So I went to pick up some from the vault today

[Dan Turner]

Ok I contact my local store about picking a few of these up and was told a few weeks ago i would have some..

I contact them today and "oh I am sorry they will be $100 each and then a little while later OOPS we sold out."


Another store that will not be getting my business (http://cgi.ebay.com/MTG-From-the-Vault-Exiled-SEALED-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ400069960465QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5d26072311&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)

yea they sold them on ebay oh thanks for screwing your local players in the ass may I have some sandpaper next time.

[akiratheoni]

Yeah I can understand that you're pissed; I would be, too. But this reminds me of a tournament that I went to... a girl was going through the commons/uncommons, and she found a Ponder that was in the .10 box, and another that was in the .50 box. She asked if she could get them both for .60 since they were in different boxes, but the owner explained to her that he's trying to run a business so he'd need to charge a dollar for both.

Stores are businesses first and foremost. Although you may have been able to offer the $90-100 they were asked for (and I've heard of the boxes going for as much as $150), I think that the store determined that they were going to be able to sell the product quickly on eBay for the price that they wanted. And looking at the eBay page, it looks like they did in fact sell the product quickly.

[FoulQ]

It is a card shop.

In a shitty economy.

They gotta survive somehow. Give them a break

[rockout]

90 bucks is actually pretty cheap. I probably would have done the same thing if I could make roughly 70 dollars per box instead of maybe 15-20 selling it at the msrp.

[Dan Turner]

Actually it pissed me off because I offered the $100 each for 2 of them they would have actually made more money off me compared to the $90 each they got and the ebay/paypal fees. Well the store my allocation went to gave me my 4 at msrp ( I am their TO) So it was ok but I wanted some to use as prizes for tournaments. Oh well I guess I will pull what I need from my 4 boxes (MMMMMMMMM SHINY LACKEYS)and use the rest for prize support.

[MMogg]

Actually it pissed me off because I offered the $100 each for 2 of them they would have actually made more money off me compared to the $90 each they got and the ebay/paypal fees. Well the store my allocation went to gave me my 4 at msrp ( I am their TO) So it was ok but I wanted some to use as prizes for tournaments. Oh well I guess I will pull what I need from my 4 boxes (MMMMMMMMM SHINY LACKEYS)and use the rest for prize support.

Come on September b/r list update: banned, Goblin Lackey! :wink:

Don't mind me, I'm jealous of anyone getting one of these boxes, let alone 4! :eek:

[frogboy]

Ok I contact my local store about picking a few of these up and was told a few weeks ago i would have some..

I contact them today and "oh I am sorry they will be $100 each and then a little while later OOPS we sold out."


Another store that will not be getting my business (http://cgi.ebay.com/MTG-From-the-Vault-Exiled-SEALED-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ400069960465QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5d26072311&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)

yea they sold them on ebay oh thanks for screwing your local players in the ass may I have some sandpaper next time.

I fucking hate it when my local card shop makes money and doesn't go out of business so I can keep playing there.

[DrJones]

The only place from which I could buy "From the Vaults: Exiled" is several kilometers away, and the owner told me by phone that they would be 120€ each and that I shouldn't drive to get them because they would probably be sold off on the launch day.

[yawg07]

You guys are all being so shitty towards this dude, when you know you'd be pissed if the same thing happened to you.
This guy made the mistake of complaining on the internet, and of all places, the asshole capital of the world.

[DrJones]

Well, he already got 4 at retail price. So it's not a big deal to complain when he's already very lucky. Some of us can't find even one at outrageous prices.

(lucky bastard! :wink:)

[ilovejess2]

Seconded Yawg. I would be pissed too. Stores have to support their local player base. They are not even making more money doing it this way. Bad business.

[MMogg]

Seconded Yawg. I would be pissed too. Stores have to support their local player base. They are not even making more money doing it this way. Bad business.

It's easier said than done. I feel for both of them because I've been on both sides of the fence.

The mistake the store made was not selling the product on ebay, it was A) telling customers they were getting them, B) estimating a price, C) selling them on ebay, and D) telling a customer(s) they were selling them on ebay. If they were smarter businessmen they'd have sold them on ebay quietly and not made any promises to any local customers. If customers ask about it, be straight and tell them that (I'm assuming here) stock is limited and they aren't able to procure enough or, alternatively, reason with them that they are not going to sell them because of their limited nature.

I think some people are pissed because if you look at other products (let's say for the sake of argument, a rare CD boxset will be released in limited quantities in HMV stores) those products would sell for about same price everywhere and if people turned around and re-sold them on ebay, it wouldn't matter to the people at HMV. In the collectibles market, however, the store owners are also prospectors who finagle retail prices. But, that's the nature of collectibles that are so driven by the secondary market.

[Dan Turner]

That is what pissed me off he would have made MORE money off me then Ebay, but would have waited until tomorrow (Today I guess since it is Friday now). It was just pure greed on his part, not looking at the stores bottom line or anything since I had offered the $100 each 3 weeks ago before he ever listed them.

[UrDraco]

Superstars in San Jose is doing something I think is awesome and using them as prizes. There are a million people that want FTV:E and this gives everyone a chance to get it. The store will also draw more players for tournaments so its a win win.

[DrJones]

Well, giving that WotC only sold the set to Tournament Organizers, it was a pretty obvious thing to do.

[sauce]

just buy the cards from it u need in a playset on ebay gg.

[Creeping Death]

Well, he already got 4 at retail price. So it's not a big deal to complain when he's already very lucky. Some of us can't find even one at outrageous prices.

(lucky bastard! :wink:)

Indeed, and on another topic he even says that he has 2 more from GenCon. So he is a very very lucky one :cool:

All I can say is: to few to little. WotC knows that they can't bring out those cards in to high numbers, otherwise the price of them would fall and all people allready having them would be outragious. Now they bring out a box, that everybody wants, and the retailers know this. So they ask ridicuous prices. They even sold them on beforehand. Release dates??? The release date was on the day they announced the box!

There were no lines of waiting people at my shop. When Harry Potter or the new Warcraft comes out it is a different story. I guess the others can put more pressure on their retailers to stick to the plan. Now, WotC is not going to punish their retailers, but are going to have to deal with a lot of dissapointed people playing magic. Because the fact that people are making money out of them, playing the game, is really too apparent like this. The next time a FROM THE VAULT is released I think a lot of those people won't even bother/care.

[Fons]

I picked up my four for 110....Total! I'm not keeping everything though, I'm getting rid of Skullclamp, Tinker, Serendib Efreet, Channel, Strip Mine, Kird Ape, Balance, Berserk, Necropotence, and Goblin Lackey as playsets on ebay.

My local store got 14 of them which is very high considering that we only get like 14 players for standard tournaments and can't even get FNM going.

[DrJones]

That is crazy!

[MMogg]

That is crazy!

QFT

Something needs to be done so that people can get access to this stuff better. I think this has proven how crappy their system of distribution is.

The more I hear the more my sentiments change: :cry: --> :frown: --> :rolleyes: --> :eek: --> :mad:

[JeroenC]

This was totally their intention though. They made low supplies on purpose, to keep demand high. You know, the way promotional cards should work. So in that way, job well done. I'm still sore I won't be getting one, but shit happens.

[Ectoplasm]

Just think of all the people raging about their Berserks plummeting in value because WotC decided to print a gazillion foil ones :D

[Dan Turner]

Well the whole reasoning for them selling them and distributing them the way they did this time was so that they did not get sold online. I hope wizards sanctions some of these stores that sold there entire stock of them online the first day. Honestly I think it should be a rule that stores can not sell a B & M only product online until 30 days after release. I know some of the other companies do it. Yea you will still get players selling theirs online the day they get them but that is the true secondary market there. B & M stores are suppose to be the retail market and I understand them needing to make money.

But some of these stores seem to care less and less about their customer base then the bottom Dollar. Our local shop (not the one where he sold his FTV on ebay) sold most of their M10 online because he could get more money per box even though we would have payed the 110 he was asking no problem. My biggest problem with him is when he gets stock in he wants to move it all that week instead of having stuff on the shelf for customers to buy. I have even talked about this with him and his reasoning for this is so screwed up.

He runs a brick and mortar store for one reason...it is the only way he can get the prices he gets on the product he buys, so that he can sell it online.

So he is manipulating the system just so that he can sell online, he sells promos online (FNM, GATEWAY) he has even sold me 20 PTE for $3 each when they first came out as Gateway promos. C'Mon I understand needing to make money but if you have no customer base how do you expect to be able to run the tournaments to keep the players involved that will give you the ability to order this stuff.

[Ectoplasm]

Selling gateway promos online?

:eek:

I'm pretty sure that's against some kind of rules.

[santeria]

Yeah I can understand that you're pissed; I would be, too. But this reminds me of a tournament that I went to... a girl was going through the commons/uncommons, and she found a Ponder that was in the .10 box, and another that was in the .50 box. She asked if she could get them both for .60 since they were in different boxes, but the owner explained to her that he's trying to run a business so he'd need to charge a dollar for both.

Stores are businesses first and foremost.

all stores are not connected through a giant hive mind. its the people running the shop. some places I've been would have:

a) just given them to her for free.
b) charged her $0.60
c) charged her $0.20
d) charged her $1.00 or
e) charged her a $1.00 each


It is a card shop.

In a shitty economy.

They gotta survive somehow. Give them a break

I shop in a card shop. In a shitty economy. I have to survive somehow. give me a break.

a happy customer is usually a loyal customer. and a loyal customer usually returns.

in the case of the ponders, is it better in the long run to charge the girl $0.60 and have her return or charge her $2.00 and possibly lose all future business.

[Krieg]

We got in our allotment of 22 FTV: Exiled
20 of these were sold to our regulars at MSRP (1 per each)
the other 2 will be tourny prizes

happy customers tell their friends and come back
unhappy customers tell everyone and no one comes back

that extra bit of loyalty is worth more than the money I
could have made by jacking up the price

[from Cairo]

Yea like others said the only thing I see wrong with a store choosing to sell something like this online is being misleading to the customer base. Just say you aren't getting any, or they were already reserved or sold or whatever. It's easy enough to bs an excuse and sell them online. It's lame and hurts the store's reputation to say they'd sell them to customers in person and/or at msrp, and back out of it.

[frogboy]

He runs a brick and mortar store for one reason...it is the only way he can get the prices he gets on the product he buys, so that he can sell it online.

If that isn't the reason you own a brick and mortar store, you're doing it wrong.

In related news, most of the people in this thread should familiarize themselves with supply and demand. hint: things are worth what people are willing to pay for them.

[MMogg]

If that isn't the reason you own a brick and mortar store, you're doing it wrong.

In related news, most of the people in this thread should familiarize themselves with supply and demand. hint: things are worth what people are willing to pay for them.

Then why not just let Wizards open an ebay account and away we go?

[Nihil Credo]

Then why not just let Wizards open an ebay account and away we go?
Same reason Wizards gives away those Judge Foil promos and lets judges sell them, rather than selling them themselves.

[MMogg]

Same reason Wizards gives away those Judge Foil promos and lets judges sell them, rather than selling them themselves.

But the act of giving away a promo is certainly different than releasing product that is then sold by the retailer. As soon as a promo card is in a judge's hands it's the secondary market, whereas when the FTV: Exiled was sent out, it was in retailers' hands: still the primary market. The wildly varying and somewhat unrestrained primary market frenzy is what concerns me.

It seems like Wizards of the Coast/Hasbro is not really benefiting from this mentality because it only serves to sour those who may have bought them at higher prices. Whether sold at the MSRP or 100 times that, WotC makes the same amount of money per unit, but it is individual players more than retailers who ought to be appeased. If people stopped playing Magic, retailers would stop selling it. The game is sustained by players, not retailers.

In 2003, just before I left Canada, stores in my local area pretty much nerfed Magic tournaments and product because of the feeding frenzy over Yu-Gi-Oh. (Most) retailers are not loyal to any product, are fickle and easily caught up in fads and trends. Giving them the advantage in this whole FTV debacle only serves to reward retailers more than players.

[Apex]

my store kept their 16 or so boxes and sold it to the players first, and particularly if you pre-ordered, you got it for 50 CAD (it's what I got mine for). They've always done this (for FTV:Dragons too, when it was ebaying for alot, they sold it for $40), and the store owner told me they will always do it in the future too, to keep their player base happy.

Lo and behold, they are the only viable store for Magic in my town. There have been others, and they've all came and went. Maybe there's something to be had in a stable player/customer base more than just making a quick buck at the expense of the future.

Though I guess if in your town, there was like only 1 store that carries Magic related items, then there's nothing much you can do about it.

[dahcmai]

I am close to my local store and to go so far as to say I sell a lot of stuff online for him.

I felt bad buying one of those for myself at MSRP. Why? Because I know that's his income. You don't fuck with people's incomes. Face it, the card business sucks and sucks even more right now. He's having a hell of a time and I can understand that. Diversify isn't in most people's vocabulary or even the word vocabulary for that matter. If it wasn't for the fact I made him a few thousand this month I wouldn't have bought it at that price and warned the others about buying at it also.

He ended up getting 22 of them for some reason and sold them to his friends who helped him out during a heart attack and sold the rest at $80. I told him Star City was buying them at $100 and he decided to cater to the locals instead. That shows how much respect he has in my mind. Your store might be hurting more than you know. It's not like a store owner is going to tell everyone about how they are hurting for money.

I'd ignore this incident and knock it up to the fact he needs it to stay open. A lot of stores are hurting right now. Thank god M10 was damned good. It's better to have someplace to play instead of having a store owner who caters to everyone an goes out in a month.