Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 57

Thread: Obosh B'gosh

  1. #1
    Sushi or Meat and Eggs
    Cire's Avatar
    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Posts

    2,071

    Obosh B'gosh

    Obosh, the Preypiercer

    So it is apparent that companions are sort of . . . good. At least half of them are playable in legacy so I want to see if we can abuse the half that aren't yet broken. Obosh seems like a likely candidate - a 6*/5 for 5 that doubles the damage output of all your spells. What is more many of Magic's best cards are odd costed. . . The cantrip cartel, OKO and Astrolab, FOW, Delver, TNN . . . . You don't have to jump through that many hoops. The only think that is hard to justify is the fact that you can't use LED, so any Obosh deck would seem to be non-optimal as long as Lurrus is legal. That said, no need to waste time and lets see how good we can get this deck in the mean time.

    Now, it seems that you can easily modify a Delver or Oko deck to run Obosh on the side - unlike Jegantha, the Wellspring, which is also seeing play, you can play Obosh as a beater that's always in hand AND still play FOW. Also, although it can't win as a one card combo, like Gyruda, Doom of Depths, you can play Dark Ritual and Seething Song to accelerate this out.

    So I think you can either modify an existing deck to fit it in as a beater or you can see if you can build a deck to accelerate it into play and then burn out an opponent.

    Obosh - Delver

    4 Delver of Secrets
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    2 Oko, Thief of Crowns

    4 Arcum's Astrolab

    4 Force of Will
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Chain Lightning
    3 Spell Pierce
    3 Preordain
    3 Force of Negation

    19 Lands

    -1 Companion
    Obosh, the Preypiercer

    This idea is that this deck would play as a regular RUG Delver deck just without Daze. Daze is obviously important, but you exchange it for a midgame-lategame threat (a 6/5 that also doubles your burn spells, allows TNN to swing for 6 the turn it comes out, doubles your delver's power etc. You should be able to cast Obosh and perhaps even win the next turn.

    Obosh - "Combo"

    This will be built entirely differently. The idea here is that you want to acclerate out to Obosh as soon as possible and then chain some burn spells. The turn sequence should be something like this:

    Turn 1 - Land + Discard
    Turn 2 - Sol land + Seething Song OR Dark Ritual --> Obosh
    Turn 3 - Land + Burn + Burn + Burn

    The following should be decent for the above gameplay:

    12 Lands
    8 Sol Lands
    4 Dark Ritual
    4 Seething Song
    4 Rite of Flame
    4 Duress
    4 Thoughtseize
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Chain Lightning
    4 Lava Spike
    4 Rift Bolt
    4 Skewer the Critics

    -1 Companion
    Obosh, the Preypiercer

    It should play sort of like a weird burn deck with a little bit of disruption, also with Obosh constantly in hand it can probably recover from losing gas early on, especially since Obosh can hit for 6 and doubles any burn spell that you top deck.

    edit- removed fireblasts for being even CMC.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    You sir are a ninja of fine quality.

  2. #2
    Hymn-Slinging Mod
    H's Avatar
    Join Date

    Sep 2008
    Location

    The U-easy-anna
    Posts

    2,926

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Well, not sure how good this avenue is, but Lurrus has an odd cost, so you could run some maindeck with Obosh.
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
    óKaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order

  3. #3
    Member

    Join Date

    Sep 2011
    Posts

    2,068

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    This looks interesting.

    Unfortunately you can't play Fireblast (even CMC). Otherwise you could just run this as a companion to Burn.

    I think you need more creatures than just 4 Delver + 2 TNN.

    What about in UR Delver


    //Creatures: 12
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Monastery Swiftspear
    2 Pteramander
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    //Spells: 29
    4 Force of Will
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Stifle
    4 Lightning Bolt
    3 Chain Lightning
    2 Preordain
    2 Spell Pierce
    1 Force of Negation
    1 Dismember

    //Lands: 19
    4 Wasteland
    4 Scalding Tarn
    2 Polluted Delta
    2 Misty Rainforest
    3 Volcanic Island
    2 Island
    1 Mountain
    1 Fiery Islet

    //Other playables in Main or SB:
    x Brazen Borrower
    x Spell Snare
    x Light Up The Stage
    x Surgical Extraction
    x Shattering Spree
    x Grafdigger's Cage
    x Pithing Needle
    x Bonecrusher Giant
    x Soul-Scar Mage
    x Gut Shot
    x Red Elemental Blast
    x By Force
    x Flusterstorm
    x Force of Negation


    Many games you won't hit the mana to cast Obosh but it's powerful if you ever reach a drawn-out lategame.

    The opportunity cost isn't huge compared to what UR Delver usually runs. You mainly lose Daze and Dreadhorde Arcanist, so you can try to play a speed game with Stifle + Waste + 1 drops + burn.

    Is it better than splashing black for Lurrus though? Maybe not.

  4. #4
    Hymn-Slinging Mod
    H's Avatar
    Join Date

    Sep 2008
    Location

    The U-easy-anna
    Posts

    2,926

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Another option is Obosh Jund. You still get Discard, but you do loose 'Goyf. However, you could still run silly things like Seal of Fire with Lurrus in the maindeck.
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
    óKaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order

  5. #5
    Sushi or Meat and Eggs
    Cire's Avatar
    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Posts

    2,071

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post

    Many games you won't hit the mana to cast Obosh but it's powerful if you ever reach a drawn-out lategame.

    The opportunity cost isn't huge compared to what UR Delver usually runs. You mainly lose Daze and Dreadhorde Arcanist, so you can try to play a speed game with Stifle + Waste + 1 drops + burn.

    Is it better than splashing black for Lurrus though? Maybe not.
    My theory with these lists is that Obosh's restriction is actually really easy to build around without losing much in many builds. The cost of the restriction and and SB slot are worth it to run a threat that can end the game the turn it comes out or the turn after. Just having the option to play aggressively knowing that late game you will always have a must-counter card that can turn the tide is a huge benefit. It is 100% not as good as Lurrus and if Lurrus stays legal you should be building around it instead, but these ideas are mostly for the idea of what happens after a potential Lurrus ban. The idea is that Companions > No-Companion.

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    Another option is Obosh Jund. You still get Discard, but you do loose 'Goyf. However, you could still run silly things like Seal of Fire with Lurrus in the maindeck.
    I think you lose a lot in Jund actually - Hymn, Decay, Trophy, Goyf, Bob, Library.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    You sir are a ninja of fine quality.

  6. #6
    Hymn-Slinging Mod
    H's Avatar
    Join Date

    Sep 2008
    Location

    The U-easy-anna
    Posts

    2,926

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Of course, the following cards also have odd CMCs:

    Arcum's Astrolabe
    Oko, Thief of Crowns
    Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath
    Green Sun's Zenith

    So, maybe a RUG mid-range deck? But it does mean you can't run Coatl. You might still be better off with Yorion in that direction...
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
    óKaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order

  7. #7
    Sushi or Meat and Eggs
    Cire's Avatar
    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Posts

    2,071

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    Of course, the following cards also have odd CMCs:

    Arcum's Astrolabe
    Oko, Thief of Crowns
    Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath
    Green Sun's Zenith

    So, maybe a RUG mid-range deck? But it does mean you can't run Coatl. You might still be better off with Yorion in that direction...
    GSZ is interesting - also an option would be Noble Hierarch to accle out Obosh and other threats.

    And the difference between Yorion and Obosh is the decks that might want them. Yorion seems to slot into Snow-Ko Miracles very well while Obosh seems to slot into RUG or BUG Delver very well. The R/B Burn list, I think is more fun . . . but I can admit that if he is played it will probably be in a list a blue list.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    You sir are a ninja of fine quality.

  8. #8
    Hymn-Slinging Mod
    H's Avatar
    Join Date

    Sep 2008
    Location

    The U-easy-anna
    Posts

    2,926

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by Cire View Post
    GSZ is interesting - also an option would be Noble Hierarch to accle out Obosh and other threats.

    And the difference between Yorion and Obosh is the decks that might want them. Yorion seems to slot into Snow-Ko Miracles very well while Obosh seems to slot into RUG or BUG Delver very well. The R/B Burn list, I think is more fun . . . but I can admit that if he is played it will probably be in a list a blue list.
    Well, it would be interesting if a RB list could really do it. But, yeah, I mean, Yorion takes what was already competitive and just adds to it, with very little cost.

    5 mana is a lot though, I'm not sure a Delver deck could realistically run it, even if it didn't mean not running Daze, which it does. I'd think if you want to go to Obosh, you'd have to try it in something more midrange-ish.
    "The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
    óKaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order

  9. #9
    Sushi or Meat and Eggs
    Cire's Avatar
    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Posts

    2,071

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by H View Post
    Well, it would be interesting if a RB list could really do it. But, yeah, I mean, Yorion takes what was already competitive and just adds to it, with very little cost.

    5 mana is a lot though, I'm not sure a Delver deck could realistically run it, even if it didn't mean not running Daze, which it does. I'd think if you want to go to Obosh, you'd have to try it in something more midrange-ish.
    Would love for the RB list to turn out well - will run a couple games with it later.

    As for midrangeish . . . how about:

    Team Obosh

    3 Oko, Thief of Crowns

    1 Courser of Kruphix
    1 Gilded Goose
    1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    4 Noble Hierarch
    1 [[Big] GSZ target]
    2 Plague Engineer
    2 Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath

    4 Green Sun's Zenith
    4 Brainstorm
    2 Force of Negation
    4 Force of Will
    4 Thoughtseize

    4 Arcum's Astrolabe

    1 Dryad Arbor
    4 Ancient Tomb
    18 Lands

    -1 Companion
    Obosh, the Preypiercer
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    You sir are a ninja of fine quality.

  10. #10

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    The problem with this companion in a Delver deck is not only that you canít run Daze, but that your opponent knows from the very start that you donít run Daze. The threat of Daze is a huge advantage to a Delver deck even when it doesnít get drawn. You lose that weapon to gain access to a 5-drop ó sure, its a companion, and that means automatic card advantage, but losing tempo advantage in favor of a value 5-drop seems counterproductive in the Delver strategy.

    I like the TNN synergy and the fact that you have FoW. Not sure what kind of deck that leaves you with. Edit: I think I agree with your last decklist as a general idea :-)

  11. #11

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    I'd like to use him with something silly like goblin grenade or seismic assault.
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  12. #12
    Sushi or Meat and Eggs
    Cire's Avatar
    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Posts

    2,071

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post
    The problem with this companion in a Delver deck is not only that you canít run Daze, but that your opponent knows from the very start that you donít run Daze. The threat of Daze is a huge advantage to a Delver deck even when it doesnít get drawn. You lose that weapon to gain access to a 5-drop ó sure, its a companion, and that means automatic card advantage, but losing tempo advantage in favor of a value 5-drop seems counterproductive in the Delver strategy.

    I like the TNN synergy and the fact that you have FoW. Not sure what kind of deck that leaves you with.
    That is a very fair point.

    Also, if we want to take advantage of FOW+TNN it does seem like we also want to run Oko+Astrolab. Note that Oko transforms the Astrolab into a creature . . . with a converted mana cost of 1, meaning that when Obosh ETB that Astrolab-Elk will be hitting for 6!

    Also - some quick playtesting with "Obosh - R/B list" - it is . . . not bad? I don't know how to explain it without asking people to playtest it as well. First, it clearly needs to run some creatures. I'm thinking Grim Lavamancer or something on the ground, it also needs to run more disruption. But overall it threatens Obosh turn 2/3 and has enough burn to attack and kill the turn after. Coupled with discard it pressures decks with a consistent turn 4 clock. I think tweaking some stuff in it could make it somewhat competitive if it can pressure opponents and disrupt their plans as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    You sir are a ninja of fine quality.

  13. #13

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Thatís cool that your RB Burn is working. Itís a unique deck to be sure, so Iíd be happy if it turned out to be good.

    Two other thoughts:
    (1) The Nic Fit engine is built around two one-mana cards (Explorer and Therapy) and can ramp up to 5cc. Maybe itís not well positioned with all the snow basics these days, but it might be a natural way to use Obosh.
    (2) I have an Orcish Lumberjack / Land Tax / Titania / KotR / GSZ deck: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...d-Tax-Titania)
    Itís... not gonna win you a tournament tomorrow, but a lot of the main cards are odd-cost. (Mox Diamond is a loss, ScOoze might be an even bigger loss even though itís singleton.) There might be a way to use Obosh. The deck likes cards that you can sink mana into but that wonít ruin your opening hand, so a companion could help there. Obosh is good at reducing GY reliance (KotR and Titania need the GY and theyíre the main ways to win), and doubling the power of a KoTR when your GY is intact could be a beating. One would need to cut the even cards and the Karns to fit in disruption and more Obosh synergy to make it all worthwhile. Oh, and also: Iíve been toying with Firestorm in that list and that card could be hilarious with Obosh.

  14. #14

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post
    (2) I have an Orcish Lumberjack / Land Tax / Titania / KotR / GSZ deck: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...d-Tax-Titania)
    Itís... not gonna win you a tournament tomorrow, but a lot of the main cards are odd-cost. (Mox Diamond is a loss, ScOoze might be an even bigger loss even though itís singleton.) There might be a way to use Obosh. The deck likes cards that you can sink mana into but that wonít ruin your opening hand, so a companion could help there. Obosh is good at reducing GY reliance (KotR and Titania need the GY and theyíre the main ways to win), and doubling the power of a KoTR when your GY is intact could be a beating. One would need to cut the even cards and the Karns to fit in disruption and more Obosh synergy to make it all worthwhile. Oh, and also: Iíve been toying with Firestorm in that list and that card could be hilarious with Obosh.
    I like this. How would your 75 look?
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  15. #15

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Chandra Nalaar and Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh allow you do the gimmick-y oneshot in tandem with that companion. The only shell that would fit those cards is sort of a dragon stompy stuff, but sadly without chalice.

  16. #16
    Sushi or Meat and Eggs
    Cire's Avatar
    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Posts

    2,071

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Update:

    Obosh is now officially competitive in Pioneer at least (BTW jesus - 22/32 of the top 32 decks featuring a companion in a 7 round event and thats with Gyruda is banned due to bugs)

    Anyway the list is very simple. It is a RG beat down deck with accel. Turn 1 - Mana Dork, Turn 2- 4 to 5 power creature, Turn 3 - 4 to 5 power creature, Turn 4 - Obosh and beat face for the win. Simple and easy. Wondering if this is the direction legacy version should take.

    A shell could be:

    9 Mana Dork
    14 3 cmc 5+ creatures
    8 Sol Land
    15 Other lands
    10 Discard
    4 Bolt

    I think that would actually have a pretty good chance of beating for 20 turn 4 and you have a fair bit of discard and it would seem to be pretty resilient. You're just laying out threat after threat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    You sir are a ninja of fine quality.

  17. #17
    Member

    Join Date

    Sep 2011
    Posts

    2,068

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by Cire View Post
    (BTW jesus - 22/32 of the top 32 decks featuring a companion in a 7 round event and thats with Gyruda is banned due to bugs)
    Not just any companion.

    Places 1, 2, 4, 5, 15 and 17 were all the same BW Lurrus Enchantress deck.
    13th place Ballista-Heliod list has 1 Lurrus maindeck and can board it out as a Companion with a few other swaps
    14th place is Lurrus Hardened Scales
    Lurrus has Breach-levels of dominance. A ban must be coming.

    8th, 9th and 11th are the same RG beatdown Obosh list
    That midrange beatdown strategy works in Pioneer. Midrange beatdown isn't as good in Legacy. Lumberjack+Titania or NicFit are the closest thing, but those are low tier decks.

  18. #18

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by Cire View Post
    Update:

    Obosh is now officially competitive in Pioneer at least (BTW jesus - 22/32 of the top 32 decks featuring a companion in a 7 round event and thats with Gyruda is banned due to bugs)

    Anyway the list is very simple. It is a RG beat down deck with accel. Turn 1 - Mana Dork, Turn 2- 4 to 5 power creature, Turn 3 - 4 to 5 power creature, Turn 4 - Obosh and beat face for the win. Simple and easy. Wondering if this is the direction legacy version should take.

    A shell could be:

    9 Mana Dork
    14 3 cmc 5+ creatures
    8 Sol Land
    15 Other lands
    10 Discard
    4 Bolt

    I think that would actually have a pretty good chance of beating for 20 turn 4 and you have a fair bit of discard and it would seem to be pretty resilient. You're just laying out threat after threat.
    Seems like it could be decent. I might try legion warboss, goblin rabblemaster, bolt, goblin grenade plus the ramp and discard. I'd prefer orcish lumberjack though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  19. #19

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by kinda View Post
    I like this. How would your 75 look?
    I tried to come up with something, but couldnít make a convincing list. The problem with Orcish Lumberjack is that no other creature does what he does (so you donít get nice, consistent opening hands, as you would in decks that run both Hierarch and GSZ, or the two Sol lands and spirit guides). So either you draw Lumberjack or you donít, and if you do, either it gets bolted or it doesnít, and on turn 2 you have either five mana or two mana. Itís really hard to find cards that are good in both scenarios, and being limited to odd-cc cards doesnít help. (GSZ is one of the best friends of a deck that has widely varying amounts of mana ó you can get Arbor or BoP if youíre at low mana or Titania if youíre at high mana, and thereís a toolbox to tie it together. But with the odd-cc restriction you lose the toolbox: SCooze was your best friend, especially with Lumberjack amounts of mana, and Collector Ouphe is one of the best reasons to have GSZ.)

    Obosh helps this deck from one angle by guaranteeing that you always have a five-drop ďin your hand,Ē but you still just have the four Lumberjacks, and you canít use Once Upon a Time to help find them on turn 1 because that card has an even cc.

    Okay, maybe forget the Land Tax (even though I love my Orcish Lumberjack + Land Tax list to a fault) and use Veteran Explorer *with* Lumberjack?

  20. #20
    Member

    Join Date

    Sep 2011
    Posts

    2,068

    Re: Obosh B'gosh

    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post
    Okay, maybe forget the Land Tax (even though I love my Orcish Lumberjack + Land Tax list to a fault) and use Veteran Explorer *with* Lumberjack?
    A list like that was posted in the N&D here some time in the last few months. It might be the best place to start. 4 Lumberjack + 4 Explorer + GSZ should be enough consistency.

    Or check out this thread
    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...rk-depth/page3

    Other turn 1 plays:
    Tinder Wall
    Elvish Reclaimer
    Birds of Paradise, followed by Crop Rotation into Ancient Tomb
    GSZ into Dryad Arbor

    You can build a ramp deck with 4x Titania and a good backup plan of just playing an early 3 drop if you don't have Lumberjack.

    Good turn 2 3-drops:
    Bonecrusher Giant
    Steel Leaf Champion
    Knight of the Reliquary
    Terravore
    Ramunap Excavator
    Tireless Tracker

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)