TURDUCKEN
tur·duck·en
/tərˈdəkən/
Why would I want to eat something with ‘turd’ in its name?
We don’t. We serve it.
What Turducken is:
Turducken is a high threat, aggro-combo deck. It wins through different angles of attack: Turkey (Painter’s Servant + Grindstone), Duck (Beatdown), Chicken (Thespian’s Stage+ Dark Depths)
What it is not:
While the concept of jamming multiple combos in a deck is not new (two-card monte in vintage, DETH, etc), Turducken is different in that it is capable of grinding out games. It also has a non-combo avenue to victory in the form of disruption backed by a quick clock.
Does it taste good?
Turducken’s biggest strength comes from the way the deck plays, which is different every game. Though the pieces on the board may vary depending on the hand, the threat the deck presents is always there. It doesn’t rely on any one way to win. It also doesn’t fold to one hate against it. The deck aims to apply pressure and pass the burden of decision making to the opponent, having them react to what line of play you may or may not draw in to.
(Ex. Turn 1 Mox diamond, Thespian’s stage into Painter’s Servant. Turn 2 Sol Land into Thoughtknot Seer/ Lodestone Golem. Will the opponent counter the spell, use removal, or save it? They could very well lose next turn to a Dark Depths, Grindstone, or another 4-5 power beater.)
It’s overcooked outside and cold in the middle...
Cooking with 3 meats isn’t without challenges. Card selection is virtually non-existent (that didn’t stop dragon stompy). Having the wrong pieces can lead to going to top deck mode too early in the game. The manabase can be fragile at times as well. Though its playable being hit by a wasteland, recurring one early can be game over.
So what’s in it?
Turkey
4 Painter’s Servant (naming white is a good habit)
3 Grindstone (can win on its own, grinding wincon light decks)
Duck
4 Thought-knot Seer (disruptive beater)
4 Reality Smasher (trampling clock)
4 Lodestone Golem (disruptive beater)
Spices
4 Mox Diamond- Crucial ramp, permanent source of color, Goblin Engineer fodder
4 Chalice of the Void- Chalice actually has an important role to play. It’s disruption that allows your threats to push through. It slows opposing combo decks at 0. It’s a must counter for high cantrip decks at 1. It also protects our threats from removal. But.. but.. it’s a non-bo with Grindstone... Not really. You can get rid of it with Goblin Engineer, Karn, or even Chaos Warp it into a threat if need be.
4 Chaos Warp- This card is great for two reasons. This serves as an instant speed, catch all removal. It’s great against low permanent count decks (Miracles, Delver etc.). On the other side of the coin, we can target our own permanents. Turducken runs 56 permanents. Fifty-six! That almost guarantees that whatever we are targeting will be replaced. Wasteland on my land? Chaos Warp in response, get a land back or combo piece. Destroy my artifact? Here’s a Reality Smasher for my troubles. Mana flooding? Churn it out and roll the dice. Of course, hitting our permanents with Chaos Warp is a gamble. But with how the rest of the deck plays, it’s not always a bad thing.
2 Goblin Engineer- It tutors, recurs, and is great for grindy games. It gets back what is previously countered or destroyed. It brings back Grindstone with an active Chalice. It has a relevant toughness at 2. Engineer can do combat tricks and synergies. (Put Painter’s Servant in the graveyard with Engineer. Cast Grindstone. Activate Grindstone, trigger on the stack, engineer it out for Painter’s Servant. Resolve trigger and win.)
1 Ensnaring Bridge- This gives us an out against 20/20s and any other large creature cheated into play. It’s tutorable with the engineer. Sometimes, we can’t win on the battlefield. Hiding behind a bridge and some blockers allow us to turkey grind the opponent.
Gravy
2 Karn, the Great Creator- It allows for a toolbox sideboard or go for a ‘Plan D’ and tutor out Mycosynth Lattice/ Liquimetal Coating. Karn, the Great Gravy makes Turducken threat dense and just gives the opponent more stuff to deal with.
Sides
4 Ancient Tomb (Sol Land 1-4)
4 City of Traitors (Sol Land 5-8)
4 Eldrazi Temple (Semi-Sol Land)
4 Mountain
1 Great Furnace
4 Thespian’s Stage (Chicken)
3 Dark Depths (Chicken)
Condiments
The sideboard plan is pretty meta dependent but here’s what I’m using at the moment.
1 Pithing Needle/ Sorcerous Spyglass
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Walking Ballista
1 Mycosynth Lattice/ Liquimetal Coating
1 Grindstone
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Ratchet Bomb
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Sphere of Resistance
4 Sulfur Elemental (becomes a 4/1 and kills all x/1s with Painter’s Servant on white, split second, flash, and decent expendable body to fill)
Recap:
4 Painter’s Servant
2 Goblin Engineer
4 Thought-knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Lodestone Golem
3 Grindstone
4 Chaos Warp
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
2 Karn, the Great Creator
1 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Thespian's Stage
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Dark Depths
4 Mountain
1 Great Furnace
Matchups
I cannot claim exact win percentages as I haven’t been keeping a track record for all matchups. But on average, this deck can go 50-50 toss up against competition. I got this data by keeping track of my out of pocket cost playing tournaments and store credit payout.
Control
UWx
Slam threats without overextending. Chalice on 1 is great. Distract them with mismatched, partial win conditions, Drunken Master style. The onus is theirs to decide whether to spend or save removal.
Out: 1 Ensnaring Bridge, Any 3mix of Thought-Knot Seer/ Lodestone Golem (lowering the curve a bit)
In: 4 Sulfer Elemental. It walls Monestary Mentor. Uncounterable answer to a Jace at 3 loyalty played and of turn.
Grixis/ 4C control
Difficult match. They have a lot of removal. Overextend to apply pressure, you’ll probably lose this if it goes long.
Out: 1 Ensnaring Bridge, 4 Lodestone Golem (weak to artifact removal/ bolt/ strix)
In: 3 Sulfer Elemental, 1 Pithing Needle, 1 Tormod’s Crypt
Aggro
Delver Variants (RUG/Grixis)
Chalice on 1 is great. W6 and wasteland is terrible.
Out: 2 Karn, 2 Reality Smasher (getting to 5 can be tough with wasteland)
In: 1 Pithing Needle, 2 Surgical Extraction, 1 Ratchet Bomb
Death and Taxes
We probably aren’t winning via combat since they have a ton of creatures. Still play what you have and put down blockers. Try to go for Grindstone, 20/20, or Karn+toolbox. Don’t name white with Painter’s Servant (We can’t have more than 1 Sulfur Elemental in play if white is named.)
Out: 4 Reality Smasher (lower the curve), 2 Chalice of the Void, 1 Ensnaring Bridge
In: 4 Sulfur Elemental, 1 Ratchet Bomb, 1 Pithing Needle, 1 Walking Ballista
Combo
Sneak and Show
Game 1 is tough. Turkey won’t work since they have spaghetti monster. Post board, we just have to hope we slow them down enough with chalice, spheres, golems, and TKS. Or we can hope for a quick 20/20
Out: 4 Painter’s Servant, 3 Grindstone
In: 2 Sphere of Resistance, 1 Ensnaring Bridge, 1 Pithing Needle, 3 Sulfur Elemental (extra bodies)
Storm
Hope they have a slower hand. Hope you have a faster/disruptive enough hand.
Out: 2 Karn, 2 Reality Smasher, 1 Ensnaring Bridge, 4 Chaos Warp
In: 1 Tormod’s Crypt, 2 Surgical Extraction, 2 Sphere of Resistance, 1 Ratchet Bomb, 1 Grindstone, 2 Sulfur Elemental
Dredge
Hope they have a slower hand. Hope you have a faster/disruptive enough hand.
Out: 2 Karn, 4 Reality Smasher, 4 Chaos Warp
In: 1 Tormod’s Crypt, 2 Surgical Extraction, 2 Sphere of Resistance, 1 Ratchet Bomb, 1 Grindstone, 2 Sulfur Elemental, 1 Walking Balista
Reanimator
Hope they have a slower hand. Hope you have a faster/disruptive enough hand. Hope you can hide behind ensnaring bridge and assemble the turkey.
Out: 2 Karn, 2 Reality Smasher
In: 1 Tormod’s Crypt, 2 Surgical Extraction, 1 Ensnaring Bridge
Depths
Hope they have a slower hand. Hope you have a faster/disruptive enough hand. Hope you can hide behind ensnaring bridge and assemble the turkey.
Out: 2 Dark Depths
In: 1 Pithing Needle, 1 Ensnaring Bridge
General Notes:
-Mulligan decisions make or break the game. While this is true for all, it is especially true in the case of Turducken. For a deck that has no card selection, we have to analyze every starting hand we get.
-While it is admittedly inconsistent, the deck is naturally powerful. It has 14 cards restricted in vintage (Lodestone Golem, Chalice of the Void, Mox Diamond, Karn, the Great Creator), which is pretty close to storm’s 16 (brainstorm, ponder, petal, LED).
-Can this deck place at a tourney? I’d say it has the same chance as Dragon Stompy, which is the closest analogue. Both decks can have explosive starts, disruption, and clock. Both have similar weaknesses in their manabase and lack of card selection. I’d say that one thing we come ahead with is the combo aspect of the deck. We can have random turn 2/3 kills as well as top deck/ Chaos Warp wins out of nowhere.
*I currently play 4 matches a week at most and I don’t think that is changing anytime soon. I just wanted to share the deck and welcome others’ testing results/ suggestions.
Now... who’s up for slinging turds?
Last edited by MoxCoprolite; 11-17-2019 at 10:51 PM.
Room in the SB for 1-of Expedition Map so you can use Karn to find the other piece for Marit Lage?
Thanks for the suggestion. I actually tried this before. The problem I encountered is that whenever I have Karn in play, I'm too far behind in which expedition map into dark depths will help. If I'm ahead, it might be better to just lock them out and draw the natural depths/ other win condition. It also takes some time to setup. 1 turn to drop Karn, 1 turn to drop the map+activate (and hope there's enough mana to activate stage depths), and 1 turn for the lethal swing. It has a danger of being too cute.
Nice writeup! I was wondering when you were going to get this primer out . Keep up the good work with the deck, I always like seeing how it plays.
slinging turds this weekend, just gotta get the chaos warps.
i'm gonna go with a slightly different SB, but thanx for a great primer.
Sweet foils! How did it go? I'm trying something with a greedier mana base now that Wrenn and Six is out of the format.
I was thinking of maybe splashing Oko for something like:
-4 Mountain
-1 Great Furnace
-4 Chaos Warp
+4 Interplanar Beacon
+2 Volcanic Island
+3 Oko, Thief of Crowns
Turn 2 Oko via Sol Land + Interplanar Beacon looks delicious.
so i got some matches in with the list. fun as all and no one (even me) knew what i was playing.
the chaos warps were pretty good and the surprise factor was worth it...
Proper capitalization and punctuation are required when posting on these boards. Also, please try to avoid double posting. Thanks for your understanding. -zilla
I've been testing Oko in the deck. It did pretty good in the past 5 three-round tourneys (2-1, 2-1, 2-1, 1-2, and 2-0-1). The mana base was able to support it. There are times when I needed to answer a land or enchantment which Chaos Warp used to be able to deal with. But overall, the extra threat Oko provides felt reassuring. I'm also still working on remembering the life gain trigger of Interplanar Beacon which is crucial to offset the life lost from Ancient Tomb. Going with a blue splash, I was able to add Hibernation in the board taking place of Ratchet Bomb.
My current 75:
4 Painter’s Servant
2 Goblin Engineer
4 Thought-knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
4 Lodestone Golem
3 Grindstone
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
2 Karn, the Great Creator
1 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Oko, Thief of Crowns
4 Thespian's Stage
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Interplanar Beacon
3 Dark Depths
2 Volcanic Island
1 Pithing Needle
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Walking Ballista
1 Liquimetal Coating
1 Grindstone
1 Tormod’s Crypt
2 Hibernation
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Sphere of Resistance
3 Sulfur Elemental
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