
    4 Dark Depths
    4 Thespian's Stage

    1 Forest
    1 Swamp
    2 Bayou

    4 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Misty Rainforest
    2 Polluted Delta

    3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1 Khalni Garden
    1 Dryad Arbor
    1 Bojuka Bog
    1 Wasteland

    //Sideboard (15)
    2 Surgical Extraction
    3 Not of This World
    4 Assassin's Trophy
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Karakas
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    3 Thoughtseize

  5. #85
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    Re: DarkDepth-Hogaak

    LOL has this deck reached a point where we need a SB strategy for the mirror?

    Draggo, have you playtested your list much yet? Thoughtseize is very strong against non-combo decks too. Most fair decks have no or few mainboard ways to interact with Marit Lage. Thoughtseize + Therapy keeps them off those few answers. It can also just take counters or draw spells or win conditions to buy tempo until you go off.

    7-8 turn 1 discard is a higher probability of having one, instead of 4 (you won't have one more than half the time). It also gives you information to make Therapy better (when you have both). Having more ways to flashback Therapy doesn't increase your chance of drawing any discard.

    Not of This World looks worse than Sylvan Safekeeper. They both achieve the same function (protect your win condition from stuff like StP), except that Safekeeper is repeatable, protects other things too (e.g. Elvish Reclaimer), and is a green weenie to convoke.

  6. #86
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    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    I am moving this into the DTB because I feel its playing a rather significant part in the uptick of Depths of late.
    It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spam View Post
    Do not make fun of lands masters, they've spent many years mastering the punishing fire technique in the secret loam monastery. Do not mistake them with the miracles masters, eternal rivals, they won't like it.
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVicious View Post
    I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dice_Box View Post
    Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVicious View Post
    Something about how fun it is pulling the wings off flies and microwaving the neighbors cat?

  7. #87
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    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    I played this deck for the first time last night, didn't play it in modern, so I really didn't know what I was doing. Went 4-0 in matches against competitive decks. Hogaak is the real deal in Legacy.
    Originally Posted by Forbiddian

    "Drawing it consistently" is a joke. It doesn't matter whether you have 10 copies or 1 copy. Some games you'll start with it. Some games you'll start without it
    .

    I'm thoroughly convinced that talking to you morons kills braincells. Your parent's should have been sterilized.

  8. #88
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    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    It is. I find if the opening assault is answered the deck runs out of steam fast, but very few decks not playing White are able to do that.
    It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spam View Post
    Do not make fun of lands masters, they've spent many years mastering the punishing fire technique in the secret loam monastery. Do not mistake them with the miracles masters, eternal rivals, they won't like it.
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVicious View Post
    I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dice_Box View Post
    Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVicious View Post
    Something about how fun it is pulling the wings off flies and microwaving the neighbors cat?

  9. #89

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    Quote Originally Posted by Dice_Box View Post
    It is. I find if the opening assault is answered the deck runs out of steam fast, but very few decks not playing White are able to do that.
    Depending on the matchup sometimes it's better to slow play a bit (prioritize discard) to avoid completely running out of gas right away.

    That's also where I like Loam. Dredging your Loam back gives Hogaak food (with a little luck a single dredge can almost be enough to recast Hogaak i.e. mill for 3 and get back a Garden or Dryad) and gives you three chances to find a Depth's piece.

    This is definitely the real deal. Every card synergizes so well together. It feels unfair being able to shred someone with discard, cast Hogaak, and threaten Marit Large all at the same time.

  10. #90
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    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    Oh no, the real fun is when you make Lage and then use her to cast Hogaak.

    In not personally sold on having Loam main in this list, not sure I can dig up the space. What have you go?
    It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spam View Post
    Do not make fun of lands masters, they've spent many years mastering the punishing fire technique in the secret loam monastery. Do not mistake them with the miracles masters, eternal rivals, they won't like it.
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVicious View Post
    I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dice_Box View Post
    Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVicious View Post
    Something about how fun it is pulling the wings off flies and microwaving the neighbors cat?

  11. #91

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Blood View Post
    It feels unfair being able to shred someone with discard, cast Hogaak, and threaten Marit Large all at the same time.
    it does feel unfair even with poor starts...

    i played against a leylines deck and he had leyline of the voids both games and it still was a slaughter.
    the hilarity was when he opened with two leylines of the meek and one leyline of the void.

    after stripping his hand with discard, i beat him to death with plant tokens...
    however, the hogaaks just sit in your hand though.

  12. #92

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    From last mtgo challlenge most of the RUG delver decks where with 2 crop/1 karakas in side ; it seems very bad for us... :(

    https://magic.wizards.com/en/article...off-2019-09-09

  13. #93
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    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    Quote Originally Posted by adrieng View Post
    From last mtgo challlenge most of the RUG delver decks where with 2 crop/1 karakas in side ; it seems very bad for us... :(

    https://magic.wizards.com/en/article...off-2019-09-09
    I think Pithing Needle's stock will go up again. Rather than trying to play your own Wastelands, maybe its better to just Needle their Karakas/Wasteland/W&6. It doesn't play into the Mox Diamond/Loam plan as much, but it's known and reliable tech.
    I am counted amongst legions of the unrighteous
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  14. #94

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    What are everyones thoughts on the new card, Once upon a time.

    For those not familiar : http://mythicspoiler.com/ted/cards/onceuponatime.html

    This card seems like it does everything we want. Can find Depths/any land needed or Hogaak, satyr wayfinder, sylvan safekeeper, hexmage. Its generally free early game and even in the mid to late game when you do pay the mana for it's still good.

    The selling point for me though is making hands keepable that previously weren't (hands with colored spells but no colored mana) as long as this card is part of that hand. It also accelerates the speed at which you can kill when you can find what you need for free on turn 1 and then play a discard spell the same turn.

    I think it's definitely worth trying

    What does everyone else think?

  15. #95

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    I just built this deck as my first legacy deck.

    Does anyone have any advice for sideboarding? A sideboard guide would be really appreciated.

    I am using the 61 card list thats on mtggoldfish.

    https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2263022#paper

    Thanks!

  16. #96

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    hello boys Just to comment my deck-building doubts.

    I'm comparing DLs in order to select what DL could be more suitable for me, taking account I would like to keep Marit Lage as Plan A (the main plan)
    So 4xDD 4xTS and the Crop Rotations are a must for me and at less 3 x Urborg sounds well, specially if we will include some Hymns -even in the SB-.


    But I had some doubts regarding the rest... checking the different decklists:

    1. NUMBER OF CREATURES:
    we can find different number of creatures:14 or 19 or 24 ...

    I would like to play the Hexmages, because they are very good for main combo (plan A), for convoke Hogaak (plan B) and even in certain situations they are a slow clock dealing damage. This because I'm not sold with 14 creatures. Adding Bloodghast can be mostly meta-dependent, Our regular DL can play well around GY hate but including Bloodghast could improve the Surgicals as answer versus our deck
    Sitcher Suppliers... better to include them for Hogaak plan


    2.NUMBER OF HOGAAKS:
    the Hogaak itself: what is better to play more copies, or use tutors or both? GSZ? Fierce Empath?

    3. MOXES OR PETALS:
    Mox Diamonds or petals? I would like to play moxes and they are good for Reclaimers...

    1 x Khalni Garden is for sure very good to convoke and can help Dryad Arbor to avoid Edicts

    Sylvan Safekeeper in the SB are OK also.

    As you can see, I have many doubts, whatever advice will be very appreciated. Thank you in advance

  17. #97

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    Bloodghast was something I theorized in the beginning but ultimately dismissed.

    The longer I played the deck, and the more Karakas/StP entered the format (over the past few months), the worse the 4x Supplier 4x Hogaak shell became, obviously. Supplier is pretty weak and you never want more than 1 in a game, so probably max out on 2 copies.

    I haven't tried the Matsole list with no Hexmages, but that looks interesting because I'm so into Green Sun's Zenith recently.

    Edict effects have declined in the meta with some other flexible answers like Tyrant's Scorn seeing play in U/B/x or 4-color decks. Khalni garden is still playable but I don't think more than 1x is needed.
    If you're wondering how I produce blue mana, I copy my opponent's Island with Thespian's Stage

    My Youtube and Twitch usernames are DNSolver.

    I am the Legacy metagame:

    -2016 Eternal Weekend Europe won by BR Reanimator (I wrote the primer)
    -2016 Eternal Weekend North America won by Turbo Dark Depths (I write about and develop the winning version specifically)
    -Refiner of Hogaak Depths.

  18. #98

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    Thanks DNSolver for your advices

  19. #99

    Re: Dark Depth-Hogaak

    So I've been testing some more cards and fine tuned my list some more.

    Creature (22)
    4 Stitcher's Supplier
    4 Satyr Wayfinder
    1 Bloodghast
    1 Dryad Arbor
    4 Vampire Hexmage
    4 Elvish Reclaimer
    4 Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis

    Spells (12)
    4 Cabal Therapy
    1 Life from the Loam
    4 Crop Rotation
    2 Thoughtseize
    1 Entomb

    Land (26)
    4 Dark Depths
    4 Thespian's Stage

    1 Forest
    2 Swamp
    2 Bayou

    4 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Misty Rainforest
    1 Polluted Delta

    3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1 Khalni Garden
    1 Bojuka Bog
    1 Wasteland

    //Sideboard (15)
    2 Surgical Extraction
    4 Assassin's Trophy
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Karakas
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    1 Thoughtseize
    2 Sorcerous Spyglass
    1 Blast Zone

    1 Moldervine Cloak (up for testing)
    1 Maze of Ith (up for testing)

    So...
    Want more Bloodghast, but can't fit them into the 60. Great to have access to 1 though, for flashbacks and fast Hogaak.
    Entomb is great. Get's the Bloodghast, Loam, Therapy or Hogaak. Can also fetch up lands once you have a Loam hanging around your hand or grave.
    Blast zone is great fetchable removal. Blow up some stuff/Needles/what ever.
    Spyglass, since I wan't to blow up stuff and Needles with Blast zone. Also peeking is fine for Therapy or for other obvious reasons.
    Trophy is a beast. Can't see why other lists don't run more in the side.

    1 Forest, 2 Swamp, 2 Bayou and 7 Fetch. Been finding myself annoyed with dredging away a fetchable land from the top. So adding one more (swamp) should help a bit. Also better vs Blood Moon stuff.

    Maze and Cloak are up for testing. Not sure if Maze is needed. Cloak seems fine as backup plan for beatdown with small creatures. Not needing to rely on the big legendaries. Can get it with Entomb and Stitcher/Wayfinder can actually find it.

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