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Thread: Song of Creation Storm

  1. #41

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post

    Any place for Jeweled Amulet? It can lay the groundwork for a quick Song, and like all free spells itís never bad once you have Song.
    That's pretty interesting. I worry a bit that it doesn't have enough of an immediate impact though. The turns where you don't have an extra mana to charge it up make it 2 turns away from producing even 1 could be rough. Cool suggestion though! I'd never really looked at that card before.

  2. #42

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    I will try Riddlesmith as an alternate engine before Amulet. He might already be that last card needed for consistency. After testing the other build, I saw how powerful Riddlesmith was and how valuable it was to have a cheaper engine. I can probably squeeze it into my own build, cutting Preordains. Then I can add Emry and/or Mishra's Bauble, without needing the higher-risk stuff like Narset+Echo, Entomb, or all nonbasics.
    Yeah RS is way better than it looks. Resolving Echo with one in play is usually enough to win, since you can almost always filter your hand enough to play 6 rocks and echo again, or simply find Burning Wish for a lethal tendrils without even worrying about Song. Glad you're testing it out! Excited to hear how it goes. Just hopped into another league and starting it off 2-0. Crossing my fingers that I can 5-0 with this so we can get on the leaderboard with it

  3. #43

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiFunn View Post
    That's pretty interesting. I worry a bit that it doesn't have enough of an immediate impact though. The turns where you don't have an extra mana to charge it up make it 2 turns away from producing even 1 could be rough. Cool suggestion though! I'd never really looked at that card before.
    Yeah, a Mox it isnít. Iíve played it in some metalcraft decks, and the worst-case scenario of it being a 0cc artifact with no text sometimes happens when your mana is tight. But Iíve never seen a list that makes better use of that worst-case scenario than yours, with Opal, Emry, Riddlesmith, and Song. And in the best-case scenario it fits the deck like a glove: Youíre trying to resolve a three-color, four-mana card (often on turn 2, Iím guessing) and youíre not doing much thatís meaningful until you do, and when you do itís the last turn of the game.

  4. #44
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    What's the purpose of Ovalchase Daredevil? Is it just to provide another angle of attack and keep restocking if you misfire, or is there something I'm not seeing?
    Quote Originally Posted by non-inflammable View Post
    If you diversified your cantrips, a chalice wouldn't be a liability.
    Quote Originally Posted by chunderbucket View Post
    You want interesting, nonbinary games? Don't make your deck so reliant on cantrips, like pretty much every above deck.
    Quote Originally Posted by iatee View Post
    I am tired of malicious top 8s and it is time to put an end to the practice.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Almost everyone plays decks that are strictly worse 75s than the top decks - which most people could sleeve up if they wanted to, they just elected not to.

  5. #45

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    What's the purpose of Ovalchase Daredevil? Is it just to provide another angle of attack and keep restocking if you misfire, or is there something I'm not seeing?
    Riddlesmith interaction

    @SamuraiFunn nice deck and good job!
    Have you been happy with emry and can you explain it's role in the deck?
    Do you ever fizzle out with song of creation? When i tried it in this kind of deck i had some problems where i had to use my fast mana to cast it, and after paying 4 mana i would not have mana to cast more of the expensive spells so i had to pass the turn. And if my next top deck then was a land i felt very far behind. This ofc comes up with riddlesmith as well, but you don't have to discard your hand eot with that :) I guess an active emry really helps there.

    And finally, what would you say are the best/worst matchups?

  6. #46
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    What's the purpose of Ovalchase Daredevil? Is it just to provide another angle of attack and keep restocking if you misfire, or is there something I'm not seeing?
    It turns Riddlesmith into "draw a card".

    You cast a 0cc artifact. Riddlesmith triggers. You draw a card, then discard Ovalchase. The 0cc artifact ETBs, triggering Ovalchase to return to hand.

    He has Entomb to find 1-of Ovalchase when he has Riddlesmith resolved. I like that better because Ovalchase is terribad without Riddlesmith. He can also mill into it with Emry.


    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post
    worst-case scenario of it being a 0cc artifact with no text sometimes happens when your mana is tight. But Iíve never seen a list that makes better use of that worst-case scenario than yours, with Opal, Emry, Riddlesmith, and Song. And in the best-case scenario it fits the deck like a glove: Youíre trying to resolve a three-color, four-mana card (often on turn 2, Iím guessing) and youíre not doing much thatís meaningful until you do, and when you do itís the last turn of the game.
    Pretty sure the 4th Chrome Mox is better than the 1st Jeweled Amulet. You can imprint nothing for a 0cc artifact with no text. If you imprint, it's a reusable mana source with no tempo loss.

    The tempo cost to charge Amulet hurts. My list needs mana to cantrip or cast Grid. His doesn't cantrip, but still has many early plays like Riddlesmith, Emry, Narset, Wish and Echo. Neither build needs to rush Turn 2 Song.


    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    Do you ever fizzle out with song of creation? When i tried it in this kind of deck i had some problems where i had to use my fast mana to cast it, and after paying 4 mana i would not have mana to cast more of the expensive spells so i had to pass the turn.
    What expensive spells do you need after Song? The chain is mostly 0-1cc spells, maybe a Riddlesmith, and then Burning Wish to win. Other cards are blanks, which means a lot of it is having the right ratios in the deck build and using tools to filter your draws.

    I've tested 50+ games by now (~50% win rate against tier 1 decks) and even more goldfishes. The fizzle rate is very low, but the sequencing is not always easy. I've had to pass the turn after paying extra mana for Spell Pierce/Daze/Veil or getting a draw Stifled, but not undisrupted. It might take some practice to get used to the patterns.

    One trick is to not use all your fast mana. Sandbag 1-2 0cc artifacts (especially LED, Bauble, 2nd Opal). Both Riddlesmith and Song reward you for having artifacts in hand, so you shouldn't be playing them all out when you can convert them into free cards instead.

    Another trick is to abuse LED and the stack. Stack draw triggers, then crack LED in response. Black Lotus should be enough mana.

    Beyond that, his build abuses LED+Echo to restock with cheap spells. Mine uses cantrips to filter everything that's not a 0-1cc. Sticking Riddlesmith after Song lets you draw 3 per artifact and filter out lands.

  7. #47

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post

    What expensive spells do you need after Song? The chain is mostly 0-1cc spells, maybe a Riddlesmith, and then Burning Wish to win. Other cards are blanks, which means a lot of it is having the right ratios in the deck build and using tools to filter your draws.
    What i mean is, say i cast song turn 2 with 2 baubles left in my hand, cast one bauble, draw narset + riddlesmith, cast the other bauble, see land and song of creation. Then you have to pass the turn and discard your hand. My question was how often this happens in his build. I've tried a similar build but gave up on song because i lost to many games where i got stuck hellbent.

  8. #48
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    What i mean is, say i cast song turn 2 with 2 baubles left in my hand, cast one bauble, draw narset + riddlesmith, cast the other bauble, see land and song of creation. Then you have to pass the turn and discard your hand. My question was how often this happens in his build. I've tried a similar build but gave up on song because i lost to many games where i got stuck hellbent.
    Ok, you mean what if variance causes you to draw duds. That's a good question. The deck needs a coherent strategy for that.

    Our builds handle it in different ways.
    My build: don't run as many 2-3cc cards and use cantrips to filter draws
    His build: use Riddlesmith + Song together to get more draw power, or use LED + Echo to reset hand

    Samurai can better speak to his build. He also has redundant engines so you can fizzle, try next turn and fizzle, then try again. I've fizzled more often with his, but he knows it better.

    I'll post an example of mine. The cantrips & LED synergize together to do silly things, so that I end up stuck hellbent maybe 5% or less. I am also more conservative with how fast I drop Song.

  9. #49
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Here are some examples of combo turns, sequencing to avoid fizzling.
    Opponent: RUG Delver

    Build: Xerox version with Riddlesmith&Bauble
    (Long attrition war backed by cantrips. T2 Riddlesmith Bolted. T3 Grid Forced, Force back but countered by 2nd Force. Then Song #1 countered by Spell Pierce. Grid #2 countered by 3rd Force. Finally resolved Song #2 before dying to Delver).

    Hand: Brainstorm, Opal, LED.
    Board: Island, Mountain, Forest, Tropical

    1. Song (using all 4 lands)
    2. LED. Draw 2 -> fetch, Song.
    Fetch Volcanic (2nd land drop).
    I'm down to my last mana and 0cc spell, so I do a stack trick with LED and Brainstorm to optimize chance of not fizzling
    3. Opal. Draw trigger. Hold priority
    4. Brainstorm (using Volcanic). Draw trigger. Hold priority.
    Crack LED for UUU (discard last card = Song) <- discard dud and draw 5 with UUU. Any 0cc or cantrip lets me keep going
    1st draw trigger -> Island, fetch
    brainstorm resolves -> Petal, fetch, Bauble. Put back 2 lands.
    2nd draw trigger -> same 2 lands
    5. Petal. Draw 2 -> Bauble, fetch
    6. Bauble. Draw 2 -> Petal, Riddlesmith
    7. Riddlesmith (using Opal + U). Draw 2 -> Riddlesmith, LED
    8. Petal. Draw 3 -> Bauble, Opal, fetch. Discard land.
    9. Opal. Draw 3 -> Ponder, Mox, land. Discard land.
    10. LED. Draw 3 -> Bauble, FoW, Wish. Discard land.
    11. Chrome. Draw 3 -> LED, Chrome, Land. Discard land. Imprint Riddle.
    12. LED. Draw 3 -> Land, FoW, Wish. Discard land.
    13. Wish (using Opal + U). Crack LEDs for BBBRRR. Draw 2 -> Wish, Petal. Wish for Tendrils.
    14. Petal. Draw 3 -> Grid, FoW, Opal. Discard Opal.
    15. Grid (using Chrome & Petal). Draw 3 -> Brainstorm, Ponder, Riddlesmith. Discard Riddle.
    16. Tendrils (pay BBRR) for 16 copies. Draw 2 trigger.

    6 cards left, behind Grid & FoW backup

    I used LED for early mana, then Riddlesmith let me draw extra to dig deeper.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Build: Xerox with Veil&Preordain instead of Riddlesmith&Bauble
    (Turn 4 OTD, turn before death to turn 1 flipped Delver)

    Hand: (Tarn, Ponder, Opal, Wish, Petal, Song, Veil)
    Board: Island, Island, Mountain, Forest

    1. Petal
    2. Song (using 4 lands).
    Opponent Dazes.
    4. Veil (using Petal). Resolves, countering Daze. Draw 1 -> fetch
    Play Tarn.
    5. Opal. Draw 2 -> Petal, land
    6. Petal. Draw 2 -> Veil, song
    7. Ponder (fetching for Volcanic). Draw 2 -> LED, land
    Ponder resolves: see BS, FoW, land. Draw BS.
    8. LED. Draw 2 -> FoW, land
    Out of 0cc artifacts. Down to 2 mana (Opal, Petal). To minimize fizzling, I stack to see the most cards with LED mana floating
    9. Brainstorm (using Opal). Stack draw. Hold priority.
    10. FoW it (pitch Song). Stack draw. Hold priority.
    11. Veil (using Petal). Stack draw. Hold priority.
    Crack LED for UUU (discard 4 lands + Wish) <--- dig 10 cards deep to find more gas with UUU floating!!!
    1st Draw 2 -> LED, brainstorm
    Veil resolves. Draw 1 -> FoW
    2nd Draw 2 -> Preordain, Preordain
    12. FoW the FoW (pitch Preordain). Draw 2 -> Wish, LED <-- lol make that 12 cards
    FoW fizzles (due to Veil)
    FoW#2 fizzles
    Last Draw 2 (from BS) -> land, FoW
    Brainstorm resolves: Draw land, Petal, Grid. put back 2 lands.
    13. LED. Draw 2 -> same 2 lands
    14. LED. Draw 2 -> Opal, Preordain
    15. Opal. Draw 2 -> Ponder, Opal
    16. Petal. Draw 2 -> land, Chrome Mox
    17. Chrome Mox. Draw 2 -> Wish, Song. Imprint Song.
    18. Opal (floating R from other Opal). Draw 2 -> Opal, Taiga
    19. Grid (using UU). Draw 2 -> Chrome Mox, Grid
    20. Wish (using UR). Stack draw. Hold priority.
    Crack LEDs for RRRBBB. Draw 2 -> Grid, LED.
    Wish for Tendrils or Grapeshot.
    21. Tendrils/Grape for 21 copies.


    Does that help?

    Most spells are 0-1 cc. Stack tricks enable you to see more cards before putting back with Brainstorm and to use LED mana.

    Also I went off with 4 lands. Vs Delver decks I play slow with basics and Grid to play around mana denial and counters. Vs combo you may have to go faster, but there's also FoW and Veil to disrupt them.
    Last edited by FTW; 06-26-2020 at 07:39 PM.

  10. #50

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post

    @SamuraiFunn nice deck and good job!
    Have you been happy with emry and can you explain it's role in the deck?
    Yep, Emry is an absolute powerhouse. The deck actually has relatively few high-impact cards to play on t1, since it plays no 1-drops and only Riddlesmith at 2 cmc (not counting Burning Wish here, since it's a late game play). Even though we have an abundance of artifact ramp, you generally would rather play your artifact ramp after resolving Riddlesmith so that you can benefit from the draw triggers. Emery changes that sequencing math, since you'll be able to play stuff from your yard.

    To get a sense of how powerful Emry is, consider this sequence:

    t1 - land, opal, bauble, Emry
    t2 - land, LED
    You now have access to 9 mana on turn 2. If you have Echo in hand (or if Emry milled one), you can tap opal, crack LED, Replay LED w/Emry, and echo with 5 mana floating (enough for a Song and 6 other cards).

    This line is insane and I try to set it up whenever I can. If you find yourself in this spot, remember to make U off the first LED and R off the second (leave yourself with UUR after casting Echo) so that any green source will allow you to resolve Song after wheeling.

    Often times we cast every spell in our entire hand just to finally end with a Song in play. In those moments having that one extra spell from Emry is super helpful to begin going off after that.

    Finally, in the fair matchups Emry will singlehandedly run away with the game if not answered immediately. The threat of drawing 2 cards per turn with Emry + Bauble makes it a must-answer for blue decks. In this way, Emry often baits out countermagic that would otherwise be used on Song, Echo, Narset, or Teferi.


    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    Do you ever fizzle out with song of creation? When i tried it in this kind of deck i had some problems where i had to use my fast mana to cast it, and after paying 4 mana i would not have mana to cast more of the expensive spells so i had to pass the turn. And if my next top deck then was a land i felt very far behind. This ofc comes up with riddlesmith as well, but you don't have to discard your hand eot with that :) I guess an active emry really helps there.
    "Fizzling" happens sometimes, but it's pretty rare. If I don't have a Riddlesmith in play, I'll usually try to land one shortly after Song. 20/60 of our cards are 0 mana artifacts, which basically makes a ration of 1/3 deterministic. With that said, I've never lost a game in which I resolved song of creation. Even when you need to land it and pass the turn, the draw power is so signification that it has always been enough to just bury the opponent in the card advantage the next turn. Baubles really help to keep you in the game here, because if you have to pass with just lands, a song, and 1 bauble, there's a high likelihood that at least 1 of the next 2 cards you draw on the following turn will not be a land, which should be enough to start the chain. Also, discarding Echo at the end of turn to Song is pretty sweet too


    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    And finally, what would you say are the best/worst matchups?
    So, right now my match record in league+challenge matches since adding Burning Wish is 57/28, so a match-win record of 67%. I haven't had a chance to distill all the match data, but Maverick is always a bit scary because they can GSZ for Ouphe, as well as all the Thalia/Deafening Silence type stuff that slows us down. Red Prison and D&T can be tricky as well. With that said, I'm very happy with the current wish-board and think we have all the tools we need to fight back against these decks. Also, we can just win on t1 pretty consistently if we know we're not facing down Force of Will

  11. #51
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiFunn View Post
    So, right now my match record in league+challenge matches since adding Burning Wish is 57/28, so a match-win record of 67%. I haven't had a chance to distill all the match data, but Maverick is always a bit scary because they can GSZ for Ouphe, as well as all the Thalia/Deafening Silence type stuff that slows us down. Red Prison and D&T can be tricky as well. With that said, I'm very happy with the current wish-board and think we have all the tools we need to fight back against these decks. Also, we can just win on t1 pretty consistently if we know we're not facing down Force of Will
    I really love Burning Wish in decks like this.

    Have you considered Massacre for decks like Maverick and D&T, since you actually run USea?

  12. #52

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Yeah i think in a version with fow like you are playing you can afford to be more conservative. In the current meta without fow i feel you have to go pretty fast before someone drops a karn, GSZ for ouphe, or just kill you/lock you down. So i'm mostly interested in SamuraiFunns build as that's closer to what i've been playing before.

  13. #53

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    I really love Burning Wish in decks like this.

    Have you considered Massacre for decks like Maverick and D&T, since you actually run USea?
    Oooh, I really like that. Going to test it out for sure.

  14. #54

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiFunn View Post
    I'm very happy with the current wish-board and think we have all the tools we need to fight back against these decks. Also, we can just win on t1 pretty consistently if we know we're not facing down Force of Will
    Thanks for all the answers! I did join a league with your list now and started out with a win vs reanimator and win vs depths but lost vs grixis control (pyroblast, snap pyro felt really tough to beat). Deck felt good, but i did miss defense grids or veils or something vs control. Also i had some times where i wished there where anything to wish for to advance my gameplan after i already wished for echo once. I only resolved song twice, but won both times (it really was win more one of the times, i already had 3 riddlesmiths and both daredevils and i almost lost because song is not a may trigger :) I probably misplayed a lot, fetched the wrong duals etc.

    When do you board in chalice, and what do you cut?

  15. #55
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    Yeah i think in a version with fow like you are playing you can afford to be more conservative. In the current meta without fow i feel you have to go pretty fast before someone drops a karn, GSZ for ouphe, or just kill you/lock you down. So i'm mostly interested in SamuraiFunns build as that's closer to what i've been playing before.
    Yeah, I am playing more control-combo, using protection and Wishboard to answer their cards. FoW is very strong because it both protects the combo and then acts as 0-mana spell to draw 2.

    The strategy worked very well with Breach and Bant Zirda, and is how a lot of other combos work too (SneakShow, OmniTell, High Tide, Thought Lash). The plan is to be more interactive at card parity, investing fewer cards in the engine (to avoid blowouts to disruption). Then Song is a 1-card win button.

    Because I sculpt and play for card parity, there's usually gas to support Song. That's why the fizzle rate is low. If I had to dump my hand to play T2 Song I could see more fizzles happening, or having to scoop to FoW. If I need to race and have explosive mana, Wish + LED -> Empty is another line.

    For a faster build without FoW, you might as well be explosive with Echo of Eons. Samurai's build does that. If you float mana through Echo, you can cast Song if it's in your new 7 and then win. The build I posted on page 1 (Rite of Flame, Wish, Echo, Gamble) does that too and has more T1-T2 goldfishes. Echo is a big part of that. The drawback is if you get Echo countered, you're hellbent. And sometimes Echo gives the opponent a grip of answers. I started with the explosive plan but was getting blown out by counters so I switched.

  16. #56
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    (it really was win more one of the times, i already had 3 riddlesmiths and both daredevils and i almost lost because song is not a may trigger :)
    Playing around decking is important. Riddlesmith is a "may", so when you're down to the last 15ish cards you may want to stop using Riddlesmith. Wish and Tendrils trigger Song draws before Tendrils copies resolve, just remember that!

    Another out to decking (especially if you need Grapeshot instead of Tendrils) is to LED+Echo to reshuffle your graveyard. Good to have a spare LED and Echo set up just in case.

  17. #57
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    I tried out my old more explosive build. It was better than I thought.

    It wins much faster against non-FoW decks.
    Against FoW decks it's more vulnerable, but it can board into Hopes and maindeck Empty like TES does.


    //Artifacts: 18
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    4 Chrome Mox
    3 Mox Opal
    3 Defense Grid

    //Enchantments: 4
    4 Song of Creation

    //Spells: 23
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Gamble
    4 Rite of Flame
    4 Manamorphose
    4 Burning Wish
    3 Echo of Eons

    //Lands: 15
    4 Scalding Tarn
    4 Wooded Foothills
    3 Volcanic Island
    1 Taiga
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Badlands
    1 Mountain

    //Sideboard: 15
    1 Tendrils of Agony
    1 Echo of Eons
    1 Reverent Silence
    1 Pulverize
    1 Pyroclasm
    1 Grapeshot
    4 Empty the Warrens
    3 Abrupt Decay
    2 Hope of Ghirapur


    To test both racing and resilience I tested against Burn and UR Delver.

    vs Burn (8/10)
    1) T2 Win OTD (natural Tendrils x10)
    2) Loss OTD (Had T2 Song, but Eidolon forced me to Wish for Pyroclasm first, then too slow)
    3) T1 Win OTP (Echo into Song, Grapeshotx22)
    4) Loss OTP (T2 Gamble bricked @ 20% to miss. T3 Echo bricked)
    5) T2 Win OTD (Song into Tendrilsx20)
    6) T2 Win OTP. T1 Echo. T2 Song. (Tendrilsx14)
    7) T2 Win OTD T1 Echo into Song, pass the turn. (Tendrilsx11)
    8) T2 Win OTD. T1 Echo into Song, pass (Wish for Pyroclasm on Eidolon, Tendrilsx14)
    9) T3 Win OTD. T2 Song, pass. T3 Brainstorm into gas (Tendrilsx20)
    10) T3 Win OTP. T2 Echo, Grid. T3 Song (Tendrilsx20)

    Won 80% T1-T3
    Beat T2 Eidolon 1/2 times


    vs UR Delver (7/10)
    1) Lost to FoW+Daze+2x Waste and bricked on Gamble
    2) T3 Win. (T1 Grid eats FoW, then Echo into Grid. T3 Song)
    3) T3 Win. (T2 Song Forced. T3 Echo into Song (pay for Daze))
    4) T3 Win with Song.
    5) T3 Win. (Grid through double Daze, Echo into Tendrilsx15)
    6) T6 Win. (T2 Grid Forced. T4 Song Forced. T5 Wish Forced. T6 Song resolved!! Brainstorm into gas)
    7) T4 Win. (T2 Grid, T4 Song)
    8) Lost to 2x Waste after resolving Grid, couldn't cast Song
    9) Lost to 2x Force, Waste. Empty for 14 Goblins was 1 turn too slow.
    10) T3 Win (T2 Echo into Song, pass. T3 Grid, Echo, win)

    Won 70%
    Force in 5/10, won 3 of them (This build had 5x Force, 4x Daze, but no Spell Pierce main, more aggro focused)
    Played around Daze

    I underestimated the power of speed. It's much riskier playing without FoW and with Gamble, but it's explosive.

  18. #58

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Nice!
    I finished the league today with losses vs omnishow and some post/eldrazi deck. The omnishow match did not tell me anything, opponent had extremly strong draws for the matchup. The post match was easy preboard, postboard was a lot harder with chalice on 0, trinisphere leyline.
    My main takeaways from the league:
    1) I like song of creation, esp that it does not care about the graveyard and also not care about the spells actually resolving to draw cards in comparison to ovalchase daredevil that needs the artifacts to hit play so chalice on 0 is rough.

    2) I'm no big emry fan, i had one match where it was really good (with bauble recursion), and while it did _some_ work in other matches it did not feel like the best card in that slot for me. But if you like Emry i would probably test with some number of Jeskai Ascendancy. It's a more expensive riddlesmith that wins the game if you have emry in play.

    3) I never cast a chalice, but i like it in theory as it stops very many problematic cards post board, almost all of them :) It almost felt like i wanted to board it in vs all decks except other chalice decks.

    4) i think i would play pulverize and empty the warrens in the sideboard.


    So my next step will probably be to add some songs to my riddlesmith deck and test that.

  19. #59
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    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    4) i think i would play pulverize and empty the warrens in the sideboard.
    Especially postboard, I've been using Empty a lot as plan B, like TES does. It gives the deck more legs when you can't stick an engine or just need to go off fast.

    I like Pulverize because I find the deck tight on mana, although it's really awkward vs 3sphere.

    The post match was easy preboard, postboard was a lot harder with chalice on 0, trinisphere leyline.
    What's your SB strategy for Post?

    I'd consider just boarding out Ovalchase and other graveyard heavy stuff (Entomb?), ignoring Leyline instead of trying to fight it. Then you just need artifact removal instead of needing multiple bounce/Wishes.

  20. #60

    Re: Song of Creation Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    What's your SB strategy for Post?

    I'd consider just boarding out Ovalchase and other graveyard heavy stuff (Entomb?), ignoring Leyline instead of trying to fight it. Then you just need artifact removal instead of needing multiple bounce/Wishes.
    Yeah in this league i think i boarded out a emry and an daredevil for two abrades, leaving the shattering spree and R.silcene in the board to wish for.

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