Helm of Iggy Pop (Leyline, Helm, Tendrils Combo)

[Pulp_Fiction]

Alright, I have been getting tired of hearing about the "new (recently discovered)" combo of Leyline of the Void and Helm of Obedience. But after reading Kevin Binswanger's article "A Legacy Mixed Bag" which featured a decklist for a Iggy Helm build, I started to really like the idea of this deck. I have been toying around with this build for a little while and it is very consistent and mulligans very well:

4x Mystical Tutor
4x Dark Ritual
4x Cabal Ritual
4x Brainstorm
4x Leyline of the Void
4x Ill-Gotten Gains
4x Infernal Tutor
4x Lotus Petal
4x Lion's Eye Diamond
3x Ponder
2x Helm of Obebience
1x Tendrils of Agony
1x Enlightened Tutor
1x Wipe Away
4x Flooded Strand
4x Polluted Delta
2x Underground Sea
1x Tundra
1x Scrubland
2x Portal 3 Kingdoms Islands
2x Portal 3 Kingdoms Swamps

The SB is all meta dependant but some to highly consider would be: Wipe Away/Echoing Truth, Rebuild/Hurkyl's Recall, Massacre, Dark Condidant, Orim's Chant, and Empty the Warrens. Now I have not done any testing of this deck but I have high hopes for it. I think this will be one of the hardest fucking decks to SB for especially against Thresh, it will take some time to figure out what works; and deciding on when to SB out the Leyline combo, lots of choices to make. Also, with the addition of Leyline to the main this opens up the ability of playing useful hand destruction against Blue control decks, since IGG just brought everything back, Chant seems to solve most problems, so will this deck be better with hand destruction or Chant?

Card choices are fairly self explanatory. I am not sure 4x IGG is right however, the ability to Mindtwist your opponent is just so strong. Now it won't happen on the play very much but the fact you can remove your opponent's hand from the game on turns 1-3 with startling regularity I think is just to good to pass up. This acts as another "combo" assisted by Leyline. I always thought 2x Tendrils of Agony was to many in Iggy Pop so I cut it down to 1. Helm of Possession is just right at 2, you could possibly go to 3 but you don't want to consistently see them with Brainstorms and Ponders.

Other cards which may be right for the deck: Intuition, Grim Tutor, more Enlightened Tutors, Street Wraith, Tainted Pact, Spoils of the Vault, Fabricate, etc. There are a lot more, should these cards be included in this deck? Please only comment on this deck if you have goldfished or playtested this build OR actually know how to play combo decks that aren't Belcher.

[thefreakaccident]

I think it is a necessity for all combo decks nowadays to play some number of protection spells to combat the current environment.


I think the generally agreed upon number is somewhere between 5-8, generally it varies on the speed and consistency of the deck itself.


How 'fast' do you think this deck is, is it just as fast as it used to be?


With that question in mind, why play this over other current combo decks?

It seems to me that FT is a good place to start as that was the excepted 'evolution' of this, and therefore, the natural progression that came through testing and new sets.


If you want this deck to be competative, then you should look at the more adapted builds of tendrils combo, and then suit it to your needs.

I do like the addition of the helms, although I feel as if you are becoming too reliant on leyline... 4 Igg for example.

[Skeggi]

That's a 60 card list with 8 Mystical Tutors. I know Legacy is not Vintage, but this is pushing it mate :wink: Also, instead of Helm of Possesion I'd run Helm of Obedience :tongue:

A bit more serious, a combo list without Orim's Chant seems like asking for trouble. There also seems to be a distinct lack of FoW and Brainstorm.

[m03]

That's a 60 card list with 8 Mystical Tutors. I know Legacy is not Vintage, but this is pushing it mate

I'll bet that those extra 4 were supposed to be Personal Tutors.

[DeathwingZERO]

Personally, I'd think:

-4 Mystical Tutor
-1 Enlightened Tutor
-1 Island
-1 Cabal Ritual
-1 Infernal Tutor

for:

+4 Orim's Chant
+3 Thoughtseize
+1 Tundra

Might be a good start. 7 pieces of protection, a second white source to guarantee Chant going off if stalled long enough, and no need to topdeck into whatever you've tried getting is pretty good.

I was never a fan of the tutors that required putting anything on top in combo decks because of the need of Brainstorm/Ponder or EoT cast Tutor = slow. I also don't believe 4 Infernals is worth it, as they tend to clump in the hand, or require LED in order to actually get something you really want. Tendrils seems like the secondary kill for the deck, so the Infernal chain doesn't seem to be a necessity as a backup plan.

[Pulp_Fiction]

@ Skeggi and m03: Fixed the errors in the post, the extra 4x Mystical Tutors were supposed to be 4x Brainstorm.

@ freak accident: It really isn't that reliant on Leyline of the Void but Leyline seems to be very useful, especially against other IGG based storm decks. It also makes things very easy against Ichorid. However it does prove to be a useless topdeck later on, but it doesn't really clog up your deck much at all. I am trying to decide on whether I like 4x IGG or 3x. The Mindtwist ability is just so strong and it buys you lots of time to finish them off with little to no potential disruption. IGG also isn't a totally useless topdeck later on but there are times when I have wanted to see other cards. Not sure of the correct number but I really like 4x.

@ Deathwing: I LOVE Infernal Tutor in the deck. It is part of the reason this deck consistently kills on turns 2-4. There are times when I needed threshold and had Lotus Petal in hand and on turn 2 Tutored for another Petal and went off with a thresholded Cabal Ritual, into IGG bringing back Infernal FtW the next turn. I also agree that the Mystical Tutors are slow but they make turn 2 Mindtwist very possible should you need to do so and I just like them in the deck. I don't think a deck like this should run Chant and Thoughtseize in the main. It is something to consider but as it is the deck already has a few useless topdecks and those will just add additional clutter to the deck. That said, I am not a fan at all of Fetchland Tendrils or TES, I just simply don't like how the decks play. This feels somewhat similar to the original builds of FT with Mysticals and Street Wraith, but it plays just like Grim Iggy with a new twist!

[DeathwingZERO]

I understand not wanting clutter, but even IGGy ended up going the route of Chant, as game one is crucial going blind against opponents. I would say a deck like this has far more ability to both cast and make use of Chant or Seize than TES, as your curve isn't nearly as big (with the exception of IGG and Helm + activation, of course), and you aren't as invested in core mana with draw 4s etc.

If you are set on having no protection in the maindeck, have you worked out ideas on sideboarding? The biggest problem I had with the pre-Chant IGGy lists was going up against anything Thresh, since they had incredibly fast counters and mage from the board in the white splash. Now with Counterbalance running rampant on decks packing 0-2cc heavy, have you had any testing against any Thresh builds or Thresh/Landstill variants?

EDIT: Also, I'm also a fan of Infernal, but I've never been happy with decks packing it as a 4 of. Have you ever had hands where one or two of them just sit there because you don't want to have to go after whatever is in your hand, only to dump the second one when you finally get an LED, or use it just to get something that wasn't worth the investment? I found that happening an awful lot in both TES and IGGy, and hated the idea of having more than 3 of them for that reason. It's not an essential opening hand card, and 3 are enough to chain tricks out of.

I'll see about proxying this up and trying out the original list and some different changes. May take some time for further info though, as I'm going to be very busy these next few weeks.

[Forbiddian]

I wondered when Helm would get ported into Iggy Pop as a random win, which already MDs 4x Leyline of the Void.

I didn't think that it would change the deck much other than like 1 or 2 cards out for Helms and then something else.



After getting LotV out, IGG seems just as powerful as Helm, but I thought one problem with IggyPop was it runs out of steam with LotV in play and then no way to resolve IGG.

With Helms, it'd be harder to stop, but I didn't think this would facilitate an entirely new deck coming out. Are you sure this is stronger than the IGG decks with just 1 or 2 Helms in?

[Pulp_Fiction]

I have no idea how many Helm of Possession should be in the deck. I am really liking 2x and 1x Enlightened Tutor but there are tons of different directions the deck can go in. I was hoping with this thread to get some people thinking about Iggy Pop again as the meta seems ok for a deck like this to step back in so-to-speak. Here is a link to a bunch of old Iggy lists and IMOP the best version is the one played by Michael Bomholt at Gencon 07 http://www.deckcheck.net/list.php?deck=Iggy+Pop
As far as benefits of playing this over FT or TES, I personally don't like either deck. I have proxied up Doomday more than a few times, I really want to like the deck but I just hate how it plays. The reason to play this deck over some other storm combo is simply IGG, Leyline, and Helm. They give you alternate outs to hate cards. You don't have to actually storm out to win, similar to Belcher, you just get Leyline in play and drop Helm. Or the Legacy Mindtwist, another reason to run this deck. Does it really need Chant in the main? Should it run Grim Tutor? Would Dark Confidant be good in the main? Should Thoughtseize and Duress be run anywhere? These are the kinds of things that need to be addressed. I personally like a combo deck like this that doesn't play Chant in the main because I always seem to draw all my protection spells when I shouldn't. Thats the reason I am not a fan of FT and TES, I think they play to many protection spells and they clog up your hand and slow the deck down (JMOP nothing against either proven deck). I found the same problem with iPop Negation, it ran 4x Chant, 4x Leyline, and 4x Thoughtseize/Duress main. It seems like a lot of the storm combo decks focus more on not losing instead of winning.

With that said please post any helpful comments on how to make this deck better, if you think the deck needs to play protection spells post a list but also explain why this plan is better. I also thought of a totally new strategy, what about a man-plan in the SB? Running 16 lands can have a big benefit. Should something like this be considered:

4x Tomb of Urami
3x Tombstalker
3x Avatar of Discord/Sea Drake
3x Rebuild
2x Wipe Away

This could be potentially amazing against Thresh. Something to consider.

[GreenOne]

Why would you run Enlightened Tutor instead of Lim-Dul's Vault?

LDV Finds both protection, combo#1 and#2, has a nice sinergy with Brainstorm and Ponder and stacks 5 cards in the deck, opposed to 1. It's also on your main color.

I'd run your list -1 Mystical -1 E.Tutor (-1 Ill Gotten Gains) +2/3 LDV
Testing will show if LDV should replace Mysticals entirely.

I did no testing at all, just pure speculation by a combo player, but i like the idea of such a combo.

Oh, some protection is needed too.

[Michael Keller]

Maybe it's just me, but the main list should be running Helm of Obedience, not Helm of Possession. Big difference.

[Pulp_Fiction]

Took this to a tournament last night:
4x Mystical Tutor
4x Dark Ritual
4x Cabal Ritual
4x Brainstorm
4x Leyline of the Void
4x Ill-Gotten Gains
4x Infernal Tutor
4x Lotus Petal
4x Lion's Eye Diamond
3x Ponder
2x Helm of Obebience
1x Tendrils of Agony
1x Enlightened Tutor
1x Wipe Away
4x Flooded Strand
4x Polluted Delta
2x Underground Sea
1x Tundra
1x Scrubland
2x Snow-Covered Island
2x Snow-Covered Swamp

SB
4x Tomb of Urami
3x Tombstalker
4x Thoughtseize
2x Rebuild
2x Wipe Away

I did terrible, finishing 1-3 with the bye!!!!!!!!!!! But this deck really has a LOT of potential, and 2 of the matches I lost, both opponent's topdecked 4 cards in a row to win!!!!!!!!!! Short tournament report:

Round 1 White Weenie w/ 3x True Believer and 4x Orim's Chant in the main
g1: I win turn 3 very easily with Tendrils.
g2: I open with Leyline and remove his entire hand from the game while he has only Isamaru and a plains in play. In succession he draws: plains, True Believer, Chant, Chant. WTF! I lose after I manaburn for 5 and die to wussy creatures.
g3: The bad luck continues, we both mull to 5 and he keeps a NO LAND HAND on the draw. His next 4 draws are lands!!!! He also is keeping 1x white mana open ..... I am trying to set up for the Helm win but he drops True Believer AGAIN on turn 4 and has fucking double Chant backup. Nightmare scenario for me.

Round 2 Stiflenought
g1: Turn 2 Stiflenought with double Force of Will back up .... yep I lost.
g2: Turn 2 Tombstalker wins ths game uncontested.
g3: I can't get a fucking hand with Leyline and settle for 6 cards with Wipe Away and some cantrips. I get stuck on 1 land and lost to counters on my Leyline attempt then to Mishra's Factorys.

Round 3 Recruiter Aluren
g1: This is my buddy Josh and we are both in the no chance in hell bracket and laugh about it. But this game is far from funny :) He is on the play and I Mindtwist him while he has Tropical Island, Bayou, and Wall of Roots in play. His next 3 draws in a row are as follows: Thoughtseize (getting my other IGG), Imperial Recruiter, Intuition (EOT fetching his last 3 Aluren), and a land to make me lose. He would have died to Helm the next turn, I just had mana problems all game, stuck on one land constantly.
g2: Mull to 5 and proceeded to lose promptly to Aluren on turn 3 + Imperial Recruiter. I just could not get a break. 16 lands + 7 cantrips and I consistently got stuck on 1. Nothing I could do.

It was a good tournament, 3/4 of the field was playing some form of gaybluecounters.dec and I played this deck simply because ... I wanted to. The semi-man plan SB is actually pretty good and Wipe Away is hot against Stiflenought. This deck is not bad at all but it needs some more tweaking. I think I am going to test out Lim-Dul's Vault like Green One suggested.

[Pulp_Fiction]

After a little thought and goldfishing of a few other combo decks like TES and FT there really is no good reason to run this deck. The Leyline/Helm combo is just useless most of the time. It is a nice answer to having to deal with an opposing Leyline or Crypt but the combo itself just takes up a lot of slots and can be useless a great deal of the time. Anyone who wants to develop the deck any further feel free to but I think the deck just has to many useless top decks and is a little slower than FT or TES is. Here is what I consider to be the optimum list for Helm of Iggy:

3x Mystical Tutor
4x Dark Ritual
4x Cabal Ritual
4x Brainstorm
4x Leyline of the Void
3x Ill-Gotten Gains
4x Infernal Tutor
4x Lotus Petal
4x Lion's Eye Diamond
4x Ponder
2x Helm of Obebience
1x Tendrils of Agony
1x Wipe Away
3x Orim's Chant
4x Flooded Strand
4x Polluted Delta
1x Underground Sea
1x Tundra
1x Scrubland
2x Snow-Covered Island
1x Snow-Covered Swamp
1x Snow-Covered Plains

The SB is all meta dependant but something like this would be good in an unknown meta:
4x Serenity
3x Defense Grid
1x Echoing Truth
3x Wipe Away
1x Rushing River
2x Darkblast/Slaughter Pact
1x Extirpate