[Deck] A new take on FEB

[ACME_Myst]

I. Introduction

So, while I don't actually play Magic regularly anymore, I still enjoy the occasional deckbuilding challenge. Some time ago I started toying around with FEB.

FEB, for those who don't know it, is short for Full English Breakfast. It's an old-skool combo-control deck that uses Survival of the Fittest to do all sorts of nasty things with Volrath's Shapeshifter. Go look up some of the original lists, they're awesome.

II. Development

Anyway, the deck was updated in the past to incorporate the Stifle-Nought combo, Tarmogoyf and some updated protection/kill mechanisms. I started out with a rather ordinairy list, but soon found out that Tarmogoyf just wasn't working for me. This was mostly due to the fact that I didn't run enough stuff to fuel my graveyard effectively, and because I had lots of other, better threats. By the time the opponent had filled his graveyard enough to turn Goyf into a relevant threat, I would've already have resolved Dreadnought, Shifter/Something or Survival.
I also noticed that I never used Stifle for anything else than enabling Dreadnought. Because I didn't have any Wastelands and/or Dazes to back them up, mana denial was never a valid strategy.

I then stumbled upon the DreadStalker thread (here (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12531)). Of course I knew that Vision Charm could be used as a Dreadnought enabler, but I had never thought about the synergy it has with Tombstalker. After this, my reasoning went like this:

- In this deck, I cannot effectively use Tarmogoyf as a fast and relevant threat.
- Stifle is just being used as a Dreadnought enabler
- If I cut Goyf and Stifle and replace them with Tombstalker and Vision Charm, I get:
* A 1 CC enabler for 8 cards, which is dead less often than an enabler for 4 cards
* Better creature to pitch to Shifter if you don't have Survival
* Delve! Nice, now I have better control of the top of my graveyard
* Delve! Nice, now I can (to some extend) shrink opposing Goyfs
* Randomly milling the top 4 cards to burn through a bad SDT
* Protecting Dreadnoughts and Shifter-Noughts by phasing them out in response to removal

So, after reworking the manabase, I came up with the following list:

III. Decklist



Full English Breakfast

// Mana (25)
4 Polluted Delta
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Windswept Heath
3 Tropical Island
3 Bayou
2 Underground Sea
2 Island
2 Forest
1 Swamp

4 Birds of Paradise

// Beaters (11)
4 Volrath's Shapeshifter
4 Phyrexian Dreadnought
3 Tombstalker

// Utility Creatures (3)
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
1 Psychatog
1 Shriekmaw

// Kill Switch (3)
1 Palinchron
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath
1 Phage the Untouchable

// Protection (4)
4 Force of Will

// Dig (6)
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Lim-Dul's Vault

// Enablers (8)
4 Survival of the Fittest
4 Vision Charm

// Proposed Sideboard (15)
4 Annul
3 Krosan Grip
3 Divert
3 Engineered Plague
2 Ground Seal


IV. Card choices

Manabase
Nothing much to say about this. It still sucks that we don't have an U/G fetchland. 8 Fetches to grab any color you want, fuel the GY for Tombstalker, and provide shuffle effects for SDT. 5 Basics gives you a nice capability to fight against Wasteland. 4 Birds provide acceleration and pitchfood for Survival.

Beaters
Volrath's Shapeshifter: The heart and soul of the deck. Comboes with Dreadnought, Tombstalker, Survival, LDV and any fatty you randomly draw. They can also be Survivaled for if you need something to pitch to Force of Will.

Dreadnought: Your main kill mechanism. Use Vision Charm or Shapeshifter as enablers. Turn 2 Nought wins so many games it isn't even funny.

Tombstalker: Nice evasive fatty. Use Vision Charm, Shapeshifter, or reaching the mid-game as enablers. Note you can use Delve to control the top of your graveyard, keep stuff out of the way of Extirpate, and possibly shrink opposing Goyfs.

Utility Creatures
Squee, Goblin Nabob: What Survival deck could do without one? I don't actually use it that often, but you can grab it in a pinch if you want to grind it out against control.

Psychatog: It can be used as a late-game finisher, but it's main purpose is to give you control of your graveyard. Note you can actually drop this on top with Shifter in play, use Shifter-Tog to remove stuff so the card you want on top becomes the second-to-top card, then remove Tog itself with Shifter-Tog. It's quite obvious, but I just wanted to point that out.

Shriekmaw: This kills creatures that are randomly annoying, and you can use its Fear to force through an attacking Shapeshifter.

Kill Switch
Palinchron: This is actually the single slot I can't decide on. For the moment it's taken by Palinchron, but I'm considering a whole lot of cards. More on that later. Palinchron is used to set up Shapeshifter with enough land untapped to search Akroma and Phage on the same turn you play the Shifter.

Akroma, Angel of Wrath: This allows you to generate a Hasty, evasive Shapeshifter which you can then turn into Phage the Untouchable (or just beat for 6). Also, randomly drawing into this with Shapeshifter in play isn't that bad.

Phage the Untouchable: Turn an unblocked Shapeshifter into Phage and win on the spot. Good times.

Dig
Sensei's Divining Top: If you don't have Survival, this lets you find more threats. If you do have Survival, you can go apeshit with shuffle effects and get the best card quality ever.

Lim-Dul's Vault: This tutors for anything you need. Note it´s a valid play to drop Shapeshifter, then during your next upkeep play LDV into Phage and win (assuming no blockers of course. In that case, just go grab Dreadnought or something).

Enablers
Survival of the Fittest: This card makes sure you can keep pumping threats, and enables your combo-finish through Shapeshifter-Phage.

Vision Charm: Enables both Dreadnought and Tombstalker as turn 2 plays. You can also randomly use it to protect Dreadnought from removal, burn through a bad SDT, 'counter' an opposing topdeck tutor, or during your opponent's EOT, phase out that pesky Tormod's Crypt/Relic of Progenitus and combo during your turn.

Sideboard
Krosan Grip: Kills stuff you don't like seeing, like Tormod's Crypt, Relic of Progenitus, Pithing Needle, Leyline of the Void... The usual suspects.

Annul: See above. Probably also works against storm combo to some degree.

Divert: Very nice against Sui style decks (nice Hymn) or against control.

Engineered Plague: Board this in against Solidarity. Too bad it sucks against tribal aggro though.

Ground Seal: In case you expect Extirpate, and it's nice against Loam too!

V. Test Results

This is what actually got me to make this post. So far, I haven't done any controlled testing sessions yet, but the results seem quite good. This definitely needs more testing, but just to give you an idea, here's the matches I've played so far (the ones I can remember at least):

2-0 vs Sligh (mws)
0-2 vs Merfolk (mws)
3-0 vs Uwr Control Slaver (teammate, all preboard. Runs a metric fuckton of (mass)removal)
8-0 vs Ugb Goodstuff.dec (teammate, all preboard. Maindecks Extirpate)
4-1 vs Uwr Control Slaver (teammate, all preboard. See above)
2-0 vs Ugr Thrash (mws)
2-0 vs Ugx ?? Some tempo deck (mws)
2-1 vs Merfolk (mws)

And yes, I know mws isn't the best platform the test decks on, but it's the best I can do for the moment. Still, going 23-4 must count for something, and at least they were all tier 1-2 decks.

VI. Random Thoughts

- Damn, this deck is a blast to play!

- No, this deck doesn't roll over and die if you counter the first Survival / Nought / Stalker and start to apply pressure. On the contrary, this deck seems to keep on pumping threats like nobody's bussiness.

- No, losing combat damage stacking with M10 doesn't hurt the deck that much. You win half the time through Dreadnought/Shifter-Nought anyway, and the other half of the time people can't seem to block my Akroma on turn 4.

- No, graveyard hate doesn't kill you. Tombstalker and Nought are threats that don't use the graveyard (actively at least), and Survival allows you to bait a lot. Also, don't forget you can use Vision Charm to remove Crypt/Relic during your opponent's turn.

- I can't decide on the last open slot (currently filled by Palinchron). Options I'm considering include (but are not limited to): Palinchron, Genesis, Quirion Ranger, Plaxmanta, Kira Great Glass-Spinner, Eternal Witness, Gigapede, Stinkweed Imp, Venser Shaper Savant, Mulldrifter, and a whole lot of other things I can't think of right now.

- Yes, the deck can be quite difficult to play correctly. If you decide to give it a shot, you'll notice that you have an extreme amount of options. Personally I consider that a good thing, but if you like playing simple decks, this one isn't for you.

- All comments and questions are welcome :)

[AngryTroll]

Things I like about your list:

21 lands and 4 Birds is solid. I'm a glutton for extra lands.

Top. Top and Survival are disgusting in the same deck. I'd make it a four of; you will ALWAYS want it. Even if you go turn two Dreadnought-Vision Charm, Top will help you dig yourself out of the card-disadvantage hole you've dug for yourself.

Vision Charm is more proactive in your list that Stifle is in other lists, as it feeds both Tombstalker and Dreadnought (and can even save Dreadnought from a Swords).

Tombstalker flies over Goyfs if you are ahead in the damage race.

21 creatures for Survival. It's easy to start running short on creatures.



The real question is how your deck compares to this one, lifted out of the Full English Breakfast Thread:



4 Birds of Paradise
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Shapeshifter
4 Phrexian Dreadnaught

1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath
1 Phage, the Untouchable
1 Psychatog

4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Stifle
4 Survival of the Fittest
3 Reanimate / Unearth
4 Force of Will

4 Tropical Island
3 Bayou
6-8 Fetches
3-5 Forests (depending on how many fetches you run)


I think I'd update this list to have 4 Noble Hierarch instead of Birds (there's, what, 3 Reanimates and 1 Tog that cost B?), and probably add a land over Shapeshifter number four and a Ponder over Dreadnought number four.

This list basically has the creature base of Dreadstill (plus Shapeshifters), the best part of the Survival decks (Squee and Goyfs, with Hierarchs for Exalted, and Shapeshifters if you need to win in a hurry), the cantrip engine of Thresh (4 Ponder + 4 Brainstorm is amazing), and a win condition that dodges Counterbalance (Shapeshifter at 3cc). You trade countermagic and mana disruption for this, with only 4 Force and 4 Stifle instead of 4 Force, 4 Counterbalance, 4 Daze, and sometimes 4 Stifles (and 3 Wastelands).

Tombstalker flies, but Goyf doesn't need assistance to sneak into play early like Tombstalker does. With 4 Brainstorm, 4 Ponder, and 7 or 8 fetches, Goyf should be solid early game, and with artifacts and enchantments in the deck, Goyf can get as big as any Thresh deck can make him.

On the other hand, Tombstalker never gets stuck at being a 2/3, flies over Goyfs and Goblins, and can shrink opponent's Goyfs, all for the same CMC as Goyf.

Your list is certainly interesting. I'd be tempted to sleeve up one and then the other and play with both for a while. I like how you've approached the deck from a different direction to see what happens. I'm especially interested to see how Palinchron treats you; if you set up Palinchron before Shapeshifter, is it better than Hypnox?

[TheLion]

- Stifle is just being used as a Dreadnought enabler
- Delve! Nice, now I have better control of the top of my graveyard


I think, Stifle is good on its own on far more things than just mana denial, which obviously doesn't work. (Deed, EE, Storm, Grindstone, ...)

So, was this Delve point really ever relevant?



Psychatog: It can be used as a late-game finisher, but it's main purpose is to give you control of your graveyard. Note you can actually drop this on top with Shifter in play, use Shifter-Tog to remove stuff so the card you want on top becomes the second-to-top card, then remove Tog itself with Shifter-Tog. It's quite obvious, but I just wanted to point that out.


Though I know and played this trick, too, in the end I felt, that it happens or is needed maybe 1 out of 30 games. I also only rarely needed the GY control aspect, so I dropped it.



Palinchron: This is actually the single slot I can't decide on. For the moment it's taken by Palinchron, but I'm considering a whole lot of cards. More on that later. Palinchron is used to set up Shapeshifter with enough land untapped to search Akroma and Phage on the same turn you play the Shifter.


IMO, it's only good, to win one turn 3. Since that happens so seldom, because you need the perfect hand, I'd rather go with Hypnox or something, which acts like an alternative win condition, too, most of the time.



Sensei's Divining Top: If you don't have Survival, this lets you find more threats. If you do have Survival, you can go apeshit with shuffle effects and get the best card quality ever.


I'd rather play Brainstorm and maybe Ponder. SDT is just too mana intensive for me.



- Damn, this deck is a blast to play!


Definitively.



- No, losing combat damage stacking with M10 doesn't hurt the deck that much. You win half the time through Dreadnought/Shifter-Nought anyway, and the other half of the time people can't seem to block my Akroma on turn 4.


This is my biggest concern actually. I mean without trample damage on stack, the combo already fails, if the opponent has a Bird or something...

I thought about: Flowstone Hellion, to attack with a 23/1 Dreadnought. Or Rafiq of the Many, to attack with a 13/13 Trample Doublestriker. Or Cephalid Inkshrouder. Discard Hellion for Inkshrouder, attack, discard Inkshrouder for Phage. Discard Phage. It costs only two activations, too.

I am glad, that some people still work on FEB, though I tend to rebuild my FEB to Welder Survival (which is the same blast to play), due to M10 combat changes.

[Ranarion]

I think I'd update this list to have 4 Noble Hierarch instead of Birds (there's, what, 3 Reanimates and 1 Tog that cost B?)
I think that BoP are better in this deck because they can make the Shapeshifter fly over blockers. But I'm not shure wether it's possible after M10...

[ACME_Myst]

I'm especially interested to see how Palinchron treats you; if you set up Palinchron before Shapeshifter, is it better than Hypnox?

It's not been that great so far. If it would be, I wouldn't doubt about this slot that much. I've considered Hypnox, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's more useful than Palinchron. I'll test this when I have the time.



I think, Stifle is good on its own on far more things than just mana denial, which obviously doesn't work. (Deed, EE, Storm, Grindstone, ...)


It is. I just noticed that in roughly 10 games or so, I've used it only once to stop an EE. In all the other games, it was either used on Nought, pitched to Force, or sitting in my hand doing nothing.



So, was this Delve point really ever relevant?


Yes, I've actually been using that a lot. It's mostly useful if you hit the mid-late game though.



Though I know and played this trick, too, in the end I felt, that it happens or is needed maybe 1 out of 30 games. I also only rarely needed the GY control aspect, so I dropped it.


This sounds really strange to me. In any game where you cannot win undisrupted, I've really liked the ability to keep useless stuff off the top off my GY.



I'd rather play Brainstorm and maybe Ponder. SDT is just too mana intensive for me.


Seriously? I know there's been a discussion about this in the old FEB thread, and I think the argument was that if you don't have Survival, SDT is the better card to have once you've reached the mid game. Also, with 25 manasources, you don't really need the early game cantrips to hit your manacurve.



This is my biggest concern actually. I mean without trample damage on stack, the combo already fails, if the opponent has a Bird or something...

I thought about: Flowstone Hellion, to attack with a 23/1 Dreadnought. Or Rafiq of the Many, to attack with a 13/13 Trample Doublestriker. Or Cephalid Inkshrouder. Discard Hellion for Inkshrouder, attack, discard Inkshrouder for Phage. Discard Phage. It costs only two activations, too.


Seriously, it's not an issue. If your opponent has Birds, just drop a Nought in the GY, kill a manasource and deal 11 damage, then try again next turn.
If you have the mana to go Hellion->Inkshrouder->Phage, you might as well go Akroma->Shriekmaw->Phage and use Fear to force through your Shifter. Obviously this won't work in the face of opposing Tombstalkers, but in that case I'd just Survival up something else (like, you know.. Nought). You don't have to win with Phage you know. Winning small (with a 12/12 trampler, yeah right..) is still winning.



I think that BoP are better in this deck because they can make the Shapeshifter fly over blockers. But I'm not shure wether it's possible after M10...


He was talking about his build. But yeah, you can do that. Just turn Shifter into something nasty at the end of the declare blockers step.

[TheLion]

Seriously? I know there's been a discussion about this in the old FEB thread, and I think the argument was that if you don't have Survival, SDT is the better card to have once you've reached the mid game. Also, with 25 manasources, you don't really need the early game cantrips to hit your manacurve.

[...]

Seriously, it's not an issue. If your opponent has Birds, just drop a Nought in the GY, kill a manasource and deal 11 damage, then try again next turn.
If you have the mana to go Hellion->Inkshrouder->Phage, you might as well go Akroma->Shriekmaw->Phage and use Fear to force through your Shifter. Obviously this won't work in the face of opposing Tombstalkers, but in that case I'd just Survival up something else (like, you know.. Nought). You don't have to win with Phage you know. Winning small (with a 12/12 trampler, yeah right..) is still winning.


Yes, but you can drop lands, if you add Brainstorm/Ponder. 25 Mana sources is good though. I run 19 lands, 4 Bop/Hierarch, 2 Wall of Roots, 1 Ranger, 4 Brainstorm, 2 Ponder.

[...]

Yeah, I know. But Akroma->Shriekmaw->Phage still needs one more mana, which can delay your win oftentimes. It was just an untested idea to overcome the new combat rule (Hellion->Inkshrouder->Phage).
About Charm + Tombstalker: It still costs at least UBB and a specific card for a 5/5 flyer. While not bad, it still does not convince me.

[AngryTroll]

So, was this Delve point really ever relevant?

About Tog:
Though I know and played this trick, too, in the end I felt, that it happens or is needed maybe 1 out of 30 games. I also only rarely needed the GY control aspect, so I dropped it.

About Top
I'd rather play Brainstorm and maybe Ponder. SDT is just too mana intensive for me.


Delve and Tog both seem plenty relevant. I'm surprised Tog came up so rarely for you; I was ALWAYS happy to draw it. Even if I wasn't trying to do Shapeshifter tricks, Tog helps control opponent's Goyfs, swings like a champ, blocks like a champ, and is really solid when paired with Shapeshifter. I'd be tempted to run two...but one is probably the right number. Similarly, Tombstalker seems fine in the midgame, setting up Shapeshifter (whether it's in play or not) and presenting a flying threat.

Top is mana intensive, but the deck is heavy on lands because the whole deck is mana intensive. If you have Survival, you should be in pretty good shape anyways. If you don't have Survival, you'll be able to spare the mana to Top.