I think you can get the same thing in mono black (in standard no less) with:Originally Posted by bruizar
What else is there to build a deck around?
Turn 1: Dead Weight a creature
Turn 2: Cacophony, exile dead weight make a zombie
Turn 3: Sarcomancy make a zombie, Perilous Research, draw 2 cards, attack for 4, exile Sarcomancy make another zombie
Turn 4: Attack for 8
Not too powerful, I guess Sarcomancy and Perilous Research are too weak, but Cacophony looks like a really good Young Pyromancer that lacks the enchantments to fuel it.
bonus, it fuels the graveyard and can be exiled once it hits its 3rd chapter and helps scupt your draws.
Thassa, Deep-Dwelling 3U
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God Mythic Rare
Indestructible
As long as your devotion to blue is less than five, Thassa isn't a creature.
At the beginning of your end step, exile up to one Target creature you control, then return that card to the battlefield under your control.
{3U}: Tap another target creature.
6/5
Is this the cheapest continuous blinking effect we have? And it's end step not upkeep so you get value out of it when you cast it?
Just with Man-O-War type creatures in blue its a continuous bounce. It's very annoying with Vendilion Clique. . . IDK, seems like it could be something?
Well it's definitely going straight into my Yarok EDH deck.
Soulherder is cheaper.
Ah, totally didn't realize that card existed. On the plus for New-Thassa though - you can use Sol lands if you need to, mono blue, hard to get rid of (not a creature and is indestructible), in a pinch you can eventually hit for 6, can tap creatures.
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Also rules question does Theros Achiles work with like Hushbringer to have you avoid choosing a number?
Thassa has more utility, but Soulherder is quite a bit better with Vial. With Thassa, you’ve got a 4 mana clunker that doesn’t really take over a game, and you still have to survive to cast it [meaning control aspects, which lead into why isn’t that a JTMS]. The 4 mana activation is also a bit crippling, as you probably can’t even use it after an opponent’s SnT to lock down an Emrakul.
“As“ is not a trigger.
Ah, well definitely more trouble than it's worth, but what if you manifest him and flip him?
Then he's already on the field so there will be no need to honor an As clause
Another dumb question . . . the ability seems to me to read that he has protection from have protection from 0, 1, 5, 6, etc. always right? It doesn't just refer to 2, 3, 4. As such . . . isn't this pretty good in general? He is Decay proof just by being 4 CMC and always has protection from STP and Bolt. He also has protection from Karakas?
If that is true he is a bit like mini-Progentius except for 2, 3, 4 at random?
Yeah, he is basically a "augmented" TNN. It's hard to say how good that is at 4 mana though, because dodging Decay is nice, but atwhich isn't the easiest cost to pay.
"The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
—Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order
No.Ah, totally didn't realize that card existed. On the plus for New-Thassa though - you can use Sol lands if you need to, mono blue, hard to get rid of (not a creature and is indestructible), in a pinch you can eventually hit for 6, can tap creatures.
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Also rules question does Theros Achiles work with like Hushbringer to have you avoid choosing a number?
It does, however, work with Manifest.
It's cute with Threaten effects and stuff like dash, but way too slow to matter in legacy.
They're going to interpret or edit the rules so it doesn't. ( https://twitter.com/EliShffrn/status...48285415804929 )
Amazing that this gets immediate changes to the rules to prevent people from trying to have protection from everything (which already exists, btw) but nonsense like changing land types still cancels the abilities, and that replaced events can still meet if conditions. (Blood moon, and wasteland stranger)
The rules don't really need to be updated, it's just poorly formatted. The second and third text blocks should be in a single paragraph to better illustrate how they fail in sequence.
Every legacy player should inherently understand that if Revoker enters face-down and is later turned face-up, that Revoker does nothing to stop the abilities of cards with no name (like morph or manifest). So too does it make sense that if you can't choose a number, that Haktos cannot apply any text dependent downstream on having a declared number.
Rule 706.7a reads (in the relevant part) "If an ability refers to an undefined choice, that part of the ability won’t do anything." Only that part of the ability does nothing. The part of this ability that uses that choice is the exception, therefore only the exception should be ignored and therefore his ability should give protection to all CMC values.
Uh no, Revoker coming in without naming a thing does not equal applying the rest of its text to cards without names.
The last text block on Haktos can‘t work b/c it specifies needing a chosen entity. If the choosing portion is undermined, you can replace every instance of “chosen“ with “Fizzled“
That's because undefined is not equal to no characteristic. A choice that is never made is explicitly stated as "undefined" It's even in quotes.
706.7a If an ability causes a player to “choose a [value]” and a second, linked ability refers to that choice, the second ability is the only ability that can refer to that choice. An object doesn’t “remember” that choice and use it for other abilities it may copy later. If an object copies an ability that refers to a choice, but either (a) doesn’t copy that ability’s linked ability or (b) does copy the linked ability but no choice is made for it, then the choice is considered to be “undefined.” If an ability refers to an undefined choice, that part of the ability won’t do anything.Undefined doesn't match No Characteristic, so Revoker can't match. Also the part of revoker's ability that does something is 100% dependant on a card name, so it can't do anything.707.2. Face-down spells and face-down permanents have no characteristics other than those listed by the ability or rules that allowed the spell or permanent to be face down.
Last few posts have been some of the most intense rules-lawyering I've ever seen
I'm impressed with the citations.Last few posts have been some of the most intense rules-lawyering I've ever seen
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