After you have hit your opponent even once with Negator or Obliterator, they should be at significantly less life then you. If you have other creatures out and they are at say 10 or less life, just kill them. In all likelihood they will use Force of Will to stop you from playing Phyrexian Obliterator or Phyrexian Negator. If they did, well that's one less spell to stop Hatred. Sure its risky, but Suicide can be. Hatred is just a win condition. No need to build a deck around it.
Yeah those cards are much slower then Phyrexian Tower. Plus they have the added downside of being able to be killed. Not worth it in my opinion. By the way, I tested the above deck with more expensive cards and it still performed well. Even with Nighthawk and Specter and the like. I just think it’s a bit slow for my taste. But you can get those cards into play by sacrificing creatures quickly. Looking to speed the deck up as the environment now is very fast. Made some changes by adding Phyrexian Negator into the deck.
First of all, its my opinion that Phyrexian Negator is Suicide’s friend again. Simply look at the field. The top decks are certainly not Red Deck Wins or Zoo. It’s a sea of islands and green/white decks with a few decks which splash black. Negator really shines in the current format. When your opponent plays Jace, trust me, you don’t want that fool to have anytime at all. Especially if you run 4 Phyrexian Tower. If they Bolt him just sacrifice it. If you don’t have one you can sacrifice Sarcomancy and Bloodghast well enough as well.
Hatred
Sideboard
4 Chains of Mephistopheles (not sure)
4 Curses Scroll
3 Perish
2 Forsaken Wastes (not sure)
2 Umezawa’s Jitte
Main
13 Swamp
4 Phyrexian Tower
4 Wasteland
4 Dark Ritual
4 Soul Spike
3 Hatred
4 Sarcomancy
4 Vampire Lacerator
4 Dauthi Horror
4 Dauthi Slayer
4 Bloodghast
4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Phyrexian Obliterator
What ends up happening is Negator starts the fight and Obliterator finishes. Also, Soul Spike is an amazing finisher. And also, if you really need to kill something on the board’s its ok for that too. Ideally, though its for finishing off your opponent unexpectedly. I took out the graveyard hate as I realized the deck seems fine without. Sure if they Entomb, Iona and reanimate it before you get anything in play it’s a problem, but you do have a fighting chance with shadow creatures and direct damage of Soul Spike in response.
The reason I don’t run discard in the deck is Leyline. Decks like Show and Tell board in Leyline and make it useless, if they draw it.
Last edited by necrowil; 07-24-2011 at 01:34 AM. Reason: error
Not many decks actually run leyline in the board. Even if they do not having discard seems like you will auto lose to a lot of decks (basically anything faster than you which is quite a bit). Negator has been obsolete since goyf was printed. Sure turn 1 dark rit -> negator is pretty cool but if they even have something like a curse catcher you are either out a land or your negator. And god help you if you are playing zoo. Have you tested vs any tier decks? I can't imagine that list stands a chance vs anything but jank.dec or awfuldraw.match
You have almost no removal and no discard.
Every type of Combo will just go off without any hesitation.
Every kind of Maverick Deck will be bigger than your creatures plus having a lot of removal and counterbackup and since many of your creatures have shadow, he will just walk right into your face.
Zoo is faster than you and can still burn of your shadow stuff. (Fast Obliterator will eat Path)
Merfolk will outplay you by countering and swarming.
Goblins, let's just not talk about it...
Dredge can be faster than you, The Gate is more consistent than you...
Also never forget that after match 1, every U.dec will go all in to counter your Hatred on which u spent 19 life. Your only chance of winning that i see in this list is heavily dependant on Dark Ritual, might it be an unhandled Obliterator or a Hatred. If you can't power that out really early, you just won't win versus most Legacy decks.
For starters, add a decent removal and Discard package. Then the list might be worthwhile to discuss.
What do you guys think about Diregraf Ghoul?
"If you're playing Storm in Legacy, you need to believe that what your deck does is better than what their deck does."
I've been testing MBC on cockatrice for a few days now, and I have to say that it's one of my favorite decks now. It also seems to be a bit more popular than led to believe; I played against 3-4 other people today that were testing very similar builds to mine.
Diregraf Ghoul + Bump in the Night = Black sligh is finally here!
I think the biggest thing is the deep seeded emotional understanding that the right play is the right play regardless of outcomes. The ability to make a decision 5 straight times, lose 5 times because of it, and still make it the 6th time if it's the right play. - Jon Finkel
"Notions of chance and fate are the preoccupation of men engaged in rash undertakings."
Nah dude, we got BURN now! Imma run 4x Bump and 4x SiB for hell of reach.
I think the biggest thing is the deep seeded emotional understanding that the right play is the right play regardless of outcomes. The ability to make a decision 5 straight times, lose 5 times because of it, and still make it the 6th time if it's the right play. - Jon Finkel
"Notions of chance and fate are the preoccupation of men engaged in rash undertakings."
IDK man, Bitterblossom just seems so much better if you need reach. It's every creature you will ever need for the rest of the game.
"If you're playing Storm in Legacy, you need to believe that what your deck does is better than what their deck does."
Anybody else enjoys Bad Moon in monoblack sui? With Bitterblossom and an overabundance of 1-drops, the enchantment is quite potent. Here is my Bad Moon version:
Creatures (20)
4 Diregraf Ghoul
4 Carnophage
4 Vampire Lacerator
4 Dark Confidant
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
Spells (8)
4 Dark Ritual
4 Geth's Verdict
Enchantments (12)
4 Sarcomancy
4 Bitterblossom
4 Bad Moon
Lands (20)
4 Wasteland
16 Swamp
It is a very simple and straightforward list. The strength of Sui lies in its 1 drops and how much you can regurgitate with a Dark Ritual. I couldnt ask for better ways to spend life than Dark Confidant and Bitterblossom.
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
I'd recommend throwing in a few Nighthawks, seeing as how your build results in a lot of life being lost.
I just got back into Magic and decided to update my Suicide Black Deck. Any advice for this deck?
Lands-20
1x Strip Mine
16x Swamps
3x Wasteland
Creatures-16
4x Gatekeeper of Malakir
4x Nantuko Shade
4x Phyrexian Obliterator
4x Vampire Nighthawk
Spells-24
4x Dark Rituals
1x Demonic Tutor
4x Go for the Throat
4x Hymn to Tourach
1x Mind Twist
4x Sinkhole
4x Thoughtseize
1x Vampiric Tutor
1x Yawgmoth’s Will
Side Board-15
4x Extirpate
3x Null Rod
2x Perish
2x Planar Void
4x Powder Keg
Your decklist is for vintage (t1), this website is largely legacy (1.5).
check out the restricted list:
http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazin...rces/sfrlegacy
Yeah, once that is remedied it looks fine. Maybe try using a 1 drop in there, too though.
"If you're playing Storm in Legacy, you need to believe that what your deck does is better than what their deck does."
I have never played Suicide Black in legacy per se but I have casually and I know the archetype and I have always found jitte to be ultra handy.
Thanks for the advice. What should I run instead of 2x tutors, will and mind twist? Just Jitte?
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