[Deck] Fetchland Tendrils

[Jaiminho]

Hell, Doomsday with a crappy stack like 4 Stomping Slab also wins, so it's usually protecting and resolving Doomsday that signals the win. I think this deck is capable of pulling it off, although it involves more work on refining and tuning it to include Doomsday.

Actually, Stomping Slab deals 0 or 7 damage. It doesn't say "for each card", but "if a card".

[emidln]

I think IGG should be 2nd/3rd from the stack depending on your hand for consistency. You don't usually have the mana to draw 3 and Doomsday together (6cc). Streetwraith/Brainstorm helps and IGG allows for more consistent wins. I agree that Doomsday is a huge win in the deck, but it involves making the deck more resilient to hate i.e. running more Duress/Chant to protect it.

Why would you turn a stack that costs 2BBBBU into a stack that costs 3BBBBBU? My pile is elegant and rather efficient at doing what it needs to do. That you can use any of your 12 rituals to accel into it is pretty solid which likely brings the cost down to around 2BBU or less (assuming just a single Dark Rit).

Playing Doomsday and drawing a card costs as little as BBB and at most BBBU. To draw four cards, as in some of my examples, you also need BBB to cast a draw4. Presumably, you would be intelligent enough to know when you have rituals to cast Doomsday and then a Draw4.

Hell, Doomsday with a crappy stack like 4 Stomping Slab also wins, so it's usually protecting and resolving Doomsday that signals the win. I think this deck is capable of pulling it off, although it involves more work on refining and tuning it to include Doomsday.

Why? Doomsday is a convenient bomb. The reason why it can work is that the deck isn't focused on using shitty cards that are worthless by themselves (e.g. Conjurer's Bauble, Stomping Slabs, Shelldock Isle, etc). The lone copy of Doomsday supports the Tendrils plan in the face of hate or when it is convenient. I've drawn Doomsday six times today, shuffled it away five times, and tutored for it twice. That's three castings in roughly 30 games. If you use the best tool for the job, that is likely how things will turn out. If you instead force yourself into using Doomsday, you will run into problems like MM on Doomsday being GG or stuffing your deck full of suboptimal cards just to make sure that you can win through various hate.

Actually come to think about it: Doomsday removes the graveyard which IGG needs so I think it's possibly not that fitting in this deck. I guess we should scrap the idea. I'll still think about it though.

Honestly? IGG is fine as long as you properly construct your Doomsday pile with regards to your hand. This takes very little brainpower, but it is critical to playing FT. I don't see this as any different than knowing what to tutor for with Mystical Tutor.

I might start a thread in the New and Developing Section for this decklist. It's pretty strong, but it depends heavily on protecting the combo, which makes it weaker than the current deck. But Doomsday is a possible inclusion, but not in this deck.

WTF? You can't be serious about this. This deck finds and resolve Chant effects in the fact of control better than anything in existence. That's the reason why I've included the card.

Duress is also terrible. Don't play it. Play either Extirpate, Pact of Negation, or Abeyance if you need the need for extra protection past 4 Chant, 4 Mystical Tutor.

[TeKo]

Cost/Requirements: 1BB + U/BBB Draw Spell that draws at least 3 (Brainstorm or a Draw4)
Effect: 8 Storm + Tendrils with just the stack (so excluding the draw spell, doomsday, accel, etc)
Stack:
LED
LED
Infernal Tutor
DW
IGG

I don't understand the Cost: U/BBB is clear, but what are the 1BB for?

Stack:
LED
LED
Infernal Tutor
DW
IGG

Play Brainstorm 2 cards != LED/IT on top
play LED
play LED
play IT -> IGG
sacc LEDs for BBBBBB
play IGG (LED LED IT)
play LED
play LED
play IT -> Wish
sacc LEDs for BBBBBB
play DW -> Tendrils
play Tendrils (ah ok here you need 1, but not really B so the cost would be 2B + U/BBB right?)

= 20life
Or if you Stack Tendrils instead of Wish (for 18life) you only need 1B + U/BBB but if you combo in the turn you played Doomsday its still lethal.
Then you need something like this:

W(Chant)B(Ritual->Doomsday)U(Brainstorm)+(still more than 2 cards in Hand)1B(Tutor)+1(if you play with Death Wish) = 1(2)BBUW seems OK

[emidln]

I don't understand the Cost: U/BBB is clear, but what are the 1BB for?

Or if you Stack Tendrils instead of Wish (for 18life) you only need 1B + U/BBB but if you combo in the turn you played Doomsday its still lethal.
Then you need something like this:

W(Chant)B(Ritual->Doomsday)U(Brainstorm)+(still more than 2 cards in Hand)1B(Tutor)+1(if you play with Death Wish) = 1(2)BBUW seems OK

W + 1B + BBB + (U or BBB) would be correct with a Chant. I didn't figure chant into any of the costs. The Death Wish pile is actually correct at 2B as well. Thanks for catching that! Also, you technically need to be at 4 or more life to use Doomsday + Death Wish, although that seems irrelevant in most circumstances.

[TeKo]

The life shouldn't be a problem because you'll use Doomsday against "hate decks" right?
And most of them don't have a really fast clock or deal damage to them self like Staxx, so you dont have to use DW.

Do you still play your Petal-less build?
Do you get the mana for the combo easy enough, because against Staxx I had problems to get the mana I need (Duals wasted, fetched for Island and cant find fetchland or swamp)

[emidln]

The life shouldn't be a problem because you'll use Doomsday against "hate decks" right?
And most of them don't have a really fast clock or deal damage to them self like Staxx, so you dont have to use DW.

Do you still play your Petal-less build?
Do you get the mana for the combo easy enough, because against Staxx I had problems to get the mana I need (Duals wasted, fetched for Island and cant find fetchland or swamp)

My petal-less build plays 4 Brainstorm, 4 Ponder, 3 Top, 8 fetches, 4 basics (2 Island, 1 Swamp, 1 Plains), 2 Tundra, 1 Scrubland, 2 Sea) with the additional sea and tundra as concessions to needing appropriate colors of mana. With 4 basics, I've had very little problem getting the mana I need. Stax has a tendency to play Chalice @ 0 anyway which renders Petal kinda bad. The only place that petal is really missed is vs Dragon Stompy, but I haven't played that matchup in forever.

I'll cast Doomsday whenever it is the easiest path to victory. It gets cast vs hate so much because it is usually the only path to victory in those scenarios. If I was holding something like double rit, chant, brainstorm, fetch, mystical on my opp's eot2, I would have no reservations about finding Doomsday and casting it ftw, but I don't force it when it's not convenient.

[Jaiminho]

I've always hated Petals against Stax, since it usually costs 3 to play and may delay my bounce or Serenity by an entire turn, which could be the difference between losing and winning.

Games 2 and 3 against Crypt/Leyline/Planar Void or whatever are easily winnable through Doomsday without having to fetch bounce or Abeyance. It's even faster. That's the sideboard hate I face the most.

[thefreakaccident]

This is the list I have been testing, I would like suggestions:

lands//14
1 badlands
1 volcanic island
1 underground sea
1 swamp
1 island
1 tundra
1 scrubland
4 polluted delta
3 flooded strand

creatures//4
4 street wraith

spells//42
4 dark ritual
4 lion's eye diamond
4 cabal ritual
4 lotus petal

4 infernal tutor
4 mystical tutor
4 brainstorm
3 ponder
2 grim tutor

3 orim's chant
1 wipe away

2 ill-gotten gains
2 tendrils of agony
1 empty the warrens (I see lots of extirpate)



sideboard//
4 serenity (awesome tech, thanks emdlin!)
1 rushing river
1 echoing truth
1 extirpate
4 dark confidant
1 empty the warrens
2 abeyance
1 orim's chant


The only reason I run red is because I see lots of grave hate, and sometimes it is nice not to have to wait to just win the game... I will admit that I win with the warrens route very infrequently, but I cannot get myself to cut it from the list.


I think the deck plays better with the 11/10 split between cantrips and tutors, and being able to tutor for LED before combo is pretty sweet...

Please give me some suggestions.

I have been having a real tough time against discard as well, even with the tutorable power draw... perhaps there is another way to fix this?

[emidln]

I have been having a real tough time against discard as well, even with the tutorable power draw... perhaps there is another way to fix this?

Sensei's Divining Top over Street Wraith helps this immensely as does playing a singleton Draw4. You could probably get away with -4 SW, +3 Top, +1 Draw4 and not be any worse for wear.

[Mental]

I kind of like Doomsday in this deck, kinda don't. The pros seem to be that Doomsday is a great card if you can't set up LED/IT, and lets you go for Double Tendrils fast and easily. However, it seems to take away abit from the consistancy of the deck. Honestly, I don't love 3 cards that take you down to half your life and don't let you win that turn. However, I'm thinking that as of now, the pros outweigh the cons. I'll test it in place of a Ponder.

[Jaiminho]

I don't see Doomsday as an out for when you can't go IGG via IT+LED or whatever; I see it as a way to dodge hate and opponent's card reuse as if it didn't exist. I don't see how it makes the deck less consistent.

Also, Doomsday lets you win the turn you cast it. It's not like you might cast it anytime just because you can, since you will need a cantrip/draw4/top in order to begin using the top card in order to win immediately. The major con is that it requires too much mana for a right away win.

This is the list I have been testing, I would like suggestions:

(stuff)

Try out Lim-Dul's Vault in the Grim Tutor slots. I've never used Grim Tutor, since I could never have one, so it's more like I don't know how good it is, but LDV + brainstorm/SW let's you fetch 2 cards (in the worst case, LDV becomes Vampiric Tutor; in the usual case, it gets 2 cards). The main problem with LDV is that it gets much worse after you take out SW for Top. I've cut them from my list when I made the switch.

About EtW: I've been there. I couldn't remove it until I saw there were other (better) options, specially when topdecking it costed me games. It's in my SB just in case I need to wish for it, which didn't happen yet.

[Mental]

Doomsday is an awful card to open with in most cases, and lacking a BS you can't get rid of it. It sometimes lets you win the turn you cast it, yeah, but that's conditional.

LDV is card disadvantage. Still, I'd play it before I'd shell out for a GTutor. It's worth testing.

[Jaiminho]

LDV is card disadvantage. Still, I'd play it before I'd shell out for a GTutor. It's worth testing.

So is Mystical and no one questions that. Doomsday is card disadvantage also, BTW. It's not the card disadvantage that makes it not awsome, but the two mana you have to pay, specially that black mana.

[Mental]

So is Mystical and no one questions that. Doomsday is card disadvantage also, BTW. It's not the card disadvantage that makes it not awsome, but the two mana you have to pay, specially that black mana.

Meh, the disadvantage is still crappy, especially when coupled with Doomsday and Mystical. I'm ok with 5 Sources of card disadvantage tutors, not 7 or 8.

[BreathWeapon]

You could replace Mystical for Vault, I doubt it'd be that much slower considering Vault can tutor for LED and gets to set up Brainstorm piles, you're almost guaranteed a third turn kill.

[Mental]

You could replace Mystical for Vault, I doubt it'd be that much slower considering Vault can tutor for LED and gets to set up Brainstorm piles, you're almost guaranteed a third turn kill.

That's an interesting idea, actually. Vault is definitely a more powerful card than Mystical Tutor, however, the fact that MTutor costs no black mana and one less mana, and has no cost in life, is definitely an argument against LDV. LDV may be worth it, however - Though it was pretty fun to bluff entire games as UW Landstill with an awful hand.

[emidln]

I'm going to go ahead and decree the following:

4 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Doomsday
1 Death Wish
2 Tendrils of Agony
1 Ill-Gotten GAins

are MANDATORY in Fetchland Tendrils. I'll post more about this later, but Doomsday might become a 2-of. This deck no longer even remotely cares about graveyard hate. The standard plan of attack for Leyline is Infernal Tutor + LED into 6 mana with a Top out. This wins the game on the spot with an additional 6 storm + tendrils after infernal tutor (so this should always be lethal).

Dark Rit
Dark Rit
LED
Infernal Tutor (break LED for BBB) -> Doomsday
Doomsday (Cruel Bargain, Lotus Petal, Dark Ritual, Dark Ritual, Tendrils of Agony)
Tap top to draw Bargain, play Bargain (drawing Top, Petal, Rit, Rit)
Petal
Dark Rit
Dark Rit
Top
Tap top to draw Tendrils, play Tendrils with storm of 10.

[No_Life_No_Future]

I was wondering what the matchup percentages look like for this deck.

Also have you tested:
Merchant Scroll<---Im assuming mystical is strictly better here.
Disrupt
Remand
Flash of Insight<---seems like it could work well with iggy and LED but there might not be enough blue cards to make it dig far enough.

[TeKo]

Dark Rit
Dark Rit
LED
Infernal Tutor (break LED for BBB) -> Doomsday
Doomsday (Cruel Bargain, Lotus Petal, Dark Ritual, Dark Ritual, Tendrils of Agony)
Tap top to draw Bargain, play Bargain (drawing Top, Petal, Rit, Rit)
Petal
Dark Rit
Dark Rit
Top
Tap top to draw Tendrils, play Tendrils with storm of 10.

The stack is great, but I thought you play Petal-less

But without Petal you can do the same, with Mystical (+ Blue mana source) instead of Infernal or direct Doomsday (9 Storm should be lethal)

I want to play:
1 IGG
1 Doomsday
1 Draw4
4 Ponder
4 Top (there are both great as a 4of)
And Petal (not so many people play Stompy/Staxx here, so the tempo boost is very good)
But its a bit difficult to fit all that Stuff in
maybe I try 15 Lands 3 Petal 1 Tendrils (+1 SB)

[BreathWeapon]

Why is the Death Wish mandatory, does it have anything to do with the Doomsday pile I'm not seeing?

Do you mean a Draw 4 is mandatory?