View Full Version : Blue Stax....
Hunter245
06-27-2008, 09:06 PM
Alright well after tweaking usually white build of stax, I was like you can splash blue but why not go mono blue
So I took the core of the stax decks which is
4x Trinisphere
4x Chalice
4x Prison Effect
4x Tabernacle Effect
4x Smokestack
4x Crucible
4x Geddon Effect
Then with the mana base atm I'm trying
8x Double Lands
7x Island
2x God's Eye Gate to Reikai
2x Academy Ruins
3x Wasteland
3x Mishra's Factory
The God's Eye land seems cool as a pursuado Flagstones, but it doesn't produce blue mana.... Academy Ruins helps against decks with artifact hate.
So this leaves me with 7 slots or 8 if i cut a stax.
Now Mox diamonds definatly need a inclusion so that's 3 slots left, and I'm thinking of bumpin the land count up to 26. And the fact is blue doesn't have a armeggedon. Oh wait in a tarmogoyf enviroment we do! We have Acid Rain, but you'll say they'll have lands left, but thats why we have wastelands. Now in some games it'll be a dead draw (Like mirror), but Blue stax is a meta choice.
So for the last 3 slots we have the choice of running
Tabernacle land, Sphere of Resistance, Tangle Wire, 26th land
So before we decide on the last slots lets look at our list so far
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
7x Island
2x God's Eye Gate to Reikai
2x Academy Ruins
3x Wasteland
3x Mishra's Factory
4x Trinisphere
4x Chalice
4x Propaganda
4x Pendrell Mists
4x Smokestack
4x Crucible
4x Acid Rain
4x Mox Diamond
3x ?
But before the decklist is done, I’ve wondered is it worth it running blue instead of white, although everything is the same we do lose armegeddon for a situational geddon effect. But do we gain anything? I mean we might be able to run fow? But is the one card loss to great? But I do suppose we can hardcast force easier than a lot of decks. We gain echoing truth in the sb? It seems like a good card that helps mirror matches? All of this is speculation. But I suppose we do gain academy ruins which makes it much easier to deal with a pernicious deed.
And after some testing I realized the current list right now is simply a worse version of white stax… Maybe if we add brainstorm/ponder it might be better but my Conculsion is it’s not worth it. And the only reason I posted this is because I didn’t want this to be a complete waste of my time…..
New List as of July 6th
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
6x Island
2x God's Eye Gate to Reikai
2x Academy Ruins
4x Wasteland
3x Mishra's Factory
1x Cephilid Collisium
4x Trinisphere
4x Chalice
4x Propaganda
4x Pendrell Mists
1x Smokestack
3x Crucible
4x Thirst for Knowledge
4x Mox Diamond
3x Tangle Wire
3x Fabricate
Currently Thinking about -2 Mists, +2 Puca's Mischief
KillemallCFH
06-27-2008, 09:26 PM
The biggest strength of Blue Stax over any other Stax variants is its access to card draw, most notably in the form of Thirst For Knowledge and Meditate. Losing Armageddon is huge, and I'm pretty sure White Stax is better. Nevertheless, I've been toying with Blue Stax off and on, and this is my current Blue Stax list:
// Lands
7 [LRW] Island (1)
2 [BOK] Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai
1 [MOR] Mutavault
4 [TE] Wasteland
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
4 [EX] City of Traitors
4 [4E] Mishra's Factory
// Spells
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
4 [10E] Crucible of Worlds
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
4 [TE] Propaganda
4 [US] Smokestack
4 [TO] Liquify
4 [WL] Pendrell Mists
3 [MR] Thirst for Knowledge
3 [OV] Meditate
// Sideboard
SB: 3 [DS] Trinisphere
SB: 3 [10E] Pithing Needle
SB: 3 [7E] Arcane Laboratory
SB: 4 [TSB] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 2 [REW] Powder Keg
The Liquify spot is obviously an experiment. I had an open slot and was looking for a counterspell that fit the curve. It is pretty close to a hard counter in Legacy, and RFGs annoying things like Loam and Survival (so they can't Eternal Witness it back).
Valtrix
06-27-2008, 09:43 PM
Well, my friend tried to build a good chronostax list. Just a couple suggestions for now, as I don't exactly ahve a ton of thoughts for this.
Intuition: Why not run this is you're running blue? That's seems really good in here. In fact, I'd cut out 2 crucible and something else for this. 4 crucibles is too much in my opinion, I'd run 3 at most. You don't want it as a dead draw later.
Acid rain: This just seems like a bad choice...Lots of decks do play forests, but devoting 4 slots to this card just isn't worth it in my opinion. It's going to be dead a lot, and even when you cast it, it probably won't be that useful.
Thirst for knowledge: Agree with above.
3sphere: I'd cut to three, just because you have a lot of useful stuff already, and this could become a dead draw later. It doesn't deserve a 4-of in my opinion.
I'd also tell you to run force, but it's probably not that good in here because of how few artifacts you run. That's about all I have to say right now...Make sure you run 4x factory, just because it's that good.
If you want to add a little more to your opponent's frustration, you could try Spell Burst. Wash Out might be good against creature decks or enchantress, and makes your lock pieces a little better.
dude 666
06-27-2008, 10:26 PM
What about pirates? Rishadan footpad and rishadan cutpurse along with rishadan ports could be interesting to test out. Maybe figure out a way to make tangle wire work?
Counterspells are bad in stax cause you dont want to leave mana open, you want to be consistently disrupting your opponent through lock pieces.
I completely agree with abusing Meditate though, stax is a perfect place to play it.
Pendrell Mists seems really weak unfortunately :(
KillemallCFH
06-27-2008, 10:38 PM
I had actually been playing Pirates and Ports before playing the Liquifies. In theory they seem good, but they were always underwhelming. Liquifies are probably not going to work out, but I figured it couldn't hurt to try them. I'll probably replace them with 3Spheres main or maybe try out Tangle Wires.
Pendrell Mists is okay. It can't swing like Magus, and it isn't as good without Geddon, but it still serves a purpose
The Rack
06-27-2008, 11:23 PM
Isn't Paradox Haze pretty good in BLue Stax? I mean they sac way more whcih clears the board much faster. That's the only reason I would run Blue Stax over White.
KillemallCFH
06-27-2008, 11:26 PM
I considered Paradox Haze, but it seems so meh. I mean, it's only really good with Stax out, and it's okay with Pendrell Mists out. Besides that, its a dead card. I've never actually tested it, so it could end up being amazing, but on paper it looks so much like a "Danger of Cool Things" kind of thing.
Valtrix
06-27-2008, 11:29 PM
Speaking of paradox haze, I remember when my friend was putting together chronostax... It probably wouldn't work well, but I always thought that slow motion would be fun to try in blue stax...Put it on their creatures, and then you can sacrifice it to smokestack and replay it if you want. That said I think paradox haze is decent. It really just doubles as a second mists/stax/upkeep effects. However, it' useless without anything else, so that's a consideration to keep in mind.
Bruticus
06-27-2008, 11:48 PM
Eater of Days (http://magiccards.info/ds/en/120.html) doubles as a lock piece and win condition.
Hunter245
06-28-2008, 01:43 AM
Wow this got alot of intrest, Kinda resparked the kindle for this deck. Chronatog seems kinda cool with staxs! I thought the card was only for stasis decks lol. Paradox haze does nothing on it's own which is why I don't want to include it because I can imagine drawing two and being like damn it. Lol Eater of days, I would rather run another thirst instead. But this deck performs, like any stax's deck it's just that goblins get's a little harder with rishadan port (Since you run less blue sources), and you don't have a 2/6 wall, but then again they can't remove the mists. I was thinking of the tabernacle land too. Liquify is iffy. I mean i hate reactive answers in a stax deck, I mean i rather dig with thirst for a ruins or a artifact. Meditate seems sweet, but i wonder if the turn will hurt you in testing. If some of you can help test it would save me alot of time.
One note no one said anything about acid rain. Should it be moved to the sb? Also the sb echoing truth is amazing although reactive its sweet against empty the warrens, stax's mirror, and simply any annoying permanant. Maybe our O-Ring.
Finnally the pirates seem sweet! I can imagine like trinisphere-> tangle wire -> pirate!, beat for a couple turns. Seems better that acid rain! I'm thinking of something like this...
// Lands
3 [TE] Wasteland
3 [4E] Mishra's Factory
4 [EX] City of Traitors
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
7 [PT] Island (2)
2 [BOK] Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai
2 [TSP] Academy Ruins
// Creatures
4 [MM] Rishadan Footpad
4 [MM] Rishadan Cutpurse
// Spells
1 [US] Smokestack
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
3 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
4 [DS] Trinisphere
4 [TE] Propaganda
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
3 [MR] Fabricate
4 [NE] Tangle Wire
I'll test to see if fabricate is better than thirst
Mordenkaynen
06-28-2008, 05:58 AM
1. Paradox haze is also usefull with tangle wires.
2. Blue: Puca's Mischief. (replace your Acid Rain with it and you will get their goyfs for trini, for example, instead of destroying some forests which are more likely nonbasic)
Melwis
06-28-2008, 10:07 AM
The problem with Blue Stax if you ask me is that you can't clear the opponents board the same way with White Stax (thanks to Armageddon + Tabernacle effect). Puca's Mischief seems it could take avdvantage of this problem. When I tried the deck out on MWS I had no problem stalling my opponent. But eventually he managed to pay trough Propaganda (since he can play lands with ease without worrying about Armageddon) and so he won. At the end of that turn I had 2 Propagandas, 2 Trinisphere, 1 Tangle Wire, 1 Crucible etc. etc. Now imagine if I had thrown out Mischief. Then I would just start trading his creatures for my permanents (which works just has good on my opponents side btw) and the tables would have been turned. I think a list that looks something like this deserves some testing:
// Lands
7 [ARE] Island (6)
1 [TSP] Academy Ruins
4 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
4 [EX] City of Traitors
4 [TE] Wasteland
// Spells
4 [MR] Thirst for Knowledge
4 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
4 [DS] Trinisphere
2 [SHM] Puca's Mischief
2 [TSP] Paradox Haze
4 [NE] Tangle Wire
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
4 [US] Smokestack
4 [TE] Propaganda
I think TfK is better than Meditate because it always works (Meditate will only work if you have gotten control and locked your opponent down and by then you should have won already). Fabricate might be nice but I think running 4 of every artifact together with TfK should get you what you need (not to mention Fabricate doesn't give you Puca's Mischeif, Paradox Haze, Propaganda nor lands should you need that).
Paradox Haze coupled with either Smokestack or Tangle Wire seems to good not to run but 2 Paradox is probably enough since it's crap in the start and worthless on it's own.
Just my toughts on how the deck should look like. Tell me what you think!
Serbitar
06-28-2008, 12:10 PM
What about Sunder as a Armageddon replacement?
Hunter245
06-28-2008, 12:25 PM
Alright last night it was late and I thought the pirates were amazing. But It's only for one permanent. I thought it was everysingle one and I was like OMG Broken! But after being disgusted I went back to a simple list. Also about acid rain it's not as good because we can simply waste lock them anyway. Sunder might be good, only testing will tell but I want to try the puca's mischief, But I'm not quite sure how well it'll do. But right now I'm going to see if Fabricate is better thatn thirst. Keep on helping guys XD
Ok, I'm going to get a little crazy here and suggest some odd things, just for argument's sake. First, Words of Wind might be an interesting include. I used to toy around with WoW and pirates, but more importantly it has neat synergy with tangle wire, and ties in to the rest of the taxing effects. It effectively makes you draw a tangle wire every turn, while simultaneously fixing the number of permanents your opponent can have on the board. The problem is, of course, that it's effectiveness is dependent on the turn it is played, but that's true for almost every card in Stax
Second, I'd just like to point out that with the large number of 3 costing cards (propaganda, trini, puca's mischief, crucible, thirst) Drift of Phantasms transmutes into a lot of good stuff.
Mordenkaynen
06-28-2008, 02:06 PM
First note is very interesting but I'm not sure if it's not too narrow. Ah sorry, you run pirates, I managed to forget it directly after reading the post. But have you enough permanents to support this tech? It's, say.. four mana for engine plus two permanents for wires (upkeep is before draw, right?)) and words can't be tapped for wires. Seems a little fancy.
Well, about the second one - it's another fabricate, I'm not really sure what is better (mischeif costs 4 actually) and is it easy to pay UU for it. However, increasing the number of propaganda is interesting.
Hunter245
06-30-2008, 01:02 PM
Alright after doing a bunch of testing it seems, that Fabricate is awesome, and the list I use currently run both. Basically I noticed a couple things, I can get color screwed with only 7 + 4 blue sources so I'm bumping it up one more blue source, The way I currently play the deck is more of a tangle wire hold up since it's ties up their mana, and it almost never hurts me. I read the post about Drifts, Its a nice blocker but it gives something to throw their removal at, and I find it hard to cast the transmute cost, Although if i cut down on Non-basics I might be able to try it. Puca's Mischief and Haze seem cool but I don't want to try it atm, If someone else could it would be great.
Now What the hell would be a good sb? I've been trying to find any goodies. What have you all been running?
Well here's my list atm. I'm still trying to fit another island but it's hard...
// Lands
4 [TE] Wasteland
3 [4E] Mishra's Factory
4 [EX] City of Traitors
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
7 [PT] Island (2)
2 [BOK] Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai
2 [TSP] Academy Ruins
// Spells
1 [US] Smokestack
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
3 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
4 [DS] Trinisphere
4 [TE] Propaganda
4 [WL] Pendrell Mists
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
4 [MR] Thirst for Knowledge
3 [MR] Fabricate
3 [NE] Tangle Wire
Now it may seem like a sin to cut a crucible but Fabricate can fetch it and it's not a horrible sight to see crucible destroyed unlike white stax, since we run academy ruins. Btw why not ruin 2 ruins? Although I've drawn both in games it's never really hurt me. They give you huge advantage if your game plan is fow, deed. Because in reality you can't always win the die roll xD. Thoughts and Criticism's would be nice.
Valtrix
06-30-2008, 01:16 PM
Yeah, how about cutting God's eye for islands? They're only "good" with crucible, and even then a 1/1 token for the land is hardly going to do you much good. Granted you do need another win condition, it doesn't seem the right way to go. I'd run 1x Cephalid Colliseum at least...It's another win-con in disguise, since you can make your opponent deck themselves (and gives you blue mana!). Perhaps try 2x Faerie Conclave instead. Also, fabricate seems not as good as intuition. You can keep mana open for factory/ruins/whatever, and you can search for your enchantments too. Also, why only one smokestack? That card is amazing enough to run more than a single copy.
KillemallCFH
06-30-2008, 02:10 PM
I really think it is a mistake to run any less than 4 Smokestacks, even if you do have Fabricate. Unlike White Stax, which has ORing and Geddon + Tabernacle, Blue Stax doesn't have any way to actually get rid of permanents except for Smokestack. In some matchups it is the best card, and there are few matchups where it is actually useless.
A card I have been testing, and loving so far, is Dream Tides (http://magiccards.info/vi/en/31.html). It makes it so Goyf (and every other Thresh creature) can only swing once and against non-green creatures it compliments Propoganda and Pendrell Mists as an additional taxing effect.
Also, I've noticed this deck has a severe weakness to flying creatures. Factories chump/kill ground creatures easily, but flying ones, well, fly right over. I had originally added a Conclave to remedy this but the CIPT is so brutal, esp. if you need to recur it via Crucible. I'm considering replacing it with a 1-of Rainbow Efreet, who can act as a finisher as well as an infinite chump-blocker until I'm able to assemble Smokestacks/Crucible to clear the way.
Has anyone tested In the Eye of Chaos?
idraleo
06-30-2008, 03:20 PM
It seems quite powerful but it hurts you as it did for your opponents...
Roman Candle
06-30-2008, 03:50 PM
Has anyone looked at Rhystic Study? Alongside all of your mana denial, it could give some massive card advantage. It's also pretty disgusting turn 1.
Ray.N
06-30-2008, 04:05 PM
Has anyone looked at Rhystic Study? Alongside all of your mana denial, it could give some massive card advantage. It's also pretty disgusting turn 1.
Mystic Remora is also a card that could be used along those lines.
Melwis
06-30-2008, 04:52 PM
I really think it is a mistake to run any less than 4 Smokestacks, even if you do have Fabricate. Unlike White Stax, which has ORing and Geddon + Tabernacle, Blue Stax doesn't have any way to actually get rid of permanents except for Smokestack. In some matchups it is the best card, and there are few matchups where it is actually useless.
I agree with you that 1 Smokestack is way to low. 2 is guaranteed but I would say 3-4 is probably always for the best. But you are forgeting that Puca's Mischief also handles permanents very well. Infact I can't believe you (and everyone else) don't realise how good the card is as a wincon for this deck. I'm not advising you to auto-include 4 of it in your lists but the 2 I have in my list has been superb! Please just try it out atleast.
A card I have been testing, and loving so far, is Dream Tides (http://magiccards.info/vi/en/31.html). It makes it so Goyf (and every other Thresh creature) can only swing once and against non-green creatures it compliments Propoganda and Pendrell Mists as an additional taxing effect.
I'm not sure about this one but it might warrant an include for the SB atleast since it is very good vs. Threshold I agree. The problem I see is the UU in it's costs. You can't have alot more than around 11-12 blue mana sources in this deck so relying on getting 2 blue mana is not very secure..
Also, I've noticed this deck has a severe weakness to flying creatures. Factories chump/kill ground creatures easily, but flying ones, well, fly right over. I had originally added a Conclave to remedy this but the CIPT is so brutal, esp. if you need to recur it via Crucible. I'm considering replacing it with a 1-of Rainbow Efreet, who can act as a finisher as well as an infinite chump-blocker until I'm able to assemble Smokestacks/Crucible to clear the way.
Throw out Puca's Mischief and those flyers are suddenly turned towards your opponent. Yeah..
Rainbow Efreet is hardly an infinite blocker since you won't be able to constantly maintain 2 blue mana sources.
Tought I'd comment on a few of those cards that has been mentioned aswell:
In the Eye of Chaos - This is probably not a bad SB choice. Switchin it out for TfK in certain matchups might work. I don't think it is MD material tough..
Rhystic Study - In the first few turns this won't be played anyways (Trinisphere, Chalice and/or Tangle Wire are much more important in the start). It won't be played until midgame most of the times and by then your opponent might be able to pay that 1 mana cost. Besides, TfK is way better I would say even tought I haven't tested this one. If you got room to play both than go ahead and try this card out but I don't it will be very good.
Mystic Remora - Strictly no. See Trinisphere and Chalice as for why.
PS: Could anyone give me some feedback on my list? I didn't get any the last time I posted it:
// Lands
1 [TSP] Academy Ruins
8 [ARE] Island (6)
4 [EX] City of Traitors
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
4 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
4 [TE] Wasteland
// Spells
2 [TSP] Paradox Haze
3 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
2 [SHM] Puca's Mischief
4 [US] Smokestack
4 [TE] Propaganda
4 [MR] Thirst for Knowledge
4 [NE] Tangle Wire
4 [DS] Trinisphere
yawg07
06-30-2008, 05:26 PM
Yeah, how about cutting God's eye for islands? They're only "good" with crucible, and even then a 1/1 token for the land is hardly going to do you much good.
Gods' Eye tokens are for Stax.
If you have the Stax Crucible thing going on, you can even ramp stax to 2 indefinitely.
I've noticed this deck has a severe weakness to flying creatures. Factories chump/kill ground creatures easily, but flying ones, well, fly right over. I had originally added a Conclave to remedy this but the CIPT is so brutal, esp. if you need to recur it via Crucible.
How about Blinkmoth Nexus?
Melwis
06-30-2008, 06:04 PM
Gods' Eye tokens are for Stax.
If you have the Stax Crucible thing going on, you can even ramp stax to 2 indefinitely.
How about Blinkmoth Nexus?
Between Blinkmoth, Factory, Gods' Eye, Academy Ruins, Wasteland, Ancient Tombs and City of Traitors, how are you supposed to fit in enough islands?
You clearly have to choose a few of these to run and I don't think Blinkmoth is worth it (altough this would be the best defence against flying creatures I guess). I don't think Gods' Eye is worth it either. Altough i'm not sure about one thing: With 2 counters on Smokestack. Is it possible to choose the land thus making it go to the GY and then choose the token aswell? I doubt it works this way but if it does the land might warrant an include..
Academy Ruins is to good not to run atleast 1 of imo. I am actually even wondering if I should add another one instead of 1 Wasteland or 1 Factory. What do you think?
City and Tombs are both 4-ofs and I think you should atleast have 11 blue sources thus "forcing" you to have atleast 7 islands (I run 8). Mox Diamond is the last 4 sources.
All in all the shell of Blue Stax's landbase should probably be something like:
7-8 Island
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
3-4 Mishra's Factory
3-4 Wasteland
1-2 Academy Ruins
If you run the least amount of all these it gives you 2-3 spots to add in the other lands (assuming 24-25 lands is the best number of lands) but I highly doubt adding either Gods' Eye or Blinkmoth will improve the deck.
Hunter245
06-30-2008, 07:50 PM
Everyone, I understand that Smokestack is a biggie, But honestly This is how most games go....
Turn 1 Chalice/Trini/Wasteland
Turn 2 Crucible/Ghostly Prison/ Pendrell Mists/ TFK/Fab/ Wasteland
Turn 3 Tangle Wire
Turn X+1 Keep oppenent mana denied and unable to harm you with recurring wires
Then if they don't concede by then you Fab -> Smokestack and win...
This is simply a more common scenario But essantially you lock the oppenent out with wires more often then Stax. Because we simply don't have a card called armegeddon to make it so stax's are getting rid of problem permanents.
Puca's Mischief Is a card I'll eventually get to test out (I thought it was double U cost) So now I'll try it out but Melwis I hate paradox haze... I'd cut a factory for a ruins, I did that and haven't looked back since. Also what is your sb melwis? I'm going to try the mischief, but i have none right now, Guess that's what mws is for
In the eyes of chaos I thought of running it in the intial decklist but I don't play it since it's a dead card in the begining of the game. Also I do not own it but I simply think its overkill.
But I really want to see some sb's because most of the time mine isn't used (Bad thing)
The only thing used constantly is the echoing truths which are amazing,,,
4 Echoing Truth
4 Needle
3 EE/ Keg
1 Island
3 Chill
Thats my sb atm.
Jaiminho
06-30-2008, 08:20 PM
Altough i'm not sure about one thing: With 2 counters on Smokestack. Is it possible to choose the land thus making it go to the GY and then choose the token aswell? I doubt it works this way but if it does the land might warrant an include..
You need to sacrifice two permanents simultaneously, so you can only use that token for your next turn's trigger.
Bourgeoise
06-30-2008, 10:01 PM
The thing I would like to know is why nobody is testing intuition as one of the draw spells. I saw someone mention it on the first page but none of the posters here have even suggested that they have tested it.
It grabs you (for example) 2x crucible/1x Academy ruins, if you have one of those two cards already then you get the other one and grab 2 lock pieces. If it gets down to it you can use it to fetch up your enchantments or lands even, which fabricate cannot do. Get your wastelock together, get your artifact recursion going, etc. Fabricate grabs you one piece and it has to be an artifact, has to be done at sorcery speed, and doesn't get you ahead at all in terms of card advantage.
Try it out I think this deck can abuse intuition.
Hunter245
07-01-2008, 12:23 PM
Yeah, It's on my list of things to do, I just like to actually get a general idea by you know actual testing, which I usually get to do about an hour and a half a day. It seems good, but I'll try em out after the mischiefs. I mean it seems broken and I've been meaning to pick them up so now will be a good time, I'm loving the idea. Also I highly recommend running the tabernacle land if you got em. We need the extra effect.
Seriously let's hear some sb tech since I don't have much time to brainstorm... Ghost Quarter may be good but I like the island since it's a nonbasic.
Alright for some results, although they may be wacked due to my bad luck..
Aggro Loam, It depends on if you get chalice, Wastelock helps alot in this match up, and if they drop crusher you go Yay! But thoughtseize sucks. It's essantially in favor of the die roll, which I seem to lose about everyround. Even losing the die roll every match it went with me going 2-1 most of the time, except for when you thirst getting 3 lands, then thirst again getting 3 more lands, lol.
Threshold- Oooo. I never seem to draw chalice.... After mulling both games.. It seems i can never draw into any goodies for the couple of games. I don't see chalice, propaganda, and even wasteland! Kinda frustated me pretty bad, when I was playing around daze but he got 3 fow.... and of course I lost just about every die roll. Need to test this more
White Stax, I love seeing this deck because most people don't know how to play this, and since I even play white stax, I find this matchup good, because sbing out trini for echoing truth. You just gotta abuse their smokestacks for them, And know when to drop the truth.
Dragon Stompy, Faerie Stompy, Eva Green, are on my lists to do test, with my list. So if some people can test dreadnought various decks, it would help alot.
Btw Help create a solid sb with me.... I seem to only use it once in awhile and if I'm on the draw.
Mordenkaynen
07-03-2008, 09:57 AM
Another (much more junky) card to consider: Quicksilver Fountain.
Sure, meta-depended choice; in the right meta seems interesting while comboing with smokestack. Also allows some tricky play (not sacrificing city, not getting damage from tomb). Can be in SB.
Before making a SB we have to understand what match ups are bad. Or if anybody does, tell please.
Hunter245
07-03-2008, 11:39 AM
Alright well I did some testing but EDH has me distracted atm.
Faeire Stopmy- Hard as hell match-up that is in their favor due to they can hold 2 mana which is un tangleable. Also they run equipment which lowers tangles uses. Echoing Truth helps but I don't think this a good match up at all
Eva Green- Erh, Pretty bad unless you go first and your hand doesnt lose a propaganda. But if you play it is winnable definatly, But otherwise it's a uphill battle, Not as hard as faeire Stopmy but Managable.
Also I'm afraid that my deck will run into time, So since I picked up two Puca's yestorday here am I hoping that is the answer. Also Intial Testing Shows that Intuition can get everything you need but takes 2 turns which you won't neccessaryly have against aggro, Gold against control though, More testing with it will be needed.
Well I'm off to play EDH!
Clark Kant
07-03-2008, 01:44 PM
This may warrant consideration in Blue Stax...
Dominus of Fealty UUUUU
Creature - Spirit Avatar
Flying
At the beginning of your upkeep, untap and gain control of target permanent until end of turn.
It gains haste until end of turn.
4/4
Take your opponents best card, and sac it to Smokestack, plus beat for 4 each turn (or take your opponents Dreadnought and just beat for 16).
Seems like a strong finisher.
KillemallCFH
07-03-2008, 01:48 PM
If it costed 2UU then it would probably be worth considering, but UUUU is nigh impossible for Blue Stax to get consistently.
Clark Kant
07-03-2008, 01:56 PM
Nevermind, I didn't notice that this deck runs the Fairie Stompy manabase.
pingveno
07-03-2008, 07:08 PM
why not try chronotog in a build like this? same idea as the old stasis builds, skip your turn while your opponent is tapping 4 permanents a turn with tangle wire and saccing two others with stax. you swing for 4, they take two turns and sac some stuff, rinse, repeat.
Natthew
07-03-2008, 09:00 PM
What about ancestral vision? It's playable after you drop chalice, and can get you a bunch of lock pieces when you don't want to spend mana on draw spells. It's a shitty topdeck and might draw you cards too late, though.
Also, I've been considering using Meloku as a finisher/means of recurring permanents. Hard locks don't typically need finishers, but getting a factory extirpated pretty much equals scoop.
Hunter245
07-06-2008, 06:21 PM
Alright back to playing from the 4th of July weekend! I've been brainstorming and I'm thinking maybe I should run stasis? I dunno, Just brainstorming ways to get past time, Still going to try Puca's Mischief.
Also please don't post mindless garbage, Please test before suggesting a new card.
I'm updating the first post so take a gander.
BenKossman
07-06-2008, 08:31 PM
I really like the idea of this deck particularly in regards to Abusing Meditate w/smokestack which just seems broken as hell to me. Here's how I would build it...
Artifact:28
4 Smokestack
4 Tangle Wire
4 Trinisphere
4 Crucible of Worlds
4 Sphere of Resistance
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
Blue:10
1 Upheaval
1 March of the Machines
4 Propaganda
4 Meditate
Land:22
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Academy Ruins
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
2 Tolaria West
6 Island
Hunter245
07-14-2008, 09:33 PM
Well i Forgot to post this before I left, on Vacation, and I was like hmmm.. Free Wifi so I just checked the site out, and nothing seemed to be done :(
Well After testing Puca's Mischief I realized It only helped in certain matchups/situations. Like Against dreadnought and Threshh If you play it right it can be devastating, But against anything Else I'm like damn I drew this again! So into the sb it goes! Right now I'm thinking if even Cephilid Collisium is worth bumping up the # or cutting it for a island. What is your thoughts on mischief in the sb?
Bourgeoise
07-15-2008, 07:47 AM
In regards to your updated list, I don't know why you still insist on running fabricate when there is a card called intuition that just does so much more for the deck. Fabricate - sorcery - get an artifact. Intuition - Instant - search for any three cards and you get one in hand and two to the bin. Just the fact that it is instant speed makes it better in my book, it can still get what you wanted from the fabricate, but say you have yourself an academy ruins. You can the search for crucible and any two lock pieces, essentially gaining access to three relevant cards.
This deck really wants to abuse the smokestack as much as possible as well so running only one seems like a weak choice seeing that blue has no access to an armageddon effect like white stax does.
The coliseum seems like a neat idea but if you hit threshold you are probably already winning I would think, though the build I have runs a little differently than this one.
I also went down to 1 Academy ruins and cut god's eye completely in favor of more blue sources. Bumping Mishra's factory up to four can't hurt either since it is usually your win con and god's eye tokens have dissynergy with your pendrell mists.
acchia85
09-04-2008, 01:56 PM
is possible inserert in the deck a new pw??
KillemallCFH
09-04-2008, 02:00 PM
is possible inserert in the deck a new pw??I'm sorry, but I have no idea what you just said.
EDIT: Oh... You're talking about the new planeswalker. Gotcha. Seems like it might be too slow, but it is definitely worth testing.
acchia85
09-04-2008, 02:14 PM
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78048
this bad boy :cry: :cry:
Skeggi
09-04-2008, 02:21 PM
Stax + Tezzeret is being explored here (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10966).
Arkham
09-11-2008, 06:33 PM
Hey, I've been trying to tinker with Blue Stax for awhile now and I was just wondering. Given the dilemma with there not really being any blue form of armageddon, has anyone giving any consideration to Parallax Tide? Virtually the same cost and it can remove up to five lands for as many turns as it has fading counters on it. It isn't a permanent solution by any means, but taking a bite of 5 lands out of your opponent for one whole turn could mean something if you're in a clinch.
Thoughts?
Hey, I've been trying to tinker with Blue Stax for awhile now and I was just wondering. Given the dilemma with there not really being any blue form of armageddon, has anyone giving any consideration to Parallax Tide? Virtually the same cost and it can remove up to five lands for as many turns as it has fading counters on it. It isn't a permanent solution by any means, but taking a bite of 5 lands out of your opponent for one whole turn could mean something if you're in a clinch.
Thoughts?
It can serve as a one-sided, RFG Armageddon if you manage to remove all the counters, then Stifle/Trickbind the leaves-play trigger.
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