Okay, here are my latest thoughts on deck configuration and exploration.
Since in the last part of your article you mention the possibility of playing additional one drops to smooth out the deck, that is becoming a bit clunky due to many 3 drops, i wonder if the new dwarf from kaladesh (Toolcraft Exemplar) could be played with ancient den in the manabase. The artifacts requirements would be satisfied (4 ancient den, 4 vial, 2/3 revoker, jitte) and it could be a good way to put pressure acting as a tempo deck.
I'm not saying it is good, but since you mention playing things like judge's familiar, weathered wayfarer, land tax and so on, i think also the dwarf could be worth exploring.
Originally Posted by LeoCop 90
How about Vault Skirge as the additional 1 drop? Flying, Lifelink, gets past chalice, holds equipment nicely.
On another note I've been having a really hard time fighting eldrazi, so much so that I've added a moat as a tutor target in my sideboard. Inevitably though they still seem to run me over more often than not. How do you all fight eldrazi?? I've considered Serene Master but it's a huge downside that it's hit by Warping Wail
Anyway here is my deck - I'm on the 2/2/2 Prelate/THC/Recruiter. I'm thinking about dropping THC all together since it's been pretty meh for me, but on paper it seems like it'd be so good against eldrazi. Maybe Elbrus, the Binding Blade would be some spicy tech.... The singleton COP:Red in my sideboard has turned my abysmal burn matchup to an as-of-yet undefeated matchup, and I know there must be a similar silver bullet for the eldrazi menace.
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
3 Karakas
3 Cavern of Souls
9 Plains
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Aether Vial
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
4 Mother of Runes
2 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Recruiter of the Guard
3 Flickerwisp
2 Sanctum Prelate
2 Serra Avenger
1 Banisher Priest
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Sideboard
1 Leonin Relic-Warder
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Council's Judgment
1 Circle of Protection: Red
2 Enlightened Tutor
2 Rest in Peace
1 Mirran Crusader
1 Sword of War and Peace
2 Path to Exile
1 Moat
I did a podcast with Zachary Koch of MtG Training Grounds on Aether Vial. There's a ton of good D&T information sprinkled throughout, though the episode isn't specifically about D&T. You can find both the versions with and without video here.
Interesting DnT list in the t8 of Euro Eternal Weekend. Double Magus in the board, none main.
5th place : Alexandre Dudziak - Death and Taxes
4 Wasteland
2 Karakas
3 Rishadan Port
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Plateau
8 Plains
4 Mother of Runes
3 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Flickerwisp
3 Recruiter of the Guard
1 Banisher Priest
2 Serra Avenger
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Mirran Crusader
2 Sanctum Prelate
3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Aether Vial
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
1 Aven Mindcensor
Sideboard
1 Sword of War and Peace
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
2 Council's Judgment
2 Path to Exile
1 Containment Priest
2 Rest in Peace
2 Magus of the Moon
1 Leonin Relic-Warden
1 Pithing Needle
2 Ethersworn Canonist
I don't think I'm a fan
Plateaus in the main to randomly support 2 magus in the side?
Cutting SoFaI?
Cutting a port and a land in general? Yet plays a ton of 3 drops...
Mindcensor? It was always an okay card; but another "meh" 3 drop is what we probalby need to avoid...
I'm being overly critical of course; solid result. And I can't argue with the core 70 or so cards... 3/2 split of recruiters/prelates continues to put up results.
Hi, I'm Arnaud Aubert. I finished 3rd at Bom Paris and went to the Eternal Week-end yesterday.
24th with the following decklist :
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
3 Karakas
1 cavern of Souls
1 Mishra's factory
10 Plains
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Aether Vial
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
3 Mother of Runes
3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Recruiter of the Guard
3 Flickerwisp
2 Sanctum Prelate
2 Serra Avenger
1 Banisher Priest
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Sideboard
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Pithing Needle
2 Council's judgment
2 surgical extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
1 Sword of War and Peace
2 Path to Exile
1 Containment Priest
Round 1 - Omnishow (1-2)
0-1
On G3, lost to a resolved Emrakul with Show and Tell. No Karakas, I scooped.
Round 2 - Eldrazy black (1-2)
0-2
Never played Eldrazi before. On G3, lost to All is Dust as I was going lethal next turn.
Round 3 - Omnishow (2-1)
1-2
Round 4 - Eldrazi black (2-0)
2-2
Round 5 - Deathblade (2-0)
3-2
Round 6 - Infect (2-1)
4-2
Round 7 - Infect (2-1)
5-2
Round 8 - Infect (2-0)
6-2
Round 9 - Shardless Bug (2-0)
7-2
3 recruiters / 2 prelates seem to be the right numbers. Thc was really a blast to play and I never missed the 4th flickerwisp.
Also played that list on last Friday's trial, went 4-2 beating Merfolk, Painter, GrixisDelver, Ant and losing to Nic fit and Shardless Bug.
Never thought to switch to another decklist or deck, as all my losses were pretty close or I played against some decks for the 1st time : Nic fit, Eldrazi.
@Misterjuzam
Congrats on your finish.
I got 3rd/4th at an IQ yesterday running the same 75 I ran at EE. Deck feels great. I'm very happy with the Avengers back in the main, and I don't really miss THC.
https://www.twitch.tv/bazaar_of_moxen/v/96437952
Coverage randomly at ~728 and ~828 that ive seen so far
edit: top 8 match at 1023 <--all this is ends up being is all-in reanimator hitting turn 1 chancelor, turn 2 elesh norn
Alexandre's Win-and-In match against Miracles was fun to watch. The commentators did not really ever realize why he was withholding his resources. Just a couple of threats at a time. No rush. The opponent was able to deal with some of the threats, including that big sweep with Engineered Explosives. But you will notice that Miracles was never able to clean him out because (a) he did not over-extend and (b) he kept Miracles from getting piles of mana. To an opponent facing this tactic it just looks like you can't seem to get your deck going. You can not just expect the deck to do its thing and the wins come rolling in. Alexandre was consciously exerting control over the environment with the decisions he made, and that is what allows your overt disruption to matter. That is, without that larger strategy stuff like Thalia, Prelate, Revoker, etc. often don't have enough impact. Anyone who does not feel confident facing Miracles with this deck, just have a look at the sublime performance Alexandre puts on here.
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."
"Politicians are like diapers. They should be changed often and for the same reason."
"Governing is too important to be left to people as silly as politicians."
"Politicians were mostly people who'd had too little morals and ethics to stay lawyers."
Actually he was trying to use the correct line but I don't think it was sublime at all. His opponent was mana screwed and yet he was playing around terminus with no need (specially the turns he played mother of runes). Could respond the snapcaster's trigger with thalia and many other technical mistakes. ONE thalia is not 'a couple of threaths at a time', btw haha.
I think his performance was worse than what Finn is suggesting, but Kasumi Fox, I feel as though you are being overly critical. It was his win and in, and playing perfect magic round after round becomes all but impossible. I think he did a good job. Not perfect, but he had a game plan and he stuck with it.
Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
If there is anything that miracles does well; it finds answers. Playing around terminus is 100% correct. It is those moments when you don't play around it and get punished that
Yes, beating Miracles is the best feeling ever. However, I'd be cautious before pinning that match as some sort of guide on how to beat Miracles for the DnT player. Alexandre played well, and there are some non-obvious lessons to be learned from watching the replay (Jitte should probably be left in against mentor Miracles unless you are playing SoWaP in the side, and tapping fetchlands instead of basics/duals in the early turns might be worth it when you're not scared of any big plays).
However, the Miracles player made a few obvious mistakes, like forgetting about Mindcensor, and letting himself get wastelanded out of blue mana by fetching plains -> mountain when low on lands, etc. In g2 especially, those poor choices combined with a dangerously land light, topless hand, and a nearly perfect Vial + Port + Thalia + Karakas start on the DnT side to turn the game into a swift battering. But that's the equivalent of your opponent coming in slightly overweight, then slipping on the canvas and tumbling face-first into your fist in a boxing match. If you count on that happening every time, you're in for a rough awakening...
There are plenty of better replays out there that show DnT thoroughly embarrassing premium Miracle players, and most of those who've been playing this deck with dedication for a while will probably have their own stories to share.
Only yesterday I 2-0'ed an opponent on Cockatrice after a g2 in which he got to play 6 plows, 3 Terminus, 2 Council's Judgement, 1 Wear/Tear, 2 Jaces, 1 Entreat the Angels, 3 Mentors and 4 Snapcaster Mages (due to Terminus shuffling his own creatures back in the deck), a Vendillion Clique, and, finally, an Izzet Staticaster. There were probably another Terminus and another Wear/Tear left in his deck when I won, but apart from those, he literally threw everything his 75 had to offer at me, and still lost. As you can imagine, a blow-by-blow description of that match is out of the question, but the most memorable moment was probably countering his huge, blowout Entreat during my attack phase with Warping Wail, killing his Jace with a Recruiter of the Guard in the process. I don't think I had ever seen anyone go that quickly from absolute confidence to unmitigated disaster before in a game of Magic. Honorable mention to THC slowing his Izzet Staticaster just enough to allow Mother of Runes to push lethal through an army of monk tokens.
And yet, on Sunday I got destroyed by a very similar list, after my opponent chained turn 3 Terminus (saw it coming, and didn't lose anything of value) into turn 4 Plow ("I can do this all day") into turn 5 Entreat during my attack step ("ouch, but I've got the tools to deal with it"), into turn 6 Mentor (crap, just used my plow on an Angel token, but hey, this Prelate I recruited earlier set on 1 will mostly neutralize it, and if he wants to Terminus his board away away I'm more than happy), into turn 7 Jace -> bounce your Prelate, chain double top for the win ("fuck this"). In g2, I (maybe mistakenly) kept a somewhat slow hand with only two lands and lots of 3 drops (no vial), and got punished by turn 3 Staticaster into Turn 4 Jace. Sure, my opponent drew the absolute nuts in game 1, but that is more common than you'd think in a deck playing so much manipulation.
There's a reason why Miracles is by far and away the best deck in legacy, and that is because even its "bad" matchups (and, at this point, we probably fit the description) aren't really that bad.
In our case, their most problematic aspect is the speed with which they can switch roles from a purely reactive, "draw-go" control deck into a proactive "kill you in 2-3 turns" one. Running them out of removal by administering our resources and forcing awkward or less-than ideal plows and termini is all fine and dandy and will probably win the long game, but only as long as they don't find their early Entreat. Or Jace. Or Mentor + FoW. Then you'll look silly with your grip full of creatures that you won't be able to deploy in time to prevent his advantage from snowballing into a victory. In these games, it doesn't matter if their Terminus isn't a 3-for-1, or if their Plow is actually card disadvantage because you're just bouncing your equipped Thalia back to your hand. They only need them to buy enough time to set up their big, proactive play.
The ideal scenario for us is that in which we can both make their removal ineffective AND, as you put it, "prevent them from getting piles of mana". But that is usually only possible with the Vial, Thalia, Karakas, Port, Prelate draws, as in the Alexandre game. But you can't expect to have that every time, or even most of the times (especially considering they have plenty of ways to deal with Vial post-board). Most of the times, you will have to take a risk. Either pace yourself, and risk them pulling ahead on board in a way that is difficult for you to come back from, or turn up the pressure and expose yourself to Terminus. I am starting to think that the second option might be the correct one more often than a lot of people think...
Oh boy. Are you really parsing my words like that? How about this: "He had one creature at times, two at others, and three on one occasion." Will that do? Was it really necessary for me to clarify that?
Yes he could have responded to the Snapcaster's trigger. He let the Mother of Runes die, apparently knowing he had another in hand. When the opponent's lands were tapped and no land was played for the turn he was able to safely deploy the much more important Thalia again and then untap Karakas. Conservative actions, yes, and perhaps unintuitive. But it was the right play because the game was his to lose, and he was taking no chances. That's how you make top 8 at a large event.
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."
"Politicians are like diapers. They should be changed often and for the same reason."
"Governing is too important to be left to people as silly as politicians."
"Politicians were mostly people who'd had too little morals and ethics to stay lawyers."
The more clear-cut mistake was tapping his Karakas to Port when he had an untapped Plains and Thalia on board. That seemed like just a mental lapse, unless he had another Thalia in hand and was baiting.
Oh yes. That is definitely true.
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."
"Politicians are like diapers. They should be changed often and for the same reason."
"Governing is too important to be left to people as silly as politicians."
"Politicians were mostly people who'd had too little morals and ethics to stay lawyers."
I wasn't misreading your post. I was saying it was not like you said. It's different.
While your opponent is mana screwed you should never try to end the game with JUST 2 damage a turn (and 6 cards in hand). My opinion is that either he should deploy another 2 drop or even put the vial on 3 to set a 3-turn clock.
You said that he was brilliant. I say that he was scared and this fear could lead his opponent out of that mana screw situation. That game was only Alexander's because the miracles guy fetch'd a useless mountain and never hit the 4th land drop (also had counterspells that are pretty useless as well). A 10-turn clock with only 1 port is never gonna be the right play.
I got to play 3 rounds of legacy last night, no top 8, just a little practice to help strengthen legacy in our area.
I played against shardless, burn, and colorless eldrazi, and afterwards I played against an infect list. I 2-0'ed the burn player and 2-1'ed everything else.
I love my deck!
Can you share your list please?
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