[Deck Design] Monogreen Control

[MGC_player]

Green control has always been a somewhat interesting archetype to me (mostly due to the WTF? expressions people have on their faces after a deck like that is played.) While this is fun and great, its viability in a competitive environment is questionable. After playing with Legion Land Loss and a Green Chalice Control variant I've come to realize that most Green Control decks that I have played focus on the land destruction aspect of Green as a form of disruption. Looking on Gatherer, there appears to be a number of Green control cards available but are not really being used. Looking at a variety of green cards one evening, my friend and I actually sat down, assembled, and proxied parts of a monogreen control deck that does not revolve around land destruction but board control. It feels so fundamentally wrong (especially using Berserk as creature removal), but actually works pretty well.

Monogreen Control V 1.0
Removal: 14
4 Hailstorm
4 Sandstorm
4 Berserk
2 Desert Twister

Creatures: 23
4 Wall of Roots
4 Yavimaya Elder
4 Sakura-Tribe Elder
3 Silklash Spider
2 Vexing Shusher
2 Carven Caryatid

Token Generator
4 Centaur Glade

Lands: 23
4 Tranquil Thicket
2 Slippery Karst
4 Mishra’s Factory
13 Forest

Sideboard
4 Pithing Needle
2 Vexing Shusher
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Krosan Grip
3 Beacon of Creation

As far as how it functions it clogs the board so that nothing can really get through. Once the token generators are online, you just simply outnumber them and eventually swarm in for the kill. While there really are no card drawing effects, the deck thins its land very well which allows for very good card quality. Using the manabase as part of the can trip aspect of the deck actually works to its advantage so that lands are not necessarily dead draws. Preliminary testing shows promise since it was able to hold its own with some competitive type 2 decks I tested it against (just playing for fun with a friend). I haven't tested it yet against any Legacy decks yet, but that will hopefully be done in the next week or two. Combo right now seems very problematic for the deck, so I probably will switch the Beacons and a Shusher in the SB to Chalices or Thorn of Amethysts. I'd like to fit in a Garruk or two in there somewhere, but I'm not really sure what I would take out for it.

The cards we thought about using for Green Control include:
Stunted Growth
Razormane Masticore
Savage Conception
Snakeform
Trinisphere
Goyf
Worm Harvest
Life from the Loam
Wort the Raidmother
Overbeing of Myth
Deus of Calamity
Gaea's Blessing
Unyaro Bees
Xantid Swarm
City of Solitude
Dosan the Falling Leaf
Unyaro Bee Sting
Bearscape
Crush of Wurms
Words of Wilding
Treetop Village
Mutavault
Crucible of Worlds
Wasteland
Penumbra creatures
Various Token Generators
Multitude of Green LD cards

Thoughts and suggestions? Also feel free to post your own monogreen control list since this thread is for designing the most competitive Green control list possible.

[goldenj]

This seems just hopelessly slow and irrelevant. I can't see it having game against any of the dtb except maybe goyf sligh, and ... not even really that. It just doesn't do anything unfair.

If green control is going to be done, it would probably have to be around mana denial, like trinisphere, tangle wire/winter orb, plow under, etc. In legacy you need to be disrupting your opponent or going so fast that they're hoping to disrupt you.

4 wasteland
4-8 treetop/mishra
4 needle
4 trinisphere
4-8 elves (rofellos? sak-tribe?) Chrome mox?
4 shusher
4 plow under
2-4 kill condition (kodama, goyf (4 of), beacon)

maybe 4 winter orb+4 quirion ranger? Smokestack+crucible?

Regardless, it's hard to justify avoiding black with deed and thoughtseize/duress.

Good luck!

[MGC_player]

This is more or less a thought experiment for me since this is somewhat off the beaten path.

I've gone the mana denial route already and even that is somewhat questionable due to most decks in legacy being to operate with one to 2 mana. I'll see about trying some of the ideas from my original Green Chalice control build. Smokestack might actually make its way into the list since it is a source of constant removal and with token generators, it isn't really much of a problem.

[Forbiddian]

The deck looks to have a solid matchup vs. creature decks, but it looks horribly inefficient at stopping any non-creature threats. Or even at stopping creature threats that don't swing you.

I know it's supposed to be just-for-fun, but I think this deck will have REALLY weak matchups vs. everything except aggro. I don't even think it could theoretically win game 1 vs. any sort of combo deck. You'd be relying on a 15 card sideboard to shore up all your control and combo matchups.


I mean, there's a REASON why Green tries to disrupt land. Pretty much every deck in legacy is hurt by landkill (so you're guaranteed that your Stone Rains will be worth something), and land destruction = Timewalk against most decks.

I don't know, I just can't see this deck beating Iggy or anything else for that matter.

[montanhas18]

I'm not sure this will help or not, but maybe it will give you come idea.

Today on WotC site, Flores brought up a mono-green control deck (T2, obviously). I'll save you the trip, here's the list and his comments:

// Doug McKay - 2nd Place - New York - Rochester - 8/31
// Main Deck
4 Fire-Lit Thicket
12 Forest
4 Mosswort Bridge
4 Mutavault

2 Chameleon Colossus
4 Cloudthresher
4 Devoted Druid
4 Kitchen Finks
4 Woodfall Primus

4 Dramatic Entrance
4 Fertile Ground
4 Firespout
3 Mercy Killing
3 Primal Command

// Sideboard
2 Faerie Macabre
3 Flame Javelin
3 Grim Poppet
4 Lignify
2 Oversoul of Dusk
1 Primal Command

"This is a pretty cool deck, I think you will agree... Different, and just one match out of the blue envelope.

Doug McKay's mono-green deck was heavy on the mana acceleration, and capable of deploying some pretty serious hitters. Not just the (arguably) best card in the Block (Kitchen Finks), or gigantic Faeries-killer Cloudthresher, either. Woodfall Primus is like nothing many opponents will have ever seen. A huge mana cost (eight!) makes Woodfall Primus unattractive for most players, but if it sticks against a positional board- or card-advantage deck like Quick 'n Toast? Ka-blooey!

Woodfall Primus is gigantic, bigger than almost every other commonly played creature. Even if you put a Cloudthresher in front of it... Is that good? There goes another Vindicate. If you put something else in front of it? You can't really chump Woodfall Primus out of the game; it's too big and it has that magic one-word first line: trample.

McKay played Dramatic Entrance—the maximum number in fact—in order to take some of the edge off of Woodfall Primus; because Dramatic Entrance is an instant, that could make combat pretty disgusting. Use your imagination.

While McKay's deck was more or less mono-green, his eight (or so) red dual lands allowed him to murder the ground with Firespout; in a cool twist we haven't really seen before, Doug could run the Flame Javelins out of his sideboard as a "colorless" spell, or reduce the mana cost a wee bit with his light red support."

[MTG Guru]

Green control has always been a somewhat interesting archetype to me (mostly due to the WTF? expressions people have on their faces after a deck like that is played.) While this is fun and great, its viability in a competitive environment is questionable. After playing with Legion Land Loss and a Green Chalice Control variant I've come to realize that most Green Control decks that I have played focus on the land destruction aspect of Green as a form of disruption. Looking on Gatherer, there appears to be a number of Green control cards available but are not really being used. Looking at a variety of green cards one evening, my friend and I actually sat down, assembled, and proxied parts of a monogreen control deck that does not revolve around land destruction but board control. It feels so fundamentally wrong (especially using Berserk as creature removal), but actually works pretty well.

Monogreen Control V 1.0
Removal: 14
4 Hailstorm
4 Sandstorm
4 Berserk
2 Desert Twister

Creatures: 23
4 Wall of Roots
4 Yavimaya Elder
4 Sakura-Tribe Elder
3 Silklash Spider
2 Vexing Shusher
2 Carven Caryatid

Token Generator
4 Centaur Glade

Lands: 23
4 Tranquil Thicket
2 Slippery Karst
4 Mishra’s Factory
13 Forest

Sideboard
4 Pithing Needle
2 Vexing Shusher
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Krosan Grip
3 Beacon of Creation

As far as how it functions it clogs the board so that nothing can really get through. Once the token generators are online, you just simply outnumber them and eventually swarm in for the kill. While there really are no card drawing effects, the deck thins its land very well which allows for very good card quality. Using the manabase as part of the can trip aspect of the deck actually works to its advantage so that lands are not necessarily dead draws. Preliminary testing shows promise since it was able to hold its own with some competitive type 2 decks I tested it against (just playing for fun with a friend). I haven't tested it yet against any Legacy decks yet, but that will hopefully be done in the next week or two. Combo right now seems very problematic for the deck, so I probably will switch the Beacons and a Shusher in the SB to Chalices or Thorn of Amethysts. I'd like to fit in a Garruk or two in there somewhere, but I'm not really sure what I would take out for it.

The cards we thought about using for Green Control include:
Stunted Growth
Razormane Masticore
Savage Conception
Snakeform
Trinisphere
Goyf
Worm Harvest
Life from the Loam
Wort the Raidmother
Overbeing of Myth
Deus of Calamity
Gaea's Blessing
Unyaro Bees
Xantid Swarm
City of Solitude
Dosan the Falling Leaf
Unyaro Bee Sting
Bearscape
Crush of Wurms
Words of Wilding
Treetop Village
Mutavault
Crucible of Worlds
Wasteland
Penumbra creatures
Various Token Generators
Multitude of Green LD cards

Thoughts and suggestions? Also feel free to post your own monogreen control list since this thread is for designing the most competitive Green control list possible.

Why do you play Berserk, all of your creatures are pint size. Spot Removal?

[Mantis]

Apart from being able to run the Stompy manabase I see no reasons not to splash black and play Pernicious Deed instead of Hailstorm and Sandstorm, those just seem bad.

Also, you desperately need a way to gain cardadvantage. Garruk, Harmonize, Sylvan Library, Loam+cycling lands, Eternal Witness or even Magus of the Library can be considered.

As for removal, consider Engineered Explosives (even with only one color its better than Sandstorm) or Powder Keg.

Gigapede can be used to finish the match and can be searched up by perhaps using a Living Wish toolbox.

Anyway, just throwing some ideas out there, good luck with the deck!

[SuckerPunch]

In addition to Deed, the black splash also gives you Putrefy (and that Deed like Green/Black split card - Life/Death I believe).

Here are some cards that are natural fits into green control decks that are worth a look...

Snakeform (assuming you play a decent number of creatures/potential blockers)
Kitchen Finks
Wickerbough Elder
Krosan Tusker

I would definately play Krosan Tusker as atleast a 2 of in any green control deck.


If you don't want to play creatures at all, here is an interesting (combo) direction to go...

4 Defense of the Heart
X Tooth and Nail
X Forbidden Orchard
2 Kiki Jiki (Combo Win)
2 Pestermite (Combo Win)
4 Proteus Staff
X Mishra's Factory
X Hidden Gibbons
X Hidden Herd

I would do a search for Truffle Shuffle. It should be a deck that you'll enjoy.

[MTG Guru]

(and that Deed like Green/Black split card - Life/Death I believe).

I think you mean Crime/Punishment.

I also second the black splash. It also makes Engineered Explosives a better card and you can also run efficient removal such Smother. I'm not sure if the deck we result in developing, will be any better than Truffle Shuffle, though.

[MGC_player]

Berserk is there for creature removal.

Many interesting ideas being tossed around so I'll definitely give a few of them a whirl. Powder Keg is definitely something new I'll try in the deck. The loam engine is another possibility. I haven't really thought of using Finks yet so that is a new thing to try. I was thinking of running signets so that I can have access to three colors which could make engineered explosives much better (since I don't have any Deeds at the moment). Tornado was one that was suggested as well.

[The_Red_Panda]

Berserk is there for creature removal.

You know that the creature has to attack, and you have to play berserk before combat damage is dealt, right? The oracle for berserk is:

Play Berserk only before the combat damage step.
Target creature gains trample and gets +X/+0 until end of turn, where X is its power. At end of turn, destroy that creature if it attacked this turn.



So I really don't see you using it for creature removal, unless you're willing to take double-damage for a turn to get rid of an opposing creature.

[MGC_player]

Mistake on my part regarding Berserk then.
Lignify would probably be the next option for spot removal.