Substance

[Skeggi]

I've stumbled upon the keyword ability substance (http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Substance). I'm not entirely sure what it exactly does. For instance: can an Armor of Thorns be disenchanted when the 'instant'-ability is used?

[Anusien]

For instance: can an Armor of Thorns be disenchanted when the 'instant'-ability is used?
Yes; it's an enchantment that enchants a creature.

Substance literally doesn't do anything. In certain places (Mirage sometimes-instant enchantments, or Thawing Glaciers) cards didn't work as written. Substance is a useless ability granted to some permanents until end of turn. At end of turn, they lose substance and some ability triggers on that.

[DeathScythe]

tbh, substance does absolutly nothing, i think that's also stated somewhere in the comp rules

what it does indirectly is prevent abuse of cards that were printed before sixth and went stupid after the rules change after it
Example waylay was designed as a defensive card, but after sixth it suddenly also became an offensive one which wasn't what the card for designed. To maintain the function of the cards they created a meaningless keyword.

Ok so now the 'real' function of it,when you play cards designed like waylay the permanent or permanents it creates gain substance .When a permanent loses substance it is sacrificed (waylay) or is returned to it's owners hand (thawning glacier) depending on the card.

[Skeggi]

So, in Waylay's example, without substance I could cast it at the end of the opponent's turn, and have 3 2/2 tokens to attack with?

I don't see how substance changes this; if they get it until end of turn, wouldn't it cause the same problems?

[Anusien]

So, in Waylay's example, without substance I could cast it at the end of the opponent's turn, and have 3 2/2 tokens to attack with?

I don't see how substance changes this; if they get it until end of turn, wouldn't it cause the same problems?
There's no such thing as "Get them until end of turn." You cannot have an "until end of turn" creation of creatures or anything else, you can just have an "At end of turn" trigger. Substance functionally duplicates the "You have this until end of turn" effect. The triggers used by Astral Slide are "At end of turn" and substance is "Until end of turn".

[Skeggi]

Can't it be simply resolved in "sacrifice at end of turn"? Really, I don't understand the extra value of substance, but ofcourse, please bare with me, I am dumb.

[Anusien]

Can't it be simply resolved in "sacrifice at end of turn"? Really, I don't understand the extra value of substance, but ofcourse, please bare with me, I am dumb.
"At end of turn" triggers once per turn, at the beginning of the "End of Turn" step. Any delayed triggers created after that point that trigger on "At end of turn" will wait until the next "End of Turn" step to resolve. On the other hand, "Until end of turn" abilities go away during the Cleanup step, and it's impossible to get out of a turn without a Cleanup step.

[Nihil Credo]

Also, with regards to Armor of Thorns and a few others, it's important to have them trigger after Cleanup because that's when damage gets removed from creatures - it's still on them during the EoT step.

Substance looks odd, but it would be worse to not let Armor of Thorns save your creature from lethal damage, when that's the entire reason for giving it the instant-speed option.