Imp Stompy - (aka Demon Stompy Take 2)

[Maveric78f]

I start a new thread for a Demon Stompy build because the last one was very far from the build I'm going to propose here. As there is no demon anymore, it could even been renamed in Imp Stompy, as the deck relies on small body, hard to deal with, evasive utility creatures.

The creatures and assimilated I selected :
4 Stinkweed Imp : probably the best creature in the deck. Some decks basically can't win against that card. It has 3 properties that makes it better than any other spell : evasive, immune to (most) removal/counterspells/discard and an anticreature.
4 Bitterblossom : once more, some decks (and I'm probably one of them actually...) cannot win against a resolved Bitterblossom. And as we can play it on our turn 1, it's a very precious card that we want as 4-of, even if we rarely play 2 of them, either because we know that a single one wins the game (and we don't want to overextend) or because of life loss. It's evasive in 2 ways : flying and swarm. Weakness : can't be recurred with SoLaS, can't be sacrificed with Braids.
4 Dusk Urchins : not evasive and life limit but quite interesting as it almost always cycles at worst. It's good because it puts itself quite easily to the grave in exchange to some card drawing and SoLaS can bring it back. It kind of fills the role of Mulldrifter in this deck.
3 Braids, Cabal Minion : 100% of the MD cards are permanents. It takes advantage of it. It comboes with Bitterblossom, it can kill an annoying Graveborn Muse, it makes you draw in conjunction with Dusk Urchins. Most of all, it's a Stax that can deal damage and be equipped. Only 3-of, because it's legendary and requires BB.
4 Graveborn Muse : essential. It's the Dark Confidant of the deck. The cost of 1 life is really nothing when you consider that we have ways to kill it (Braids) or to gain life (equipments), or that it can simply easily kill the opponent before killing you (3/3).
3 Shriekmaw : surprisingly, it's maybe the creature I like the less, because it's difficult to play it in first turns. It comboes well with SoLaS. Appart from that, there is nothing to say that you do not already know. Oh, maybe you forgot that it had fear, which is cool when equipped with SoLaS... Only 3-of because Tarmogoyf is never a problem for the deck and because (non-tribal) creature decks in general are not really a problem.

Our creatures are cool but they are pretty weak (and they hurt). Equipments are there to help you with that :
3 Umezama's Jitte : you know it makes coffee.
4 Sword of Light and Shadow : that's cool to be protected from W, especially with Stinkweed imp. That's cool to be protected from B, especially with Shriekmaw (complementary). Protection is very important I have to say, mostly because big fliers are either W or B. As soon as it starts recurring creatures in the graveyard, you know that you've won.

Stax elements :
4 Chalice of the Void and 4 Trinisphere, nothing special to say about, except that trinisphere is probably better in this deck that in other stompies because of Braids.

Mana Base :
8 2-mana lands
10 swamps
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Chrom mox
That's 1 more than FS or DS (if we don't count Seething Song) because you want 4 manas as soon as possible. I still feel it might not be enough.

Sideboard :
4 Leyline of the Void : we can play it very fast, which is pretty cool.
4 Engineered Plague : tribal decks can overwhelm the deck. Plague calms them down.
4 Cranial Extraction : Our defense against Deed, combo and a lot of decks. It's rarely a bad card.
3 Eyeblight's Ending : Anticreature that can deal with artifacts and black creatures.

In short this gives:

// Lands
4 [TE] Ancient Tomb
10 [MM] Swamp (4)
1 [PLC] Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 [EX] City of Traitors

// Creatures
4 [RAV] Stinkweed Imp
4 [LE] Graveborn Muse
4 [SHM] Dusk Urchins
3 [LRW] Shriekmaw
3 [OD] Braids, Cabal Minion

// Spells
4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
3 [BOK] Umezawa's Jitte
4 [MR] Chrome Mox
4 [DS] Sword of Light and Shadow
4 [MOR] Bitterblossom
4 [DS] Trinisphere

// Sideboard
SB: 4 [GP] Leyline of the Void
SB: 4 [CHK] Cranial Extraction
SB: 4 [7E] Engineered Plague
SB: 3 [LRW] Eyeblight's Ending

[Aernil]

First of:
Im pretty glad to see not everybody forgot my deck.
It changed pretty much over the past years, but I like people to think about it^^

Whatever, Im pretty interested in your build, as you sacrifice the speed of the old one, to gain a serious bonus in redundancy.
But do you think that bitterblossom and braids are worth it?

I play and develop this deck for almost 2 years now, literally since I posted it.
I tested it so much I eventually got sick of it some time.
But as I recognised (and it is well known):
DemonStompy had an incredible bad Control MU.

So may I ask how your build does against control?
The card I most fear(ed) now playing DemS is Deed, and I dont see that problem solved yet.

//
I tried several cards fighting Deed, Imp included.
In my testing Imp was almost everytime a defensive card, hindering opposing goyfs to attack.
I litterally never dared to attack with them (except I had more than one creature)
After some time I decided to test another card, seeming utterly crap
(heck, it is utterly crap).
But surprisingly the card did pretty well, both as an attacker and as blocker.
Rendclaw Trow is the card Im talking about.
I wonder if repeated recurring of Imp is really necessary when you can shrink opposing creatures down a bit, and even surviving one deed.
(not to mention equip + wither = fun)
//

Back to your list:
Did you ever test nether Void with bitterblossom and Braids?
Seems like a fine choice here.

Finally:
I wonder if you have enough pressure on the board in time to seal the deal.
The lack of a fat creature seems a bit risky to me.
Also, Chalice@2 kicks ass against most decks, did you ever got a problem with that?

[Maveric78f]

Im pretty glad to see not everybody forgot my deck.
That's also the reason why I changed thread. Because, as you did the opening post, you thought you had the authority on the whole discussions.

Deed is not that much a problem and that's not a 2/2 persist/wither (or Rotlung Reanimator that will change the deal). The deck faces difficulties against deed, as all stompy decks do. However with Cranial Extraction/Braids/equipements/bitterblossom/Graveborn Muse, you have a bunch of more or less solutions. Cranial Extraction deals completely with the offense. Braids puts a clock on your opponent and sometimes he will never be able to activate it for 4. The most common way to play around deed remains to play a creature and equip it. Then he absolutely needs to deal with the creature, deal with the equipment or deed. Bitterblossom can be dealt only with deed or an early vindicate/grip. And finally Muse is also a card he has to deal as soon as possible since it provides card advantage.

The point now is that you don't need to overextend as you had to before. Before, you were the aggro deck with only hope to kill before being deeded. Now you can place 1 or 2 bombs, and wait that he deeds to survive, and then do it again.

Neither Void is too reflexive (and mana expensive) to be good. And I don't need to "seal the deal". I'm a stompy deck that often wins long games. It's not aggro anymore.
My creatures are not fat but your opponent has no other choice that deal with them, or I'll overwhelm him.
About Chalice@2, I usually first play my 2CC cards in hand and then I don't hesitate to play it @2. Sometimes I use Braids to break chalice to play a card @2.

[Aernil]

That's also the reason why I changed thread. Because, as you did the opening post, you thought you had the authority on the whole discussions.
Sry if it seemed that way.
I really did not intend to use my (not existing) authority.
Im just happy to see someone taking DemS or a deck with a similar idea serious.
I totally accept that Imp Stompy is a deck on its own, just sharing an idea with DemS, although going into a different direction.
By no means I want to declare this deck to mine.


The deck faces difficulties against deed, as all stompy decks do. However with Cranial Extraction/Braids/equipements/bitterblossom/Graveborn Muse, you have a bunch of more or less solutions.
I understand the purpose of Braids beeing a solution to Deed, same to Extraction.
But i really fail to see BB and equip as a solution.
The mentioned cards just force an activision of Deed, as pretty much every thread in your deck does.
Whatever, I understand you're going into the slower direction, so it doesn't matter anyway.



Neither Void is too reflexive (and mana expensive) to be good.
I just thought Void might be interesting with Bitterblossom/euip/creature.


I'm a stompy deck that often wins long games. It's not aggro anymore.
Did you ever think of adding Contamination?
Seems it does very well with a slower Stompy deck utilizing bitterblossom.

It seems your deck aims to win mid/lategame.
May I ask if you considered Sengir Autocrat or Rotlung reanimator.
The autocrats tokens can do some serious damage carrying an equipment, working as chumpblockers, or as braidsfodder.
Although it has a weak body, it might deserve some testing.
(in theory I think its a creature where removing it has a pretty high priority)
And Reanimator is also decent as braidsfodder and giving you a nice possibility to overextend into a deed without loosing much.
Also, recurring Autocrat or Reanimator seems pretty nice.

Again, sry if I gave you the feeling of owning your deck.

Edit:
An equipped trow is also useful for shrinking Dreadnoughts
Just to justify my suggestion of it^^

[Maveric78f]

I understand the purpose of Braids beeing a solution to Deed, same to Extraction.
But i really fail to see BB and equip as a solution.
The mentioned cards just force an activision of Deed, as pretty much every thread in your deck does.
Whatever, I understand you're going into the slower direction, so it doesn't matter anyway.
This last sentence shows that you got my point.



I just thought Void might be interesting with Bitterblossom/euip/creature.


Did you ever think of adding Contamination?
Seems it does very well with a slower Stompy deck utilizing bitterblossom.
I don't want to rely on a single card. BB is just a mean among other ones to reach our aim.

[Maveric78f]

May I ask if you considered Sengir Autocrat or Rotlung reanimator.
The autocrats tokens can do some serious damage carrying an equipment, working as chumpblockers.
Sengir autocrat is no CA. The opponent just has to deal with it and the tokens disappear. I tried Rotlung but I changed it with Braids. Strange maybe but I never tested them together.

The only innovation I want to try right now is to exchange Urchins with that 2B 2/2creature that makes you draw and lose 1 when it comes into play. I still honestly fail to see how it can be more a creature hard to deal with. The default of Urchins is that you need sometimes to make it run into a beef because you want draw.

[Mordenkaynen]

There's another possibility of designing black "stompy" that's not a real stompy.
Black give you access to bitterblossom, Imp, persist guys, nether spirit, Chimeric Idol, necraplasm, mishra's factory and also to symmerical disruption such as Damnation, smallpox, Braids etc. So, you can design it even in more controlish manner if you want to. As for control MU, I'm not sure but you can swith chalice to something like culling scales.

As a side note vs. some forms of control (but not against deed) you can add Necrogen Mists.

[Phantom]

I love what you've done here. Black Stompy always had an embarrassment of riches, and no one could ever decide which direction to take it in. I personally think you're on the right track with a more controlling direction. I loved BB and Imp when I tested them, and never got a chance to try out Braids, but I can imagine it's nuts.

I only have one small thought for your maindeck. Do you ever have problems hitting :b::b:? Do you ever connect with a SoLaS and not have anything in the yard? Do you ever not have anything to imprint on a Mox? 1 or 2 Twisted Abomination's could help with all those.

Your board seems pretty terrible. Why Cranial Extraction over Unmask? I'm assuming this spot is for combo since you already have Leyline (and Chalice) for Loam and recursion. Extraction can be too slow vs combo, and really what you want is a stall piece to get you into your artifact disruption.

Also, Eyeblight's Ending??? You can't need to board in spot removal against anything (and if you do I'll bet Rend Spirit is better thanks to stupid Changelings). Get some needles in there to stop Survival and Deeds and everything else.

Anyway, color me excited. I'll see if I can test the deck at all.

[Tao]

Dusk Urchins are horrible. The worst about them is that they sound good. But I tested them a while ago in standard (with Smallpox synergy) and it took me a while to understand that they are bad. Being able to play them earlier won't change that. They will almost never do what you want them to do and just cost you a lot of Tempo.

[cloudstrife7]

Dusk Urchins are horrible. The worst about them is that they sound good. But I tested them a while ago in standard (with Smallpox synergy) and it took me a while to understand that they are bad. Being able to play them earlier won't change that. They will almost never do what you want them to do and just cost you a lot of Tempo.

What kind of deck did you test Dusk Urchins in? They're pretty bad in an aggro deck, and they're pretty bad when you want to purposely use them for combos, but I tested dusk urchins in standard MBC and found them to really be the one saving grace of the deck. To me, Dusk urchins reads:
2B
Sorcery-weird impy thing
Prevent 2-4 damage during next combat phase
Destroy target creature
Draw a card

I would guess that in legacy the destroy target creature clause would be more conditional, as a 3-power blocker is not always going to trade. However, a card where the worst case scenario is gain 4 life and draw a card might be worth it for 2B in a deck with an otherwise superior long-game. Plus, if he shows up on turn one you have a devastating beater.

[Maveric78f]

There's another possibility of designing black "stompy" that's not a real stompy.
Black give you access to bitterblossom, Imp, persist guys, nether spirit, Chimeric Idol, necraplasm, mishra's factory and also to symmerical disruption such as Damnation, smallpox, Braids etc. So, you can design it even in more controlish manner if you want to. As for control MU, I'm not sure but you can swith chalice to something like culling scales.

As a side note vs. some forms of control (but not against deed) you can add Necrogen Mists.
I am sorry but there are a lot of dyssynergies in what you propose. Nether spirit is cool, but not with imps and other creatures. You don't want to play damnations in such decks neither. And finally, I don't see the point of mists, you can't deal with both hands and permanents.

[Maveric78f]

I love what you've done here. Black Stompy always had an embarrassment of riches, and no one could ever decide which direction to take it in. I personally think you're on the right track with a more controlling direction. I loved BB and Imp when I tested them, and never got a chance to try out Braids, but I can imagine it's nuts.
I know that you are very experienced in Stompy decks design and really appreciate your positive intuition.


I only have one small thought for your maindeck. Do you ever have problems hitting :b::b:?
Usually I have time to play something else to play before running out of playable cards. But BB is for sure an issue.


Do you ever connect with a SoLaS and not have anything in the yard?
It always happens. Far more often than connecting with a creature. But you have to understand that connecting with SoLaS means uncountedable and indestructible creatures. So finally, I don't really care.

Do you ever not have anything to imprint on a Mox?
Franckly, I can have diffculties to choose a card because they are all bombs, but that's the point of mix isn't it? I never miss acceleration with mix for not having a black in hand though.


Your board seems pretty terrible. Why Cranial Extraction over Unmask? I'm assuming this spot is for combo since you already have Leyline (and Chalice) for Loam and recursion. Extraction can be too slow vs combo, and really what you want is a stall piece to get you into your artifact disruption.
Extraction is the card I enter the most often. First it's never a bad card, so that I can always remove a useless card in a MU to include it. Secondly, t's the only reliable answer to deed. Third, it's a kill against combo.


Also, Eyeblight's Ending??? You can't need to board in spot removal against anything (and if you do I'll bet Rend Spirit is better thanks to stupid Changelings). Get some needles in there to stop Survival and Deeds and everything else.
Needle is awful in the situations you describe. Survival will fetch a utility creature in response and deed decks always have an answers to needles. You won't deal with deed reliably with needle.

[Nihil Credo]

I didn't see a mention of Fleshbag Marauder in this thread. Seems like it would solve most of what you don't like about Shriekmaw in this build; in other decks the +50% cost is a pain, but here it's actually beneficial. You can sacrifice an unwanted creature (Faerie token/Braids/Urchin) and keep the 3/1, and the trigger hits Dreadnought and Tombstalker as well.

Volrath's Stronghold also seems to have some potential here; if the extra colourless mana is too much of a problem (quite likely), it can still be run in the SB and brought in against control.

And for the record, I strongly disagree with you about Needle. Cranial Extraction also isn't that great against combo when half of Storm combo runs Burning Wish, and the French combo decks (Aluren & Life) sometimes or often run Living Wish.

[Moczoc]

Usually I have time to play something else to play before running out of playable cards. But BB is for sure an issue.


Then just add another Urborg, playing two copies of a legendary land should be a much smaller issue than constant problems to get BB.

[Mordenkaynen]

Nether spirit is ok with dredge creatures and as for Braids it has to be played in a right moment anyway.
Can you explain why don't you want to play symmerical removal?
EDIT: I mean, that's would make the strategy and purposes of the deck more clear.

[uberfrank]

I'm surprised Cranial Extraction isn't played more in Legacy. It seems a lot of decks aren't playing a lot of win conditions. I'm sure an early extraction can seriously cripple a lot of opponents. Of course, you have to know what you're playing against, that's the tricky part.

[Maveric78f]

I didn't see a mention of Fleshbag Marauder in this thread. Seems like it would solve most of what you don't like about Shriekmaw in this build; in other decks the +50% cost is a pain, but here it's actually beneficial. You can sacrifice an unwanted creature (Faerie token/Braids/Urchin) and keep the 3/1, and the trigger hits Dreadnought and Tombstalker as well.
That's surely a strong addition, at least in SB in place of the tribal instant. At best in MD instead of Shriekmaw (which would probably take the SB slot).


Volrath's Stronghold also seems to have some potential here; if the extra colourless mana is too much of a problem (quite likely), it can still be run in the SB and brought in against control.
I've been considering adding mana producers in SB for two purposes: fighting mana denial and explosiveness against comboes. That's a possibility but I miss room.


And for the record, I strongly disagree with you about Needle. Cranial Extraction also isn't that great against combo when half of Storm combo runs Burning Wish, and the French combo decks (Aluren & Life) sometimes or often run Living Wish.
Half of the combo play BW, that's right but half of the BW combo do not play tendrils MD. Just name BW. If your opponent does not concede then you should have time to play another cranial. The fact is that chalice or trinisphere are not an effective lock without braids. We need a kill. Against living wish comboes, I don't see what needle would do except wasting an opponent living wish on a utility creature once more.

[Infinitium]

Seconding and thirding Cranial Extraction as the quintessential sideboard card. I've played it in my Black Stax build for ages and have come to view it as the decks single best asset postboard, especially as it provides a fast clock versus storm combo.

Considered cutting Trinisphere for Unmask? It serves a similar purpose (slowing down combo, forcing spells through) but generally does it a turn earlier and is better lategame. Nice synergy with Extraction as well, and since Braids cannot be ramped anyway having 60 permanents is less of an issue, especially with recursive creatures and BB. Overall I like the direction you've taken with this deck, even if it does look somewhat reliant on equipment in order to push damage through.

[GGoober]

My Imp Stompy build runs Mindslicer + Grafted Wargear. I achieve Hellbent really quick, and rely on Stinky to win the game lol, but he fucking does it by himself with a grafted Wargear!

My hellbent deck runs Gathan Raiders + Grinning Demon, as a morph mix, morhping them up fast and swinging fast. The Grafted Wargear + mindslicer disrupts an opponent's hand immediately, by turn 3 if needed. And if you have a stinky in play, Grafted Wargear and Stinky are best friends. If stinky dies, dredge and equip for free again, and you get a 4/4 flying Deathtouch beater. However, I've abandonned the deck for awhile since the problem with the deck is that Grinning Demon gets chumped all day long.

Great job for revitalizing the deck. Here're just my thoughts on some sheniniganns that's worked out for me :)

[Maveric78f]

Considered cutting Trinisphere for Unmask? It serves a similar purpose (slowing down combo, forcing spells through) but generally does it a turn earlier and is better lategame. Nice synergy with Extraction as well, and since Braids cannot be ramped anyway having 60 permanents is less of an issue, especially with recursive creatures and BB. Overall I like the direction you've taken with this deck, even if it does look somewhat reliant on equipment in order to pus damage through.
Unmask can at most make you earn 1 or 2 turns against combo, which not enough. A resolved trinisphere is almost game. Moreover Trinisphere comboes with Braids. Trinisphere does virtual card advantage when unmask does real card disadvantage. And I fail to see the combo between unmask and extraction.

[Infinitium]

Unmask can at most make you earn 1 or 2 turns against combo, which not enough. A resolved trinisphere is almost game. Moreover Trinisphere comboes with Braids. Trinisphere does virtual card advantage when unmask does real card disadvantage. And I fail to see the combo between unmask and extraction.

True, but Trini can still be run in the SB for the combo mu (the way a lot of Dragon Stompy builds go about it). Seeing your opponents hand before Extracting (as well as protecting Extraction itself) is pretty tech.

From my experience, forcing an early threat through or picking off an early Deed or simular card is well worth the card disadvantage, and you run an obscene amount of draw engines anyway.

[survival]

does anybody have a link to the old thread I'd like to take a look a it?

[Maveric78f]

I just googled "demon stompy the source" :
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8332

Some people really don't search before asking...

[Ozymandias]

After extensively playing black Stompy, I've come to a few realizations:

1) Nether Void is only really good against decks without counters/cheap removal. Otherwise, Trinisphere is better. This is because dropping an early Void sacrifices the tempo that you're trying to steal, and while that may be fine if the other deck is combo, if you try that against anything from Team America to Burn, you will be in trouble.

2) Dark Ritual is a very good addition to this deck. Although it takes up slots, it allows you to begin Roshamboing the opponent from turn 1 a lot more consistently than simply Mox+:2:-lands alone. This is especially relevant to point

3) Phyrexian Negator. This card is phenomenally good for Black Stompy, because if unanswered, this card will wreck the opponent faster than any other commonly used creature. With the fall in the fortunes of decks packing bolts, Negator is often a safe choice as well. It is often big enough to trample all over early 2/3 or so Tarmogoyfs.

That said, here is my current list

4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Graveborn Muse
4 Shriekmaw
4 Stinkweed Imp

4 Bitterblossom

3 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Sword of Fire and Ice

4 Chalice of the Void
4 Trinisphere

4 Dark Ritual
4 Chrome Mox
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
9 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Tomb of Urami

This deck would like to squeeze in Braids, and Negator might just be the right cut for that, but I've found Braids to be situational, dependant on an attending Imp or Blossom to shine, slower, and moreover, it dies just as easily as Gator. Tomb of Urami is probably better as a second UToY, but sometimes the demon is just GG. An unanswered SoFaI is game, but the lifegain from either SoLas or Loxodon Warhammer is often sorely missed.

The current sideboard is

4 Engineered Plague
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Pithing Needle
and 3 Nether Void.

I could see Cranial Extraction as a valid choice, and it seems like it would be even better to Ritual into. Dropping the turn 1 hammer on a threat could be backbreaking versus control or combo.

[leander?]

I don't know if anyone already considered it, but wouldn't Tombstalker be an option for Imp Stompy in particular. Becouse one dredge would do to play a Stalker for BB. You might run about two copies to be shure you do have an Imp-engine online to be able to cast Stalker easily.
Even though, in traditional Demon Stompy builds, Stalker would suck, the addition of Imp should open posibilities for it.

At first, I wanted to cut the Shriekmaws for Tombstalker, until I realised that without Shriekmaw you will have an even harder time getting any cards in your graveyard. Not such a good idea, I suppose.

[Maveric78f]

Ozymandias, we just played each other in a tasteless mirror. No surprise that I've won as you play MD 4 shriekmaws, 4 trinisphere, 4 chalice and 4 dark ritual, 16 cards that azre useless in the mirror although I play only 1 shriekmaw, 4 chalices and 4 trinisphere. When we count the bombs, I play 7 great equipements when you play only 3 jittes (SoFaI is bad in the mirror). I know that you mulled to oblivion in game 2, but I keep thinking that the mirror MU is by far in my favor. Actually, I don't see the point of your version compared to mine. You want to be more explosive but what's the point in the current meta? I prefer consistency personnally.

Leander, Actually, it's a bit the contrary, in traditionnal Demon Stompy builds, Imp is played too and maybe Stalker is not that bad. In our Demon Stompy build, Stalker is definitely not what we need. We want, as I said in introduction creatures that are easy to play and that create CA to some extent. We don't need the fat, thanks to equipments.

[Ozymandias]

Demon Stompy is less than one percent of the 1.5 meta. I don't really think the mirror percentage matters, do you?

And explosiveness is huge. With everything from a totally-screwing-you Dinkhole from Team America to a lethal tendrils from ANT to a Stifle-Naught nightmare possible in the current meta, you better have something ready by turn 2 at the latest. Dark Ritual helps in that goal immensely.

[scarlet_moon]

Braids, Cabal Minion is a nice idea, but i would also suggest Shimian Specter as a bomb against combo/control (and aggro often, too).

Here you see:

Creature - Specter 2/2, 2BB (4)
Flying
Whenever Shimian Specter deals combat damage to a player, that player reveals his or her hand. Choose a nonland card from it. Search that player's graveyard, hand, and library for all cards with the same name as that card and remove them from the game. Then that player shuffles his or her library.

Also, i think Dark Ritual is not needed. Priest of Gix is the Ritual of the deck in my opinion, because it allows very fast starts.

[Willoe]

If you are to play a Specter, then why not the Hippie? It's castable with Dark Ritual, for Christ's sake, which is - in my opinion - what makes it so much better than any other Specter around.

But on the other hand, it's rather risky to run 1cc spells in a deck that aims for chalice@1, and it's an awful topdeck.

I like Ozymandias' list a lot, but Dusk Urchins worth playing? I'd rather like to go aggro with Demon Stompy, so I definetely think that Imp is out of place. On the other hand, it's such a house. It depends on which route you want to take the deck, doesn't it?

[Chaz_the_hunter]

Do you even need the wargear to make mindslicer good? You can always get him out and just start swinging with him. either your opponent dumps his grip or he takes 4. Also works well with Braids and Fleshbag

[scarlet_moon]

some questions after playtesting:

1) How often can you manage the BB to cast a Graveborn Muse? Other Stompys don't play many cards with two colored mana in the castingcost. And when they do, they have more ways to fix their manabase (FearieStompy has Trinket Mage for artifact-lands, DragonStompy has Seething Song).
2) Umezawa's Jitte or Loxodon Warhammer?
3) The deck seems to be weak against Aggro in general. Maybe, Damnation as a useful addition for the sideboard? Engineered Plague + Damnation or only one of them?

I play this list:

//land 19
7 Swamp
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Tomb of Urami

//creature 19
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Dusk Urchins
4 Shimian Specter
3 Braids, Cabal Minion
4 Shriekmaw

//enchantment 4
4 Bitterblossom

//artifact 18
4 Chrome Mox
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Trinisphere
4 Sword of Light and Shadow
3 Loxodon Warhammer

[Pulp_Fiction]

I have a random idea, with Bitterblossom, could this deck support Contamination lock either in the SB or clear some slots in the main? At worst Contamination will buy you a turn by locking the opponent out of mana. Could be a lot like Choke in green decks against Landstill and blue control matchups.

[JohnnyCage]

I have a random idea, with Bitterblossom, could this deck support Contamination lock either in the SB or clear some slots in the main? At worst Contamination will buy you a turn by locking the opponent out of mana. Could be a lot like Choke in green decks against Landstill and blue control matchups.

It could be ok after board but is certainly not worth maining.

[frenchy-man]

My list :
4 Chalice
4 Trinisphère

4 Chrome mox
4 City of the traitors
4 Ancien tomb
10 Swamp

4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Phyrexian Scuta
4 Dusk Urchins
4 Shriekmaw
4 Phyrexian Rager
3 Graveborn Muse

4 Sword of Light and Shadow
3 Loxodon Warhammer

Sb :

4 Cranial extraction
4 Unmask
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Bane of the Living

I'll probably change the hammers for jitte, and scuta for... I don"t know what, it could be braids, but I would prefer a creature with only B in the cost.
Cranial is so good that I am nearly about to cmove them MD instead of the shriekmaws.

What I wanted to say is thaht the deck is very good in a dreadstill/ant/thresh metagame. But against aggro it's very difficult to hand them.

[Maveric78f]

It could be ok after board but is certainly not worth maining.

Probably not worth SBing neither. I mean, the upkeep is really difficult to pay, and it only prevent your opponent from playing cards. As a conclusion, it's a 2 cards combo, that makes you lose 1 life per turn and that can be played only when you control the board. How sexy is this?

Frenchy-man >> I think that you're half-way between classical Demon Stompy and Imp Stompy. Having BB should not be worrying you because you want those BB cards (braids and muse). They are maybe the best cards in the deck. They can be got rid of only with STP or burn. If you play them wisely, it's also often 2 for 1, if not better. I would rather remove city of traitors instead of removing Braids of the 4th Muse.

[scarlet_moon]

What are your thoughts on Nether Void for the sideboard?
It's gamebreaking against combo in general, but it's difficult to cast it on turn 2 (even 3). Useful or not?
Against control or aggro, NV isn't really useful in my opinion, because you can only play it, when your boardposition allows it.

[Maveric78f]

Cranial is probably more gamebreaking against combo. And it's usefull much more often too.

[scarlet_moon]

Thank you.

After some more playtesting und brainstoming, i come to this conclusion:

This deck plays much more like a stax-deck then a stompy-deck. It's not agressive, but very disruptive. On the other side, the high number of creatures and equipment makes it playable as aggro-deck, but without real threats on it's on - only in combination of creature+equipment.
I like some starts, first turn Chalice/Trinisphere/Bitterblossom are really nice, but also, there are many hands without this impact -> 2-3 Creatures alone will not control the opponent. And when i compare the impact of Blood Moon etc. with Braids, i can't imagine that Imp Stompy is more disruptive.
The lack of consistency in every Stompy is a bit lowered in this special version, because of Dusk Urchins and Graveborn Muse. But Muse (and Braids) needs 2BB (very bad casting cost).
The need of Chrome Mox (as it needs a threat/utility-card to imprint) is not typical for the way of control, because it's pure carddisadvantage. Also a big problem imo.

After this thoughts, i would compare this deck with Mono Black Aggro, as it has nearly the same gameplane: First disrupt the opponent (with Ritual+Hymn/Thoughtseize/Duress/whatever), then play threats (Stalker, Negator, Shade...) and win fast.
Imp Stompy's disruption stays game and i think it's more powerful, but the hole deck is much slower (ironic because of the Stompy-lands...) and will never finish the enemy before turn 4-5... Yes, it will finish in mid-/lategame, but can it manage to control the enemy for such a long time?

[Pulp_Fiction]

I am very interested in this deck and playtested it a little yesterday. Here is the list I used:


4 Ancient Tomb
10 Swamp
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 City of Traitors
1 Tomb of Urami

4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Graveborn Muse
2 Dusk Urchins
4 Shriekmaw
3 Braids, Cabal Minion
1 Phyrexian Scuta

4 Chalice of the Void
2 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Chrome Mox
3 Sword of Light and Shadow
4 Bitterblossom
4 Trinisphere
1x Grafted Wargear

SB

4 Leyline of the Void
4 Cranial Extraction
4 Engineered Plague
3 Pithing Needle

I played against Mono-U control and destroyed it. The game took 35 mins and he got double Shackles in play but cound not iwn since he was at 6 and I had lots of creatures on the board. He ended up decking himself but Braids was the defining card in this matchup + Bitterblossom. After Pithing Needle comes in this matchup gets a lot better!

TES is a very iffy matchup. With Ad Nauseam being as good as it is, this deck can only stall for so long. And with not much of a clock it wasn't what I had hoped for. I won 3/7-8 games we played. All of them were after SB. Cranial Extraction + Leyline really hurts the deck since it shuts off the IGG loop and threshed Cabal Rituals. I had pretty bad hands and only had 1 hand the entire matchup with Trinisphere in it. One game I mulled to 4 trying to find Chalice/Trinisphere/Cranial Extraction and just couldn't find anything worthwhile.

This deck certainly has potential but it mulligans like shit. I am not sure what can be done to make it better though. Maybe more Phyrexian Scuta.