GBW Rock w/ LD

[sauce]

The Beats
3 Eternal Witness
2 Loxodon Hierarch
4 Dark Confidant
4 Tarmogoyf

The Spells
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Regrowth
4 Vindicate
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Thoughtseize
4 Duress

The LD suite
4 Sinkhole
2 Crucible of Worlds
4 Wasteland

The other lands
4 Bayou
4 Scrubland
1 Savannah
1 Plains
1 Forest
1 Swamp
4 Windswept Heath
2 Bloodstained Mire

http://www.deckcheck.net/stats.php?id=62173&saved=true

Thoughts?

[swarm187]

I think Doran or Kitchen Finks might be a better fit than Loxodon Hierarch in a build like this. You may even want to consider Mystic Enforcer here too, because you'll almost always have Threshold.

I'm not sure if you need Eternal Witness AND Crucible of Worlds in the same deck, it seems like a redundancy. Crucible is a bit slow, so you may want to use those slots for something more useful like Dark Ritual or Ice Storm.

Hope this helps!

[sauce]

I think Doran or Kitchen Finks might be a better fit than Loxodon Hierarch in a build like this. You may even want to consider Mystic Enforcer here too, because you'll almost always have Threshold.

I'm not sure if you need Eternal Witness AND Crucible of Worlds in the same deck, it seems like a redundancy. Crucible is a bit slow, so you may want to use those slots for something more useful like Dark Ritual or Ice Storm.

Hope this helps!

the witness is not just for returning sinkhole/wasteland, its there to return other things i may need like a fetchland, thoughtseize, etc..

the reason for hierarch is cuz i run dark confidant + thoughtseize + fetchlands, it helps bring my life total back up and also beats kinda nicely.

the crucible is really not that slow, i can ramp w/ it and/or wasteland lock, not too shabby id say.

[nitewolf9]

I like this list, it looks pretty focused and has a strong disruption suite. Couple of things though.

Is duress really better than hymn here? Or maybe even Gerrard's Verdict, which would be a bit easier to cast and lets your opponent screw himself over?
Also, why the random regrowth? I'd want the 3rd top, and might even try to fit in the 4th if I could.

I also think the Hierarchs are weak. Maybe you could try something like Terravore? As a 2 of he seems pretty huge in a deck with this much LD. Life from the Loam could also be better than Crucible, but that's debatable.

I like it though, looks like alot of fun.

[sauce]

I like this list, it looks pretty focused and has a strong disruption suite. Couple of things though.

Is duress really better than hymn here? Or maybe even Gerrard's Verdict, which would be a bit easier to cast and lets your opponent screw himself over?
Also, why the random regrowth? I'd want the 3rd top, and might even try to fit in the 4th if I could.

I also think the Hierarchs are weak. Maybe you could try something like Terravore? As a 2 of he seems pretty huge in a deck with this much LD. Life from the Loam could also be better than Crucible, but that's debatable.

I like it though, looks like alot of fun.

i think duress/thoughtseize are easier to get out the way than hymn, even though hymn is a house, i rather be casting sinkhole on turn 2.

also, im thinking maybe running 2 Elspeth instead of 2 Loxodon hierarchs?

[nitewolf9]

i think duress/thoughtseize are easier to get out the way than hymn, even though hymn is a house, i rather be casting sinkhole on turn 2.

also, im thinking maybe running 2 Elspeth instead of 2 Loxodon hierarchs?

Thing is, you won't always have sinkhole. Hymn can also hit lands and makes sure you have some strong disruption on turn 2. Duress however does make it more likely that you will be able to stop your opponent's Counterbalance, but Hymn is very powerful and deserves serious consideration. I also like the idea of maybe running Knight of the Reliquary and a Volrath's Stronghold in there, but Terravore will probably be bigger and also tramples. Plenty of things you could try.

Elspeth is probably strong, and I think alot of people underestimate the planeswalkers. If you didn't want to run stronghold that might be worth trying out.

Edit: Another pro to LftL over Crucible would be its synergy with top, something that shouldn't be overlooked.

[sauce]

Thing is, you won't always have sinkhole. Hymn can also hit lands and makes sure you have some strong disruption on turn 2. Duress however does make it more likely that you will be able to stop your opponent's Counterbalance, but Hymn is very powerful and deserves serious consideration. I also like the idea of maybe running Knight of the Reliquary and a Volrath's Stronghold in there, but Terravore will probably be bigger and also tramples. Plenty of things you could try.

Elspeth is probably strong, and I think alot of people underestimate the planeswalkers. If you didn't want to run stronghold that might be worth trying out.

Edit: Another pro to LftL over Crucible would be its synergy with top, something that shouldn't be overlooked.

if i run lftl, i want genesis in there and also the lands that let me cycle and draw... it kinda changes the whole deck.

[nitewolf9]

if i run lftl, i want genesis in there and also the lands that let me cycle and draw... it kinda changes the whole deck.

There's no law that says you have to run those cards with LftL, and you're only running 2. Even if I ran 4 LftL I'd still want the single stronghold over Genesis. Why is Crucible better?

[sauce]

There's no law that says you have to run those cards with LftL, and you're only running 2. Even if I ran 4 LftL I'd still want the single stronghold over Genesis. Why is Crucible better?

crucible does not require you to miss your draw step and does not base your whole strategy around lands coming from the yard and doing things w/ them.

the deck's strategy is to disrupt/LD early (turn 1-5) and then land a goyf ultimately and beat them down w/ vindicates/swords if they manage to get land back and cast dudes.

crucible is just there for the random "i win" if it resolves against most good decks.

dark confidant speeds up this strategy.

[from Cairo]

I agree with Nightwolf LftL seems better especially with Sensei's Top. A one of Volrath's would want to find it's way in for this set up.

I also agree that Terravore or Mystic Enforcer seem like better cards for the 2 of spot than Hierarchs, since they actually break a ground stand off.

[sauce]

I agree with Nightwolf LftL seems better especially with Sensei's Top. A one of Volrath's would want to find it's way in for this set up.

I also agree that Terravore or Mystic Enforcer seem like better cards for the 2 of spot than Hierarchs, since they actually break a ground stand off.

here is a changed version with lftl/vores
http://www.deckcheck.net/stats.php?id=62224&saved=true

vs the other version
http://www.deckcheck.net/stats.php?id=62221&saved=true

[johanessen]

And why not knight of reliq?

sac forest, search waste,

[EdsonDettoni]

Great Deck Idea. More than fun and interesting.

1. You have to keep Eternal Witness. Is the more interesting idea with Sinkhole, Vindicate. 3 is a good number.
2. Lodoxon is unflexible. Umezawa's Jitte is flexible, and helps you to beat.
3. If you want to maintain thoughtseize/Duress, I'd change Duress for BlackMail. When a hand is full of creatures (especially goblins), duress dont help.

Bye.