[Deck] A Cold Day in Hell (Breach Freeze)

[Lemon]

Is there a Discord for this deck yet? Have a link?

It's a subsection of the storm discord.
https://discord.gg/Eq36TEM

[FTW]

Both Sylvan Library and Dark Confidant seem like strong sources of card draw.

The Jeskai Intuition deck uses 2 Predict for card advantage. After watching a bunch of AnziD's streams, Predict looks pretty good. With 12 cantrips you can usually set it up so you cantrip the turn before and leave a card you want to get rid of (or LED or Freeze) either 1st or 2nd from the top (depending on whether you want to Predict this turn, EOT, upkeep, or next turn). Then you get 1 controlled mill + draw 2, which is quite strong. It's similar to the Thought Scour trick except 2 cards go to hand instead. Effectively 2.5 cards for 1U.

[FTW]

Just noticed we're already the 2nd biggest deck in the online metagame now, according to MTG Goldfish.

AnziD got 4-1 in the preliminaries both Thursday and Friday, using the Jeskai Intuition build. I still prefer the ETutor build but he's getting good results.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2789438#online

ziofrancone also got 4-1 in Friday's preliminary with Jeskai Intuition (2 of the 4 decks at 4-1 or higher were Jeskai Breach):
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2789437#online

His build cuts down to 1 Intuition, runs 2 Thought Scour over Predicts, has Grapeshot as a wincon, and runs the traditional 16 lands and 4 Lotus Petals (AnziD's on 15 lands and 3 Petals, less mana).

[Lemon]

I think the current record for a deck to go from N&D to DTB is Dark Depth-Hogaak, but let's see if we can beat that record from the time Underworld Break actually becomes legal

Just noticed we're already the 2nd biggest deck in the online metagame now, according to MTG Goldfish.

I'm pretty sure we beat Gaak's record. We did have 2 top 8's before the card was event legal in paper

[FTW]

I'm pretty sure we beat Gaak's record. We did have 2 top 8's before the card was event legal in paper

https://www.mtgtop8.com/archetype?a=893&f=LE&meta=34

Even including paper events (this deck sees less play in paper), in the last 2 weeks Breach represents 10% of top 8s, the #1 combo spot, matched only by UR Delver and Bant Snoko.

[Cire]

How often were you drawing extra cards?

After Etutor into Library, pretty much all the time to make up for the lost card advanatage. Otherwise about a third of the time, the digging is usually enough to help get the combo. Almost always draw after discard to recover.

Did you find yourself getting lands to shuffle more?

Tried to, but we're pretty land light.

Were you playing preordain or thought scour?

Ended up only having space for two preordain but was not happy with it. Might replace it with Scour.

Both Sylvan Library and Dark Confidant seem like strong sources of card draw.

Wonder if there is a URgb version that runs both? Bob seems really strong because while it does activate their Creature Kill they have to choose to keep their creature kill game 2 just for Bob and its dead against the rest of the deck.

Looking at Michael Keller's Confidant list, if you want to jam in 3 Veil and 2 Libraries you could maybe do: -1 Merchant Scroll, -1 Daze, -1 Pact of negation, -1 Chain of Vapor (the singletons sort of makes sense with Scroll), -1 Preordain. But then you're sort of running low of Blue count for FOW, but still seems doable and strong with lots of tweaking.

[Ronald Deuce]

So I finally bit the bullet and decided to buy some white cards. (Ugh. And just in time to start eyeing Intuitions.) I've got a few questions for America pilots:

—How are people optimizing the use of Grinding Station? It's definitely our riskiest engine piece, but I'm primarily concerned about running into problems with Surgical Extraction on Brain Freeze. It feels like it needs a lot of setup, though, and because it doesn't net us graveyard size, I'm not sure it's something I'd want in the maindeck. I took a quick look back at the threads but didn't see a walkthrough of how best to use it.
—I might just be obtuse, but what's the reasoning behind a split between Silence and Orim's Chant? Is it only for Surgical Extraction? Why would one want to play a double of one and a singleton/double of the other?
—As has been discussed, it seems people are cutting the Enlightened Tutor package back a fair bit. I fully support their reasoning, but what's the current thinking about anti-permanent cards in the mainboard?
—Win-cons are rising and falling, presumably because this deck's so new. Is it worth it to keep a Thassa's Oracle in the 75 to deal with Leylines and such, or would it be better to just run removal?
—No love for Plateau? I've been finding myself wanting it on occasion.

I'm trying something a bit odd at the moment. I've got two Burning Wishes in the main in place of other win conditions. My reasoning was that with Wishes, we can dig ourselves out of something like a Chalice on 1 or maindeck shenanigans from people playing RiP–Helm and stuff. That brings me to a final question: What do you guys prioritize in your sideboard suites?

I hope this doesn't come across as too needy a post, but I'm sort of all over the place right now. I got the cards just before I had to move over the weekend, so I've not had the time to read much or work with the deck in its newest (to me) incarnation.

[Lemon]

So I finally bit the bullet and decided to buy some white cards. (Ugh. And just in time to start eyeing Intuitions.) I've got a few questions for America pilots:

—How are people optimizing the use of Grinding Station? It's definitely our riskiest engine piece, but I'm primarily concerned about running into problems with Surgical Extraction on Brain Freeze. It feels like it needs a lot of setup, though, and because it doesn't net us graveyard size, I'm not sure it's something I'd want in the maindeck. I took a quick look back at the threads but didn't see a walkthrough of how best to use it.
—I might just be obtuse, but what's the reasoning behind a split between Silence and Orim's Chant? Is it only for Surgical Extraction? Why would one want to play a double of one and a singleton/double of the other?
—As has been discussed, it seems people are cutting the Enlightened Tutor package back a fair bit. I fully support their reasoning, but what's the current thinking about anti-permanent cards in the mainboard?
—Win-cons are rising and falling, presumably because this deck's so new. Is it worth it to keep a Thassa's Oracle in the 75 to deal with Leylines and such, or would it be better to just run removal?
—No love for Plateau? I've been finding myself wanting it on occasion.

I'm trying something a bit odd at the moment. I've got two Burning Wishes in the main in place of other win conditions. My reasoning was that with Wishes, we can dig ourselves out of something like a Chalice on 1 or maindeck shenanigans from people playing RiP–Helm and stuff. That brings me to a final question: What do you guys prioritize in your sideboard suites?

I hope this doesn't come across as too needy a post, but I'm sort of all over the place right now. I got the cards just before I had to move over the weekend, so I've not had the time to read much or work with the deck in its newest (to me) incarnation.

1) Grinding station is a 'must go off this turn' card that acts as a tutorable tutor for Brain Freeze. It's untap trigger triggers with it's own entry, so always respond to that by eating your petal\LED. That way when you finally find BF, you can tap to eat itself and have +6 cards to escape both LED\Petal and BF.

2) Orim's Chant targets, and can't be cast against a Leyline of Sanctity

3) I am still fully on the Etutor package and am running 3 MD Chain of Vapors to deal with troublesome permanents. I would be hard pressed to cut even one.

4) I don't think Thassa's Oracle is worth running. You can always run a utility card like Chain of Vapor that you can escape to bounce it. I'm also on Burning Wish though and my main plan is Wish -> Grapeshot instead of BF, which has a ton of incidental problems. (Just yesterday someone revealed a Second Sunrise and said they were planning on then sacing everything to a ravager and moving it to a balista for the kill.)

5) It's one of those cards that phases into and out of the deck. I personally don't own one, but can understand why some people want it and others don't. It's an awful top deck land, but sometimes very very nice to fetch.

6) I have about 50:50 wishboard:sideboard split. Wishboards I think need a minimum of Infernal Tutor, Tome Scour, and Grapeshot. I'm also running Meltdown, Eye of Nowhere, Pyroclasm, and Sivinne's Reclamation. The rest of the board is mostly tutorables. Link is in my signature to my current list.

[FTW]

—How are people optimizing the use of Grinding Station? It's definitely our riskiest engine piece, but I'm primarily concerned about running into problems with Surgical Extraction on Brain Freeze. It feels like it needs a lot of setup, though, and because it doesn't net us graveyard size, I'm not sure it's something I'd want in the maindeck. I took a quick look back at the threads but didn't see a walkthrough of how best to use it.

Grinding Station is a 1-of in the ETutor lists to have a tutorable copy of Brain Freeze. The other pieces (Breach, LED, Petal) are tutorable but Brain Freeze isn't. It's much worse than the main line, but if you already have Breach and a mana rock it beats passing the turn a bunch of times until you draw Brain Freeze. It's not playable without ETutor.

You generally don't blind self-mill with it until the combo turn, so it doesn't open up any new Surgical vulnerabilities. Casting Chant before you go off helps. You can watch some of AnziD's earlier streams (January) to see him use it in MentalMisstep's ETutor build.

It doesn't need much setup. It helps to cast Grinding Station on a precombo turn. With Grinding Station + LED/Petal + Breach in play it can go off with as little as 0 cards in the graveyard (as long as you sequenced so your last spell was an artifact). More cards in GY is always better to enable more lines, but that's the bare minimum.

Last artifact spell resolves (Station, LED or Petal)
Station triggers
In response, T: sacrifice LED/Petal to mill 3 (GY size = 4)
Station untaps

If Brain Freeze is not in those cards:
Exile 3 cards to escape LED if you've found it, otherwise Petal (GY size=0, storm +1)
Station triggers
In response, T: sacrifice LED/Petal to mill 3 (GY size = 4)
Station untaps

Keep repeating until you're able to escape LED (not Lotus Petal) and find Brain Freeze in the 3 cards milled.

If Brain Freeze is in those cards:
T: sacrifice Grinding Station to mill 3 (GY size = 8)
Exile Grinding Station + 2 filler to escape LED (GY size = 4, storm +1)
Crack LED for UUU (GY size = 5)
Exile 3 other cards, not LED or BF, to escape Brain Freeze (GY size = 1)

Then you have Brain Freeze + LED and a large graveyard.
This line is nondeterministic but will hit Brain Freeze most of the time with enough storm and cards to win.

With a higher initial graveyard size and/or more lands in play there are many more lines:

• Grinding Station + Lotus Petal can get you a BF win without LED (e.g. LED was extracted). You just need more cards and/or mana to make that 1U.
  
• You can play around Surgical/Faerie Macabre on BF by floating 1U before Grinding (e.g. escape LED one more time, escape Petal twice, tap lands). When you hit BF you have the mana to cast it immediately in response to any targets on it so they cannot Surgical it.
  
• Grinding Station or Petal/LED can start in graveyard. Again, you just need the extra cards and/or mana to escape them first.
  
• You can escape a Silence effect or Pact to handle tricks like Surgical.
  
• You can Grind through your whole library and directly escape Burning Wish/Grapeshot/Thassa's Oracle without ever casting Brain Freeze. (e.g. BF extracted). You just need to make sure you'll have enough resources to both escape and generate the mana.

Once you know the requirements of the main loop, it just takes some math to figure out how many extra cards you need for the alternate lines given your game state. Extra lands save you cards, because you won't have to escape mana rocks as often. e.g. on a Lotus Petal line, each mana costs either 1 land or 3 cards, and each extra spell cast cost 4 cards (3 to escape, plus 1 to save room for that card).

—I might just be obtuse, but what's the reasoning behind a split between Silence and Orim's Chant? Is it only for Surgical Extraction? Why would one want to play a double of one and a singleton/double of the other?

Subtle differences between Orim's Chant and Silence. One targets. Name diversity dodges Surgical, Therapy, Meddling Mage. Kicking Chant is very rarely relevant. If you do kick Chant, it works even if opponent is hexproof (target yourself).

—As has been discussed, it seems people are cutting the Enlightened Tutor package back a fair bit. I fully support their reasoning, but what's the current thinking about anti-permanent cards in the mainboard?

The Intuition build lacks the same ability to answer permanents in game 1. You could run a few singleton answers but won't see them reliably. Even G2/G3, a lot of sideboard space is wasted running multiple copies of important answers, which limits answer diversity. It can answer some cards very well and has 0 answers for some other cards (e.g. Karn).

—Win-cons are rising and falling, presumably because this deck's so new. Is it worth it to keep a Thassa's Oracle in the 75 to deal with Leylines and such, or would it be better to just run removal?

The difference in win % is very marginal, so it's hard to tell. The deck is new and mostly played in 5-round events.
You need access to enchantment removal either way, so Leylines are not really a problem.

—No love for Plateau? I've been finding myself wanting it on occasion.

It would probably take the spot of a basic Mountain or Plains or a spell. The deck can support very few nonblue lands to get good use out of cantrips and have keepable opening hands. If you think you could do without that other card, try it out.

I'm trying something a bit odd at the moment. I've got two Burning Wishes in the main in place of other win conditions.

Personally I prefer that option too, better than Intuition. Burning Wish taxes SB space, but it also allows you to be more efficient with space in other ways, so there's a tradeoff. Wish builds don't need 3x Wear // Tear SB or a "win con" spot main.

The primer has some example of Wishboard cards. You can also see Jbinder's lists (linked). They're RUG instead of Jeskai, but he runs a very similar Wishboard.

[FTW]

Sarusta made 4th in this weekend's Legacy Challenge, barely squeezing into top 8 at 5-2:
https://magic.wizards.com/en/article...rusta_th_place

2 other Jeskai Breach decks at 5-2 but missed the top cut on tiebreakers:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/tourname...12094313#paper

Look at the rest of the top 4... Eldrazi Post, Eldrazi Post, BR Reanimator. Also 2 4C Loam in the top decks. These are tough matchups for Jeskai Breach. Lots of permanent-based hate. The meta is adapting to beat us.

This could be a good reason to favor the Burning Wish builds over the Intuition build. Intuition enables some powerful G1 piles and lets you swap a high number of cards postboard, but it's the worst at finding SB answers. ETutor and BWish lists can run niche singletons.

Chain of Vapor or Burning Wish->Void Snare are among Jeskai's few outs to a resolved Karn. The Intuition build has 0 outs in the 75. Eldrazi Post runs 4 Karn backed by 4 Chalice + X Trini + 4 ThoughtseizeSeer. I don't see those Intuition Breach decks doing any better against those Post decks.

[FTW]

Anuraag made 8th in the Dice City Games Open with the Intuition build:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/tourname...20-02-24#paper

3 other Jeskai Breach decks in the top 16!!
Jesse Hatfield made 9th with the ETutor build proving it still has legs too:
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/2794650#paper

I'd credit the popularity of the Intuition build to Anuraag's stream, not that it's necessarily better. The ETutor build has put up great results over the last 5 weeks.

[shojeel]

We should talk about our problem matchups. Karn Decks are not easy, and neither are Reanimator or Loam. What cards help us beat them from each color? We can't just rely on B-Wish to Voidsnare.

[FTW]

We should talk about our problem matchups. Karn Decks are not easy, and neither are Reanimator or Loam. What cards help us beat them from each color? We can't just rely on B-Wish to Voidsnare.

Karn is a must-counter. I won't Force a Chalice @ 0 or 3sphere if my hand has a reasonable chance at finding an answer, but Karn demands a counter. If it resolves then we're in trouble. Void Snare is far from optimal, it's just one of the few ways we can buy a turn to go off when we otherwise just lose. I don't know if that's worth a sideboard slot. Bounce is just one of the very few outs. ETutor for Detention Sphere would also work.

ETutor is MVP for me these matchups.

Against Karn decks and Moon decks I ETutor for Serenity. It's significantly better than Seal of Cleansing or Wear // Tear due to the high number of artifacts they play plus Leylines postboard. Serenity can 4-for-1 their board and also Time Walk (they won't play any more artifacts until it blows). This is insane value for 2 mana. I try to time it so Serenity blows the upkeep I'm about to go off. Since their deck plays at sorcery speed, that's hard for them to play around. Instant ETutor putting the card on top of library also dodges TKS.

With a Karn out, Serenity is also Time Walk if they're telegraphing Lattice and you have nothing better. If you play Serenity, Lattice turns into a game reset for both players (destroy all permanents). We recover faster than them so we probably win this game of chicken, buying a free turn to try to go off. The other out to Lattice is to float mana, let Lattice resolve, then Wear // Tear @ Karn.

Against Reanimator, we have to play the control role. We can't race. Counters are strong. AnziD aggressively Forces every Entomb. If they T1 Dark Ritual OTD and you don't have a counter, respond with Chant. ETutor finds a 1-of Silent Gravestone in my SB. Gravestone plays double duty. It protects us from GY hate and also acts as Meddling Mage on Reanimate and Animate Dead, cutting them down to only Exhume.

As you can see, postboard I often use ETutor to shutdown multiple cards from their deck at once, which makes up for the card disadvantage. A card I want to test more against hatebear decks is 1-of Porphyry Nodes, which will kill ALL the Collector Ouphes and Thalias and Prelate @ 2 when a single StP falls flat. 1-of Engineered Explosives probably also belongs in the 75.

Against Loam I haven't figured out a good strategy yet. Silence effects stop Crop Rotation into Bojuka Bog, but we also need artifact/enchantment kill to deal with cards like Chalice and Spheres. AnziD seemed to struggle against Loam without a cohesive plan.

What are your strategies for these decks?

[shojeel]

@FTW I just started a FB group and I am wondering if I can use your primer there, either link or copy/paste? Obviously I would include you as the author :)

[FTW]

@FTW I just started a FB group and I am wondering if I can use your primer there, either link or copy/paste? Obviously I would include you as the author :)

Yeah sure, feel free to link the primer. Linking is probably easier than copy/pasting. It's long, and it will be edited over time.

What are your thoughts on those tough matchups? Interested to hear your strategies.

EDIT: The 6-1 4C Loam deck from the Challenge even had a 1-of Kunoros, Hound of Athreos SB. In a Loam deck. This has 0 synergy with the engine, it's just hate for decks like Breach.
Look at all the hate this deck packs for Breach!


//Maindeck: 10
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Blast Zone

//Sideboard: 9
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Collector Ouphe
1 Lavinia, Azorius Renegade
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Kunoros, Hound of Athreos


Ironically they have KotR but no Bojuka Bogs. Knight bluff??
Anyway, how do we beat all these axes of hate? Hatebears, Chalice, Decay, Leylines.

[JackaBo]

Isnt that the thing with combodecks. That they can be hated on to the point where it’s unplayable. I don’t think you can expect to beat that kind of hate. I think that’s a good thing as it prevent combo winter and might lead to that Ub mustn’t be banned.
Of course using so many slots to breach means other matchups are sacrificed. So i guess you wont see that much hate forever.

I much rather see that Legacy adopts vintage deckbuilding norm, with serious hate in the board and possibly maindeck, than that people don’t try to fight the best deck and instead call for a ban.

[shojeel]

Yeah sure, feel free to link the primer. Linking is probably easier than copy/pasting. It's long, and it will be edited over time.

What are your thoughts on those tough matchups? Interested to hear your strategies.

EDIT: The 6-1 4C Loam deck from the Challenge even had a 1-of Kunoros, Hound of Athreos SB. In a Loam deck. This has 0 synergy with the engine, it's just hate for decks like Breach.
Look at all the hate this deck packs for Breach!


//Maindeck: 10
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Blast Zone

//Sideboard: 9
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Collector Ouphe
1 Lavinia, Azorius Renegade
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Kunoros, Hound of Athreos


Ironically they have KotR but no Bojuka Bogs. Knight bluff??
Anyway, how do we beat all these axes of hate? Hatebears, Chalice, Decay, Leylines.

Thanks! I’ll link it later today.

My findings on the tough matchups are:
1. Karn
2. Taxes (death&, Eldrazi.....and maybe moon lock)
3. 4-5c Loam

....with an honorable mention to any discard heavy builds. Everything else is pretty well matched for us. Of course I am playing a different build than most, being 5 color. I have moved back to 3 B wish in the main to deal with “bad stuff” (By force, Reverent Silence) and to find out missing pieces through Tome Scour and Infernal Tutor. I am running Grapeshot in the SB as an alt win-con. I may add a massacre. None of that shuts off Karn, which is a real problem for us, so I am running a 2/2 split of CoV and Echoing Truth along with 4 FoW. 3 slots are still flexible in the SB and I have 2-3 flex spots in my main. Right now the main is 2 Bolts and 1 Inution. The 3 SB cards are changing all the time as I have not found anything that makes me happy yet.

[Michael Keller]

Thanks! I’ll link it later today.

My findings on the tough matchups are:
1. Karn
2. Taxes (death&, Eldrazi.....and maybe moon lock)
3. 4-5c Loam

....with an honorable mention to any discard heavy builds. Everything else is pretty well matched for us. Of course I am playing a different build than most, being 5 color. I have moved back to 3 B wish in the main to deal with “bad stuff” (By force, Reverent Silence) and to find out missing pieces through Tome Scour and Infernal Tutor. I am running Grapeshot in the SB as an alt win-con. I may add a massacre. None of that shuts off Karn, which is a real problem for us, so I am running a 2/2 split of CoV and Echoing Truth along with 4 FoW. 3 slots are still flexible in the SB and I have 2-3 flex spots in my main. Right now the main is 2 Bolts and 1 Inution. The 3 SB cards are changing all the time as I have not found anything that makes me happy yet.

The key to making the deck really shine in post-board games is to make Breach an incidental value engine - not necessarily the primary win condition of the deck. This is why I think having a combination of Dark Confidant, Monastery Mentor and some other aggressive strategy really helps the deck in those games. To that end, Breach becomes just a good card to draw for added value where you can buy back a few cantrips or removal spells.

One has to wonder if Pyroclasm is a good sideboard option, in addition to some number of Blood Moon or Ensnaring Bridge for those other decks. Another card I've been using out of my board is Meltdown as a one-of, possibly two. I know Wear // Tear operates on the same axis, and will always have a place in the sideboard. That being said, Meltdown can gain huge value against Tomb decks in post-board games looking to aggressively mulligan for Chalice or some other combination of problematic artifacts. And it certainly has blowout value against other artifact decks.

[thefringthing]

Sweepers and Mentors are a bit of a nonbo.

[Mr. Safety]

Sweepers and Mentors are a bit of a nonbo.

I think it's pretty easy to chain a few spells, some of them free artifacts, and get all but one monk out of Pyroclasm range. It does however clear problematic creatures like Containment Priest, Ethersworn Canonist, Meddling Mage etc, while providing an out to Empty the Warrens or other problematic board situations involving small creatures. Pyroclasm also basically says 'kill target Death and Taxes player's chances of winning"..