The truth is, I would never play a version without hibernation. The bant version is just a bunch of lords with crystalline. At that point you should just play merfolk since the mana is much better. You also cut yourself out of syphon sliver which can be useful in some racing matchups.Originally Posted by Havrekjex
If you're still determined to only play bant, then probably run 2 Sylvan library so you can find your crystalline slivers.
You asked about playing a brainstorm/fetch/duals version. This simply isn't as good with 4-8 rainbow lands.
You'd likely need to cut the mutavaults, but you can try it.
-rob
Some lists ran a Scrubland in the pre-Mutavault days so that Scrubland+Trop could cast any Sliver on two lands. If Seas aren't an option, you could try Scrubland. It won't help Daze or cantrips, but at least it allows you to cast slivers and some utility spells.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
I'm wondering if anyone here has seen my topic in developmental, about a "control" version of the deck.
It's probably the most interesting and entertaining deck i've ever played, so i'm really interested in your opinion about a way to make it almost "competitive", if possibile =)
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...Tricky-Slivers
One question at a time please!
1st on the list is : Brainstorm or not Brainstorm?
Brainstorm.
I mean, my sig. What's better than fixing your mana, digging for relevant slivers, having more chances to get sideboard hate, and shuffling away dead cards with fetchlands? Merfolk doesn't run cantrips because of the simpler manabase and Chalice, but those don't apply to Slivers (not to mention that Merfolk gets bitten by the inconsistency bug due to a lack of library manipulation).
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
Library manipulations are indeed primordial imo (until we get a good card advantage sliver) ... but brainstorm isn't the only card doing it...
Sylvan library of instance, even if less explosive, is also real power house in the deck.
I am currently hesitating between those two builts concerning card drawing:
2 sylvan library (2 makes the deck a little more clunky but the first one will most of the time prevent your from drawing the second)
2 recruiter of the guard ( I strongly encourage everybody to give her 1 or 2 slots no matter what build you are playing!)
Brainless makes room for more slivers, letting me add a tutorable syphon sliver which btw works wonderfully with S library (turns slivers into mini griselbrands)
I'm testing this right now...
My point being: less bs = more good slivers.
OR
2 recruiter of the guard
1 sylvan library
3 brainstorm
The reasons of my hesitations are:
-The redundancy of bs with library on the field (let you dig only one more card)
-It can easily be disrupted
-3/4 slots that forces me to cut -1 syphon, -1 muscle, -1 Galerider
and since I play 3 chalice in the sideboard, brainstorm is often taken out on the 2nd or 3rd game.
I'm not sure if the "flexibility" provided by the blue cantrip is still worth 3/4 slots considering with have other ways to get card selection and net card advantage if needed...
On the other hand, i am well aware that bs can be a life saver in those cases:
- Rearange a bad starting hand (+ fetch)
- Dig for a counterspell or a sliver in emergency.
- Hide some key cards from discard spells.
Both lists works, but I would gladly hear your thoughts !
The conversation continues...
PS:
Why playing chalice?
-At 0 or 1 and even sometime at 2 ( locking punishing fire and Life of the loam out in case of emergency)
-Protects slivers if no Crystalline or Hibernation available (PLAY HIBERNATION!!!!)
-Synergetic with Cavern of Souls
-ELVES
I'm a little skeptical of Recruiter here, to be honest. Sure it's card advantage, but netting a non-sliver 1/1 isn't really all that hot given that we can't recur it with Flickerwisp here. Additionally, it's not a Sliver (bad for Cavern) and costs 3 (bad for Vial). If I felt the need for 1-shot search effects, I might still prefer Eladamri's Call.
I'm a big fan of Sylvan Library too if you see my other posts on Sliver and Zoo threads, but IMO you add 1-2 Libraries only after you establish a consistent base with Brainstorm and you still have room in the deck.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
You are probably right about BS... 1/2 libraries and 3 brainstorm is the safest thing.
But again I encourage you to give recruiter a try...Sure it's not a sliver... but let's compare it to silvercycling (which is theoretically good but only let you remplace a sliver) or eladamri's call which is mana intensive and can be countered.
Recruiter can be vialed, or caverned (I run a playset and naming human is rarely a hard thing to accomplish) it's a 5/6th crystalline, 4/5th hibernation, 4/5th galerider, it's an additional lord, or even a blue card to pitch to fow... it makes room in the sideboard (let you tutor hatebears without having to pack 3/4 of them) and in the main (only one phantasmal is needed) , can block or attack , be sacrificed without a thought and without ruinning your boardstate... Honnestly it's a house... even if not recursive.
Hey fellow legends and meathooks enthusiasts (what a tautology)
With the super prestigious Legacy FNM coming up for me, I've decided that it's time to fish-hook some people into submission.
//Artifact (4)
4 Ćther Vial
//Creature (27)
4 Crystalline Sliver
2 Edric, Spymaster of Trest
4 Galerider Sliver
4 Hibernation Sliver
4 Muscle Sliver
4 Predatory Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
1 Winged Sliver
//Instant (10)
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
//Land (19)
2 Cavern of Souls
3 Flooded Strand
1 Misty Rainforest
4 Mutavault
3 Polluted Delta
2 Tropical Island
2 Tundra
2 Underground Sea
SB: 3 Containment Priest
SB: 3 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 2 Fatal Push
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 2 Invasive Surgery
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Rest in Peace
As you can probably tell from my sideboard, I don't have much love for combo (there should probably be 4 Containment Priests, fuck Show and Tell).
I haven't added much in the way of spice except making the deck worse by trying to force Abrupt Decay. I'm gunna test Edric although it's probably win-more and just more of me trying to turn every deck into a deck with Goblin Ringleader in it. Please let me know if I'm making any super-fatal errors in deckbuilding before I go fish out these hooks from the closet they've laid dormant in for quite some time.
Evening Everyone,
I want to preface this with I have never played a sliver before.
Stone forge mystic likes to be in creature heavy decks. Creature heavy decks want to have their creatures double as spells. Therefore slivers?
Has anyone tried this?
Not exactly sure what your point is. The most common uses of SFM are probably Stoneblade/Deathblade, with 10-16 creatures, and Death and Taxes, with 25+ creatures. It's also sometimes seen in creature-light decks, e.g. a Batterskull package in Miracles. In other words the creature count for SFM decks varies a lot.
IMO very few slivers function as spells. Beyond Harmonic Sliver, it's mostly pump and evasion. Merfolk can do things like counter spells, draw cards, and bounce creatures (in addition to pump/evasion). Elves and Goblins do all kinds of crazy things.
If you're proposing adding SFM to Slivers, I don't think it will work. The goal is to have Slivers that can't be equipped to (due to Crystalline), so you're left with equipping to SFM or running living weapons.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
Fair enough on the variation on creature numbers in sfm decks. I just happened to see this deck played and thought it was fun but I'm not huge on the straight up lords idea for tribal decks. Vial slivers seems a lot like merfolk or vial goblins with a worse mana base so I was curious if it were feasible to move in a different direction closer to d&t but bigger/more versatile?
Again, not sure, I was just curious what the knowledge was from the people who have come before me.
Thanks for the input.
If you read my posts on countersliver threads I've said the same time and time again ... except I generally think the creature are worse too. I mean, that's a nice Muscle Sliver you got there but my tribal lord ALSO lets me landwalk the most powerful color in the game while pumping the team. Crystalline is about the only reason to run Slivers, but it's not so good that people throw random Crystallines in their non-tribal decks. On the other hand, Merfolk has creatures powerful enough to run outside of the tribe (TNN).
People have tried shoving all sorts of creatures into Slivers, but the more you do that, the more you should ask yourself the fundamental question of why you're running Slivers at all.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
Hi all,
I have asked previously about all-in slivers and now I am asking about Smuggler's Copter in all-in slivers.
A sample proposed list
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Sliver Hive
4x Mutavault
4x Mana Confluence
3x Ancient Ziggurat
2x Chrome Mox
2x Chalice of the Void
4x Aether Vial
4x Galerider Sliver
4x Striking Sliver
4x Crystalline Sliver
3x Hibernation Sliver
4x Muscle Sliver
4x Sinew Sliver
4x Predatory Sliver
2x Venom
1x Winged Sliver
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Sideboard
1x Chalice of the Void
1x Containment Priest
2x Darkheart Sliver
2x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Harmonic Sliver
1x Necrotic Sliver
2x Meddling Mage
1x Pithing Needle
I am more then willing to change the list to something similar if it will work more on this current metagame. I think this was more for miracles, so something might be better in this different metagame. I would be interested to hear your suggestions. My proposal is changing out 2 Striking Slivers for Smuggler's Copter. I would also be considered adding some Manaweft/Gemhide Slivers and some larger ones like Blur or Necrotic that do well in the modern slivers deck. I am also thinking a Sidewinder or two might be good against all the true name nemesis out there.
I'd take out Chalice instead. I don't think you're running it (Chalice) in a shell that can really leverage it. If you want to have control deck elements, go all out like Merfolk does with a full playset and additional layered protection like countermagic, Venser, Truth, Clique. But that's not your deck. Ultimately, I'd much rather have Sylvan Library or SmugCop in the Chalice slots.
Speaking of Red, Hunter Sliver and Striking Sliver is a wonderful combo. You can easily kill utility creatures like SFM, DRS, Wirewood Symbiote, etc. I might slightly prefer Hunter over Venom, as you can then use your army as removal. Alternately, take out the single Winged and a Striking to run both Venom and Hunter, as any combination of Venom+Hunter+Striking removes much of the need for evasion.
Keep in mind that if you're really all-in aggro, that implies a kind of dumb brute force mentality. If you're gonna get tricky with things like disruption, that's something I heartily endorse but it really benefits from library manipulation to help find the right answers to a given situation. SmugCop, Oath, Library, etc.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
Well All-In Slivers have another land option that I think I will persue in addition to Cavern and Sliver Hive. Uncharted Territory is something that helps this version of the deck quite a bit and does nothing to help other versions.
4 Cavern
4 Hive
4 Mutavault
4 Uncharted Territory
1 Gemhide Caverns
1 Mana Confluence
1 Ancient Ziggurat
^
Is Uncharted Territory a newly spoiled card? I can't find it anywhere.
EDIT: Card is Unclaimed Territory. It's Cavern of Souls without "Can't be Countered."
Thanks, I was wondering about that.
Most people blindly suggest new cards for decks. True contributors also suggest what to remove. It's not about what's good, but rather what's better than the current selections.
---
Carpe Diem
NECRO ALERT!
Planning to start playing Slivers soon and this is my starting point:
4 Predatory Sliver
4 Sinew Sliver
4 Muscle Sliver
4 Crystalline Sliver
3 Hibernation Sliver
4 Galerider Sliver
2 Phantasmal Image
4 Brainstorm
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
4 Aether Vial
4 Mutavault
1 Sliver Hive
1 Island
2 Polluted Delta
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Cavern of Souls
1 Savannah
1 Tropical
1 Tundra
1 Underground Sea
Sideboard
1 Spell Pierce
2 Flusterstorm
2 Echoing Truth
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Necrotic Sliver
2 Pithing Needle
2 Harmonic Sliver
1 Divert
2 Containment Priest
Sideboard still is a mess, but it will have to do for now.
And the manabase is still wonky. On one side I want to play more blue lands (don't own any tundra's so I need to borrow/buy them, and no Flooded Strands)/fetches. Or should I replace the 2 delta's by 2 Sliver Hives for 'better' mana. I think being able to cast the brainstorms/Images/return Island for daze, is more important than the Sliver Mana base. Also, with 4 Mutavaults, mana might be more of a problem. Maybe including a chrome mox?
The 2 images are flex slots, thought about a recruiter or a library, but I find that with a small manabase, weak to wasteland, getting to that 3 mana (plus white) isn't always easy. And by the time you cast it, it might not even matter anymore. Library can be more interesting in long games.
Although I think that the Images can be of more use, you can copy a lord, or counter one of the unfair decks strategies (by copying Marit Lage, Emrakul, ...)
Not a big fan of removal, mostly because it's hard to find a decent manabase for it, but maybe a dismember may fit (easier on the mana).
Might want a Darkheart/Syphon sliver in the side against burn or maybe grixis (although I feel that Syphon sliver might be too slow against Burn)
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