I don't know which lists you're looking at, but Prison doesn't play Ballista.
Originally Posted by ktkenshinx
Yeah, Ballista is in Steel Stompy and new Cloudpost-Metalworker decks, not Mono-Red Prison.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/c...planeswalkers/
Arena Rector 3W
When it dies, you may exile it, and if you do, search for a PW and put it into play.
1/2
Not the most viable. I do see some cute plays though. Main one Gideon or Elspeth to grab, and free up sideboard for Cataclysm.
Not viable in this deck at all. Certainly viable in Nic Fit.
I would like to splash only to play 1 magus maindeck and another magus in the sideboard.
I was searching for the article on thrabenuniversity about the mana base but the website is down.
How can I maximise the number of basic plains? I'm thinking about cutting caverns.
Something like (i would like to play 23 lands):
4 port
4 wasteland
4 fetch
2 plateau
3 karakas
6 plains
Is it viable? Maybe I need 1 more fetch? Can someone do the math for me?
Site is back up.I would like to splash only to play 1 magus maindeck and another magus in the sideboard.
I was searching for the article on thrabenuniversity about the mana base but the website is down.
How can I maximise the number of basic plains? I'm thinking about cutting caverns.
Something like (i would like to play 23 lands):
4 port
4 wasteland
4 fetch
2 plateau
3 karakas
6 plains
Is it viable? Maybe I need 1 more fetch? Can someone do the math for me?
Concerning the splash manabase, you are mostly balancing the ability to cast your splash spells as reliably as possible and the ability to stabilize your manabase with basics as reliably as possible. This seems to favor a semi-equal split of fetch and basics, as long as you're not running cavern and you're not adjusting for an expected metagame (i.e. either low or high in nonbasic hate, as well as the likelihood of encountering stifle).I would like to splash only to play 1 magus maindeck and another magus in the sideboard.
I was searching for the article on thrabenuniversity about the mana base but the website is down.
How can I maximise the number of basic plains? I'm thinking about cutting caverns.
Something like (i would like to play 23 lands):
4 port
4 wasteland
4 fetch
2 plateau
3 karakas
6 plains
Is it viable? Maybe I need 1 more fetch? Can someone do the math for me?
That said, I think the biggest card to splash red for is Pia and Kiran Nalaar, because it single-handedly warps the control match-ups so much. But because of P&K's double red, you want extra red sources and you also tend to rely significantly on magus to fix your mana. Hence, I think a minor red splash is suboptimal: either you go for all the goodstuff or you don't splash for it.
Hello fellow DnT'ers,
my name is Marian and I'm currently living in the far north of Germany (Flensburg). I have been playing A LOT of Magic "back in the days", but Legacy was never a favorite of mine until I moved to Flensburg and found a realy nice, friendly and open Legacy community with about 15-25 players each FNM and a regular bigger Tournament series (http://www.eternal-clash.com/start/ for those who are interested). We even reached over a 100 players at the Last Eternal Clash.
As a lot of new Legacy players I was overwhelmed by the amount of decks you could play in the format so I started with borrowing some different kind of decks (from Grixis Delver over 4c Loam to even Goblins) from realy nice guys here in the area. As a competitive player I'm always looking at the top decks of the Meta and as soon I played DnT for the first time (even though it isnt T1 at the moment) , I was hooked and until now I never looked back. This was about a year ago and I played the deck quite a lot at some of the MKM Series Tournaments and at local events too.
So last Weekend the MKM Series took place in Hamburg Germany (http://series.magiccardmarket.eu/cov...g-2018-legacy/) and a lot of our community packed their Legacy Decks and where ready to rumble on Sunday in the Mainevent.
I wanted to share my tournament experience with you guys and girls to give more data and information to the DnT community. Im wirting this out of memory without any notes so bare with me if something isnt 100% accurate and feel free to ask questions.
So here we go!
I played a Legacy Trial already on friday which didnt go too well (1:2 drop). I won against Grixis Delver in the first round and lost to 4c Control (with Punishing Fire and Dack Fayden) and Elves (GRRRR...).
The second day of the event must have been one of the worst days of my Magic life with a 0:3 drop in the Modern mainevent, then my waterbottle broke in my bag (luckily no cards where damaged) and in the evening my favorite football club (I won't call it soccer) lost the german cup final...So I wasnt to motivated and was even considering to change my DnT decklist due to the bad results on friday. I talked with some friends and a lot with another fellow DnT player who decided to run a weird list without Mother of Runes and 4 Chalice of the Void sideboard.
I'm a big fan of consistency at bigger events so in the end I stayed on the somewhat "stocklist" of WW DnT. Here is what I was familiar with and ended up registering for the tournament (260 players, so 9 rounds of action):
Maindeck:
1x Cavern of Souls
3x Karakas
4x Rishadan Port
4x Wasteland
11x Plains
4x Mother of Runes
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x Stoneforge Mystic
4x Flickerwisp
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Serra Avenger
2x Recruiter of the Guard
2x Mirran Crusader
1x Sanctum Prelate
1x Shalai, Voice of Plenty
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Batterskull
4x Aether Vial
4x Swords to Plowshares
Sideboard:
1x Containment Priest
1x Leonin Relic-Warder
1x Sword of War and Peace
2x Surgical Extraction
2x Path to Exile
2x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Rest in Peace
2x Council's Judgement
2x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
Round 1: Sneak & Show (2:1)
This is what a lot of us know. Youre driving a couple of hours to a bigger event to play against a player of your community...at least I got to play against those sweet Beta duals ;)
If I remember correctly we played a quite normal G1 where I got to poke him a bit and when he resolved his Show and Tell he could only activate his Griselbrand one time and I had a Karakas already in play. So he drew 7 cards I bounced the
Griselbrand eot and I was a bit lucky he couldnt go off in the one turn he had left before my creatures just poked him to death.
I lost game 2 fast to a turn 2 or 3 Show and Tell.
Game 3 was realy tight. He started with some cantrips while I established my board with SfM (getting SoWaP) some other dudes and even got the time to equip my sword to my Crusader. My first attack was stopped by a Rushing River but I could just use my Vial and SfM to bring in Crusader and Sword again eot. My second attack with Crusader knocked him down to 1 and Stone Rained him twice, because he couldnt use his fetch or tomb any longer.
Even though he had Omniscience in his deck I was lucky he never could cheat it into play.
So off to a good start.
Overall = 1:0
Round 2: Naya Fires (Maverick without Black but more Red) (0:2)
Not much to tell here. He won G1 with the Fire/Grove engine and in G2 I mulled to a good Mana Denial hand with Port/Wasteland/Plains but also the Batterskull in my opener. I drew several Lands in a row and he established his board with a turn 2 Tireless Tracker and turn 3 Knight and just went to Valuetown without me ...
Back to reality.
Overall = 1:1
Round 3: Sneak & Show (2:1)
G1 was close but I had the right tools at the right Time. I poked him in the beginning of the game and when he played his Show and Tell I used my Vial to get a Revoker into play on Griselbrand. He cheated in his Omniscience while I could had a Flickerwisp which could stop him from casting big scary Spaghetti monsters for free. He played a Wish in response on Intuition and got his 15 mana dude, but I had exactly Lethal in the one turn I had left.
G2 was the usual Sneak & Show stuff.
I can't remember much of G3 but iirc he couldnt find a creature and my Thalia did some work taxing his Mana.
Not even a resolved Omniscience could stop me here.
Overall = 2:1
Round 4: Grixis Delver with Stifle (2:0)
In G1 my Opponent kept a hand without any threats but a lot of counters and 2 Stifle. It took him to long to find any answers or a clock for my first 2 resolved creatures.
In G2 he kept a very sketchy hand with 2 Delver one Land but no cantrips. I had the Wasteland and a StP, so his clock was to slow. A Thalia and some turns later reached out for the handshake.
Beat the "Deck to Beat"
Overall = 3:1
Round 5: Steel Stompy (2:1)
A very nice opponent and a super tight game 3! I havent played a lot against this deck, but I see it rising more and more and I guess this match up isnt the best for us.
I start game 1 with Vial, SfM (fetching SoFaI). My opponent had a decent but not overwhelming start with Turn one Thorn and some minor beaters. He took 10 dmg total from his two Tombs and I got one of my Avengers on the Battlefield and equipped it as soon as possible with my SoFaI. I had to chump his Loadstone Golem one or two times and he did the same with his Vault Scourge to my Avenger. He couldnt find a way to handle my flyer and I took the game.
In game 2 I got crushed by two Golems.
As already mentioned game 3 was super close. I remember the last couple of turns. I had 3 active vials but just one land in play. I did some dmg to my opponent with SfM and a Flickerwisp. My opponent had a Spyglass in play shutting down my SfM because I had the Batterskull sitting in my hand. Then he played a Revoker and in response I used one of my Vials to get a Recruiter into play. I grabbed my Leonin Relic-Warder and took out his Spyglass to free my SfM. The next turn I attacked with my whole Team, which was a mistake. He blocked my Relic-Warder with his Revoker, got back his Spyglass and the "As trigger" shut down my Vials before I could response to it. He was able to stabilize at 1 Life because I couldnt find my 2. and 3. land for the Judgement in my hand. Some turns and a Karakas on my site of the battlefield later he played an Etched Champion, while having a Ravager and Overseer already in play. He used his overseer in his turn and attacked me down to 17 only leaving his Etched Champion back. This was a mistake on his site, because he knew about the judgement in my hand (Spyglass). I Topdecked the 3rd land, used the judgement on his Champion and my lonely Recruiter finished the job.
Guess we will be facing this more in the future so be prepared!
Overall: 4:1
Round 6: Sneak & Show (2:1)
This again....3rd time and quite the same type of Games.
Lost game 1 to a turn 2 Show and Tell = Omni = 15/15 Spaghetti.
Game 2 was a lot of cantrips but no rewards on my opponents side.
Game 3 was a lot of cantrips again on his site and some usuals DnT stuff on my side (SfM for SoWaP, Mom and some other Dudes of Vial). Then the important turn were about to happen. At this point I had a Mom, SfM (equipped with SoWaP), Crusader, Revoker (shutting down my opponents Sneak Attack) and Karakas on the field. My opponent on 5 life started his last turn with 5 cards in his hand. He casts a Show & Tell and gets an Omniscience into play, which I cant answer at this point. Griselbrand comes into play but he cant use him to draw cards due to his low lifepoints. Blood Moon wants to enter the Battlefield and in Response I use my useless Karakas to bounce the Griseldaddy just to see him in play one second later again. The Last card in my opponents hand is a Pyroclasm. I protect my Crusader from it and in my turn I equip the SoWaP to my Crusader swing for lethal with protection from black.
3rd resolved Omniscience beaten...
Overall: 5:1
Round 7: Eldrazi Stompy (1:2)
Even though I played 3 Wastelands in Game one my opponent managed to draw 3 Tombs, 2 Cities and a Temple to get his Aliens fast enough onto the Battlefield.
I was under a lot of pressure in the beginning of game 2 but with some help of Judgement, StP and Gideon I manage to take this game home.
Also the 3rd game starts with a lot of pressure on my opponents side. Turn one 2/2 Endless One into turn two Thought-Knot which I can handle with trigger on the stack. The first Smasher hits me together with the Endless one. I flash in my Containment Priest eot to get rid of the Smasher for good with one of my Flickerwisps. My opponent plays Smasher number 2, I trade the Endless one for my wisp and exiled the Smasher with a Judgement in my turn. Im at 5 life at this point trying to stabilize the board with Thalia + Karakas, Revoker on Endbringer which already was in play for my opponent together with the Thought-Knot Seer. I even manage to get my Shali onto the battlefield and was hoping for a piece of removal or equipment. A 3rd Smasher from the top later I reach out for the handshake.
Stupid Trample Aliens...
Overall: 5:2
Round 8: R/G/u Lands (Tolaria West, Academy Ruins + Engineered Explosives) (2:0)
This is one of the "not even close" category. I know my opponent and we play 2 very fast but entertaining (at least for me) games.
I start Game one on the play with a Vial. My opponent plays an EE on one which I can negate with a Revoker on my second turn. A Thalia, Prelate on 2 and one or two Wastelands later my opponent wants to use his sideboard.
Game 2 is onesided again. I can use surgical on his Loam, shut down his Mox Diamond with a Revoker and on top of that I Wasteland him three times. Never had such onesided matches against lands until now.
If you have it all, you just have it all!
Overall: 6:2
Round 9: U/B Deathshadow (2:0)
Interesting Deck. One of my friends lost to BUG Deathshadow in round 8 (Berserk ftw), so I assumed this was his opponent. Game one is as aspected. He takes a lot of damage from his own lands, Street Wraith and Probes kills some of my early creatures but he is not able to handle my Crusader. I was scared to lose to Deathshadow + Berserk out of nowhere but my opponent only fetched for Useas and Watery Grave.
My opponent takes a mulligan and keeps a onelander with Probe, Street Wraith and a Brainstorm. His to cycle cards are not able to find him a second land and the Brainstorm locks him out of the Game.
We talked a bit about his deck afterwards and he was straight UB with no answers to a resolved Crusader in Game 1. One or two tables to the right was the guy with the BUG Deathshadow deck.
Who could have guessed that the last two rounds where the ones most onesided.
Overall: 7:2
I finished the tournament on 13th place which Im super happy with. I managed to dodge Elves which there are a lot of in northern Europe. The Top 8 with 3 Turbo Depths, 2 Red Prison and Belcher was quite strange but I guess this is what a lot players are recognizing these days. More Land dependent combo decks and the prison deck which tries to punish greedy manabases and 20/20 tokens.
Im glad that I played the stock DnT list in the end. Even though I didnt play against one control deck (4C Control, Miracles or even Grixis Control) I feel like the Shalai is good enough for the Deck. I would gladly play 2 of them but I just don't know how to fit it into the Deck without cutting important pieces.
I was able to use all my sideboard cards and wouldnt change anything for a tournament of this size. SoWaP was the Sideboard MVP against all the Sneak & Show players. Avenger did a lot of work which im super happy to see, because I was close to cutting them out of the maindeck.
I hope this is not too much or too boring/hard to read and understand because Im not used to write too much in english.
Feel free to leave some feedback or questions!
Have a nice day wherever you are and may your Vials always be cast on turn one!
Hi Tyres!
I was also at MKM Hamburg, I was looking the area for other DnT players, but haven't seen you.. I ended up going 5-4 with same list except the SB I got +2 cataclysm instead of 1 Leonin-relic warder and 1 Gideon!
I lost twice against Chech Pile in extra rounds in game 3. This matchup feels so hard after SB. They got so much removal, I feel like you have to be a bit lucky to win SB games....
I like the Shalai also very much. If you have a Karakas and vial on 4, its nearly unbeatable.
This is definitely not viable in D&T, but it might see play in Nic Fit. I can imagine fetching up Vraska or Garruk Apex Predator is pretty dope, or other dumb stuff like Karn, Ugin or NicoB.
Team SPOD
<Der_imaginäre_Freund> props:
Adan for being the NQG God (drawer)
You mean the exact ones they've been talking about already on the nic fit thread?
So just to throw it out here, what do you guys think of the following D&T list?
I've been running a colorless splash (seems the right word for it) for a while now, mixed up with some green before for Teeg main and Choke side, but with the introduction of Daredevil I swapped to red, witch made my mana more smooth at the same time since I could add more Caverns to drop on Human.
Mana (23):
6 Plains
2 Karakas
3 Cavern of Souls
4 Battlefield Forge
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Wasteland
Spells (11):
4 AEther Vial
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
Creatures (26):
4 Mother of runes
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Dire Fleet Daredevil
1 Mangara of Corondor
Sideboard (15):
3 Lotus Petal
2 Rest in Peace
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Declaration in Stone
1 Warping Wail
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Disenchant
1 Wear / Tear
Few quick notes:
I'm not sure about the Revokers and Mangara main, never been much of a fan of main-deck Revokers becouse they always feel a bit awkward to play and are terrible attackers unless you play vs storm.
2 Canonist in SB might be a bit much but I came from 4 Talia + 2 Teeg main to this, so 6 hatebears seems ok.
Love the Lotus Petals side. Ramping out turn 1 Talia is just great is some match-ups. Same for higher chance of turn 2 Tought-Knot.
Displacer is really strong for offense, defense and utility.
@Draggo
My question to you would be why is that deck going to be better than a white eldrazi deck? Here's something that I cooked up that I'll try out at some point this weekend.
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4 Vryn Wingmare
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Reality Smasher
2 Palace Jailer
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Umezawa’s Jitte
4 Lotus Petal
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Battlefield Forge
2 Plains
2 Snow-Covered Plains
4 Wasteland
1 Karakas
3 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Holy Light
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Rest in Peace
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Armageddon
So they just revealed this:
Fumble
1U
Instant
Return target creature to its owners hand. Gain control of all Auras and Equipment that were attached to it, then attach them to another creature.
Apart from being absolutely and absurdly undercosted (Unsummon plus a discounted Copy Artifact plus an equip total up closer to 3UUU), this is likely to be a problem going forward. The card answers several problems that Delver, Pile, Miracles, and other Blue decks want answers to: Marit Lage tokens, reanimated creatures, and equipped creatures. It will be adopted, make no mistake.
The stock of all equipment other than Sword of Fire and Ice just went down significantly against all Blue decks. It is not safe to bring in Batterskull or equip Jitte without backup anymore. The same is true for creatures intended to abuse that equipment.
Countermeasures are largely limited to:
1. Equipping the creature with Sword of Fire and Ice.
2. Having an active Mother of Runes (or Shalai, if you equipped any other creature).
3. Countering the spell by making it miss, either by Vialing in Flickerwisp, using Karakas on a legendary creature, or by hitting your own creature with Swords to Plowshares.
4. Using Flickerwisp to blink your equipment after the fact.
However hard we already had it with equipment right now, it's about to get a lot harder.
I don't know if I'm as doom and gloom as all that. Bounce spells are rare already, and the ones that see common play are far more versatile a la Dead//Gone (Which can be a Shock) or Echoing Truth (which can hit all nonland permanents and hit multiples besides).
1. There are only a few hundred other blue instants that bounce a creature and do some shit. Exactly 0 of which see legacy play. Edict, Dead / Gone, and Plow will continue as the Marit Lage killers.
2. DnT is already not great. The only other equipment deck even fringe viable is 4c Deathblade. No one is boarding a card to hate specifically equipment.
3. WotC has handed this deck so many tools over the last 3 years, while reprinting every bit of it as well.
4. This is legacy. For any given deck, there are likely hundreds of absurd sideboard cards that absolutely crush you, but no one plays. If I wanted to screw with DnT with narrow cards, Dread of Night, Teferi's Response, and Grip of Phyresis already exist.
5. It is wholly unreasonable to be salty about this card existing. If you ever lose to it, you have the right to be salty about losing to unplayable garbage.
Hello Guys,
I whould like some input on my last flex spot.
Im looking at Vryn Wingmare, Thalia 2.0, spirit of the labirinth, or Shalai
My preference is going to Vryn Wingmare for maximal taxing and the fact that it has flying.
Thalia 2.0 is great for aditional taxing, miracles , eldrazi and is a decent body
Spirit of the labirinth i great vs combo but i dont like it with that many young pyromancers.
Salai i havent tested at all, but 4 mana seems to much in D&T
Current build i will run is:
2 Cavern of Souls
1 Horizon Canopy
3 Karakas
9 Plains
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
4 Mother of Runes
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
2 Serra Avenger
2 Recruiter of the Guard
2 Mirran Crusader
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Sanctum Prelate
1 --------------
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Aether Vial
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Rest in Peace
2 surgcal extraction
1 Containment priest
2 Council's Judgment
1 Path to exile
1 Blessed alliance
2 cataclysm
1 pithing needle
1 Leonin Relic-Warder
I will play 3 revoker
I never liked Vryn, weak for 3cmc.
Thalia 2.0 and Shalai are not that bad and I like Spirit but I still prefer the third revoker (we often loose from one single card).
BlueStew.dec would also very much prefer to spend one mana on spot removal, and considering this is twice as much with no versatility, there's much better cards they can have. Bolt/Push responding to the equip is much more effective, and annoying.
It's mana-intensive and lacks evasion, but with protection (either from Swords or Mom), it might be an interesting card for racing:
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