It's called circumstantial evidence. If there's an immediate price dip right after the RL abolishment announcement happens that can easily be enough to carry the day in court.
The proof is simple as printing screenshots of market prices before and after the announcement.
Wrote this in 2013.
This.
Why would Wizards jump down this rabbit hole trying to figure out how they could distribute reprints without bad PR for themselves, LGS, online retailers, etc.
If you print a Master's set, your LGS or online store of choice will be hoarding boxes/ selling packs 100x , 1000x MSRP.
If you insert cards a la Zendikar, same potential senario.
List more options and you end up with people getting butt hurt because they still can't afford the cards or were unlucky enough to not pull some ultra-uber- mythic rare equivalent reprint. Plus, the cynical (i.e. run of the mill eternal player) will end up saying "it's just another cash grab by Hasbro..."
Why bother with these headaches when Standard sells and every couple of years you invent a new extended format?
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I totally agree. Have you seen how people behave in malls on black friday? Picture that times 1000 when the prize is Power 9, Mishra's Workshops, Bazaar of Baghdad, Tabernacles and (black bordered) duals. It's going to be a Quintin Tarantino style blood bath.
its the class action from millions of players + collectors that will break the bank
I'm fairly certain this conversation has already been had internally. There is a point where it makes sense to them. Also, they have a general counsel so there's no billable hours to worry about, they get to pay salary to a handful of lawyers to deal with this.
Pretty sure WOTC in their latest statement about their reserve list changes acknowledges that they have made changes before but will not be doing so going forward. Also, whether or not something can be successfully argued in court doesnt always make sense. It takes a very different way of thinking to be a lawyer. Once you become a lawyer, your entire perception of the world changes and you begin to understand why companies take certain actions.
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Currently Playing
Legacy: Dark Depths
EDH: 5-Color Hermit Druid
Currently Brewing: [Deck] Sadistic Sacrament / Chalice NO Eldrazi
why cards are so expensive...hoarders
This is the dumbest argument, none of these things are an issue for wotcI totally agree. Have you seen how people behave in malls on black friday? Picture that times 1000 when the prize is Power 9, Mishra's Workshops, Bazaar of Baghdad, Tabernacles and (black bordered) duals. It's going to be a Quintin Tarantino style blood bath
Nobody there is going "hmmmm it seems we have a problem, people are TOO hungry for our cardboard"
Print to demand will lead to upheaval, limited printing will lead to store owners cornering the market and flipping the product for X times the intended retail price, limited printed direst sales will lead to bots buying out all product the way it happens with Sneakers, just to release it the same day for X times the price.
You will not get your hands on reserved list cards for cheap, unless they print it like it’s venezuelan money. Look up the price of a Collectors edition set, and thats not even legal in sanctioned tournaments.
Guys, just let it go. Legacy has gone the way of Vintage; I sold out years ago because of that. The truth is, Wizards doesn't really give a shit about us. As long as there's people buying $30 collector boosters, there's zero incentive to even touch the list.
The only way it's getting broken is when Wizards is in the shitter at the tail end of the upcoming recession, and someone in a suit says "you know what we need? Go back to our roots. Let's get those 40 and 50 year olds with money that used to play 25 years ago to buy the stuff from their childhood". Then we miiiight get stuff like duals. Maybe some form of paper Vintage Masters.
Or get someone in China with a printing press, but if that happens there is zero chance of SCG ever touching Legacy again.
So, no way out. Put a fork in it, it's done.
I'm addressing the argument that wotc won't ever bother print RL cards because it would be some kind of logistical hassle that detracts from their core business of making standard-legal sets.
I'm not denying that any of this secondary market drama will happen. With the mythic editions people already did the sneaker-esque shit where if you were lucky to get it for the RRP from the Hasbro website it was basically free money if you just flipped it on the secondary market immediately.
My point is that wotc doesn't care: they are still making money selling people cardboard. If they make a reserved-list product tomorrow that's a new way to sell people cardboard that they didn't have access to today. They don't lose money by "printing it like venezuelan money" either unless they totally oversaturate the demand and theres a bunch of vintage cube box-sets or 'mythic-edition: power' left sitting in a warehouse somewhere that nobody wants, which seems unlikely.
If your argument is instead "wotc has shown in the past that they're too afraid to reprint cards in a way that has any noticeable impact on their secondary market value, so there's no reason to be excited about the prospect of the RL disappearing", then that's a different argument. I agree with you that wotc is way too conservative in this regard but I don't agree that it's impossible to imagine a realistic product that would noticeably reduce the prices of RL cards
edit
The second paragraph is exactly the incentive you're looking for in the first paragraphGuys, just let it go. Legacy has gone the way of Vintage; I sold out years ago because of that. The truth is, Wizards doesn't really give a shit about us. As long as there's people buying $30 collector boosters, there's zero incentive to even touch the list.
The only way it's getting broken is when Wizards is in the shitter at the tail end of the upcoming recession, and someone in a suit says "you know what we need? Go back to our roots. Let's get those 40 and 50 year olds with money that used to play 25 years ago to buy the stuff from their childhood". Then we miiiight get stuff like duals. Maybe some form of paper Vintage Masters.
It doesn't necessarily have to be in a situation where wotc/hasbro is in a hole, either. It just needs to be a situation where the expected returns outweigh the legal repercussions. (Which I don't know enough about to comment on, but from what I've heard from people who's opinions I trust/value it's not just an imaginary bogeyman invented in the minds of wotc)
I would argue that the value of any investment, if you can even consider it an investment vehicle which if I was the lawyer would never do, is prone to fluctuations, hence the price dip or rise is bound to be expected, plus, there have been previous fluctuations in price and the cards returned to their original value, or even surpassed it.
WoTc should print something along the lines of this:
"Pseudo volcanic island
Land - Island mountain
Tap: Add U or R to your mana pool
You cannot have more than 4 volcanic island and Pseudo Volcanic island in total in your deck"
Does not break the RL (although it breaks the spirit of the RL), does not rise the number of duals in a deck.
Or a Golgothian Sylex for core sets. Garfieldian Sylex. Solved! :)
In all seriousness, if you want to achieve anything, don't wear yourself out trying to get WOTC to abolish the reserved list. Maro, Ben, years of lobbying by the most prolific Vintage players and the entire Vintage community.. Many have tried, and many have failed. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome.
Focus on what you CAN do.
Do what you can to support your local and online Legacy scenes?
That's the point. The onus shouldn't be nor it shouldn't ever have been on the player to "support their local Legacy scene." That's precisely the problem. There should be enough organic interest and affordability in the format and support coming from above that gives Legacy and Vintage players a chance to afford and compete with the cards they want to play with so more players will naturally show up to events.
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