Damage to planeswalkers

[Jason]

Say Gideon Jura has 8 loyalty counters on it and Everlasting Torment is in play (damage can't be prevented). If the 0 ability is activated and Gideon attacks, a player blocks dealing it 6 damage, does it die, or just remove 6 loyalty counters? Is removing the loyalty a replacement for the damage done to planeswalkers? Thanks!

[heroicraptor]

Gideon is put into its owner's graveyard because it has as much damage marked on it as toughness.

From the ROE FAQ:

* If you activate Gideon Jura's third ability and then unpreventable damage is dealt to him (due to Unstable Footing, for example), that damage has all applicable results: specifically, the damage is marked on Gideon Jura (since he's a creature) and that damage causes that many loyalty counters to be removed from him (since he's a planeswalker). If the total amount of damage marked on Gideon Jura is lethal damage, he's destroyed as a state-based action. If Gideon Jura has no loyalty counters on him, he's put into his owner's graveyard as a state-based action.

[Nihil Credo]

This made me think of a weird hypothetical. Let's say there is the following enchantment in play:

"If a creature [you control] would be destroyed, return it to its owner's hand instead."

Now, an animated Gideon Jura with six loyalty has six unpreventable damage dealt to him. What happens? The Comprehensive Rules state that all state-based actions are performed at the same time (see below), but I could find no rule on how to deal with two mutually exclusive SBA.


704.3. Whenever a player (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#player) would get priority (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#priority) (see rule 115 (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#R115), "Timing and Priority (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#priority)"), the game checks for any of the listed conditions for state-based actions (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#state-based_actions), then performs all applicable state-based actions (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#state-based_actions) simultaneously as a single event (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#event). If any state-based actions (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#state-based_actions) are performed as a result of a check, the check is repeated; otherwise all triggered abilities (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#triggered_ability) that are waiting to be put on the stack (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#stack) are put on the stack (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#stack), then the check is repeated. Once no more state-based actions (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#state-based_actions) have been performed as the result of a check and no triggered abilities (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#triggered_ability) are waiting to be put on the stack (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#stack), the appropriate player (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#player) gets priority (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#priority). This process also occurs during (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#during) the cleanup step (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#cleanup_step) (see rule 514 (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#R514)), except that if no state-based actions (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#state-based_actions) are performed as the result of the step (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#step)'s first check and no triggered abilities (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#triggered_ability) are waiting to be put on the stack (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#stack), then no player (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#player) gets priority (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#priority) and the step (http://www.yawgatog.com/resources/magic-rules/#step) ends.

[Anusien]

If such a thing could happen, the rules would be changed to allow for it.

[cdr]

This made me think of a weird hypothetical. Let's say there is the following enchantment in play:

"If a creature [you control] would be destroyed, return it to its owner's hand instead."

Now, an animated Gideon Jura with six loyalty has six unpreventable damage dealt to him. What happens? The Comprehensive Rules state that all state-based actions are performed at the same time (see below), but I could find no rule on how to deal with two mutually exclusive SBA.



That effect would never be printed, so your question is moot. You are beyond corner-case.

That said, the SBAs are not mutually exclusive. There's a replacement effect that is applied as applicable to SBAs or any other event. You could say the effects are "mutually exclusive", I guess. I don't think the rule is currently set up to handle such a situation, since there's no need to, so I would agree with Anusien.