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brianw712
03-09-2010, 10:45 PM
Chains of Mephistopheles:

If a player would draw a card except the first one he or she draws in his or her draw step each turn, that player discards a card instead. If the player discards a card this way, he or she draws a card. If the player doesn't discard a card this way, he or she puts the top card of his or her library into his or her graveyard.

Say I have two cards in my hand, and then I play a Ponder. When I draw a card, I discard a card first, then I draw a card. Why doesn't the draw that Chains of Mephistopheles allows me to take (bolded section in the oracle text above) generate another replacement effect?

cdr
03-09-2010, 10:49 PM
614.5. A replacement effect doesn't invoke itself repeatedly and gets only one opportunity for each event.

Example: A player controls two permanents, each with an ability that reads "If a creature you control would deal damage to a creature or player, it deals double that damage to that creature or player instead." A creature that normally deals 2 damage will deal 8 damage--not just 4, and not an infinite amount.

Nonex
03-10-2010, 06:40 AM
Note that if Chains of Mephistopheles replaced its own draws, a single cantrip would force the affected player to discard the entire hand and mill 1.

cdr
03-10-2010, 06:57 AM
Note that if Chains of Mephistopheles replaced its own draws, a single cantrip would force the affected player to discard the entire hand and mill 1.

Actually, it would be an infinite loop, which would be even sillier. Every draw would force a discard, which would force a draw, which would force a discard...

Skeggi
03-10-2010, 07:03 AM
Actually, it would be an infinite loop, which would be even sillier. Every draw would force a discard, which would force a draw, which would force a discard...
Would it? I suppose if you have an infinite deck you would, but as soon as statebased effects are checked after you want to draw a card from your library but can't because it's empty, you'll lose the game. So I thought not so infinite...

Nonex
03-10-2010, 07:17 AM
In theory, when you run out of cards and can't discard any, Chains would tell you to mill 1 rather than trying to draw again, thus ending the loop.

cdr
03-10-2010, 07:24 AM
Infinite until you lose the game, anyway.