Nether Void in Legacy

[Pastorofmuppets]

How long has it been since Nether Void even saw any play? I mean its the only Enchantment that can counter Krosan Grip, it completely shuts down Storm, and its only enemies I can think of until VERY late-game are AEther Vial or an early Goblin Welder. The issue is, of course, resolving it. There are a few methods of this. One is to run Blue, which may or may not work too well. Replenish is a backup plan, and we're already in-color for Black, so there's Rituals.
Here is where the possible paths of the deck diverge.

-AEther Vial: It drops before your Void and lets you drop creatures through your Void.

-Humility/Manlands: You could pretty much make a Landstill build that splashes Black for Void.

-Morph Creatures: Not a good plan, since you'd have to pay 6 just to get the creature facedown in the first place, probably the most casual of all of the strategies suggested here

-Bitterblossom: Also not advisable, because if they resolve an EE or Pernicious Deed before your Void you've lost all of your progress

-Astral Slide: let anything hit the board, the Red Enchantment that works like Astral, and cycle away, with or without Fluctuaor.

[DrJones]

Also, Nether Void with trinisphere, uncounterable creatures, Urami and/or Phyrexian Totem.

[Pastorofmuppets]

phyrexian totem is pretty weak unless you couple Nether Void with the Abyss. Tomb is interesting but leaving yourself Landless could end in your opponent paying :3: :w: to rfg it leaving you too far behind to ever hope to gain tempo. Trinisphere is pretty funny, all spells costing 6, period. Does Trinisphere effect alternate costs too?

Edit: there's also Thorn of Amethyst and the original one that also hits creatures.

[Shanghi Knights]

ya trinisphere hits alternate costs of spell 2.

with the printing stuff like shriekmaw i thought leyline of life force with nethervoid might make for an interesting build. but i never did anything with it. if so could add glowriders for more fun.

[shaneswa]

Seems like this card wants vexing shusher. Seems like a solid way to get your spells in under the void.

[ykpon]

unless you couple Nether Void with the Abyss
you can't do it as you can't have two Nether Voids on the battlefield:

704.5m If two or more permanents have the supertype world, all except the one that has been a permanent with the world supertype on the battlefield for the shortest amount of time are put into their owners’ graveyards. In the event of a tie for the shortest amount of time, all are put into their owners’ graveyards. This is called the "world rule."

btw, Demigod of Revenge is pretty hot with Void.

[Maveric78f]

Somthing like that ?

4 NV
4 Trinisphere
3 Crucible
4 Great Sable Stag
3 Isao
4 Chalice of the Void

4 ESG
4 Mox Diamond
4 Mishras
4 Wastelands
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
10 GB lands (featuring Bayou)
4 Treetop

And say gg to vial.

[TheCramp]

spell breaker behemoth can't be countered and my allow you to drop Tarmogoyf or Phrexian [sp?] Negater.

[Maveric78f]

Yeah, but it's 1RRG, which is not really combo.

[Shanghi Knights]

definitly need red in this for volcanic fallout, 1 lackey or vial and we got problems

[Pastorofmuppets]

Somthing like that ?

4 NV
4 Trinisphere
3 Crucible
4 Great Sable Stag
3 Isao
4 Chalice of the Void

4 ESG
4 Mox Diamond
4 Mishras
4 Wastelands
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
10 GB lands (featuring Bayou)
4 Treetop

And say gg to vial.

We need artifact destruction in here somewhere. I like the idea of fallouts, but we want this to be as doable of a manabase as possible, so there you go. I'll ramshackle a beta testing list and post it after a few matches.

EDIT: how do Nether Void and Trinisphere interact with spell copies from a replicate ability?

[Shanghi Knights]

i believe its the same as chalice for 1, in the instance of shattering spree.

the card itself costs 3 to play from sphere, then nethervoid counters the first spell played.

the way both chalice and nethervoid counter spells is almost the same.

[Pastorofmuppets]

so the deck's current tech is: Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, Pernicious Deed, and Chalice at 1 & 2. The deck beat Merfolk already and lost to dredge, probably because I played Crucible over Trinisphere on my 2nd turn so I could keep fetching to drop Sable Stag.

EDIT: Also, I'm looking at Wreak Havoc from Guildpact as my Artifact hate.

[Shanghi Knights]

wreak havoc looks like as it hits both land or artifact but i can't help but think your better with shattering spree, if you put out a sphere and either chalice or void you'll be spending 3 to 4 mana any how and you could hit more artifacts for that 4 mana.

the upside of wreak havok is that earlier builds of nethervoid used sink holes to keep people off color and land count to in that sense wreak havoc is a logical choice.

i'm having a hard time coming up with artifacts that give you such a problem that you need artifact hate? the artifacts of stax? personally i see crucible as a problem but nothing deed can't wipe out.

[Pastorofmuppets]

wreak havoc looks like as it hits both land or artifact but i can't help but think your better with shattering spree, if you put out a sphere and either chalice or void you'll be spending 3 to 4 mana any how and you could hit more artifacts for that 4 mana.

the upside of wreak havok is that earlier builds of nethervoid used sink holes to keep people off color and land count to in that sense wreak havoc is a logical choice.

i'm having a hard time coming up with artifacts that give you such a problem that you need artifact hate? the artifacts of stax? personally i see crucible as a problem but nothing deed can't wipe out.

I'm actually running Crucibles for fetch fixing/wastelock/returning Mishra's..ses. However you'd pluralize that

[heroicraptor]

I'm actually running Crucibles for fetch fixing/wastelock/returning Mishra's..ses. However you'd pluralize that

Factories?

What about Vexing Beetle?

[EdsonDettoni]

Hi People,

This old thoughts maybe could help.

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?p=317830

Edson.

[Pastorofmuppets]

Well, here's my current list.
Bgr Void
Spells
3 Nether Void
3 Trinisphere
4 Dark Ritual (dead card post-void, might cut down on them for something, probably mox diamond)
3 Shattering Spree
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Sphere of Resistance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Volcanic Fallout
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Pernicious Deed (I might change Deed/EE to a 2/2 split)
3 Crucible of Worlds

Creatures
3 Vexing Shusher
2 Great Sable Stag

Lands
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Bayou
3 Wasteland
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Badlands
1 Taiga

[MTG-Fan]

So, if Nether Void gets countered, you're just running a deck with bad cards and a horrible manabase.

And don't tell me that Void will never get countered because of Vexing Shusher either.

[Pastorofmuppets]

So, if Nether Void gets countered, you're just running a deck with bad cards and a horrible manabase.

And don't tell me that Void will never get countered because of Vexing Shusher either.

this deck is pretty casual, I read an article somewhere that made good points on why Void never sees play (it has something to do with balls, which even THEY aren't used much in Legacy. The article was about Vintage.)
Also, I really suck at manabases.

[Mystical_Jackass]

It'd be interesting in a Pox shell. Small pox, Nether Spirit is great synergy.
Also, if you included bitter blossom & contamination that's like instant shutdown. Nether Void could drop after as sorta a lockdown... I just see that more effective in the long run than rushing for it turn2. I could be wrong though. Possibly dark confidant too, speed up draw.. it can be sac'd to contamination later also. Trinisphere seems like overkill

Volcanic Fallout seems better as sideboard against tribal. The mana base seems sorta fragile here, you got 1GG creatures with 1RR spells mixed with Ancient Tombs lol, etc.

[Media314r8]

my take on it:

Lands (25)
4 badlands
2 urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
4 mire
4 delta
6 swamp
1 mountain
4 wasteland

Artifact mana (10)
4 mox diamond
4 phyrexian totem
2 crucible of worlds

Dudes (4)
4 demigod of revenge

Disruption (19)
4 thoughtseize
4 hymn
4 CotV
4 nether void

Don't die plox (5)
3 damnation
2 snuff out

SB
4 volcanic fallout
4 e plague
4 LLotV
3 shattering spree

Less all-in on double lands, and more consistancy at the expense of speed, but thoughtseize and hymn gained. Faster kill and 3 reset buttons that have synergy with your wincons.

[Pastorofmuppets]

resolving a pernicious deed can clear your board of stoppers so you can go back into the game. It just works too well in this deck.

[Pastorofmuppets]

It'd be interesting in a Pox shell. Small pox, Nether Spirit is great synergy.
Also, if you included bitter blossom & contamination that's like instant shutdown. Nether Void could drop after as sorta a lockdown... I just see that more effective in the long run than rushing for it turn2. I could be wrong though. Possibly dark confidant too, speed up draw.. it can be sac'd to contamination later also. Trinisphere seems like overkill

Volcanic Fallout seems better as sideboard against tribal. The mana base seems sorta fragile here, you got 1GG creatures with 1RR spells mixed with Ancient Tombs lol, etc.

I know
another route that could also include bitterblossom would be to make it B/W with Porphyry Nodes and Elspeth. Uncounterability vs. Tech?

[Shanghi Knights]

only problem i see is elseph is color heavy. but to go planeswalker suck as elseph or garrak would be a huge boost to the deck. like them for the token making for sure but that being my main like in them i can't help but feel bitterblossem or a squee zombie infestation engine would be nice. both of which compliment any pox synergy. i'd almost put in rector then go pox.

[Pastorofmuppets]

The deck could be a B/W pox build. Nether Spirit gets around void nicely, and can even put itself into your graveyard. I'll work on a Bx pox shell for Nether Void and a BW build for meself.

EDIT: after my first match with the deck, I must say Nether Spirit is a nice engine to keep the Nodes in play.
EDIT part deux: Bitterblossom vs. something that creates tokens and can get rid of extra nether spirits?

[Mystical_Jackass]

If use deed, possibly run "Sun.. bah, I forget what it's called..
Basically, this engine:

Sylvan Library
Words of Wilding
Ancient Tomb
Trinisphere
Crucible
Stax
...
Nethervoid
maybe throw in blossom or w/e your flavor

It's very good.

[Shanghi Knights]

i'd say just go with words of war if your doing the sylvan word engine, that way you can pop merfolk and goblins without a void on the table.

[Mystical_Jackass]

I say no, run ensnaring bridge.

But even moreso, if you're running smoke stack, Wilding can generate up to 3-9 tokens a turn, double up on smoke stack and run them into ground. Crucible with fetch and generally ~2wasteland further locks. Nether Void would shut down ability to grip Words; plus, less mana fixing and would fit color scheme if they did choose to include deed.

A friend runs a deck very similar, he goes 3-1 and 4-0 almost every time.

[Shanghi Knights]

i missed the part where you listed stax otherwise i wouldn't of posted as i did.

the thing for me is thought once you put smoke stack in it just doesn't feel like a nethervoid deck any more but non the less they do compliment each other being run in the same deck.

[Mystical_Jackass]

I could see Nether Void complimenting it pretty well.

I played his deck for fun, went like 1-4 (no sideboards).
Its just tough to deal with, trinisphere comes out fast, usually turn1-2, followed by Sylvan Library.
Basically this just slows my tempo down tremenously and he gains a tremendous card advantage, sets up crucible, WoW, sometimes stacked libraries, etc. faster than I could slow him down. The game I won, was able to go first and grip his library and rush ftw, but most cases he gets out 1-2 ensnaring bridge ('cause he can dig 3-5 cards each turn) and with library in play he had full control over his drawing ability, especially being able to pitch to mox at times he could idle at one card while he took his sweet time locking me out >.< 'cause Once token/stax lock is in place, its game over pretty much.
I'm thinking nether void could deffinitely be made to fit into the stall, getting Library out with wilding, crucible, stax, or just about anything would be devastating if you followed up with nether void. Basically all those do the same thing in a diff way, generate a huge card advantage opponent cant recover from.

[Pastorofmuppets]

Here's a pox list I'm testing with.
Bw Toolpox
4 Mishra's Factory
3 Scrubland
3 Wasteland
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Swamp
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Polluted Delta

2 Nether Spirit

4 Enlightened Tutor
3 Mox Diamond
3 Thoughtseize
1 Duress
1 Phyrexian Totem
4 Bitterblossom
2 Nether Void
2 Crucible of Worlds
3 Dark Ritual
4 Smallpox
3 Pox
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Vindicate
2 The Rack
2 Contamination

Sideboard
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Vindicate
2 Engineered Plague
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 The Abyss
2 Seal of Cleansing
2 Damnation (Disk?)
2 Leyline of the Void

[Mystical_Jackass]

I'd personally ditch the splash, ditch the tutors and run hymn to tourach so you can go 4 Ritual and actually make it effective. This allows you to run Duress instead of Thoughtseize, save some life for blossom.. and, my next point, I recommend at least 2-3 Phyrexian Arenas. This sorta takes the slot of tutor, but works toward your card advantage instead of against. I've been running in my Pox deck for quite a while, and I often go 3-1 the majority of time

Turn 1 Arena is friggin golden against matchups like countertop, the card advantage eventually runs them into the ground.

Vindicate & The Rack can be pitched. Vindicate is unnecessary, in this deck your hand/land disruption spells ARE your source of control, this is like a luxury spell that gets in the way. Rack is not that great, it oftentimes at most hits them for like 1 damage maybe 2 each turn, hold off there are better options.

Sideboard EE. Mox Diamond doesn't belong in the deck either, it does pretty close to nothing.

With enough card advantage from Arena, you'll be drawing faster.. playing lands and rituals faster, and getting the spells you need eventually WHILE disrupting opponent, this is your best way of winning otherwise you'll end up Nuking yourself from Pox if you play card disadvantage.

From the 2x Racks, I recommend 2x Syphon Life as extra discard outlets. It gives a pretty amazing engine with crucible on the table, it keeps your life up from blossom, pox, and arena and it turns your otherwise dead late-game land drops into... "draws wasteland, discards to syphon opponent, plays wasteland with crucible, wastes their Taiga" etc.

[MMogg]

I recommend at least 2-3 Phyrexian Arenas ...
Turn 1 Arena is friggin golden against matchups like countertop, the card advantage eventually runs them into the ground.

By running only 2-3 Phyrexian Arena, the chance of drawing one in your opening hand with a Dark Ritual to play it seems pretty slim. :confused:

[Pastorofmuppets]

I'd personally ditch the splash, ditch the tutors and run hymn to tourach so you can go 4 Ritual and actually make it effective. This allows you to run Duress instead of Thoughtseize, save some life for blossom.. and, my next point, I recommend at least 2-3 Phyrexian Arenas. This sorta takes the slot of tutor, but works toward your card advantage instead of against. I've been running in my Pox deck for quite a while, and I often go 3-1 the majority of time

Turn 1 Arena is friggin golden against matchups like countertop, the card advantage eventually runs them into the ground.

Vindicate & The Rack can be pitched. Vindicate is unnecessary, in this deck your hand/land disruption spells ARE your source of control, this is like a luxury spell that gets in the way. Rack is not that great, it oftentimes at most hits them for like 1 damage maybe 2 each turn, hold off there are better options.

Sideboard EE. Mox Diamond doesn't belong in the deck either, it does pretty close to nothing.

With enough card advantage from Arena, you'll be drawing faster.. playing lands and rituals faster, and getting the spells you need eventually WHILE disrupting opponent, this is your best way of winning otherwise you'll end up Nuking yourself from Pox if you play card disadvantage.

From the 2x Racks, I recommend 2x Syphon Life as extra discard outlets. It gives a pretty amazing engine with crucible on the table, it keeps your life up from blossom, pox, and arena and it turns your otherwise dead late-game land drops into... "draws wasteland, discards to syphon opponent, plays wasteland with crucible, wastes their Taiga" etc.

the deck doesn't really play like normal pox.
But I can say a few things. Mox Diamond does do alot for this deck. Test with it. Test hard with it. Vindicate did feel kind of splotchy in here. Its mostly hate for sticky artifacts/enchantments, but I figured an MD seal of cleansing can be brought up from E tutor.

[Pastorofmuppets]

So either this has a really good Thresh/Merfolk Matchup or people on MWS are really, really incompetent. Im going something like 75-25 against thresh and 70-30 against the 'folk with my toolpox list.
EDIT: With this slowly becoming a Pox discussion, where's Bowvamp? If he's the same guy from TCGplayer he sort of wrote the primer on Pox. lol

[DrJones]

I would adventure to say that it's just that they are not used to play against a black deck. lol

[Mr. Fix it]

if you got some white in there for vindicate why not put in academy rector and small pox in nethervoid through her?

[Mystical_Jackass]

Actually... that's actually a really awesome idea *scratches chin*

just toolbox in like.. abyss, blossom, moat, etc. Sick

[Shanghi Knights]

if anything she will definity eat up the opponents resources as they'll panic to keep her from resolving/triggering.

[DeMarki]

Seems like this card wants vexing shusher. Seems like a solid way to get your spells in under the void.

No need, the whole concept of the deck is to play early threats and disrupt your opponent as much as possible, having the Void only to seal the game.

My version of Void is the following:

4 Thoughseize
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Sinkhole
4 Diabolic Edict (Or Contagion, haven't decided yet)

4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Nantuko Shade
4 Tombstalker
3 Nether Void

4 Dark Ritual
4 Wasteland
4 Polluted Delta
4 Bloodstained Mire
9 Swamp

I know it's 56 cards, I used to play a Vintage version of this deck using 1 Sol Ring, 1 Demonic Consultations, 1 Demonic Tutor and 1 Strip Mine as well.

So that leaves 4 cards of your choice. Any suggestions?

[baghdadbob]

I would say probably 4x Duress for the ultimate hand sodomy boutique. If that's not your style then you could always run some Bitterblossom's to create chumpers, and in worst case scenario make them waste a Krosan Grip. Next turn Nether Void. Good luck I like the deck but I don't think I would ever pay 60 some-odd dollars for each copy of the card. :tongue:

[Shanghi Knights]

@demarki

you don't run any factorys in your list?


@baghdadbob

there more like 30 bucks these days cause no one has any interest in them. too many people think there not worth playing as the deck is not easily piloted through many match ups.

[baghdadbob]

http://sales.starcitygames.com/cardsearch.php?singlesearch=Nether+Void

http://www.trollandtoad.com/p86057.html

http://www.mtgfanatic.com/store/magic/ViewCard.aspx?I=MTG-MS-019184

http://www.blackborder.com/cgi-bin/prices/ex_search.cgi

I don't think so dude. I really do love the card... I'm just saying that 30 bucks? I don't think so. Maybe at a really really super awesome card shop. :rolleyes:

[ThatGuyThere]

@baghdadbob

there more like 30 bucks these days cause no one has any interest in them. too many people think there not worth playing as the deck is not easily piloted through many match ups.

I shall take the opposite approach from, er, Mr. Bob. :wink:

I would like to purchase your Nether Voids at the above-quoted price, fine vendor. I'm even willing to pay a 20% premium.

Please contact me for shipping information. :tongue:

[Shanghi Knights]

http://sales.starcitygames.com/cardsearch.php?singlesearch=Nether+Void

http://www.trollandtoad.com/p86057.html

http://www.mtgfanatic.com/store/magic/ViewCard.aspx?I=MTG-MS-019184

http://www.blackborder.com/cgi-bin/prices/ex_search.cgi

I don't think so dude. I really do love the card... I'm just saying that 30 bucks? I don't think so. Maybe at a really really super awesome card shop. :rolleyes:

i was not aware they had stayed in the 60 dollar range. I do admit i bought them at that price a long time ago and never gave there value much thought after wards. I did see some in a card store a year ago going for 30 bucks each so i based my last statement on that. With the decline of vintage i only thought all the more 30 bucks was there going value.

[MMogg]

i was not aware they had stayed in the 60 dollar range. I do admit i bought them at that price a long time ago and never gave there value much thought after wards. I did see some in a card store a year ago going for 30 bucks each so i based my last statement on that. With the decline of vintage i only thought all the more 30 bucks was there going value.

Is it possible you saw Italian ones for sale? Generally they are much cheaper (and more prevalent) than their English counterparts.

[Shanghi Knights]

they may have been Italain i was visiting my cousin up in Michigan and he took me to a card store somewhere near Detroit, I can't remember the name but i'll ask him next chance i get.

[DeMarki]

How can you guys be complaining about the Nether Void price, where almost every Legacy deck packs 4 Tarmogoyfs, at 40$ each.

You only need 3 Nether Void for this type of deck, you could find some played ones for around 50$ each, which is fine considering it's a very rare card from Legends.

[Shanghi Knights]

to boot you never know if wizards will remake nether voids in some "from the vault exiled" limited set.

[FoolofaTook]

How can you guys be complaining about the Nether Void price, where almost every Legacy deck packs 4 Tarmogoyfs, at 40$ each.

You only need 3 Nether Void for this type of deck, you could find some played ones for around 50$ each, which is fine considering it's a very rare card from Legends.

Tarmogoyfs win games and Nether Voids don't unless the table has been set by a bunch of other cards?

Why Nether Void is a $79.99 card and Living Plane is at $11.49 is the mystery. They have similar rarity, albeit more Nether Voids got worn out in the old single meta, and both appear in the same number of highly competitive decks (zero).

[baghdadbob]

Oh why do I even open my mouth... Starting fights about card prices lol :rolleyes: Let's get back to the deck at hand. I don't know how I feel about Phyrexian Negator in here... @Pastor is this still your list?
Spells
3 Nether Void
3 Trinisphere
4 Dark Ritual (dead card post-void, might cut down on them for something, probably mox diamond)
3 Shattering Spree
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Sphere of Resistance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Volcanic Fallout
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Pernicious Deed (I might change Deed/EE to a 2/2 split)
3 Crucible of Worlds

Creatures
3 Vexing Shusher
2 Great Sable Stag

Lands
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Bayou
3 Wasteland
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Badlands
1 Taiga

Or did you decide you liked the pox list more?

[Shanghi Knights]

stable stag is what the old green splash version of this was dying for so long ago. freaken mongoose never got the job done. 3/3 that can't be hit by abyss as well as any other anti black spell. plus to boot its big enough to survive a pyroclasm, aka in modern technology volcanic fallout. but green black red is kinda complicated but to voids advantage it only needs 1 black on the table so supporting the other might not be as bad as i fear.


whats the point of sphere of resistance in that list? i would think trinisphere would be better i don't see that mana base being very conductive to a long game sphere of resistance.

though in many decks i find it to be superior tech over trinisphere.

[DeMarki]

Oh why do I even open my mouth... Starting fights about card prices lol :rolleyes: Let's get back to the deck at hand. I don't know how I feel about Phyrexian Negator in here... @Pastor is this still your list?
Spells
3 Nether Void
3 Trinisphere
4 Dark Ritual (dead card post-void, might cut down on them for something, probably mox diamond)
3 Shattering Spree
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Sphere of Resistance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Volcanic Fallout
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Pernicious Deed (I might change Deed/EE to a 2/2 split)
3 Crucible of Worlds

Creatures
3 Vexing Shusher
2 Great Sable Stag

Lands
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Bayou
3 Wasteland
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Badlands
1 Taiga

Or did you decide you liked the pox list more?

You need more threats instead of so many tech cards like Trinisphere and Spheres of resistance.

Do you really expect to win by running 5 creatures, 3 of them being utility ones?

Mishra's are unreliable, they get wasted. Rather run wastelands + sinkholes to slow your opponent even more, along with cheap threats like Negator or Shades to put early pressure followed by a Void to seal the game.

[baghdadbob]

Dude not my list! I was asking if that was still what he was running or if he had decided on going pox. L2RPleez

[jhhdk]

Would Multani's Presence be effective in this sort of deck, since it sort of gives all other cards except lands "cycle X" (where X is their casting cost)?

[Pastorofmuppets]

Oh why do I even open my mouth... Starting fights about card prices lol :rolleyes: Let's get back to the deck at hand. I don't know how I feel about Phyrexian Negator in here... @Pastor is this still your list?
Spells
3 Nether Void
3 Trinisphere
4 Dark Ritual (dead card post-void, might cut down on them for something, probably mox diamond)
3 Shattering Spree
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Sphere of Resistance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Volcanic Fallout
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Pernicious Deed (I might change Deed/EE to a 2/2 split)
3 Crucible of Worlds

Creatures
3 Vexing Shusher
2 Great Sable Stag

Lands
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Bayou
3 Wasteland
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Badlands
1 Taiga

Or did you decide you liked the pox list more?

I like the pox list a lot more. Anything that is somewhat consistently beating thresh is good to me. Plus with that list I've wasted too many hands with 1 green and 1 red source with a stag and a fallout in hand.

[Pastorofmuppets]

Oh why do I even open my mouth... Starting fights about card prices lol :rolleyes: Let's get back to the deck at hand. I don't know how I feel about Phyrexian Negator in here... @Pastor is this still your list?
Spells
3 Nether Void
3 Trinisphere
4 Dark Ritual (dead card post-void, might cut down on them for something, probably mox diamond)
3 Shattering Spree
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Sphere of Resistance
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Volcanic Fallout
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Pernicious Deed (I might change Deed/EE to a 2/2 split)
3 Crucible of Worlds

Creatures
3 Vexing Shusher
2 Great Sable Stag

Lands
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Bayou
3 Wasteland
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Badlands
1 Taiga

Or did you decide you liked the pox list more?

I like the pox list a lot more. Anything that is somewhat consistently beating thresh is good to me. Plus with that list I've wasted too many turns with 1 green and 1 red source with a stag and a fallout in hand.

[syssc9]

Nether Void average on Ebay last week was $38.40.

[Shanghi Knights]

Nether Void average on Ebay last week was $38.40.

thats encouraging, gives my last comment on its price some credit. (not really, but shows my ignorance wasn't far off)

@pastoro

you do make a good point as the pox version is more consistant than a version running red and green. to keep such a version consistant you need to have a constant threat of counters on the table and part of classic never void is always building up to dropping nether void. rgb is just assuming you get one out, now you can move around the void while the opponent struggles a little. not very good play stradegy with void. better to cripple then lock.

[jhhdk]

Would Multani's Presence be effective in this sort of deck, since it sort of gives all other cards except lands "cycle X" (where X is their casting cost)?

[Pastorofmuppets]

thats encouraging, gives my last comment on its price some credit. (not really, but shows my ignorance wasn't far off)

@pastoro

you do make a good point as the pox version is more consistant than a version running red and green. to keep such a version consistant you need to have a constant threat of counters on the table and part of classic never void is always building up to dropping nether void. rgb is just assuming you get one out, now you can move around the void while the opponent struggles a little. not very good play stradegy with void. better to cripple then lock.
and yet void is really good in here. most of the time it hits hard enough after so much disruption along with my Blossom/Nether Spirit+Contamination engine along with the possibility of wastelock, the entire point of the deck is a consistent hard shutdown, and Void does a good job of making sure my tokens stay alone on the board.
as for the BRG version, we could cut it to RGb with black splashed for the voids, and tinder wall or spirit guides replacing the rituals...

[Thoughtseizer]

Replace dark ritual with tinder walls and take out the the speed, black mana and efficiency of the broken and game changing dark ritual? Not a prudent move I reckon.

[Pastorofmuppets]

Replace dark ritual with tinder walls and take out the the speed, black mana and efficiency of the broken and game changing dark ritual? Not a prudent move I reckon.

Chances are I'd have to drop the balls and the Tombs for the deck to even stay alive. which hurts me, it truly does.:rolleyes: so that leaves 4 Lands and 5 cards, right? Unless the tombs are, in fact the proper aproach, though the aforementioned mana dedication to Red and Green to drop the uncounterables problem still exists. so 5 openings at least. It might be smart to drop the chalices if the tombs do have to leave.

[Pastorofmuppets]

So let's keep this about the rBg. The Bw list I've posted in another thread.

[Mr. Fix it]

Tinder wall might be a bit slower but it makes up for it with being a chump blocker if needed.

[Pastorofmuppets]

Tinder wall might be a bit slower but it makes up for it with being a chump blocker if needed.

does anyone have a list they're testing with?

[Shanghi Knights]

4 tarmogoyf
4 tinder wall
4 dark confidant
4 spell breaker behemoth

3 divining top
2 crucible of worlds

3 nether void

2 jund charm
4 duress
4 thoughtseize
4 tainted pacts


4 mishra factory
2 swamp
3 polluted delta
4 bloodstained mire
3 bayou
2 badland
4 wasteland

its by no means a serious lock out by void but it does make for strong beats with a turn 2 behemoth off of tinder wall. unfortunately its missing pieces at the moment as i put thoughtseize and wasteland into other decks, as well as goyf.

when i got spellbreakers this seemed the best use of them at the time. while making it more of a creature beat deck i can't help but lose vital space for land destruction to make this an absolute lock out nether void deck.

besides confidant card advantage is somewhat and issue, i'd go for nights whisper but an early confidant makes that a risky if not dead play late game. tainted pacts while flawed have served me variably well

the deck is unfortunately currently neglected so i haven't constructed a side board. if i did it would definitely have magus of the moon, vollcanic fallout, and maybe even vexing shusher. I lost the post but i saw a rb deck running magus and nether void a while back which looked like great synergy. once i get going with nether void i'd definitely make that version again.

[Pastorofmuppets]

4 tarmogoyf
4 tinder wall
4 dark confidant
4 spell breaker behemoth

3 divining top
2 crucible of worlds

3 nether void

2 jund charm
4 duress
4 thoughtseize
4 tainted pacts


4 mishra factory
2 swamp
3 polluted delta
4 bloodstained mire
3 bayou
2 badland
4 wasteland

its by no means a serious lock out by void but it does make for strong beats with a turn 2 behemoth off of tinder wall. unfortunately its missing pieces at the moment as i put thoughtseize and wasteland into other decks, as well as goyf.

when i got spellbreakers this seemed the best use of them at the time. while making it more of a creature beat deck i can't help but lose vital space for land destruction to make this an absolute lock out nether void deck.

besides confidant card advantage is somewhat and issue, i'd go for nights whisper but an early confidant makes that a risky if not dead play late game. tainted pacts while flawed have served me variably well

the deck is unfortunately currently neglected so i haven't constructed a side board. if i did it would definitely have magus of the moon, vollcanic fallout, and maybe even vexing shusher. I lost the post but i saw a rb deck running magus and nether void a while back which looked like great synergy. once i get going with nether void i'd definitely make that version again.

8 lands that don't produce colored mana? a little intensive. What are your results so far?

[DeMarki]

8 lands that don't produce colored mana? a little intensive. What are your results so far?

4 Wastelands AND 4 Mishra's Factories are too much. I would go for the Wastelands, they will hurt your opponent a lot more in conjunction with Sinkholes and decent hand destruction.

[Shanghi Knights]

4 Wastelands AND 4 Mishra's Factories are too much. I would go for the Wastelands, they will hurt your opponent a lot more in conjunction with Sinkholes and decent hand destruction.

though the mana base is heavy in colorless mana producers the decks over all colored curve is just 1 green or 1 black. getting behemoth out quickly is dependent on a tinder wall I don't put all my eggs on him as a play as he often bits it to sword being played for either 1 or 4. The whole reason i use him is just so i can drop goyfs post void instead of having to tactically drop them before i drop void. (plus a 5/5 beater whats not to like about him?) jund charms just in there for additional md support card, if voids out its just a dead draw.

putting in land destruction would make this deck better but i'd have to cut into the creatures some what and that takes away from the beats i was going for. on the other hand I could go stompy with it and cut the discard and throw in chalices and maybe trinisphere or something else to help protect the beaters instead of solely relying on nether void.