[Deck] AggroStill (CoatlGro)

[Dark_Shakuras]

http://sales.starcitygames.com/cardscans/MAGALARA_REBORN/LorescaleCoatl.jpghttp://sales.starcitygames.com/cardscans/MAGODY/standstill.jpg


Background:

The deck began as a way to break Coatl. Basically Sockmonkey and I were looking for a way to bust it in half. I figured out Coatl and Standstill are sick shit, and monkey said Dreadstill is great, but Nought could go.

Thus AggroStill was born. The deck started as a quick swap of nought's and stifle for coatl and goyf. We quickly found removal was needed, and Swords flew into the deck. Shortly after we pulled wasteland because without Stifle is was just under whelming.



Current List:

3 [ON] Polluted Delta
3 [ON] Flooded Strand
2 Tundra
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (1)
3 [GUR] Island
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (3)
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (2)
4 Tropical Island

4 [FUT] Tarmogoyf
4 [ARB] Lorescale Coatl

4 [CS] Counterbalance
4 [OD] Standstill
4 [CST] Brainstorm
4 [AL] Force of Will
3 [DD2] Daze
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
3 [LRW] Ponder
3 [DIS] Spell Snare
4 [CST] Swords to Plowshares

SB: 2 [IA] Hydroblast
SB: 3 [B] Blue Elemental Blast
SB: 3 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 3 [FD] Engineered Explosives
SB: 2 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
SB: 2 [TSB] Tormod's Crypt



[b]Card Choices:

Goyf and Coatl: I consider Coatl to be better than goyf in this deck. He is the same size 1-2 turns later, but pitch's to force, can grow larger, can't be Spell Snared, and is not going to fall prey to Balance and Chalice nearly as often. Both however are amazingly under-costed, and thus are run.

Balance and Top: The mana curve of the deck supports them nicely. Because we rely on dropping a threat and riding the victory, and because we have so few threats, we need a way to make sure it lives. CB is reusable, and is on of the best ways on ensuring this.

Standstill: In theory it would be great to drop a Coatl and then a still, and watch them fold. It has been done, but is often not. More importantly it is a huge CA machine, and in fact i sometime drop Still w/o a way to win under it (besides decking) just to watch them break it anyways fearing letting it sit. It is truly a strong card in this format, and with Factory, is all but broken.

Spell Snare, Daze, Force: Basic disruption package in Legacy. Force is a auto-include, and Daze and Spell Snare are both time tested staples.

Swords: We run swords over other like Snuff Out for many reasons. Considering we only run 4 removal spells, we need to be able to hit anything. Snuff Out does not do that. Also Swords can in a pitch be used on a goyf, or huge Coatl to gain some life should you be swarmed, or otherwise unable to win before it gets that bad. Grant it if this happens your probably in bad shape, but the option is there.

Sideboard: Grip is pretty standard. Relic/Crypt split is to stop Needle and Chalice. Yes Relic hits your goyfs, but it is worth it against decks like Ichorid, where if they drop a chalice or needle on Crypt your 6/7 goyf may not be enough. Blasts are for burn and other red crap. These are kinda just filler slots as of now, until we can get some more testing done to figure out exactly what is needed. If you have any idea's shoot. EE can be recurred, and is used for goblin, and zombie swarms. It can also be used to take out troublesome things like crucible or threads.



[b]Match-Ups:

As a pre-note, most of the match's are tested on MWS against fellow Sourcers. That said, we do not think the deck has been tested enough to give definite results, and thus are just giving initial reactions to the few test games we have done.

Thresh: A pretty even match-up. Both decks play similar. I would like to think we have the advantage running better cards in a vacuum, but Thresh has been tested and picked card for card into the perfect balance.

Team America: Not as great as would be liked. The LD and kill spells are pretty tough. Add 5/5 flyers to the mix, and it just turns rough.

Storm Combo: Pretty good. We run a lot of counterspells, and our clock can be quick. However Storm Combo is Storm Combo, but the match-up is still in our favor.

Eva Green: Not bad at all. At first this match-up looked dismal. But after some testing, Coatl's and goyfs could beat down fast enough to win the game. Going first helps a HUGH amount, and Spell Snare is MVP!

More to come, give it time.



Credits: Thanks Sockmonkey for helping build this gem. Also all the sourcers who both got crushed, and lucksacked yourselves into wins. :tongue:

[Holo_rip]

i've try such a build last week with a buddy of mine. Here is what i have conclude.

Yes this kind of deck have potential, coatl can grow very quickly to a 10/10 with such a shell.
You need to diversify your threat. I suggest cutting on the counter package (wich is in my opinion too heavy) and adding 2 shackle (and maybe one more island to support it).

Standstill is bad. You can't really abuse it. For it to be effective you have to either : have a factory or have a threat on the board. In both case, you generally tap out to do this. This is bad, you can't let this happens, because except for free counter, you won't be able to protect your threat. The best i have found so far as a draw engine is accumulated knowledge.

I would also fill in 2 EE, because otherwise you have no out to an resolve enchantment (and you have already the ruins).


All in all, great deck.


Edit : as for myself, i didn't run CB/top.

the list :

lands (22) :
4 flooded strand
4 windswepth heath
4 tundra
4 tropical island
2 island
1 plain
1 forest
2 academy ruin


creature (10) :
4 tarmogoyf
4 Lorescale Coatl
2 jace beleren


permission (11) :
4 force of will
4 counterspell
3 spellsnare


control (9)
4 sword to plowshare
3 engineered explosive
2 vedalken shackle

draw (8) :
4 brainstorm
4 accumulated knowledge

[Dark_Shakuras]

i've try such a build last week with a buddy of mine. Here is what i have conclude.

Yes this kind of deck have potential, coatl can grow very quickly to a 10/10 with such a shell.
You need to diversify your threat. I suggest cutting on the counter package (wich is in my opinion too heavy) and adding 2 shackle (and maybe one more island to support it).
Standstill is bad. For it to be effective you have to either : have a factory or have a threat on the board. In both case, you generally tap out to do this. This is bad, you can't let this happens, because except for free counter, you won't be able to protect your threat. The best i have found so far as a draw engine is accumulated knowledge.

I would also fill in 2 EE, because otherwise you have no out to an resolve enchantment (and you have already the ruins).


All in all, great deck.

First thanks. It has been coming along quite well.

More threats i'm not to sold on. Although I love the idea of shackles (and we also though about sower) the deck is a little more Control than Aggro Control. I do think your might be right about the shackles though, and I think i will try and fit some in the board to try them out.

I think you are shorting standstill. You can play it turn 2 w/ nothing down, knowing you will draw a factory. The smart play there is to actually break it fast, and many players just let you draw 3. Worst case, you pitch it to force.

Thought about EE main deck. The problem is what do we need to kill game 1? Yes there are a few problem cards, but for the most part we can counter it (humility, and moat come down turn 4 and EE does not answer them anyways) or EE does not really help (see moat). Maybe we are missing something, but so far i have never really felt like I wanted EE main. There just never seems to be anything to blow up. Also the 1 ruins is there for the SB EE's so if EE's got cut the ruins becomes a Island.

If I am overlooking anything please let me know.

[elof]

If you have no board, then dropping a Standstill means you have 4 mishras and your opponent probebly has at least 3-4 Wastelands. Simple put, dropping an early Standstill is not your thing.

Also, against decks that can swarm out critters/threats, standstill is aslo bad. Your opponent can get a monster grip and then EOT or when he has 8 cards in hand break standstill and swarm out. You'll have 7 counters for this but it will not probebly be enough against, for example ANT/Solidarity/Natural Order.

[Holo_rip]

You might be right about standstill. Maybe i have just overlook it because of the shell i was running, and because i feel more confortable by having mana open to counter stuff and if nothing happen draw at the end of turn.
Also, i feel more confortable by controling the beginning of the game, then drop a threat and ride to victory.

A thread that you should look into is the TEC (The Epic Control) one. While it is a control deck, you can find some piece of advice that are worth looking into i think (i build my version with TEC in mind in fact).

[Waikiki]

I fail to see why you run academy ruins.

[Elfrago]

In a format where people are usually packing 4 Mishra's, 4 Wastes and sometimes even Vial to abuse of Standstill you're trying to compete with them with only 4 Mishra's... might as well replace Standstill with something else (hint: with Top, Brainstorm Ponder and CB Predict is nice).

[Bahamuth]

The above post is a good point. I'd try to fit in at least 2 more land that function under Standstill. You really don't want the card to fuck yourself. Wasteland doesn't seem that strong here, so you might try Mutavault instead. Tolaria West could be possible too, which would validate a mainboard EE much more.

Your land count seems a little on the low side. I'd try to add 1 if possible.

This number of threats seems fine to me. I wouldn't add any more, especially since there aren't really any that are as good as Coatl.

I'd consider this:
-1 Ruins (I don't think this is worth it for being colourless)
-1 Top
-1 Ponder
+1 Tolaria West
+1 Mutavault
+1 EE

I'm unsure on wether cutting Ponder and Top is the right call. I especially doubt cutting a Ponder. I don't really see what could come out instead though.

[Dark_Shakuras]

Yeah, might have to add more man lands. How bad is Faerie conclave...

;-P

[Bahamuth]

Yeah, might have to add more man lands. How bad is Faerie conclave...

;-P

Like really bad. Don't play that...

[zulander]

There's nothing really aggro about this deck. This deck should be called Coatl Still or Snake Still or SomethingThatDoesn'tSignifyAggroBecauseThisDeckPlaysEightCreaturesThatAreNotLands Still.

Other than that I'm not too sold on the idea. Standstill is sick because it comes down early, but with a creature that comes down on turn 3 then standstill comes down turn 4 at earliest - not so great.

[lolosoon]

Other than that I'm not too sold on the idea. Standstill is sick because it comes down early, but with a creature that comes down on turn 3 then standstill comes down turn 4 at earliest - not so great.
This.

Standstill in DreadStill is neat, 'cause it easily lets you draw your stifle-nought 2 card combo.

Drawing coatl from a triggred Standstill allows you to put in play a 3/3 vanilla beatStick... The power gap betwen those two examples is huge.

Ancestral Visions could be really useful if you play an heavy controlish build (with schakles and a big counterWall that need to be refilled from time to time...).

[xsockmonkeyx]

Ive been helping with this so I figured I'd say some things. This deck is basically dreadstill with the stiflenought gutted out and replaced by creatures that dont get you 2 for 1'd like a boss. Its halfway between NQG and dreadstill and plays as such. There is the clunkiness you would expect but some benefits of both. It can either go really well and play out like NQG with actual card advantage, or it can go shitty and play out like landstill without all the landstilly goodness to back up your standstill. One thing is that there is no synergy between coatl and standstill, and you are not waiting until turn 4 to drop SS after coatl, just like youre objective with dreadstill isnt to drop nought then still. You're using SS purely for CA and hoping to drop it ASAP.

@D_S: what is the Academy Ruins for? Seems pretty useless IMO.

[Dark_Shakuras]

@D_S: what is the Academy Ruins for? Seems pretty useless IMO.

I have no idea what your talking about... <_< >_>


Also thanks for explaining it better than me. ;-P