Chicago Banned Listed/Errata

[Dan Turner]

So in everyone's opinion what do you think will be banned/errata d come next week in legacy

I personal think Natural order will get the following errata

-This card sucks

and go back to being a $2 casual rare

[sunshine]

I'm not really sure how they would go about doing that, the card is functioning exactly as it was intended. Also, I'm not trying to downplay the Natural Order/Progenitus interaction but it remains to be shown that it is warping enough to warrant errata.

It is a good question though how our banned/restricted list will be shaken up if the format continues to get more attention.

[Anusien]

They don't power level errata cards. If Natural Order is a problem they will ban it.

[herbig]

Top gets banned, if they're taking the format seriously like they do Extended.

[mtglordtom24]

Top gets banned, if they're taking the format seriously like they do Extended.

OMG I completely agree, and I play with Top a lot. The card is just too slow to be allowed in tournament, it just makes games drag and become boring, not fun. Magic should be fun, my opponent searching the top three cards for 20 seconds every time I do something isn't fun.

[Skeggi]

Without Top Counterbalance will lose its power. Without Counterbalance, Combo will run amok and cause disarray! And then the dawn of the Combo will emerge into existence, and no-one will be safe. People will start playing Stax out of desperation. So now you have a meta with half Combo and half Stax, resulting in many heart-attacks among slightly older Legacy players. Health insurance fees will skyrocket, the economy will suck even harder. Third World countries will be rich countries compared to the current First World countries, and they will pay us back for what we have done to them for eons. It will be the end of the world as we know it. There is also a slight chance Hitler will rise from his grave.

Yeah, it's Friday-afternoon, and I have to work for 10 more minutes and I couldn't be any less motivated.

[bowvamp]

Ok, I doubt they'll ban top because legacy is sorta it's last place to hide from the banhammer. I'd say that they will ban... tgoyf. It seems to be the only thing worth banning at the moment. Of course then green will be the next red.

[Brad Herbig]

Without Top Counterbalance will lose its power. Without Counterbalance, Combo will run amok and cause disarray! And then the dawn of the Combo will emerge into existence, and no-one will be safe. People will start playing Stax out of desperation. So now you have a meta with half Combo and half Stax, resulting in many heart-attacks among slightly older Legacy players. Health insurance fees will skyrocket, the economy will suck even harder. Third World countries will be rich countries compared to the current First World countries, and they will pay us back for what we have done to them for eons. It will be the end of the world as we know it. There is also a slight chance Hitler will rise from his grave.

Yeah, it's Friday-afternoon, and I have to work for 10 more minutes and I couldn't be any less motivated.
I love both combo and stax though...

[Omega]

Nothing will be banned, period.

Tarmogoyf : We had the discussion so many time, i cant believe there are actually people who still believe it will be banned.

Sensei's Divining Top : Due to the fact that it has been banned in Extended, there some "chances" that it will see ban in Legacy. Although personally, I believe that it is incorrect to ban a card just because it is slow. I saw some people abusing it (time abuse), but that's it. Its a fair card, it seriously takes no time to use. Pay 1 and look at top 3. That's it. If you have to think 20 seconds, then clearly, you either have no clue what is happening, or you just want to stall the game
CB-Top is actually a combo that helps aggro-control deck. Remove it, and I think most aggro control will die, or at least be pushed out of DTB status. Dreadstill seems like one of those deck. With no CB-Top, the deck is just a bad Landstill running X dreadnought + Stifle.

The day they ban Dredge from Magic the Gathering, the world would be a much better place to play

Robert

[Zach Tartell]

I love both combo and stax though...

Then play both at once! Nothing says synergy like Trinisphere and Lotus Petal!

[Seriously]

Im not understanding why everyone is so ban happy. for all of the cards mentioned so far, there are answers to them already out there. play the answers, switch decks or dont complain.

as for flash, hulk flash could essentially go off on turn 0, depending on the build. unless your opponent had a force, the game was over. none of the cards mentioned so far have that sort of effect on the game.

[georgjorge]

Not that I think they should ban Top for "slowing down" the game...but if they did, Standstill would have to be there as well. Nothing says "I'm not interested in doing anything for the first twenty turns of the game" like a turn two Standstill on an empty board. Standstill's flavor text would fit Top better, though.

[jazzykat]

If anything gets banned it's top. The card creates a pretty uneven skew at least in our DTB status. If you banned top you might have to ban LED.

I think the format would slow down a lot and there would be an upsurgence in slower combo (solidarity, painter/grindstone, Natural Order/Prog), rockish board control decks, SLOOOOW U control decks, and truly viable aggro decks (goyf sligh?) again.

In a way I would be sad because I just got into storm combo and my playset of LEDs would be worth nothing then but on the upside I think the format would revert way more back to old school and take a step back to the beginning of legacy for a while until people break the new cards out there.

[spirit of the wretch]

If anything gets banned it's top. The card creates a pretty uneven skew at least in our DTB status. If you banned top you might have to ban LED.

I would really like this! Seems like a pretty solid plan to me.

[Dan Turner]

ban top and LED this way i can play solidarity and goblins no problem

[Team-Hero]

Keep in mind: Wizards restricted Ponder in Vintage. I believe that they can ban almost any card they see fit from Legacy if they wish to do so. I just pray that the top 8 is diverse enough for them to feel they need to make no change. LED, Top, Counterbalance, and Standstill all equal no fun.

[Omega]

There are no clear criteria about banning. They ban for power level, they ban for "slowness", they also ban stupid card (read chaos orb, ante...)

I personally feel that neither Top nor LED are too strong to be banned. Right now, I feel like the only argument about banning LED is that once CB/Top gone, Combo will be broken (at the moment, it is not dominating every meta). This alone should be enough to not make any reckless move! If you are not sure of the consequences when banning a card, you shouldn't. And if the consequences of banning a card are that a deck (in our case combo) will dominate, then certainly, it is not a good idea to ban. For a card to be worth banning, the card must have a decisive (unclear criteria) impact on a format.
At the moment, only threshold (non canadian) and Dreadstill are playing TOP and are considered DTB or close. Also in DTB or close, but not playing Sensei's : Landstill, TA, Combo (except DD combo), Merfolk, Goblin. I think it is safe to say that Top is not dominating the format.

So if top is not too-strong, what other argument can we bring to advocate its banning?
IF slow is a valid argument, we could argue to ban more cards. Oh my, Brainstorm is slow too (Its not a slow card, its just people are scared for no reason about making a mistake, or are incapable of reading the gamestate. Its pretty easy though, draw 3, put 2 back.).
And, with sarcasm : Fetchlands are slow too! Aren't you mad when an opponent sacrifice a fetchland, then search his library, then look at his hand before picking a land? Don't sacrifice a fetchland if you have no idea what to look for!
It is clearly a bad argument in my opinion.


I stand by my point. Sensei's divining top is not a slow card. It can be made slow.

Im sick of rotation (I dont play T2-Extend for that purpose), and I hate restriction due to the insane power level of certain cards (Vintage). I play Legacy because I find it to be a fair format. So far, I have never been touched by the ban in Legacy (Flash). I dont recall any other ban in my Legacy career. This is a proof of stability (at least, in my opinion. It can be argued).

Robert


EDIT : And let's not use the other format's arguments.
Affinity was banned T2 because it was ridiculous.
Extended : Affinity is legal, but Disciple has been banned to slow down the deck.
Legacy : Affinity is no threat

Extended : Aether vial was banned because it can cheat creatures into play (which is considered unfair)
Legacy : Aether Vial exists to help aggro beat control (and combo)

Two formats = two different worlds