I actually don't run GSZ; I find it too narrow (it hits only Argothians and your 1-of Gaddock Teeg postboard). The idea of having "virtual copies" of Argothian is good in principle because it increases redundancy and helps get around counters (i.e., you don't lose the Argothian if GSZ is countered), but I've consistently found that while this works against tempo, it's not as good as just burning the control player dry of counters with other bombs or running discard, Gitaxian Probe, or Abeyance/Chant/Silence (probably Abeyance). Especially since our control matchup is pretty favorable anyway.
I'm currently running something similar to Freggle's list from SCG Orlando, but with 2-3 Enlightened Tutor in the GSZ slots, fewer (2-3) MD Rest in Peace, Sigil over Emrakul, and a small black splash for things like Dread of Night and postboard Leyline of the Void.
This being said, my SCG Columbus was a disaster. I played Miracles round 1 and lost to turn 2 Counterblance/Top which naturally flipped a second Counterbalance to counter my T2 Argothian and locked me out. Game 2 he apparently had a hand of 2 lands, 2 spell pierce, 2 force, and brainstorm, and topdecked a second blue card for the second Force. That was enough to empty my Argothain, Presence, Forest, Savannah, Sprawl, Seal of Cleansing mull to 6; he won by topdecking Top after about 5-6 turns of draw-(land)-go and Entreating for a bunch of Angels the next turn. Sometimes you lose even good matchups. The next four rounds I got paired against Omnitell, High Tide, Reanimator, and Reanimator, taking only the last High Tide and second Reanimator matches. I ended up scooping to the second Reanimator player anyway because I didn't want to continue that dreadful run. I'm not going to try to draw any conclusions from this because I (like everyone, I think) knew that Enchantress has a bad combo matchup already. I am considering going back to a 1-of Humility either main or board with all the Reanimator running around, though.
I posted one a few pages back. Here it is:
Mana Sources/Lands (27)
5 Forest
4 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
2 Savannah
2 Serra's Sanctum
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
4 Utopia Sprawl
4 Wild Growth
Engine(16)
4 Argothian Enchantress
3 Sterling Grove
3 Enchantress's Presence
2 Sylvan Library
2 Enlightened Tutor
2 Replenish
Staying Alive(6)
3 Elephant Grass
1 Sphere of Safety
1 The Abyss
1 Leyline of Sanctity
Answers(8)
3 Duress
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Seal of Cleansing
1 Suppression Field
1 Words of Waste
Win(3)
1 Rest in Peace
1 Sigil of the Empty Throne
1 Helm of Obedience
This isn't the current list (also, the sideboard is in another post), and is also an artifact of playing in a meta with mostly slow decks (Stoneblade, Miracles, Jund) where Confinement didn't help much. My current build is on the Confinement/Guile plan.
@Dihensoeur: I've advocated (and used) Abeyance/Chant in the past, and it might be worth it in the current meta. With TNN around (and the changes it's brought), it's probably a better plan to run Abeyance because it doesn't matter if it gets Misdirected/Diverted. It's worse against A+B combo (Show and Tell, Reanimator) than it is against Storm, but since A+B combo is currently better and more common than Storm, it's also going to be worth testing things like Thoughtsieze or Duress. As for the rest of your list, I feel like you're better off with the Hero of Iroas-focused decks being discussed elsewhere if you want to run the straight aggro plan, because your creature base seems strictly worse than theirs and doesn't really give Enchantress anything it didn't have. Delver and TNN aren't the things keeping the deck from Tier 1, combo is.
He guys, yesterday i ran into Emrakul multiple times.....the annihilator part sucks bigtime....
I play RIP/Helm combo so i came up with 'Web of Inertia', i already play a blue splash (Energy Field)
That stops creature from attacking.
Are there anymore cards good against Emrakul besides Karakas???
http://deckbox.org/mtg/Web%20of%20Inertia
True, but your using an ability when exiling him with Parallax Wave
Souprised by the list. Expected to see some cadeverous Bloom and planar void. how did it make it?
I was tinkering with something like this:
4 grass
3 planar void
4 presence
4 growth
4 utopia
4 enchantress
2 cadaverous Bloom
1 seal of doom
1 words of waste
1 o ring
2 helm (Works pretty good with void)
1 emrakul
3 confinement
2 E. tutor
4 grove
2 serra sanctum
1 bayou
1 scrubland
1 Savannah
6 fetch
4 plains
5 forest
Actually i do run GWu enchantress.
Could you share list?
GC
Rough run BTM10. I was hoping you were the 6-3 guy I read about on Salvation.
@Emrakul: Seal of Removal, Oblivion Ring, and Karakas are your best bets. Never tried Parallax Wave but it does seem a little slow / narrow.
It happens Freggle. I talked to several Enchantress players who put up good numbers, including one guy who ran a very traditional (WGr, multiple maindeck Replenish, no Rest in Peace/Helm) deck and went either 5-4 or 6-3. There seems to be a lot of viable design space out there, but the pairings just weren't with me or anyone else (enough) to top 8 in Columbus. Gotta keep working on the deck, though.
Ok thx, it was just a suggestion. It seems so that Enchantress GW can't be competitive now (personal opinion). Discards work well vs combo (at least 6 dicards MD), but how do you include them into GW Enchantress ?@Dihensoeur: I've advocated (and used) Abeyance/Chant in the past, and it might be worth it in the current meta. With TNN around (and the changes it's brought), it's probably a better plan to run Abeyance because it doesn't matter if it gets Misdirected/Diverted. It's worse against A+B combo (Show and Tell, Reanimator) than it is against Storm, but since A+B combo is currently better and more common than Storm, it's also going to be worth testing things like Thoughtsieze or Duress. As for the rest of your list, I feel like you're better off with the Hero of Iroas-focused decks being discussed elsewhere if you want to run the straight aggro plan, because your creature base seems strictly worse than theirs and doesn't really give Enchantress anything it didn't have. Delver and TNN aren't the things keeping the deck from Tier 1, combo is.
Good luk people.
I wanted to share with you my decklist looking foward an open tournament this weekend.
It is a GWu enchantress with great performance up to now.
Here it is:
4 Enchantress's Presence
4 Argothian Enchantress
4 Elephant Grass
4 Utopia Sprawl
3 Wild Growth
3 Mirri's Guile
2 Solitary Confinement
1 Detention Sphere
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Karmic Justice
3 Rest in Peace
2 Helm of Obedience
4 Sterling Grove
2 Enlightened Tutor
1 Sigil of the Empty Throne
2 Serra's Sanctum
3 Windswept Heath
3 Wooded Foothills
1 Karakas
1 Savannah
1 Tropical Island
4 Plains
5 Forest
1 Energy Field
SB: 1 Energy Field
SB: 1 Oblivion Ring
SB: 3 Carpet of Flowers
SB: 4 Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 1 City of Solitude
SB: 1 Sphere of Safety
SB: 1 Moat
SB: 1 Rest in Peace
SB: 1 Mana Maze
SB: 1 Humility
Some comments:
Mirri's guile: when i run GWr enchantress 3 off worked far well. The question that arises is how do you see if i go for 2 off and add a toolbox enchantment let's say moat?
Mana maze: is a fast response to combo if you dont get an opening leyline. Did you test it against elves? It's almost gg!! Would you replace it with in the eye of chaos?
Humility: against elves and S and T fits perfect as well as s. of safety.
Leyline: Do you think that a set is too much? I know that combo is our worst mu but a skilled combo player will go for EtW which is not so dangerous but makes leyline a bit less useful and drawing into much of them is nasty. Any impression?
I still love winning games with helm + rip and locking down with EF + Rip. However i splited 2/1 confinement/ field because when confinement lands shuts down almost any kind of .oponent response, discard mainly.
All in all the main concern i found with the list is filtering into blue. In contrast to GWr when you need just r in all the game, here we do need at least UU or more game two.
Anyway the decks Works almost perfectly to me.
Any comment is apreciated.
GC.
Enchantress seems like it's become a little better situated in the meta lately, at least the versions running the MD RiP, due to the popularity of all these Loam Land decks popping up. Have seen quite a bit more Reanimator and Dredge on mtgo lately as well.
I wonder if a GWr build running Blood Moon maindeck could be possible. Use Words of War as your primary wincon, perhaps cut some number of Serra's Sanctums due to dis-synergy, hell maybe even run 1 or 2 Wild Research (I can dream can't I?) If I went with something like this I'd probably drop the Emrakul, again due to the dis-synergy with Serra's Sanctum and Blood Moon. Then again I guess the Blood Moon could just be sideboard, but there's just so many land-greedy decks out there right now that I feel like attacking lands and graveyards is extremely powerful atm.
Anyway just an observation, maybe I'll brew something up and play around with it a little later. If anyone has any input or has toyed around with any of this feel free to chime in.
I agree attaking lands and GY is a great way to go. I use Back to Basics main deck.
I just wish for a suitable replacement (enchantment) for Argothian....then we can play Humility also main deck!
In my experience blood moon is a good side card. I dont find it useful maindeck as a toolbox enchantment. I mean it is good but probably youcould run a more versatile enchantments instead. However if you feel confortable with it just go for it.
Im not completely convinced if blue splash is better tan red or viceversa. Each other has its strenght and weakness. Nowadays i choose blue because it allow us to drop a very hard lock early (Field + rip) or simply drop field to buy ine or 2 turn and shape the table for confinement or even winning.
GC
I'm pretty sure I agree with you. I've been running the red splash for Words and Blood Moon, but I've run into it being a nonmbo enough times to be annoyed; I want to generate a boatload of mana, but am restricted by Moon on my Sanctums. Sideboard seems fine, since it completely stops some decks, but I am pretty sure I don't want to main it. Also, I assume that moving forward, a lot of decks (BUG comes to mind) will be forced to address cards like Blood Moon from not only fringe decks (like Enchantress or Mono-Red Sneak Attack), but mainstream archetypes (Sneak and Show).
Blue sounds intriguing, though, and I think I'm going to move that direction and use Helm as my kill. Some of you more experienced Solitaire players correct me if I'm wrong, but it feels like this deck wants to address, in order of priority, 1) how to survive, 2) how to completely lock the game down, 3) how to win. It's like a Stasis or Vault/Key lock in that it's the implementation of the lock that's important, with winning being a detail.
I'm totally unimpressed with Energy Field + RiP. It's strictly worse than confinement + enchantress, and field is actually pretty bad on its own. Blue provides a lot of good options, though. I've really liked In the Eye of Chaos, Ancestral Knowledge, Back to Basics and Psychic Surgery.
I've always been happy with Blood Moon in the red splash version, though. If you build your deck to accommodate it, it's very rarely weak, and it's almost always a must-counter.
A simple opinion:
If you want to play Red:
- don't play Words of War because it needs too many manas and enchantments (at least 20manas with 10 enchantments that cost 1) and a big setup (many argothian/presence)
- Obvious play Blood Moon x1 (maybe another in side)
- Play Seal of fire that allow you to manage the board (Clique, Thalia, Deathrite Shaman, Elves, Delver, Canonist, SoL,....... a long list!)
Otherwise:
- don't forget that Energy Field and Solitary Confinement don't work for Deathrite Shaman.
- don't forget that you have no chance vs combo.deck if you don't play at least 6 real hate combo MD (and more in side).
Good luk people
Is there a good reason to not playing suppression field? It's a very good enchantment against death and taxes, elf and decks with many fetch.
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