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Thread: Modern Post-Hogaak

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  1. #1
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    Modern Post-Hogaak

    Banned:
    Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis
    Faithless Looting

    Unbanned:
    Stoneforge Mystic


    Hogaak everyone saw coming. Faithless Looting I'm a little sad about, despite not playing it in any of my favorite decks. I really hope they print a "fixed" version at 1 mana, but usually blue is the one to get any consistency generating toys. Stoneforge Mystic I'm happy that others are happy about, but I'm not looking forward to 90% consistency of hitting a 4/4 mostly uncounterable life link vigilance creature in any non-combo deck.

    Is this enough to fix the sour feelings from Hogaak Summer?

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix Ignition View Post
    but I'm not looking forward to 90% consistency of hitting a 4/4 mostly uncounterable life link vigilance creature in any non-combo deck.
    Stoneforge Mystic into Batterskull is stopped by the following commonly played cards (among many others):

    Lightning Bolt/Path to Exile/Fatal Push on SFM

    Spell Snare on SFM

    Pithing Needle on SFM

    Thoughtseize/Cabal Therapist/Duress on Batterskull

    Thoughtseize/Inquisition of Kozilek on SFM

    Nature's Claim/Force of Vigor/Shattering Spree on Batterskull

    And those are just answers at 0-1 mana. The card is strong but not broken. Batterskull is very inefficient hardcast or paying the full equip cost. All you have to do is stop the SFM activation.

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Yeah, I know the cards that can kill a 1/2. I play it in Vintage. I'm surprised that was the take away from my post, as the real format shake-up is mostly going to be no more Hogaak (which was obviously going to happen) and *many* decks getting hit by Faithless Looting Ban. Arclight Phoenix gets hit the hardest, but fringe decks that could have been much better post-Hogaak like Mardu Pyromancer get hit pretty hard by that as well.

    Also, I was ready to debut my crappy Crack the Earth + Dreadhorde Arcanist Modern list, but it gets hit pretty hard by the Faithless ban.

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    That format shakeup is obvious, didn't need commenting.

    I was just reacting to this "90% consistency of 4/4 lifelink" fearmongering. Batterskull is quite stoppable. Caw Blade terrorized Standard almost a decade ago, before so many better cards and strategies emerged in Modern. It's like saying "oh no Tarmogoyf is big".

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Dang, man, sorry to bring up the obvious "Hogaak and Faithless Looting are banned, how does the format change?" topic.

    I'm curious since it's so obvious to you, what are the new best decks? Are Arclight decks truly dead and gone, or can they recover while playing a slightly slower plan? Is dredge going to be fringe playable, or did they need the flashback Faithless? Can non-blue Pyromancer decks fuel their token generation enough to be worth playing without Faithless?

    Sorry if these are so obvious to not be worth discussing, but if you can enlighten me I'd appreciate it immensely.

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Of course they're worth discussing. I meant it's obvious those bannings shake up the format (and clearly Hogaak had to go). It's not obvious what the new format will be. That's a lot of speculation, and you didn't really leave any speculations or thoughts about it to start conversation (e.g. banning Faithless Looting will hurt Dredge and probably boost the position of blue decks) so there wasn't anything to add to that.

    The only real hook you left was this speculation that Batterskull will be this nearly uncounterable threat with 90% consistency. That statement was so extreme, can you not see how that would be worth discussing too? If you didn't want to discuss it, why say it? I still haven't heard you give any reasons supporting why it's remotely true.

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Shaheen Soorani has a decent article up about mystic, even advocates for sfm package in vial aggro decks.

    http://www.starcitygames.com/article...ouncement.html
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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    What are some cards that get better without Looting/Hogaak, along with adding stoneforge mystic? I'm not talking Batterskull, etc, but rather the slower mid-range cards that fell out of favor because the format was just too fast for them. I've been trying to come up with some cards that will become better because there is time within the games to utilize them again.

    Remand
    Electrolyze
    Lightning Helix
    Kolaghan's Command
    Collective Brutality
    Search for Azcanta
    Restoration Angel
    Grim Flayer
    Izzet Staticaster
    Grim Lavamancer


    Do these cards, or type of cards really, get better now that the format has gotten a little more mid-range oriented?
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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Perahps a little bit offtopic, but i'm already bored looking at Modo streamers trying to find the right stoneforge mystic shell, battling vs other streamers trying to find the right stoneforge mystic shell :) And that doesn't make me drool over playing modern more right now than before in hoogak dark summer!

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    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    What are some cards that get better without Looting/Hogaak, along with adding stoneforge mystic? I'm not talking Batterskull, etc, but rather the slower mid-range cards that fell out of favor because the format was just too fast for them. I've been trying to come up with some cards that will become better because there is time within the games to utilize them again.

    Remand
    Electrolyze
    Lightning Helix
    Kolaghan's Command
    Collective Brutality
    Search for Azcanta
    Restoration Angel
    Grim Flayer
    Izzet Staticaster
    Grim Lavamancer


    Do these cards, or type of cards really, get better now that the format has gotten a little more mid-range oriented?
    From what I've seen, mono red is still quite popular, so Collective Brutality is in a great place. Electrolyze might just be too slow, but I suppose with everyone trying to fit Stoneforge in their decks (sometimes with stepmom) it's probably okay in the really slow control lists. K Command is going to be great for a while, especially with the popularity of Karn and Urza. I think that card is in the best place it's ever been.

    A few other winners:
    Liliana of the Veil. Holy crap was she bad in Hogaak meta, but with the emergence of midrange she's much better. Still bad against W6 but used *with* W6 she's insane.
    Collector Ouphe. Artifacts are out in force and if you're not playing with them you should be running at least 3 in your 75 (if you're green).
    Plague Engineer. Great card in general, but with everyone trying to run Lingering Souls for equipment shells it's even better.
    Torpor Orb. Sideboard it's pretty good against Urza and a fair number of creature decks. I wouldn't play it just against Stoneforge but depending on what else they're doing it might be worth it (kinda wrecks humans, too).



    Quote Originally Posted by Tylert View Post
    Perahps a little bit offtopic, but i'm already bored looking at Modo streamers trying to find the right stoneforge mystic shell, battling vs other streamers trying to find the right stoneforge mystic shell :) And that doesn't make me drool over playing modern more right now than before in hoogak dark summer!
    I feel ya here, it's been pretty bad this first week. I expect it to die down after a few top contenders emerge and hype dies down. The format actually looks pretty healthy despite what the streamers are doing.

  11. #11

    Re: Modern Post-Hogaak

    Really wish they'd hit Mox Opal and Ancient Stirrings along with Looting.

    I think Tron (either blue or green) will be super tier 1, unless Urza/whir prison turns out to be broken AF. Either way the format is still going to have one uber deck that's super hard to hate out and a bunch of also rans.

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