[ICD] Maelstrom Pulse

[heroicraptor]

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/3216/attachmentm.jpg
Yowza. Might this be just what The Rock needed?

[Piceli89]

Vindicate is just better. And this Pulse is strictly situational, since opponent doesn't have always 2 same goyfs/whatever else on the table.
But on the other side, this > Putrefy 'n' Mortify ( expect it's a sorcery).

[Forbiddian]

Yowza. Might this be just what The Rock needed?

That's great card design. I am so excited for this next set, it looks awesome.

[Giles]

Very intriguing card. It is a Echoing-Vindicate.

I am going to test this card for sure. Something about this card tells me it is going to read 90% time will be: "Destroy Target nonland Permanent"
I just noticed this: Maelstrom Pulse hits counterbalance like a fucking champ, thumbs up.

[Maverick676]

While it is probably worse than vindicate in general, it is probably playable since it is in different colors. Seeing cards like this makes the new set seem rather interesting.

[bowvamp]

This definitely makes eva-green better. But then again, I don't play Eva Green anyways. Makes GB Pox better, but why do that when you can run WB or MonoB?

[Van Phanel]

From the Solidarity player's point of view I like that card, as it might replace Vindicate in some decks.

Now to be serious: good job with that one wizards.

[FoolofaTook]

This certainly makes BG more interesting. Pernicious Deed and Maelstrom Pulse is enough removal and leaves a lot of space for other elements.

[kicks_422]

Rock might not have room for this, especially if they're already splashing white for Swords and Hierarch or whatever. I think 8 Vindicates is overkill.

[Aggro_zombies]

Rock might not have room for this, especially if they're already splashing white for Swords and Hierarch or whatever. I think 8 Vindicates is overkill.
This has the added benefit of being on-color for The Rock, which eases stress on your mana base.

However, I wasn't under the impression that The Rock had mana issues.

Might see play in some sort of Vorosh-colored control deck as a Vindicate that occasionally kills more than one permanent.

[rufus]

Looks like a super solid utility card. Good for playing against ETW and Spawnwraithe.

[Soto]

Looks like a super solid utility card. Good for playing against ETW and Spawnwraithe.

Do tokens have names? I don't think it would hit all ETW tokens just the one you targeted.

[Maverick676]

They are all named "goblin token."

[Watcher487]

They are all named "goblin token."

Excuse me, my good man. It's the token called 'goblin', it makes a difference when it comes to things.

[Volt]

Nice card. Might replace Engineered Explosives in Aggro-Loam.

[Aggro_zombies]

Nice card. Might replace Engineered Explosives in Aggro-Loam.
I doubt that. The great part about EE is that you can set it to two, then blow it up to take out your opponent's Counterbalance and his Tarmogoyf, all at the same time.

If anything, it would be in the Wish board. It may also be an alternative to Terminate for builds needing the targeted removal but wanting a little more flexibility.

[Volt]

The great part about EE is that you can set it to two, then blow it up to take out your opponent's Counterbalance and his Tarmogoyf, all at the same time.

True. On the other hand, EE can be stifled.

EDIT: Also, Pulse hits Tombstalker.

[memnarch]

Rock might not have room for this, especially if they're already splashing white for Swords and Hierarch or whatever. I think 8 Vindicates is overkill.

I think so too. I wouldn't compare this to vindicate but to pernicious deed for the same price(ok deed is gonna probably cost more). Deed can hit shroud creatures. And while Maelstrom Pulse can also wipe an ETW token army, deed wipes the entire board which can be very useful against explosive decks. But as far as standard this takes care of plainswalkers which is probably a huge deal.

[rleader]

I plan on getting them -- you just know they're going to make a Namers' Servant someday. :p

[KillemallCFH]

Extended Rock will eat this card up, methinks. I don't pay attention to Standard, so I don't know if it'll be played there. It is kinda funny with Mirror Weave (does card even still see play?), but a 7 mana, 2 card WoG doesn't exactly scream playable. Might pop up in a few Legacy lists, but ultimately will have little to no impact.

[Zork]

Seems bad against decks that play many of the same permanents that you do. This, for instance, sucks at ending goyf wars in your favor.

[e=mc^2]

Seems bad against decks that play many of the same permanents that you do. This, for instance, sucks at ending goyf wars in your favor.

That isn't a problem for all those bad legacy players out there who have yet to acquire Goyfs. However, unless there is more than one out, three mana is a lot to kill a Goyf when Snuff Out, Deathmark, and Diabolic Edict are around.

[MTG-Fan]

Unimpressive. 90% of the time it will be a Vindicate that can't hit lands.

I guess if you need to clear away Warrens tokens or if your opponent somehow gets lucky (lucky for you, unlucky for him?) and 3 of his goyfs within the first 5 turns of the game...

[keys]

That isn't a problem for all those bad legacy players out there who have yet to acquire Goyfs. However, unless there is more than one out, three mana is a lot to kill a Goyf when Snuff Out, Deathmark, and Diabolic Edict are around.

Smother!!

[Sek'Kuar]

Wow. There is actually a card in Alara block i care about. Congrats Wizards, you finally pulled your head out of your ass for air. How does it feel? I plan on attempting to use this in every way possible. G/B always was my favorite 2 color combo.

[memnarch]

Wow. There is actually a card in Alara block i care about. Congrats Wizards, you finally pulled your head out of your ass for air. How does it feel? I plan on attempting to use this in every way possible. G/B always was my favorite 2 color combo.

LOL Wizardz got OWNED!!! Richard Garfield in yo face!!

[AngryTroll]

That's awesome. It doesn't end Goyf wars, but neither does Deed. It does kill Counterbalance for 2 cheaper than Deed, with possible card advantage built in.

I like it. It'll probably make it into something or other that I have built.

[Cire]

This might be a stupid comment by why now a BGW rock deck running a full set of 8? I mean they are never dead cards....

The one thing i don't like, is that wizards has recently just been rehashing old cards...a lot...

Imagine

4 Maelstorm Pulse
4 Vindicate

4 Duress
4 Thought Seize

4 Mesmeric Fiend
4 Tidehollow Sculler

4 Orim's Chant
4 Silence

4 win conditions (your pick of Elspeth, Gigapeade, Goyf, Stalker, ect)

24 lands
-----

Probably not that good of a deck, but come on its amazingly consitent...on the draw you will always have at least one Vindicate effect/ Duress effect/ Nightmare effect/ and a chant effect...That's not bad...

[FoolofaTook]

The thing that's interesting about Maelstrom Pulse is that it creates the opportunity to not splash for white in Rock builds or alternately to maybe make the splash blue for things like Stifle and Brainstorm.

It's not Vindicate, but it's not clear that it's worse than Vindicate unless you're specifically targeting the opponent's mana base. It does sweep tokens also and occasionally multiples of the same permanent so it does have some advantages that Vindicate does not. It's much better against Elves as an example.

[Tog]

The problem I've encountered whenever I've played Rock is that the 3cc slot is really glutted. Deed, Finks, Witness, Equipment, Doran, Vindicate. It's hard enough as it is to cast a 3cc spell as it is with all the mana pressure with Wastelands and Dazes in Legacy. I don't think a 3 cc removal spell is going to make the cut. Just my two cents.

[mercenarybdu]

This is an awesome card. Serves as an extention cord to Vindicate, although it can't kill lands. Yet what makes up for the land killing is an echo effect.

I still plan to gain a hold of a set of them to see what I could do with them.

[Giles]

I think what it boils down to this question: 1GB easier to cast than 1WB? (Not Nukeing lands aside.)

[eq.firemind]

Trainwreck WANTS this card!

[humppa]

This definitely makes eva-green better. But then again, I don't play Eva Green anyways.
It's to slow for Eva Green. And not better then krosan/deed/seal/snuff out .. etc...

But it's a very nice card to a highlander deck :-)

[Wargoos]

AND it's already 42$/ set on ebay.

[mercenarybdu]

It's to slow for Eva Green. And not better then krosan/deed/seal/snuff out .. etc...

But it's a very nice card to a highlander deck :-)

True, but then again, it gives us another option on the table for G/B.

[citanul]

To pricey for what it is. Vindicate is superiour. It's decent in type2 but will almost always result in a 1 for 1 trade. Sure it kills of generated tokens but it's 1 card that made those anyway: Spectral, Bitterblossom, Cloudgoat Ranger... In the case of the last 2 you don't even deal with the original problem.

It's still good though but I think the prices are a bit to high now for what it's worth. O-Ring does basicly the same except for solving the token issue and that card doesn't see play in type2 top decks. I give it three months before prices drop and I get my set.

[Skeggi]

So far this is the best card I've seen in ARB.

[Valdez]

more vindicates for truffle shuffle... \o/

[sauce]

its not the worst but vindicate is better.

[quicksilver]

The only thing I am worried about with this spell is you will probably often want to sue it to kill an goyf. However this card is green and you will almost certainly be playing goyfs yourself. It seems like the situation may come up often where you cannot kill their goyf without killing your own.

Also I do not think it will be better than vindicate in eva green since vindicate will often want to go for the lands in that deck.

[Skeggi]

Also I do not think it will be better than vindicate in eva green since vindicate will often want to go for the lands in that deck.
The problem here is that most Eva Green lists don't run white.

[Arsenal]

Eva Green, being a tempo-based Suicide variant, typically runs removal that is either free (Snuff Out) or pre-emptive (Seal of Primoridum). Pulse is neither.

[Skeggi]

Well, I run 3 Putrifies in my Eva Green, and I really like them. But sometimes I hate it that they can't blow up enchantments. Here I see my problem solved :cool:.

[Arsenal]

But sometimes I hate it that they can't blow up enchantments.

That's what Seal of Primordium is for. Also, if you're not running Snuff Out, I assume you're coming across a fair number of black creatures in your meta. If this is the case, if Putrefy really the best option? Outside of Tombstalker, Smother should be able to hit every relevant black nasty you see.

[leander?]

I give it three months before prices drop and I get my set.
I really want just one for my LoamWishboard, but I suppose I´ll have to wait indeed before I can get one for a reasonable price. It sucks, but I´m not going to spend a vindicate-ish price for this.

Edit - @MTG-Fan: Err.. is that a serious question? The difference is that it costs :1: less, is an Instant and nukes lands. Ofcourse it's better that way. But it's just not realistic.

[C.P.]

It is awesome in EDH. Take that, Pegasus tokens!

In Legacy, it suffers from comparison to vindicate and Swords. However, if you want to stick to BG, this may not be a bad option. Random ability to deal with ETW and Bridge Tokens are handy, too.

@Suggested BG version: There are other formats in magic, you know. Have you heard of this thing called Playing with more than 5 basic lands? Oh, and I heard there is this thing called standard which does not have a good stone rain effect for 3cc.

[MattH]

It may be the casual player in me speaking, but I really like how this embiggens Woodlurker Mimic.

[Jak]

I don't think it will see too much play in Legacy. 3cc Sorcery that is pretty much worse than Vindicate isn't all too hot. No decks that could pack both will. I also see the Echoing Truth effect be more of a negative than a bonus.

[Volt]

It may be the casual player in me speaking, but I really like how this embiggens Woodlurker Mimic.

That's a perfectly cromulent observation.

[godryk]

The only thing I am worried about with this spell is you will probably often want to sue it to kill an goyf. However this card is green and you will almost certainly be playing goyfs yourself. It seems like the situation may come up often where you cannot kill their goyf without killing your own.

I'm wondering if this isn't the same situation as when playing EE@2, as many decks play EE with CB and Tarmogoyf, so you may find you facing a Goyf war and then drawing some Explosives. Those situations do happen, but the cards are still played all together in a bunch of decks. I'm not comparing the power of these two cards, I'm just pointing out that I think this kind of scenario sometimes happens in current Legacy.

[Mayk0l]

True. On the other hand, EE can be stifled.

EDIT: Also, Pulse hits Tombstalker.


This is very true. For R/G/x Aggro Loam, Tombstalker is a threat they have a very hard time dealing with (usually they'll need Devastating Dreams). It's the reason they're starting to play Terminate more often. Three mana is hardly a problem considering Tombstalker usually isn't an early play and hitting three mana with Loam isn't that hard, and the uses of this card go beyond taking out a creature. It's solid!

[Infinitium]

I'm wondering whether this can replace Deed in UGB Intuition control shells. The prevalence of Stifle, Stalker and Grip and the fact that it pumps Goyf might give this one up for the 3cc spot, especially as Deed is often just a 5+ mana answer for singleton threats.

[Skeggi]

Deed is very good at blowing up Mishra's Factories and Mutavaults, something this card is less talented at. I think that's a vital distinction.

[Infinitium]

Aye, I've been considering that as well. My personal build runs Smothers and the singleton Waste though so might be better equipped to deal with them otherwise. I'm definetly going to test it in the Deed spots before dissmissing it though.

[Arsenal]

I'm wondering whether this can replace Deed in UGB Intuition control shells. The prevalence of Stifle, Stalker and Grip and the fact that it pumps Goyf might give this one up for the 3cc spot, especially as Deed is often just a 5+ mana answer for singleton threats.

I don't think Pulse is comparable to Deed. Aside from the actual removal of permanents, Deed drastically changes the way your opponent plays the game if you stick one early. True, it might get Gripped, but I doubt your opponent will be dropping my permanents during the time it took to find Grip, allowing you to work yourself into an advantageous position (even after Grip is used on Deed).

[AnwarA101]

Also I do not think it will be better than vindicate in eva green since vindicate will often want to go for the lands in that deck.

I respectfully disagree. When I saw the card the other day, I was very excited. I worry mostly about it being slow, but giving you a maindeck way to deal with artifacts and enchanments while still having removal for black creatures seems really good. I plan to swap out the 3 of slot for this card.

[zulander]

I'm definitely playing this in GBR Loam. It's a bit more expensive but it's worth it! Hitting 2x oblivion rings with one card seems really good. It also seems retarded good against merfolk and goblins, "Hello aether vial, say hello to my little friend"

[Anusien]

Oh great, another card that makes the counterbalance mirror MORE random.

More answers is "more random"? Wut? ~NC

[Shawon]

They should've called this Echoing Destruction, or just Echoing Something, to mimic the Echoing cycle from Darksteel. Maelstrom Pulse sounds boring.

[Anusien]

More answers is "more random"? Wut? ~NC
It's like Engineered Explosives. It's an incredibly powerful, incredibly swingy answer that cares about how many copies of each card people have drawn. Sometimes one guy will draw two Tarmogoyfs, the other guy will draw zero, and it ends in a different sort of blowout, especially when they are potentially one-sided. All the cards are so powerful and obvious that it's hard to get an edge other than better draws. At least Krosan Grip was interesting.

[Ch@os]

Seems like UGB Thres`h gains a revival with this card, destroys troublesome enchantments like CB, Humility usw...

[sauce]

Seems like UGB Thres`h gains a revival with this card, destroys troublesome enchantments like CB, Humility usw...

krosan grip does that better.

[quicksilver]

krosan grip does that better.

However this can be played main. Also can destroy attackers if they draw a more agro hand and not a counterbalance hand. Also you can play this in additioan to krosan grip allowing you more answers to coutnerblaance without getting flooded on dead cards if you draw more answeres than they draw counterbalances.

[Happy Gilmore]

This card is extremely good. I would go for far as to say as good as Pernicious deeds. Unlike deed it is quite a bit faster and can answer Tombstalker. This card will see play in legacy, that I am sure of. Eva Green is doing a little dance right now.

[leander?]

They should've called this Echoing Destruction, or just Echoing Something, to mimic the Echoing cycle from Darksteel. Maelstrom Pulse sounds boring.
I actually do like the name. Re-using "Echoing" would be kindof lame and unoriginal actually.

coutnerblaance
I think that will be my new nickname for 'Balance:tongue:

[georgjorge]

Seems like UGB Thres`h gains a revival with this card, destroys troublesome enchantments like CB, Humility usw...


Yep, Oblivion Rings for everyone ! The Rings have gained popularity in UGW Thresh, and now black has one as well.

[Korsakow]

Nice One, i don't know if it's realy good for Eva Green (Sorcery, cc3, not proactive), but hey: Train Wreck is back.
Maybe it's also a good choice for the Rock in addition to Vindicate and not as full 4 of.

[Happy Gilmore]

Nice One, i don't know if it's realy good for Eva Green (Sorcery, cc3, not proactive), but hey: Train Wreck is back.
Maybe it's also a good choice for the Rock in addition to Vindicate and not as full 4 of.

It answers so so many problem cards for the deck. And is a perfect replacement for Seal of Primordium.

[Korsakow]

Right, it answers.
It's perhaps not realy principle-consistent for Eva Green. Eva Green does not answer preboard, it tries to jump in your face.

2cent

[AnwarA101]

Right, it answers.
It's perhaps not realy principle-consistent for Eva Green. Eva Green does not answer preboard, it tries to jump in your face.

2cent

The disruption that Eva Green plays is very similar to what you would consider an answer. Cards like Thoughtseize, Hymn to Tourach, and Sinkhole largely answer cards before they actually become spells. In this sense they are answers and they can't be really considered threats. In addition to these, cards like Snuff Out and Seal of Primordium are answers for cards that are actually make into play.

The fact that Eva Green is aggressive does not mean that the deck is focused entirely on threats. Its a combination of disruption and threats that allows the archetype to work. Imagine the deck without the disruption and you'll see what I mean.

[Korsakow]

Hmm, Snuff Out seems to be the only card, that is played in response to a thread, and that one is often played for cc0. The rest of the board is mana, thread or proactive.
Maelstrom is not a total failure, but does not follow the same plan.
What does Mealstorm destroy, that Seal doesn't? Planeswalkers and Creatures. There is allready Spotremoval in the pile, does Eva need more? So it is just for the walkers.
What does Seal destroy, that Mealstrom does not? Mishras for instance.

If Trash would not play cc3, i would perhaps consider it for MD, but more and more Trash-Builds start to play Grips and Predators MD, so it is also not absolutely CB safe.

In the end, it is all just theory, i will try it anyway, but i don't beleive it is better than Seal.

2cent :-)

[HdH_Cthulhu]

Maelstrom Pulse is bad in the Mirror : /

[Fossil4182]

I think the card has some utility, but in all reality there aren't a lot of times you're going to benefit from the ability to hit multiple copies of a given cards. And if you can't, its strictly a worse Vindicate.

I almost feel like this card falls into the danger of cool things.

[URABAHN]

Since we didn't have a tournament yesterday we did some playtesting. I ran Eva Green with 3x Pulse and playtested 10 games vs RGW Zoo, 2 games vs Holistic Wisdom "combo", and about 6 vs Elf Survival. Everyone involved in the playtesting felt that in those matchups splashing White for Vindicate would probably have been just as good as Pulse. There were many times I felt Putrefy would have been better (against those decks, anyway) because it's an instant and I almost always targeted a creature. There were 2 or 3 times in all the testing that Pulse hit two of their creatures and just about cemented the game for Eva Green. I haven't tested against any other matchups, if you have I'd like to hear your thoughts.

[FoolofaTook]

I think the card has some utility, but in all reality there aren't a lot of times you're going to benefit from the ability to hit multiple copies of a given cards. And if you can't, its strictly a worse Vindicate.

I almost feel like this card falls into the danger of cool things.

If it cost BW1 it would be a worse Vindicate. Costing BG1 it's not clear that that is the case, given that it does many of the things you rely on Vindicate to do, a few additional things that don't quite make up the difference, and yet does not require a white spalsh which might well make up the difference.

You have to take into account the fact that Vindicate requires a passive white splash in the deck, whereas Maelstrom Pulse combines two colors that are generally more explosive, particularly in combination.

[lolosoon]

Worst Vindicate or not, the price tag is the same than the previous permanent hoser sorcery !

I'd rather put some bucks on 2 Scrublands to fetch and splash W for my old 'cates than buy a playset of those pulses...