[SCD] Lotus Cobra [Archive]

from Cairo

09-17-2009, 01:53 AM

Vial it in, play fetch, crack fetch, use free mana to cast Standstill, then attack with factory...

yeah, this thing could find a home, somewhere.

But you have an active Vial, a Factory and a Standstill. The Lotus Cobra is the least of their worries. The fact that you gained a 2/1 in play isn't that relevant if you're playing it over something that could have synergy in the deck (IE Merfolk, Tarmogoyf, Dark Confidant).

Goaswerfraiejen

09-17-2009, 01:57 AM

Frankly, at this point in time, I prefer Noble Hierarch for a few reasons:

1.) Consistency. Hierarch ALWAYS gives you one extra mana, every turn after it's cast.

2.) Exalted is awesome.

3.) This third point is probably the most important, and it has to do with consistency. You can start using Hierarch on turn two, which means that it has an extra turn to speed you up. This, in turn, means that you start being aggressive a whole turn earlier--your creatures aren't sick from summoning, etc. It also means that it doesn't compete with your two-drop threats (Tarmogoyf!), and that you're not casting your two-drop threats on turn three, when you can (and should be) cast(ing) your three-drop threats, or a second two-drop.

The potential to hit 5 mana on turn three brings negligible benefits if you consider that Hierarch grants 4 on turn three (five if you manage to cast one on turn one, and another on turn 2, and don't miss land drops--but that's an unfair scenario since there are two Hierarchs, but only one Cobra), but doesn't eat up a turn of aggression or a turn of casting. In this case (these cases), Hierarch certainly looks a great deal better. The Cobra essentially loses you two turns, since it eats up turn two and forces you to hold off on casting Tarmogoyf for a turn (pushing it's impact back by two turns).

conboy31

09-17-2009, 02:07 AM

As I sit around filling in for someones night shift at work sleep deprived, the best I can come up with is powering through a root maze in some kind of green disruption? (or any of the resistors for that matter)

TheInfamousBearAssassin

09-17-2009, 02:17 AM

It's good in a deck that can get a lot of mileage out of extra mana, has a use for beaters and doesn't suck without it. So far that seems to be Survival as the only possibility in this format.

Philipp2293

09-17-2009, 02:25 AM

Yes, I'm totally trying this in my survival build, as this also combos with Quirion Ranger :smile:

morgan_coke

09-17-2009, 02:29 AM

It's good in a deck that can get a lot of mileage out of extra mana, has a use for beaters and doesn't suck without it. So far that seems to be Survival as the only possibility in this format.

Or something like this:

4x Lotus Cobra
4x Dark Confidant
4x Tarmogoyf

4x Ponder
4x Brainstorm
2x Sensei's Divining Top

4x Force of Will
4x Daze

4x Sinkhole
4x Hymn to Tourach
4x Thoughtseize

4x Wasteland
3x Misty Rainforest
3x Polluted Delta
3x Verdant Catacombs
1x Tropical Island
1x Underground Sea
1x Island
1x Forest
1x Swamp

(yes, I'm sure this list could be better, i threw it together in about 10 seconds, it's not a bible, its a brainstormed outline)

Cobra just acts like a different variation of Bob in a deck like this, where instead of turbocharging your drawing, he turbocharges your mana, enabling you to use cantrips and disruption or disruption + disruption + disruption all at once.

Aggro_zombies

09-17-2009, 02:30 AM

It's good in a deck that can get a lot of mileage out of extra mana, has a use for beaters and doesn't suck without it. So far that seems to be Survival as the only possibility in this format.
He's worse than Rofellos. Survival is always heavily in green, why would it take this over him? Increased vulnerability to Stifle and the inability to make lots of mana at will seems worse than being Legendary and costing :g::g:.

n00bas4urus_r3x

09-17-2009, 02:35 AM

He might be workable in Zoo. The ability to burst off of a play like land for turn (fetch) -> crack it, and have 3 mana open seems strong.

TheInfamousBearAssassin

09-17-2009, 02:37 AM

Or something like this:

4x Lotus Cobra
4x Dark Confidant
4x Tarmogoyf

4x Ponder
4x Brainstorm
2x Sensei's Divining Top

4x Force of Will
4x Daze

4x Sinkhole
4x Hymn to Tourach
4x Thoughtseize

4x Wasteland
3x Misty Rainforest
3x Polluted Delta
3x Verdant Catacombs
1x Tropical Island
1x Underground Sea
1x Island
1x Forest
1x Swamp

(yes, I'm sure this list could be better, i threw it together in about 10 seconds, it's not a bible, its a brainstormed outline)

Cobra just acts like a different variation of Bob in a deck like this, where instead of turbocharging your drawing, he turbocharges your mana, enabling you to use cantrips and disruption or disruption + disruption + disruption all at once.

Yeah, turbocharging your card draw turn three is a lot better than your mana in such a deck. What are the broken plays that he would enable in such a deck? None. Your manacurve is already scraping the floor. That's a terrible list to abuse this card.

He begs to be midrange. Put some meat in the deck and we can talk. At least some cards like Sower and Jitte and EE.

Arctic_Slicer

09-17-2009, 02:40 AM

This card wants you to play lots of lands in your deck to get the most benefit out of him so it seems kind of like a controlish card to me as you wouldn't want to be playing extra lands in an aggro deck; the fact that it's a meager 2/1 doesn't help much either. With a casting cost of 1G it just seems like he has too much competition from other cards at the same cost; outside of a few wacky Johnny concoctions, I can't think of a single deck that would want this guy. It might be good in block constructed and possibly standard but for any other format you're better off leaving him in your trade binder.

He might be workable in Zoo. The ability to burst off of a play like land for turn (fetch) -> crack it, and have 3 mana open seems strong.

Except zoo plays a minimal number of lands which allows a minimal number of opportunities to use this guy. Most of the time he is going to be a vanilla 2/1 for 1G which just doesn't cut it in this format. The uber mana cheating Aether Vial doesn't even make the cut in most zoo lists so the chance of this guy making the cut is almost zero.

Humphrey

09-17-2009, 02:51 AM

I say this card is useless. At least in Vintage and Legacy.
Also, its a 2-Drop. Spellsnare, CB anyone?

Otter

09-17-2009, 02:57 AM

I think the main problem is, "What does he accelerate out that actually matters?" He's not going to beat Rofellos for mana in the long term, so he'd better do something great up front. I'm having trouble thinking of anything better than just feeding him to Natural Order, which isn't mana intensive and I can also just use any green creature, from Tarmogoyf to Wood Elemental.

Skeggi

09-17-2009, 03:13 AM

any thoughts ?
I like the pretty colors.

eq.firemind

09-17-2009, 03:31 AM

Hmm... When I saw this, I start thinking about Mox Diamond, Crucible of Worlds, Life from the Loam... Some kind of Loam/StaX...

Oh, and I always wanted a deck around Natural Balance! :smile:

Amon Amarth

09-17-2009, 03:40 AM

Snakes. Why'd it have to be snakes?

Humphrey

09-17-2009, 03:46 AM

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/6820/22720236.jpg
u know...

takfort

09-17-2009, 04:57 AM

he has a lot of synergi with natural order, he sacrificies to it, makes it avoid daze/speed it up and might let you cast a thoughtseize before as well

Black Mass

09-17-2009, 05:36 AM

Maybe they want snakes to be the new tribe to beat :rolleyes:

4eak

09-17-2009, 05:42 AM

For Legacy, I'm just not impressed by this card. Mana Accelerants are at their peak utility on turns 1 and 2. This doesn't come online until turn 3 (in most cases). Where Birds of Paradise/Noble Hierarch can make one-land hands very keepable, this card just doesn't.

The card is good at the wrong points in the game. It is only good when you already have a decent set of mana/lands to work with, and it is useless when you are bottlenecked on land (the point at which you need the ability most).

The ramp is also unstable. Predictable, deterministic effects (even mana producing abilities) are subtle in that they don't have 'huge explosions' (like a fetchland could produce with the cobra), yet their consistency (tap: add mana each turn) is reliable and has more impact over the course of a match than we initially might perceive. For such an unreliable and inconsistent effect, it better be much stronger than the predictable and consistent options (which it isn't).

You will have to bend over backwards to make land drops consistently. If I'm running mana accelerants, it usually means I'm able to cutback on lands. This guy doesn't help you in that respect. He wants to see lots of land in your deck, which is kind of opposite the reason I would play additional mana sources.

I'd take a BoP or Hierarch over this card in every deck. If you played 26 lands in a deck (and no other mana accelerants besides cobra), then at best, each Cobra produces an average of 0.4 mana per turn. This is conditional, difficult to abuse, and frankly, not as strong a ramp as our other options.

Sure, you can try to build around this card. I don't think he's anywhere near powerful enough to be worth building around though (not like the other :1::g: creature in this format).

peace,
4eak

Eldariel

09-17-2009, 05:48 AM

Meh, it may be playable in some Natural Order crap, but that's about it. Roflmao, Priest, Wearebears & co. do the "2-drop mana accelerant" thing way better and are still fringe playables at best.

The big draw of this card is supposed to be that it can swing while accelerating your mana, but the fact that it's a 2/1 kinda puts a damper on things, especially since the only way for it to be better than Rofellos is for it to be fueling your plays while swinging.

Yeah, someone somewhere may play it, but I'd hardly call it a good card. Maybe in like...10-Land Stompy with 4-drops or something similarly incredible.

Skeggi

09-17-2009, 05:49 AM

Yeah, someone somewhere may play it, but I'd hardly call it a good card. Maybe in like...10-Land Stompy with 4-drops or something similarly incredible.
Except there you lack a decent amount of lands to trigger landfall.

Eldariel

09-17-2009, 06:23 AM

Except there you lack a decent amount of lands to trigger landfall.

If only that were the biggest of that deck's worries...

JeroenC

09-17-2009, 06:31 AM

I'm severely underwhelmed for a card hyped this much. Either I'm going to get my face pushed into a $30 price tag, or Flores and his cronies will eat their words. You heard it here first.

Arctic_Slicer

09-17-2009, 06:41 AM

I'm severely underwhelmed for a card hyped this much. Either I'm going to get my face pushed into a $30 price tag, or Flores and his cronies will eat their words. You heard it here first.

I actually feel bad for Flores as he's supposed to hype up cards to impress the Spikes and they give him Johnny's next challenge as his preview card. Even his examples of using the mana for game winning combos was a more Johnny/Spike approach than pure Spike. Honestly I don't see this card being that good outside of block constructed and maybe standard/limited. Though with all of the hype I might get lucky enough to open one at the pre-release and trade it for something that's actually good such as Misty Rainforest.

JeroenC

09-17-2009, 06:53 AM

Well, of course, only time can point out. This card is awesome for a ramp deck though. It can do extremely broken things (Harrow is being reprinted) so I think it'll be worthwile in T2.

Eldariel

09-17-2009, 06:54 AM

I actually feel bad for Flores as he's supposed to hype up cards to impress the Spikes and they give him Johnny's next challenge as his preview card. Even his examples of using the mana for game winning combos was a more Johnny/Spike approach than pure Spike. Honestly I don't see this card being that good outside of block constructed and maybe standard/limited. Though with all of the hype I might get lucky enough to open one at the pre-release and trade it for something that's actually good such as Misty Rainforest.

It's fine in Standard. The format lacks good mana accelerants outside Hierarch. It's a decent card for Flores to preview, but it sure as hell won't be making a dent in Legacy.

jazzykat

09-17-2009, 07:33 AM

A very elegantly designed and looking card. Unfortunately I could see it in a NO or perhaps strange combo deck but that is about it. I would like to own one because the picture is nice and then I'll put it next to my Island's of Wak Wak....

undone

09-17-2009, 07:38 AM

When I saw this card I was thinking of standard and extended and I think my responce was "Oh my jesus christ monky balls" But when it comes to legacy the only play this card could see would be in aggro loam and maby 4X lands, I could totaly see aggro loam running this guy although alter the deck slightly.

PS: He also might just go in ANT or Next level storms board, mostly because people board out removal and he helps dodge, daze, leathal swings(Blocker zomg!) and enables more double threats (IGG + adnauseam) and still actualy beats for 2 vs slow decks. (-1 tendril count yay!)

jazzykat

09-17-2009, 08:07 AM

Actually Tarmogoyf is awesome in a storm SB. 1 Swing should reduce needed storm count by 2.

Skeggi

09-17-2009, 08:09 AM

Yeah, good idea. You know what, if you run even more creatures, you won't have to storm at all! You can just swing for the win... hey... :really:

Nizmox

09-17-2009, 08:18 AM

Could 43 lands find a way to abuse it?

Eldariel

09-17-2009, 09:09 AM

Could 43 lands find a way to abuse it?

You're talking about the deck that contains ~40 mana producing cards with no casting cost, 8 1-drops that basically remove any limits with regards to your mana production, 4 2-drop super mana engines and random chaff? Oh, and that discards its hand turn 1 a large percentage of the games? I do not think it's exactly a perfect fit, no.

DragoFireheart

09-17-2009, 09:28 AM

This card might find value in Standard with all the fetchlands, but otherwise I don't see him making an impact on Legacy.

Lotus Cobra is neat, but that's it.

Wrath_Of_Houlding

09-17-2009, 09:51 AM

In his defense, Flores never claimed it would be good in Eternal formats, which it won't be. It is pretty nuts in standard though, especially with fetches and cascade, like he said. I see RG Ramp Cascade and B/x Vampires being the decks to beat in the new standard.

quicksilver

09-17-2009, 09:56 AM

This card is terrible for Legacy. He's like a really bad rofellos. If he costed 1 then he'd be playable.

Nightmare

09-17-2009, 10:03 AM

(Pointingouttheobvious)

this guy is flat-out retarded in multiples.

rufus

09-17-2009, 10:05 AM

I'll give it a second look if we see decks playing cards like Scapeshift, New Frontiers, or Natural Balance.

DragoFireheart

09-17-2009, 10:25 AM

(Pointingouttheobvious)

this guy is flat-out retarded in multiples.

That can be said for many things:

Tarmogoyf is nuts in multiples.

Swords is nuts in multiples.

Dark Ritual is nuts in multiples.

DrJones

09-17-2009, 10:29 AM

And your point is? All these cards are legacy staples.

DragoFireheart

09-17-2009, 10:30 AM

And your point is? All these cards are legacy staples.

Many cards become nuts in multiples, but we don't determine it's power in multiples as we may only see one in a game.

quicksilver

09-17-2009, 10:32 AM

(Pointingouttheobvious)

this guy is flat-out retarded in multiples.

So you can what? Make all that mana on turn 4? Assuming you have the 4th land drop and it's a fetch. That is way to slow for legacy. And if you build a deck to work with that you deck is going to be terrible when it doesn't get that.

Tacosnape

09-17-2009, 10:51 AM

Wrath_Of_Houlding

09-17-2009, 10:55 AM

That can be said for many things:

Tarmogoyf is nuts in multiples.

Swords is nuts in multiples.

Dark Ritual is nuts in multiples.

Screw all that: Relentless rats is crazy nuts in multiples.

JeroenC

09-17-2009, 11:00 AM

Most of the time, Birds will be able to do the same job. Yes, everything doubles up when you play fetchlands, but unless you play 12 fetchlands, that's really not going to be consistent enough.

Attacking isn't a factor either, because every format should be able to block a 2/1 two-drop.
And stay away from Twitter guys, a veritable war is going on. Nerd rage in copious amounts.:really:

ReAnimator

09-17-2009, 11:02 AM

Lotus Cobra turns Crop Rotation into a dark ritual, this can give you 9+ mana on turn 3, or 7+ on turn 2 if you can get this guy out first turn. Seems like it has potential.

Gheizen64

09-17-2009, 11:08 AM

This will never see play in legacy. And is mythic for absolutely no reason, except monetary ones. Stupid.

troopatroop

09-17-2009, 11:08 AM

Jeff Kruchkow

09-17-2009, 11:37 AM

But he is a 2/1 for 2, as opposed to other mana accelerants which only really function as land. He powers out that turn 3 Baneslayer Angel, while protecting him from the Edict guy... Doesn't seem bad to me at all.

Except we are talking about legacy. It might be alright in standard (I'm skeptical)

However, the idea of turn 3 fetch->crop rotation->fetch=7 mana seems ok and not that hard to pull off. The only issue is what do i wanna play for 7 mana that flat out wins the game??

citanul

09-17-2009, 11:37 AM

Lotus Cobra turns Crop Rotation into a dark ritual,

Crop rotation on it's own generates 1 mana less than Dark Ritual. Dark Ritual makes 1 mana into 3. Crop Rotation gives you 2, the fetch and the land you fetch. If you account a land drop in this situation it isn't really a comparison anymore.

ReAnimator

09-17-2009, 11:45 AM

Crop rotation on it's own generates 1 mana less than Dark Ritual. Dark Ritual makes 1 mana into 3. Crop Rotation gives you 2, the fetch and the land you fetch. If you account a land drop in this situation it isn't really a comparison anymore.

Here is how i'm counting it.

Cobra in play 1 forest untapped. Crop rotate for a fetch (+1) fetch (+2) tap that land (+3). That's not even counting if you played a land that turn and it was a fetch.

majikal

09-17-2009, 11:52 AM

What the fu- this thing is exactly the kind of utility card they vowed NEVER to make mythic. This motherfucker is already $25 apiece on the Bay.

FML

Soldar

09-17-2009, 11:54 AM

I'm going to test this guy a little bit in Aggro Loam, it'll happily let me play around Daze for my 3cc guys, and keep playing spells and cycling lands while Wastelanding. On the other hand, a 2/1 for 2 isn't exactly a reasonable attacker in Legacy.

Not the messiah, but maybe another piece to the Loam puzzle.

rufus

09-17-2009, 11:57 AM

The problem is that it's hard to think of decks that would want to play the Lotus Cobra instead of Tarmogoyf or something like Werebear, Noble Hierarch, or Birds of Paradise.

Basically, you'd need to play 2 fetches, or crack 2 and play 1 after the Lotus Cobra comes into play for it to be about as efficient in acceleration as a dark ritual. There's certainly potential for silliness in some kind of new combo-ish deck:

Turn 2: Lotus Cobra
Turn 3: Fetchland Crack-> New Frontiers (fetch 4 forests) -> Scapeshift (Valakut + 6 mountains), swing for 2 more.

But it all looks a little janky to me.

P.S.

09-17-2009, 02:40 PM

I think the biggest thing that people are overlooking is the fact that the mana you gain from the Landfall ability is of any color. Play a Polluted Delta, add a red mana, sacrifice and go get an Underground Sea, get a white mana. Now you have a R, W and either U or B from the Sea.

I'm sure there will be a way to break this card some how. Something comboish. I'm not looking at this dude as a beater, I'm looking at him as an engine.

T1: Forest, Birds of Paradise.
T2: Wooded Foothills, Lotus Cobra.

Tap Forest & Bird to cast Cobra. Sac Foothills get Forest (+1). Tap Forest, cast Crop Rotation, go get Wooded Foothills (+1). Sac Foothills go get Taiga (+1). Tap Taiga, use 3 mana cast Natural Order, sac Cobra, go get Progenitus.

Forest, Birds (or Elves), Crop Rotation, Lotus Cobra, Natural Order. That's a lot of cards.

MattH

09-17-2009, 02:45 PM

Legacy's a format that revolves around 1 and 2-drops. Lotus Cobra doesn't provide all that much of a speed boost to very many decks.

It's worth noting, however, that this guy can make you hit 5 mana on turn three with a fetchland, which in theory could be used for something.
I'm hoping Cobra actually provides a reasonable way to break up the paradigm of the format revolving around 1 and 2cc cards, by providing enough boost to make 4cc and 5cc cards hit play before the game's over. Like, do I want to play Wickerbough Elder in Survival? Before, the answer was "Fuck no". If I'm running a playset of this guy, it's "Well...maybe!"

Right now, Legacy is kind of stuck between playing cheap cards and getting Counterbalanced out of the game, or playing expensive cards and getting tempo'd out by Daze, Stifle, Wasteland, FoW, Lackey, and STP. If Cobra can make 4- and 5-mana cards playable, that's a big change, and I think a positive one.

Orcish Lumberjack was almost playable - a good effect at the right price, but no real home - and I see this as the same style of card, but a significant improvement. I don't think it should be dismissed out of hand.

rufus

09-17-2009, 02:47 PM

I'm sure there will be a way to break this card some how. Something comboish. I'm not looking at this dude as a beater, I'm looking at him as an engine.

As an engine card, it seems like the snake really doesn't compare all that favorably to manamorphose unless you're getting multiple land stuff, or you're using something like NO which requires a body.

quicksilver

09-17-2009, 02:53 PM

T1: Forest, Birds of Paradise.
T2: Wooded Foothills, Lotus Cobra.

Tap Forest & Bird to cast Cobra. Sac Foothills get Forest (+1). Tap Forest, cast Crop Rotation, go get Wooded Foothills (+1). Sac Foothills go get Taiga (+1). Tap Taiga, use 3 mana cast Natural Order, sac Cobra, go get Progenitus.

Forest, Birds (or Elves), Crop Rotation, Lotus Cobra, Natural Order. That's a lot of cards.

Or you know just replace Crop rotation and lotus cobra with Elvish spirit guide, or lotus petal.

P.S.

09-17-2009, 02:57 PM

Seems good with the aforementioned Quirion Ranger and cards like Exploration too.

P.S.

09-17-2009, 03:00 PM

Or you know just replace Crop rotation and lotus cobra with Elvish spirit guide, or lotus petal.

A late game Crop Rotation isn't a dead card though, like ESG or Lotus Petal. You can go and get something like Tabernacle or Treetop.

If this cards gets people to start testing new ideas, or playing old cards like Summer Bloom or Sakura-Tribe Elder again, I'll be all for it. I think it's a little ridiculous that it's already $25 on eBay but we'll see what it amounts to.

Elfrago

09-17-2009, 04:06 PM

Ok, everyone and their little brother found a way to make a lot of mana out of it. Now WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE GOING TO DO WITH THAT MANA?

tivadar

09-17-2009, 04:08 PM

Ok, everyone and their little brother found a way to make a lot of mana out of it. Now WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE GOING TO DO WITH THAT MANA?

Fireball!

Wrath_Of_Houlding

09-17-2009, 04:30 PM

Boom.

MattH

09-17-2009, 04:42 PM

Ok, everyone and their little brother found a way to make a lot of mana out of it. Now WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE GOING TO DO WITH THAT MANA?

MOAR LOAM

P.S.

09-17-2009, 04:49 PM

Maybe they want snakes to be the new tribe to beat :rolleyes:

To be fair, over the years, there have been some playable snake cards in constructed formats. Ophidian, Mystic Snake and Sakura-Tribe Elder all come to mind.

Apex

09-17-2009, 04:54 PM

Well, at least I'll be able to sell these off if I open them. Because I sure as hell am not going to play with these.

Also, I saw someone mentioned that this + fetchland = 3rd turn Baneslayer for standard. You know what else gave 3rd turn Baneslayer in the current standard? Devoted Druid, and you don't even need a fetchland for that. Last time I checked, Devoted Druid weren't played together with Baneslayer just because it COULD happen.

And this piece of crap was what got Flores so hyped? How the hell is this suppose to be on the same level as Mind's Desire?

P.S.

09-17-2009, 05:03 PM

Well, at least I'll be able to sell these off if I open them. Because I sure as hell am not going to play with these.
I think it's too early to tell. The biggest thing this card has going against it is the hype. So the price is going to be wonky.

Of course, when Tarmogoyf came out, people didn't think it was going to be $25 card. So I'm taking a "wait-and-see" approach. It could be broken. Maybe there's another card in the set that makes it really good. Maybe there will be a card in the next set that makes it really good. Maybe there's an older card that we haven't thought of/remembered yet, or maybe a new deck altogether will pop up.

It's just too early to tell.

quicksilver

09-17-2009, 05:03 PM

Ok I think I have broken lotus cobra:

Turn 1: Land
Turn 2: Land, Cobra
Turn 3:
Tap 2 land (+2mana)
Second Cobra (0 mana)
Fetchland + fetch (4 mana)
Tap Land for mana(5 mana)
Cast 4x Crop Rotation for fetches + fetch (21 mana)
Cast Fireball

And this piece of crap was what got Flores so hyped? How the hell is this suppose to be on the same level as Mind's Desire?
We have no idea which card he was so hyped about, but I can guarantee you it's not this card.

Nihil Credo

09-17-2009, 05:16 PM

I dropped by Flores' Twitter to find out if he was talking about this guy, and apparently he was:

It's for sure one of the best ever I think. On-par with Mongrel and straight up better than Confidant. Might be worse than Goyf.

I predict playing this on-curve will result in higher correlation to victory than playing Mind's Desire in the abstract.

Well, maybe he's right and we'll all be eating humble pie soon.

I am pretty sure that more than 50% of the Bobs played against me lifetime have killed my opponent.

or maybe not.

godryk

09-17-2009, 05:22 PM

And stay away from Twitter guys, a veritable war is going on. Nerd rage in copious amounts.:really:

Didn't you know the best card EVAR is coming out with Zendikar? They have seen it... :eek:

Elfrago

09-17-2009, 05:26 PM

http://www.opaquelucidity.com/facepalm.jpg

godryk

09-17-2009, 05:33 PM

:cry: :cry: :cry:

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/963/ultrafacepalm.jpg

I was being ironic.... or at least I was trying... :cry:

DukeDemonKn1ght

09-17-2009, 05:33 PM

I just don't see this guy in Legacy, although I'm sure he'll be good in Standard, might even see some play in Extended.

The only Legacy deck I can think of that might even want this guy is Eternal Garden... And it's not a very good deck right now, plus they generally try not to run many creatures besides Dark Confidant.

On a side note, I find Flores is kind of like WotC's "hype man" for tournament players. The problem is he only really pays attention to Standard and Extended, and he's prone to making statements in hyperbole... "Better than Dark Confidant," please. I just wish he had been writing back when Legends came out so I could see how much they would have made him hype up Wood Elemental.

SilverGreen

09-17-2009, 05:40 PM

It may work just fine in a Stax shell too.

quicksilver

09-17-2009, 05:48 PM

Flores has an article today about Lotus Cobra. (http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/td/56) Also the article has my name in the title for some reason.

edit: Apparently I have a rule:

"There's a problem with your idea, Mike," said my friend Chris Pikula when I told him how I wanted to play with Millikin. "You are assuming that you are going to get to tap Millikin ... even once. The problem is .... You see, Dave [Price] has this rule ... Millikin is a Weird Card. People don't know what to do about weird cards. Why in the heck is he playing with a Millikin? Dave has this rule, see. When you see a weird card and you don't know why someone is playing it ..."

"You kill it on the spot."

"That's right. You kill it on the spot."

edit: Of course if you are expecting to be playing first, and your opponent has no first turn play and spending his whole second turn to play a rupture Spire, I guess pretty much any card can seem good.

Otter

09-17-2009, 07:18 PM

Flores is a comedy legend. I'm looking forward to when he topdecks this thing on turn 12 and his opponent topdecks Bob. Or Goyf.

HAVE HEART

09-17-2009, 09:52 PM

Flores is a comedy legend. I'm looking forward to when he topdecks this thing on turn 12 and his opponent topdecks Bob. Or Goyf.

This is exactly why it will not be broken in any format. What happens when an opponent answers the player's two/three ramped-out threats? That player now has three/four Goblin Piker left in his/her deck. Birds of Paradise and Noble Hierarch are both fair, so it should be expected that this guy is more than fair.

Otter

09-17-2009, 10:13 PM

Perhaps we should have "Duel Decks: Lotus Cobra versus Tarmogoyf." Flores can make the Cobra deck.

Media314r8

09-17-2009, 10:13 PM

This is exactly why it will not be broken in any format. What happens when an opponent answers the player's two/three ramped-out threats? That player now has three/four Goblin Piker left in his/her deck. Birds of Paradise and Noble Hierarch are both fair, so it should be expected that this guy is more than fair.

I'm not sure what you're saying here...

Noble hierarch is essentially a Norwood Ranger as a topdeck, (albeit better in multiples) but the reason hierarch is good in legacy and (as of now) cobra is bad is that hierarch comes down turn one and facilitates turn two daze-proof threats and ramps 1 mana a turn starting turn two whether or not you hit your land drops. Cobra comes down turn two and enables two turn three two-drops both of which are daze proof, (conditional to you having a third land, and it being a fetch) and is a 2/1 mid-lategame, as the extra mana is not very relevant outside of decks designed to abuse it. (which would likely be better with more lands to manabond into play, as having enough mana is rarely a problem in such decks) Hierarch also makes your large men swing for an additional damage, as well as forcing your goyfs, predators, ect. through your opponent's. Cobra, however, will hardly ever attack in legacy, unless you are allready winning, as he has the same stats and relative manacost as dark confidant, which actually yields card advantage, rather than tempo advantage, which is rarely needed in legacy, as cards run out, and the format is full of cheap removal and free counterspells, making plays such as turn three baneslayer much less attractive. If cobra had deathtouch (making him psuedo-removal post accel) or came down as a 1/1 for G, his tempo boost would likely be much more relevant and thus legacy-playable. Any deck built to abuse him would likely be better advantaged by something like mana flare or additional exploration/manabond-type effects than the extremely-removable cobra, as such decks tend to play few non-land creatures, and he would turn on both counterspells and removal whos' effect would otherwise be lessened by recursive effects such as LftL or CoW.