Inspired by the new hotness of Vintage, I decided to try to port it over to Legacy as best as possible. The deck I'm talking about can be found here.
At first I tried to make Fauna Shaman work, but being a creature and having to tap made it unplayable in the shell I was looking for. So I ditched the Shamans and went full on with Hollow One and Vengevine. Here's where I'm at right now:
Creatures
1 Anger
4 Basking Rootwalla
3 Birds of Paradise
4 Hollow One
2 Hooting Mandrills
4 Noble Hierarch
2 Squee, Goblin Nabob
4 Vengevine
1 Wonder
Enchantment
2 Sylvan Library
Instant
2 Izzet Charm
3 Punishing Fire
Sorcery
4 Careful Study
4 Faithless Looting
Planeswalker
2 Dack Fayden
Land
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Taiga
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
Sideboard
3 Faerie Macabre
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Echoing Truth
3 Flusterstorm
1 Krosan Grip
2 Lightning Bolt
2 Pyroblast
In testing so far, the deck has been performing well enough. It can sometimes prove to be a little inconsistent, but not as badly as I first expected without proper blue cantrips. Graveyard hate has not been that big of an issue either, as with all of the dorks just hardcasting threats is completely realistic.
Cards I have tried and did not like: Street Wraith, Fauna Shaman, Nimble Mongoose, Search for Azcanta, Wasteland, Llanowar Mentor, Jace, Vryn's Prodigy. I have yet to try Memnite and Ornithopter, but I am skeptical they will do much good.
Maybe I just suck at Magic, but as far as I can tell, this deck cannot currently beat Turbo Depths or UB Death's Shadow. Perhaps some sideboard rearrangement is in order.
In any case, thanks for reading this far, and please let me know what you think about this deck and how to improve it. Triggering Vengevine is a riot, and an experience everyone should have.
"On the other hand, I am still wondering on which basis certain people appoint themselves authorities on a matter; postcount does not equal stormcount."
- CabalTherapy
keep in mind that squee's effectiveness in vintage is due mostly to the playset of bazaars. i think there's another thread on this but i can't recall the name.
-rob
Here's My Take -
1 Anger
1 Wonder
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
4 Basking Rootwalla
4 Hollow One
4 Vengevine
4 Hapless Researcher
4 Bloodghast
4 Izzet Charm
4 Faithless Looting
4 Burning Inquiry
1 Dread Return
4 Mox Diamond
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Taiga
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
1 Island
1 Mountain
1 Forest
2 Cephalid Coliseum
The goal of this build is to pump out an Iona backed by a clock. Running this deck means having basically no method of interaction outside of Izzet charm. I shore this up with burning inquiry, which allows us to filter a lot and hymm an opponent for 1 red. Cephalid Coliseum is used to discard dread return, bloodghasts and iona if we've messed up late game. Mox Diamod allows for starts like mox, faithless, land (double bloodghast), burning discarding more goodstuff. Basically, we need the speed and the cost of mox diamond allows for an extra discard trigger for hollow one.
Note: This is highly untested, and is generally just me throwing ideas around. It's also 3am here and I can't sleep, so sorry if my post seems a bit disjointed.
I am curious, what you think about the following list:
4 Careful Study
4 Faithless Looting
4 Hollow One
4 Punishing Fire
4 Hooting Mandrils
4 Stubborn Denial
4 Basking Rootwalla
4 Vengvine
4 Insolate Neonate
4 Mox Diamond
1 Anger
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
3 Volcanic Island
3 Tropical Island
9 Fetch 19
I don't think that there is enough to trigger Vengevine consistently. I found in testing so far that the deck is fairly mana hungry, and wants to have the dorks to not only trigger Vengevine but also to cast all of it's spells. Not saying this list is wrong, as I haven't tested it, but that's my opinion on it.
"On the other hand, I am still wondering on which basis certain people appoint themselves authorities on a matter; postcount does not equal stormcount."
- CabalTherapy
Seems like a blast to play, love this kind of deck.
I've been playing around with different versions of Cloudvine and have often considered moving more in this direction.
I have been playing and tweaking this deck for months. Here is my most recent build:
4 Hollow One
2 Hooting Mandrills
4 Insolent Neonate
4 Flameblade Adept
4 Street Wraith
4 Basking Rootwalla
1 Wonder
4 Vengevine
2 Careful Study
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Izzet Charm
2 Stubborn Denial
4 Faithless Looting
2 Lightning Axe
1 Island
2 Volcanic Island
1 Tropical Island
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Mountain
2 Taiga
1 Forest
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Flusterstorm
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Pyroblast
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Echoing Truth
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Blood Moon
1 Pyroclasm
I disagree about street wraith, i think it's really strong -- looting + wraith has led to some of the most explosive starts with multiple hollow ones or VVs
I've never tried Squee or all the dorks, I've just been focusing on the turbo GY plan. But I can give your idea a spin. I must have close to like 50 matches under my belt with variants on this deck.
As far as Street Wraith goes, I initially liked the cycling for early Hollow Ones, but I have since started using Mox Diamond instead, which enables the fast Hollow One plus mana. So far it has been great. I am also thinking of replacing the Mox Diamond/Street Wraith sloth with Shardless Agent, which should be a hoot and allow two creatures to be cast per turn with ease.
"On the other hand, I am still wondering on which basis certain people appoint themselves authorities on a matter; postcount does not equal stormcount."
- CabalTherapy
Double post, but this deck isn't attracting any attention anyways, and I have an updated list to share that has been the best so far in all my testing. I decided to give Street Wraith another shot at showing me what its worth could be, and it has over performed. Card is nuts. Anyways, here's the list:
1 Anger
4 Basking Rootwalla
3 Birds of Paradise
4 Hollow One
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Street Wraith
4 Vengevine
1 Wonder
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Breakthrough
4 Careful Study
4 Faithless Looting
2 Forest
1 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Taiga
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
SB
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Ancient Grudge
3 Echoing Truth
2 Spell Pierce
3 Flusterstorm
4 Surgical Extraction
Notable plays have included casting Faithless Looting turn one, binning 2 Vengevines, then cycling a Street Wraith and casting 2 Hollow Ones for zero mana, getting back both Vengevines and having 16 power on the board. Also, Breakthrough has been awesome, at any point in the game. I've cast it turn one and binned 3 Vengevines and cast 2 Basking Rootwallas for their Madness cost. I've also used it mid game with all of the mana dorks to draw 4 and discard zero or one card.
I'm going to keep tinkering with the list and testing things out. So far the deck is a complete dog to SnT, struggles against a turn one or two Tabernacle, absolutely crushes DnT/Miracles/Stoneblade/decks that play white, and is a riot to play.
"On the other hand, I am still wondering on which basis certain people appoint themselves authorities on a matter; postcount does not equal stormcount."
- CabalTherapy
Still more test results with the deck?
Faerie Macabre seems like interesting option for the board.
I would be tempted to replace the birds with neonates or the adept (more the adept, especially with 12 looting effects)
Can you image, turn 1 flameblade adept, turn 2 breakthrough?
Sorry for all the posts.
Yes faerie seems good might go a 2-2 split with surgical. If the deck is so 'aweful' against SnT. Is a gilded drake or 2 an option?
I haven't changed the decklist or sideboard all that much in my testing from my last post above. I cut down on the number of Breakthrough, as the card has a very low floor. I was trying to steer away from cards like neonate, flameblade adept, and hapless researcher, as then the deck begins to look a lot like some kind of Modern port of the Hollow One deck, which I wanted to avoid, as I believe there's a better shell for that, either B/R or Jund.
In any case, the deck is still fun, but sometimes just poops on its self. Sometimes you get to have 3 flying Vengevines out by turn 2, other times you keep casting looting effects and nothing happens. Maybe I need to adjust the mana base to not flood out so badly.
"On the other hand, I am still wondering on which basis certain people appoint themselves authorities on a matter; postcount does not equal stormcount."
- CabalTherapy
Instead of Birds and Nobles you could play Wild Cantor.
It allows a turn 1, Wild Cantor -> sac for red/blue, Faithless Looting/Breakthrough/Careful Study discarding Rootwalla and Vengevine, cast Rootwala get back Vengevine.
I hadn't thought of Wild Cantor before, but that does sound pretty awesome. I'll give that a whirl and see how it goes. It would help speed up the deck, which I think is kind of the point of this archetype.
Regarding faerie macabre, I added it to the sb and it has been great. I found that Surgical extraction on vengevine was a beating, and faerie can save you from that, as well as act as yard hate and Hollow One enabling to boot.
"On the other hand, I am still wondering on which basis certain people appoint themselves authorities on a matter; postcount does not equal stormcount."
- CabalTherapy
I haven't worked on this deck in a while but Cantor is a good idea.
The best way to beat Surgical is Silent Gravestone imo. I think this deck may be more all-in and less hybrid than I thought it could be originally.
So:
-3 Birds
-1 Noble
+4 Wild Cantor
and in the side:
-4 surgicals
+2 Faerie
+2 Silent Gravestone
Will test this as well.
EDIT: maybe trying 1 (or 2) Cephalid Collosseum in the manabase to allow for 'mid'game looting effect, you can easily shave some lands and put some extra mana dorks in. (the ones that you cut for cantor)
A life from the loam to refill your hand for looting effects should also be considered if you go for Coliseum. I had a small package for a while with that + cycling lands + barb ring for reach. Doesn’t work with gravestone though so a sideboard map would be ideal
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