bad player needs advice on trading cards

[Pastorofmuppets]

would 4 Thoughtseizes be a good trade for 4 played Italian Chain Lightnings, or should I ask for a little more from the guy?

[Dan Turner]

your on the losing side by about $5 or so but honestly I would do it just because it is easier to get thoughtsiezes than chain lightnings.

[MMogg]

your on the losing side by about $5 or so but honestly I would do it just because it is easier to get thoughtsiezes than chain lightnings.

Well, according to MOTL's price guide, which is based on ebay, they are equal. CL = $10.75 and TS = $10.74. That said, the Chain Lightning is Italian so they are probably about $8-9, and they are played (how badly?) so that's another couple of bucks off. But as MF says, Chain Lightnings are on a rising trend, whereas TS isn't. You could always ask for some throw-ins. No harm in asking.

[mchainmail]

Thoughtseize has risen about 20-30% in the past month. ($8-$10) because of Extended / Legacy. If you need Chain Lightnings, do it.

[MMogg]

Thoughtseize has risen about 20-30% in the past month. ($8-$10) because of Extended / Legacy. If you need Chain Lightnings, do it.

But, check out these trends:

http://www.blackborder.com/images/graphs/26800.gifhttp://www.blackborder.com/images/graphs/2981.gif

If those were stocks, which company would you back?

[Pastorofmuppets]

But, check out these trends:

http://www.blackborder.com/images/graphs/26800.gifhttp://www.blackborder.com/images/graphs/2981.gif

If those were stocks, which company would you back?

TS dropped in price when it cycled. I can always get more Siezes from Extended players when the season's over. I just wanted to know if I should do it as is or if I should try and get some more from the guy. He's trading off his stuff Vial Gobs, Ichorid, (remnants of) Storm, and Burn for MBA stuff. Not smart, but CL will always be good as I can dangle it over the heads of the cheap asses who want to play burn and nothing else because it's "fun" (cheap)

[Tha Gunslinga]

That's a horrible deal. NM English Chain Lightnings would be fair, 1-for-1, for Thoughtseizes. Played Italian ones, I'd say maybe 2.5 Seizes for 4.

[Forbiddian]

Played = Any condition. Bent, water damaged, whatever.

This is a horrible trade. Good condition Thoughtseizes are worth good condition English Chains 1:1.

[SomeRandomDude]

If you are looking for chains, eBay Chain Lightings... I'm not jokeing, I got my playset for the cheap that way.

[Pastorofmuppets]

bah, I'm probably getting 2 Ancient Tombs and a Trinisphere sent along with the CLs.

[Pastorofmuppets]

okay, another question for youse guys:
How much is an NM Italian The Abyss worth? And should I be barking up that tree or should I be shooting for Entombs instead?

[Pastorofmuppets]

okay, another question for youse guys:
How much is an NM Italian The Abyss worth? And should I be barking up that tree or should I be shooting for Entombs instead?

The guy values it at 65 but at T&T it's $35 for Italians.

[MMogg]

The guy values it at 65 but at T&T it's $35 for Italians, but they are out of stock so who the hell knows when that price is from.

Fixed.

[Pastorofmuppets]

Fixed.

ah, okay. Fuck everything, why is it so hard to get a solid price on something? I saw one on Ebay for $20...
I wish I could trade a set of PtE for one.

[MMogg]

ah, okay. Fuck everything, why is it so hard to get a solid price on something? I saw one on Ebay for $20...
I wish I could trade a set of PtE for one.

That's the nature of the secondary market. Figuring out prices gets worse when you get into different languages (not for Legends, which you generally can tell the value of Italian vs. English). At least in this case, ebay has had five recently ended auctions to give you a rough estimate (http://completed.shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=mtg+abyss+italian&_in_kw=1&_ex_kw=&_sacat=See-All-Categories&_okw=mtg+abyss+italian&_oexkw=&LH_Complete=1&_udlo=&_udhi=&_samilow=&_samihi=&_sadis=200&_fpos=Zip+code&_fsct=&LH_SALE_CURRENCY=0&_sop=12&_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_rdc=1).

[Shugyosha]

Some month ago I talked to people who have Abyss's and knew the price. It's somewhere between 30-35 Euros (roughly $45). They are hard to get but also mostly unused so I consider this a fair price and I trust the people I talked to. (European) Magic card market also has many in ITA NM für 30 Euros up.

[MMogg]

Some month ago I talked to people who have Abyss's and knew the price. It's somewhere between 30-35 Euros (roughly $45). They are hard to get but also mostly unused so I consider this a fair price and I trust the people I talked to. (European) Magic card market also has many in ITA NM für 30 Euros up.

That estimate is clearly confirmed in the ebay sales, which range from 30-50. $20 looks way too low though.

[Pastorofmuppets]

I'm guessing the Entomb is my target then. Hopefully they'll go up after Madrid.
EDIT: fuck, now he's all offended because $65 in cash or $70 in cards is "the price that they always go for" and not at all frivolous as "he's been doing this for years"

[MMogg]

I'm guessing the Entomb is my target then. Hopefully they'll go up after Madrid.
EDIT: fuck, now he's all offended because $65 in cash or $70 in cards is "the price that they always go for" and not at all frivolous as "he's been doing this for years"

I hate that kind of talk. I won't deal with people like that. Hyperbole and claims to knowledge cannot replace true market values.

[SlopeeJ]

This is why I try to not to trade as much as possible. For me it takes away from playing the game and people always value their stuff high and yours low. Trading is like a full time job lol, I just try to buy/win cards I need.

[Pastorofmuppets]

I hate that kind of talk. I won't deal with people like that. Hyperbole and claims to knowledge cannot replace true market values.

Especially since he has 28 refs and has only been trading since October as far as I can see... He has a lot of stuff, but he also wanted $35 for the Entomb. To think I offered him my set of mint AN Serendib Efreets. First time I even MENTIONED those on that or any other site.

[MMogg]

Especially since he has 28 refs and has only been trading since October as far as I can see... He has a lot of stuff, but he also wanted $35 for the Entomb. To think I offered him my set of mint AN Serendib Efreets. First time I even MENTIONED those on that or any other site.

Hehe, well, MOTL refs and site activity doesn't mean he hasn't been playing/trading for years and years, but experience is one of the worst arguments of all time. I always remember that George W. Bush is one of the two most experienced people in the world at being President of the United States. Not all experience is equal or signals a knowledge base. :laugh: In trading it's fairly simple, though, to ascertain values. Also, it's very easy to just say $X amount is my lowest/highest I am willing to value Y card. No need to get all emotional about it. I find people who throw around shit like experience or complain about pricing or something like that just use that as negotiation leverage. Like my wife, whenever she goes shopping will always reply "so expensive" no matter what she's buying or how cheap it already is, just to help her bargain and lower the price.

AN Serendibs are sweet, don't give those up, especially for shit like The Abyss.

[dahcmai]

I wouldn't bother with him and just go buy some of those Chain lightnings for less than what you would pay for the Thoughtseizes. If he can't be decent about it and keeps trying to rip you off let him sit on his cards with no trades.

[Pastorofmuppets]

I wouldn't bother with him and just go buy some of those Chain lightnings for less than what you would pay for the Thoughtseizes. If he can't be decent about it and keeps trying to rip you off let him sit on his cards with no trades.

No, this isn't the same guy. The Chain Lightning guy was really cool. I was going to let the trade go straight up with just a Trinisphere and he told me to pick out like $8 more in stuff.


Hehe, well, MOTL refs and site activity doesn't mean he hasn't been playing/trading for years and years, but experience is one of the worst arguments of all time. I always remember that George W. Bush is one of the two most experienced people in the world at being President of the United States. Not all experience is equal or signals a knowledge base. :laugh: In trading it's fairly simple, though, to ascertain values. Also, it's very easy to just say $X amount is my lowest/highest I am willing to value Y card. No need to get all emotional about it. I find people who throw around shit like experience or complain about pricing or something like that just use that as negotiation leverage. Like my wife, whenever she goes shopping will always reply "so expensive" no matter what she's buying or how cheap it already is, just to help her bargain and lower the price.

AN Serendibs are sweet, don't give those up, especially for shit like The Abyss.

Abyss, Entombs, and a Force, actually. That trade would've been bigger than (insert reference here, inb4 genatalia)

[Mr.C]

I'm guessing the Entomb is my target then. Hopefully they'll go up after Madrid.
EDIT: fuck, now he's all offended because $65 in cash or $70 in cards is "the price that they always go for" and not at all frivolous as "he's been doing this for years"

Tell him to fuck off, then.

I have one abyss. I got it for 25. People on average ask 30. A local store asks 40 (Canadian). SCG has a NM English one at 65.

[Cthuloo]

If you still need some advice, in Italy The Abyss goes for 20-25 € if NM. I'm pretty sure about that, since I bought one some months ago and I'm searching for others.