the beets

[cubemaster]

I'm just getting into legacy and wanted to try a pretty budget list to start off with. Here's what I have so far:


4 Boggart Ram-Gang
4 Keldon Marauders
4 Kird Ape
2 Quirion Dryad
2 Radha, Heir to Keld
4 Scab-Clan Mauler
3 Scuzzback Scrapper
4 Tattermunge Maniac
Creatures [27]


3 incinerate
3 Colossal Might
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Rancor
Spells [13]


4 Copperline Gorge
6 Forest
4 karplusan forest
6 Mountain


SB:
3 Burning-Tree Shaman
3 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
4 Relic of Progenitus
3 Vexing Shusher




Any suggestions on the mana base or card choices? Any and all criticism welcome.

[Mr. Safety]

Solid list. I would suggest Bloodbraid Elf and Violent Outburst just to get some free plays. Violent Outburst in particular goes well with any 2 mana creature with haste (like Rip-Clan Crasher)

With so many low cost warriors Giantbaiting + Bramblewood Paragon become pretty good, too.

[Valtrix]

I'd look into making a couple good equipments make their way into the list, if you have any. Equipment can do wonders for making "less-good" creatures become really scary.

For creatures you might be able to get skyshroud elite, which is usually just another kird ape. It would be better than tattermunge maniac. You might also find countryside crusher to be good too.

Although it wants double read, I personally like searing blaze, which might be better than incinerate. I'm not really sure though.

As for mana, you might be able to trade for rootbound crag, which aren't too difficult to find/expensive now. You might also be able to take advantage of teetering peaks.

Otherwise, bloodbraid elf and violent outburst could be good. Good luck with the deck!

[Mr. Safety]

If you decide to drop a 2 mana creature for Skyshroud Elite, then Giantbaiting gets even better. The more cheap creatures you have, the better chance of getting two 4/4 hasted beaters are on turn 3. It's good, and you can usually get the conspired copy even if the card is countered. It's a nice way around Daze/Force of Will and Counterbalance (the copy is not played...it is put directly onto the stack)

[cubemaster]

thanks for the help! a few things...
1) I didn't include bloodbraid elf because I can't consistently hit my 4th land drop and to do so I would have to lower the threat density.
2) I have since replaced scuzzback scrapper with skyshroud elite. he was in there originally when boartusk liege was also in the list. Liege was removed for the same reason as bloodbraid.

I have been testing with this:

creatures: 28
4 kird ape
4 skyshroud elite
4 tattermunge maniac

4 keldon marauders
4 scab-clan mauler
4 quirion dryad

4 boggart ram-gang

spells: 12
4 lightning bolt
4 char
4 giantbaiting

lands: 20
4 mossfire valley
4 rootbound crag
2 copperline gorge
5 forest
5 mountain


I would like something else in the quirion dryad slot because she is a huge tempo sink but nothing really stands out as far as beating down. any recommendations welcome.

[Mr. Safety]

Try out these:

Rip-Clan Crasher
Bramblewood Paragon
Obsidian Battle-Axe
Nettle Sentinel
Skarrgan Pit-Skulk
Hellspark Elemental
Spark Elemental


Nettle Sentinel and Bramblewood Paragon both go SICK with Giantbaiting. Check out magicthegathering.com and do a search for Jacob Van Lunen's article on Giantbaiting...his deck name was 'Dating Baiting'. It was mono-green, but he's also a HUGE fan of Lightning Bolt.

Good luck man!

[cubemaster]

ahhh thanks for that. Bramblewood paragon is the absolute sickness! it might push nettle sentinel over skyshroud for that spot. Having tried skarrgan pit-skulk, I don't think it is correct in this deck. I might try a 2-2 split with rip-clan crasher and scab-clan.

[Mr. Safety]

ahhh thanks for that. Bramblewood paragon is the absolute sickness! it might push nettle sentinel over skyshroud for that spot. Having tried skarrgan pit-skulk, I don't think it is correct in this deck. I might try a 2-2 split with rip-clan crasher and scab-clan.

If you include Bramblewood Paragon, you basically have to run Rip-Clan Crasher if anything at the RG spot. You need warriors so you can take full advantage of Paragon. That's why Skarrgan Pit-Skulk was mentioned...it's better than Scab-Clan Mauler because of creature type.

[cubemaster]

so a paragon oriented version would look like:

4 skarrgan pit-skulk
4 tattermunge maniac
4 nettle sentinel

4 bramblewood paragon
4 rip-clan crasher
4 keldon marauders

4 boggart ram-gang
4 giantbaiting

4 lightning bolt
3 shard volley

4 copperline gorge
4 rootbound crag
7 forest
6 mountain

so now its mono green warriors splashing keldon marauders and removal, which is kind of interesting. There may be potential there

[Mr. Safety]

Yeah, definate potential. I'm not sure I'd use 3x Shard Volley...I wouldn't want to be tempted to use it early game without enough land to support it. If you need burn in that spot (which I think you do...) then I would look to Magma Jet for the library manipulation. The other possibility is to drop to 2 Shard Volleys and put in Sylvan Library x1 to help refill your hand.

Good luck, man! The deck is fun, but I'm not sure how competitive it would be.

[cubemaster]

@Mr. Safety thanks for the advice on shard volley replacements. Magma jet is awesome but a little expensive (by expensive I mean dollar amount not mana cost)....it might just be worth it though. Sylvan library sound awesome though. thanks for the advice.

I have been wondering recently how I might go about beating NO/pro with this deck. I just realized that I can't simply stingscourger it back. Once again, ricochet trap might save the day on this one but I would like an answer to the progenitus itself. All the good ones seem to be in other colors. The only other thing that comes to mind is having double combust available which seems unlikely. Advice welcome.

Lastly, I have decided to (for now) not go with bramblewood paragon for this list, which leaves my 2-drop spot slightly open. Right now, scab-clan mauler and keldon marauders are both awesome but I want 2-4 more options to curve out successfully. Rip-clan crasher seems underwhelming for legacy but might be an option. I tested Radha, heir to Keld but he wasn't very good. I know Mr. Safety has advocated kavu predator as a replacement for goyf before, does that seem right here? punishing fire fits in nicely in the shard volley slot and grove would be just fine. Once again, I am open to suggestions and thank you all for the help.

[Mr. Safety]

I don't think Grove/Fires belongs here. Your goal is to get them from 20 to 0 as fast as possible.

Remember that with Brambewood Paragon, you get two 5/5 trampling giants on turn 3 with Giantbaiting. The fact that you can drop Paragon turn 2, Giantbaiting turn 3 is key.

If you were to use something like Chrome Mox or Simian Spirit Guide/Elvish Spirit Guide, you could do that 1 turn faster. Turn 2 conspired Giantbaiting? That's FAST man, really fast.

Magma Jet isn't that expensive. Check out this site, it's where I get about 99% of my cards:

www.mtgfanatic.com

Awesome prices, and you can usually get cards played for less, but the condition isn't bad, just slightly noticable wear.

Good luck man!

PS - Rip-Clan Crasher was only because of warrior status. I think Magma Jet fits nicely here, you have enough creatures to feed Giantbaiting without Crasher.

[cubemaster]

ok so after looking through this thread and gatherer I settled on this list:

4 kird ape
4 tattermunge maniac
4 skyshroud eilte

4 keldon marauders
4 scab-clan mauler
4 garruks companion/ beastbreaker of bala ged/ quirion dryad/ tarmogoyf/ hellspark elemental
4 boggart ram-gang

4 lightning bolt
4 magma jet

4 karplusan forest
4 rootbound crag
4 copperline gorge
4 forest
4 mountain

i still am not sure about sideboard possibilities...definitely some dredge hosers, ricochet trap seems like a lifesaver in some matchups, pyroclasm or some sort of effect for goblins and little blue men, krosan grip for countertop and mindbreak trap for ANT seems about right but I'm not sure

Thanks again for all the help

[Mr. Safety]

Solid...good luck!

[cubemaster]

Thanks again for all the help guys! I guess mods can close the thread now if they want.