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Thread: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

  1. #4421
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Decks in the room: 4c SnowOko miracles, Stryfo Pile, Jeskai Mentor [Snow, from the Wrenn days], Elves!, UR Standstill [think Dreadstill without any Noughts], Jund, Painter [mono red?? w/ Recruiter], R/Gu Lands [+Oko], UR Delver, TES, unknown, and manifest destiny.

    Round 1 vs Painter (2-0): Game 1 play Dreadnought, Force their Karn, dead. Game 2 I keep 4 land + Karn hand, get to Karn mana and shut off Welder with Humility (concedes). Interesting point in game 2, opponent opens City, Hope of Ghirapur + Grindstone + LED. I have the option with my 3rd land drop to Wasteland them, but I choose to build to Karn mana instead - this is an interesting point in the game. It's probably safer to Wasteland, but I didn't mind making them draw exactly Painter.

    Round 2 vs UR Delver (2-1): Game 1 opponent is on the draw and opens Volc, Ponder. I Wasteland them and they are unable to find lands until they're already facing down active Azcanta, Teferi, and Standstill - at this point they concede, thinking they know what my deck is. Game 2 is pretty close but Pyromancer is able to get enough on board to out-pace my being on one white mana. Game 3 they keep a 7 with Tarn as only land and get Stifled out of the game, they never find land.

    Round 3 vs Jeskai Mentor (2-0): Game 1 opponent is struggling to get to 4 mana and Stifle x2 are eating all their blue cards. They lose Teferi on the stack, and then lose JTMS on the stack on the next turn; They concede to Karn resolving. Game 2 Stifle again is eating all their blue cards, but this time I have two Factory in play and I'm letting them resolve Teferi into Teferi into JTMS. Teferi #1 dies to 2x Factory animate and Karn +1 on Astrolabe. Teferi #2 dies to dies to same attack after going [-3] after resolving. JTMS bstorms and dies in pretty much the same way. Opponent's REB sat in hand with nothing to target while I slowly assembled Crypt and worked towards Liquimetal to permanently remove red mana from their tableau; opponent concedes before Karn starts murdering basics.

    Round 4 vs StryfoPile (ID, no match played).

    The UR Delver player was new to legacy and ran into both Standstill/Stifle decks and uh...it was a pretty nasty into to legacy.

  2. #4422
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by Rood View Post
    Breach is a tough MU i typically lose game 1. You have to try to restrict the first few turns i often will counter a brainstorm and try to hold up stifles on fetch. This is one MU where dispel truly shines. Hitting Veil FOW and chant is pretty large.

    Dreadstill streams going live at 10 PM!
    Hey Rood, when do you usually stream? I would love to tune in and watch you. Currently seeking Scroll of Fate to finish your version of the deck.

  3. #4423
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Playing through my first league on MODO. Scoop count to Dreadnought off Scroll of Fate is two so far.

    Also, I'm not sure if this has been posted previously (I can't find it), but ELD's Time Vault Games has a bunch of videos of Rood playing Dreadstill against a number of decks. Link is https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCib...UtB1A/videos.s

  4. #4424
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    You considered streaming or recording and putting on youtube @pandaman?

    Rood also has a youtube channel (Rood Slayer), but right now the only mtgo video is B/R Worldgorger-Reanimator.

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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by Fox View Post
    You considered streaming or recording and putting on youtube @pandaman?

    Rood also has a youtube channel (Rood Slayer), but right now the only mtgo video is B/R Worldgorger-Reanimator.
    I hadn't considered it. But one of my friends (DougesOnTwitch) streams, so I'll ask him how to do it.

    First league was 3-2 and I made heaps of misplays and misclicks (was definitely good for 4-1 without those), but today I played another league and went 4-1. Beat Storm 2-1, Breach with Infernal Tutors 2-1, URx Breach 2-1, and Burn 2-0 (gotta love natural T2 Dreadnought in both games) but lost 1-2 in the final round to a spicy Mono Black brew with Hymns, Sinkholes, Cursed Scroll, LotV, Murderous Rider, etc.

  6. #4426
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by pandaman View Post
    I hadn't considered it. But one of my friends (DougesOnTwitch) streams, so I'll ask him how to do it.

    First league was 3-2 and I made heaps of misplays and misclicks (was definitely good for 4-1 without those), but today I played another league and went 4-1. Beat Storm 2-1, Breach with Infernal Tutors 2-1, URx Breach 2-1, and Burn 2-0 (gotta love natural T2 Dreadnought in both games) but lost 1-2 in the final round to a spicy Mono Black brew with Hymns, Sinkholes, Cursed Scroll, LotV, Murderous Rider, etc.
    Nice results man. Mind posting your list? Wondering what splash you're running.
    Dreadstill

    "Control"(tr.v.): To exercise authoritative or dominating influence over; direct."

  7. #4427
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Red splash. I just took Rood's list from the first page. No changes at all. Shameless netdecking.

  8. #4428
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    I'm thinking about sideboarding with Rood's list. A couple of things:

    • I don't know when you should bring in Dismember. I initially thought it was for Eldrazi (particularly Reality Smasher and Thought-Knot Seer) but after watching some of Rood's videos it seems he brings it in for other matchups (I just watched him bring it in vs. Grixis Control, for example).
    • I'm pretty sure Agent of Treachery is for Show and Tell decks.
    • Extra True-Name Nemesis seems to be for control matchups (Miracles, Stryfo pile, 4C control, etc.) but I'm not sure whether I should also bring it in vs. Grixis Delver and UR Delver.
    • Engineered Explosives. When should you bring them in? I thought in against Miracles (Counterbalance and Monk and Angel tokens). But I also considered bringing it in against Breach and Storm to combat a potential Empty the Warrens win. Or is Stifle enough insurance against that?


    Also, Spell Snare seemed to be really good in Rood's matches that I watched. It counters a lot of important cards that we are seeing in the top decks: Counterbalance, Snapcaster Mage, Dreadhoard Archanist, Young Pyromancer, little Thalia, Stoneforge Mystic, Baleful Strix, Daze, Underworld Breach, Predict. I might try a 2/2 split between Snare and Pierce. Thoughts?

  9. #4429
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Sorry im bAck... good to see ya again Panda. TNN are to hose control and delver actually. Cards disgusting in all those matchups as well as D&T and lands. Dismembers come in vs a wide variety of decks its very good vs delver too actually and stoneblade/eldrazi. Agents are for show/tell. EE comes in in alot of MUs primary ones being chalice decks. I like it against TES and belcher too. Miracles w CB is fine or RIp/energy control (yes it exists on MTGO.) i have brought in EE vs delver its ok. Best vs death shadow. I wasnt playing true names but I added them back in and wouldnt consider playing less then 4. Gives us better outs vs the abrupt decay control decks.

    Snare vs Pierce: I have a few 5-0s with both variants. The Snare version is superior vs plains (D&T, stoneblade) which can be tough MUs. Pierce is way better vs combo tho. Snare is bad vs the breach decks cuz they revolve around orims chant. Snare is wayyy better against control and delver also.

    The deck in round 5 you faced sounds like a pox variant. That MU is tough cause they run factories/wastes for standstill
    UR Dreadstill creator and BRx WGD Combo Pioneer
    Quote Originally Posted by xsockmonkeyx View Post
    EDIT: and Roodmistah. If Dreadstill sucks then he's been mopping up the East Coast with a "crap" deck and making you all look bad.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbi View Post
    "Protection from player" is like a joke ability from Unglued. Ban this crap from legacy asap.

  10. #4430

    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Do you have an updated sideboard guide. What comes out is just as important as what goes in :)
    Don't hate the player, hate the game..

  11. #4431
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by DKK View Post
    Do you have an updated sideboard guide. What comes out is just as important as what goes in :)
    I finally updated the primer with a few of the metas popular decks at the moment. Will update slowly but please request a specific matchup if you are curious.

    Quote Originally Posted by pandaman View Post
    Red splash. I just took Rood's list from the first page. No changes at all. Shameless netdecking.
    That's the way.
    UR Dreadstill creator and BRx WGD Combo Pioneer
    Quote Originally Posted by xsockmonkeyx View Post
    EDIT: and Roodmistah. If Dreadstill sucks then he's been mopping up the East Coast with a "crap" deck and making you all look bad.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rabbi View Post
    "Protection from player" is like a joke ability from Unglued. Ban this crap from legacy asap.

  12. #4432

    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by Rood View Post
    I finally updated the primer with a few of the metas popular decks at the moment. Will update slowly but please request a specific matchup if you are curious.
    Thanks! I would be interested in Eldrazi and Lands (decks with Chalice).

    Playtested the list recently and feels like a house. Keep up the good work!
    Don't hate the player, hate the game..

  13. #4433
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    For the UW version...
    vs. Eldrazi Aggro: +1 Torpor Orb, +1 Powder Keg, +1 Porphyry Nodes, +1 Humility, +1 Scroll of Fate. -1 FoN, -1 JVP, -1 Snare, -1 Noxious, -1 Stfle.

    vs. Lands (lands doesn’t have Chalice?): +1 Crypt, +1 RiP, +1 Ashiok, +1 Ratchet. Option to bring in +1 Crucible and +1 Humility. -1 Snare, -2 Verdict, -1 Standstill, then optional -1 Nought, -1 more Standstill).

    vs. Loam (lands with Chalice and dudes): +1 Ashiok, +1 Scroll of Fate, +1 Powder Keg, +1 Mastery of the Unseen. Option for +1 Humility, +1 Crucible, +1 RiP. -1 Nought. -1 Noxious, -1 Stifle, -1 JVP (on the play)/-1 Snare (on the draw). Optional cuts can include -1 additional Nought, -1 FoW, -1 Standstill. Adapt strategy as necessary once variant is identified - classic vs 5c Oko vs 4c Oko w/o P-fire.

  14. #4434
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Took Rood's standard list for another spin on MODO. Went terribly, ending up with a 1-4 record.

    R1 v Grixis Delver. G1 He had Daze for my Delver, Daze for my Standstill with Factory on the Board, and Force for my TNN. He then followed up with a Young Pyromancer and I don't draw anything to interact with it and die. G2 my T1 Delver flips natuarlly and gets there because opp can't find removal and I have enough countermagic to prevent him from putting down a faster clock. G3 hinges on my Standstill with my unflipped Delver on the Board, in response to the Standstill he flashes in Brazen Borrower. Or course, my Delver doesn't flip for another five turns so I can't chump block and I don't draw any Factories, so I lose.

    R2 v 4-colour Snow Control with that Uro Titan thing. L0-2. G1 I have a Delver but he has a Plague Engineer naming Human before it flips. After Bolting the Engineer I had a Dreadnought and two Lightning Bolts with him at 18 life, and I swing with Dreadnought and Elk against his Elk for the win, but unfortunately he has Abrupt Decay for my Nought. After this he has all four Ice Fang Coatls to put a very effective wall up. Then Uro comes down to ruin my day. G2 I resolve a TNN but Force of Will an Oko, after which he plays a Plague Engineers naming Merfolk. Dreadnought is terrible v Oko so I lose this game in short order. The Force on Oko was a mistake. I should have identified that my path to winning the game was TNN and Plague Engineer was the only card the opponent had to disrupt that, so Force should have been reserved for Plague Engineer.

    R3 v UWr Breach. W 2-0. G1 I disrupt his cantrips and that is enough for a Delver to crack in for the win. G2 I had an interesting situation where I had a Standstill and Stifle in hand and opp had a fetch and a basic. I had Delver on the board, and cast the Standstill. He then could crack his fetch without worrying about it being Stifled. I am not sure Standstill was the right play there. I think holding up Stifle with Delver pressure might have been correct. Also, is Scroll of Fate too slow against combo? Could it be correct to board it out? Or is in fact Standstill that you should be boarding out against combo? Anyway, he makes some land drops under Standstill and eventually cracks it for Underworld Breach, which I can't counter. G3 I slow him down with Pyroblast and Spell Pierce on his early cantrips. I eventually get and flip a Delver to start pressuring his life total. He casts Underworld Breach, I Spell Pierce, forcing him to crack his LED and go hellbent. With the Spell Pierce still on the stack I use Surgical Extraction on his LEDs and he concedes.

    R4 v BUr Breach or Storm, I don't really know which (it had both Breach and Tendrils, but he killed me with Tendrils both times so maybe Bridge was just a one-of) - L 1-2. G1 permission disrupted him enough for a Delver and Stifled Nought to get there. G2 I mulled to six and bottomed a Factory without any other creature in hand. I definitely think this was a mistake. The game ran way longer than it probably needed to. I did eventually draw a Delver after many turns, but by then he'd drawn heaps of cards and could use them to force through a lethal Tendrils. G3 I have double Stifle and Nought, which I get down on T3 holding up Stifle. I used Stifle on a fetchland, which I don't think was correct. Against Storm, Stifle essentially reads "counter Tendrils of Agony" so I'm wondering if you shouldn't use your Stifles on fetches against Storm and should just make them have the discard for the Stifle if they want to win.

    R5 v UW Miracles. L 0-2. Both games he has Terminus for my TNNs and Factories and outgrinds me with Predicts and Jace and Counterbalance and lots of counterspells, while I draw no Standstills or other relevant action.

    So, pretty terrible third outing with the deck. But I'm learning and identifying misplays, so there is a positive. Still really unsure on correct boarding choices as I said above, whether Scrolls and Standstills should come out vs Combo. I tried taking out Wasteland against Miracles but I don't know if that was correct. Maybe it's also correct to take Wasteland out against Snoko because of Astrolabe and lots of basics.

  15. #4435

    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    That is actually a very interesting post you made here, pandaman. Thanks. People (too) often write stuff when they win so readers can get the wrong idea that the deck just steam-rolls by itself. It is not. I love the deck and have being playing it regularly on cocka for quite some times now and always found that this deck is a Damocles sword: it either crushes opponents when cards comes the right way or just looses and leaves you with quite a bitter aftertaste. So yes, it defo is a "harder than you think" deck to play.

    I too believe that Oko is just a freakin pain in the rear for this deck. Sure, REB or Pyroblast can deal with it but the card is still really troublesome. Decay has also been a massive annoyance which led me to main deck at least 1 Misdirection (instead of Force of Negation). Admittedly it is not always optimal (especially if opponent has nothing on his side to redirect to) but it still gives a shimmer of hope with a Standstill on the board.
    Boarding out Wasteland vs Snoko.deck still sounds like a bad idea. After all, you still need your land drops and you can always nuke a dual every now and then.

    Lowering the count of Scroll vs Combo seems right. But I would not cut all of them. Should the game drag for too long, it still converts otherwise useless cards into additional threats. Cutting Standstill is quite a tough call, also because normally they will tend to Duress us before the take off so drawing an extra 3 cards might just give us the answer(s) we need to prevent the loss caused by the Duress.

    Another deck I found to be pretty tricky to play against is Lands. G1, Standstill often turns out to be more a dead card (if not a free Thrall for the opponent) than anything else. They can easily disrupt our manabase (especially Mishra). And most of our counters are plain useless. Post-side, depending on what we play, the sole "real" options are bouncing spells and Needle. The rest is just jank. So am more and more tempted by cutting the 3rd REB to make room for a Blood Moon. Downside is obviously that it hurts our Mishras (the Wastelands too but the card is just suboptimal here anyways). Upside would be that we can simply focus on protecting the Moon, land a threat a ride from then on. But frankly, am all ears to suggestion for this specific MU.

  16. #4436
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    oh my, the naughty Hong Kong spice:

    https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=24746&d=373157&f=LE

    Has Mirage Mirror been discussed here before?

  17. #4437
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist


    @ pandaman: No worries. Practically all my tourney reports thus far are L's. It's just a bunch of me learning, and given the time I actually have to practice, a lot of it is learning on the fly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tobitzki View Post
    oh my, the naughty Hong Kong spice:

    https://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=24746&d=373157&f=LE

    Has Mirage Mirror been discussed here before?
    Neat list. Don't recall seeing Mirage Mirror come up, at least in what I've read. This list seems to be geared more towards comboing off as opposed to a steady beatdown or slow grind. Looks like a blast, but I'd say it's pretty distinct than your traditional Dreadstill list. ("Turbo Depths" that happens to have a Nought package).
    Dreadstill

    "Control"(tr.v.): To exercise authoritative or dominating influence over; direct."

  18. #4438
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by pandaman View Post
    Took Rood's standard list for another spin on MODO. Went terribly, ending up with a 1-4 record.

    R4 v BUr Breach or Storm, I don't really know which (it had both Breach and Tendrils, but he killed me with Tendrils both times so maybe Bridge was just a one-of) - L 1-2. G1 permission disrupted him enough for a Delver and Stifled Nought to get there. G2 I mulled to six and bottomed a Factory without any other creature in hand. I definitely think this was a mistake. The game ran way longer than it probably needed to. I did eventually draw a Delver after many turns, but by then he'd drawn heaps of cards and could use them to force through a lethal Tendrils. G3 I have double Stifle and Nought, which I get down on T3 holding up Stifle. I used Stifle on a fetchland, which I don't think was correct. Against Storm, Stifle essentially reads "counter Tendrils of Agony" so I'm wondering if you shouldn't use your Stifles on fetches against Storm and should just make them have the discard for the Stifle if they want to win.
    I was your R4 opponent. I wanted to comment to you after g2 how much I enjoyed our match regardless of the W/L since it seemed so interactive from my point of view but maybe you disagree. I tend to go long in games... I think stifle on fetch can be good most often since I'll likely have discard or go through pif to check for the stifle before casting a storm card but there are the times when I have a flood of lands and I use them to duress you. G3 was well played I think and I was lucky to have it that turn. I can't recall exactly (modo replay is not working for me) but I think I remember knowing the coast was clear so I had discard or something. Your play makes more sense too since you had a 12/12 in play and I had only 2 turns. It's circumstantial and not always so clear.

  19. #4439
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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    Quote Originally Posted by ScottW View Post
    I was your R4 opponent. I wanted to comment to you after g2 how much I enjoyed our match regardless of the W/L since it seemed so interactive from my point of view but maybe you disagree. I tend to go long in games... I think stifle on fetch can be good most often since I'll likely have discard or go through pif to check for the stifle before casting a storm card but there are the times when I have a flood of lands and I use them to duress you. G3 was well played I think and I was lucky to have it that turn. I can't recall exactly (modo replay is not working for me) but I think I remember knowing the coast was clear so I had discard or something. Your play makes more sense too since you had a 12/12 in play and I had only 2 turns. It's circumstantial and not always so clear.
    Thanks, it was indeed a good set of games! Playing against Storm is always nerve-wracking but enjoyable. That's a good point you make, that if you have PiF you'll most likely check for Stifle with a discard spell from your GY. My replay for that match isn't working either, or I'd watch it back to make sure I'm remembering it correctly.

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    Re: [Deck] Dreadstill - Enter the Fist

    @pandaman on some of SBing you saw in Rood’s UR play: when it comes to Dismember and EE, it is generally best to view this as the “Standstill [w/o Nought] is enough” to grind out a win. As hard as a lot of the SBing can be, always do a post-mortem on Factory use and make sure manland decisions complemented the post-board vision. The manland play patterns should be looking different. Some of the higher yield scenarios are:
    3-4 land + Standstill onboard
    only 1 blue mana on board (usually Fetch Mountain board states)

    What resource are you trying to trade, what was the objective (i.e. if you’re boarding to grind, why did 2 points matter right at that time), how important is playing around future soft permission, are you letting opponent back into the game with a future Wasteland by exposing a land to a spell, etc...

    It’s not the most specific advice, but a lot of SB choices come down to how you plan on winning/how you want opponent to trade resources.

    @Tobitzki yes, Mirage Mirror was discussed when it was spoiled. The issue is that you’ve got a 2+ mana enabler that still loses to Chalice and doesn’t offer any meaningful resistance/disruption to opposing strategies. While Mirror works with Dreadnought and Depths, these strategies do little to help each other. Draw the correct half of the deck and maybe you somehow beat (or avoid) SCM/Plow-type strategies. At the end of the day though, you’re still trying to bash everything in [effectively] the same way without sidestepping potential issues nor offering different puzzles. The deck can be reduced to mono-U Dreadnought with another color used solely to offer more of the same (either Depths or Hunted Horrors being the most common).

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