[Deck] Dragon Stompy

[Phantom]

EDIT: Here's a list by Parcher that placed well recently:

4 Ancient Tomb
4 City Of Traitors
10 Snow-Covered Mountain

4 Arc-Slogger
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Simian Spirit Guide
3 Gathan Raiders
3 Sulfur Elemental
2 Rakdos Pit-Dragon

4 Chrome Mox
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Trinisphere
3 Sword of Fire and Ice
2 Umezawa's Jitte

4 Seething Song

2 Demonfire

Sideboard

4 Pyrokenisis
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Blood Moon
2 Icefall
1 Trinisphere
1 Sulfur Elemental
1 Rakdos Pit-Dragon


Well, Tacosnape and I have been working on this deck for a while now. Basically, it's the best Faerie Stompy spin off I've ever seen, and is even better than FS in certain ways. Here goes:

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Dragon Stompy 2.0 created by Tacosnape

//Mana (26)
10 Mountain
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Chrome Mox
4 Seething Song

(Creatures - 18)
2 Squee, Goblin Nabob
4 Bloodrock Cyclops
4 Rakdos Pit Dragon
4 Flametongue Kavu
3 Razormane Masticore
1 Arc-Slogger

(Spells - 16)
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Rolling Earthquake
4 Pyrostatic Pillar

SB:
3 Smash
4 Boil
4 Tormod's Crypt
4 Blood Moon

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Card Choices

Mana - This is all pretty standard stuff for stompy decks now except for Seething Song, which allows us to go even more broken early.

Rakdos Pit Dragon - Talk about broken. This thing allows us to pull off the elusive turn 2 kill on occasion.

Razormane Masticore - Wow. My favorite creature here. Just WRECKS aggro decks, most notably Goblins. He's either a toss a card, kill two of their creatures or a toss a card, deal five damage. Either way, a bargain. Oh, and a Squee in hand makes him all the better.

Flametongue Kavu - Could be a 4 of, but I cut back to three since they occasionally suck and I wouldn't want 2 then. Against aggro, he's an insane 2-for-1 and is a nice beater against everything else. Feel free to hit a Jitte pumped Cyclops, a Razormane Masticore, or a Squee with him if you need to get him into play.

Bloodrock Cyclops - Far and away the most contested creature in the deck, and with good reason. He's a 3/3 for 3 (already crap) and he has a drawback, but we need a 3 drop, and we need it to be red. The only other options as I see it are Dwarven Patrol, Viashano Heretic, Arc Mage, and Thoughtbound Primoc. None of them seems downright stellar, and Cyclops has been ok.

Squee, Goblin Nabob - A Jack of all trades for us, Squee can be Moxen imprint, Masticore pitch, Jitte carrier, or simply chump blocker extraordinaire.

Chalice of the Void - Like FS, we can lay it at one or two and there are not many decks in the meta that aren't crippled by it. Unlike FS, we can lay Chalice @ 3 against decks thbose decks that are hit hard by it like the Rock.

Umezawa's Jitte - You might have heard of it. I'm thinking about going 3/2 with Jitte and Sword, but I haven't tested that yet, so I'll leave it be for now.

Rolling Earthquake - Used to be Pyroclasm. RE may seem a bit slower, but we actually hit 2R about the same time we hit 1R. This way the slot isn't dead vs. Thresh and combo and can be a great Mogoose killer. There is still some speculation that Clasm might be better, but with combo on the rise, I think I'd take Earthquake to an open met tourney. That is if I could afford it.

Pyrostatic Pillar - We decided on Pillar since the deck just plows through aggro. Pillar gives us 8 dedicated anti combo slots mainboard and works well with our quick clock, high mana curve, and life gain (Jitte). Also has been nice vs. Thresh in testing.

Sideboard - Seems pretty clear. 4 slots each against the top 2 combo decks with the Crypts pulling multi duty. Smash is nice anti artifact card advantage and Blood Moon is for control.

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Matchups

Goblins: Extremely Favorable
Everything in the deck except Pillar is a problem for them.

Thresh: Favorable
Tough matchup, but I've found it to be in our favor and I think Tacosnape can back me up. A ton of cards in our deck are problematic for them and even more after boarding. They can however keep us off our threats and pull out a win.

Solidarity: Slightly favorable (Possibly even against a real master)
Chalice OR Pyrostatic is a huge slowdown for them, and on occasion you can flat out outrace them with really fast Pit-Dragon shit. Post board, Boil helps more than you think. It ups your density of massively game-swinging cards from 8 to 12, and there's a good chance that resolving only one with a decent aggro draw will be enough to save it for you. If Solidarity's a real problem, sneak a couple of Scalds in sideboard.

GK Salvagers: Incredibly Favorable.
Resist the urge to Chalice for 1. Do it for 0. Chalice for 1 doesn't even slow this deck down. They'll go Salvagers, Living Wish, LED, Orzhov Guildmage, play the Orzhov, go Infinite, and kill you. Chalice for 0 should be close to game. If not, Pyrostatic Pillar is.

Iggy Pop: Tricky, but slightly favorable.
Chalice for 0 if you're going first. Drop Pillar if you can, but don't rely on it. Crypt from the board helps a lot. Sometimes you'll just randomly get exploded on and not have a shot to do anything in this match, though.

Madness: Slightly Favorable.
It should be better on paper, but it isn't. You'll lose more than a couple Bloodrock Cyclops that randomly just walk into Wild Mongrel, and Dragon Stompy doesn't have a lot to board in against it. (I've found Blood Moon, Boil, Smash, and Crypt to all be awful here.) You will win this game from Flametongue Kavus on Arrogant Wurm/Aquamoeba, however, and even with their countermagic you've got a fair chance at winning the Jitte war.

Red Death: Even.(?)
On paper I would have said this was a heavily favored match and I'm not convinced it isn't. Chalice for 1 is so golden in this, and nailing a Negator with a Flametongue Kavu is one of the most fun things ever. Yet somehow I can't seem to consistently beat this deck. I often wind up one mana source short of being able to stabilize and turn the tables. Stupid Sinkhole. (More testing to come)

Landstill: Unfavorable.
Concede game one. Board in Blood Moon and Boil. Use Boil to bait counters so you can resolve Blood Moon. Two games in a row. Yeeeah.

Random Aggro: Mostly Incredibly Favorable
The only aggro deck I've ever had any problem with is Angel Stompy (which is clearly unfavorable). Our creature base and equipment both wreck aggro and Rolling earthquake is a gamebreaker.

Random Control: Mostly Unfavorable
Control matches fall under two categories. Either they scoop to Blood Moon or they beat Dragon Stompy. (Though you can also steal random draws with 14-point Rolling Earthquakes, heh). Dragon Stompy in its current form isn't ever going to have a -good- control match (Though it takes down random Rifter decks with Squee+Jitte), as it was designed to slaughter aggro, ag-con, and combo.

Random Combo: Mostly Favorable
We run a quick clock and some solid anti combo cards mainboard.

[Eldariel]

Hee, looks fun! Is Seething Song really all that and then some though? Oh, and how is the casting cost of Rakdos Pit Dragon? Oh, and is there any extra combo hate you'd consider on the SB (say, Trinisphere?)? And what about the FS match-up itself? Are your sweepers too much or do you fold to Sword of Fire and Ice? How's the lack of any library manipulation working out for you; missing Thirst for Knowledge/Fact?

I like the look of the deck though, it gives away the flying for some incredible sweepers (Rolling Earthquake, I really like the card in this deck) and some pretty nutty beaters. Stoneshaker Shaman could be a funny idea as a 3-drop, combo-decks and Threshold are rarely able to tap out before they can go off so they'd be sacrificing a good number of lands. Probably a horrible card, but it looks funny in theory.

[Volt]

Yeah, this looks pretty cool and fun! I may have to put this together and try it out.

This might be a random and stupid suggestion, but how about Stone Rain/Molten Rain/Pillage in the Bloodrock Cyclops slot?

[quicksilver]

This deck looks a lit like ponza. You should do some searches on Ponza to get some ideas since you have the same game plan. For example ponza ran trinisphere which seems farily solid in here, although you don't have the land destruction part they do.

[Tacosnape]

Hee, looks fun! Is Seething Song really all that and then some though?

Yes. Turn 2 Razormane Masticore destroys aggro. And this happens far more often than you might think.

Plus, Seething Song allows for the ever ridiculous turn-2 kill which I've done six times, usually against decks lacking removal or against sellout combo like Iggy Pop. This kill involves the following:

1. Ancient Tomb, Chrome Mox imprinting Random Red Card, Chrome Mox imprinting Random Red Card, Rakdos Pit Dragon.

2. Mountain, Seething Song, Swing with a 10/3 Double Strike Hellbent.

This might be a random and stupid suggestion, but how about Stone Rain/Molten Rain/Pillage in the Bloodrock Cyclops slot?

No, but no suggestion is really all that random/stupid in the new/developmental forum. This deck packs no land disruption at all, and land destruction cards don't help. The only noncreature card I would consider sneaking in this deck is Control of the Court/Goblin Lore, as they're fantastic with Squee.

This slot, however, should be Bloodrock Cyclops and nothing else. He's a 3/3 that's dropped on turn 1-2 almost constantly. If a better creature with the exact cost of 2R existed, Cyclops would get replaced. But as of right now, said creature doesn't exist. The deck needs a 3-drop creature. Anything 1RR is out due to the incompatibility with Tomb/City, and Phyrexian War Beast doesn't make the cut, either, as he's not imprintable on a Chrome Mox and you can't afford the land loss with this deck ever. This makes Bloodrock Cyclops the top choice, narrowly over Shinka Gatekeeper and the 4 billion guys who aren't any bigger and can't block.

[Phantom]

Hee, looks fun! Is Seething Song really all that and then some though?

It really is. I would go so far as to say SS is to DS as Dark Ritual is to Red Death/Deadguy. First turn Razormane's are amazing, but there are so many other uses.

Oh, and how is the casting cost of Rakdos Pit Dragon?

I was a little worried at first, but we either need to draw 2 of the 14 red sources or a single Song. Frankly, he's just too good to cut.

Oh, and is there any extra combo hate you'd consider on the SB (say, Trinisphere?)?

We had slots for 2 disruption cards and decided on Chalice and Pillar. We considered both Ankh and 3sphere in the Pillar slot, but we thought Pillar did more for us. Trini def deserves some testing, but I'm not sure it fits here.

And what about the FS match-up itself?

Lol. I haven't fully tested it, but I think it's in FS' favor. Dragon stompy does have some bombs here like Razormane, Rolling Earthquake, and the Seething Song fueled Chalice @3, but pro red and FOWs are bad for us. Still, I would guess it almost even preboard, with Binding Grasp being a bomb out of the board.

Stoneshaker Shaman could be a funny idea as a 3-drop, combo-decks and Threshold are rarely able to tap out before they can go off so they'd be sacrificing a good number of lands. Probably a horrible card, but it looks funny in theory.

The reason we're having trouble replacing Cyclops is that we need a turn one drop that can carry a Jitte turn 2 and still live (dying does us little good) so the 3 toughness is fairly big since it can swing into Mages and Confidants and Hypys and Piledrives and so on. Also, surviving a Quake for 2 is big.

[Eldariel]

We had slots for 2 disruption cards and decided on Chalice and Pillar. We considered both Ankh and 3sphere in the Pillar slot, but we thought Pillar did more for us. Trini def deserves some testing, but I'm not sure it fits here.

I was thinking more along the lines of sideboarding additional disruption-card in Trinisphere and bringing it in for something like Squee, Earthquake or such that's decidedly mediocre in the combo MU. I definately don't suggest MDing it over either since both, Chalice and Pillar are far stronger in both, combo- and non-combo MUs, but bringing additional 3-4 hate-cards seems like it would give you a bit more solid post-board game especially since you generally want more than one resolved piece of hate since they tend to bring a variety of bounce-spells in, so you'll want to draw at least 2 different pieces generally.

[Phantom]

I was thinking more along the lines of sideboarding additional disruption-card in Trinisphere and bringing it in for something like Squee, Earthquake or such that's decidedly mediocre in the combo MU. I definately don't suggest MDing it over either since both, Chalice and Pillar are far stronger in both, combo- and non-combo MUs, but bringing additional 3-4 hate-cards seems like it would give you a bit more solid post-board game especially since you generally want more than one resolved piece of hate since they tend to bring a variety of bounce-spells in, so you'll want to draw at least 2 different pieces generally.

Sorry, others were suggesting it mainboard and I responded to all. I would love to have some in the board that we could bring in vs Combo and possibly Thresh, but I haven't done enough board testing to say what we could cut.

As for the hand manipulation issue, it's always an issue when a deck has no real draw engine, but it hasn't killed us so far. I think we get past it by running card advantage bombs like Rolling Earthquake, FtK, Chalice, Squee (which is kind of our Trinket Mage), and even Razormane Masticore (which allows us to trade crappy hand cards for creature kill).

[skirge5]

Since the cyclops isn't as good as it could be, couldn't you just run Phyrexian War Beast in that slot, giving you an even larger backside while not losing the 3 power?

[mikekelley]

When I was testing this, I ran 4 char in place of the rolling earthquake with some decent success. Targeted removal is something missing in this deck i think (sans razormane) and I believe it helped in a lot of situations.

[Elf_Ascetic]

I don't think Avatar of Discord is a good option. It's triple red, and with the current manabase (4 Tombs, 4 City's), that's rather meh..

I seriously think more direct damage / spot removal is the answer here. Kill of the Goblins, Mage's and treshed Bears! Or just finish your opponent off.

[Cavius The Great]

Have you guys considered Brimstone Dragon or are you guys looking for something cheap?

[Elfrago]

Cathodion FTW

[Eldariel]

Mmm, I was playing against Smart Goblins with very disappointing results. StP is huge (no, I didn't manage a Chalice) as the deck usually only gets a fatto or two. I got 2-0d in short order, first game by losing my turn 2 Arc-Slogger to StP and drawing no creatures other than Squee (no Jitte), Rolling Earthquake his double Warchief to prevent them from doing me in only to get only to get overrun by a Matron into Ringleader into SGC-sequence. Game 2 I drop a turn 1 Chalice, but he Wastelands and I can't drop my Razormane before off 2 Tombs and he alphas me by Matron-Piledriver-Piledriver with Chief in play. Now, this seems really annoying to me, the expensive creatures are really tough to cast without Songs and the Tomb-damage adds up. Also, Pillar is frustrating. I'll of course play more games, but that was pretty disheartening.

Another game, against BGW Control of some sort, I got destroyed. Duresses kept me off explosive early plays and then Sinkholes, Vindicates and Hymns kept me off any plays at all with my Rakdos Pit Dragon eating Swords (Flametongue Kavu was mocking me in my hand all game, but the time he started casting Witnesses and Confidants, I was handless and my only permanent was a Jitte that I had managed to cast). Game 2 was going well until my board got Deeded (3-drop, Jitte, Mox, Chalice and Tomb). I really think the deck needs more creatures at the 3-mana slot and the SB definately wants Needle or something to handle Deeds (I really miss FoWs and Needles of FS when playing this) and something like Dodecapod to not get annihilated by discard. I'd really want some more 3-drops with actual butt in the MD too, the 5-drop count is insanely high and they're just as hard to cast as Meloku used to be in FS (hence why it got dropped even though it's completely and utterly nuts). Also, the 4-drops seem to be a bit hard to cast as multiple Tombs and Cities don't contribute, and they pretty much force me to hold my Cities back until I can drop 2 Mountains. The list I was testing was the one on the first page although I used Chimeric Idol in the Bloodrock Cyclops spot, but that should hardly be relevant to the results as the Idol got killed by StPs and Deeds when I got 'em off.

Oh, I did beat manascrewed Counterslivers. I will admit small sample size though, so perhaps I've just gotten unlucky. Still, I think the curve is pretty off :/


EDIT: Would either of you care to run some testing with me on Goblins? I don't know how, but maybe I'm piloting the deck wrong or something, I'd want to see how you play it.

[Phantom]

Mmm, I was playing against Smart Goblins with very disappointing results. StP is huge (no, I didn't manage a Chalice) as the deck usually only gets a fatto or two. I got 2-0d in short order, first game by losing my turn 2 Arc-Slogger to StP and drawing no creatures other than Squee (no Jitte), Rolling Earthquake his double Warchief to prevent them from doing me in only to get only to get overrun by a Matron into Ringleader into SGC-sequence. Game 2 I drop a turn 1 Chalice, but he Wastelands and I can't drop my Razormane before off 2 Tombs and he alphas me by Matron-Piledriver-Piledriver with Chief in play. Now, this seems really annoying to me, the expensive creatures are really tough to cast without Songs and the Tomb-damage adds up. Also, Pillar is frustrating. I'll of course play more games, but that was pretty disheartening.

Yeah, that is strange. I actually haven't tested vs the White splash as much. I tested vs. mono red because that was the most popular at the time, and vs. the green splash because I thought that would be our worst matchup (tutorable Disenchants > Disenchants). I had great results against the green splash boarding in Blood Moon as well as Smash. I assume it will work great vs. the White Splash as well seeing as it completely cuts the off from Disenchant and StP.

I will try to do some more testing vs. the white splash as it seems to be the most popular build these days.

As for the control matchup, it's not suprising at all. You pretty much have to hope that Blood Moon or Chalice destroys their deck. Against GBW, Chalice @ 3 can be killer, but is often tough to get to.

(btw.: has the original Masticore even be considered for the deck?).

My original build ran 4 of both masticores and 4 Squees. It was a little too much and the original Masticores were too mana intensive.

- How necessary are the City of Traitors? I know, a 2 mana land is huge for explosive starts, but lacking the power of Sea Drake, that had nice synergy with the City, makes me wonder if there aren't better options (maybe these are the Slots to be turned into Wastelands?).
- Maindeck Pillar? Seems a lot like a win more card to me outside the combo matchup. At least it does very little if you're behind in board position.
- 4 FTK seem a lot, considering they are often dead in your hand (shooting Mongeese is no option... and versus Landstill//Solidarity//other creatureless decks they do absolutely nothing). I know it's hard to cut any of them, but maybe this is the way to go?
- I really liked the idea of combining Squee with Goblin Lore, maybe some Fiery Tempers could be a nice addition (also good synergy with Masticore discard), giving the deck some more reach.

@ City - Very necessary. I usually prefer them to Tombs even though they're often a tad slower (have to lay a mountain first)
@ Maindeck Pillar - It actually started in the board, but made it to the maindeck. It is aminly there for combo, but it does hurt every deck to some degree, and screws over 2/3 of the tier one decks. Basically, it's sort of a "this deck already beats down aggro, let's get some slots that improve other matchups". You find a card that's better in the slot, let us know, but I'm still loving Pillar. Hell, it's even won some goblin games for me when they didn't draw Vial.
@ 4FtK - I was on board with you till I cut down to three. I missed the spot removal and am back up to four. Luckily, it's not completely dead against non combo decks. You can target anything with an active Jitte on it, Razormanes, or lowly Squees.
@ Lore/Temper - I really don't like Fiery Temper (why do I need removal when I have a Razormane out?) but I'll admit it has synergy here. I've never tested Goblin Lore, but I'm not crazy about the randomness or the lack of card advantage (We only run 2 Squee's, and they often get pitched to Mox).


Thanks for all the feedback everyone!

[Bongo]

Sorry for bumping this.

This has been mad fun, props to the creators.

Like Alfred, I have found Arc-Slogger to be better than Razormane.

What's the current list? Any new additions?

[tsabo_tavoc]

Ja, mad fun! This deck beats the best, get beaten by others. It's supper against combos, simply lose to controls and 3stompies(Angel,Faerie,Zilla). More aggressive stompies have more spells @1, just mulled to CotV.
I am playing similar to the original version, besides 4 Onslaught 2/3 birds instead of 4 Cyclops(I just cannot find them in China!), 4 Pyroclasms in place of 4 Earthquakes(Earthquake get countered by Chalice@1, doesn't it?).
The deck is quite manatight and suffers huge lifeloss. Pyrostatic Pillars can only sit on Moxes besides you are facing Thresh, and High Tide. Yeah, it's nearly 40% of your matches, but I am still skeptical about it; 3sphere is good against this two matchups and many others, while being not red .
Also, this deck is interesting : http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...ead.php?t=4744

[Drkdstryer]

Well I've been messing around with this deck and I've found that Blade Sliver is at least as good as the Cyclops - and it gets MUCH better if you draw another. Not only can it hold back to block if need be, there's no real difference between 2 and 3, truly.

- They both die to Bolt
- Both kill off Lackeys and unthreshed Mongeese, and trade with threshed 'Geese
- Sliver gets better in multiples
- Cyclops has a drawback, Sliver doesn't

Playing, the only difference I've seen is that Sliver trades with Bob, Meddling Mage, Goblin Warchief, and the like - and those ALL seem like good trades for you. It's the stacking of the ability that really pushes the Sliver over the Cyclops for me.

[tsabo_tavoc]

/3 allows it to avoid your own quakes/clasms, as creatures are so precious in this deck.

[outsideangel]

I used to run a red fat + disruption deck in Extended, and one card I always loved was Tangle Wire.

Basically, the whole deck is focused on keeping up the tempo. Drop fast beats and keep up the pressure. Tangle Wire is a virtual multi-turn Timewalk, especially with two-mana lands, Chalice, and equipment.

With Arc-Slogger in place of Masticore, Tangle Wire should be tested in the Squee slot, plus maybe one more if room can be found.