[Official] Bitching About Prices, Buyouts and Reprints Thread

[Davran]

wait, what? A guy walked into your LGS and made a 5 figure transaction on sealed product?

Granted, I'm sure they didn't give him what SCG prices those at, but.... even 7-8k seems like a lot to drop on such a product. i'm not sure my local store would even want to acquire that because it would be so hard to move for profit.

Yeah, it was pretty surreal. We're just sitting there playing EDH and the owner came upstairs to grab cash out of his office and chat with us about what just walked in. Not sure what the actual agreed upon price was, but the gentleman in question had a NM UNL Lotus and Time Vault, plus the sealed boxes still in their factory wrap. I know the owner quite well, and he was very nervous about the transaction, so I assume it was a fairly large sum being discussed. I also know that he has some friends of his that are generally interested in power and such when he is able to acquire it, so he probably has outlets for that kind of stuff that will at least get him a little return. Maybe not SCG prices or anything...but still profit.

Part of me would love to just crack those boosters for the nostalgia value...but they're definitely worth more sealed.

[phonics]

that's the thing tho, i can't think of any other collectibles that are actively played with.

The only thing I can think of that is vaguely similar is old instruments (violins ect)

[MGB]

So I have 5 MM Eye of Ugins left, 4 in my modern Eldrazi deck to play while the deck is still unbanned, and 1 in my Legacy MUD deck.

Question: Would I be losing alot of value if I held onto the Eyes until after March 19 (the last event I'd want to play Eldrazi in before the ban)? Would it be better to dump the Eyes RIGHT NOW *before* the Modern GP or would I still be able to unload them for decent profit as late as March 20th or so?

I paid around $2-$5 for each one, so if I can dump them for anything north of $15 I'll be really happy. I still want to play the deck in Modern and possibly Legacy, but I also don't want to miss out on making a profit while I still can. I can also re-buy later on if I want to play the deck again in Legacy, and it surely won't be a factor in Modern after the April bannings.

[TsumiBand]

Scorched Ruins got bought out. 2 sellers at 19.99, and 1 at 100.00. LOL

I keep trying to find any rationale for this. Is someone just trying to game the system, again, for the 100th time, or is there some legit playability in this terrible terrible card that has only recently come to light?

[Delvis]

I keep trying to find any rationale for this. Is someone just trying to game the system, again, for the 100th time, or is there some legit playability in this terrible terrible card that has only recently come to light?

I suppose they're speculating on its playability in Eldrazi decks due to it producing CCCC. But that deck is already vulnerable to Wasteland, and that land would just be like, "Yep! You win, [insert any deck playing Wasteland or Rishadan Port here]!"

I mean, it's on the reserved list. If you buy in at $10 per and it turns out to be playable, they could wind up around, I don't know, $50 or so, in short order. But they won't.

@MGB I would hedge and sell some while retaining some. If you sell just one at market value you should be able to recoup your entire initial buy-in, and then you're playing with house money.

[sjmcc13]

I keep trying to find any rationale for this. Is someone just trying to game the system, again, for the 100th time, or is there some legit playability in this terrible terrible card that has only recently come to light?
I can not think of any uses other than a Eldrazi themed EDH deck...

[MaximumC]

I keep trying to find any rationale for this. Is someone just trying to game the system, again, for the 100th time, or is there some legit playability in this terrible terrible card that has only recently come to light?

Cross-post incoming!

Speculators can and do lose money sometimes, and I bet whoever is trying the ol' pump and dump with Scorched Ruins is going to lose money after transaction and opportunity costs.

It is rare when you can tell that a card can't see play, but here, I think you can make a solid case that Scorched Ruins basically CANNOT see play, except under such bizarre conditions that I don't think any speculator would bet on it.

First off, what does the card DO? Scorched Ruins' role is to accelerate you from 2 to 4 mana in a single land drop on turn 3. To begin with, this is an very slow way to accelerate; MUD decks want to dump their fatties right away, not durdle until turn 4. To get this effect, you have to dump two other lands into the bin without tapping them for mana that turn. Alright, so that's what we have to work with.

1. Does this give you a benefit over other lands? Not really, no. Since you want <><><><>;, I think it's safe to assume you're playing a MUD or Eldrazi deck of some kind that can function off of colorless. So, you're probably also playing the Sol lands The minute you're sacrificing an Eldrazi Temple, Eye of Ugin, Ancient Tomb, or City of Traitors, you're not better off than if you had just played a Wastes instead. You're much worse off than if you played a utility land or manland of some kind. True, it's cute to kill City of Traitors with Ruins' trigger instead of its' own, but you don't net any mana out of it. And also true, it is a cute way to dispose of spare Eyes of Ugin, but again, you could net the same kind of mana playing almost anything else.

2. Is there a downside to using Ruins? Absolutely. First off, it's a dead card on turns 1 and 2, and those are critical turns in Legacy. Worse, one Wasteland now nails 4 mana instead of 1-2. Wasteland on turn 3 after you drop Ruins is probably GG. Incidentally, even if this were Modern legal, getting Ghost Quartered is not a whole lot better.

3. Are there corner cases you can construct where Scorched Ruins has advantages over other Sol lands? Not really. Ruins does two things reasonably well: it puts lands in your graveyard and it consolidates a large amount of mana in a single land. Let's take a look at each of them.

Putting lands in your graveyard fuels Delve, so much so that a turn 4 Ruins (assuming you have an Island in addition) pays for Treasure Cruise all by itself. It also fuels the Dementia (or whatever they're calling it) mechanic from Shadows Over Innistraid. It might be giving the buyout artist too much credit here, but they might be betting some of the Dementia cards are so good that putting 2 lands in the yard is an awesome thing to do. However, as much as I would die laughing if Mudhole became a thing, there are simply much more powerful and better ways to fill you yard in Legacy. Chiefly among them? Play the game. You don't need to mill yourself to grow Goyf and you won't play a land with the huge disadvantages of Ruins just for a free Millstone activation.

Consolidating your mana in a single land is great if you're playing some kind of effect like Limited Resources, Land Equillibrium or Balance that turns your having few lands into an advantage. But, no card like that is legal / good enough to play in Legacy. No one plays Balance - Cascade. Do we really think Wizards will print new cards that give you an advantage if you're low on lands or makes it easier to cascade into Restore Balance? Well, the original Innistrad block had a mechanic that made cards stronger if you were at low life. Cards that get better when you have a low land count, however, seem really hard to print; they go literally the opposite direction of every other mechanic Wizards prints, making cards that are better early and suck late.

(EDIT: Land Tax gets a benefit out of you having few lands, too, and this is probably the only really cute thing about Ruins. If you play T1 Tax into T3 Ruins, you're probably behind on lands for at least the next 3 turns, letting you strip every single land from your deck. However, since you're playing White, Lotus Vale seems superior.)

4. For each of the corner cases you can construct to make Ruins interesting, are there already better options? You bet! We have lots of turn 1 plays that let us dump arbitrary amounts of cards into our graveyards without needing Ruins. If you want a low land count for a Balance effect, why not just play artifact mana?

Almost any kind of weird scenario you could construct to justify Ruins also justifies Lotus Vale, and probably moreso. That card is not spiking. Perhaps someone thinks buying Ruins will make it spike? (It shouldn't -- see above). This includes wacky new mechanics. Let's say they print a land that says "This land has all the activated abilities of lands in your graveyard." I'd want Vale over Ruins in that scenario, no contest.

In summary, Ruins fails the Tibalt test:
1. The decks that would run a card like this have better existing options;
2. This card is incompatible with those existing options;
3. There are better cards for any purpose you could imagine Ruins performing; and
4. The kind of new card that would improve Ruins is not likely to see print.

The only remaining possibility is someone hoping against hope that Lotus Vale and friends get their original text restored, which would of course make this a $200 - $300 card overnight, I would think. However, that change won't happen. At least as long as Mr. Tabak is in charge of the Oracle. To see why, let me link you to my exhaustive analysis of the subject. ;)

http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/604177-oracle-text-and-errata-policy-the-qui-bono-school

From there:


A "Cui Bono" policy also explains why cards like Abeyance and Lotus Vale still have errata that preserves their functionality over rules changes, even though strict application of schools 2 or 3 would reject that. Without the change, Abeyance is nearly Time Walk and Vale is nearly Lotus. Wizards probably does not think reprinting the most powerful cards in Magic’s history is a good idea. Who can blame them? Mr. Tabak has actually explained it that way to me, saying "If we remove the errata on those cards and then ban them in all formats, whose interests have we served?" or something to that effect.


EDIT: If you doubt the folly of chasing Ruins, look at the eBay completed auctions. Since the spike, there have been EXACTLY TWO listings that closed at the new 19-20 dollar pump tag that I can find. Looks like the fishies are not biting, oh Captain of Industry!

[the Thin White Duke]

Oh snap! I just picked up 13 Null Rods at my LGS for $5 each. How can this backfire on me?

[Megadeus]

May i ask... What about Abeyance was changed? I may be missing something, but it seems pretty close to what the card says that it does. Was there some old rule that allowed it to do something unintended? What made it so special?

[bruizar]

text

I think you are forgetting the part where you can sacrifice double Urborgs/Eye of Ugins that you have stuck in your hand. But even with that going for it, it still sucks. The best I can think of is UU, Play Ruins, tap, play land equilibrium :/

[MaximumC]

I think you are forgetting the part where you can sacrifice double Urborgs/Eye of Ugins that you have stuck in your hand. But even with that going for it, it still sucks. The best I can think of is UU, Play Ruins, tap, play land equilibrium :/

I didn't miss any of that, Oh All Seeing Eye! I mentioned the interaction with legendary lands, and Eye in particular, and I mentioned the funny interactions with land-limiting cards like Equillibrium. I then reached the same conclusion you did - Ruins is still terrible. :)


May i ask... What about Abeyance was changed? I may be missing something, but it seems pretty close to what the card says that it does. Was there some old rule that allowed it to do something unintended? What made it so special?

As written, Abeyance stops lands for tapping from mana when read under Sixth Edition and newer rules. It has Oracle text that specifically changes this and allows you to use mana abilities.

[bruizar]

I didn't miss any of that, Oh All Seeing Eye! I mentioned the interaction with legendary lands, and Eye in particular, and I mentioned the funny interactions with land-limiting cards like Equillibrium. I then reached the same conclusion you did - Ruins is still terrible. :)

It seems like I missed that part :)

[phonics]

It seems to me that the puca trade manipulation is the most probable answer, just buy them out and spike the price and then put them into puca for instant profit?

And it looks like Thorn of Amethyst just spiked too.

[ESG]

May i ask... What about Abeyance was changed? I may be missing something, but it seems pretty close to what the card says that it does. Was there some old rule that allowed it to do something unintended? What made it so special?

Before the errata on Abeyance, it turned off lands producing mana via the line "abilities requiring an activation cost," so it was basically a white Time Walk that cantripped. For a short while, anyway. I remember people scrambling to pick up copies and the price shooting up (I recall $30, which was a lot at the time). Then WOTC issued the errata and people became much less interested. The card still saw play, but it wasn't broken anymore.

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/wl/117.jpg

Edit: Ah, just saw Maximum C's reply in that multi-post reply.

[CutthroatCasual]

Oh snap! I just picked up 13 Null Rods at my LGS for $5 each. How can this backfire on me?

Sell me 4 for $40. 200% return.


Before the errata on Abeyance, it turned off lands producing mana via the line "abilities requiring an activation cost," so it was basically a white Time Walk that cantripped. For a short while, anyway. I remember people scrambling to pick up copies and the price shooting up (I recall $30, which was a lot at the time). Then WOTC issued the errata and people became much less interested. The card still saw play, but it wasn't broken anymore.

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/wl/117.jpg

Seems pretty good in a deck that's mono creature removal.

[DLifshitz]

i can't think of any other collectibles that are actively played with.

Dual lands are being played with. The market for dual lands is not likely to collapse as long as there are people willing to play in some relevant Eternal format, which means, for at least a generation from today. But what's happening to random fringe cards, and cards whose only claim to fame is being on the Reserved List, will probably turn out to be a speculation bubble. They are nothing more than collectibles with no practical use.

[jrsthethird]

Dual lands are being played with. The market for dual lands is not likely to collapse as long as there are people willing to play in some relevant Eternal format, which means, for at least a generation from today. But what's happening to random fringe cards, and cards whose only claim to fame is being on the Reserved List, will probably turn out to be a speculation bubble. They are nothing more than collectibles with no practical use.

I think he meant things other than MTG. Like, no one plays competitively with their Star Trek figures.

[Mr.C]

I keep trying to find any rationale for this. Is someone just trying to game the system, again, for the 100th time, or is there some legit playability in this terrible terrible card that has only recently come to light?

Highest buylist currently is $6.70 (and rising, yesterday it was $5). TCG Mid last week was $3, SCG was $3.50 iirc. A cool, easy double up.

If I were in the US, I'd totally be participating in this right now. Unfortunately, shipping costs to Canada are insane.

The reason it keeps happening is that most people are greedy *and* stupid to buy into these things.

Edit: As for things that are "used" (played with), I can think of classic cars, which have gone through various boom/bust phases.

[chemicalstylez]

Anymore it just seems like "guess the card that's getting bought out next", lol. I've never in all my years have seen cards just wash up instantly. The more I search older cards the more I see evidence of buyouts, some of them aren't even noticed yet. Boy how times have changed.

[mini1337s]

I'd like to throw-out a question to the Forum.

What disincentive is there to buying out nearly any reserve list card that has not already experienced a buyout? Clearly, when they are not extreme (IE. Scorched Earth from $2 to $100) there is a track record of people panic-buying into non-proven buyouts, particularly on early expansion cards (Arabian - Legends).

As quick examples from Legends, cards I would consider unproven, but subsequently have seen major gains, both in retail AND in buylist, are:

Arboria
Divine Intervention
Field of Dreams
In the Eye of Chaos
Invoke Prejudice
Land Equilibrium
Living Plane
Storm World
Typhoon

While MTGstocks is super easy to manipulate, people, albeit many uninformed, are clearly buying into them based on Sold Listings on eBay.

Honestly, aside from an ethical reservations that one might have, you can double-triple up on trash with zero downside. The only people who really can "justify" the new prices are people completing sets, but I would be surprised at how many people are doing this. Based on the number of sales you can view on eBay (as start for determining sales), it makes you wonder how many people just take easily manipulated price aggregation as truth, and from there is becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Typhoon, which is LITERAL garbage in every format, has gone from $.99 to closing on eBay at $15-20 USD just because some decided to create a price-spike.

All that said, there are cards out there that I believe could legitimately see justified price increases, though those cards are in the majority. A lot of them already happened and were supported by legitimate demand based on rarity and use. A couple good examples of this would be Legends Sylvan Library, Legends Underworld Dreams, and Alpha -> Unlimited rares that are played as 4 of's in Swedish 94 (Jayemdae Tome, Mana Vault, Armageddon, etc) that people want to pimp out their old school decks with.

Please note, I'm not advocating this (and don't do this), but anyone, even those with ethical reservations, essentially is a sucker for not doing this.

As a side note, and I'm not trying to encourage buyouts or panic buys, but I keep my mind on the following:

Alpha - Beta:
Hypnotic Specter
Power Sink

Beta:
Icy Manipulator

Arabian Nights:
Kird Ape

Antiquities:
Jalum Tome
Power Artifact (unless re-restricted in Swedish 94, which there is a high potential of)

Legends:
Mirror Universe (ENGLISH only)

If you have them on your radar for personal use, I would suggest getting them sooner than later. I know this is a public forum, but all of these are cards I am legitimately surprised haven't been bought out.

[Mr.C]

There is no disincentive whatsoever. Buyouts can move tge market of anything pre-Alara, pretty much.

[KindGrind]

There is no reason not to pick up dirty cheap 93/94 playables at this point, stuff like Jalum Tome and LGD Relic Barrier. I'm not saying "buy them all!", but owning a set or 2 might prove useful. A set of these will cost you what, a few bucks each? Why not. It is too late for Fellwar Stone, but there are many more targets out there.

Power Artifact I don't see re-restricted, not very soon anyway. If the most recent tournament report on the old school blog is any indication, that is. His fellings echo mine on the deck: when it works, it feels terribly powerful, but half the time it ends up fizzling. "I was missing only 1 mana to untap the Monolith, but Chaos Orb / SInkhole made sure I could never untap it." That happens quite a bit. That or you have infinite mana but no sink.

There are a few old school cards I have on my radar, but as you guys know and understand, name dropping isn't going to help accessibility for anyone, so I'll refrain from now.

[jamesh]

I'm interested to see how Old School develops. Will it be the tiny leaders of 2016? If it becomes more popular, I imagine people will be relaxed about introducing revised cards to the format. These cards are pretty old now anyway. Black border is one thing but paying a premium for unlimited is something I wouldn't do.

[Lysandros]

I really don't see Old School going anywhere. The draw of the format is the casual, beer-friendly nature of it all. No tournament scene needed. Speaking from personal experience, it replaced what used to be my weekly poker game when I found people who could play it. The format just doesn't have the same flash-in-the-pan feel that Tiny Leaders does...it's much more Commander-esque, and I think that'll be reflected in its staying power. A couple cards that are ubiquitous in the format that I'm shocked haven't spiked hard or harder are ANQ Mishra's Factories, ANQ Strip Mines, and most of all, ARN City of Brass. City in particular is in most all Old School decks and it's about impossible to find them in NM condition given how much the card was played back in the day (and therefore most ARN versions are beat to hell). While I'm excited about the format since it's an outlet to play with old cards, it's also made completing sets of those old expansions much more expensive than I'd like.

[Stan]

I really don't see Old School going anywhere. The draw of the format is the casual, beer-friendly nature of it all. No tournament scene needed. Speaking from personal experience, it replaced what used to be my weekly poker game when I found people who could play it. The format just doesn't have the same flash-in-the-pan feel that Tiny Leaders does...it's much more Commander-esque, and I think that'll be reflected in its staying power. A couple cards that are ubiquitous in the format that I'm shocked haven't spiked hard or harder are ANQ Mishra's Factories, ANQ Strip Mines, and most of all, ARN City of Brass. City in particular is in most all Old School decks and it's about impossible to find them in NM condition given how much the card was played back in the day (and therefore most ARN versions are beat to hell). While I'm excited about the format since it's an outlet to play with old cards, it's also made completing sets of those old expansions much more expensive than I'd like.

Tell me about it. Two years ago, I completed my UNL power, and I already had several of the UNL duals. I managed to pick up the missing ones quickly, and with the power, Time Vault, duals and Gauntlet already in my possession, I decided to ocmplete the set. The biggest ones still missing now are Armageddon, Winter Orb, Howling Mine and Wheel of Fortune. And then that stupid 93-94 crap happens. 80 cards missing until completion, most of them rares, and the effort became a whole lot more expensive.

[keys]

Old School was fun for a while, but then you realize... the format (if you want to call it that) NEVER CHANGES. It's good for nostalgia, but it gets boring real fast. It's more of a niche collector obsession than a format, IMO.

That's not to say that some A/B/U/AN/ANTQ cards weren't undervalued (especially reserved list stuff), but some of the prices on UNL cards are getting a bit out of hand and they probably will end up dropping back down over time.

--

On another topic-- looks like Colorless Eldrazi is the real deal in legacy (or at least as good as MUD which is already a regular). For those who have all the MUD staples already (Wastes, Mishras, Caverns, Tombs, Cities, Chalices), when is the best time to buy the Eldrazi core if you want to convert your deck? After the predicted Modern ban? (Will it even matter given that it seems inevitable at this point and everyone knows it?) Would you buy any now? (perhaps Temples/Thorns?) How would this differ for foils?

[Lysandros]

It doesn't take much to turn 93/94 into 95 by introducing Ice Age and Homelands. Then 96, and so on. The format probably loses some of its nostalgia (and certainly it's innocence) with Urza's Block (if not Alliances). Then there's Old School Commander, etc. it doesn't take much to mix it up. JMO, but I'm convinced it's got staying power as a "thing," at least as far as demand for original printings of old cards are concerned

[H]

On another topic-- looks like Colorless Eldrazi is the real deal in legacy (or at least as good as MUD which is already a regular). For those who have all the MUD staples already (Wastes, Mishras, Caverns, Tombs, Cities, Chalices), when is the best time to buy the Eldrazi core if you want to convert your deck? After the predicted Modern ban? (Will it even matter given that it seems inevitable at this point and everyone knows it?) Would you buy any now? (perhaps Temples/Thorns?) How would this differ for foils?

I think prices on the Eldrazi have already started dropping. I picked up the last 3 Endless Ones I needed (I have all the rest) for about 3 dollars each. I could swear they were higher just last week.

[rlesko]

I'm interested to see how Old School develops. Will it be the tiny leaders of 2016? If it becomes more popular, I imagine people will be relaxed about introducing revised cards to the format. These cards are pretty old now anyway. Black border is one thing but paying a premium for unlimited is something I wouldn't do.

I agree with this sentiment 100%. The tournaments that do pop up in the US (at eternal weekend, for example) allow any version of the card thats non foil original artwork. The spike on UNL cards seems 100% artificial so I don't see how it stays. FWIW, its also odd that the format is called 93/94 yet revised (printed in 94...) isn't allowed. And most people who played back then would tell you revised was on the tables more than A/B/U, so in a way 93/94 is a little bit disingenuous by not allowing revised anyways.

[Bosque]

I agree with this sentiment 100%. The tournaments that do pop up in the US (at eternal weekend, for example) allow any version of the card thats non foil original artwork. The spike on UNL cards seems 100% artificial so I don't see how it stays. FWIW, its also odd that the format is called 93/94 yet revised (printed in 94...) isn't allowed. And most people who played back then would tell you revised was on the tables more than A/B/U, so in a way 93/94 is a little bit disingenuous by not allowing revised anyways.

Yeah, I played then and by far revised was hugely more numerous. Additionally Fallen Empires was released in 1994 as well so if we're being honest about the naming it should at least include revised and FE.

[sjmcc13]

I think prices on the Eldrazi have already started dropping. I picked up the last 3 Endless Ones I needed (I have all the rest) for about 3 dollars each. I could swear they were higher just last week.
There was an initial rush right after the pro tour, and once the have to have it now players were satisfied the price started going down, and last I saw still on a downward trend. It will not go back to pre-pro tour #'s but they have all gone down a bit.
The creatures being in a current draft set helps with their prices, as the drafts are a downward force on the price, unfortunately once a ban could come into effect the set will not be the current draft set anymore, and that downward force will be gone. and since they are pretty much all seeing some Standard play I half expect them to go up a bit once they stop being drafted, since the std demand could outstrip the modern demand for a few of them.

These are also cards that the Kitchen Table players are going to look at and say "oh, cool" meaning they might not get rid of theirs as easily.

I would say for non-foils you can try to wait for the price to reach its bottom, but for foils, I would go now if you think the cards has the chance to become a Legacy contender because as soon as the pimp my deck crowd starts building it the foil price will spike.

[sjmcc13]

I agree with this sentiment 100%. The tournaments that do pop up in the US (at eternal weekend, for example) allow any version of the card thats non foil original artwork. The spike on UNL cards seems 100% artificial so I don't see how it stays. FWIW, its also odd that the format is called 93/94 yet revised (printed in 94...) isn't allowed. And most people who played back then would tell you revised was on the tables more than A/B/U, so in a way 93/94 is a little bit disingenuous by not allowing revised anyways.

From what I read, it is basically elitism and showing how they are better than others while claiming nostalgia, Revised was released before Legends and The Dark which are both included.

[keys]

From what I read, it is basically elitism and showing how they are better than others while claiming nostalgia, Revised was released before Legends and The Dark which are both included.

Yep, it makes no sense. Could have been a deliberate plan to increase the value of UNL cards collectors were holding.

More anecdotal evidence, but I was also playing during 93/94 and Revised cards were definitely more common (and are hence more nostalgic to me).

[mini1337s]

From what I read, it is basically elitism and showing how they are better than others while claiming nostalgia, Revised was released before Legends and The Dark which are both included.
You are correct, but recognize that Swedish Magic 93/94, which is the go-to for the majority of players, started in 2007 amongst a very small playgroup. People took notice locally, and slowly over the last 9 years it has spread across the globe. 94 or Old School play started to peak some interest in North America around 2011-2013 on and sites like Eternal Central and LandLotusJuzam (which is amazing if you haven't seen it) developed similar formats, but with more lax printing restrictions. Throughout that period, I've found the Swedish ruleset and restrictions to be the most popular globally.
The reason that the Swedish format gained a lot of interest was largely due to Chas Andres's (Starcity Finance Writer) article on it last May (http://www.starcitygames.com/article/30889_Old-School-Magic.html). He didn't try to make it a spec format, but he encouraged people to pickup Unlimited copies as the pricing was much cheaper than Alpha and Beta. People took note and the items quickly started to dry up and increase in price sense.
I can appreciate that a lot of people were burned with Tiny Leaders and now are very skeptical homebrewed formats. I also understand that the restrictions of the Swedish format seem to imply that people are trying to pull the financial wool over your eyes. That said, the is documented history and interest in this particular iteration of the format for nearly 10 years, with the last 5 years being on a global level.
As I've previously said, no one is forcing anyone to follow the Swedish 94 printing restrictions, however that tends to be the most desirable way to play. People like pimp, and the reality is that Unlimited is now considered a pimp printing by many people. We all know there is a finite amount of this stuff out there, especially in near mint condition, so with increased demand 22 years post printing, the prices are going to go up. I sympathize with those who genuinely want to relive some nostaglia and play with early printings, but it is what it is. You don't need to get hung up on whether your cards say Tap or have the Tap symbol, but if it is important to you, realize that the available supply has diminished from early adopters and the price has increased.

[H]

Yeah, I played then and by far revised was hugely more numerous. Additionally Fallen Empires was released in 1994 as well so if we're being honest about the naming it should at least include revised and FE.

Here in the US, the Eternal Central rules allow Revised and FE.

They also generally change the Restricted list to allow "new" decks to be made each event.


There was an initial rush right after the pro tour, and once the have to have it now players were satisfied the price started going down, and last I saw still on a downward trend. It will not go back to pre-pro tour #'s but they have all gone down a bit.
The creatures being in a current draft set helps with their prices, as the drafts are a downward force on the price, unfortunately once a ban could come into effect the set will not be the current draft set anymore, and that downward force will be gone. and since they are pretty much all seeing some Standard play I half expect them to go up a bit once they stop being drafted, since the std demand could outstrip the modern demand for a few of them.

These are also cards that the Kitchen Table players are going to look at and say "oh, cool" meaning they might not get rid of theirs as easily.

I would say for non-foils you can try to wait for the price to reach its bottom, but for foils, I would go now if you think the cards has the chance to become a Legacy contender because as soon as the pimp my deck crowd starts building it the foil price will spike.

That makes sense. Also, I think people have realized it is almost certainly going to be banned in Modern and so demand has slacked, while supply really hasn't.

If you want foils though, always move on them before the set is out of print. Once it is, the price on foil anything playable generally doubles. I'm glad Gerry had Matter Reshapers in his deck though, I randomly opened a foil one in my prize packs on Friday and I have a playset of regular ones.

[keys]

I would say for non-foils you can try to wait for the price to reach its bottom, but for foils, I would go now if you think the cards has the chance to become a Legacy contender because as soon as the pimp my deck crowd starts building it the foil price will spike.

Thanks for the input.

If you have the Stompy manabase and Chalices already, the deck is actually quite cheap. I ended up buying set foils (since the multiple was only about 2x) of everything except the Thorns (bought non-foil) and Eyes (waiting for a ban) and it came out to less than 300 euros.

Seemed like an easy upgrade on standard MUD and better for the long-term since it's also playable in Modern (assuming the DCI doesn't completely gut it).

Though if they ban Temple and not Eye I'll feel a bit stupid...

[Di]

Thanks for the input.

If you have the Stompy manabase and Chalices already, the deck is actually quite cheap. I ended up buying set foils (since the multiple was only about 2x) of everything except the Thorns (bought non-foil) and Eyes (waiting for a ban) and it came out to less than 300 euros.

Seemed like an easy upgrade on standard MUD and better for the long-term since it's also playable in Modern (assuming the DCI doesn't completely gut it).

Though if they ban Temple and not Eye I'll feel a bit stupid...

In all honesty if the deck remains playable in Legacy, a banning of Eye in Modern won't drop the price that significantly. Sadly price memory is a thing, and the fact that the deck appears to be playable in Legacy (and relatively budget at that) will help it maintain a price of $20+ regardless of what happens to it in Modern.

[keys]

In all honesty if the deck remains playable in Legacy, a banning of Eye in Modern won't drop the price that significantly. Sadly price memory is a thing, and the fact that the deck appears to be playable in Legacy (and relatively budget at that) will help it maintain a price of $20+ regardless of what happens to it in Modern.

True, but I think we might see a lot of Expedition Eyes go up for sale if it does get banned. You also have Tron players who'd probably be selling their copies as well.

[sjmcc13]

True, but I think we might see a lot of Expedition Eyes go up for sale if it does get banned. You also have Tron players who'd probably be selling their copies as well.
Eye might still command value from EDH players wanting it, as tutoring my eldrazi and other targets is good enough for many of them.

If you want foils though, always move on them before the set is out of print. Once it is, the price on foil anything playable generally doubles. I'm glad Gerry had Matter Reshapers in his deck though, I randomly opened a foil one in my prize packs on Friday and I have a playset of regular ones.

Ya, I do not know if I should be hopeful of this, or dreading it.
I bought a 4 Japanese boxes (tentacle monsters need to be Japanese, not English) and pulled a foil Thought-Knot, Mimic and Reshaper from them. Now I do not know if I should buy foil Japanese playsets or sell those 3 cards...

[KindGrind]

I really don't see Old School going anywhere. The draw of the format is the casual, beer-friendly nature of it all. No tournament scene needed. Speaking from personal experience, it replaced what used to be my weekly poker game when I found people who could play it. The format just doesn't have the same flash-in-the-pan feel that Tiny Leaders does...it's much more Commander-esque, and I think that'll be reflected in its staying power. A couple cards that are ubiquitous in the format that I'm shocked haven't spiked hard or harder are ANQ Mishra's Factories, ANQ Strip Mines, and most of all, ARN City of Brass. City in particular is in most all Old School decks and it's about impossible to find them in NM condition given how much the card was played back in the day (and therefore most ARN versions are beat to hell). While I'm excited about the format since it's an outlet to play with old cards, it's also made completing sets of those old expansions much more expensive than I'd like.

I understand and share the views of most here about Old School. It does indeed feel somewhat elitist, allowing certain prints and not others. Yes, the Fallen and Revised argument. Tiny Leader was indeed a flash in the pan, but Old School developped slowly over the years. All valid points.

I couldn't care less if the guy in front of me taps an Cronicles City to tap a Revised Tome to draw a card. I'd rather have someone in front of me to play with than building decks I can only goldfish. At the end of the day, I do feel the format has lasting appeal. Price memory being what it is, I doubt the cards are going down to what they were last year, even if all of a sudden everybody decides to unload their staples.

Considering my very limited free time and my absence of desire to take part in Modern tournaments, I converted some Modern staples into stuff on the Reserve List/Power 2 years ago. At the rate they were reprinting stuff, keeping everything in a box didn't seem like a good idea. The trades you could make back then were truly mindblowing, with stores no less. Although the prices on higher end stuff readjusted, some Modern cards are way overpriced and would convert nicely to RL stuff even now. Glimmervoid, Ravager, Ugin, Chalice,...Spellskite? I don't like the fact they can reprint, and do reprint everything they can. People sitting right now on sets of Twilight Mires and Phyrexian Altar are wasting money. I mean, why? If you play in tournaments I semi get it. If they're in your pet decks that's fine. But these sitting in binders?

There's an insane amount of pressure on AN City of Brass these days, especially NM ones, but the beat up will follow suit eventually. Considering the price of Duals, most people turn to these for fixing. I, for one, am very optimistic for the format, and there is palpable, growing interest in my city. Clerk at my LGS tells me the old binders are taken out and emptied a hell of a lot more than before, and anything remotely playable from UNL/LGD/ANQ sells very well and quickly. That did not happen overnight, mind you, but a rather as growing interests over time here.

[jamesh]

There's an insane amount of pressure on AN City of Brass these days, especially NM ones, but the beat up will follow suit eventually.

This is another interesting area of collection - beat up cards. If you are playing in 9394 why would you care about having NM cities? There is an authenticity about playing old, beat up cards and 9394 is the format for that. Really heavy play cards are often more popular/commented on than EX condition cards.

[Bed Decks Palyer]

It doesn't take much to turn 93/94 into 95 by introducing Ice Age and Homelands. Then 96, and so on. The format probably loses some of its nostalgia (and certainly it's innocence) with Urza's Block (if not Alliances). Then there's Old School Commander, etc. it doesn't take much to mix it up. JMO, but I'm convinced it's got staying power as a "thing," at least as far as demand for original printings of old cards are concerned

If I'd be to play any kind of so-called Old School "format", I'd try to play with a rule "one new set per year". So yes, I'd play solely with ABU+Nights until December. It might be pretty silly and boring, but considering that I'd have time for about ten evenings of MtG until that date, it won't be THAT boring.

Or, maybe the 93-95 would be better. There are of additional cards, with some amazing mana fixing options (painlands, Glaciers), especially if we'd allow APO painlands for the sake of balance. (There's nothing wrong with five additional lands; those should have been in Ice Age, not the Veldt nonsense.)

With ABU-Alliances you got many of cheap and good new cards. The nostalgia factor is not that affected, unless you started in 93/4 and had the best time back then. The color green is still kinda shitty (it will be until at least Mirage, if not until Visions), but at least you can build some silly Storm Cauldron + Fastbond deck and you got loads of cheap LD, some additional removal (Dark Ban, Reprisal), a semi-viable graveyard decks (Nether Shadow + Ice Age Ghoul), some kind of silly reanimator (Mind Bomb, Deep Spawn, 8x Animate Dead), traditional RG Beats with solid number of bolts, GWillowGeddon, monoblack/white knights, Sacrificial Dance of the Collosus of Drain Life, whatever else.
Even Stasis.

I'd love that format, but alas, it won't happen.

[Havrekjex]

I think the 93/94 format looks fun and interesting, but there`s just no way I`m sticking to the edition rule. I get the original intent, I really do, but paying $83 a piece for an otherwise unplayable card like Erhnam Djinn is just not something I can bring myself to do when the Chronicles edition costs $0.2. Even something like a set of Unlimited Armageddon costs Tarmogoyf money while a Revised set can be had for $10. And don`t get me started on Unlimited duals. I have the dough, but that`s not at all how I want to spend it. This has a ripple effect when considering if I should get into the format. Do I bother to build the deck and spend money on the cards I need that don`t have cheap reprints and/or have non-artificial value if I won`t be able to play in proper tournaments? Maybe not. I absolutely think that they should open up, officially, for playing Revised and Chronicles reprints of cards that are in the legal sets if they want their format to survive and grow. Then again, maybe opening up the format and making it widely popular is not their intent at all.

[Bed Decks Palyer]

Then again, maybe opening up the format and making it widely popular is not their intent at all.
If by "them" you mean the original Swedes, then yes, they're not interested. Their choice, and I understand why they've chosen that.

[Stan]

The issues with 93/94 can be easily fixed. The Swedes invented it, so even though it's a completely casual format, there will be a psychological expectation of people to play by the 'official' Swedish rules, sort of like how in reality most EDH playgroups stick to the official banlist. If there'd still be an invitational, WotC would have to simply include something like 93/94 on the agenda, and allow reprints of the cards. Instantaneously, the 'official' rules as seen by the playerbase will be those of WotC, even if they'd never touch the format again afterwards (kind of like how Cursed Scroll is still banned from Tempest block tournaments, even though those haven't been organized in 19 years). Even a single tournament as side event on a legacy GP would do, probably. It'd prevent further inflation of a good chunk of the secondary market.

[H]

Ya, I do not know if I should be hopeful of this, or dreading it.
I bought a 4 Japanese boxes (tentacle monsters need to be Japanese, not English) and pulled a foil Thought-Knot, Mimic and Reshaper from them. Now I do not know if I should buy foil Japanese playsets or sell those 3 cards...

Well, I am not one for Japanese cards. Do you really want to play the deck? If so, I'd say go for it now. If you don't really, then I'd move them, you can always pick up non-foil ones easily post-Modern ban.

[Spam]

Really, do we really need wizard to step in and say: "Hey, guys, we printed this card so you can play it. And if someone says otherwise, just change friends."
People are just accepting this for no reason.

Inviato dal mio LG-D605 utilizzando Tapatalk

[Stan]

Really, do we really need wizard to step in and say: "Hey, guys, we printed this card so you can play it. And if someone says otherwise, just change friends."
People are just accepting this for no reason.

Inviato dal mio LG-D605 utilizzando Tapatalk

Yes, we do, because yes, they do. Man is a pathetic herd creature.

[ReAnimator]

I think the 93/94 format looks fun and interesting, but there`s just no way I`m sticking to the edition rule. I get the original intent, I really do, but paying $83 a piece for an otherwise unplayable card like Erhnam Djinn is just not something I can bring myself to do when the Chronicles edition costs $0.2. Even something like a set of Unlimited Armageddon costs Tarmogoyf money while a Revised set can be had for $10. And don`t get me started on Unlimited duals. I have the dough, but that`s not at all how I want to spend it. This has a ripple effect when considering if I should get into the format. Do I bother to build the deck and spend money on the cards I need that don`t have cheap reprints and/or have non-artificial value if I won`t be able to play in proper tournaments? Maybe not. I absolutely think that they should open up, officially, for playing Revised and Chronicles reprints of cards that are in the legal sets if they want their format to survive and grow. Then again, maybe opening up the format and making it widely popular is not their intent at all.


Not sure how it is in Europe, but every get together in North America i have seen goes by the Eternal Central rules list, which includes FE, and is fine with reprints and FBB.

I've got a Oldschool deck that i'm going to be playing with at GP Toronto (we're trying to get a side event going). It's like 90% "real" but i'm not interested in getting unlimited Duals for it, i've had my duals since 94, screw anyone who says that isn't old enough. The rest is just for aesthetics and pimp factor and cause it hasn't cost me much at all.

[chemicalstylez]

Not sure how it is in Europe, but every get together in North America i have seen goes by the Eternal Central rules list, which includes FE, and is fine with reprints and FBB.

I've got a Oldschool deck that i'm going to be playing with at GP Toronto (we're trying to get a side event going). It's like 90% "real" but i'm not interested in getting unlimited Duals for it, i've had my duals since 94, screw anyone who says that isn't old enough. The rest is just for aesthetics and pimp factor and cause it hasn't cost me much at all.

Yea we play 93/94 here as well, and revised in totally allowed. There is no way now people could afford the Swedes rules, plus those rules they made were when the older cards were MUCH cheaper. Compare prices to 2007 and its not even close.... and we also allow FBB.

[aahz]

Not sure how it is in Europe, but every get together in North America i have seen goes by the Eternal Central rules list, which includes FE, and is fine with reprints and FBB.

I've got a Oldschool deck that i'm going to be playing with at GP Toronto (we're trying to get a side event going). It's like 90% "real" but i'm not interested in getting unlimited Duals for it, i've had my duals since 94, screw anyone who says that isn't old enough. The rest is just for aesthetics and pimp factor and cause it hasn't cost me much at all.
In NorCal, we have our own list (different from EC), but we do also allow Revised, Chronicles, Fallen Empires, and FBB. And quite frankly, I don't think any of us care as long as reprints are old frame and original picture (I've even played a 4th Edition Verduran Enchantress, though admittedly it was a pimpish color error one).

Speaking of which, we just had an event a couple days ago (http://www.archive.themanadrain.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=c6cn8as7sl98ss8shubpn0s4v0&topic=48433.0) (lots of pics for those into that sort of thing).

[KindGrind]

In NorCal, we have our own list (different from EC), but we do also allow Revised, Chronicles, Fallen Empires, and FBB. And quite frankly, I don't think any of us care as long as reprints are old frame and original picture (I've even played a 4th Edition Verduran Enchantress, though admittedly it was a pimpish color error one).

Speaking of which, we just had an event a couple days ago (http://www.archive.themanadrain.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=c6cn8as7sl98ss8shubpn0s4v0&topic=48433.0) (lots of pics for those into that sort of thing).

Thanks for sharing this - beautiful decks inside. I see you also allow 4x Black Vise, which makes UR pretty devastating! I also notice Tourach isn't restricted (some group do restrict it) - I'd absolutely be rocking that Deadguy Ale pile the front runner was playing in a Tourach-friedly meta. This is what I'm talking about - some people going all out with their Beta duals and Power, and others rocking their RV Duals. Excellent day of MTG it must have been!

Side note: so many Howling Mines... No wonder they're getting pretty hard to come by... =)
Side note #2: that blue mana-screw deck is a feast for the eyes.... Tabernacle overkill (!)

[ReAnimator]

Speaking of which, we just had an event a couple days ago (http://www.archive.themanadrain.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=c6cn8as7sl98ss8shubpn0s4v0&topic=48433.0) (lots of pics for those into that sort of thing).

Sweet! thanks for the share.

[Jamaican Zombie Legend]

Petrified Field just doubled in price; is it some sort of speculative anti-Wasteland tech for Legacy Eldrazi builds? Or is it just another crazy buyout?

[Bed Decks Palyer]

Petrified Field just doubled in price; is it some sort of speculative anti-Wasteland tech for Legacy Eldrazi builds? Or is it just another crazy buyout?

Maybe the idea is that the card is crappy enough to not be reprinted ever, but otoh everybody needs it for T1 dredge? Is it RL?

[Barook]

Is it RL?
Odyssey, so nope. But how would it be better than CoW as anti-LD tech?

[phonics]

Maybe the idea is that the card is crappy enough to not be reprinted ever, but otoh everybody needs it for T1 dredge? Is it RL?

Rebuys bazzars and landfall triggers for days.

[Davran]

Petrified Field just doubled in price; is it some sort of speculative anti-Wasteland tech for Legacy Eldrazi builds? Or is it just another crazy buyout?

Guess I'm glad I have one for random EDH decks and such...but this sort of thing is getting more than a little ridiculous.

[Octopusman]

Rebuys bazzars and landfall triggers for days.

It's been begging to be broken for a long time. Only needs one other card (and two fields) to get a kill from an infinite recursion. Half or the theoretical combo is free.

[Dice_Box]

Gods, I have four of those unsleeved in a pile from when I was playing Dredge in Vintage. Really, that is the only place I have ever seen it used. In Legacy I would rather Pithing Needle, Crucible or Loam over this. The only use I can see for it is countering DRS.

[ramanujan]

All,

I would not place much faith in the automated market prices that we are seeing today. Many of them are manufactured by buying out product with a low liquidity and no playability. I fully understand the supply demand aspect, but this is not an efficient market. For every legitimate spike in price, like chalice of the void, there are 5 or more silly ones. In general, the smaller the amount of product that is available, the less faith I would put in these automated "market value" estimates.

People act as if these automated "market value" calculators are fully appropriate, as if the changes they show indicate real value. This is not the weather, we are part of the equation. In the end, stupendous spikes in the value of a card can not be created by purchasing a couple thousand dollars of a crappy card. Sure, you can cause the needle of the stupid calculator to skyrocket, but who cares. It isn't like you can offload a thousand "One with Nothing" cards for a set of power within the 13 minutes that the stupid calculator says that it is actually worth that much.

Peace

[Jamaican Zombie Legend]

Looks like Paper Pauper has become the hot, new format for speculations; Chainer's Edict is now a ~$13 dollar card, Oubliette is being bought out, and foils of many format staples are rapidly disappearing.

This secondary market in this game is wack.

[Spam]

People have realized pauper is a fun, not insanely expensive format and they just want to play. Chainer's Edict is an uncommon from like 10 years ago that goes in every deck with the color black. It's sad, but not surprising.

Inviato dal mio LG-D605 utilizzando Tapatalk

[swoop]

Chainers edict? Haha don't shit me...

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

[MaximumC]

People have realized pauper is a fun, not insanely expensive format and they just want to play.

This partly explains it.

I think the full explanation goes like this:

PLAYERS: "I'm either bored with the marquee constructed formats or priced out of it. I'd like to try a format that is cheaper and requires me to think about different cards. Hey, look, Pauper is nice. Let me pick up some cards for that."
RETAILERS: "Hm, people are buying more Chainer's Edicts than usual."
SPECUALTORS/ALGORITHMS: "CHAINER'S EDIT IS SEEING MORE DEMAND. EXECUTE ORDER 66."
<<buyout and relisting commences, price settles at whatever new local maximum can be supported>>
PLAYERS: "Huh, I guess pauper is expensive now. Oh well."

WELCOME TO MAGIC FINANCE

[ESG]

This partly explains it.

I think the full explanation goes like this:

PLAYERS: "I'm either bored with the marquee constructed formats or priced out of it. I'd like to try a format that is cheaper and requires me to think about different cards. Hey, look, Pauper is nice. Let me pick up some cards for that."
RETAILERS: "Hm, people are buying more Chainer's Edicts than usual."
SPECUALTORS/ALGORITHMS: "CHAINER'S EDIT IS SEEING MORE DEMAND. EXECUTE ORDER 66."
<<buyout and relisting commences, price settles at whatever new local maximum can be supported>>
PLAYERS: "Huh, I guess pauper is expensive now. Oh well."

WELCOME TO MAGIC FINANCE

This is pretty much true except for the part about Pauper being expensive.

[CutthroatCasual]

This is pretty much true except for the part about Pauper being expensive.

If the only format you can afford is Pauper, and the cost goes up to the point where you can't afford it, it's expensive (to you.) Though this isn't Reddit so I think we're safe.

[Whippoorwill]

Just a heads up, but counterfeiters are now printing cards in foreign languages.

I thought I saw it mentioned somewhere before, but I figure I'll mention it again since I just noticed them for the first time (for multiple languages). They claim to pass most of the various tests as well.

[CutthroatCasual]

Which languages? They have a hard enough time getting ENGLISH right. I'd imagine it'll be shitshow for anything not in the Latin alphabet.

[Barook]

I'd imagine it'll be shitshow for anything not in the Latin alphabet.
Pretty much this. Also, doesn't print quality still differ between the various languages for actual Magic cards? Differences might be much harder to spot when you can't read shit.

[Whippoorwill]

Which languages? They have a hard enough time getting ENGLISH right. I'd imagine it'll be shitshow for anything not in the Latin alphabet.

The seller I saw on ebay had: Italian (Modern legal stuff), Chinese & Korean in addition to the usual English stuff. They also had proxy Guru lands, but I don't think they were able to fake the foil symbol based on the pictures.

[iamajellydonut]

Link to the listings?

[D@N]

Just a heads up, but counterfeiters are now printing cards in foreign languages.

I thought I saw it mentioned somewhere before, but I figure I'll mention it again since I just noticed them for the first time (for multiple languages). They claim to pass most of the various tests as well.

They have been printing in foreign languages since at least christmas. So far the languages I've seen are Japanese, chinese, korean, and Italian. They have been making guru since September-ish. 3 or 4 packs I've gotten from zhang have been pretty close but still easily distinguishable so no real worry about getting screwed. Just be aware they exist.

[CutthroatCasual]

Differences might be much harder to spot when you can't read shit.

Good thing I can read Japanese ;)

Yes, card stock is different (I know most Japanese cards are glossier–and I think newer French cards are the same) but the counterfeiters can barely match English card-feel. No way their technology is advanced enough to match the feel of every other language.

[Ephemeron]

http://media.wizards.com/2016/images/daily/en_zAOlTYNT68.png

Yes please!

[mini1337s]

SCG has finally gained confidence in Swedish Magic 94; large price increases across the board on playable Unlimited Rares/Uncommons. I compiled a small list:

Card Name | Retail (NM) | Buylist (NM)
Armageddon | $29.99 | $15
Balance | $29.99 | $15
Braingeyser | $29.99 | $15
Copy Artifact | $59.99 | $30
Counterspell | $20 | $10
Disrupting Scepter | $30 | $15
Earthquake | $20 | $10
Elvish Archers | $24.99 | $12.50
Fastbond | $24.99 | $12.50
Fork | $24.99 | $12.50
Howling Mine | $40 | $20
Icy Manipulator | $24.99 | $12.50
Jayemdae Tome | $79.99 | $40
Mana Vault | $99.99 | $60
Meekstone | $24.99 | $12.50
Mind Twist | $49.99 | $25
Nevinyrral's Disk | $69.99 | $15
Sol Ring | $29.99 | $15
Stasis | $29.99 | $15
Swords to Plowshares | $24.99 | $12.50
Wheel of Fortune | $49.99 | $25
Winter Orb | $69.99 | $35

When people start to gain wind, I think we are going to see two major things happen:
1. I expect buyouts on "missed" tech and massive price "increases" on sites like eBay or High-End.
2. As the former starts, a lot of people are going to say that Swedish 94 set restrictions are no longer worth it. "Finite" supply suddenly starts to become a whole lot more available.

So, my advice to everyone who currently follows Swedish restrictions to really think about why they do it. Do you do it because it's the closest thing to something "offical"? Do you do it because you enjoy the pre-Revised look and the prestige that comes with it? There is nothing wrong with following Swedish restrictions; honestly, looking at a field of ABU decks is pimp, but do you get more out of the play or do you get more out of showing off collectibles? Neither is wrong, and a combination is fine too, but have a good long think.

If you do decide to stick with the Swedes, I caution you on your future purchases. I anticipate a lot of people are going to "leave the 10% for the last guy" so make sure you are comfortable paying more for a card than it will potentially be worth in a year. Some stuff I anticipate to remain sticky price-wise for the long-term, but I'm not bullish on $25 Unlimited Elvish Archers or $60 Copy Artifacts, even having sold both those cards for more than that in the past month.

Personally, I've made the decision to stick with Swedish rules, but I'm offing everything but 1 deck (BWR Juzam Masterrace) and using the profits from my excess Unlimited to Beta out that bad-boy. I imagine there will be other people in my boat too, so maybe buy those Beta Hippies sooner than later.

[chemicalstylez]

We used revised in our area for 93-94. But I have like 6 unlimited elvish archers I may dump now lol.

[Mr.C]

Sweet, gonna be able to dump my Unlimited cards that nobody ever wanted now.

[chemicalstylez]

Sweet, gonna be able to dump my Unlimited cards that nobody ever wanted now.

Its just certain ones. Savannah Lions has become extremely rare, along with Elvish Archers. Even silly cards from Legends like Time Elemental and Land's Edge are washing up. Glad I've been playing this format for a few years now, but now when i want to pick up something stupid i have to pay a premium.

Let's add whirling dervish to that list lol. People are asking $50+ for play sets.

[Stan]

I won't touch that format, but after I managed to get my unlimited power and one of each dual two years ago, I decided I had already gotten the most expensive stuff, and began collecting the full set. Still about 90 cards to go (Wheel of Fortune may be the most expensive card missing, still missing Armageddon, Savannah Lions, Copy Artifact, Jayemdae Tome, Neninyrral's Disk, Winter Orb,...), and then those damn swedes and their hipster crap doubled the prizes on everything that was ever playable at some point in the last two decades. Aaaaaaaaargh.

[guillemnicolau]

I won't touch that format, but after I managed to get my unlimited power and one of each dual two years ago, I decided I had already gotten the most expensive stuff, and began collecting the full set. Still about 90 cards to go (Wheel of Fortune may be the most expensive card missing, still missing Armageddon, Savannah Lions, Copy Artifact, Jayemdae Tome, Neninyrral's Disk, Winter Orb,...), and then those damn swedes and their hipster crap doubled the prizes on everything that was ever playable at some point in the last two decades. Aaaaaaaaargh.

Just get revised instead of unlimited, nobody will care (unless you are planning to move to Sweden...). There's even people who can't differentiate unlimited from revised, a month ago I bought a revised Savannah Lions and they sent me one from unlimited...

[MorphBerlin]

Not sure if this is the right threat, but wasn't there some rumor to reprint special cards for SOI like expeditions? Or was this untrue?

[Dice_Box]

Not sure if this is the right threat, but wasn't there some rumor to reprint special cards for SOI like expeditions? Or was this untrue?

If you do not have news on it by now, it aint happening.

[jandax]

Does anyone know of a forum or site that tracks markets of old school and other similar formats? Probably a shot in the dark, just trying to keep up with market movement in one place.

To keep on topic: mind twist and other sweet edh abu cards like nevs disk etc have gone to bat shit crazy prices. They don't even sell anymore because people ask too much. An unregulate money market is a helluva thing to observe

[Stan]

Just get revised instead of unlimited, nobody will care (unless you are planning to move to Sweden...). There's even people who can't differentiate unlimited from revised, a month ago I bought a revised Savannah Lions and they sent me one from unlimited...

I don't care about that format, I'm collecting that complete set because I want to own it complete. I already own a revised set, I don't need another one.

[chemicalstylez]

I don't care about that format, I'm collecting that complete set because I want to own it complete. I already own a revised set, I don't need another one.


Think TCG had some Savannah lions in the $20 area. But the prices have been all over the place with some older cards lately. Recall went from a $2 rare, up to $80. Now it's settling around $25 lol. Oh and all in a 8 week span hahaha

[Stan]

Think TCG had some Savannah lions in the $20 area. But the prices have been all over the place with some older cards lately. Recall went from a $2 rare, up to $80. Now it's settling around $25 lol. Oh and all in a 8 week span hahaha

20 euro here for that card. Still an awful lot of money for an obsolete rare, which costs less than a quarter of that in revised. I need about twenty or thirty halfway playable (in 93/94) rares, which have all ballooned like that. Thank goodness for that NM chaos orb which I found at a LGS, where they hadn't updated their prices for old cards with almost zero mobility in over a year. Those stupid Swedish hipsters have created an explosion in the prices of completely forgotten cards, for no good reason. AN Serendib Efreets had been in the 40-50 range for almost a decade, I had a long term project to get a playset for a fun deck. Guess I'll have to settle for FBB now.

[Octopusman]

It hasn't exactly exploded, but I noticed Mayor of Avabruck is going up a little. Speculation because of this new block or is there something else going on? I know it made a quick splash in Vintage a while back.

[Dice_Box]

It hasn't exactly exploded, but I noticed Mayor of Avabruck is going up a little. Speculation because of this new block or is there something else going on? I know it made a quick splash in Vintage a while back.
It was used in Dr Edge's Laboratory. As for why it would see movement now, I am thinking people are wanting to play tribal Wolves and are hoping for some good shit when the next set comes. Also there is a Legendary Wolf in the next Block so there may be some EDH movement.

[GenghisTom]

Mayor of Avabrucks increase is probably the same as Serra's Sanctum after they announced the Enchantment-themed Theros block. Also, after we saw Fiery Temper spoiled for SOI, madness cards had a little spike, most notably Big Game Hunter.
People are just on high alert nowadays considering how volatile the market has become. Everybody has a friend who's enjoyed a spike on cards from Lantern of Insight to Thunder Spirit and everything in between and they want to hit it big on the next spike. If things keep up, we'll continue to see very odd buyouts on obscure stuff.

[Stan]

Sweet, gonna be able to dump my Unlimited cards that nobody ever wanted now.

You don't happen to have a list at hand from what you have for trade or sale that's in decent condition by any chance?

[keys]

AN Serendib Efreets had been in the 40-50 range for almost a decade, I had a long term project to get a playset for a fun deck. Guess I'll have to settle for FBB now.

I think the FWB ones are really nice looking, and you can get them for like 2 euro each.

[Hopo]

UB Tezzeret got a push from modern unbannings. Now a 30€ card.

[Stan]

UB Tezzeret got a push from modern unbannings. Now a 30€ card.

That increase is there to stay. It's a very good card, which lacked a deck to go in. It basically reads 'suspend 1: you win the game'.

[Amon Amarth]

That increase is there to stay. It's a very good card, which lacked a deck to go in. It basically reads 'suspend 1: you win the game'.

Yeah, this card is better than JTMS in the right deck. Now it's good in Modern too. This one is real and not hype. It was undervalued before.

[Stan]

Yeah, this card is better than JTMS in the right deck. Now it's good in Modern too. This one is real and not hype. It was undervalued before.

I got crushed once by a deck centered around it in a legacy tournament. You don't see it coming, and suddenly 'boom, take 8'. The ultimate is so cheap that if he's holding two of them, he can nuke you two turns in a row if the need arises.

[TheArchitect]

I got crushed once by a deck centered around it in a legacy tournament. You don't see it coming, and suddenly 'boom, take 8'. The ultimate is so cheap that if he's holding two of them, he can nuke you two turns in a row if the need arises.

I've played Tezz in legacy before as well. The card would still be crazy good if he didn't even have his -4 ability. His -1 is nuts. So many people don't realize, first, that you can attack with the creature that turn (usually), and second, that it is not a 5/5 until EOT, it is a 5/5 forever.

[Barook]

I thought I posted it in this thread. Turns out I was wrong and it was the MTGO thread.

Be aware of Rishadan Port and watch its price closely. Today on MTGO, there was a 25$ drop out of nowhere. Could be insider information at work.

[supremePINEAPPLE]

I'm going to be really shocked if it isn't in the set so moving them now seems like the smart thing to do if you don't play them regularly. I'll be bummed when my ports crash but removing the artificial price-ban on Death and Taxes and Lands will be great for online.

[Hopo]

I thought I posted it in this thread. Turns out I was wrong and it was the MTGO thread.

Be aware of Rishadan Port and watch its price closely. Today on MTGO, there was a 25$ drop out of nowhere. Could be insider information at work.

There's the new DCI foil and it's also been unofficially spoiled for EMA long ago so expect it to drop towards June even more.

[Octopusman]

There's the new DCI foil and it's also been unofficially spoiled for EMA long ago so expect it to drop towards June even more.

As far as I know spoilers other than Force of Will and Wasteland were all baloney. It's a great candidate for a reprint but I would be vary cautious about dumping them as they will probably go up if they're not in the set.

[Hopo]

As far as I know spoilers other than Force of Will and Wasteland were all baloney. It's a great candidate for a reprint but I would be vary cautious about dumping them as they will probably go up if they're not in the set.

Actually I meant to say rumours, not spoilers. Of course it's not certain. I remember the source being the same who leaked the Twin ban and actually the whole EMA thing but still, rumours only.

[Lord Seth]

Actually I meant to say rumours, not spoilers. Of course it's not certain. I remember the source being the same who leaked the Twin ban and actually the whole EMA thing but still, rumours only.
I wouldn't necessarily trust everything that person said. It's true they called the Splinter Twin ban and Eternal Masters, but they got some things noticeably wrong. They claimed Amulet of Vigor would get banned, but it was Summer Bloom that got the axe, and they also claimed Eternal Masters would be announced at the Pro Tour when it was actually later.

[Hopo]

I wouldn't necessarily trust everything that person said.
Me neither, hence I tried to make it very clear that it's all about rumours, not facts.

[Octopusman]

Sadly, Port is a card that not only has an effect that WotC considers unfun, but it contains "Rishadan" in the name. They're very focused on keeping their lore making sense so it's unlikely that this would ever appear in a set not based in Mercadia(Mercadia City?). It's only possible chance for a reprint is in supplemental sets [edit: unless the return to Mercadia but I think Maro was quoted as saying Masques was the worst received set only second to Kamigawa] and I would be totally shocked if it's not in EMA. That being said, I'm pretty sure they'll make it Mythic because of its price on the secondary market. Same goes for Karakas.

Of course, there is the fear that the set will be so limited that the increased supply might not only mean very little in terms of bringing the price down, but that it may event go up. I've also heard arguments that a Port/Karakas reprint even at Mythic will tank the price.

Looking forward to finding out. In the meantime, we can chuckle about Killer Bees and Death Baron spiking.

[iamajellydonut]

Looking forward to finding out. In the meantime, we can chuckle about Killer Bees and Death Baron spiking.

Also, as much as I love pigs, what the hell is Brindle Shoat doing?

[Octopusman]

Also, as much as I love pigs, what the hell is Brindle Shoat doing?

Supposedly just low supply and demand from pauper.

[Arsenal]

Buy a box foil promo BoP is $100 now. Was at $20 forever.

[Esper3k]

Buy a box foil promo BoP is $100 now. Was at $20 forever.

Whoa.

[Ace/Homebrew]

Whoa.
There's still 15 SP ones at SCG for $27.

[Esper3k]

There's still 15 SP ones at SCG for $27.

I'm curious how long those will last for. It looks like BINs in eBay are going up now too.

[ScottW]

BoP? Sorry, out of context I have no idea what card this is.

[Arsenal]

The M11 buy a box promo was alt art foil Birds of Paradise. BoP is common acronym for it. It was $20 for a looooong time. It's now $100 thanks to artificial buyout.

[Ace/Homebrew]

I'm curious how long those will last for. It looks like BINs in eBay are going up now too.

Annnnnnd they're gone! :rolleyes:

[cdr]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej34H1pabOU

[Esper3k]

Annnnnnd they're gone! :rolleyes:

Glad I got my playset of those years ago. That's my favorite art for BoP.

[keys]

Sell.

[Octopusman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej34H1pabOU

Wow, I really liked this video. Thanks!

[Edit] I sent the video to Mark Rosewater and asked that he watches and shares with his peers.

[Edit] Apparently he already "responded" to it but seems like he missed the point. Big surprise.

[Seraphix]

Wheel of Sun and Moon is now >$25. Thanks, Modern players.

Seriously, I should just buy every Modern legal card I even have the slightest chance of playing now so I don't have to worry about all these stupid spikes.

[mini1337s]

Wheel of Sun and Moon is now >$25. Thanks, Modern players.

Seriously, I should just buy every Modern legal card I even have the slightest chance of playing now so I don't have to worry about all these stupid spikes.

Alternatively, you can stop worrying about having to play every single deck in Modern.

Buy into hype if you want, or just focus on a couple of decks and save money over the long run.

[Seraphix]

Alternatively, you can stop worrying about having to play every single deck in Modern.

Buy into hype if you want, or just focus on a couple of decks and save money over the long run.

I'm not playing Modern right now. Wheel, Thorn of Amythest, Blood Moon, Stony Silence, Ensnaring Bridge, Urborg, etc...I've been wanting to pick up all those cards for Legacy decks but their prices have been heavily affected by Modern.

None of these cards are un-affordable (particularly by Legacy standards), it just "feels bad" to have to buy them after a spike.

[Dice_Box]

The worst part is the self fulfilling prophecy that comes with this situation. Hoarding by players drives up the price, trying to get in ahead of the hikes incentives hoarding, when price starts to rise people try and jump in early and hoard...

[Megadeus]

Maybe with modern no longer being a pro tour format the prices won't go quite as insane.

[Dice_Box]

Maybe, I feel like it still will, but you do not have to worry about a seasonal increase now. The real bonus is that now you do not have to worry about Rotation Banning.

[ESG]

The worst part is the self fulfilling prophecy that comes with this situation. Hoarding by players drives up the price, trying to get in ahead of the hikes incentives hoarding, when price starts to rise people try and jump in early and hoard...

As soon as WOTC starts releasing spoilers for Eternal Masters (or any other reprint set), people will start dumping cards. We still have lists for Commander and From the Vaults to be announced, along with Conspiracy 2. There's a lot of room for reprints.

[jimmythegreek]

Dark petition jumped to $8. I may be wrong but i think its due to some standard deck.

[CorwinB]

Dark petition jumped to $8. I may be wrong but i think its due to some standard deck.

John Finkel just reached his 16th PT Top8 with a Dark Petition deck this weekend...

[Megadeus]

Muddle the Mixture is $7. SO if you have any lying around it's time to sell

[Sloshthedark]

Muddle the Mixture is $7. SO if you have any lying around it's time to sell

Transmuting for Thoptersword or what's the reason? I noticed it the moment it spiked on Sunday and was lazy speculate on it, still available <1$ on MKM

[CutthroatCasual]

The fuck? I have so many of those lying around.

Though I bet now if I try to look for them they'll not be around.

[Esper3k]

Transmuting for Thoptersword or what's the reason? I noticed it the moment it spiked on Sunday and was lazy speculate on it, still available <1$ on MKM

Yeah that's what it was used for when it was a deck in Extended.

[Stan]

Up until five, six years ago I regularly bought boxes, which means you have a lot of chaff lying around. Piles of craprares, and useless commons or uncommons. When I moved, i threw a lot of that cardboaard away (several kilos). It sucks now years later when those useless commons suddenly begin to spike.

[Ephemeron]

I'm not playing Modern right now. Wheel, Thorn of Amythest, Blood Moon, Stony Silence, Ensnaring Bridge, Urborg, etc...I've been wanting to pick up all those cards for Legacy decks but their prices have been heavily affected by Modern.

None of these cards are un-affordable (particularly by Legacy standards), it just "feels bad" to have to buy them after a spike.

Those cards have all been around forever. If you've been wanting to play them in Legacy but don't have them already, I'm not sure what to tell you.

[Seraphix]

Those cards have all been around forever. If you've been wanting to play them in Legacy but don't have them already, I'm not sure what to tell you.

Well, not all of us have been playing Legacy "forever", and I'm sure there are plenty of us that have but still don't own a comprehensive Legacy collection.

At any rate, I think I'm going to stop caring and just be content that I can afford to enjoy this expensive hobby. If that means spending $20 on a Wheel of Sun and Moon, whatever.

[Mr Miagi]

You murricans are so silly. Are you really spending 20$ on a wheel of sun and moon? Yes the price has been spiked, but that's just a current hype and it will water down in next few weeks. But even with the current hype, 20$, really!?

https://www.magiccardmarket.eu/Products/Singles/Shadowmoor/Wheel+of+Sun+and+Moon English copies can be found for 5-7€, which is now what, 6-8$.

Is American market so different from EU's that you are overpaying 2-3 times for cards? If so, I'll seriously consider a trip to US and sell all my collection for 2 times of what it's worth in EU :smile::wink:

[CutthroatCasual]

The proportion of Modern:Legacy players here in the US is higher than elsewhere I'd imagine. That means the effect of the Modern sheep on card prices is much more pronounced than in other parts of the world.

[Rocco111]

And yet, you all wanna have German cards to pimp... Leaving the Germans thinking their language is worth much more than the Portuguese! Way to go! :laugh::laugh::laugh:

[Dice_Box]

I would settle for English if Wizards ever managed it. You know, English... Akroan Jailer should be Akroan Gaoler.

[Stan]

I never understood the premium some people will pay for German cards. You can get boxes for the same price as 'normal' ones (English or French) at the normal price here (Belgium) with ease. It's not as if those cards are so hard to come by. I used to buy my boxes in Russian when that was still possible, if I were to pick up that habit again, I'd go for German. Same price, but the individual cards seem to move a lot faster.

[MaximumC]

I never understood the premium some people will pay for German cards. You can get boxes for the same price as 'normal' ones (English or French) at the normal price here (Belgium) with ease. It's not as if those cards are so hard to come by. I used to buy my boxes in Russian when that was still possible, if I were to pick up that habit again, I'd go for German. Same price, but the individual cards seem to move a lot faster.

Well, it used to be that foreign cards were rare. Japanese, in particular. I don't know if that's true anymore. Here's my experience:

1. I like Chinese cards because I can typically get them for cheaper than English ones.
2. I like Russian cards because the language is really pretty.
3. I like German cards because the language is so angry and awesome.
4. Some particular cards are funny (if you are twelve): Treasure Cruise in German is "Lehnende Ausfahrt." Delay in French is "Retard."

[JohnGalt]

I never understood the premium some people will pay for German cards. You can get boxes for the same price as 'normal' ones (English or French) at the normal price here (Belgium) with ease. It's not as if those cards are so hard to come by. I used to buy my boxes in Russian when that was still possible, if I were to pick up that habit again, I'd go for German. Same price, but the individual cards seem to move a lot faster.

Neither do I understand the German premium. I have been asked several times more for foil German cards than foil Japanese ones (and I'm not talking about Wilder Nacatls), which seems absurd to me. But some people are really willing to pay a big premium, so it does exist.

For cards from recent sets there doesn't seem to be any premium over English though, and they sell considerably slower. So buying German boxes instead of English ones is a worse idea than it may seem.

[Stan]

Well, it used to be that foreign cards were rare. Japanese, in particular. I don't know if that's true anymore. Here's my experience:

1. I like Chinese cards because I can typically get them for cheaper than English ones.
2. I like Russian cards because the language is really pretty.
3. I like German cards because the language is so angry and awesome.
4. Some particular cards are funny (if you are twelve): Treasure Cruise in German is "Lehnende Ausfahrt." Delay in French is "Retard."

I am quite fond of my German Portal Götterdämmerung in my Numot deck, for that reason. The name is cool. But that's the rare exception.

[rlesko]

I never understood the premium some people will pay for German cards. You can get boxes for the same price as 'normal' ones (English or French) at the normal price here (Belgium) with ease. It's not as if those cards are so hard to come by. I used to buy my boxes in Russian when that was still possible, if I were to pick up that habit again, I'd go for German. Same price, but the individual cards seem to move a lot faster.

I'm not sure either. But I just *had* to have german FBB duals for my legacy deck.

[Esper3k]

For Legacy, one reason why German is popular is because if you want to keep your entire deck one non-English language, that pretty much limits you to German, French, or Italian because of your duals.

Plus, it's an awesomely angry language.

[jrsthethird]

4. Some particular cards are funny (if you are twelve): Treasure Cruise in German is "Lehnende Ausfahrt." Delay in French is "Retard."

Or the recent "Descend Upon the Fishermen" French translation snafu.

[Stan]

Or the recent "Descend Upon the Fishermen" French translation snafu.

I just saw that. Those accents are there for a reason.

[Sidneyious]

I have a couple worthless tron lands in I think French I'd love to make English.

Only prices I'm bothered about are lands and a few artifacts.

2 years ago I tried to get 1 set of duals, said when I get my income tax I'm getting them.

I look and a set went way way out of my range of even probability.

So I'm forever stuck playing a tier 2 deck.

[sdematt]

I have a couple worthless tron lands in I think French I'd love to make English.

Only prices I'm bothered about are lands and a few artifacts.

2 years ago I tried to get 1 set of duals, said when I get my income tax I'm getting them.

I look and a set went way way out of my range of even probability.

So I'm forever stuck playing a tier 2 deck.

Bank loan/LOC?

[ESG]

So I'm forever stuck playing a tier 2 deck.

The difference between Tier 1 and Tier 2 is honestly too small to fret about. Just learn your deck(s) inside and out.

[Sidneyious]

The difference between Tier 1 and Tier 2 is honestly too small to fret about. Just learn your deck(s) inside and out.
Oh I do, I'm fairly proficient in making my decks work.

Example in modern

Mono blue tron vs gr tron.
I should lose but I won, I just made a play mistake and I wasn't even trying I just made a silly mistake.

If I had a full spiral tide list I might of did better another night but I was just having fun.
Wasn't expecting to even do anything.

But a couple people conspired and his midget ass was gloating at me.

"3 turns to slow"

Now the patrons are pushing thoes 2 out because noone wants their kind.

But I want duals, I want p9, sadly I'll never get it.

[kingsey]

Oh I do, I'm fairly proficient in making my decks work.

Example in modern

Mono blue tron vs gr tron.
I should lose but I won, I just made a play mistake and I wasn't even trying I just made a silly mistake.

If I had a full spiral tide list I might of did better another night but I was just having fun.
Wasn't expecting to even do anything.

But a couple people conspired and his midget ass was gloating at me.

"3 turns to slow"

Now the patrons are pushing thoes 2 out because noone wants their kind.

But I want duals, I want p9, sadly I'll never get it.

Get p9 and loose the woe is me im poor thing. Its not classy.

[CutthroatCasual]

Oh I do, I'm fairly proficient in making my decks work.

Example in modern

Mono blue tron vs gr tron.
I should lose but I won, I just made a play mistake and I wasn't even trying I just made a silly mistake.

If I had a full spiral tide list I might of did better another night but I was just having fun.
Wasn't expecting to even do anything.

But a couple people conspired and his midget ass was gloating at me.

"3 turns to slow"

Now the patrons are pushing thoes 2 out because noone wants their kind.

But I want duals, I want p9, sadly I'll never get it.

You're on a forum for Legacy players. You don't get to complain about not being able to afford expensive cards.

[Phoenix Ignition]

You're on a forum for Legacy players. You don't get to complain about not being able to afford expensive cards.

But they're literally in the "Bitching About Prices" thread. That's what this thread is for, is it not?

[Stan]

But they're literally in the "Bitching About Prices" thread. That's what this thread is for, is it not?

There's a difference between complaining about the price of cards, and stating you'll never get them. If obtaining the pricy staples needed to play eternal isn't even an objective anymore, how strong is your desire to play eternal at all?

I'll likely never own a playset of Workshops (I let that train pass by two years ago, they tripled in price since then). But if I ever fall upon a stupid pile of cash, you can bet your ass I'll get them.

[Mr.C]

There's a difference between complaining about the price of cards, and stating you'll never get them. If obtaining the pricy staples needed to play eternal isn't even an objective anymore, how strong is your desire to play eternal at all?

I'll likely never own a playset of Workshops (I let that train pass by two years ago, they tripled in price since then). But if I ever fall upon a stupid pile of cash, you can bet your ass I'll get them.

I love Legacy. I have no more Legacy decks. I play proxy Legacy when I can, and have no intention whatsoever of acquiring $300 cards.

That does not change my desire to play the format.

[kingsey]

I love Legacy. I have no more Legacy decks. I play proxy Legacy when I can, and have no intention whatsoever of acquiring $300 cards.

That does not change my desire to play the format.

How much can you really love it if you can't even find the willpower to invest in something you "love".

I

[Mr.C]

How much can you really love it if you can't even find the willpower to invest in something you "love".

I

Put it this way: I love my car. But, say, between paying $5000 for an original AC Schnitzer kit to put on it, plus another $2000 for paint, I instead paid $400 for a replica set and painted it in my garage with rattlecans for $200.

Did it affect my enjoyment of the car? Nope.

Will I win any Concours d'Elegance? Fuck no.

Does anyone imply that I don't love the car due to using non-original parts? That's debatable, but I've had a couple of people with $50,000 invested into their cars complimenting me on how it looks and asking where I sourced the reps, what paint I used, how the fit was, etc.

-

I think I mentioned this several pages back, but god damn is the Magic community much more elitist than cars. Nobody gives you shit for using replicas to save money, not even people with hundreds of thousands of dollars in their builds. There's an intrinsic understanding that acquiring originals of many parts is cost prohibitive, and unless you're building a car to win Pebble Beach, you'll use replicas and alternatives whenever possible to cut down on costs.

[Stan]

Put it this way: I love my car. But, say, between paying $5000 for an original AC Schnitzer kit to put on it, plus another $2000 for paint, I instead paid $400 for a replica set and painted it in my garage with rattlecans for $200.

Did it affect my enjoyment of the car? Nope.

Will I win any Concours d'Elegance? Fuck no.

Does anyone imply that I don't love the car due to using non-original parts? That's debatable, but I've had a couple of people with $50,000 invested into their cars complimenting me on how it looks and asking where I sourced the reps, what paint I used, how the fit was, etc.

-

I think I mentioned this several pages back, but god damn is the Magic community much more elitist than cars. Nobody gives you shit for using replicas to save money, not even people with hundreds of thousands of dollars in their builds. There's an intrinsic understanding that acquiring originals of many parts is cost prohibitive, and unless you're building a car to win Pebble Beach, you'll use replicas and alternatives whenever possible to cut down on costs.

If you use that car in some sort of tuning or restoration contest, and the use of specific parts is outlawed in that contest, then the other participants would have reason to be upset with your replicas. Same as magic players who'll take offense when you use a proxy in a tournament. If somebody bitches about a suboptimal but legal deck you bring to a tournament, or about a proxy in a kitchen table game, meh.

[MGB]

I already told you to buy Collected Company ($12ish now, will be $20+ as long as its legal down the road), Khans fetchlands (seems obvious but they're in the $12-$15 range now and if you're willing to wait, they're going to be $20-$25+ down the line for as long as Modern is a format), Thoughtseize (won't be reprinted soon, is the best at what it does, will also see demand in every format it's legal in), Abrupt Decay (just going to keep going up as it's the best at what it does in every format) , Dig Through Time (barring a ban, should be a Legacy staple for a while). And buy shocklands. Again, another "obvious" one, but so was Snapcaster and Liliana. Good cards are good cards and will see play forever, and just keep going up in price as long as Magic is popular.

Did you guys buy all those Collected Companies when they were still around $10-$12? If you had, like I told you to, about 8 months ago, then you could cash them out for twice as much or more now that they are riding their crest of popularity in standard/modern. I personally have like 40+ of these sitting around and a handful of foils, so i'll be cashing them out pretty soon before they rotate out of Standard. Bought all of them for around $8-$10 each!

[Mr.C]

If you use that car in some sort of tuning or restoration contest, and the use of specific parts is outlawed in that contest, then the other participants would have reason to be upset with your replicas. Same as magic players who'll take offense when you use a proxy in a tournament. If somebody bitches about a suboptimal but legal deck you bring to a tournament, or about a proxy in a kitchen table game, meh.

I just re-read my post and the post I quoted, and I see no mention of tournaments. Actually, I specifically mentioned I wouldn't win any Concours.

[Stan]

I just re-read my post and the post I quoted, and I see no mention of tournaments. Actually, I specifically mentioned I wouldn't win any Concours.

You compared the audience of amateur mechanics and car restoration hobbyists on one side with Magic players on the other. The use of specific authentic parts on cars was referred to as a point of reference, argueing that the Magic players are more elitist. The obvious analogy with authentic car parts in this comparison is the use of 'authentic cards', meaning a ban of proxies. This can only be enforced in a tournament setting, just as the use of authentic parts can only have other consequences besides a snarky comment from a fellow hobbyist in the setting of a hypothetical competition which dictates which restaurations are valid and which aren't. The comparison is valid.

[Mr.C]

You compared the audience of amateur mechanics and car restoration hobbyists on one side with Magic players on the other. The use of specific authentic parts on cars was referred to as a point of reference, argueing that the Magic players are more elitist. The obvious analogy with authentic car parts in this comparison is the use of 'authentic cards', meaning a ban of proxies. This can only be enforced in a tournament setting, just as the use of authentic parts can only have other consequences besides a snarky comment from a fellow hobbyist in the setting of a hypothetical competition which dictates which restaurations are valid and which aren't. The comparison is valid.

He asked how I could love a format that I don't invest in. I responded with an analogy that apparently went over a few people's heads.

Let me rephrase it:

You can love cars and not want to spend $$$ to win Pebble Beach, and not get shit on by other enthusiasts.

Apparently, loving Legacy but refusing to 'invest' in the yhe format is inconceivable.

See the difference?

[sdematt]

He asked how I could love a format that I don't invest in. I responded with an analogy that apparently went over a few people's heads.

Let me rephrase it:

You can love cars and not want to spend $$$ to win Pebble Beach, and not get shit on by other enthusiasts.

Apparently, loving Legacy but refusing to 'invest' in the yhe format is inconceivable.

See the difference?

Exactly. Just because I don't have a garage princess Ferrari doesn't mean I'm not an enthusiast.

[hymnyou]

This thread sucks

[Sidneyious]

I understand everything Mr.C is trying to convey.

[ESG]

Just because I don't have a garage princess Ferrari that I bought with Beta duals in a sandwich baggie ...

Fixed that for you. ;)

[jrsthethird]

There's one thing I hope we can all agree on:

Fords are the FTV foils of cars.

[sdematt]

The only reason I'm okay with Ford is because of the early Mustang models, and even then, I'm only getting one to complete the horsey trifecta (Ford, Ferrari, Porsche).

-Matt

[Mr.C]

There's one thing I hope we can all agree on:

Fords are the FTV foils of cars.

ew, no. They're like the Premium Decks of cars.

[CutthroatCasual]

I just re-read my post and the post I quoted, and I see no mention of tournaments. Actually, I specifically mentioned I wouldn't win any Concours.

You wouldn't be able to enter any Concours AFAIK. So Stan has a point: counterfeit cards are illegal for the "show." It's fine–though still not really because buying fake shit is generally frowned upon even in automotive circles: it's one thing to buy BBS-reps made by König, it's a whole other deal to buy Volk-knockoffs (and that's the difference: replicas vs. knockoffs) made by Rota–to use proxies at the kitchen table/casual playtesting. However, when you obtain them for the sole purpose to competing with them, that's when you're no longer kosher.

[Echelon]

The only reason I'm okay with Ford is because of the early Mustang models, and even then, I'm only getting one to complete the horsey trifecta (Ford, Ferrari, Porsche).

-Matt

Oh, Zatarra, the stories you tell.

[CutthroatCasual]

So is this a fake FoW?

https://i.imgur.com/dXeMRYo.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/tqT3kV5.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/xr6ySI0.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Laif2qy.jpg

I already have my thoughts. What say you?

[rlesko]

So is this a fake FoW?

https://i.imgur.com/dXeMRYo.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/tqT3kV5.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/xr6ySI0.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Laif2qy.jpg

I already have my thoughts. What say you?

I think so, font and mana symbols seem off

[Mr Miagi]

seems fine to me .. :confused::eyebrow:

[phonics]

I think so, font and mana symbols seem off

It looks like the print pattern is seamless between the circle in the mana symbol and the border, iirc they should be printed separately on the card.

[CutthroatCasual]

The symbols/text are printed separately but the mana symbol circles are part of the same layer as the border.

FWIW the OP also posted a Tundra that he got with the FoW and the Tundra was a fake.

[Mr.C]

You wouldn't be able to enter any Concours AFAIK. So Stan has a point: counterfeit cards are illegal for the "show." It's fine–though still not really because buying fake shit is generally frowned upon even in automotive circles: it's one thing to buy BBS-reps made by König, it's a whole other deal to buy Volk-knockoffs (and that's the difference: replicas vs. knockoffs) made by Rota–to use proxies at the kitchen table/casual playtesting. However, when you obtain them for the sole purpose to competing with them, that's when you're no longer kosher.

Oh, I definitely could enter, but judges would look at my car and laugh hysterically (or DQ it, like it would happen in a Legacy tournament). But again, that was not what I said in my original post lol.

[chemicalstylez]

The German language thing i'll never get.... When i bought my FBB lands i went with whatever the cheapest was lol. Safe to say I have many Italian lands :cool:. If i found a good deal on a German FBB I'd no sooner flip it and pocket the extra cash.

[Esper3k]

The German language thing i'll never get.... When i bought my FBB lands i went with whatever the cheapest was lol. Safe to say I have many Italian lands :cool:. If i found a good deal on a German FBB I'd no sooner flip it and pocket the extra cash.

You're talking about a game where people will spend thousands of dollars on a small piece of cardboard.

People like what they like :)

[iamajellydonut]

The German language thing i'll never get.... When i bought my FBB lands i went with whatever the cheapest was lol. Safe to say I have many Italian lands :cool:. If i found a good deal on a German FBB I'd no sooner flip it and pocket the extra cash.

That's like buying a Ferrari with a ding in it so that you can save some money. Go balls out or just get HP Revised. Any middle ground is just ratchet and idiotic.

[kingsey]

That's like buying a Ferrari with a ding in it so that you can save some money. Go balls out or just get HP Revised. Any middle ground is just ratchet and idiotic.


As far as looks goes, Italian is the only language that still use the old T tap symbol which is kinda cool. TBH compairing french or italian fbb sea with an HP revised is kinda extreme, but thats what this thread is for.:eyebrow:

[Mr.C]

The German language thing i'll never get.... When i bought my FBB lands i went with whatever the cheapest was lol. Safe to say I have many Italian lands :cool:. If i found a good deal on a German FBB I'd no sooner flip it and pocket the extra cash.

I prefer Italian, actually, because of the T symbol.

[iamajellydonut]

I prefer Italian, actually, because of the T symbol.

And, if you do, that's great. Play with what you love. I truly mean it. But chemicalstylez's mentality is the same as those who run foil Modern Masters instead of foil Ravnica in an attempt at an "all foil" deck because "it's still foil lol". It's not impressing or fooling anyone.

[supremePINEAPPLE]

And, if you do, that's great. Play with what you love. I truly mean it. But chemicalstylez's mentality is the same as those who run foil Modern Masters instead of foil Ravnica in an attempt at an "all foil" deck because "it's still foil lol". It's not impressing or fooling anyone.While that's true around here and it's fun to be elitist about duals and shit it's not actually the case in the real world. Normal players love expeditions, ktk fetches, and modern masters foils and the percentage of people who actually care about this sort of thing is about as low as it could possibly be.

[iamajellydonut]

Normal players love expeditions, ktk fetches, and modern masters foils and the percentage of people who actually care about this sort of thing is about as low as it could possibly be.

Normal players will actively point out anything that's worth more than the stadium cost of a pretzel and fries. However, if ever two nerds sitting at a table are interrupted by a filthy casual, the deck that will receive more "ooo"s and "aaah"s, without fail, is the deck that's groomed to taste. Even my pile of misfit toys manages to snag more complements than haphazard lists. Starting out your "thank you" with "yeah, they're cheaper than German lol" is a surefire way to have no one ever give a shit about the aesthetics of your deck ever again. Run those Italian black borders because you want to run those Italian black borders.

No one appreciates a deck whose Lightning Bolts look like this...


http://i.imgur.com/bJegcW2.jpghttp://i.imgur.com/SEDWOwo.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ns4n479.jpghttp://i.imgur.com/ns4n479.jpg


"But they're valuable" doesn't matter. To everyone this playset looks like shit, and running Italian black border because it's what you felt like affording is no less telling.

[Havrekjex]

Normal players will actively point out anything that's worth more than the stadium cost of a pretzel and fries. However, if ever two nerds sitting at a table are interrupted by a filthy casual, the deck that will receive more "ooo"s and "aaah"s, without fail, is the deck that's groomed to taste. Even my pile of misfit toys manages to snag more complements than haphazard lists. Starting out your "thank you" with "yeah, they're cheaper than German lol" is a surefire way to have no one ever give a shit about the aesthetics of your deck ever again. Run those Italian black borders because you want to run those Italian black borders.

No one appreciates a deck whose Lightning Bolts look like this..


"But they're valuable" doesn't matter. To everyone this playset looks like shit, and running Italian black border because it's what you felt like affording is no less telling.This is true, though there's some matter of degree here. If you run Italian FBBs, you won't run into a lot of "ewww Italian". It's not really comparable to the most horribly mismatched set of Bolts imaginable.

But it's true that you get away with more shit if you do it with confidence. I get compliments on the 7th edition white bordered basics i run in one of my decks to match the white-bordered duals. Nobody thinks it's cooler than black bordered, obviously, but most people appreciate that all the lands match. Same if you do a deck with, say, English non-foil, but you are super picky about condition and edition. You do get style points just for going with a look and sticking with it.

I had to do a double take. This is in fact not the pimp thread. Huh.

[Seraphix]

...

But it's true that you get away with more shit if you do it with confidence. I get compliments on the 7th edition white bordered basics i run in one of my decks to match the white-bordered duals.

...



Holy shit, I'm not the only person who plays these? I just get made fun of for it though. :frown:




RANT RANT RANT



I actually used to play a set of the full-art Lightning Bolts, but realized they are pretty crass and traded them off. I'm currently using generic M11 Bolts while looking to acquire true Beta ones. Now I hadn't looked at their prices much before, but I feel like Beta Bolts have gotten a bit more expensive with C. Rush's passing.

[Esper3k]

Holy shit, I'm not the only person who plays these? I just get made fun of for it though. :frown:



I actually used to play a set of the full-art Lightning Bolts, but realized they are pretty crass and traded them off. I'm currently using generic M11 Bolts while looking to acquire true Beta ones. Now I hadn't looked at their prices much before, but I feel like Beta Bolts have gotten a bit more expensive with C. Rush's passing.

I actually like the full art Lightning Bolts because the art is pretty awesomely hilarious to me (Nicol Bolas' giant claw zapping some poor tiny bastard).

Of course, the Beta (or my preference is the Judge promo ones) are the sweetest ones.

[CutthroatCasual]

running Italian black border because it's what you felt like affording is no less telling.

Mmmm, not necessarily true. For example, Italian FBB Tundras and Volcs are only, on average, $100 less than their German counterparts. So it stands to reason to that if someone is running the Italian ones in a traditional Miracles list (3 and 2, respectively), it's not out of budget considerations because it's only a few hundred more on top of the $2450 ($500 more, less if you can find a good seller). And someone who has no problem spending almost $2500 on 5 cards will have had no problem spending $3000 on those same 5 because at that point it's just gratuitous.

At least, that's how it was for me.

But I also just wanted ITA more than GER.


Run those Italian black borders because you want to run those Italian black borders.


Yup.

I completely agree that if you're using the cheapest versions to pimp but don't make the rest of the deck the same (i.e. you have German FoWs but run some beat ass French FBB duals) then you're just trying too hard.

[iamajellydonut]

For example, Italian FBB Tundras and Volcs are only, on average, $100 less than their German counterparts. So it stands to reason to that if someone is running the Italian ones in a traditional Miracles list (3 and 2, respectively), it's not out of budget considerations because it's only a few hundred more on top of the $2450 ($500 more, less if you can find a good seller). And someone who has no problem spending almost $2500 on 5 cards will have had no problem spending $3000 on those same 5 because at that point it's just gratuitous.

Agreed. However...


The German language thing i'll never get.... When i bought my FBB lands i went with whatever the cheapest was lol. Safe to say I have many Italian lands :cool:. If i found a good deal on a German FBB I'd no sooner flip it and pocket the extra cash.

... is what started this conversation.

[Cambriel]

And, if you do, that's great. Play with what you love. I truly mean it. But chemicalstylez's mentality is the same as those who run foil Modern Masters instead of foil Ravnica in an attempt at an "all foil" deck because "it's still foil lol". It's not impressing or fooling anyone.

I end up going for French because I prefer the look. IIRC, the print run is comparable to German. When I was foiling Maverick I wanted a French Bayou because the name said "Bayou" instead of whatever angry German phrase it is, and I wanted them all to be the same language so I ended up with Savanes and Brousse as well.

When you're talking about sinking money into a vanity card, imo it's more important that YOU like the way it looks than whatever anyone else thinks.

[iamajellydonut]

because the name said "Bayou" instead of whatever angry German phrase it is

"Mangrovensumpf". Fun part is is, iirc, "Bayou" is hard as shit to say, so Mangrovensumpf is the word that's frequently spoken even during English conversations.

German folks can feel free to confirm/deny.

Edit: Debunked.

[ScottW]

I end up going for French because I prefer the look. IIRC, the print run is comparable to German. When I was foiling Maverick I wanted a French Bayou because the name said "Bayou" instead of whatever angry German phrase it is, and I wanted them all to be the same language so I ended up with Savanes and Brousse as well.

When you're talking about sinking money into a vanity card, imo it's more important that YOU like the way it looks than whatever anyone else thinks.

+1 for French. I'd rather eloquence than austerity. I chose these solely on the point of not following the macho German language trend.

[Hopo]

Let us continue with bitching about prices and discuss pimp in the pimp thread.

[Sidneyious]

Let us continue with bitching about prices and discuss pimp in the pimp thread.
Werd, I'll use whatever I get my hands on in English.

I have 2 or 3 not English urza lands and it bugs the crap out of my.

Now I have replaced them from a recent collection acquisition.

I'm not picky about cards anymore other than the lands I use.

Zen/UN, urza saga and earlier lands(t:add * to your mana pool). When they moved to the symbol instead of text I started buying older lands.

Mostly saga and tempest but I do like iceage and revised basics.

I need a few cards to tank so I can finish my spiral tide list, in sure someone is saying to themselves.

"Big whoop, tides cheap as dirt"

[MorphBerlin]

"Mangrovensumpf". Fun part is is, iirc, "Bayou" is hard as shit to say, so Mangrovensumpf is the word that's frequently spoken even during English conversations.

German folks can feel free to confirm/deny.

(To make sure: you meant Germans specifically use "Mangrovensumpf" during English conversations?)

If so: Sorry can't confirm, bayou is not hard to say and both names are used during English and German conversations here.

[iamajellydonut]

If so: Sorry can't confirm, bayou is not hard to say and both names are used during English and German conversations here.

Damn. I've been fed false information it seems.

[Speedbump]

(To make sure: you meant Germans specifically use "Mangrovensumpf" during English conversations?)

If so: Sorry can't confirm, bayou is not hard to say and both names are used during English and German conversations here.I think he was being slightly sarcastic, even though 'Mangrovensumpf' is pretty easy compared to some of the other cards in existence. (For example, Gedankenpeitschenremasuri is much more of an abomination)

[iamajellydonut]

Gedankenpeitschenremasuri

Oooh, my God. I just googled the card associated with that name, and there is no way I ever could have guessed that a card with such an innocent name could have such a terrifying translation.

That said, I was actually being serious. I had heard somewhere that "bayou" was tough to pronounce for Germans, but apparently I was told wrong.

[sdematt]

That's like buying a Ferrari with a ding in it so that you can save some money. Go balls out or just get HP Revised. Any middle ground is just ratchet and idiotic.

Depends on what you plan to do with the Ferrari. I'm not Ralph Lauren, because if I was, I'd drive the ever loving hell out of his 250 TR, so there's no reason to own that particular example, at least for me. But, since there's only like five, you can't be super picky. #30milliondollars

[Havrekjex]

Holy shit, I'm not the only person who plays these? I just get made fun of for it though. :frown:I find it surprisingly hard to find a white-bordered, old-frame Swamp that I like. It's as if they decided that Swamps should be ugly because, you know, black and evil and stuff. I'd appreciate any recommendations.

[guillemnicolau]

I find it surprisingly hard to find a white-bordered, old-frame Swamp that I like. It's as if they decided that Swamps should be ugly because, you know, black and evil and stuff. I'd appreciate any recommendations.

Unlimited, summer, revised

[Dice_Box]

Unlimited are white yes, I use them but they are not pretty. 7th is where you go for pretty white bordered lands.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?multiverseid=11523&type=card

[Stuart]

Unlimited are white yes, I use them but they are not pretty. 7th is where you go for pretty white bordered lands.

Portal 3K is also a fun route for white-bordered basics. Though unfortunately in this case, the Swamps aren't as nice as the others.

[phonics]

5E also has nice lands too.

[Deadeye_Mongoose]

Run those Italian black borders because you want to run those Italian black borders.

This picture seems extremely relevant:

http://i.imgur.com/FoAWjaL.jpg

I actually play with unlimited duals myself because they're easier to fetch, I don't like foreign cards, and they do look MUCH better than revised. Ideally I'd run Beta, but that's a LONG way off.

[CutthroatCasual]

Isn't that list short one Usea?

[Bosque]

How did this turn into the pimp thread all of a sudden?

[guillemnicolau]

This picture seems extremely relevant:

http://i.imgur.com/FoAWjaL.jpg

I actually play with unlimited duals myself because they're easier to fetch, I don't like foreign cards, and they do look MUCH better than revised. Ideally I'd run Beta, but that's a LONG way off.

http://i.imgur.com/dsu0rts.jpg

[Kathal]

How did this turn into the pimp thread all of a sudden?

As if there would be any difference between those two threads ;)

Greetings,
Kathal

[Deadeye_Mongoose]

Isn't that list short one Usea?

Seems to be. There are 59 cards and most decks run another Usea.


How did this turn into the pimp thread all of a sudden?

Someone posted about theme being more important than price, I remembered a relevant picture and thought I'd post it.

Back to bitching about prices though: why did Grishoalbrand have to become a deck before I finished Tin-Fins? I refuse to pay $40 for Goryo's Vengence.

[Sidneyious]

A friend sold me his collection but failed to tell me he sold 2 wastelands and a mana drain out from under me.

Now I have to buy them outright

[kubalonek]

Sth from diferent field. Is this shitty set worth sth? It was given in PT Avacyn in Barcelona 2012.
I just want to get rid of it (or just throw it away).

http://i.imgur.com/uyMVcAm.jpg

[Kathal]

Back to bitching about prices though: why did Grishoalbrand have to become a deck before I finished Tin-Fins? I refuse to pay $40 for Goryo's Vengence.

You are welcome (as one of its designer) :wink:

Through, I still miss one foil Japo Goryo's (have already the ger, eng and portugese one). So yeah, kinda rekt myself here.

Greetings,
Kathal

[Undomian]

Sth from diferent field. Is this shitty set worth sth? It was given in PT Avacyn in Barcelona 2012.
I just want to get rid of it (or just throw it away).

http://i.imgur.com/uyMVcAm.jpg

"Good job making the Pro Tour! Here's a complimentary mousepad." :laugh:

[CutthroatCasual]

Back to bitching about prices though: why did Grishoalbrand have to become a deck before I finished Tin-Fins? I refuse to pay $40 for Goryo's Vengence.

Because Modern finance is stupid. I would much rather pay $250 up front for a single card that will hover around $250 than passing on a playset of some jank rare for $40 one week and then needing to spend $160 on the playset next week, only to have that $160 become $80 due to either a reprint or a crash.

[Dice_Box]

http://ebay.com/itm/191870292267?

Anyone got a house laying around they wish to sell?

[jandax]

Kidicarus will eventually drop some pretty phat lewt


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Mr.C]

http://ebay.com/itm/191870292267?

Anyone got a house laying around they wish to sell?

275k for a house? Pfft, peasant.

[Stevestamopz]

http://ebay.com/itm/191870292267?

Anyone got a house laying around they wish to sell?

Or a house deposit if you live in melbourne/sydney :cry:

[Dice_Box]

Well it's in US dollars, so you might get a flat in Frankston.

[Speedbump]

Well it's in US dollars, so you might get a flat in Frankston.Nah mate, rather not get stabbed or shot.

Don't think I'd ever spend remotely near that much on MtG, although the Volcanic does look pretty sweet.

[Mr.C]

Or a house deposit if you live in melbourne/sydney :cry:

Or Vancouver.

[Sidneyious]

http://ebay.com/itm/191870292267?

Anyone got a house laying around they wish to sell?
It just takes me to m.eBay. no listing.

[Dice_Box]

It's a set of Summer for 275k.

[PirateKing]

It just takes me to m.eBay. no listing.

For those wanting to see the pretties:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/h6o4jwyvwr4yy5z/AADVhFMgXGfZ5PTmO9WOOD7ka?dl=0

[Sidneyious]

That's to much, cereal.

[Whitefaces]

Soooo....Library of Alexandria has shot to $1200. Probably a mix of market manipulation and price correction.

[Dice_Box]

It's... Not really played anymore. I have not used mine ever.

[Quasim0ff]

Soooo....Library of Alexandria has shot to $1200. Probably a mix of market manipulation and price correction.

Where? (https://www.magiccardmarket.eu/Products/Singles/Arabian+Nights/Library+of+Alexandria)

[Whitefaces]

Where? (https://www.magiccardmarket.eu/Products/Singles/Arabian+Nights/Library+of+Alexandria)

Mm, I looked at MKM after posting.

On MTG Goldfish and MTG Stocks it's shot up, market manipulation etc. Old cards on the RL suffer from price memory a lot more than Modern staples, for example, so this could definitely up the price significantly if people buy into it and snap up the 250 euro ones on MKM.

[Havrekjex]

Mm, I looked at MKM after posting.

On MTG Goldfish and MTG Stocks it's shot up, market manipulation etc. Old cards on the RL suffer from price memory a lot more than Modern staples, for example, so this could definitely up the price significantly if people buy into it and snap up the 250 euro ones on MKM.Too many sites fetch their price solely from TCG mid, which is way too easy to manipulate. Sites like mtggoldfish should balance out prices somehow.

[Barook]

http://www.mtggoldfish.com/price/Mercadian+Masques/Rishadan+Port#online

Port is now the first card to breach the 200$ threshold on MTGO (aside from the initial Black Lotus spike, but that wasn't sustainable). :mad:

And they use the Port promo in the Legacy Gauntlet for the extra rub-ins.

[cab0747]

http://www.mtggoldfish.com/price/Mercadian+Masques/Rishadan+Port#online

Port is now the first card to breach the 200$ threshold on MTGO (aside from the initial Black Lotus spike, but that wasn't sustainable). :mad:

And they use the Port promo in the Legacy Gauntlet for the extra rub-ins.

Seems silly to have the new art JUST for the legacy gauntlet. It has to see a reprint somewhere.

Did any of the other cards in the gauntlet get new art?

[Barook]

Seems silly to have the new art JUST for the legacy gauntlet. It has to see a reprint somewhere.

Did any of the other cards in the gauntlet get new art?
The Port promo is rotting in their database since January 2015: That how we learned about the Judge promo in the first place.

I think they just use the latest version of the cards in the database.

[Megadeus]

Well Moat is $1000

[Hopo]

Well Moat is $1000


I say it's 5000$. I guess it's your word against mine, then, since we both failed to give anything that could be even by mistake taken as evidence.

[Quasim0ff]

Well Moat is $1000

https://www.magiccardmarket.eu/Products/Singles/Legends/Moat

huh

[Dice_Box]

760au on ebay.

[Whitefaces]

More market manipulation, but unfortunately these RL 'staples' have a price memory.

[jrsthethird]

It's been ~$200 for a while. It's about time the price caught up with the meta relevance (although will probably only stick around $400-500).

I'm glad my buddy bought his last week. Just in time.

[ScottW]

I traded mine last year but stuck with the reserved list card swap so it's not too bad. Plus the stupid card was even less when I bought it.

[CutthroatCasual]

Got mine for $280 back when I didn't even have a particular need for it; just loved the pillow-fort nature of the thing.

[chemicalstylez]

lol guess its time to sell moat now

[jrsthethird]

Tabernacle up to almost $1500.

[Dice_Box]

Tabernacle up to almost $1500.

So that is how I am getting my VR headset. Drop a Tab.

[supremePINEAPPLE]

Tabernacle's tcg mid price seems pretty unreliable. There are 4 LP available with 1 @ $870 from a newer seller, 1 @ $1200 from channel fireball , 2 @ $1500 from random sellers with good feedback but less than 1000 sales, and finally a NM one for $2000 that's been sitting there for a while. I don't know much about MKM but it looks like they are closer to the $750-$1100 range that Tabernacle normally sits in.

I'm curious if anything listed at these higher prices is actually getting sold since I personally wouldn't buy from any of the sellers on tcgplayer except for CFB.

[Chatto]

Got my Tab on MKM for something like € 350,00. Six months later it doubled in price

In other news: Alpha Set, anyone? (http://www.ebay.com/itm/122015519362?ssPageName=STRK%3AMESELX%3AIT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649)

[Sidneyious]

Tabernacle's tcg mid price seems pretty unreliable. There are 4 LP available with 1 @ $870 from a newer seller, 1 @ $1200 from channel fireball , 2 @ $1500 from random sellers with good feedback but less than 1000 sales, and finally a NM one for $2000 that's been sitting there for a while. I don't know much about MKM but it looks like they are closer to the $750-$1100 range that Tabernacle normally sits in.

I'm curious if anything listed at these higher prices is actually getting sold since I personally wouldn't buy from any of the sellers on tcgplayer except for CFB.
I buy much from other seller's because it's cheaper for the same condition and I get my cards.

I had an issue with one store, they fixed it quick fast and in a hurry. Hell one time it was the postal services fault they were ready to ship a new set then it came in and I told them to halt and thanked them for their great service.

Would gladly buy from them again, I don't buy from people based on who they are but their price competitiveness for condition.

If I'm helping someone put food on the table for my albeit silly hobby then sure.

If it's some mass produced item then yeah I will buy the better brand.

[jrsthethird]

Tabernacle's tcg mid price seems pretty unreliable. There are 4 LP available with 1 @ $870 from a newer seller, 1 @ $1200 from channel fireball , 2 @ $1500 from random sellers with good feedback but less than 1000 sales, and finally a NM one for $2000 that's been sitting there for a while.

Blackest Magic very frequently lists cards extremely high to shift the TCG price. Bonus if someone actually pays it too. I'd bet money whoever runs that storefront is active on Pucatrade.


I'm curious if anything listed at these higher prices is actually getting sold since I personally wouldn't buy from any of the sellers on tcgplayer except for CFB.

TCG really goes to bat for buyers; we saw that during the Pro Tour when they announced that cancelling orders after spikes was not allowed. I know of at least one store that was taken down (not sure if temporarily or permanent) after cancelling an order on PT weekend. They also require all orders over $250 to be shipped with tracking and Signature Confirmation.

You can try googling the store names and contacting the store directly with questions or concerns before buying a high value card. I did this with a couple duals I just purchased. They were listed as HP or Damaged, and I found the stores' Facebook pages and asked for pics and details on the wear. I know these aren't beat up, but you can still get some information or pics of the real card if you can contact the store directly before purchasing. It won't work if they're people like me who set up a store to list their trade binder, but for any real brick and morter or online store, you can get an extra layer of security before the purchase.