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Thread: Mono Red Welder

  1. #1

    Mono Red Welder

    Hey guys, I've been toying around with a not so new idea but one I haven't seen anybody else try since the printing of Goblin Engineer. Now we can run 8 Welders.

    Aside from early builds of Stax (maybe even MUD), I think I first saw the power of Goblin Welder back in the early 2000s in an old Vintage deck called Tools n' Tubbies. The deck centered around Survival of the Fittest and Bazaar of Baghdad as discard outlets, Moxen and Mishra's Workshop for ramp, Trinisphere, Tangle Wire and Sphere of Resistance for disruption, Juggernaut and Su-Chi for beats and then Goblin Welder for all sorts of artifact swapping shenanigans.

    Since we don't have access to discard outlets such as Bazaar and Survival of the Fittest, we substitute with Smuggler's Copter and Faithless Looting to fill those slots. We also get Goblin Engineer who essentially takes on a Stoneforge Mystic type role in that it can literally grab "ANY" artifact from the deck and put it into the graveyard to be swapped into play using Goblin Welder.

    Anyway, I'm sure you get the idea. Here's my list so far. It is not tested or tuned but it goldfishes like a champ! Here's my list so far:

    MONO RED WELDER: 60 Cards

    WELDERS:
    4x Goblin Welder
    4x Goblin Engineer

    TOOLS:
    0cc for early swaps:
    4x Mox Opal
    3x Mishra's Bauble
    1x Tormod's Crypt

    Draw, Utility:
    1x Smuggler's Copter
    1x Ichor Wellspring

    Disruption:
    3x Sphere of Resistance
    3x Tangle Wire
    1x Trinisphere

    TUBBIES:
    3x Lodestone Golem
    2x Meteor Golem
    1x Steel Hellkite
    1x Sundering Titan

    OTHER STUFF:
    2x Blood Moon
    4x Faithless Looting
    2x Karn, the Great Creator

    LANDS:
    4x Ancient Tomb
    4x City of Traitors
    4x Great Furnace
    6x Mountain
    2x Wasteland

    SIDEBOARD: 15 Cards
    1x Crucible of Worlds
    1x Wurmcoil Engine
    1x Meteor Golem
    1x Mycosynth Lattice
    1x Possessed Portal
    1x Powder Keg
    1x Smokestack
    1x Smuggler's Copter
    1x Sorcerous Spyglass
    1x Sphere of Resistance
    1x Static Orb
    1x Tangle Wire
    1x Tormod's Crypt
    1x Trinisphere
    1x Walking Ballista

    Some card explanations:

    1). Tangle Wire might look weird here but it is really good combined with Welders and static tax effects such as produced by cards like Trinisphere, Lodestone Golem and Sphere of Resistance. Swapping it in and out with fresh counters is extremely disruptive.

    2). Although it can be grabbed with Karn, I wanted to run Possessed Portal main. There are some stupid Welder tricks you do with it, especially when swapping it into play during your opponent's upkeep, sac it to itself at the end of turn and then Welder it back in during their upkeep again. I was at one point swapping it back and forth with Meteor Golem. Think about that for a second. With two Welders you can sac it back and forth with Ichor Wellspring drawing you a ton of cards and your opponent doesn't ever get a draw step. The more I play with it the more I think it should be main deck.

    3). There's probably something better than Mishra's Bauble for the 0cc slot but for now it stays. Maybe Lotus Petal or some other 0cc trinket. Chalice of the Void?? The card draw is nice though.

    4). There's a lot of stuff on the sb that I want to put into the main deck but had no room.

    5). I had the Painter / Grindstone combo in the main deck. It didn't seem to come together fast enough. Maybe I didn't test it enough though. Maybe it should be in the sb?

    6). Yes I wanted to play Chalice of the Void, but I also want to be able to play Goblin Welder and Faithless Looting. Maybe it should be in the Mishra's Bauble 0cc slot. I can always sac to Engineer etc..

    Thoughts? What would you do different? Constructive comments only. ;)
    Last edited by Laser Brains; 12-29-2020 at 02:09 AM.
    "WaaaauuugghhhaaaauuugghhhaauuugghhhaaauuugghhhW" -Chewbacca

  2. #2

    Re: Mono Red Welder

    I'd cut one meteor golem for Bolas' citadel.
    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    With the printing of Gigantosaurus, Thrashing Brontodon and Steel Leaf Champion the deck has evolved from good to very competitive. Anyway, give it a few play tests if you are interested and let me know what you think.

    Winter Maze
    Quote Originally Posted by CptHaddock View Post
    With veteran explorer I know that I 100% will not enjoy a 30 minute grindfest against someone who can barely afford dual lands and believes that their deck can cast a 10 mana 8/8.

  3. #3

    Re: Mono Red Welder

    Spine of Ish Sah is pretty much strictly better than Meteor Golem

  4. #4

    Re: Mono Red Welder

    @Kinda: Yes, I will test Bolas's Citadel. It looks strong! Some life gain would come in handy with it though. That, or something that produces a lot of tokens to sac to it's ability.

    @Mr Miagi: I originally ran Spine of Ish Sah, and I agree. In most cases it's better because you can target lands. The downside is that it goes back to your hand when you swap it with Welder. Meteor Golem you can keep swapping in and out from the yard.

    Although the deck gold fishes like a champion the only downside is that I feel I need something better than Smuggler's Copter to tutor up with Goblin Engineer for a discard outlet. Rarely, but sometimes cards get stuck in my hand when I actually want them in the yard. Smuggler's Copter has summoning sickness and it would be nice to have a low cc artifact discard outlet I can tutor up with Engineer. I have thought of a few but Smuggler's Copter still seems to be the best.


    Is Anvil of Bogardan better than Copter? If I have a soft lock on opponent's mana it shouldn't matter that I'm helping my opponent dig through his/her deck, however, again like Smuggler's Copter (which has summoning sickness) I have to wait an entire turn before I can discard. At least it doesn't die to being blocked or die to creature removal. Is it better here? I'm starting to think so.

    Trading Post seems not shitty. But it can't be tutored with Engineer due to the 4cc.

    LED is an outlet but it dumps my entire hand, plus there's not much synergy with other cards in the deck outside of draw effects that I can use the mana in response on.

    Bomat Courier? He also dumps my entire hand. And he sucks.

    Is there anything like Ichor Wellspring with a "draw and then discard" ETB ability that can be tutored??

    Gamble was another thought, and of course other "draw then discard" spells such as Cathartic Reunion but they can't be tutored and the deck is already to tight for multiple copies.
    "WaaaauuugghhhaaaauuugghhhaauuugghhhaaauuugghhhW" -Chewbacca

  5. #5
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    Re: Mono Red Welder

    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post
    Hey guys, I've been toying around with a not so new idea but one I haven't seen anybody else try since the printing of Goblin Engineer. Now we can run 8 Welders.
    With the deck so dependent on both Goblins, why there are no Cavern of Souls in the deck?
    ---
    Carpe Diem

  6. #6

    Re: Mono Red Welder

    Quote Originally Posted by Chronatog View Post
    With the deck so dependent on both Goblins, why there are no Cavern of Souls in the deck?
    Good call! That's a no brainer. I hadn't gone that far with the tuning of the deck. Probably axe a couple Mountains and add them. Thanks!
    Last edited by Laser Brains; 12-30-2020 at 01:41 AM.
    "WaaaauuugghhhaaaauuugghhhaauuugghhhaaauuugghhhW" -Chewbacca

  7. #7
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    Re: Mono Red Welder

    Quote Originally Posted by Laser Brains View Post

    Thoughts? What would you do different? Constructive comments only. ;)

    I've been toying with these cards too. I'm using Emry, Lurker of the Loch and Myr Battlesphere. Wurmcoil main would be wise too I think. Welder this guy in and out for a lot of fun

    Good luck brewing!

  8. #8
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    Re: Mono Red Welder

    More copies of Karn should make it easier to support all these singletons with Welder. It also means you don't need as many MD tubbies (uncastable dead draws) because you can find them with Karn. Maybe cut down to just 1x Meteor/Spine, 1x Sundering, 1x Hellkite and the Golems.

    Daretti, Scrap Savant seems very strong here for both looting and Welding. The only downside is too many 4ccs will be hard to support with all the sphere effects.

    Lotus Petal might be better than Bauble just for the acceleration.

    Copter looks bad. You have fewer 1/xs than most Copter decks, and you want to be tapping them to Weld instead. If you want a 2cc artifact that requires tapping a Welder to draw, Ichor outperforms it.

  9. #9

    Re: Mono Red Welder

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    More copies of Karn should make it easier to support all these singletons with Welder. It also means you don't need as many MD tubbies (uncastable dead draws) because you can find them with Karn. Maybe cut down to just 1x Meteor/Spine, 1x Sundering, 1x Hellkite and the Golems.

    Daretti, Scrap Savant seems very strong here for both looting and Welding. The only downside is too many 4ccs will be hard to support with all the sphere effects.

    Lotus Petal might be better than Bauble just for the acceleration.

    Copter looks bad. You have fewer 1/xs than most Copter decks, and you want to be tapping them to Weld instead. If you want a 2cc artifact that requires tapping a Welder to draw, Ichor outperforms it.
    Yes, I actually have a new build of this deck. Copter got the axe. The original main purpose for me including Copter was so that I had a tutorable (with Goblin Engineer) discard outlet. There are two that I have found that are better: Sliversmith and Key to the City. Sliversmith has summoning sickness but he does let me pitch my more expensive artifacts into the yard and then also he nets me a token that I can sac to Welders etc.. Neither are amazing though.

    I do have a new list for this deck, but I'm now actually focusing on another list with more of a Stax Prison theme. Servo Schematic is better than Ichor Wellspring here, especially with Tangle Wire, Smokestack and Sphere of Resistance. It's less dependent on big artifacts that only Goblin Welder can grab.

    It can also activate my Mox Opals turn one allowing me some impressive first turn plays such as: Play Ancient Tomb, tap, cast Servo Schematic, create a Servo token, drop Mox Opal, tap cast Goblin Welder. Next turn Mountain, Faithless Looting or Goblin Engineer to put something juicy like Possessed Portal or Smokestack into the yard. And still have at least 2 to 3 mana available to drop Sphere of Resistance or Tangle Wire all the while cranking out lots of Servo tokens. I dunno, a turn two Possessed Portal or Smokestack with infinite tokens to sac to them is really good.

    I think you might be right about Lotus Petal over Bauble. There are some decent tricks with Welders, Bauble and Servo Schematic though. I even tested Jeweled Amulet in that slot. It surprisingly wasn't awful.

    I never thought of Daretti, Scrap Savant here. Good idea! I'll have to test it out.
    "WaaaauuugghhhaaaauuugghhhaauuugghhhaaauuugghhhW" -Chewbacca

  10. #10

    Re: Mono Red Welder

    Quote Originally Posted by Airwave View Post
    I've been toying with these cards too. I'm using Emry, Lurker of the Loch and Myr Battlesphere. Wurmcoil main would be wise too I think. Welder this guy in and out for a lot of fun

    Good luck brewing!
    Yes Battlesphere and Wurmcoil are awesome with Welder. Think I'm now leaning closer to an all in Stax build though. There's less giant expensive to cast cards such as a Battlesphere and/or Sundering Titan that just sit in your hand if you don't have a discard outlet. Almost everything in the Stax build is less mana intensive and easier to cast. Servo Schematic is just amazing in this brew. Good luck with brewing the Emry build! He's great!
    "WaaaauuugghhhaaaauuugghhhaauuugghhhaaauuugghhhW" -Chewbacca

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