[Deck] Goblins

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I went 2-2 in the local legacy tournament today. An interesting situation came up. Would you have kept this han on the play, versus elves?
Mountain
Goblin Lackey
Gempalm Incinerator
Chalice of the Void
Goblin Sharpshooter
Engineered Plague
Perish

R1 Elves 2-1
These games were extremely close, I won on the last round of time.

R2 Burn 2-1
Chalice stole g2. I incorrectly boarded out Scrapper, and g3 he played Ensnaring Bridge. However, I managed to draw Chalice to survive a few extra turns and killed him with Siege-Gang Commander

R3 Elves 0-2
G1 I mulliganed to five and was overrun. It was an okeyish keep.
G2 I kept the hand I posted earlier. I didn't draw any land in my first two draw steps. He played NO for Progenitus. I drew a wasteland and played chalice for one. He attacked, and i didn't draw the black source for Perish. I'm still unsure if this keep was too greedy.

R4 Omnitell
G1 I try to race him but he's faster.
G2 I mulligan to six and he's faster once again. I was debating keeping my seven of lands + chalice + warchief + piledriver + matron. It's also possible I should have mulliganned to five.

[snorlaxcom]

Dropping drs + no second land... I would bail on that hand to 5 cards.

[andrebonotto]

Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
Legendary Creature — Goblin Shaman 2/2, 2RRR (5)
Haste

{T}: Put a token that's a copy of target nonlegendary creature you control onto the battlefield. That token has haste. Sacrifice it at the beginning of the next end step.

(...)
.

Indeed, I stand corrected. Should have grabbed my copy of Kiki-Jiki and read it before posting... :laugh:

[prateta]

Hi everyone, I went 2-2 in the local legacy tournament today. An interesting situation came up. Would you have kept this han on the play, versus elves?
Mountain
Goblin Lackey
Gempalm Incinerator
Chalice of the Void
Goblin Sharpshooter
Engineered Plague
Perish

R1 Elves 2-1
These games were extremely close, I won on the last round of time.

R2 Burn 2-1
Chalice stole g2. I incorrectly boarded out Scrapper, and g3 he played Ensnaring Bridge. However, I managed to draw Chalice to survive a few extra turns and killed him with Siege-Gang Commander

R3 Elves 0-2
G1 I mulliganed to five and was overrun. It was an okeyish keep.
G2 I kept the hand I posted earlier. I didn't draw any land in my first two draw steps. He played NO for Progenitus. I drew a wasteland and played chalice for one. He attacked, and i didn't draw the black source for Perish. I'm still unsure if this keep was too greedy.

R4 Omnitell
G1 I try to race him but he's faster.
G2 I mulligan to six and he's faster once again. I was debating keeping my seven of lands + chalice + warchief + piledriver + matron. It's also possible I should have mulliganned to five.

I wouldn't keep it. Maybe with 2 mountains, to have at least the chalice for sure. It's sweet hand but little mana screwed. How many fetches and black sources do you play? This question is very important to answer if you want us to tell you that you should / should have not kept the hand.

[Sandro95]

I wouldn't keep it. Maybe with 2 mountains, to have at least the chalice for sure. It's sweet hand but little mana screwed. How many fetches and black sources do you play? This question is very important to answer if you want us to tell you that you should / should have not kept the hand.

5 fetch, 2 badlands.

[ScatmanX]

Hi everyone, I went 2-2 in the local legacy tournament today. An interesting situation came up. Would you have kept this han on the play, versus elves?
Mountain
Goblin Lackey
Gempalm Incinerator
Chalice of the Void
Goblin Sharpshooter
Engineered Plague
Perish

R1 Elves 2-1
These games were extremely close, I won on the last round of time.

R2 Burn 2-1
Chalice stole g2. I incorrectly boarded out Scrapper, and g3 he played Ensnaring Bridge. However, I managed to draw Chalice to survive a few extra turns and killed him with Siege-Gang Commander

R3 Elves 0-2
G1 I mulliganed to five and was overrun. It was an okeyish keep.
G2 I kept the hand I posted earlier. I didn't draw any land in my first two draw steps. He played NO for Progenitus. I drew a wasteland and played chalice for one. He attacked, and i didn't draw the black source for Perish. I'm still unsure if this keep was too greedy.

R4 Omnitell
G1 I try to race him but he's faster.
G2 I mulligan to six and he's faster once again. I was debating keeping my seven of lands + chalice + warchief + piledriver + matron. It's also possible I should have mulliganned to five.
Before asking these questions you could write your decklist.
If you don't play Mox, nor Gator, I'd keep this hand. Drawing a land T2 is GG. If you only draw it T3 then you still have a very good fighting chance. If you had Mox or Instigators, I'd mull it, because you could have a chance of a super agressive start even without Lackey.

Against burn I also learned to always leave 1 artifact hate pos-sb. Don't know if is the norm though. But beign surprised by Bridge does suck.
Against Omni, that hand feels pretty bad, but then again, don't know your decklist. Still, would probably mulligan.

[prateta]

Just want to share one amazing play I did few days ago at GPT Paris in Prague. Ended up 4th in the end and this is what happened to me in top 8, goblins surely still can surprise.

Playing third game agains BWG opponent with Dark Depths combo alternate wincon.

He is on play.
T1: He starts Bayou, GSZ for Dryad Arbor. Plays DRS.
I start with Wasteland -> Vial (my hand was something like pyrokinesis, wasteland, mountain, vial, lackey, ringleader, gempalm)
T2: He plays another GSZ, I'm praying he puts something x/1 in play so I can pyrokinesis the hell out of him. We were playing for a long time, so like 10 players were watching us. Eventually he put into play Noble hierarch. I thanked him for playing it and told him he is not going further to top 4, he just laughed because his deck is obviously a bad matchup for goblins and he had no idea there is such a thing as Pyrokinesis.
Well I played Pyrokinesis at the end of his turn, killing DRS, Noble Hierarch and Dryad arbor. During my turn I wastelanded his Bayou, played Lackey. He got left with completely empty table when I had lackey, vial and mountain. Everybody was laughing and he scooped immediately :-D Definitely the funniest game I had this year.

Also. My deck contained only 1 wasteland. What a luck.

[BaroqueW]

Short report from my last event (the same as Sandro95 actually - hi Sandro95 :smile:).

EDITed with my list



22 lands

3 Badlands
3 Rishadan port
4 fetch
4 mountain
4 wasteland
4 cavern of souls

4 Goblin lackey
4 Goblin matron
4 Ringleader
4 Goblin chieftain
2 Goblin warchief
2 skirk prospector
1 Krenko. mob boss
3 Gempalm
2 mogg war marshal
1 Tuktuk scrapper
3 purphoros, god of the forge

4 Aether vial
2 Tarfire
2 Warren weirding

Sideboard
2 confusion in the ranks
1 goblin sharpshooter
1 shattering spree
1 tuktuk scrapper
1 boartusk liege
3 cabal therapy
1 pithing needle
3 pyrokinesis
2 relic of progenitus


R1 - Omnitell (same guy as Sandro95's R4) went 1-2

First game he plays SnT > Emrakul on turn 3/4. Second game, he plays gitaxian probe on the turn he wanted to go off (with SnT + Omniscience) and sees my only card to be Confusion in the Ranks :) He goes "what?", then "judge!", then "pass", then I kill him the following turn. Third game, he comboes out too fast again.

R2 - UR Young pyromancer 2-0

Close games each time. I won both with 1 or 2 life total. First game he gets quite a few Elemental 1/1 out with his pyromancer plus quite a few bolts to the face. I hold his last guys off with MWM tokens and lackey (I am at 2 life while he is still above 10) until I get Krenko and Purphoros. Second game he gets to flip a couple of delvers which I dispatch while I hold him off his mana with port + wasteland. In his last turn before dying, I port his only red source and he topdecks a Chain lightning. We both had two life total so he could have won on that one, instead I got to attack for lethal the following turn.

R3 - Pox - 1-2

Gee I don't like playing pox. G1 he gets Liliana out turn 1 off a dark ritual and I never establish a position on the board. He makes me discard 2 purphoros which is my main plan against pox and I never see the third one. G2 I am on the go and CT his hand for one Engineered Plague, and flashback T2 for the Night of Soul's betrayal. This allows me to get into a good early position. He eventually gets a Liliana out which makes the game last way too long but he eventually scoops when he is at 1 life total and me still at 19... G3, he gets off to T1 Liliana again and it's the same as G1. At some point I get a ringleader out to replenish my hand but I end up tucking my only Pithing Needle at the bottom of my library... Needle on Liliana would have definitely turned things around a bit...

R4 - Cephalid breakfast (!) 2-0

I didn't see that coming. G1. I am on the go with a good hand of lackey > warchief > matron > ringleader. End of my T3 he vials in the Nomads-en-kor. I had a Gempalm in hand, but my lands were at 2x Cavern and a Port. I painfully watch him as he comboes off in his turn 3 (Cephalid Illusionist > mill > 3 Narcomoeba > Dread return > Angel of glory's rise > Laboratory Maniac + Hapless researcher.
G2 I sideboarded in 3 CT, 1 Pithing needle, 3 pyrokinesis, 2 relic. I mull to 5 with still a good hand but no hate (some burn though). T1 he drops a Shuko. T2 he drops SFM for Batterskull. I tarfire it EOT. T3 I continue my gig. In his T3, I use port in his upkeep but he drops a land and gets his Cephalid out. That was definitely a bad play on my side as I should have kept a second mana up for Gempalm to burn his guy (since Shuko equips as a sorcery). So bad play on my side and obviously there is no T4.

[Chatto]

Just want to share one amazing play I did few days ago at GPT Paris in Prague. Ended up 4th in the end and this is what happened to me in top 8, goblins surely still can surprise.
(...)
He is on play.
T1: He starts Bayou, GSZ for Dryad Arbor. Plays DRS.

I don't know, but isn't that illegal? Either way, nice move indeed! That will teach them to laugh at us :) Could you share your latest build?

[HammafistRoob]

I'm a little late but I wanted to reply to the question regarding the Elves! matchup. Is it even correct to keep Lackeys in the deck? They have like 10 billion ways to just roadblock him if we don't have a Gempalm.

[Sandro95]

I'm a little late but I wanted to reply to the question regarding the Elves! matchup. Is it even correct to keep Lackeys in the deck? They have like 10 billion ways to just roadblock him if we don't have a Gempalm.

If they lead with an X/1 he is functionally a removal. It's definitely an interesting debate though. :)

[ScatmanX]

I'm a little late but I wanted to reply to the question regarding the Elves! matchup. Is it even correct to keep Lackeys in the deck? They have like 10 billion ways to just roadblock him if we don't have a Gempalm.
Absolutely keep Lackey in. They NEED to block Lackey, and they always will if able, so in the worst case, he's a removal for R. If you have a removal or a Chieftain the turn after you play him, you'll probably win the game. He's the fastest thing you can do in this MU, and you need to be fast.
Vial on the other hand is slow as hell and don't provide you with anything you want. To beat elves you need to be blazing fast, with multiple Lackeys/Gator, Chieftains, or removal to clear blockers, or you need to lock them, using Chalice, Grafdigger's Cage, Needle and whatnot. Vial don't work in any of these plans.

[Sandro95]

Before asking these questions you could write your decklist.
If you don't play Mox, nor Gator, I'd keep this hand. Drawing a land T2 is GG. If you only draw it T3 then you still have a very good fighting chance. If you had Mox or Instigators, I'd mull it, because you could have a chance of a super agressive start even without Lackey.

Against burn I also learned to always leave 1 artifact hate pos-sb. Don't know if is the norm though. But beign surprised by Bridge does suck.
Against Omni, that hand feels pretty bad, but then again, don't know your decklist. Still, would probably mulligan.

This is the list I played
4 Aether Vial
4 Golblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
2 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War Marshall
2 Goblin Warchief
3 Goblin Chieftain
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander

1 Tarfire
1 Warren Weirding
4 Gempalm Incinerator

4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Badlands
4 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Arid Mesa
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Bloodstained Mire

Sideboard
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Perish
1 Boartusk Liege
1 Shattering Spree
1 Engineered Plague

I knew ensnaring bridge was a thing, and in hindsight boarding it out was a mistake. My opponent and I agreed that I should board out all four gempalms, as it's too slow most of the time.

I spoke with my omnitell opponent after the match, and he said that chalice of the void was a really scary card for him. If that's the case, then I underestimated its impact on the MU.

I followed the same reasoning as you on the elves MU, though I'm still trying to figure out if it was correct or not. Close call.

[Sandro95]

Short report from my last event (the same as Sandro95 actually - hi Sandro95 :smile:).

I will come back and edit with my list later but I want to drop this while it's still somewhat fresh in my mind. Basically it's Rb with Purphoros, without Mox or WI.



Hi BaroqueW :) Also, how did Purphoros work out for you? I'm quite curious.

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I went 2-2 in the local legacy tournament today. An interesting situation came up. Would you have kept this han on the play, versus elves?
Mountain
Goblin Lackey
Gempalm Incinerator
Chalice of the Void
Goblin Sharpshooter
Engineered Plague
Perish



I posted this questions on the elves thread as well, and got some helpful responses.


Because Elves is VERY much favored and you porbably run 24 lands, I'd definitely keep it. You've got a 42% chance to draw a land there which - from my experience - is still way better than your average win% in this matchup, even postboard. Yes, you still can't pass a DRS or Nettle Sentinel here, but so what? At least you had a reasonably good chance to win this game.

[AlbyLegacy]

ok, so I play tested yesterday and came up to this list. I did try chrome mox and kiki game plan, but was not what I expected.
I recorded my matches VS Punishing JUND . I will be posting that today for you guys. now, I did like the chrome mox and kiki, but i decided on this list after a lot of playing.

// Deck: goblins (60)

// Lands
4 Cavern of Souls
15 Mountain

// Creatures
2 Gempalm Incinerator
3 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Warchief
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Stingscourger
3 Warren Instigator

// Spells
2 Pyrokinesis
4 Tarfire
4 Æther Vial

[virre]

Short report from my last event (the same as Sandro95 actually - hi Sandro95 :smile:).

I will come back and edit with my list later but I want to drop this while it's still somewhat fresh in my mind. Basically it's Rb with Purphoros, without Mox or WI.


Wait what, where there three Goblin players there, I missed that.

[LeoCop 90]

ok, so I play tested yesterday and came up to this list. I did try chrome mox and kiki game plan, but was not what I expected.
I recorded my matches VS Punishing JUND . I will be posting that today for you guys. now, I did like the chrome mox and kiki, but i decided on this list after a lot of playing.

// Deck: goblins (60)

// Lands
4 Cavern of Souls
15 Mountain

// Creatures
2 Gempalm Incinerator
3 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Warchief
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Stingscourger
3 Warren Instigator

// Spells
2 Pyrokinesis
4 Tarfire
4 Æther Vial

This is the second time I see you propose a list running 18-19 lands ... And I have to repeat that in my opinion it can't work. I don't want to sound harsh, since i appreciate the work you are putting in the deck and the videos you post, but really don't you happen to be manascrewed too often with this list ?

Apart from the manabase, I don't know if it's worth running warren instigator without crome mox, but, since you are running a lot of removal spells, maybe it can work. Overall I feel that you are a bit too much on the lackey/instigator connect plan, and maybe this is why you run few lands.

[AlbyLegacy]

This is the second time I see you propose a list running 18-19 lands ... And I have to repeat that in my opinion it can't work. I don't want to sound harsh, since i appreciate the work you are putting in the deck and the videos you post, but really don't you happen to be manascrewed too often with this list ?

Apart from the manabase, I don't know if it's worth running warren instigator without crome mox, but, since you are running a lot of removal spells, maybe it can work. Overall I feel that you are a bit too much on the lackey/instigator connect plan, and maybe this is why you run few lands.


19 lands has been fine for me. i don't really get manascrewed. once in a while i do, but that happens. 19 is fine. no fetchs, ports, or wastelands. yes, lackey instigator, vial, warcheif help the mana base. for my build chrome mox is not what i am trying to do. chrome mox is not bad. just not good enough in my build.

[AlbyLegacy]

MTG Legacy: Goblins VS Punishing Jund

GAME1

http://youtu.be/tfkDdjbuTkg

GAME2,3

http://youtu.be/TaDwYfsy0pk

[Sandro95]

Wait what, where there three Goblin players there, I missed that.

I think he was talking about the legacy local last wednesday, not the GPT. :)

[ScatmanX]

MTG Legacy: Goblins VS Punishing Jund

GAME1

http://youtu.be/tfkDdjbuTkg

GAME2,3

http://youtu.be/TaDwYfsy0pk
Nice games.
- You could flash your initial hand, so we can evaluate your decisions better.
- Agree with your Matron theory. It's the last card to use, unless you're going to kill him with it.
- Your play G2 was good. Don't think I'd do anything different. He had the nuts.
- G3 casting Kinesis was strange. If he'd block with Bob, thats fine. If he didn't, then you win. Still, bad bad keep from your opponent. That game would never happen in a tournament.

Keep'em coming! And show us your initial hand!

[AlbyLegacy]

Nice games.
- You could flash your initial hand, so we can evaluate your decisions better.
- Agree with your Matron theory. It's the last card to use, unless you're going to kill him with it.
- Your play G2 was good. Don't think I'd do anything different. He had the nuts.
- G3 casting Kinesis was strange. If he'd block with Bob, thats fine. If he didn't, then you win. Still, bad bad keep from your opponent. That game would never happen in a tournament.

Keep'em coming! And show us your initial hand!

yea, G2 I over did it. I could of just gempalmed the BOB and connected with the instigator. I guess I saw a blow out and went for it. his hand I think was 5 cards. so it was a ruff keep.


as for showing my hand, I am gonna try recording with the cam in a view where you guys can see the hand way better.


thanks!

[GoboLord]

as for showing my hand, I am gonna try recording with the cam in a view where you guys can see the hand way better.


Another idea would be to show you opening hand in the camera and then show each card you draw to the camera. This will give us a lot of information.

[BaroqueW]

Hi BaroqueW :) Also, how did Purphoros work out for you? I'm quite curious.

Last week I was playing with 2 in the mainboard but that is simply too few, I never hit them. Since it's not a goblin, you can't tutor for it and it gets tucked under by ringleader. Now I am playing 3 mainboard. I also pack Krenko and 2 MWM so I can get some good value for it. It seems to be usually unexpected: when I drop him, they don't look at him until I lay out a guy and call out 2 damage. It never got exiled/sacced so far once it hit the board. I usually board him out G2/3 except against pox to make some space without dropping my goblin count.
Overall I am quite happy with him, but at least part of that is a bit subjective.


@virre EDIT: didn't see Sandro95 already caught that


I think he was talking about the legacy local last wednesday, not the GPT. :)

Yes, I meant the legacy local event, not GPT.

[AlbyLegacy]

Another idea would be to show you opening hand in the camera and then show each card you draw to the camera. This will give us a lot of information.

Yea, good idea. I can do that.

[max_goblin]

Let me share some stupid thoughts.

We use mana denial so we can slow down other people decks and that is how we have a chance G1 against combo.
Wasteland is very important because we have so many lands that can make our goblins life so harder.. but that is not the same for rishadan port. Look, I love this card, but look at AlbyLegacy games agains jund I have an idea.

Ok its not knew, but I would be glad to see someone take their 3~4 rishadan ports and use 3~4 mutavault instead. Against liliana they are great, I know that is nothing to add, but I am getting very upset trying to mana denial while half of the decks I face use DRS, or dont care about having only 1~2 lands open..

Well, cya and thx for the attention.

[orcanmail]

I am getting very upset trying to mana denial while half of the decks I face use DRS, or dont care about having only 1~2 lands open..
[/QUOTE]

This is why I gave up on Rishadan Ports ages ago, and moved to Tarfires main deck to deal with DRS and mana dorks. I have since included Pyrokenesis to speed up early removal. Mana denial was not working due to the acceleration of other decks. Extra removal and speeding up Goblins with Chrome Moxes and Warren Instigators has been my approach to the problem. I cut vials as they were too slow and less effective without ports in the deck to help make room for these changes.

[LeoCop 90]

I am getting very upset trying to mana denial while half of the decks I face use DRS, or dont care about having only 1~2 lands open.. .

This is why gobolord and scatmanx advocate chrome mox lists. Mana denial is not very good at the moment so, if we can't slow down the opponent, we can try to accelerate our own gameplan. You can notice how their lists drop rishadan ports and also some wastelands.
The opposite route is playing thalia, that means exasperating mana denial so that it will have some impact on the game most of the time.

Regarding mutavault, i think that it can be played in the deck, but it won't be nothing special, just a mere 2/2 goblin. Well, 3/3 with chieftain, and have sinergy with piledriver and incinerator, but it won't be as effective as it is in merfolk where it can become easily 4/4 or 5/5. Maybe try putting it in a list with 4 chieftains.

[AlbyLegacy]

I am getting very upset trying to mana denial while half of the decks I face use DRS, or dont care about having only 1~2 lands open..


This is why I gave up on Rishadan Ports ages ago, and moved to Tarfires main deck to deal with DRS and mana dorks. I have since included Pyrokenesis to speed up early removal. Mana denial was not working due to the acceleration of other decks. Extra removal and speeding up Goblins with Chrome Moxes and Warren Instigators has been my approach to the problem. I cut vials as they were too slow and less effective without ports in the deck to help make room for these changes.[/QUOTE]

Pyrokenesis main deck is my favorite .

[snorlaxcom]

MTG Legacy: Goblins VS Punishing Jund

GAME1

http://youtu.be/tfkDdjbuTkg

GAME2,3

http://youtu.be/TaDwYfsy0pk

Are you playing any sided games to test what cards are more effective or just testing the maindeck in your games?

[max_goblin]

.

This is why gobolord and scatmanx advocate chrome mox lists. Mana denial is not very good at the moment so, if we can't slow down the opponent, we can try to accelerate our own gameplan. You can notice how their lists drop rishadan ports and also some wastelands.
The opposite route is playing thalia, that means exasperating mana denial so that it will have some impact on the game most of the time.

Regarding mutavault, i think that it can be played in the deck, but it won't be nothing special, just a mere 2/2 goblin. Well, 3/3 with chieftain, and have sinergy with piledriver and incinerator, but it won't be as effective as it is in merfolk where it can become easily 4/4 or 5/5. Maybe try putting it in a list with 4 chieftains.

Well, my idea would be bring chieftain to 4, and MD one Boartusk Liege, so we can fight the -1/-1 MD people are bringing in. Mutavault is usefull not only because it can get 3/3 or more, but we have gempalm, piledriver and krenko. But what I like the most, is that sorcery removal is not a problem anymore. They can clear our board but we still have at least a 2/2 next turn, that is what I had in mind.

And about chrome mox, I agree, I am trying to find some space to bring 2 to my list, perhaps 3.
Thankyou.

[AlbyLegacy]

Are you playing any sided games to test what cards are more effective or just testing the maindeck in your games?

Just testing main deck for now till I decide on a solid list. Soon I'll be testing with sideboard cards.

[FTW]

MTG Legacy: Goblins VS Punishing Jund

GAME1

http://youtu.be/tfkDdjbuTkg

GAME2,3

http://youtu.be/TaDwYfsy0pk

Overall the Jund player was pretty bad. After this and the burn video I wonder if you should be testing against better players? Would make for more interesting videos and probably better testing experiences for you too! Still, thanks for posting vids!

+1 on flashing opening hand. More info is good!

Game 1:
Well played in the end! Agreed on slow-playing Matron. IMO you got lucky that the Punishing Jund player practically didn't interact with you at all. If the Jund player put more pressure on or got Punishing combo online earlier or killed/discarded more things, I think you would have lost that match because for several turns you were just roadblocked and stalling out. They have a better long-game than Goblins (PFire combo, DRS, Liliana, Bob) and your list doesn't have Wasteland to kill Grove so stalling out can be really dangerous. In the end, it did work out for you. But instead of sandbagging the Tarfires so long I would have double Tarfired the Goyf on turn 2. At that stage in the game I think it's the safer game plan. Yes, Goyf would grow to 3/4 but it would also die and you would have connected with Lackey on turn 2, dropping either Krenko or Ringleader (don't know which you would have had in hand then) for a HUGE tempo swing. Like you said, even one Lackey connection can end the game. When opponent drops the second Goyf, it would be stuck trying to block Lackey and you could just plow through with other stuff for an earlier win. IMO the Tarfires have so much more value when used to ensure Lackey connections than when killing attacking 3/2 hastes. But still, nice win in the end.

Game 2:
I would Tarfire the DRS on turn 1 if both:
-there were any fetches in any graveyards
-you were running Wastes/Ports and trying to play a mana denial game

I would Vial first if:
-on the draw. T2 Vial on the draw is REALLY SLOW
-few lands in hand
-few lands in decklist in general

So in your case, T1 Vial. DRS blocking 1/1s isn't really a reason to kill it so soon because you could just play turn 1 Lackey, turn 2 Tarfire the DRS and attack. The only reason to kill DRS on turn 1 is to stop him from getting 3 mana on turn 2. This is less likely with 0 fetches in graveyards so far. As for fetchlands, he could (and did) play one on turn 2 enabling a T2 Liliana if DRS was alive. That would have been rough. But killing DRS only holds him back one turn, and without more of a mana denial plan or any tempo tools on the board (Lackey/Vial), buying the 1 turn doesn't do much for you. You basically just trade turns (you waste a turn Tarfiring, he loses a turn on Liliana but still gets to Hymn you, DRS dies either way), so you come out behind. Stalling only works if you already have Lackey or Vial on the board to buy you tempo. Doesn't matter though, in the end he had the nuts and he probably wins either way. But in general, with the information you have on turn 1, I think Vial helps you more.


Game 3:
Siege-Gang seems like a fine choice. I probably would have grabbed Chieftain. It does 4 things:
-buff your WInstigator for an extra point of damage in regular combat. each damage counts!
-get your Krenko online immediately, none o that summoning sickness
-make your tokens that much scarier
-buff Krenko out of Lightning Bolt range
But SGC+Krenko is pretty brutal too, especially against 1 Basic Forest. Either way you win.

[AlbyLegacy]

Let me share some stupid thoughts.

We use mana denial so we can slow down other people decks and that is how we have a chance G1 against combo.
Wasteland is very important because we have so many lands that can make our goblins life so harder.. but that is not the same for rishadan port. Look, I love this card, but look at AlbyLegacy games agains jund I have an idea.

Ok its not knew, but I would be glad to see someone take their 3~4 rishadan ports and use 3~4 mutavault instead. Against liliana they are great, I know that is nothing to add, but I am getting very upset trying to mana denial while half of the decks I face use DRS, or dont care about having only 1~2 lands open..

Well, cya and thx for the attention.

Yea, I like the mutavault idea.

[AlbyLegacy]

@FTW. Thanks a lot for taking the time to write a great feedback on the games. You make a lot of good points. Since this list I am running is new to me and I am testing it. I do find my self playing differently.

I will be showing my opening hands. Too.

Thanks again.

[AznSeal]

Hello

I tried the Instigator Chrome Mox list and here it is:

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
1 Stingscourger
4 Warren Instigator
2 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Matron
3 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

4 Chrome Mox
4 Aether Vial
2 Tarfire

1 Arid Mesa
4 Auntie's Hovel
1 Bloodstained Mire
2 Badlands
2 Mountain
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
1 Wooded Foothills
Sideboard:
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Engineered Plague
1 Warren Weirding
1 Pyroblast
2 Relic of Progenitus

Some comments: Boy is this deck explosive. The best thing I did was on the draw when I did a wasteland, chrome mox, lackey, go. It was insane. The only problem is that I feel like I lose to FoW more easily. Getting a turn 1 Lackey FoWed is nowhere near as bad as having a turn 1 Instigator FoWed since you're trying to go all in.

Has there been any success with lists that utilize Chrome Moxes but recovers better than if an all-in with Instigator fails? I was thinking of maybe more removal instead of instigators and try to push through with a turn 1 lackey because it seems to me that Instigator is more of a "win more" card. I may be wrong because I am still inexperienced with this list.

Currently my main list is a R/W list with Thalia, Ports, and I try to go the heavy denial/control route but it seems like if I like that, I might as well just play DnT since it does it better. Is the explosive route better?

EDIT: My old list for reference

1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Stingscourger
2 Siege-Gang Commander
3 Mogg War Marshal
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Aether Vial
1 Plateau
3 Arid Mesa
3 Mountain
3 Wooded Foothills
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
1 Tarfire
1 Warren Weirding
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Badlands
2 Gempalm Incinerator
Sideboard:
2 Relic of Progenitus
3 Pyroblast
3 Pyrokinesis
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Wear // Tear

[Vandalize]

Has there been any success with lists that utilize Chrome Moxes but recovers better than if an all-in with Instigator fails? I was thinking of maybe more removal instead of instigators and try to push through with a turn 1 lackey because it seems to me that Instigator is more of a "win more" card. I may be wrong because I am still inexperienced with this list.

You can speed up the deck without going all-in. Something like this:

Lands [20]
4 Wasteland
4 Auntie's Hovel
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Badlands
4 Mountain

Creatures [30]
4 Goblin Lackey
3 Warren Instigator
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Goblin Chieftain
3 Goblin Warchief
2 Siege-Gang Commander
2 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger

Spells [10]
4 AEther Vial
3 Chrome Mox
2 Tarfire
1 Warren Weirding

Sideboard [15]
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Pyrokinesis
2 Blood Moon/TukTuk Scrapper
1 Earwig Squad
1 Goblin Sharpshooter

I don't know, this list seems more resilient than 4 mox/4 instigator ones.

[Asgar]

Seeing all these Chrome Mox Lists i thought: Why pass on the best disruptive Start Legacy has to offer MD?

Mana:
3 Chrome Mox
3 Mountain
1 Swamp
3 Badlands
6 Fetches
3 Cavern of Souls
3 Wasteland

Non-Gobs;
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Aether Vial

Critter:
4 Lackey
3 Winstigator
3 Piledriver
2 Warchief
4 Chieftain
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
1 Krenko
1 Scrapper
1 Earwig Squad

Removel:
3 Warren Weirding
2 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger

These Are 62 at the Moment.
What do you think about the Idea?
What else could i cut?

[AlbyLegacy]

Seeing all these Chrome Mox Lists i thought: Why pass on the best disruptive Start Legacy has to offer MD?

Mana:
3 Chrome Mox
3 Mountain
1 Swamp
3 Badlands
6 Fetches
3 Cavern of Souls
3 Wasteland

Non-Gobs;
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Aether Vial

Critter:
4 Lackey
3 Winstigator
3 Piledriver
2 Warchief
4 Chieftain
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
1 Krenko
1 Scrapper
1 Earwig Squad

Removel:
3 Warren Weirding
2 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger

These Are 62 at the Moment.
What do you think about the Idea?
What else could i cut?

I seen list with chalice. they run ancient tombs as well. seems legit.

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I went to a GPT for GP Paris today. 30 players participated in the event.

R1 Maverick with Dark Depths + Thesbian Stage combo 2-0
This is a pretty good matchup. I won one game because my opponent forgot his trigger on SoFI, leaving me at 2 life.
1-0

R2 Burn 2-1
This wasn't your usual burn list, and it was a bit outdated, playing cards like Ball Lightning and Earthquake.
2-0

R3 Grixis Delver/Pyromancer 1-1
We go to time. In round five of time I play a Ringleader and miss. I attacked him down to 3 (he blocked with pyromancer +elemental). The fifth card on top was Tarfire. I had an Engineered Plague and four mana at the time.
2-0-1

R4 Junk 1-2
I win game 1 by connecting with lackey and wastelanding him out of the game.
I lose game 2 & 3 to Engineered Plague + Humility
2-1-1

R5 Miracles 2-1
He gets rip + energyfield online g1.
G2 I play a chieftain with only one red source. We realise it later and ask the judge about it and there's no backing up. I think I would likely still have won this game, but it doesn't feel as good. Big thanks to my opponent for being such a nice guy about it!
I won G3, don't remember anything special happening in this game.
3-1-1

I make top 8 as the 8th player in the standings.

Top 8

R1 UWr stoneforge, TNN, top, supreme verdict 2-0
He's low on lands g2. I wasteland his tundra and play a scrapper to get his batterskull. He vials in jitte and trades his sfm for my ringleader, but I have so much gas and he's stuck on two lands for quite a while.

R2 Grixis Delver/Pyromancer - same guy as before 2-1
G3 was really interesting. I played cavern, lackey. He played bolt, wasteland my cavern. I topdeck land and get a vial dazed. Luckily I draw another land, and play a chalice for one, which he dazes. He then Surgically extracts it and cabal therapy me for the engineered plague that he saw. A turn later he flashbacks it hitting my two ringleaders. We keep on grinding until I have seven or eight lands in play and after a while I manage to pull it out.

Finals storm
G1 my opponent cast Ad Nauseam at 18 life and even though he doesn't hit very well he untaps and kills me next turn.
G2 he went of t1. I misplayed by not playing chalice right away, although this perticular time it wouldn't have mattered.

So, second place. No byes for GP Paris though. ;)

I played the same list as last time.
4 Aether Vial
4 Golblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
2 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War Marshall
2 Goblin Warchief
3 Goblin Chieftain
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Siege-Gang Commander

1 Tarfire
1 Warren Weirding
4 Gempalm Incinerator

4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Badlands
4 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Arid Mesa
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Bloodstained Mire

Sideboard
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Perish
1 Boartusk Liege
1 Shattering Spree
1 Engineered Plague

[LeoCop 90]

For the ones interested in lists with chalice, chrome mox, ancient tomb, you might like this :

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19745-Deck-Dragon-Stompy/page63

you can read a couple of lists of what they call "goblin stompy" , a variation of dragon stompy based on Moggcatcher . But it is a completely different deck than goblins.

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I've got a short report for you! :)

R1 Dredge 2-0
Removal is pretty good at controlling bridges ;)

R2 Stoneblade 2-0
G1 He is stuck on one land for a while while I'm stuck on two. I start bringing in the beats while he is on defense. G2 was pretty similar.

R3 Merfolk 0-2 - Dafuq?
I don't know what happened here, although he was really fast especially G2. I guess cutting the 2-mana slot punished me here, as both Mogg War Marshal and Piledriver work wonders in the matchup.

R4 Jund 0-2 (sigh)
Not a good matchup. However, I almost pulled G1 out. He killed me with two bolts, otherwise I would have gotten to go Warchief > Matron > Krenko and might have turned the game around. G2 didn't go very well, as I was on defense the whole time.

Thought: The Jund matchup is quite difficult, if anyone has any ideas on how to beat it I'd love to hear them. Losing against merfolk felt pretty lousy, although I guess it happened. I didn't notice any missplays that match though, maybe it was just variance. Still, I'd prefer to learn something from every game I play.

[lavafrogg]

Goblins should always start with 4 waste 4 port 4 vial after that I can see changes but goblins has been strong for years starting with mana disruption. Changing that seems like a no go to me.

[B-rad]

Hi everyone, I've got a short report for you! :) R1 Dredge 2-0 Removal is pretty good at controlling bridges ;) R2 Stoneblade 2-0 G1 He is stuck on one land for a while while I'm stuck on two. I start bringing in the beats while he is on defense. G2 was pretty similar. R3 Merfolk 0-2 - Dafuq? I don't know what happened here, although he was really fast especially G2. I guess cutting the 2-mana slot punished me here, as both Mogg War Marshal and Piledriver work wonders in the matchup. R4 Jund 0-2 (sigh) Not a good matchup. However, I almost pulled G1 out. He killed me with two bolts, otherwise I would have gotten to go Warchief > Matron > Krenko and might have turned the game around. G2 didn't go very well, as I was on defense the whole time. Thought: The Jund matchup is quite difficult, if anyone has any ideas on how to beat it I'd love to hear them. Losing against merfolk felt pretty lousy, although I guess it happened. I didn't notice any missplays that match though, maybe it was just variance. Still, I'd prefer to learn something from every game I play. Jund is a pretty nasty matchup but it's not unwinnable. G1 it's usually about whether they are able to Abrupt Decay your vial as it far and away the best card against them. If it lives you can usually push far enough ahead and kill them. Postboard I like to board out all the Lackeys and some Piledrivers for 3 Relics and 3 Pyrokinesis. Relic is just so good vs their entire deck and combos nicely with Pyrokinesis to kill Goyfs. A nice little trick when casting Pyrokinesis with relic out(killing one or more Tarmogoyfs) is to pop the relic and hold priority and cast the Pyro. This prevents any card from possibly going to the graveyard to grow the Goyf(s) back to a toughness that lets them live :)

[B-rad]

Also I am going to start playing these little monsters again. I have been playing Rug lately but with all these Dark Depths/Lands decks running around the temptation is too strong! I'll share my list once I get one together and let you guys know leading up to SCG St. Louis here in a couple of weeks. Cheers!

[GoboLord]

Jund is a pretty nasty matchup but it's not unwinnable. G1 it's usually about whether they are able to Abrupt Decay your vial as it far and away the best card against them. If it lives you can usually push far enough ahead and kill them. Postboard I like to board out all the Lackeys and some Piledrivers for 3 Relics and 3 Pyrokinesis. Relic is just so good vs their entire deck and combos nicely with Pyrokinesis to kill Goyfs. A nice little trick when casting Pyrokinesis with relic out(killing one or more Tarmogoyfs) is to pop the relic and hold priority and cast the Pyro. This prevents any card from possibly going to the graveyard to grow the Goyf(s) back to a toughness that lets them live :)

IRT the bold part.
I think exactly the opposite is true: Aether Vial is the WORST card against Jund, which is why I board it out after G1.
There are 2 reasons for that. First, Abrupt Decay @ Aether Vial with 1 or 2 counters is a huge tempo loss. I don't want to spend my valuable first or second turn casting Aether Vial just to get nothing in return (this is a worst-case scenario of course). Second, I feel like casting Vials against a deck with discard spells is a LOSE-LOSE situation. You intentionally reduce your handsize by 1 for a card that only bcomes valuable at the moment you bring a cmc3/4 creature into play. However, at the same time you give your opponent the chance to hit you with Thoughtseize and Hymn to Tourarch even harder.

I wonder why we have such a totally different view on the MU?
My theory would be that our lists are different. The last list that you posted was a MonoR lists with 4 Tarfire and 4 Chieftain (0 Warchiefs), 4 Wasteland, 4 Ports, if I remember correctly. If that is still the list you are refferring to here, I can see why you keep in Vials. This list was perfect to aggressively aim at their mana (Relic of Progenitus SB, no fetchlands --> no fodder for DRS; Tarfire in MD, Pyrokinesis in SB --> no manaramping with DRS). With this strategy Vials are surely invaluable.
Am I right here?

(Just for refference: I'm currently on a Rb list with 4 Warren Instigator and 3-4 Chrome Moxen, 3 Wasteland, no Ports. Ergo: no manadenial plan, which makes Vial less useful).

[cronos]

Updated my listing of results (here (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-DTB-Goblins&p=751262#post751262)) with new results against many decks!

- Sixth update (1-30-2014)
Few changes in my sideboard.
vs. Imperial Painter: 2-1/2-1/2-0
vs. BUG Control: 2-0
vs. Threshold UGr: 2-1/2-0
vs. Bant: 2-1
vs. GWB Maverick: 2-0
vs. Nic Scapeshift: 1-2/2-1
vs. Belcher: 0-2/0-2
vs. Team America: 2-0

Sorry for the delay, but I have been very busy. Regards.

[Quackers]

Hey all,
New to posting in the thread. Was wondering what you all thought of punishing//grove combo in goblins. Too much?

[FTW]

Hey all,
New to posting in the thread. Was wondering what you all thought of punishing//grove combo in goblins. Too much?

I posted a Punishing Goblins deck pretty recently, but untested. Tarfire is probably better and has been putting up results, although I think there has also been a lack of Goblins players seriously trying out PFire.

PFire
-costs 1 more
-not flipped off Ringleader
-not tutorable
-lategame recursion to blow away blockers

I think it's more important for us to remove weenie blockers on turn 2-3 than at any other stage in the game, but there may be situations where lategame PFire recursion wins games. I wonder if that's greater than the number of situations where you can't resolve PFire but could resolve TFire.

You should test it and post results!

[Sandro95]

Jund is a pretty nasty matchup but it's not unwinnable. G1 it's usually about whether they are able to Abrupt Decay your vial as it far and away the best card against them. If it lives you can usually push far enough ahead and kill them. Postboard I like to board out all the Lackeys and some Piledrivers for 3 Relics and 3 Pyrokinesis. Relic is just so good vs their entire deck and combos nicely with Pyrokinesis to kill Goyfs. A nice little trick when casting Pyrokinesis with relic out(killing one or more Tarmogoyfs) is to pop the relic and hold priority and cast the Pyro. This prevents any card from possibly going to the graveyard to grow the Goyf(s) back to a toughness that lets them live :)

I see vial as a necessary card against them if we want to win by swarming the board with creatures. Vial does a really good job at helping us put multiple goblins onto the battlefield in one turn. However, I can see Gobolord's point too. I think that Vial is likely less usefull in the more aggressive winstigator lists that are also playing Chrome Mox and are more capable of going the aggressive route.

Question: Would you also board out Lackey on the play? It seems as if connecting with a Lackey would be a good way to steal a game from them. Would you consider this a valid reason to keep Lackey in, or would it just be better to go all in on playing the grindier game? Either way, I see it as a tough battle for us, jund really has a lot of effective tools for grinding us out with all their removals, hymns, Bobs and Goyfs etc.

[LeoCop 90]

I think that vs jund vial is our best card in game 1, in the sense that it is one of our only hopes. If vial stays on the battlefield we can manage to play an "unfair" game and beat their higher card quality. Of course there is always the risk of vial being destroyed by a decay, but if it doesn't happen we can steal the game.

However in game 2 and 3, when we can side in graveyard hate and pyrokinesis, i think that is correct to board out vial because now we have a way to beat their higher card quality playing fair. Plus, vial gets worse when we are siding out creatures.

Anyway i recall the stream of the last starcitygames open won by max tietze. He beat jund both in the semifinals and in the finals, and vial was by far the best card in those matchups together with siege-gang. Of course vial is less effective if we are playing less wasteland/rishadan ports.

I would always side out lackey on the draw, but i'd keep him in on the play because their only answers are bolt and deathrite shaman (which is not an answer if we have tarfire/pyrokinesis).

And (probably i'm saying something obvious) a key to winning the matchup is killing dark confidant... we really can't beat them if they are drawing 2 cards per turn.

[jrw1985]

It's been quite a while since I've played any Magic (house-hunting, wedding-planning, and learning a new job right now), but I had a free evening Wednesday night and resolved to make the trek to my local game store. Mead Hall Games in downtown Minneapolis has built a very competitive, fun and engaging Legacy scene the past six months with their $15 Wednesday night tournament. 4-0 has a $100 payout, so players feel like there is actually something at stake, and the higher buy-in + downtown location has resulted in a more mature player base (AKA- no rounds where you're sitting across from someone with unsleeved cards or a severely under-optimized deck). I pulled my Goblin deck out of my Magic closet after work and put together the following list:

4 Vial
4 Lackey
3 Piledriver
3 Thalia
2 Chieftain
4 Warchief
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
2 Krenko

3 Tarfire
2 Gempalm
1 Stingscourger
1 Tuktuk

4 Waste
3 Port
1 Karakas
4 Cavern
3 Plateau
4 Mountain
4 Fetch

My main adjustment was cutting Mogg War Marshall from the list. MWM was great when everyone was playing Goyf and Mongoose, but he doesn't bring much to the table when you're facing down Delver, DRS, and SFM-enabled equipment. MWM is a clearly defensive card, but it now does a poor job defending against the most popular threats in the format.

Gemplam Incinerator also got cut down a bit. I've advocated running no less than 4 many times in the past, but the format has accelerated and Gempalm is now too slow. I kept two in the list for some mid-game card advantage, but Tarfire is now the primary early game removal of choice.

Sideboard
1 Mindbreak Trap
2 Chalice of the Void
1 Ethersworn Cannonist
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Sudden Demise
3 Wear // Tear
3 Rest in Peace
1 Relic of Progenitus

R1 - Death and Taxes
G1 - I'm on the draw and get lucky because my opponent's opener is Plains, pass. I play a Vial and we're off to the races. He eventually gets his double-striker in play and puts a Jitte on it. I Vial in a Matron to block it and search up a Tuktuk which I use to win the game after that. Without his Jitte he just couldn't get his game going and I won through developing a superior board position.
G2 - I mulled to 5 on the draw. This game was actually close until I made a major strategic error. My opponent played Vial T1, then SFM > Sword of Fire and Ice T2. At the end of my T2 he activated Vial and put Mom into play. I Pyro'd his board. T3 he was stuck on two lands. At the end of my turn he Vialed in Serra Avenger. A Tuktuk Scrapper found his way into my hand and I had the choice of either blowing up his Vial or waiting for his SoFaI to his the board and blow up that instead. I chose to blast his Vial and he ripped a land next turn and cast the Sword. Once he equiped the Avenger next turn there was nothing I could do to get back in it. I vaguely recall losing to Death and Taxes in a similar manner before. If you find yourself with the option of blowing up equipment or a Vial you should probably wait for the equipment (unless your opponent is seriously mana screwed, like only 1 land on T3).
G3 - I had a good hand with a high curve and double Vial but no removal. I knew I was dead to Revoker but otherwise the hand was fantastic for this MU. Well, he played Revoker T2 and I never ripped removal. It was still a good keep. He just had the answers. That happens sometimes in Magic.
0-1

R2 - Elves
G1 - I'm on the draw again. My opponent opened with Bayou, pass. I had a Wasteland in hand and blew up his Bayou. His slow start became significantly slower. He played T2 Dryad Arbor. I Tarfired it. He played T3 Cradle. I played Lackey, and Lackey connected the next turn for Krenko. Port kept his Cradle out of the equation and I pulled out the G1 win (and increasingly rare feat against Elves).
G2 - We both mulled to 6. I got a 2:1 against him thanks to Sudden Demise. Bounce effects saved him from a 3:1. Thanks to his bounced elf he was able to get back in the game and Hoofed me to death. I hate that card.
G3 - Ethersworn Cannonist! That card is pretty legit. Played it T2 and the Elves player never got in the game.
1-1

R3 - Jund
G1 - I was on the play and started with a T1 Lackey. My opponent's T1 wasn't strong enough to prevent me from Lackeying in Krenko T2, so I won the game quickly off of Krenko.
G2 - He played T1 Bayou, pass. Deja Vu. I T1 Wasted, and once again my opponent was unable to recover. Wasteland STILL wins games.
2-1

R4 - Storm
G1 - I mulled to 5 and could not find a Lackey or Thalia. L
G2 - My opening hand had Thalia and Mindbreak Trap. He hit my Thalia T1 with Cabal Therapy and hit my Trap T2 with another Therapy. The game was pretty much over at that point. There was one turn where I could have Wasted his Underground Sea, but instead I cast a Piledriver. I chose putting on a clock over mana disruption. Going for mana disruption instead might have bought me another turn, but it wouldn't have won the game anyway.
2-2

Overall the deck felt pretty good. I liked playing 6 haste-lords. Running fewer removal pieces was good too. And Krenko is still the shit. Sudden Demise is a great sideboard card and I've gotten a lot of value out of it.

MWM was not missed. Our 2cc slots are the obvious focal point where Goblins has been out-paced by the format. Lackey is still awesome, as are the 3cc+ cards, but Piledriver, MWM and Winstigator are significantly underpowered. Now, more than ever, Goblins could really use a 2-drop that is good at killing artifacts and attacking. Piledriver isn't good enough on offense, MWM isn't good enough on defense, and Winstigator doesn't justify his RR cost. Unfortunately there's not much we can do except wait for the next set and hope. Which just isn't very fun.

[Chatto]

Maybe a weird suggestion, but here one crazy idea for those toying with an black splash: why not use Toxic Deluge as an SB-option?

If played correctly, we should be able to recover much easier than our opponent. Now I don't own Badlands or else would already experiment with it myself.

[jrw1985]

Maybe a weird suggestion, but here one crazy idea for those toying with an black splash: why not use Toxic Deluge as an SB-option?

If played correctly, we should be able to recover much easier than our opponent. Now I don't own Badlands or else would already experiment with it myself.

Toxic deluge is too harmful for us. It's a non goblin card that thins our deck and if we resolve it Deluge kills our own cards. It's card disadvantage and thins our deck. So it's a slower, off color pyrokinesis. And, unlike Pyro, it won't let you clear your opponent's blockers to get a Lackey through. That's a pretty big strike against it. The only deck that I've seen running Deluge is Jund, because Jund can take advantage of Deluge's synergy with Bloodbraid Elf, and Goyf is generally big enough to be the last creature standby after deluge resolves. Goblins has none of those synergies with deluge.

[Chatto]

Of course you are right, but with people playing four Chieftains you could theoretically make Deluge a one-sided sweeper. And yes this really is hypothetical speaking.

[jrw1985]

Of course you are right, but with people playing four Chieftains you could theoretically make Deluge a one-sided sweeper. And yes this really is hypothetical speaking.

If we're speaking in hypotheticals then they can hypothetically cast removal on your chieftain in response to deluge and wipe your board anyway. Not likely in any case.

[FTW]

Why Toxic Deluge? Why not just play...Meekstone!

No, seriously. It does nothing to us (unless 2 hastelords out) and locks out tons of relevant creatures in the format. I don't get why hating on Piledriver.

[GoboLord]

Why Toxic Deluge? Why not just play...Meekstone!

No, seriously. It does nothing to us (unless 2 hastelords out) and locks out tons of relevant creatures in the format. I don't get why hating on Piledriver.

On Toxic Deluge: I agree with what jrw1985 wrote in his second last posting.

On Meekstone: First of all I don't see too many "big" creatures lately - and only few of them are affected by Meekstone. I mean, Emrakul, Griselbrand, and a Germ Token carrying a Batterskull don't really give a shit. That leaves me with onyl two creatures: Tarmogofy and Insectile Abberation. Thats too few to even consider Meekstone.
Second, he problem that we have with opponent's creatures is usually that they sit still instead of attacking. So, to me a creature is really annoying if my opponent won't attack with it (like Stonefore Mystic, Death Rite Shaman, Wall-o-Goyf) because that means I can't puh my damage through properly. Goblins are very deadly when your opponent slips and sends one more creature attacking than he should (aka when he leaves too few blockers behind). Meekstone does nothing to get us past blockers. What we need, when we want to handle creatures, is something that makes blockers disappear (aka. spotremoval).

[FTW]

That leaves me with onyl two creatures: Tarmogofy and Insectile Abberation. Thats too few to even consider Meekstone.

True-Name Nemesis? Lorded Merfolks? Sword-carrying anything? Jundbraid Elf? Spirit of the Whydidn'tyouboardthisout? Venereal Clique? Flickerwhoops?

Agreed removal is usually better. I mean for when Goblins cannot remove the creature for one red mana. Perhaps those creatures out of Tarfire range are so hard to remove in general that it is not worth playing a mediocre card for them.

[GoboLord]

0. Update notes

February 6th 2014
* updated the tournament report section
* minor changes to the ""To-be-tested" card list

[ScatmanX]

Went to 3 tournaments the past 4 weeks, going 0-4, 1-3 and 2-2 respectively, so guess I'm improving =]

1st one was Rw Restoration deck. Lost to Merfolk (TNN), then won 3 games for fun. To uwr Delver (TNN again). Here I mulled to 5 G1 and almost had it. Had I had Tuktuk MD I'd pull it of), AnT (got zero cards from the 8 I have on the SB, and LD wasn't enough) and Esper because drew extremely poorly (all Jaces activations kept the card on top).

2nd was Rb Instigator list. Lost to UW Miracles to poor sideboarding (brought Cabal Therapy and should have been CotV. Therapy was fine, but CotV was awesome on the other games we played). Lost against Esper Stoneblade due to mulliganing and not founding Weirdings. Lost to something else. Won against somthing else.

3rd one Won against Esperblade. G1 he delt with 2 lackeys (while slowing himself down) while I had 0 other goblins on my hand, then started to draw gas. 2nd I mulled, then dres exctly what I needed every turn. Lost to Lands. Won G1 due To Lackey>Waste>Chieftain>Piledriver. Then lost to a lock twice. both games Wear/Tear/Oblicion Ring (total of 4) and Wasteland would have won me, but never drew them. Then lost to Bug Delver due to muligan, mistakesand tight play from my opponent. Then won against Folk.

Did not find Phurporos yet, but when I do, surly will be playing them.
Still prefer the Restoration Goblins above others. There were some insane plays like using Krenko 2 times in a turn, comboing, saving Thalia from Golgari Charm, and others. Frogtosser felt bad, but helped me win 2 games in testing, where with 3 mana I managed to Matron>Weirdings 2 turns in a row against TNN with a Jitte on the table. But, also in testing, lost 4 games to the mirror...

Well, just sharing some bad results from 2014 =]

[GoboLord]

2nd was Rb Instigator list. Lost to UW Miracles to poor sideboarding (brought Cabal Therapy and should have been CotV. Therapy was fine, but CotV was awesome on the other games we played).

Tough luck.
Can you elaborate a little more on the bold part? What did your decklist look like? How was Chalice effective here (I assume it was meant to shut down Brainstorm, StoP and Sensei'S Divinig Top)? Intuitively I would say that you don't bring in any SB cards, but then again you will always have 1-3 spotremoval cards that are "dead" draws (Warren Weirding, Stingscourger, Tarfire). I'm really curious to see your decklist!

[ScatmanX]

@Gobbolord: The decklist was this:
2 Wasteland
4 Badlands
4 Cavern of Souls
6 Fetchland
3 Mountain
3 Chrome Mox

3 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Warren Instigator
3 Gobin Piledriver
3 Frogtosser Banneret
4 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker

3 Warrens Weirdings
2 Gempalm Incinerator
3 Tarfire
SB
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Chalice of the Void

2 Perish

1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Earwig Squad
1 Wort, Boggart Auntie

2 Pithing Needle
Against Miracles the 1st game was ridiculous, and I ended up winning with a Frogtosser and 2 1/1 tokens I had from Weirdings my other Frogtosser after he cast E.E @2.
Game 2 brought 2 Needle, Squad, 4 Therapy. Took out all removal and 1 Instigator.
G2 Kept Mox, Gator, Matron, Ringleader and 2 lands. Drew land. Decided not to go all in on gator and lose 1 source of C.A. Also, he had kept his 7. Next turn I drew a Therapy. Decided to go for Gator insted. It ate a StP. The deal is that I didn't want to delay Gator so much. Next turn drew Therapy. Cast Therapy and got a Terminus. Played Mox removing Therapy, played Matron for Ringleader, and recaped Therapy (had Clique only). He flipped the Top he had into play and cast Brainstorm. I missed on the Therapy. Ringleaders were not good and that was that. Some StP and Terminuses later I died.
G3 took Therapy out and brought CotV. Got a T2 Chalice, but he had FoW. Had not, he said, he'd lost the game. Miracles plays with the top of their deck, not their hand. CotV shuts down the card that allows him to do that best. Also, G2 if those therapies were Chalices, it would have been super easy. Anyhow, this game managed to get lethan, then got Terminused, then my backup Ringleader got 0 goblins. Still, missplayed going for Lethal by searching a Chieftain and not Ringleader #2. Learned. Still, he playes Moat and Humility with E.Tutor, so there's that...

Still think the sb from the Rw version is the awesomest and playing Restoration Angel is as cool as it gets, so will be doing that again. =]

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone! I just found an interesting website that calculates your win % by format. I think it can be a useful tool for seeing your improvements over time, as your win % increases, check it out!

http://xamleeg.kavu.ru/

[jrw1985]

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?5460-DTBF-Philosophy-amp-Deck-Selection/page4

1) Goblins has fallen off the face of the earth

2) Merfolk is a deck again. Huh.

[prateta]

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?5460-DTBF-Philosophy-amp-Deck-Selection/page4

1) Goblins has fallen off the face of the earth

2) Merfolk is a deck again. Huh.

Sad days for us. At least here in Czech I manage some top 8 with goblins time to time, but it used to be better. Most of the time I finish with even score of win - loss. Goblins ain't doomed yet but we desperately need new cards. Our old cards are good but not even nearly as powerfull as the stuff that's coming out these days (sfm, tnn, batterskull, miracles...). I hold my hopes for the new block, I sincerely wish for a tribal one. It has been a long time since lorwyn.

Sent from my Lenovo S920_ROW using Tapatalk

[ScatmanX]

Well, bought 3 Purphoros, but got lazy to play today. Next week will see how it plays.

[Kayradis]

Hey there,

Long term Elves! and D&T player here. Just finished building Goblins (since I had nothing better to do lately) and after toying with ideas, I ended up wondering if anybody tested with Legion Loyalist?

If yes, what was the outcome of the testing.
If no, why not try it?

I'm all about hearing your ideas/opinions.

Cheers!

[BaroqueW]

Quick report. Went 2-2 today

List:


22 lands

3 Badlands
4 fetch
9 mountain
2 wasteland
4 cavern of souls

4 Goblin lackey
4 Goblin matron
4 Ringleader
4 Goblin chieftain
2 Goblin warchief
2 skirk prospector
1 Krenko. mob boss
3 Gempalm
1 mogg war marshal
1 Tuktuk scrapper
1 ringleader
3 purphoros, god of the forge

4 Aether vial
2 Tarfire
2 Warren weirding

Sideboard
2 confusion in the ranks
1 goblin sharpshooter
1 stingscourger
1 tuktuk scrapper
1 boartusk liege
4 cabal therapy
2 pithing needle
3 pyrokinesis


Match 1: 2-1 against Nic Fit

G1 I established a board position quickly with a Lackey T1 -> Piledriver T2 followed by more cheap guys to get a big Piledriver swing. He had SFM early but Tarfired before BS could hit the board, after that he had no real position on the board.
G2 I get him down to 8 life before he got a Batterskull online. I have a shot at it with Tuktuk but he bounces it and gets it back online too fast for me to go anywhere. He ended at 30 life total.
G3 Thanks to his Veteran explorer I had 6 lands when untapping my third turn, nice to be able to cast Matron and what you fetch in the same turn. He had only a top in play and although he must have seen 20+ cards he never found any removal for my guys. On the last turn, a Warchief allows for Krenko's tokens with haste to finish him.

If Sandro95 posts something about this event, this Nic Fit player was the same as his third matchup.

Match 2: 0-2 against Ant

He went off turn 2/3 each time and the only thing I had against him was Cabal Therapy which I didn't see game 2. I also badly brought in 2 Pithing needle hoping to hit Lion eye's diamond but I was explained it does not work (didn't get to cast them anyway so no regret).

Match 3: 1-2 against Shardless BUG

Game 1 I bring him rapidly down to 1 life pushing through with lackey, ringleader, piledriver, MWM (the two latter as one-ofs in the deck). He then goes on to stabilize with 2 goyfs, liliana and hymn. He goes on to beat me from there.
Game 2 I go Lackey T1 into Krenko T2 and he never gets anywhere.
Game 3 he gets a Jitte off a Shardless agent while he had two Deathrite. He gets 6 counters on Jitte before I play a needle on it (I am at 7 life by then). Question: could he have used the abilities of Jitte in response of me naming Jitte or does he have to do before Jitte resolves? Not that it mattered here because he pick me in two turns for 2 x 2 shamans exiling instants, but I got the impression he chose not to use Jitte. This was the only game I layed a Purphoros on the table and it was useless. I still intend to keep it as my meeting no Pox today feels like an accident.

To be noted that in one game there was a Purphoros in the graveyard, and that's actually an Enchantment to count towards goyf. That and Tribal from tarfire makes for big guys.

Match 4: 2-1 against dredge
Before the event started, I took 2 relics out of my sideboard. Well done sir :-(

Game 1, he comboes on turn two or three and that's just two fast.
Game 2, I don't bring in much except CT (which really doesn't seem like a huge idea since his point is to get things in the yard). Actually it was not that bad here as I named Faithless looting which he had used G1 to set himself up. And I hit one. He did not hit enough mana to flashback it for a while so he was below 10 before he could get going. The turn he went off, he flashbacked a Cabal Therapy, named Ringleader, while he had 3 Zombies on the board. I had in my hand one ringleader, 1 red card, 1 pyrokinesis. My plan was to zap two zombies to prevent him from flashbacking for a Dread return. I must say he played quick on his CT, and I definitely was not quick myself, but he allowed my playing of pyrokinesis although his CT had resolved and my ringleader was in the yard (so I didn't have the priority when I actually cast the pyrokinesis and should have done it immediately in response to his casting of CT before he named the card). Of course there was no stakes here as we were both 1-2 at this stage.
Game 3, he does some Breakthrough and runs Cephalid Coloseum but out of roughly 20 cards he saw, he got no dredge guys in the yard and did not go anywhere. In the meantime he got a beating from Piledriver.

Overall, I got twice Lackey T1 -> Krenko T2 which lead to two victories. I didn't expect TES and had no answers to it. Considering I am not in white, there's no Thalia or Ethersworn Canonist. With an Instigator+Mox list, Earwig Squad could be brought in I expect. Relics could have helped me neutralize his past in flames though. And against dredge they would have been welcome. They feel worth the slots. Note that I had instead brought in the fourth CT and a Stingscourger. I also found myself boarding out the Aether vial systematically G2 and 3 without really missing them. I saw someone having a list with only 3 vials, I am incline to go that way too.

Sandro95: you had some explanations on the merits (or lack there of) of Confusion in the ranks vs. other solutions to SnT. I can honestly say that I didn't catch it all but if you would be so kind as to throw some details and/or pointers here, I would appreciate it! Thanks!

[Sandro95]

Quick report. Went 2-2 today

Match 1: 2-1 against Nic Fit

If Sandro95 posts something about this event, this Nic Fit player was the same as his third matchup.
Sandro95: you had some explanations on the merits (or lack there of) of Confusion in the ranks vs. other solutions to SnT. I can honestly say that I didn't catch it all but if you would be so kind as to throw some details and/or pointers here, I would appreciate it! Thanks!

My point on CitR vs show and tell was that people generally play it because Trickbind is less effective against it, although bounce works if I remember correctly.

I went 2-2 today as well.
R1 Elves 2-1
Having a lot of good sideboard card versus them really helped here. I lost G1, both G2 & 3 he had a needle for sharpshooter, but I had other ways to deal with his creatures. G3 I had the nuts with 2 lands, prospector, chieftain, sharpshooter, perish & engineered plague I think, and drew into chalice + land.

R2 Dark Depths Maverick 1-2
G1 I swarmed the board pretty fast, G2 & 3 he got a Marit Lage into play.

R3 Nic fit 0-2
His deck looked really sweet. I know he has been tuning it for a long time. Double batterskull, multiple Kitchen Finks and Night of Souls betrayal were among the cards he had that are good against us.

R4 I had him on lethal pretty fast G1. G2 I mulliganed to 4 and lost. G3 he mulliganed to 4 and lost. I might post a more detailed report with thoughts on the deck tomorrow, now I gotta go to sleep.

[Chatto]

Anyone rocking GP Paris this weekend? I'm definitely bringing Goblins, but will scout before I decide...

[LeoCop 90]

Hey there,

Long term Elves! and D&T player here. Just finished building Goblins (since I had nothing better to do lately) and after toying with ideas, I ended up wondering if anybody tested with Legion Loyalist?

If yes, what was the outcome of the testing.
If no, why not try it?

I'm all about hearing your ideas/opinions.

Cheers!

When the card was released i played a bit with it, and others tested it more than me. The general consensus is that the card is underwhelming... it has a nice combo with piledriver, and it occasionally makes lingering souls/batterskull tokens useless, but it does nothing as a turn one play and is useless on its own. Who would play raging goblin in legacy? Every removal spell (tarfire, stingscourger,pyrokinesis, lightning bolt,....) is usually better for clearing the way to piledriver, and we already have tools like krenko, mob boss to break board stalls. But, if you really want to alpha strike with a first striking trampling piledriver i think you can run the loyalist as a one-of and tutor for him with matron when needed. For sure he can win games in certain corner cases.

[BaroqueW]

R3 Nic fit 0-2
His deck looked really sweet. I know he has been tuning it for a long time. Double batterskull, multiple Kitchen Finks and Night of Souls betrayal were among the cards he had that are good against us.

Massacre and Toxic deluge in sideboard too. That did clean my board a few times. Night of Souls betrayal lowers the usage of his undying/persist guys though. Mainboard he had Strangleroot geist also; can block your lackey and still leave behind a nice beater for him.
He did tell me that he tuned it in a way that felt good towards Goblin. He did win 3 out of his 5 games against Goblins that evening in fact.

[Kayradis]

So, I played to a 2-2 finish yesterday at one of the LGS Legacy Night.
Was my first time piloting Goblins EVER! Had a blast
Here's the meat!

MD:
4 x Goblin Piledriver
4 x Goblin Lackey
4 x Goblin Ringleader
3 x Goblin Matron
3 x Mogg War Marshal
3 x Gempalm Incinerator
3 x Goblin Warchief
2 x Goblin Chieftain
2 x Siege Gang Commander
1 x Goblin Sharpshooter
1 x Krenko, Mob Boss

3 x Tarfire
4 x Aether Vial

3 x Wooded Foothills
2 x Scalding Tarn
3 x Plateau
4 x Mountain
3 x Cavern Of Souls
4 x Rishadan Port
4 x Wasteland

Yeah....I ran 61 cards, just noticed. An old Elves! habit I guess!

SB:
3 x Rest In Peace
4 x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 x Mindbreak Trap
3 x Ashen Rider
3 x Pyrokinesis


Round 1 : Manaless Dredge

G1 : He reveals 2 x Chancellor of the Annex (WUT?) then proceed to dredge like a baws. I still bring him down to 1 thanks to Piledriver and multiple warchiefs
Out? -3 Gempalm Incinerator
In? +3 Rest In Peace

G2 : T2 RiP?

G3 : I got double RiP in my hand and a fetch to play it next turn.
Cabal Therapy naming RiP?
Good Game Sir.

0-1 / 1-2 Matches
Rd 2 : Sneak And Show

G1 : Mull to 5, on the play, find Lackey, Ringleader and friends, he scoops
Out? -1 Sharpshooter, 3 Tarfire, 3 Gempalm Incinerator
In? +3 Ashen Rider, 4 Thalia

G2 : Can't find shit. Emrakul, tentacules times.

G3 : He opts to go for the S&T but use Probe first.
Sees 2 x Ashen Rider in my hand. Decide to way!
Bring him down to 6 before he Tentacule rapes me.

0-2 / 2-4 Matches

Round 3 : BUG

G1 : He keeps a really shaky hand (3 x Ancestral Vision, 1 x U.Sea, 1 x Daze and some crap), I'm on the play. Cavern, Lackey, Go?
Out? -2 Siege Gang Commander
In? +3 Thalia

G2 : I start chaining Ringleaders on T2 with Lackey. I felt like BUG was an easy match up for the deck. Opinions?

1-2 / 4-4 Matches

Round 4 : BUG (AGAIN!)

This match is a complete repeat of the previous round.

2-2 / 6-4 Matches

Now it's either :
A) BUG players in my area are now familiar against Goblins
B) BUG players in my area shouldn't play BUG

Overall?
I like the deck. Kept greedy hands sometime, but the deck rewards being risky I guess (!?)
Still looking at improving my list. Good thing is it only costed me 200$ for the goblins we didn't had in our card pool.
It's giving me a good break from Elves! and D&T

Cheers!
- Gabe

[ScatmanX]

Hey Gabe! Nice to see new faces here.
Well done in your first run with the deck. Here are some tips for you:
- In Rw, Thalia is actually quite good against Dredge. They usually have 1 land hands, and with a Waste/Port + Thalia, they're not able to flashback Therapy or Dread Return, and that severely hinders their gamepan. Also, Kinesis is a good tool too. You instakill Moebas and Ichorids, or your own dudes during his drawphase so you remove Bridges before they do anything.
- Bug: You got Lackey unaswered twice? No wonder you found it a good MU. It is not awful though. Heavily dependent on their build.
- Don't want to be the guy that says that there is a right number of certain card, but please play 4 Matron. They make the deck as a whole more consistent and improve your 1of quality way more. Play 4.
- Goblins can keep risky hands because it topdecks very well. You can suddenly draw a Ringleader, get 3-4 goblins, and get back in a seemingly lost game. Greatest feeling ever.

Keep throwing little green men at them! o/

[Kayradis]

Thanks for the advices!
I'm fully open to suggestion. I only had 3 Matrons on me at the time (the only one close I could get my hands on was a 7th Foil....no thanks. Ill find my 4th Chinese Urza.)
So Ill probably go back to 4 matron since i just love tutor effect (who doesn't in fact?)

[Olaf Forkbeard]

...

I felt like BUG was an easy match up for the deck. Opinions?

...


Now it's either :
A) BUG players in my area are now familiar against Goblins
B) BUG players in my area shouldn't play BUG

I'm personally having major issues with the BUG Match up. They seem to always have what their looking for. The extra Golgari Charms and E Plagues for TNN are also an issue. In my meta we have 3 BUG players and they are all very strong players. After playing it a ton of times I note that I usually lose the game if he turn 2 Hymns, as it wrecks my game plan. I literally do not have a memory of NOT losing a Matron or a Ringleader to the card. You could call it variance but since I play weekly and I lose to it weekly it simply has to be me. I'm just not sure what I'm doing wrong.

[Perfettini]

Hi, I’m new in the forum. I decide to use this tread to improve my deck, my sideboard and my strategies.
Below my actual deck:

4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
10 Mountain

4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
2 Tarfire
1 Skirk Prospector
3 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War Marshall
3 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger
4 Goblin Matron
3 Goblin Warchief
2 Goblin Chieftain
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Ringleader
2 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

SIDEBOARD
4 Pyrokinesis
4 Relic of Progenitus
1 Stingscourger
4 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Boartusk Liege

No SGC to optimize the Vial use, 2 Tarfire as a faster removal, Tuktuk and Prospector against equipment, Stingscourger against Reanimator and Sneak-Show, 2 chieftain because it is very good in combo with MWM and Krenko.
In sideboard I have another copy of Tuktuk and Stingscourger. I have also one copy of Boartusk Liege against Plague, Pyroclasm and other similar cards.
I play 4 copy of Phyrokinesis because I WANT SEE it. It is too strong against other aggro deck and elves!
Last week I went to small 16 players tournament with this list.

Death & Texas 2-0 (1-0-0)
G2: -3 Goblin Piledriver (because first strike annul this card), -1 Gempalm Incinerator, -1 Stingscourger; +4 Pyrokinesis, +1 Tuktuk Scrapper.

Sneak-Show 2-1 (2-0-0)
G2, G3: -2 Tarfire, -2 Gempalm Incinerator, -1 Goblin Sharpshooter, -1 Tuktuk Scrapper; +1 Stingscourger, +4 Thorn of Amethyst, +1 Boartusk Liege.

Jund 2-1 (3-0-0)
G2, G3: -2 Goblin Piledriver, -1 Stingscourger, -1 Goblin Sharpshooter, -1 Krenko Mob Boss; +4 Relic of Progenitus, +1 Boartusk Liege.

Elves (3-0-1)

First place and Top 4.
In semifinal I played again with the same Jund (2-0), in final I played again with the same Sneak-Show (2-1) and I won the tournament.

Sneak-Show is a very bad matc-up as other combo deck, I was very very lucky with the dice and the opening hands. I saw our best cards against combo: Cavern, Port, Waste, Lackey and Vial.
He countered always my Thorn, so I haven’t feedback on this card (in my meta combo/control deck are rare, there is many Deat&Texas, Jund and Delver decks).

MVP was Krenko, I win always many matches thanks to this guy. With Warchief, Chieftain or Vial(end of turn) in play he can overturn the board in 2 turns. Too strong!

If you have some suggestions on my deck, on my sideboard or on my side-in side-out they are well-accepted.

[Sandro95]

If you have some suggestions on my deck, on my sideboard or on my side-in side-out they are well-accepted.

I would not board out Krenko vs Jund. Krenko can take over the game pretty fast. Most of the time he would be safe from Lily, and if they don't have Bolt, he will stay alive for at leas a while. Obviously cards like Maelstrom Pulse, Toxic Deluge, Golgari Charm and Engineered Plague should be taken into consideration here.

[ScatmanX]

Just want to share that tested the Purphoros version this weekend and let me tell you, I'm impressed.
Here's what I played:
2 Wasteland
2 Ancient Tomb
2 Chrome Mox
4 Cavern of Souls
12 Mountain

4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Mogg Warmarchall
3 Goblin Warchief
2 Goblin Chieftain

1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Goblin Piledriver
1 Skirk Prospector

3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Tarfire
2 Stingscourger

3 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Still on the fence about Ancient Tomb (though it migh make SB CotV a lot better) and Prospector might become a Scrapper. Rest of the deck was the nutter butters.
Purphoros let you play a different kind of game with the deck. With it in play, the best thing you can do is Matron -> MWM. Do that twice and your opponent is almost dead. Krenko was also insane, but don't know if going to 2 is right, since don't want to cut +1/+1 effects, neither more Warchiefs, and don't want to run 0 Piledrivers. Stingscourger got better too, but 1 might be the right number since MWM is usually better with Purphoros out.
Will playtest more, and try to play somewhere when I can, but combo-killing someone is always great with goblins.
ps: Even got him to attack once. It felt great =D

[Sandro95]

Just want to share that tested the Purphoros version this weekend and let me tell you, I'm impressed.
Here's what I played:
2 Wasteland
2 Ancient Tomb
2 Chrome Mox
4 Cavern of Souls
12 Mountain

4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Mogg Warmarchall
3 Goblin Warchief
2 Goblin Chieftain

1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Goblin Piledriver
1 Skirk Prospector

3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Tarfire
2 Stingscourger

3 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Still on the fence about Ancient Tomb (though it migh make SB CotV a lot better) and Prospector might become a Scrapper. Rest of the deck was the nutter butters.
Purphoros let you play a different kind of game with the deck. With it in play, the best thing you can do is Matron -> MWM. Do that twice and your opponent is almost dead. Krenko was also insane, but don't know if going to 2 is right, since don't want to cut +1/+1 effects, neither more Warchiefs, and don't want to run 0 Piledrivers. Stingscourger got better too, but 1 might be the right number since MWM is usually better with Purphoros out.
Will playtest more, and try to play somewhere when I can, but combo-killing someone is always great with goblins.
ps: Even got him to attack once. It felt great =D

Sweet! I look forward to hearing more on what you have to say on Purphoros after further testing. What are your thoughts on him in different matchups? Is there anywhere in particular where he shines?

Also, I'll be playing legacy tomorrow, so I'll be posting the report here tomorrow, or maybe the day after.

[Sandro95]

Tournament report!

Here's the list I played

23 lands
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Snow-Covered Mountain
2 Badlands
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa

37 Spells
4 Aether Vial
1 Tarfire
1 Warren Weirding
4 Goblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
3 Mogg War Marshal
2 Goblin Piledriver
3 Goblin Chieftain
2 Goblin Warchief
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Matron
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Siege-Gang Commander

15 Sideboard
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Perish
1 Engineered Plague
1 Shattering Spree
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

R1 Elves 2-0
G1 my opponent took a mulligan to five. I drew two Gempalm Incinerators to slow him down a bit further. I then got Sharpshooter online.
G2 I tarfired his t1 DR. He played a Visionary. I played 2 lackeys. He played a Nettle Sentinel and a Quirion Ranger. We traded my lackeys for his Quirion Ranger. Then I played a Chalice of the Void for one. At one point I had a Goblin Warchief, two goblins and three lands. I played a Matron fetching a Skirk Prospector and played it. I sacrificed two goblins to play a second Matron, then sacced both Matrons to play the Sharpshooter I had fetched with the second Matron. I also drew a Perish for his 2 Deathrite Shamans here. This was after he had Abrupt Decayed my chalice.

R2 Merfolk 1-2
G1 I kept a greedy onelander and my opponent raced me.
G2 I lead with lackey. My opponent didn't play a land and passed. I won this game.
G3 I Wastelanded an early mutavault, then lost the game when I didn't draw the fourth land for Krenko with Chieftain in play. I'm not sure it was incorrect to wasteland his Mutavault here, but I'm not sure it was right either. This was the second time in a row I lost to merfolks. I wonder if it's because I played wrong, something with my list (such as playing fewer piledrivers), or if it's just variance.

R3 Burn 2-1
G1 I had a bunch of lightning bolts thrown at my face.
G2 I dropped a CotV stopping my opponent from really doing much.
G3 I had a Pyrokinesis for a Goblin Guide. I then got in with a lackey. I had a second Pyrokinesis for a Hellspark Elemental unearth and then drew a Chalice to lock out the game. I also played around Price of Progress a lot here, by keeping lands in my hand and Wasteland up. My opponent showed me later that she had a PoP in hand that could have killed me earlier if I hadn't played around it.

R4 Omnitell 2-1
R1 I played a lackey and started attacking. Soon my opponent got an Omniscience into play and cast an Emrakul. He attacked leaving me with Warchief and Piledriver. He started cantripping and found a Cunning Wish for Intuition > Enter the Infinite. I had a WW in hand and would have drawn the bloodstained Mire. Sadly I failed to beat Omniscience > Emrakul this game. ;)
G2 I went lackey > CotV and my opponent got stuck on two lands with the combo in hand, unable to cantrip for more lands. I love Chalice.
G3 my opponent played a Ponder and passed. I played a Cabal Therapy naming Show and Tell. I hit two, leaving my opponent with a Divert, a Flusterstorm and two lands. I love Cabal Therapy. From there I got two Chieftains into play and attacking, and soon more goblins followed.

It felt bad to lose to merfolks. Other than that I'm pretty happy about the tournament. I made a few sloppy plays such as not shooting my opponent for two when I made his 2 DRS perish. I will not repeat that mistake. Chalice was great in 3 out of 4 matchups. Cabal Therapy was also sweet. I didn't face any stoneforge mystic decks, so I couldn't test the second Scapper or the Shattering Spree in the board. Pyrokines was good to have as usual. Perish helped versus elves and I didn't draw Plague.

[GoboLord]

15 Sideboard
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Perish
1 Engineered Plague
1 Shattering Spree
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

[...]

It felt bad to lose to merfolks. Other than that I'm pretty happy about the tournament. I made a few sloppy plays such as not shooting my opponent for two when I made his 2 DRS perish. I will not repeat that. Chalice was great in 3 out of 4 matchups. Cabal Therapy was also sweet. I didn't face any stoneforge mystic decks, so I couldn't test the second Scapper or the Shattering Spree in the board. Pyrokines was good to have as usual. Perish helped versus elves and I didn't draw Plague.

My sideboard is quite similar to yours as my core cards are CHalice, Therapy and Perish, too. I my past tournaments I boarded Chalice a lot, and I share your oppinion on Cabal Therpay: I love it.

Can you reflect on how useful you find RIshadan Ports in the games you played?

On the Merfolk MU: Call me a noob, but I never felt like this matchup was truly positive for us. I don't think you are doing it wrong (except for the greedy keep g1 maybe) as long as you aim at getting Piledriver online as early as possible and keeping their Mutavaults in check with wasteland and ports. All in all, I think the odds are pretty even in this matchup.

[LeoCop 90]

Well, sometimes i lose to merfolk too. It's possible for goblins to lose to aggro decks if they have fast starts. However playing 4 piledrivers help a lot in the matchup, together with 4 gempalm. I would say the matchup is 60/40 in our favor.

[cronos]

I was thinking about to test Goblin Pyromancer against some combo decks... and Goblins too xD. Has someone tried it? Regards.

[Sandro95]

My sideboard is quite similar to yours as my core cards are CHalice, Therapy and Perish, too. I my past tournaments I boarded Chalice a lot, and I share your oppinion on Cabal Therpay: I love it.

Can you reflect on how useful you find RIshadan Ports in the games you played?

On the Merfolk MU: Call me a noob, but I never felt like this matchup was truly positive for us. I don't think you are doing it wrong (except for the greedy keep g1 maybe) as long as you aim at getting Piledriver online as early as possible and keeping their Mutavaults in check with wasteland and ports. All in all, I think the odds are pretty even in this matchup.

Maybe merfolks is a more even matchup than I thougt it was. That would make losing to them seam less horrible I guess. ;)

On Rishadan Ports: I have been wanting more red/black sources in the deck. In some cases Rishadan Port is great, slowing down opponents or keeping them off of certain colors. Other times it is a land that doesn't tap for red or black and can be wastelanded. Playing more red/black sources would make it easier to play more black spells in the sideboard. In my experience they tend to be very high impact cards.

[max_goblin]

Wasteland is a very good card, but its best is when you think when to use it.
I see a lot of people using it after they draw it, and in my oppinion, that is wrong. You have to think in the match up and in the state of the game. I really dont know if was a good call to waste his mutavault. You had a piledriver on attack? Or a lackey? He was low on lands?

If not, I would probably dont use it. See, goblins is mana hungry, I found myself in the same boat as you a lot of times, wasting someone just to find out that I slowed my game too.. So now on, I think very hard when I am going to use a wasteland or not. The same goes for rishadan port, but it is less painful if you commit a mistake.

I dont find merfolk a even match up, is at least 60/40 to us. They dont have ways to interact with us, unless they A)play a splash and make our wastes and ports better; B) counter our creatures, what is hard when you play 3~4 caverns + 4 Vials MD; C)Block. They can dismember I know, but usually they run as 1of.. so, whatever.
The worst case is if they have lords out and a TNN, but again, we have at least 7 removals MD that can handle their lords, and 3~4 of them cant be countered... so how can be hard to keep then out of lords.. Of course that, playing 2 piledrivers sucks in this game, because this is usually the card that win this game for me, even with TNN I can race them. Dont get me wrong, if you play bad, and make a lot of mistakes, they lords will kill ya! haha But if you play right, it is a very hard to lose a match.

Ohh I always keep 1tuktuk for their jitte, some merfolks play MD, other in the SB.

Cya

[Thagaste]

Hi ! I'm a french Goblins lover and new to this forum. I registered to share my GP Paris experience last saturday.

Here is the list I ran :

Main Deck
4 Wateland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
10 Snow-Covered Mountain

4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War-Marshal
3 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Krenko Mob Boss
1 Stingscourger
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Goblin Chieftain
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

4 Aether Vial
2 Tarfire

Sideboard
3 Chalice of the Void
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Pyrokinesis
2 Ashen Rider
2 Pithing Needle
2 Boartusk Liege

Round 1 : Elves 2-0 (1-0)
To my surprise, quite an easy matchup. Maybe because my opponent didn't play Deathrite Shaman.
G1 : Sharpshooter, Lackey and Tarfire on opening hand, assuring a T2 Sharpshooter. Pretty much it.
I sided 3 Pyrokinesis against him, removing Krenko, Skirk Prospector and a Piledriver.
G2 : He Mulligans, I keep a hand with Gempalm and Pyrokinesis while the MWM + Piledriver finish him quickly.

Round 2 : Merfolk 1-2 (1-1)
Well yeah... Lost to Merfolk which i was sad about because i made a huge error.
G1 : Pretty straightforward. 2 Piledrivers doing the job.
G2 : I removed Sharpshooter and Krenko and added 2 Needles for his equipments. Hesitated to add Pyrokinesis too but didn't know what to remove. Hard game for me as he dazes my Vial and plays a Jitte on turn 2.
G3 : There's where the mistake happens. I litterally swarm the place with my MYM and Piledrivers but on a final and lethal attack, i forget to call the triggers on the attacking Piledrivers. My opponent didn't told me too so i think i should've called a judge for this one. Pretty upset and angry at him but meh, i learned from my mistake.

Round 3 : Death and Taxes 2-0 (2-1)
G1 : I start, turn 1 Vial and then, locking the game with my lands while a gentle Lackey puts down a Matron that gets Sharpshooter.
G2 : I side 3 Pyrokinesis and 2 Pithing Needles. Game is hard as he plays a T2 Stoneforge Mystic that gets Batterskull AND another SFM that gets SOFI. Fortunately i have a 2 counters Vial and a 4 counters other Vial and I play Tuktuk Scrapper on his attacking batterskull. End of turn i play MWM and on my turn Ringleader that shows a lot of hate for him. Difficult matchup though.

Round 4 : Rock Control 2-0 (3-1)
My nightmare : Toxic Deluges, Engineering plagues and Golgari Charms everywhere !
G1 : First turn my opponent plays Cabal Therapy and says "Brainstorm". I smile when i reveal my hand and hear him say "Oh dear" with a perfect british accent. I put a Mountain and say go. Turn 2 my opponent played Veteran Explorer and forgot to sacrifice it. I nuke it end of turnand get 4 lands on Turn 2 that plays Krenko and swarms the board even if he plays Sigarda on turn 3. I'm faster and win easily.
G2 : I add 2 Boartusk Liege, no Relics of Progenitus as i didn't see any DRS or Tarmogoyfs in his deck. That was a good choice because he didn't play any. I removed 2 Incinerators. During the game, he doesn't see any of his side cards and let me a Vial while I lock the game with Rishadans and Wastelands.

Round 5 : Patriot Delver 2-0 (4-1)
I thought this matchup was horrible because I had no Pyroblasts or REB in my side, it actually wasn't.
G1 : No delver on sight T1, i'm getting everthing countered but i'm very fast (as always). We laught as he plays a Chain Lightning on my Piledriver to kill it and watching me pay RR thanks to Skirk Prospector to finish him off.
G2 : I add 3 Chalice of the void. I manage to play one with 1 counter, my opponent didn't like it at all, making 50% of his deck useless.

Round 6 : Death and Taxes, the Return 0-2 (4-2)
G1 : I have a decent hand, my opponent plays a T1 Mother of Runes and a T2 SFM that gets Batterskull. Not many i can do.
G2 : I had the same side as Round 2 and i have a good hand. But my opponent, Sir Gladstone Gander, plays his 3 equipments WITHOUT a single SFM. Even if i take care of the batterskull, i can't do anything against Jitte and don't see my needles.

Round 7 : Patriot Control 1-2 (4-3)
G1 : I'm very fast, playing 3 Wastelands and a Rishadan that annihilate his manabase. Win in less than 5 minutes.
G2 : Adding Chalices and Needles. Same thing than the last Round happened : 2 equipements without SFM, can't do much.
G3 : Mulligan 5 for me and not seeing a single red land, pretty sad to be kicked out of Day 2 with this lost but, eh i came to play so i'm playing the last 2 rounds to see if i could beat my previous GP record (Strasbourg 2012) of 5-4 with monoR Goblins.

Round 8 : ANT 2-0 (5-3)
G1 : My opponent plays Cabal Therapy, same reaction than the Rock control player when he sees my hand full of Goblins. I play a T1 Lackey. My opponent struggles while i play a lot of creatures, wisely keeping a Tarfire in my hand and tapping his lands with my Rishadan. Then he decides to go combo but didn't count right, leaving my at 2. I finish him off during my turn.
G2 : Removing my Gempalms, Stingscourger, Sharpshooter and Tuktuk Scrapper to add 3 chalices of the void and 3 relics of progenitus. I open my hand with a Chalice and Lackey. Turn 1 my opponents lands and brainstorms. On my turn I play my chalice for 0. He manages to Abrubt Decay it but on my second turn, I draw an epic 2nd Chalice that i play for 1. He can't recover from this and I win.

Round 9 : Death and Taxes, the final showdown (6-3)
G1 : I start and I have the absolute perfect hand : Lackey, Matron and Incinerator. The rest is pretty much self-explanatory.
G2 : Same side as always, i open my hand with 2 pyrokinesis and a godlike hand with Sharpshooter, Tarfire and Warchief. I absolutely obliterated my opponent that did absolutely nothing.
15 minutes Round playing against the most boring and irritating girl in the world but eh, i won !

Overall a very nice experience. A tiny bit disappointed to be this close to Day 2 but when i said i was playing MonoR Goblins, nobody believed i would make a good score. But besides a few mistakes, I really played well, knowing the deck i'm playing for 3 years now. If you have any comments on my list or reports i'll be glad to recieve it !

Cya !

[Sandro95]

Hi ! I'm a french Goblins lover and new to this forum. I registered to share my GP Paris experience last saturday.

Here is the list I ran :

Main Deck
4 Wateland
4 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
10 Snow-Covered Mountain

4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War-Marshal
3 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Krenko Mob Boss
1 Stingscourger
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Goblin Chieftain
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

4 Aether Vial
2 Tarfire

Sideboard
3 Chalice of the Void
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Pyrokinesis
2 Ashen Rider
2 Pithing Needle
2 Boartusk Liege

Round 1 : Elves 2-0 (1-0)
To my surprise, quite an easy matchup. Maybe because my opponent didn't play Deathrite Shaman.
G1 : Sharpshooter, Lackey and Tarfire on opening hand, assuring a T2 Sharpshooter. Pretty much it.
I sided 3 Pyrokinesis against him, removing Krenko, Skirk Prospector and a Piledriver.
G2 : He Mulligans, I keep a hand with Gempalm and Pyrokinesis while the MWM + Piledriver finish him quickly.

Cya !

Too bad you didn't make day 2, I would have liked to see goblins do well. Versus elves I would definitely have boarded in all copies of Chalice of the Void, as it can
lock them out from playing most of their creatures. Also, losing to merfolks that way sucks, however, as you said, it's a reminder to clearly announce your triggers.

[GoboLord]

Round 2 : Merfolk 1-2 (1-1)
Well yeah... Lost to Merfolk which i was sad about because i made a huge error.
G1 : Pretty straightforward. 2 Piledrivers doing the job.
G2 : I removed Sharpshooter and Krenko and added 2 Needles for his equipments. Hesitated to add Pyrokinesis too but didn't know what to remove. Hard game for me as he dazes my Vial and plays a Jitte on turn 2.
G3 : There's where the mistake happens. I litterally swarm the place with my MYM and Piledrivers but on a final and lethal attack, i forget to call the triggers on the attacking Piledrivers. My opponent didn't told me too so i think i should've called a judge for this one. Pretty upset and angry at him but meh, i learned from my mistake.


Playing the deck for almost 7 years now I can say that I never announced the trigger for Piledriver's ability and I never got punished for it like that. I honestly believe that a judgecall would result in a warning for both of you and you being allowed to "pump" your Piledriver, since this is a mandatory trigger, not a "you may"-trigger.
The only mistake you made is not to call the judge. Nothing wrong with not announcing that trigger, in my oppinion.



Too bad you didn't make day 2, I would have liked to see goblins do well
I actually find 6-3 a decent performance, given the fact that he didn't have any BYEs and didn't face totally crappy non-competitive deck in the first three rounds.

//Edit: Too many typos....

[OlegtheSuper]

WOW, no SCG, nice. i like your list gj)

[Thagaste]

Yes I should've called a judge for this call but my opponent was really greedy and unpleasent :mad:

Thanks for the advice regarding CotV against Elves! ! Next time i'll make it to day 2 :wink:


WOW, no SCG, nice. i like your list gj)

I removed it the day before the tournament to add Krenko and I wasn't disappointed. Next step is trying to put more Tuktuk Scrapper or Tin Street Hooligans in the Main Deck.
Fortunately, next block will be a "Return to Lorwyn" with lots of new things to add !

[GoboLord]

Yes I should've called a judge for this call but my opponent was really greedy and unpleasent :mad:


One more reason to call the judge. Don't be intimidated just because someone else is having a bad day / is a dick. Take the initiative and call the judge. Nothing wrong with calling a judge at all. Judgecalls are (supposed to be) for clarification, not for punishment.
I have had judgecalls á la:

Opponent (towards bystanding judge): "Hey, John (they apparently knew each other), write down a warning for slowplay for this guy, will you?" (waving with the resultslip)

Then it was my turn to call the headjudge.

[L10]

+1, never feel intimidated to call the judge.

I had been playing with Purphoros ever since my Japanese friend gave me a list that did well at his local tournament around mid-December, and I am thoroughly impressed. I pretty much play it as a 3-off in all the variations I play now. It gives a different angle to Goblins, and gives me an option to break stalemates. However, none of my decks are based around Purphoros. For example, I only play 3 MWM. I don't play a 4th MWM just because it synergies well with Purphoros. It also makes Vial @4 much more useful, with Ringleader, Tuktuk Scrapper, Krenko, and Purphoros to cheat in. I gave up on SGC for that reason.

[max_goblin]

Fortunately, next block will be a "Return to Lorwyn" with lots of new things to add !

That is for sure? Seriosly *.* happiness has found his way back to my life lol

Sometime ago some of you asked for a new list, something different to try out, well, I got an idea. First of all, my insights about the current metagame, well, at least when I play.

1. Most of legacy can now play with 2 or even 1 land.. So mana denial has become worst.. and DRS only make that even worst, but everyone know that.
2. Blade decks mean that trade, or even chump block became worst.
3. TNN bring that blue based decks online, so, piledriver should be back online as well.
4. With a lot of decks packing board swap cards, pump goblins should be played more often.
5. Abrupt Decay + Cavern of souls made two things, first, vial is not that essencial anymore, because people play less counters and more removal, and second, because can break vial more often.

This make me thing, and I dont really know if I got it right, but to me it appear that:
1. mana denial is not that good, so we can probably cut rishadan port completely, but wasteland should be played at least at 2~3 copies (nothing new I guess).
2. whithout port and with a set of cavern of souls, I guess we can seriosly think in lowering our vial count.. perhaps even cut it off..
3. piledriver is now very good, and mwm is not, so, I would prefer to cut mwm from my list rather than piledriver.
4. I guess that mwm and gempalm work very good together, and when I dont play mwm, I start to think if I should play gempalm at all.
5. Actually, when I think of a card that gets better with less goblins in play and more cheap creatures, is sparksmith.

Thinking in this stuff I came with a new list, I dont know if it is the best, but I would really love to try it out, but I cant engage any seriolsy play right now, if anyone could try, I would be glad.

4 Cavern of Souls
3 Wasteland
3 Chrome Mox
13 Mountains

4 Lackey
4 Tarfire
4 Piledriver
2 WInstigator
2 Sparksmith
2 Stingscouger
2 Gempalm
4 Chieftain
2 Warchief
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
1 TukTuk
1 Krenko
1 SGC

I really think sparksmith is better than gempalm right know, but you need some haste, or bring him turn one... what make him insane in the currently meta, at the cost of 1 or 2 life you can kill delver, DRS, bob and SFM all drops 1 and 2, so he seen powerfull enought to test right know, oh, and off course, most decks right know are fast, but not as fast as BURN or old zoo, so we can try it without worring about dying to ourselves.
WIthout vial SGC can come handly, but I dont see any problem swithing him for another krenko. Winstigator is better than MWM because it kills SFM, DRS and if not blocked gets insane... with 6 free bringers (lackey and WI) plus 6 haste (warchief and chieftain) the decks is fast enought to try to win the first match against combo even without mana denial.

What you guys think about it?
Cya

[Fuwatanity]

Addition to the thing with the Piledriver trigger:
I think it's the same as with the Tarmogoyf, you don't have to say how strong he is, in the case of Piledriver, that he triggered, until a visible change occurs. In this case when he's dealing damage. So as long as you call the right damage you're fine. Be i guess to be on the save side you could just anounce it every time ;)

[max_goblin]

Addition to the thing with the Piledriver trigger:
I think it's the same as with the Tarmogoyf, you don't have to say how strong he is, in the case of Piledriver, that he triggered, until a visible change occurs. In this case when he's dealing damage. So as long as you call the right damage you're fine. Be i guess to be on the save side you could just anounce it every time ;)

I read this article when the changes came out.
http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/feature/233

read:A triggered ability that affects the game state in non-visible ways.

It says exactly what you said here.

[GoboLord]

http://magiccards.info/scans/en/mi/152.jpg http://magiccards.info/scans/en/ds/91.jpg http://magiccards.info/scans/en/m11/141.jpg

Hello fellow Chieftains,

today it was tournament time again. The result was a disappointing 1-4 after 5 rounds. I was piloting a Rb WInstigator list again (see below), with a minor change since my last tournament (-1 Krenko, +1 Lightning Crafter in the MD). No detailed report again, just results and some thoughts. I will answer question about the respective matches though.

MANA (22)
3 Wasteland
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Auntie’s Hovel
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Badlands
2 Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Mountain
3 Chrome Mox

CORE (23)
4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
3 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader

OTHERS (15)
4 Warren Instigator
4 Goblin Chieftain
1 Lightning Crafter
1 Tarfire
2 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger
1 Warren Weiridng
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

Sideboard (15)
1 Chrome Mox
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Earwig Squad
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
3 Perish


Round 1 Human/Werewolf Stompy (0-2)
Round 2 Punishing Maverick (1-2)
Round 3 Death & Taxes (2-1)
Round 4 Deathblade (1-2)
Round 5 Thespian Rock (1-2)

Thoughts:
* MVPs were Chieftain and Goblin Ringleader again
* I boarded out Vial far too often and got reminded how essential it actually is for the deck
* Chrome Mox #3 is still cool
* I don’t like Sharpshooter, and given the matchups of today I might think about replacing it with Dread of Night. However, this feels intuitively wrong, so I might just choose something else here
* I will work on SB-plans against the decks I commonly see in this meta – and my first impression is that Chrome Mox #4 as well as Earwig Squad and Sharpshooter will not stay in the deck.
* Krenko was not missed at all, but I can’t really say that Lightning Crafter is (much) better. I was problematic to champion a creature sometimes, or even to champion the “best” creature (Matron or Ringleader). I think he’s quite good when he hits the battlefield, but maybe not worth the slot.
* Gempalm Incinerator was underperforming today. I’m tempted to cut it down to one copy, adding Tarfire. But that might just be due to the MUs I played today.

Questions and comments are, as always, appreciated.

- GL

[max_goblin]

Bladedecks are rought, so I understand, but, didnt you miss more removal? You had only 6 removal MD, and I guess 7 is the lower number I would play, so why you choose to do not play removal? Why dont use tarfires? Stingscouger and Warren Weirding dont seen like the same to you?

The match that I dont understand at all was werewolf stomp, they try to lock you with moon (useless) and chalice of the void (we got cavern) their only piece of lock that works is trinisphere, that they usually pack 3, but we got lackey and vial (in your case WI too) to bring stuff for free + half of our deck cost 3 or more, so no problem here. I really would like to know what happend to you get a 0-2.

Did you miss Mogg War Marshal? Why?

You said AEther vial is essencial to our decks, so why side it out? When did you miss it?

Thankyou for your time!
and sorry about the results =/

[GoboLord]

0. Update notes

February 24th 2014
* updated the tournament report section

[max_goblin]

Bladedecks are rought, so I understand, but, didnt you miss more removal? You had only 6 removal MD, and I guess 7 is the lower number I would play, so why you choose to do not play removal? Why dont use tarfires? Stingscouger and Warren Weirding dont seen like the same to you?

The match that I dont understand at all was werewolf stomp, they try to lock you with moon (useless) and chalice of the void (we got cavern) their only piece of lock that works is trinisphere, that they usually pack 3, but we got lackey and vial (in your case WI too) to bring stuff for free + half of our deck cost 3 or more, so no problem here. I really would like to know what happend to you get a 0-2.

Did you miss Mogg War Marshal? Why?

You said AEther vial is essencial to our decks, so why side it out? When did you miss it?

Thankyou for your time!
and sorry about the results =/

I think my message had an error.
But anyway, I would like to know your oppinions about the questions above gobbolord,
Thankyou!

[JPoJohnson]

Anyone see the Thalia Goblins that went BRW and did well recently? Interesting list.

Anyone have some thoughts?

[GoboLord]

Bladedecks are rought, so I understand, but, didnt you miss more removal? You had only 6 removal MD, and I guess 7 is the lower number I would play, so why you choose to do not play removal? Why dont use tarfires? Stingscouger and Warren Weirding dont seen like the same to you?

The match that I dont understand at all was werewolf stomp, they try to lock you with moon (useless) and chalice of the void (we got cavern) their only piece of lock that works is trinisphere, that they usually pack 3, but we got lackey and vial (in your case WI too) to bring stuff for free + half of our deck cost 3 or more, so no problem here. I really would like to know what happend to you get a 0-2.

Did you miss Mogg War Marshal? Why?

You said AEther vial is essencial to our decks, so why side it out? When did you miss it?

Thankyou for your time!
and sorry about the results =/

On the number of spotremoval:
I think that Goblins can do well with any number of 4-8 spotremoval in MD, whereas 4 or 5 removalspells is more common, and you rarely will find lists with more than 7. However, that's what most people do - I however am also in favor of more spotremoval . So why did I run only 5 (I don't count Lightning Crafter as a real removal spells, since he is not very good in getting past early blockers)? My MD is ver tightly packed and I would not know which card to cut. In fact if I am playing with Chrome Moxen, I am hesitant to play even more removal since this would both effectively reduce the number of goblin creatures that I can put into play with Vial/Lackey/WIntigator.
AFter evaluating the performance of every single card in the MD I have reached the conclusion that I need more spotremoval (which is just what you are telling me) and that Gempalm Incinerator is (very much like Lightning Crafter) not the kind of removal I am looking for righ now. I think the NUMBER of removalspells is just fine, but I need more EFFECTIVE removal for Squires. My new removal-suite will be:

1 Gempalm, 1 Werding, 1 Stingscourger, 1 Sparksmith, 2 Tarfire
or stated differently
-1 Gempalm is replaced with +1 Tarfire and -1 Lightning Crafter is replaced with +1 Sparksmith

I am especially curious about Sparksmith, which I think will be a good replacement for Lightning Crafter (their abilities are quite similar in function, with the major advantage that I don't need to champion a creature and that it only costs 2 mana). Even on T1 out of a Chrome Mox + Land, Sparksmith can be very good at controlling the board in early game.
What do you think?

On the Human/Werewolf Stompy MU:
I agree with you that a good share of his strategy (namely 8 Moon effects + 8 of his lock-artifacts) are totally in-effective against GOblins. However, In both games he had Early Phyrexian Revoker, shutting down Vial and Chrome Mox, followed by a Umezawa's Jitte. I lost game 1 because I couldn't find my 4th manasource on time (had Tuktuk Scrapper and 2 RIngleaders in hand and a Vial at 4 counter which got "Revoker-ed".
In game 2 he shut down my offense with a T1 Hanweir Watchkeep, which was to large for my Tarfire. He manascrewed me with Revoker naming Chrome Mox and beat me with the flipped Werewolf-HUman equipped wit Jitte.

On Mogg War Marshal
I did not miss MWM. I think he is best when you are in a defensive-mode and you try to develop a board-position (which would be the case against RUG Threshold). In the matches I played in the past 5 moths I never missed MWM. If I were to play him it would probably replace Warren Instigator - but I am way too happy with WInstigator, so there won't be any MWM in my list in near future.

On Aether Vial
Some weeks ago we had a discussion about the match-ups where you can board out Vial after G1. Apart from the obvious combo-matchups (ANT, Sneak Show) or matchups in which VIal is usually too slow (ELves) we talked about boarding it out against decks that try get you with card-disadvantage aka. discard spells (e.g. Jund, especially PUNISHING Jund), since Vial itself gives you card dis-advantage. So, I experimented a little with boarding out Vials in matchups where I wasn't sure how good it actually was (Punishing Maverick, Painted Stone, Team America, Thespian Rock), and I learned that this was oftentimes not the right thing to do. While Aether VIal isn't particulary AWSOME against Painted Stone and Thespian Rock (just picking 2 examples here), none of my sideboard cards is good enough to bring in vs. these deck - even less so in favor of Aether Vial.
Reflecting on the past 4-5 tournaments here is a list with my matchups - I marked the MUs where I boarded Vial out in bold and the color red indicates the matches where I figured out it was wrong or doubtful.

UR Young Pyromancer Delver
Elves
BG something (I better had boarded them out, but I didn't)
Elves
Jund (I better had boarded them out, but I didn't)
Spanish Inquisition
Patriot
Punishing Maverick
BG something
TinFins
Ubw Faeries
ANT
UR Young Delver
Pox
TES
Imperial Painter
Sneak Show
ANT
UBG Deedstill
ANT
12 Post
Human/Werewolf Stompy
Punishing Maverick
Death & Taxes
Deathblade
Thespian Rock

[Ace/Homebrew]

Anyone see the Thalia Goblins that went BRW and did well recently? Interesting list.

Anyone have some thoughts?
I would also like to hear people's comments on this list. It is the first time I have seen anyone combine black and white as splash colors (that I've seen).

Here's the list:

Goblins
Kevin Deffenbaugh
13th Place at StarCityGames.com Legacy Open on 2/23/2014

Creatures (29)
2 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Warchief
2 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

Lands (22)
2 Mountain
4 Arid Mesa
2 Badlands
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Plateau
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Wasteland

Spells (9)
4 Aether Vial
3 Tarfire
2 Warren Weirding


Sideboard
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Stingscourger
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Rest in Peace
2 Wear // Tear
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Perish

Obviously the manabase worked out fairly well for him or he wouldn't have gotten 13th out of 390 players.
Against combo, he has 4 maindeck cards (Thalia). And 6 more in the board (swapping out 5 removal and 1 Vial against Storm combo, I'm guessing).
Maindeck Weirdings help against Reanimator and the Show part of Sneak + Show.
Perish, Relic, and RiP hurt the green midrange decks... I wonder if Therapy was used as an answer for TNN.

[ScatmanX]

[I marked the MUs where I boarded Vial out in bold and the color red indicates the matches where I figured out it was wrong or doubtful.

UR Young Pyromancer Delver
Elves
BG something (I better had boarded them out, but I didn't)
Elves
Jund (I better had boarded them out, but I didn't)
Spanish Inquisition
Patriot
Punishing Maverick
BG something
TinFins
Ubw Faeries
ANT
UR Young Delver
Pox
TES
Imperial Painter
Sneak Show
ANT
UBG Deedstill
ANT
12 Post
Human/Werewolf Stompy
Punishing Maverick
Death & Taxes
Deathblade
Thespian Rock
Very happy to see this. Mainly because I think there are some issues here.
- It always depends on your build. If I'm running 3-4 Ports alonw with Wastes, and my SB consist of hate cards like Thalia/Thorn/CotV, I leave Vial in agains AnT. If you're on the Winstigator build, it may very well be correct to take them out.
- I'm not a fan of siding Vial out against any BGx decks at all. I know we need the C.A., but Vial is an outstanding card against grindy decks, and in my experience, whenever they don't destroy it (and you don't draw 3-4 of them), you're in good shape. Apart from Jund, other BGx decks have very, very few removal, so if they use Decay on Vial, they lack removal for your threads. To be honest, the hands I like the most to see against these decks is something like 4 lands, MWM, Matron, something. Land heavy are great here, since discard usually takes care of the Ringleader/Matron on your oppening hand (against a good opponent at least). Then you just need to topdeck something cool and win.
- Agree on every match you thought it was bad to side out Vial
- Guess the same argument made on the AnT scenario can be made on the 12Post one and Sneak/Show.

[max_goblin]

@Gobbolord: I dont know if you saw the other post I wrote about a complete different list.

About Sparksmith: In fact, I think that sparksmith work in the same spot that gempalm works.
And yes, T1 Sparksmith can be a nightmare too, with not answered fast, dont get me wrong, T1 Lackey or WI are better in most case scenarios, but against blade and elves, if they dont kill your sparksmith, they simply cant do anything. You will kill their T1 delver, elf or even SFM, so I really like this idea.

About Vial: Before, when i played goblins, the best hand against most part of the field was lackey, but T1 vial was very good too, and in some cases, even better, because our second plan, waste + port was very good. But today.. I played against BUG this days, with vial turn 1, double waste + 1 port.. and believe, I lost bad.. he simply used my wastelands to feed his DRS, while AD my vial, then you know what happens. Mana denial dont work at all these days.. If I would play vial, I would keep 3 MD, at max, lower the Port+Waste, and try to be more aggressive + removals. If we lose close to the meta right now, we never had a meta that rely so hard on creatures, actually, they need more creatures than lands! Even barbarian ring sees like a possible land this days (just kidding, but I guess I will try it, just to see).

About MWM: The funny thing about MWM is that he and WI really play for the same spot. But their game plan is different, and I agree if your understanding about this subject. The best part about this is the following: MWM make sparksmith worst, because the most part of the time you want spaksmith to take small creatures from the table, not the big ones. And WI cant use Gempalm correct, but he can drop sparksmith.. So yeah, I really think that, when you play WI, we should try to play more sparksmith over gempalm.

About Rwb builds: WW is really a good card, and most of the time, better than stingscouger, i like it. Thalia MD is the only way our deck can fight while using the plan of mana denial, because waste+port isnt enought anymore in legacy =/

Cya
and thankyou for you sharings!
(and sorry about the bad english, I wrote in a hurry).

[GoboLord]

@Gobbolord: I dont know if you saw the other post I wrote about a complete different list.

About Sparksmith: In fact, I think that sparksmith work in the same spot that gempalm works.
And yes, T1 Sparksmith can be a nightmare too, with not answered fast, dont get me wrong, T1 Lackey or WI are better in most case scenarios, but against blade and elves, if they dont kill your sparksmith, they simply cant do anything. You will kill their T1 delver, elf or even SFM, so I really like this idea.

[...]So yeah, I really think that, when you play WI, we should try to play more sparksmith over gempalm.
Wow, I didn't see your list on the last page, but that list indeed has several elements which I find good (like, as you said, the removal package and 3 Chrome Moxen in MD). Thanks for the feedback on Sparksmith, I'm looking forward to turn this guy sideways. =) However, cutting Gempalm to 0 feels awkward. Although it makes sense if we accept that what we just talked about is correct. My argument to keep one copy in the deck would be: to have the option to tutor it up when you need counter-proof removal and/or you have enough mana to choose Gempalm over Tarfire and you will profit from the card-draw out of cycling (which happens once in while).



About Vial: Before, when i played goblins, the best hand against most part of the field was lackey, but T1 vial was very good too, and in some cases, even better, because our second plan, waste + port was very good. But today.. I played against BUG this days, with vial turn 1, double waste + 1 port.. and believe, I lost bad.. he simply used my wastelands to feed his DRS, while AD my vial, then you know what happens. Mana denial dont work at all these days.. If I would play vial, I would keep 3 MD, at max, lower the Port+Waste, and try to be more aggressive + removals.
I agree with you on the effectivenss of manadenial. Deathrite Shaman makes Wastelands and Ports so much worse - this adds up to the fact that everyone and his mother is playing very good manacurves, peaking at cmc2. So, yes, decks do indeed need only few lands lately. However, this does not make Aether Vial completely obsolete. Sure, Vial is pretty good when you can slow-roll and charge your Vial whil working on your opponents mana. But Vial does more than that, which is exactly what I was reminded of in the last tournament. We really need the card against a lot of decks to remain explosive and suprising. I thought about cutting it entirely too, due to card dis-advantage issues, which add up in Chrome-Mox builds. But then I discarded the idea again, because, you know, I used to run 3 Pyrokinesis in MD and rarely had issues with CDA.


@ ScatmanX:
Thanks for the feedback, it was very insightful. So, if I got it right you are saying that, against BGx decks, I should only board out Vial when they have lots of discard AND removal?

[ScatmanX]

@ ScatmanX:
Thanks for the feedback, it was very insightful. So, if I got it right you are saying that, against BGx decks, I should only board out Vial when they have lots of discard AND removal?
Well, not actually. I ment to say that it is better against BGx few removal deck, but I'd still not side out against something like Punishing Jund, though that is a very tricky matchup and I do see the reasoning for taking it out. But against P.Jund I prefer to side out Instigators, Piledriver, random goblins or Stingscourger.

[jrw1985]

That Rwb list is sweet. He relies on Thalia instead of Port, and by cutting Port he made room for more fetches (8!) and the B splash. Weirding is strong right now. I feel like not having Gempalm weakens the CA game, but maybe running Wort instead of SGC #2 would help with that. Except we all know Wort sucks. Great sideboard as well. Seriously, really nice SB. I also like how he eschewed utility goblins and just ran 3 bombs and a bunch of haste lords.

[Sandro95]

Greetings everyone, it's time for a tournament report! I went 2-2 with the same list I played last time (R/B).

R1 RUG Delver 2-0
G1 My hand after a mulligan to six was pretty meh, but playable. I played a Mogg War Marshal on turn two and after a while I was able to gempalm my opponents Delver and Warren Weirding his goyf.
G2 Chalice did a lot of work.

R2 BUG Delver 1-2
G1 Double Deathrite + Goyf do a lot of work while I'm having trouble putting on much pressure.
G2 I play mountain pass after my opponent mulliganed to five. My opponent played a drs here and I untapped, tarfired and wastelanded. I made a misplay here by not tarfiring end of turn as my opponent had a bayou in play, so daze was of no concern. I had a second wasteland and some goblins to get the pressure on. This game looked good before I played Chalice on 1.
G3 I chumped a goyf with double mogg war marshal for a couple of turns, and then lost to engineered plague. I made a misplay here where I played vial and then perish, only to have it dazed.

R3 Miracles 1-2
G1 I am in a situation where I'm thinking about whether I should sandbag some creatures or just go for it. (this was pretty early on). I choose to go for it, play out my hand and swing, putting my opponent on 1. My opponent untaps, and plays an Energy Field with RIP in play. So close.
G2 I have a fast lackey > SGC start with a chalice on t2. Things are over fairly quickly.
G3 I keep a slow vial hand at six. We get to a point where my opponent has Jace vs my chalice on 1. I play a warchief and attack jace for lethal. My opponent plays disenchant CotV, plow. Then I get killed by Helm + RIP.

R4 UB Landstill Control 2-0
I have a hard time imagining a better matchup for us. Standstill and counterspells aren't exactly effective versus us, and we have wasteland and rishadan port for their manlands.

Thoughts: Chalice impressed me once again. I would have liked to have an answer to RIP + Energy Field, suggestions?

[cooljets]

Hey GobboLord, just wanted to say, I changed my basic, mono red version into your chrome mox fueled, black for weirding/therapy, winstigator version and my win percentage in practice and smallish tournaments has gone from maybe 30% to 55-60%. I'll post any upcoming results I get. Thanks for getting me optimistic about this deck again.

[Ace/Homebrew]

That Rwb list is sweet.
I ran it tonight finishing 3-1, losing in the top 8 of 21.


He relies on Thalia instead of Port.
Weirding is strong right now.
Great sideboard as well. Seriously, really nice SB.

Totally. Perish wrecks BGx. I missed my toolbox but liked not awkwardly starting with them in my hand.

Enchantress 0-2
Junk 2-1
Zombardment 2-1
Punishing Jund 2-0
TNN Bant 1-2

I need more time and practice with the sideboard. I like the list. :laugh:

[GoboLord]

Hey GobboLord, just wanted to say, I changed my basic, mono red version into your chrome mox fueled, black for weirding/therapy, winstigator version and my win percentage in practice and smallish tournaments has gone from maybe 30% to 55-60%. I'll post any upcoming results I get. Thanks for getting me optimistic about this deck again.

Thank you, I'm glad to hear that.
Nevertheless, you should keep an eye on what exactly makes the deck perform better: is it the ChromeMox-Winstigator-Chieftain combo OR is it the addition of B cards (like Weriding, Therapy, Perish) OR a combination of those? I'm looking forward hearing from you.

[dissy]

Hello guys,

I would like to share my deck with u.
And i would like to hear what u think of my build

Lands 23
4x Rishadan Port
4x Wasteland
4x Cavern of Souls
3x Bad Lands
1x Taiga
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Arid Mesa
1x Mountain

Creatures (24)
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Matron
3x Goblin Warchief
3x Earwig Squad
3x Gempalm Incinerator
1x Goblin Chieftain
1x Siege Gang Commander
1x Krenko, Mob Boss

Artifacts (7)
4x Eather Vial
3x Chalice of the Void

Other Spells (6)
3x Tarfire
2x Warren Weirding

SideBoard
4x Leyline of the Void
4x Stingscourger
3x Pithing Needle
1x Tin Street Hooligan
1x Sharpshooter
1x Tarfire
1x Warren weirding

Oke somethings are standard the landbase is normal. But playing 3 Earwig Squads looks strange. I have tested more than 20 times. And its a killer.
Often i can cast it turn tree with a Cavern of Soul. The face of someone thats playing ANT and sees this coming in to play is priceless. He watches me taking out his tendrills of agony empty the warrens en burning wish!! And scoop. Against stoneforge package take out the jitte en skull and sword. When a player is low on lands take out his lands and so on... you can stop a lot of decks with this card. And besides that is 5/3 for 3 mana.

Now for the artifacts 3 Chalice of the Void main??????? Yes and for the same reason most of times i can play it in turn 2 when u play against blue decks turn 3 for the daze.
The other spells are standard again just stuff to get ur lackey trough (unblocked) en resolve that ringleader to refill your hand.
So this is how it goes turn 1 eather vial turn 2 pitting or other vial. Turn 3 chalice chalice takes out.

Thoughtseize
Cabal Therapy
Dark ritual
Brainstorm
Ponder
Gitexian Probe
Lightning Bolt
Swords to Plowshares
Beserk
Deathrite Shaman
and so on and so on

I played against a lot of meta decks
Stoneforge Package Decks
ANT
Elves
Dredge
Reanimator
Sneak and Show Mirracles
Against all those decks i have good matchups

But thats mostly because of my sideboard
So did i chose for this sideboard.
4x Leyline of the Voids is obvious it kills reanimater and dredge also its pretty good against the upcoming land decks
3x Stingscourger looks like a lot and maby it is but its necessary in my oppinion against emrakul and griselbrand and other big creatures and its easy to vial in too
3x Pithing Needle needs no explanation
2x Tin Street Hooligan for al the anoying artifacts: Jitte Batterskull Sword Ensnarring Bridge and so on
1x Tarfire is good against creature decks to remove early threats and let lackey to the job
1x Warren Weirding to get big creatures out of there and remove the true named nemesis burn al other creatures so TNN is the only one left
1x Sharpshooter a sharspshooter can kill almost anything of death and taxes en elves also a real killer in combination with Siege Gang Commander

I would really like to hear ur guys opinion about my deck list
Thanks in advance!

[Olaf Forkbeard]

I would also like to hear people's comments on this list. It is the first time I have seen anyone combine black and white as splash colors (that I've seen).
...
Goblins
Kevin Deffenbaugh
13th Place at StarCityGames.com Legacy Open on 2/23/2014


I'd like to point out things starting with the obvious. No Rishadan Port because he really wanted his splash colors. Thalia appears to be filling this role.

No Gempalm Incinerators because he simply wanted to kill 5 cards. Tarfire almost exclusively for Deathrite Shaman, Delver of Secret, and Stoneforge Mystic. Warren Weirding probably exclusively for True Name Nemesis but is also Gravy on Tarmogoyf. Sure other cards die to these, but it is not nearly as relevant as those 5.

Huge top end with double Siege-Gang Commander and 1 Krenko, Mob Boss. He simply wanted that powerful end game to be more powerful and less luck of the draw. I personally worry about 22 lands with a higher curve than my 23 land build where I always feel short. Dropping one of the top end is probably something I would do.

17 Goblins that survive Engineered Plague / Golgari Charm. Thalia also survives Engineered Plague more than she doesn't. So... 21 creatures that just don't care. This is huge, Max Tietze's and Jim Davis's lists both had 18 cards that die or were made irrelevant (I'm counting Gempalm as made irrelevant because it's much less useful) to the now popular meta of "Let's Kill True Name Nemesis." Of the 8 in his list that do care -- Lackey becomes irrelevant fast, the longer the game goes. Matron still tutors. That's it.

Also I agree his sideboard is a well crafted piece of art.

I think this man is a genius.





I would like to share my deck with u.
And i would like to hear what u think of my build


I find your build strange for the exact reason you probably love it. mainboard Chalice of the Void and Earwig Squad's. I don't think I could see mainboarding more than 2 of each of these as an anti meta call and in both cases I think general consensus is that doing our own game plan and being pro-active is a more beneficial game 1 and then game 2 the sideboard helps with the defensive maneuvers.

I personally don't like Leyline of the Void but it does what it says better than most cards. 4 Stingscourger, 1 Tarfire and 1 Warren Weirding seems like overkill in sideboard especially with that large removal suite mainboard. I feel like 1 Stingscourger SB is fine because you can matron for it and the other 3 could simply be Confusion in the Ranks. Several people, myself included, are having very good success with taking Omnicience and Emrakul from our opponents. Those 2 spare slots could simply be Pyrokinesis. If you are going to board in removal, make it blowout powerful. Take that Mirror Match, Death and Taxes, Maverick, Elves and Jund. Amongst others to be sure.

Lastly your earlygame appears to be Land a Vial (Very Good), Land a Chalice (Could be meh), hold removal (You're and aggro deck hit them) and wait till you hit 3 mana which could be bad news against Tempo decks. I'd be very cautious about not having a couple of 2 drop creatures in your deck. Hope I was able to help.

Typos

[dissy]

I'd like to point out things starting with the obvious. No Rishadan Port because he really wanted his splash colors. Thalia appears to be filling this role.

I find your build strange for the exact reason you probably love it. mainboard Chalice of the Void and Earwig Squad's. I don't think I could see mainboarding more than 2 of each of these as an anti meta call and in both cases I think general consensus is that doing our own game plan and being pro-active is a more beneficial game 1 and then game 2 the sideboard helps with the defensive maneuvers.

I personally don't like Leyline of the Void but it does what it says better than most cards. 4 Stingscourger, 1 Tarfire and 1 Warren Weirding seems like overkill in sideboard especially with that large removal suite mainboard. I feel like 1 Stingscourger SB is fine because you can matron for it and the other 3 could simply be Confusion in the Ranks. Several people, myself included, are having very good success with taking Omnicience and Emrakul from our opponents. Those 2 spare slots could simply be Pyrokinesis. If you are going to board in removal, make it blowout powerful. Take that Mirror Match, Death and Taxes, Maverick, Elves and Jund. Amongst others to be sure.

Lastly your earlygame appears to be Land a Vial (Very Good), Land a Chalice (Could be meh), hold removal (You're and aggro deck hit them) and wait till you hit 3 mana which could be bad news against Tempo decks. I'd be very cautious about not having a couple of 2 drop creatures in your deck. Hope I was able to help.

Typos

At first thanks for the response.
About that Earwig Squad i think its always a killer for example. Turn 3 Earwig Squads takes out:
Elves: Take out Behemoth Emrakul and Proggie, with chalice the deck is dead
Pox/black hate: Take out Plague Massacre Liliana...
Mirracles: Jace, Angels, Mass removal
SFM: Take out the package, Jitte Swords, Batterskull
Combo: Take out Combo
Lands: Take out Combo, dark depths. Needle for the wasteland (beybey loam engine)
Merfolk: Take out TNN irritating Lords
Painter: Grindstone or painter
BUG: Golgari or Plague
Infect: Beserk
Sneak: and Show: Show and tell, Emrakul, Griselbrand
Omni Tell: Take out show en Tell (good luck hard casting omnisience

U have to see it work to see how strong it is.

On the Sideboard part i totally agree with you. Well about that confusion in the ranks i dont really need that, because of earwig quads taking out all the threats.

new sideboard would be:
4x Leyline of the voids: Its just to good
3x Pithing Needle
3x pyrokinesis
2x Stingscourger
1x Goblin Sharsphooter
1x Tin Street Hooligan
1x Goblin Chieftain

Than about the thalia iam not a great fan of that because my 3 chalices do her job. Thalia often goes to the bottom with ringleader.
About that 2 drop. I agree that i dont have a 2 drop but i will explain why.
In my second turn its down to either chalice of the void or burn the opponents creature with:
Gempalm incinerator
Tarfire
Warrenweirding
Stinscourger (Bounce)

I will go voor 2 SGC sounds nice. Also when lackey comes trough en u put in SGC en play a warchief the turn after it's game.
So my changes after ur revieuw is mainly the sideboard. The mainboard just feels to sollid to change a lot.
An extra SGC is a possibility for the main any suggestions what to take out for it (no chalices or earwigs).
Thanks in advance

[OlegtheSuper]

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/27994_Playing-The-Field.html
Lol, nice in bottom

[DragoFireheart]

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/27994_Playing-The-Field.html
Lol, nice in bottom

That article quite clearly shows and tells how easily show and tell can backfire against the player casting it.

[Olaf Forkbeard]

That article quite clearly shows and tells how easily show and tell can backfire against the player casting it.

Show and Tell is a hilarious card to me. See Vorthos.

Teach: "What did you bring to school Timmy?"
Timmy: "I BROUGHT THE ENTIRETY OF KNOWLEDGE AND WISDOM." *Shows Omnicience*
Teach: "That's nice, what did you bring Billy"
Billy: "I brought what Timmy brought!" *Show's Confusion in the Ranks.*

But yea I do agree, the card is symmetrical and can therefore can backfire, sometimes hilariously. It is my game plan against Show and Tell sans Thalia.

[jrw1985]

It looks like Goblins is on the verge of a Top-8 (Currently 7th after R7)! If I recall from earlier, James Miller is playing Rw Goblins. Best of luck to him!

http://8e8460c4912582c4e519-11fcbfd88ed5b90cfb46edba899033c9.r65.cf1.rackcdn.com/www/scg_events/files/20140302181642000000.html

[Olaf Forkbeard]

It looks like Goblins is on the verge of a Top-8 (Currently 7th after R7)! If I recall from earlier, James Miller is playing Rw Goblins. Best of luck to him!

http://8e8460c4912582c4e519-11fcbfd88ed5b90cfb46edba899033c9.r65.cf1.rackcdn.com/www/scg_events/files/20140302181642000000.html

Yea, they had him on a Replay but they cut it off directly before game 3. :/

[jrw1985]

Relic against TNN Blade? Hrmf.

[jrw1985]

Relic against TNN Blade? Hrmf.

And that's game, folks.

[Wilkin]

Relic against TNN Blade? Hrmf.

Yeah that was a bit weird when i saw that. Grim Lavamancer is the only thing I can think of. But that's a bit weak, especially seeing as this Goblin player has Tarfire and Goblin Incinerator. Why try and neuter Lavamancer when you can just kill it?

Maybe he also thought about potentially Snapcaster Mage?

[L10]

They know each other's list. The 2-of Grim Lavamancer is the only relevant card in Majors' list. I sincerely think the Relic was sideboarded in by mistake since Miller did seem surprised when he drew it. Based on Miller's deck list, I would have probably sideboard out a Plateu and a Gempalm Incinerator for two Krosan Grips.

His list: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=64114

[Potdindy]

It looks like his list has TSH as the replacement for MWM. It is an interesting idea since that should make TNN much less potent. Now sure about 3 of them though.

[dissy]

Tournament last day went horrible

4 times against the SFM package
only 1 tin street hooligan in the side board.
Lost al 4 without a chance

played against reanimor that was brilliant.
Lost game one really fast
Game 2 i took out the griselbrand en emrakul with earwig squad that was game
Game 3 i had a leyline of the void in my opening hand so that was game:)

didnt get my confusion in the ranks against omnisience so died twice really fast

So yes i would definitley go 3 mainboard tin street hooligans!! SFM decks are nothing without equipments
TNN without equipments is not scarey at all!!

[Bardu]

Looks like pretty good results for Goblins recently between Jim Davis and James Miller. More of a classic Rgw build, notably missing both Krenko and Goblin Chieftan.

[LeoCop 90]

Well, if you decide to play 3 mainboard hooligans and then face a lot of blade decks i think you are almost guaranteed to have a good result unless you have very bad draws.

Personally i wouldn't play more than two main board , because if you don't face artifacts a 2 mana 2/1 is a crappy card, and because with all the -1-1 effects around i would like to have more resilient creatures. The problem is that all our two drops besides piledriver have toughness 1 (instigator, war marshal, thalia)... so unfortunately some of our creatures will always die to golgari charm and similar cards (if chieftain isn't in play).

[JPoJohnson]

Looks like pretty good results for Goblins recently between Jim Davis and James Miller. More of a classic Rgw build, notably missing both Krenko and Goblin Chieftan.

I was disappointed to see Max Tietze to switch to Stoneblade at a recent SCG event instead of his Gobbos, I hope he switches back!

[dissy]

Well, if you decide to play 3 mainboard hooligans and then face a lot of blade decks i think you are almost guaranteed to have a good result unless you have very bad draws.

Personally i wouldn't play more than two main board , because if you don't face artifacts a 2 mana 2/1 is a crappy card, and because with all the -1-1 effects around i would like to have more resilient creatures. The problem is that all our two drops besides piledriver have toughness 1 (instigator, war marshal, thalia)... so unfortunately some of our creatures will always die to golgari charm and similar cards (if chieftain isn't in play).

Well the thing is its not only the blade artifacts that are irritating there are also things like:
- chalice
- pithing needle (krenko, siege gang commander
- mox diamond wich is a good thing to kill because of our mana denial we dont want them to get arround that
- ensnarring bridge and probably more that i can;t think of right now

But maby i will go for 2 of them main and 1 in sideboard.
Any of u guys have good TOURNAMENT results with chrome mox.

and what do u guys prefer:
confusion in the ranks or ashen rider?
Also i would like to hear some oppinions over thalia main or sideboard.

I also think that at least 1 chieftain is necessary for al those -1 -1 effects also the combination of SGC and chieftain is pretty awesome

i replaced the MWM with the Tin Street Hooligan. Because Jitte en Batterskull are our biggest problems.
Also thopter foundry is a problem because with sword of the meek they out agro our deck.

Than my last question whats the right number for tarefire next to 4 gempalm incinerator?

[max_goblin]

They know each other's list. The 2-of Grim Lavamancer is the only relevant card in Majors' list. I sincerely think the Relic was sideboarded in by mistake since Miller did seem surprised when he drew it. Based on Miller's deck list, I would have probably sideboard out a Plateu and a Gempalm Incinerator for two Krosan Grips.

His list: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=64114

About his list. Seriosly, goblins is still in a good shape.. his list is really awkward.. 3 TSH and 4 Warchief? It really dont seen right. I can be wrong, but a list with more chieftains would be better in this case.
Another thing: If you aim to beat BLADE.decks why play gempalm over tarfire? Gempalm can be answered with a StP or even is too late, while tarfire can deal with delver and SFM the turn they come to the battlefield!

I like 2 MD TSH, it seens good, at least at my field now, but you have to change a lot in the list to do that. Goblins isnt that simple list, straight minded, that you can simply take off 4 copies of something that cost 2 and replace with another goblin that costs 2.. It is a tribal deck, every goblin interact with another one. I like Tuk Tuk over TSH, because he works from vial, warchief and lackey/WInstigator (that is at least 9 to 14 cards of our deck), but TSH is fast, I get it. If you want to play with him I would try to go more aggro, chieftains and perhaps Boartusk Liege, so, even if they dont play a relevant artifact, you got a 3/2 haste for 1R, what is not great in legacy, but not that bad.

@Dissy, I agree on that, 2 is very nice, but 3 seen a bit too much (perhaps when you face 3 blades from 4 decks, 3TSH would be reasonable).

Cya

[GoboLord]

Well the thing is its not only the blade artifacts that are irritating there are also things like:
- chalice
I get the idea that TSH is not only vs BLADE.dec (however, I think that their popularity is the main reason to run 3 TSHs in his list) but also vs. other random artifacts, but Chalice of the Void is definitely NOT among them. Chalice is hardly a problematic card for Goblins, as it is usually set 1 counter and we usually have only Vial, Lackey and Tarfire with cmc1. Chalice won't harm you Lackey, as we have Cavern of Souls to work around that. CHalic eis only effective against Vial if they set it before you resolve it. Tarfire is hardly an issue either, because the decks packing Chalice of the Void (aka. Stompy-decks) usually have large creatures which are out of "Shock"-range anyways. So, these are just some of the arguments why I play Chalice in my SB - it doesnt affect Goblins in the slightest.
But again: I understand your point.


Any of u guys have good TOURNAMENT results with chrome mox.
just a few:
4-1 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=724159&viewfull=1#post724159)
4-1 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=757695&viewfull=1#post757695)
3-1 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=759604&viewfull=1#post759604)
6-2-1 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=767437&viewfull=1#post767437)
4-1 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=768498&viewfull=1#post768498)
4-1 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=772039&viewfull=1#post772039)
4-3 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=778631&viewfull=1#post778631)
1-4 (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=794606&viewfull=1#post794606)
As you can see I also included 2 tournaments where it didn't go so well - just to show you that I don't want to show off, or exaggerate or something like this.



and what do u guys prefer:
confusion in the ranks or ashen rider?

I prefer Confusion in the Ranks, but there is nothing wrong with Ashen Raider. You will hardly notice any difference when plaiyng with the one or the other. The short story is that Ashen Raider is better against early S&T (when you don't have any creatures in play) while Confusion is stronger when you have a few creatures on the battlefield.
Also i would like to hear some oppinions over thalia main or sideboard.



I also think that at least 1 chieftain is necessary for al those -1 -1 effects also the combination of SGC and chieftain is pretty awesome
Agree. As you will notice in the tournament reports above me and Scatman use multiple Chieftains in our lists - partly cutting Warchiefs in favor of Chieftains.



Than my last question whats the right number for tarefire next to 4 gempalm incinerator?
I personally don't like Gempalm right now, so I wouldn't play the whole playset. 1 or 2 copies seems correct to me - but I may be biased since I don't play MWMs at the moment. Tarfire is a good meta-choice, so you could run any number between 2 and 4 copies.

[LeoCop 90]

I just watched the coverage video of james miller quarterfinals against uwr delver... the match shows, like others i saw before, the shit that true name nemesis is. Without nemesis james would have never lost the last game, and in the previous one he was in an absolutely commanding board position until nemesis came down and almost turned around the game state.

It's just stupid that a 3 mana progenitus can exist, and playing midrange creature decks feels a bit stupid when the opponent can just slam that card down and invalidate your entire strategy. I'm not saying it is unbeatable, but think for example about our matchup against delver decks.
Before nemesis, we tipycally just had to survive in the first turns (not being killed by delvers, goyfs, batterskulls or whatever) and then overwhelm them with card advantage. When matron/ringleader started going, we pretty much couldn't lose. Now not only we have to survive the first turns, but we have to make sure to kill them as soon as possible because all our creatures on board and all our removals can now be bypassed by a stupid merfolk. it just feels stupid to have gempalm incinerators and tarfires in hand, ton of creatures on board and can't be able to do anything to a 3 mana 3/1.

Anyway, i just can't wait to beat nemesis decks because i really hate that card and for sure i won't give up on goblins.

[rancOr_]

As a stoneblade player myself, I'm wondering why a black splash with Thoughtseize and Warren Weirding md isn't played that much(if at all). It fixes all the problems this deck has. Preemptively taking a sfm/TNN or Weirding that TNN away is often game changing. Sideboard gives cabal therapy/earwig squad.. or possibly even little 3c splash for Thalia side against combo. Greetz

[ScatmanX]

I just watched the coverage video of james miller quarterfinals against uwr delver... the match shows, like others i saw before, the shit that true name nemesis is. Without nemesis james would have never lost the last game, and in the previous one he was in an absolutely commanding board position until nemesis came down and almost turned around the game state.
Haven't seen the coverage before, but don't think this is actually fair. Imo James some dubioussideboarding in this game.
Thalia is not nearly as good against UWR as against Canadian. They shouldn't be brought in there. The mana requirement it brings the deck also hurts us against a deck with Wasteland. Bringing the K.Grip also sounds bad, since he plays 3 TSH. He dilluted his deck a lot, which hurt him G2 making his Ringleaders way worse. And Relic of Progenitus? Really?
Another thing: Not having Tuktuk nor Stingscourger really hurt him, since he couldn't Vial in an artifact hate, or a Germ remover, that would be awesome G3, and would have probably won him the game. 2-1 TSH-Tuktuk does sounds a better split.

All that said, Miller did played quite tight. I liked it. Only 1 or 2 different moves would me made by me, and of course, the sideboarding and deck construction.

Hope he plays more on camera and that he does well in the other tournaments he plays.

Edit: GobboLord does play Weirdings MD, and Therapy SB. Weirdings is indeed a very good weapon against TNN, but imo, it is not needed. I've been really happy just overwhelming it.

[jrw1985]

http://www.twitch.tv/scglive/b/507673922

1st Goblins match starts at 4:50

Mr Miller loses G3 off of that T2 Wasteland. He fell into the trap of Wasting RUG Delver. He just should have built his mana base toward resolving that Ringleader in hand. Instead he put himself 2 turns behind by Wasting.

Rule of thumb: Never Waste RUG Delver if they have 2 U sources.

[jrw1985]

http://www.twitch.tv/scglive/b/507673922

1st Goblins match starts at 4:50

Mr Miller loses G3 off of that T2 Wasteland. He fell into the trap of Wasting RUG Delver. He just should have built his mana base toward resolving that Ringleader in hand. Instead he put himself 2 turns behind by Wasting.

Rule of thumb: Never Waste RUG Delver if they have 2 U sources.

The following match Mr Pilcher forgets a Vial trigger, then doesn't Tarfire a Dark Confidant. You cannot let grindy decks like BUG Delver draw free cards. Then he Tarfires a Goyf. Hrmf.... wow. Um, ok. Then he scoops to a Dark Confidant before his opponent's last upkeep when opponent was at 3. You can't scoop when your opponent is one untap step from possible suicide.

[max_goblin]

The following match Mr Pilcher forgets a Vial trigger, then doesn't Tarfire a Dark Confidant. You cannot let grindy decks like BUG Delver draw free cards. Then he Tarfires a Goyf. Hrmf.... wow. Um, ok. Then he scoops to a Dark Confidant before his opponent's last upkeep when opponent was at 3. You can't scoop when your opponent is one untap step from possible suicide.

1st game against RUG: I guess what made him lose for sure is when he went for matron=tarfire with gempalm in hand, he knew that gempalm would never kill a goyf, and tarfire only made goyf bigger, I guess that a MWM would be better in that position. He could played matron, gempalm Delver, block one goyf and next turn double block easy.. giving him enough extra time to take to game, well, perhaps.
BTW, even in a match with FoW and daze we can see that tarfire is better than gempalm right now, if he had a tarfife (not a gempalm) he could kill delver and them play lackey, with that play he would have more 6 life.. what is a lot..

2nd game against RUG: The fact that the RUG player goes for a ponder on his first turn, is a sign that he is short in mana? Because that wasteland early sound a bit risk. Well, he could just played Thalia, what would be not that good, as he would just play goyf in his turn, what should change a lot this game.

In 3rd Game that wasteland really costed his game? What could he done with a flooded hand in that situation?

What you guys think about it?

Thx Jrw1985 for bringing this matchs to us.

Cya

[FTW]

1st game against RUG: I guess what made him lose for sure is when he went for matron=tarfire with gempalm in hand, he knew that gempalm would never kill a goyf, and tarfire only made goyf bigger, I guess that a MWM would be better in that position. He could played matron, gempalm Delver, block one goyf and next turn double block easy.. giving him enough extra time to take to game, well, perhaps.

I was thinking this at first, but he's at 3, both Goyfs can attack and he only has 4 mana total. If he goes Matron + Gempalm then he kills the Delver but he only has 2 creatures (Warchief+Matron) to 2 lethal Goyfs and has to block with his Warchief to stay alive. When he untaps he would have 0 board and 0 acceleration and would be at 3 trying to hold off 2 Goyfs. Bad position to be in. Tarfire lets him cast and chump with a Piledriver, keeping the Warchief alive to cast Ringleader next turn. With or without Tarfire those Goyfs were each lethal so why not just pump them +2/+2? The big difference is keeping the Warchief alive to give him a chance the next turn. Sadly he knows the opponent has a Stifle so that Ringleader isn't so good..

But what his list could use is Stingscourger. That's the perfect time for a Sting. Matron into Sting, bounce the Insectile, cast Pile as backup. Opponent attacks with both Goyfs and you chump with Sting and Matron. If opponent stupidly recasts Delver, he can't Stifle you so you Ringleader and might even be able to swing back for lethal depending on what you draw. If he doesn't cast Delver, you're still in a much better position.



BTW, even in a match with FoW and daze we can see that tarfire is better than gempalm right now, if he had a tarfife (not a gempalm) he could kill delver and them play lackey, with that play he would have more 6 life.. what is a lot..

Yeah, the correct number is probably 3 Tarfire + 1-2 Gempalm. So many times on turn 2-3 I keep wishing my Gempalms were removal spells.



2nd game against RUG: The fact that the RUG player goes for a ponder on his first turn, is a sign that he is short in mana? Because that wasteland early sound a bit risk. Well, he could just played Thalia, what would be not that good, as he would just play goyf in his turn, what should change a lot this game.
It's not risky. He has T1 Vial and infinite Thalias, at which point his lands are infinitely less valuable than his opponent's lands and the correct time to Wasteland is always IMO. In this case, it meant no Goyf and auto-win, which seems good.



In 3rd Game that wasteland really costed his game? What could he done with a flooded hand in that situation?


Uncounterable Turn 4 Ringleader. Seems like a good plan when flooded. Sacrificing a land when your only action costs 2 more than anything in your opponent's deck just seems bad.

[FTW]

The following match Mr Pilcher forgets a Vial trigger, then doesn't Tarfire a Dark Confidant. You cannot let grindy decks like BUG Delver draw free cards. Then he Tarfires a Goyf. Hrmf.... wow. Um, ok. Then he scoops to a Dark Confidant before his opponent's last upkeep when opponent was at 3. You can't scoop when your opponent is one untap step from possible suicide.

Both of them misplay like crazy. BUG player wastes a mainphase Brainstorm when there's no reason to dig for anything. He could have saved it until after the Relic was popped to get a surprise 1/+1 on his Goyf or used it to dig for something important later.

There are reasons to not Tarfire that Confidant immediately (Ringleader+1 land plays much nicer with two 1/2 Goyfs than with two 4/5 Goyfs) but those go out the window when he burns a Tarfire for no good reason. Had he not cast the Tarfire at all, less damage from Goyfs, blocking decisions might change, and he would have had it on the last turn... to cast when opponent blind flips Thoughtseize off the Confidant FTW.

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I made top 8 of a 47 people tournament yesterday. Here's the list I played
4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
3 Mogg War Marshal
2 Goblin Piledriver
2 Tarfire
1 Warren Weirding
4 Gempalm Incinerator
3 Goblin Chieftain
2 Goblin Warchief
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Krenko, Mob Boss

4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan port
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Badlands
4 Snow-covered Mountain
1 Arid Mesa
2 Bloodstained Mire
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Wooded Foothills

Sideboard
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Pyrokinesis
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Stingscourger
1 Engineered Plague
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

R1 Pox 2-1
Vial and Ringleader, along with cards like Mogg War Marshal make a lot of his cards do a lot less. G2 my opponent went Engineered Plague > Night of Souls Betrayal, and I lost, which was to much for me to handle.

1-0

R2 UWR Delver 2-0
My opponent told me that he had beat goblins the round before.
G1 I was on the play and lead with a lackey, which met a mainphase plow. On my t2 I played a Vial and a second Lackey. Lackey connected and I took the game from there. G2 My opponent played two Grim Lavamancers and two Stoneforge Mystics, fetching and playing Jitte and Batterskull. However, I had an active Vial and a Scrapper and a Matron in hand. I played Matron for a second Scrapper and took out both of his equipments. I also had to port my opponent mainphase to prevent a Batterskull bounce. With no equipments left (maybe), and me at a fairly stable life total, the game looked pretty good. When I drew a chalice I almost wanted to play it for X=3, as TNN/Sword of X & Y were pretty much all that I was afraid of. ^^ I still played it on one though.

2-0

R3 Hypergenesis 2-0
G1 I saw a Scalding Tarn and a Tropical Island. I ported Scalding Tarn and then wastelanded it, and then kept porting my opponent upkeep. I put my opponent on RUG delver. maybe that was incorrect since he would probably have played something then. G2 my opponent mulliganed to five and didn't draw any action. I figured out he wasn't playing RUG when I saw basics and Spirit Guides.

3-0

R4 BW 0-2
My opponent, who is a friend of mine, went on to win the tournament. I feel his deck has quite a good matchup versus goblins, and he is a great player as well. I made a misplay G2 when I had a cabal therapy in hand. I decided to wait until my opponent played a sfm to be able to take a batterskull. But my opponent missed his second land drop, having kept a seven. In hindsight, I don't think my opponent would keep a onelander unless he had a plague, which he had.

3-1

R5 BUG control 2-1
This matchup was more difficult than I expected it to be. I was paired against a friend who I had been preparing with the night before. It sucks to have to play a friend when both of you need a win to make top 8.

4-1

R6 ID

4-1-1

Top 8

ANT 0-2
I was paired against storm and was t2 killed g1. G2 I kept a fast six with no hate, drew a cabal therapy, buying myself a couple of turns, it wasn't enough however.

The second Tarfire and the second Scrapper in the board were great. I'll probably be cutting the relic, the surgical and the Stingscourger for something else. after having lost to storm, I want to add some more combohate, but I'm obviously biased at the moment. I might take a look at one of those lists that splash both black and white, or add some thoughtseizes to the board.

[Chatto]

Congrats! but one question:



(...)

R3 Hypergenesis 2-0
G1 I saw a Scalding Tarn and a Tropical Island. I ported Scalding Tarn and then wastelanded it, and then kept porting my opponent upkeep. I put my opponent on RUG delver. maybe that was incorrect since he would probably have played something then. G2 my opponent mulliganed to five and didn't draw any action. I figured out he wasn't playing RUG when I saw basics and Spirit Guides.

3-0

(...)


Your opponent didn't react to Port? Weird...

[dissy]

My deck:

23 Land
4x wasteland
3x Rishadan Port
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Aride Mesa
2x Plateau
2x Taiga
2x Mountain

Creatures:27
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Matron
4x Goblin Piledriver
4X Goblin Warchief
3x Gemplam Incinerator
2x Mog War Marshal
1x Siege Gang Commander
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
1x Goblin Chieftain
1x Skirk Prospector
1x Krenko, Mob Boss
1x Stingscourger

other: (6)
4x Aether vial
2x Tarfire

Sideboard:
4x Leyline of the Void
4x Ashen Rider
2x Krosan Grip
1x TukTuk Scrapper
3x Pithing Needle
1x Talia Guardian of Thraben or 1 more pitting needle for this slot.

My problem is i would like to play 3 thalia's mainboard because they take out lots of decks.
The big question is wat to take out for it.

Any tips would be welcome!

also any motivated suggestions for changing the main deck are welcome!

thanks in advance!

[FTW]

My problem is i would like to play 3 thalia's mainboard because they take out lots of decks.
The big question is wat to take out for it

I would cut the 3 Goblin Pyromancer for Thalia. Why are you running 3 main? Seems like a 0-1 slot in the SB only.

[dissy]

I would cut the 3 Goblin Pyromancer for Thalia. Why are you running 3 main? Seems like a 0-1 slot in the SB only.


I would cut the 3 Goblin Pyromancer for Thalia. Why are you running 3 main? Seems like a 0-1 slot in the SB only.

Lol that has to be a gempalm incinerator haha guess i was still sleeping haha (edited)

[OlegtheSuper]

My list and stats in cocatrice

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Warchief
2 Tin Street Hooligan
1 Skirk Prospector
3 Gempalm Incinerator
4 AEther Vial
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
3 Tarfire
1 Stingscourger
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Siege-Gang Commander

1 Plateau
2 Taiga
4 Wasteland
3 Rishadan Port
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Cavern of Souls
1 Arid Mesa
3 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Wooded Foothills

SB: 3 Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 Pyrokinesis
SB: 3 Confusion in the Ranks
SB: 1 Mindbreak Trap
SB: 4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 1 Rest in Peace

2.3.14
2-1 Control Bug
2-1 Pox
2-0 Goblins
2-0 UG Madness
2-0 UB Tezzeret
0-4 WUG Maveric

4.3.14
2-1 Spanish Inquisition
2-0 Goblins
2-1 manaless dredge
0-2 all spells
0-2 Reanimator
2-1 BW Clerics
2-1 Belcher
1-0 UR Stasis
2-1 RUG Delver

5.3.2014
1-2 RUG Delver

8.3.2014
1-0 UB Tezzeret
2-0 Pod Nic Fit
1-0 Pod Nic Fit
2-0 D&T
2-0 D&T
2-0 UWB DeathBlade

9.3.2014
0-2 UBR Reanimator
2-0 BW
2-0 Pinter

10.3.2014
2-1 BRG Deapth Combo
2-1 BRG Deapth Combo

[woodjt5]

I went 4-0 in the Legacy challenge at GP Richmond on Friday to win a Force of Will. Here's the list I played (and have been playing since GP DC):

4 Goblin Lackey
3 Goblin Piledriver
2 Mogg War Marshal
2 Stingscourger
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Warchief
3 Goblin Chieftan
4 Goblin Ringleader
2 Krenko, Mobb Boss
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Tarfire

4 Aether Vial

12 Mountains
4 Cavern of souls
4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port

Sideboard:

4 Ashen Rider
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Chalice of the Void
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pithing Needle
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

Round 1: 2-0 against Shardless BUG. I worked him in Game one. He Abrupt Decayed a vial but he just couldn't answer Krenko once it hit the board. He had to read the Mob Boss when i played it for 3 off of a Warchief. I immediately made 5 Goblins. Next turn it made 11 and he just couldn't handle all the pressure. In game 2 I survived his sideboard jitte by killing all of his threats so that he couldn't keep counters on it. He seemed quite miffed afterwards to have lost to goblins, but I think that this si a very lopsided match up in our favor.

Round 2: 2-0 against U/W Stoneblade.

He never played a Stoneforge Mystic in game 1 and died pretty quickly. He had the Squire on turn 2 in Game 2, but when he fetched Batterskull I just tarfired it and he never caught up. These games were pretty uneventful. I also think his list was a bit outdated, as I never saw a True-Name Nemesis.

Round 3: 2-0 Against Jund

I was seemingly behind in both games but managed to catch up on the back of Warchief each time. I can't remember exactly what happened in the First game, but in Game 2 the board was my lackey and Pileddriver and 4 lands against his Bob and Goyf. He plays a Lilianna and goes -2. I sac the Piledriver and Gempalm the Bob in Response. On my turn I play a land, Stingscourger his Goyf back to hand, hit with Lackey dropping Warchief, and then Play Krenko for 3 mana and make 4 Goblins. The game was not close from then on out.

Round 4: 2-0 against RUG Delver.

I think I cast 6 Ringleaders in 2 games. I kept fetching them with Matrons, being patient, and staying ahead. The most interesting line was in game 2, with me on the draw. He plays a delver, I tarfire it. He plays another delver. I have both tarfire and Pyrokinesis in my hand. I also have a vial that i want to play. If I Pyro, I play around daze. If I tarfire, I keep another piece of removal. I decide to lead with vial. He doesn't daze it, so I then tarfire his Delver. Next turn he plays a 3/4 Goyf. I Pyrokinesis it pitching a Piledriver and he has a hard time finding more threats for several turns. I win this game through TWO Rough/Tumbles by being patient and never committing too much to the board. This still feels liek a really good match up.

So there you have it. I won a Force, which was a great start to the weekend. I made day 2 with Melira Pod in the main event. I was 9-2 and up a game on Valentine Makl (Mackl?) at table 50, but he came back and beat me. I went on to lose my next 3, making it 4 loses in a row, and ended up in 295th.

I really like this Krenko-centric build. I hope you'll try it.

[OlegtheSuper]

8-0 great result, grats with FoW!

[dissy]

I went 4-0 in the Legacy challenge at GP Richmond on Friday to win a Force of Will. Here's the list I played (and have been playing since GP DC):

4 Goblin Lackey
3 Goblin Piledriver
2 Mogg War Marshal
2 Stingscourger
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Warchief
3 Goblin Chieftan
4 Goblin Ringleader
2 Krenko, Mobb Boss
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Tarfire

4 Aether Vial

12 Mountains
4 Cavern of souls
4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port

Sideboard:

4 Ashen Rider
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Chalice of the Void
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pithing Needle
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

Round 1: 2-0 against Shardless BUG. I worked him in Game one. He Abrupt Decayed a vial but he just couldn't answer Krenko once it hit the board. He had to read the Mob Boss when i played it for 3 off of a Warchief. I immediately made 5 Goblins. Next turn it made 11 and he just couldn't handle all the pressure. In game 2 I survived his sideboard jitte by killing all of his threats so that he couldn't keep counters on it. He seemed quite miffed afterwards to have lost to goblins, but I think that this si a very lopsided match up in our favor.

Round 2: 2-0 against U/W Stoneblade.

He never played a Stoneforge Mystic in game 1 and died pretty quickly. He had the Squire on turn 2 in Game 2, but when he fetched Batterskull I just tarfired it and he never caught up. These games were pretty uneventful. I also think his list was a bit outdated, as I never saw a True-Name Nemesis.

Round 3: 2-0 Against Jund

I was seemingly behind in both games but managed to catch up on the back of Warchief each time. I can't remember exactly what happened in the First game, but in Game 2 the board was my lackey and Pileddriver and 4 lands against his Bob and Goyf. He plays a Lilianna and goes -2. I sac the Piledriver and Gempalm the Bob in Response. On my turn I play a land, Stingscourger his Goyf back to hand, hit with Lackey dropping Warchief, and then Play Krenko for 3 mana and make 4 Goblins. The game was not close from then on out.

Round 4: 2-0 against RUG Delver.

I think I cast 6 Ringleaders in 2 games. I kept fetching them with Matrons, being patient, and staying ahead. The most interesting line was in game 2, with me on the draw. He plays a delver, I tarfire it. He plays another delver. I have both tarfire and Pyrokinesis in my hand. I also have a vial that i want to play. If I Pyro, I play around daze. If I tarfire, I keep another piece of removal. I decide to lead with vial. He doesn't daze it, so I then tarfire his Delver. Next turn he plays a 3/4 Goyf. I Pyrokinesis it pitching a Piledriver and he has a hard time finding more threats for several turns. I win this game through TWO Rough/Tumbles by being patient and never committing too much to the board. This still feels liek a really good match up.

So there you have it. I won a Force, which was a great start to the weekend. I made day 2 with Melira Pod in the main event. I was 9-2 and up a game on Valentine Makl (Mackl?) at table 50, but he came back and beat me. I went on to lose my next 3, making it 4 loses in a row, and ended up in 295th.

I really like this Krenko-centric build. I hope you'll try it.

Hey,

Thanks for sharing your deck with us!
I see you don't play Siege Gang Commanders. I played a build that looks a bit like this.
The problem i had with the krenko was that in response to the krenko they always abrubt decay, disfigure, bolt and so on my warchief.
So i never get my krenko to activate.
I play 3 warchiefs en 1 chieftain maby i should switch to tot 3 chieftains so my krenko is more a life.

It seems like u were prety lucky with the match ups.
We can win from fair decks with goblins.
But specially with your build we are kind of weak
But i will give it try

Myself i build a goblin stompy deck with good results (not invented by me although).
The deck is really fun to play but not for ur opponent haha
Main Deck
9 Mountain
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Cavern of Souls
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Simian Spirit Guide
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
4 Moggcatcher
4 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
1 Murderous Redcap
4 Pyroblast
1 Goblin Settler
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Blood Moon
4 Chrome Mox
3 Trinisphere

Sideboard
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Confusion in the Ranks
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Goblin Sharpshooter

Gameplan is to land trinisphere or blood moon as fast as possible. And then al the basic land decks are dead.
And than make a never ending stone rain with kiki jiki en goblin setler. You find your engines with Moggcatcher.

My results yesterday

Dredge 2-0
game 1.
Opening with trinisphere: he scooped
game 2.
Same story

WUr mirracles 2-1
game 1
Turn 1 bloodmoon, he daze me i removed shimian spirit guide. turn 2 trinisphere. he scooped
game 2
Turn 1 bloodmoon, he daze me didnt had mana so it got counterd, turn 2 trinisphere he couldnt counter turn 3 i had my second bloodmoon. he couldnt counter and than i couldnt get my engine so he managed to have some basics and take me down.
Game 3
Turn 1 bloodmoon daze shimian sirit guide so it resolved he couldnt get his basics and i started stoneraining with kiki en settler

BUG 2-1
game 1
Mull tot 3 scoop
game 2
turn 1 bloodmoon forced
turn 2 trinisphere forced
turn 3 bloodmoon resolved and that was game
game 3
turn 1 bloodmoon he scooped

infect 2-0
game 1 bloodmoon. couldnt counter so that was game
game 2 trinisphere he couldnt counter i got my moggcatcher in play he payed a inkmoth nexus i used my catcher in his turn searched for my setler. inkmoth nexus gone. than i searched fo my kiki jiki and it was scoop

It was pretty fun to play this deck and it worked damn good. The problem is that you have to commit to muliganing a lot. But if you are willing to do that it's a really fun deck. and really cheap no duals no fetches. only city of traitors u can build for around 200-300 and it is lots of fun. To see ur enemy scoop after a turn 1 bloodmoon resolving.
For counterdecks if u have an opening hand wich is good than u might even be a ble to pyroblast the force of will!!

[liamb]

Jim Davis has changed his mind?

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=13036&iddeck=95668

[OlegtheSuper]

Jim Davis has changed his mind?

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=13036&iddeck=95668

Read it here

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/27994_Playing-The-Field.html

[liamb]

Read it here

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/27994_Playing-The-Field.html

Thanks mate. That's somehow proves that he was wrong calling 'the death of an old friend'.

[OlegtheSuper]

Thanks mate. That's somehow proves that he was wrong calling 'the death of an old friend'.

you are absolutely right!

[woodjt5]

I see you don't play Siege Gang Commanders. I played a build that looks a bit like this.
The problem i had with the krenko was that in response to the krenko they always abrubt decay, disfigure, bolt and so on my warchief.
So i never get my krenko to activate.
I play 3 warchiefs en 1 chieftain maby i should switch to tot 3 chieftains so my krenko is more a life.

It seems like u were prety lucky with the match ups.
We can win from fair decks with goblins.
But specially with your build we are kind of weak
But i will give it try



I found that Siege-Gang was just worse than Krenko 90% of the time, so I built my deck to take advantage of Krenko. Seven haste enablers and two Krenkos reflect this mindset.

You're right that I got good match ups, but I feel at least 50-50 against everything that isn't combo. We also have a ton of tools to fight dredge and reanimator with this build. Obviously, Show & Tell is tough and Storm is just a terrible match up.

[dissy]

I found that Siege-Gang was just worse than Krenko 90% of the time, so I built my deck to take advantage of Krenko. Seven haste enablers and two Krenkos reflect this mindset.

You're right that I got good match ups, but I feel at least 50-50 against everything that isn't combo. We also have a ton of tools to fight dredge and reanimator with this build. Obviously, Show & Tell is tough and Storm is just a terrible match up.

thats why my normal gobbo build has:
3 thalia guardian of thrabens
4 leyline of the void
3 chalice
4 ashen riders

i will try the krenko one next week but it doesnt feel fast enough for me

[woodjt5]

thats why my normal gobbo build has:
3 thalia guardian of thrabens
4 leyline of the void
3 chalice
4 ashen riders

i will try the krenko one next week but it doesnt feel fast enough for me

I just hate the Thalia version. It makes your terrible match ups slightly better and your good match ups slightly worse. The first tiem I flipped a Thalia off of a ringleader I wanted to throw the deck. My personal opinion is that if I'm going to play Thalia, I'd rather do it in D&T.

Similarly to you, I play 5 pieces of GY hate, 4 Ashen Rider, and 2 chalice in the board.

[dissy]

I just hate the Thalia version. It makes your terrible match ups slightly better and your good match ups slightly worse. The first tiem I flipped a Thalia off of a ringleader I wanted to throw the deck. My personal opinion is that if I'm going to play Thalia, I'd rather do it in D&T.

Similarly to you, I play 5 pieces of GY hate, 4 Ashen Rider, and 2 chalice in the board.

Thats why they are in my sideboard. It kills dredge storm and a lot of other decks.

What do u think of my stompy build?

[GoboLord]

Thats why they are in my sideboard. It kills dredge storm and a lot of other decks.

What do u think of my stompy build?

With this SB configuration you won't really "kill" any storm deck. Storm (ANT and TES) is incredibly hard to hate with just a single angle of attack. Nobody will scoop to a single Chalice or a single piece of graveyard hate. You will usually need them in multiples and/or paired with a fast clock. When I build my SB I ask myself if I want to beat storm or not (i.e. if I expect to play against storm combo on a torunament at least once). If so, then I will need 10 SB slots (at least) to drag the MU down to a 50-50% AFTER game 1.

Currently my SB looks like this
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Earwig Squad
1 CHrome Mox (3 more in the MD)
1 Sharpshooter
3 Perish

Sadly enough this is far from enough to "crush" storm combo.

On a different note:
I really wonder why you guys are playing graveyard hat right now. Could be just me/my meta, but I havn't seen any Dredge deck in half a year now, and only one deck where I would even consider boaring GY hate. Which decks do you want graveyard hate against? And more importantly: what would you board OUT in these MUs?

[FTW]

Thats why they are in my sideboard. It kills dredge storm and a lot of other decks.

What do u think of my stompy build?

Why don't you post it in the Goblin Stompy/Dragon Stompy thread where everyone else is posting their Goblin Stompy decks. This thread is for Vile Goblins.

[FTW]

On a different note:
I really wonder why you guys are playing graveyard hat right now. Could be just me/my meta, but I havn't seen any Dredge deck in half a year now, and only one deck where I would even consider boaring GY hate. Which decks do you want graveyard hate against? And more importantly: what would you board OUT in these MUs?

Noted. Bringing LED Dredge to next major tournament.

[Chatto]

On a different note:
I really wonder why you guys are playing graveyard hat right now. Could be just me/my meta, (...)


Went to GP paris and played against Manaless Dredge and boy, I felt lucky to have Gravehate. I think it's a metathing though... There's always some graveyard-depenend deck in my meta

[Olaf Forkbeard]

On a different note:
I really wonder why you guys are playing graveyard hat right now. Could be just me/my meta, but I havn't seen any Dredge deck in half a year now, and only one deck where I would even consider boaring GY hate. Which decks do you want graveyard hate against? And more importantly: what would you board OUT in these MUs?

I have 3 RUG Delver players and 2 BUG Delver players in my meta. I am a big fan of Relic for the long game. Whenever my opponent Abrupt Decay's anything that isn't Vial, I feel like I'm getting ahead.

[OlegtheSuper]

[UOTE=GoboLord;799452]Which decks do you want graveyard hate against? And more importantly: what would you board OUT in these MUs?[/QUOTE]
Against jund:
+3-4 relics and for example on draw out 3-4 lackeys, on turn -sting, shooter, tuktuk, tin, for example

Against RUG
+3-4 relics, -2 tin, scrapper, sgc

Against ANT, TES
+3-4 relics, -4 ringleders

Against maveric
2-3 relics, 2-3 drivers

Against S&T, Omnitell you may SBin relics fot cycling like Enevoldsen do in D&T.

And so on.

[Goblin Massage Parlor]

Went 3-1 in a small tournament last night (23-man field) using the following list:

Lands (23)
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Wasteland
3x Wooded Foothills
3x Bloodstained Mire
3x Rishadan Port
3x Snow-Covered Mountain
2x Taiga
1x Arid Mesa

Creatures (30)
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Matron
4x Goblin Piledriver
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Warchief
3x Gempalm Incinerator
2x Mogg War Marshal
2x Tin Street Hooligan
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
1x Skirk Prospector
1x Siege-Gang Commander

Spells (7)
4x Æther Vial
3x Tarfire

Sideboard (15)
4x Pyrokinesis
3x Confusion in the Ranks
3x Mindbreak Trap
3x Relic of Progenitus
1x Ancient Grudge
1x Tin Street Hooligan

Results:

Grixis Delver 2-0 (delver, tombstalker, bolt, thoughtseize)
G1: W
board: +4 pyrokinesis, -2 TSH, -2 Lackey
G2: W

Death & Taxes 0-2
G1: L
board: +4 pyrokinesis, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge, -4 piledriver, -2 vial
G2: L

Death & taxes 2-1
G1: W
board: +4 pyrokinesis, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge, -4 piledriver, -2 lackey
G2: L
board: +4 pyrokinesis, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge, -4 piledriver, -2 vial
G3: W

TES 2-1
G1: W (Lackey->siege-gang->piledriver)
board: +3 mindbreak trap, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge -3 Gempalm, -2 lackey
G2: L
board: +3 mindbreak trap, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge -3 Gempalm, -2 vial
G3: W (sharpshooter saved it vs. empty the warrens)

[Sandro95]

Went 3-1 in a small tournament last night (23-man field) using the following list:

Lands (23)
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Wasteland
3x Wooded Foothills
3x Bloodstained Mire
3x Rishadan Port
3x Snow-Covered Mountain
2x Taiga
1x Arid Mesa

Creatures (30)
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Matron
4x Goblin Piledriver
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Warchief
3x Gempalm Incinerator
2x Mogg War Marshal
2x Tin Street Hooligan
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
1x Skirk Prospector
1x Siege-Gang Commander

Spells (7)
4x Æther Vial
3x Tarfire

Sideboard (15)
4x Pyrokinesis
3x Confusion in the Ranks
3x Mindbreak Trap
3x Relic of Progenitus
1x Ancient Grudge
1x Tin Street Hooligan

Results:

Grixis Delver 2-0 (delver, tombstalker, bolt, thoughtseize)
G1: W
board: +4 pyrokinesis, -2 TSH, -2 Lackey
G2: W

Death & Taxes 0-2
G1: L
board: +4 pyrokinesis, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge, -4 piledriver, -2 vial
G2: L

Death & taxes 2-1
G1: W
board: +4 pyrokinesis, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge, -4 piledriver, -2 lackey
G2: L
board: +4 pyrokinesis, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge, -4 piledriver, -2 vial
G3: W

TES 2-1
G1: W (Lackey->siege-gang->piledriver)
board: +3 mindbreak trap, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge -3 Gempalm, -2 lackey
G2: L
board: +3 mindbreak trap, +1 TSH, +1 ancient grudge -3 Gempalm, -2 vial
G3: W (sharpshooter saved it vs. empty the warrens)

I like your mainboard, I think multiple Tin Street Hooligans mb can be great in certain metas. However, I would never board out lackey vs TES, we need to put pressure on them fast.

[woodjt5]

[QUOTE=
I really wonder why you guys are playing graveyard hat right now. Could be just me/my meta, but I havn't seen any Dredge deck in half a year now, and only one deck where I would even consider boaring GY hate. Which decks do you want graveyard hate against? And more importantly: what would you board OUT in these MUs?[/QUOTE]

There is a good bit of Reanimator in my area. And the random dredge decks. And I use relic in the goyf match ups.

[Sandro95]

Goblins on camera right now, at twitch.tv/scglive

[jrw1985]

Goblins on camera right now, at twitch.tv/scglive

How'd it do?

[Lt. Quattro]

How'd it do?

It got wrecked just like every other time time goblins was on camera. :cry:

[Olaf Forkbeard]

Noah Swartz (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=64873) ran the exact same list sans fetch choice as James Miller (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=64114).

Anyone else play with this list? I've found that Krosan Grip is relevant again. The list is also solid. I kept thinking 24 lands was too many but it feels perfect in testing.

[LeoCop 90]

Goblins prefer to smash faces in the darkness of their dirty and stinky Goblin Caves , that's why they are wrecked on camera. Refuse feature matches if playing goblins XD

[jrw1985]

Noah Swartz (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=64873) ran the exact same list sans fetch choice as James Miller (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=64114).

Anyone else play with this list? I've found that Krosan Grip is relevant again. The list is also solid. I kept thinking 24 lands was too many but it feels perfect in testing.

0 Pyrokinesis ! I kinda like it. I'm still not digging on SGC these days though. Also, Ashen Rider seems like it should just be Wear // Tear or KGrip. Or Stingscourger.

[Olaf Forkbeard]

0 Pyrokinesis ! I kinda like it. I'm still not digging on SGC these days though. Also, Ashen Rider seems like it should just be Wear // Tear or KGrip. Or Stingscourger.

I was also wondering about the lack of Pyrokinesis. With Death & Taxes and Elves getting ever more popular I'd have thought these would be here.

On another note due to the increased number of Tin Street Hooligans I also see the nonbo with Goblin Warchief much more often. It's not often relevant but when it is I feel like I just revealed Tombstalker to Dark Confidant-- except it's their Umezawa's Jitte on a dude smashing me in the face.

More directly to your statement-- the deck doesn't need more Artifact Enchantment Hate, it has 3 mainboard and 2 side as is, adding more is redundant and won't be boarded in when you realize you can only take out so much. I think I'd personally drop an Ashen Rider and a Relic for 2 Pyrokinesis.

Gobbo's quote made my notice syntax issues. Just correcting them so that English can be English.

[Sockosensei]

It's been a while since I've posted since I've been playing more test games and fewer official ones, running the RB Instigator list with 7 hastelords.

I've found that a large percentage of my losses are against equipment that I can't answer. Tuktuk Scrapper has frequently been too slow. Although I'm not surprised to see Tin Street in placing lists again, I was somewhat surprised to see 3 copies. Most of the other loses have been to Engineered Plague, especially in multiples. Back to RGb or RGw.

Rough draft of Rgx Instigator

4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
2 Tarfire

4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Warren Instigator
3 Tin Street Hooligan
4 Gempalm Incinerator

5 Hastelords -- still working on the split; 3/2 Chieftain/Warchief
4 Goblin Matron

1 Krenko, Mob Boss
4 Goblin Ringleader

4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mountain
5 Fetchland
3 Taiga
2 Badlands/Plateau/Chrome Mox
4 Wasteland

//Sideboard
3 Krosan Grip
12 Other cards


Has anyone gone the route of Instigator with overloaded TSH recently? 2/1 TSH/Tuktuk split? If so, how is it playing for you?
I'd like to get the hastelord count back to at least 6 -- 4 Chieftain, 2 Warchief. Still debating what to cut.
Would love to hear thoughts on this style of build, the artifact kill, and whether the 3rd color is needed.
Thanks.

[Tormod]

A lot of mountains in the format. I've added a Goblin King to the 75, thinking of making it 2. For 2 War Chief, 4 Chieftain and 2 Kings for 6 pump lords and 6 hasters.

I think less warchief if you're playing hooligan because of the nonbo.

[GoboLord]

It's been a while since I've posted since I've been playing more test games and fewer official ones, running the RB Instigator list with 7 hastelords.

I've found that a large percentage of my losses are against equipment that I can't answer. Tuktuk Scrapper has frequently been too slow. Although I'm not surprised to see Tin Street in placing lists again, I was somewhat surprised to see 3 copies. Most of the other loses have been to Engineered Plague, especially in multiples. Back to RGb or RGw.

Rough draft of Rgx Instigator

4 Aether Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
2 Tarfire

4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Warren Instigator
3 Tin Street Hooligan
4 Gempalm Incinerator

5 Hastelords -- still working on the split; 3/2 Chieftain/Warchief
4 Goblin Matron

1 Krenko, Mob Boss
4 Goblin Ringleader

4 Cavern of Souls
4 Mountain
5 Fetchland
3 Taiga
2 Badlands/Plateau/Chrome Mox
4 Wasteland

//Sideboard
3 Krosan Grip
12 Other cards


Has anyone gone the route of Instigator with overloaded TSH recently? 2/1 TSH/Tuktuk split? If so, how is it playing for you?
I'd like to get the hastelord count back to at least 6 -- 4 Chieftain, 2 Warchief. Still debating what to cut.
Would love to hear thoughts on this style of build, the artifact kill, and whether the 3rd color is needed.
Thanks.

I'd like to quote Olaf the Viking, here:


your statement deck doesn't need more Artifact Enchantment Hate, it has 3 mainboard and 2 side as is, adding more is redundant and won't be boarded in when you realize you can only take out so much. I.

I find 3 TSH in MD interesting too, but I wouldn't go so far to reserve slots in the SB for more artifact hate.
My approach would be to stay a RB Winstigator list (because Warren Weirding, Cabal Therapies, Perish and Dread of Night still work quite well) with a single Taiga and 4 Cavern of souls to cast your TSHs. Also: 4-2 would be my split of choice when playing with TSHs. I would also keep 2-3 Chrome Moxen in teh MD, bc you can fuel them with TSHs in MU where you don't artifact hate. Also, I still don't like Gempalms, so you can cut them to 0, maybe 1 copy in favor of Weridings and Tarfire.

Rough sketch:

3 C. MOx
4 Caverns
3 Wasteland
4 Fetchlands
1 Badlands
1 Taiga
3 Auntie's Hovel
3 Mountain

4: Vial, Lackey, Winstigator, Piledriver, Matron, Ringleader, Chieftain
2 Goblin Warchief
3 TSH (or a 2-1 split with Tuktuk Scrapper, since you can still put it into play via Vial/Lackey/Winstigator)
3 Tarfire
1 Stingscourger
1 Warren Weirding

SB:
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Chalice
1 Chrome Mox
3 Perish
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
2 ?Dread of Night? (or something else)

[Sockosensei]

Thanks for the replies.
I face a LOT of Engineered Plagues, a ton of Jitte/SFM and Ensnaring Bridges, occasional Sneak Attacks, and recently Affinity. I could be over-valuing Krosan Grip or perhaps I just need to become more skilled at playing through these and other cards. Still, I like knowing I will consistently find the countermeasures I need and not have them countered.

Krenko has performed extremely well for me as a 1-of, complemented by the 7 hastelords I was running in BR. GoboLord, I've tried both with and without a 'big guy' as I remember you suggesting you might cut them completely. I've had enough games where Krenko has single-handily brought me back from the brink and turned sure losses into amazing wins. As a one-slot commitment that can be tutored for or hit off Ringleader, and cheated in with 1/5 of the deck, I don't see anything that could replace it in that slot and give equal or greater value.

My experience with the third maindeck Chrome Mox in the BR list has been extremely poor over about 30-40 games. Variance? I can't say. Two copies has been the sweet spot in my experience to date, and if staying with two colors then I would continue to run them.

[Raznaak]

Tourney result:
I went to a legacy tournament at my store, and I got first place! And it was my first tournament! :P
Me decklist:
http://www.essentialmagic.com/Decks/View.asp?ID=1001395 (too lazy to type)

Results:
2-1 against Counter-top (he went Engineering Plague on me on the second play)
2-1 against Painter-Stone (Painter Servant and Grindstone, with goblin wielder)
1-2 against Sneak'n'Show (he pyroclasmed me first game and I was mana screw on the third game)
2-0 against reanimator (rushed him first game and Rest in Peaced him... poor guy)
2-0 against Sneak'n'Show (my opponent really hate Stingscourger now :P)
1-1 with Stone-blade (we agreed to a mutual draw before playing, to make it both in the top 8 instead of taking a gamble)

Top 8:
2-1 against the same poor Painter-stone guy above (double Goblin Chieftain via Goblin Lackey and Talia really shut his Pyroclasm plan...)
2-1 against another Painter-Stone (fucking close, but he didn't saw coming the triple Cavern into double Lackey and Goblin Legionnaire with Goblin Warchief on the battlefield...)
1-1 against BUG (the tournament started at 9h and it was like 19h, so the organisation decided it was a draw for the prizes, but since I had a better tournament, I technically won).

So: Yes I had really favourable pairings and Talia and Chieftains are MVPs; since there was no combo, Mindbreak trap was useless (depening of the meta, I guess...), the Liege was useful once or twice, the Scrapper never, Wear//Tear is FREAKING useful, Rest in Peace too, Needle and the Chalice are situationnal, the Legionnaire should be in the side instead, against "walls" and Siege-Gang Commander won me three games against stallers.

[jimmythegreek]

A blue red goblin would be cool.....out of control of course; yet cunning....me amore!
Ps. Not a flectomancer either.
Ps. Had a few cocktails.

[Olaf Forkbeard]

A blue red goblin would be cool.....out of control of course; yet cunning....me amore!
Ps. Not a flectomancer either.
Ps. Had a few cocktails.

I could get down with Spell Pierce and Divert, but I can't seem to test it. Volcanic Island is currently $203.60 (@ TCG Player Medium - 10:48 AM 3/23/2014). Simply don't have the funds to do it, though I wouldn't mind owning some Volcanics. I suppose I could proxy...



$129.96 : Wasteland
$114.99 : Rishadan Port
$019.28 : Cavern of Souls
$094.94 : Scalding Tarn
$057.00 : Arid Mesa
$044.45 : Wooded Foothills
$042.44 : Bloodstained Mire

At first I thought it was Moderns fault for price jumps, then I noticed Wasteland. I blame Star City Games. This is still one of the cheapest decks in the format at around $1700-- geesh.

[GoboLord]

I could get down with Spell Pierce and Divert, but I can't seem to test it. Volcanic Island is currently $203.60 (@ TCG Player Medium - 10:48 AM 3/23/2014). Simply don't have the funds to do it, though I wouldn't mind owning some Volcanics. I suppose I could proxy...



$129.96 : Wasteland
$114.99 : Rishadan Port
$019.28 : Cavern of Souls
$094.94 : Scalding Tarn
$057.00 : Arid Mesa
$044.45 : Wooded Foothills
$042.44 : Bloodstained Mire

At first I thought it was Moderns fault for price jumps, then I noticed Wasteland. I blame Star City Games. This is still one of the cheapest decks in the format at around $1700-- geesh.


Some players over here in GErmany claim to have some success with blue splash. As far as I know they use Swan Song and Izzet Charm in their SBs. Flustertorm might be an option, too.

[Olaf Forkbeard]

Some players over here in GErmany claim to have some success with blue splash. As far as I know they use Swan Song and Izzet Charm in their SBs. Flusterstorm might be an option, too.

Izzet Charm appears interesting. I can't really see how Swan Song is better than Red Elemental Blast. Is there a corner case or maybe something larger I am missing? Looks better against Enchantress.. and that's it.


I just realized if the Sneak and Show player tries to simply hard cast Sneak Attack it is better, and that could come up if they learn of Goblins usual SB tech for the match-up, those being Ashen Rider and Confusion in the Ranks.


[Further Edits]
Also Josiah Skallerup (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=65256) seems to have done well in the last Star City with an interesting build to boot. 19 land, 3 Chrome Mox, Lightning Crafter, Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker with Double Tuktuk Scrapper main.
[/Further Edits]

[cooljets]

Hey guys, I just put up my best results with goblins so far at this weekend's SCG Open in LA! I ended up with a record of 7-2 to make 12th place out of about 375 players, narrowly missing top 8 after getting my second loss in the final round of swiss. I was really hoping to lock down an even stronger finish to help put our team on the map, but overall it was a good day so I can't complain too much.

Here's a link to my decklist: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=65256

I kept notes of my games and will be posting a tourney report soon, but I just wanted to let everyone know now so they can check out the list and share in some of my excitement for our little green horde. :)

[cooljets]

Looks like Olaf beat me to my own good news. :) I will get that report up soon. What a day!

[Sockosensei]

Hey guys, I just put up my best results with goblins so far at this weekend's SCG Open in LA! I ended up with a record of 7-2 to make 12th place out of about 375 players, narrowly missing top 8 after getting my second loss in the final round of swiss. I was really hoping to lock down an even stronger finish to help put our team on the map, but overall it was a good day so I can't complain too much.

Here's a link to my decklist: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=65256

I kept notes of my games and will be posting a tourney report soon, but I just wanted to let everyone know now so they can check out the list and share in some of my excitement for our little green horde. :)

Congratulations and great work!
I'm looking forward to the report and hope you'll touch on how things ran with only 5(6) removal and no Perish or Pyrokinesis out of the sideboard, choosing Kiki & Crafter over SGC & Krenko, and how often you were able to break games open with Warren Instigator.

[Suitch]

Your WInstigator list is very interesting and fun -- what match-ups do you regret not having the Rishadan Ports and the Thalias?

[GoboLord]

@ Josiah:

Your list is so damn sweet, man. In my testings I was not really happy with Lightning Crafter, I'd like to hear some words about that guy in your tournament report. Also, nice to see that you cut Gempalms entirley, that's one thing I learned after my last tournament too - the guy not as good as Tarfire right now. How did you like SHarpshooters? Could you see yourself replacing them with Dread of NIght?

[ScatmanX]

omg, congratz on the finish Josiah!
Really looking forward to see yor report. Always nice to see Winstigators list do that well.

[JPoJohnson]

Tourney result:
I went to a legacy tournament at my store, and I got first place! And it was my first tournament! :P
Me decklist:
http://www.essentialmagic.com/Decks/View.asp?ID=1001395 (too lazy to type)

Results:
2-1 against Counter-top (he went Engineering Plague on me on the second play)
2-1 against Painter-Stone (Painter Servant and Grindstone, with goblin wielder)
1-2 against Sneak'n'Show (he pyroclasmed me first game and I was mana screw on the third game)
2-0 against reanimator (rushed him first game and Rest in Peaced him... poor guy)
2-0 against Sneak'n'Show (my opponent really hate Stingscourger now :P)
1-1 with Stone-blade (we agreed to a mutual draw before playing, to make it both in the top 8 instead of taking a gamble)

Top 8:
2-1 against the same poor Painter-stone guy above (double Goblin Chieftain via Goblin Lackey and Talia really shut his Pyroclasm plan...)
2-1 against another Painter-Stone (fucking close, but he didn't saw coming the triple Cavern into double Lackey and Goblin Legionnaire with Goblin Warchief on the battlefield...)
1-1 against BUG (the tournament started at 9h and it was like 19h, so the organisation decided it was a draw for the prizes, but since I had a better tournament, I technically won).

So: Yes I had really favourable pairings and Talia and Chieftains are MVPs; since there was no combo, Mindbreak trap was useless (depening of the meta, I guess...), the Liege was useful once or twice, the Scrapper never, Wear//Tear is FREAKING useful, Rest in Peace too, Needle and the Chalice are situationnal, the Legionnaire should be in the side instead, against "walls" and Siege-Gang Commander won me three games against stallers.

Congrats on the finish! The first tournament is the most intimidating I think (: The fact that you saw such great success in it is so great for you! Good work (:


I could get down with Spell Pierce and Divert, but I can't seem to test it. Volcanic Island is currently $203.60 (@ TCG Player Medium - 10:48 AM 3/23/2014). Simply don't have the funds to do it, though I wouldn't mind owning some Volcanics. I suppose I could proxy...



$129.96 : Wasteland
$114.99 : Rishadan Port
$019.28 : Cavern of Souls
$094.94 : Scalding Tarn
$057.00 : Arid Mesa
$044.45 : Wooded Foothills
$042.44 : Bloodstained Mire

At first I thought it was Moderns fault for price jumps, then I noticed Wasteland. I blame Star City Games. This is still one of the cheapest decks in the format at around $1700-- geesh.


Modern legal lands in general can be modern's fault. Scalding tarn and misty rainforest are the two most expensive fetches.

[cooljets]

Okay, I promised everyone a report on my run at the SCG LA Legacy event yesterday, so here we go. First of all, I want to say thanks to GoboLord for the incredibly informative and detailed primer, and everyone else in this thread who have contributed their ideas. It's been a great resource for me to jump start my way back into legacy with the only deck I still had (somewhat) built after my 5-6 year hiatus from the game.

For awhile I was on a standard mono red build with Rishadan Port, Mogg War-Marshall, Gempalm Incinerator, etc, but I seemed to keep running into the same problems that inhibited any large success. MWM was underwhelming without a Piledriver or Gempalm. Gempalm never seemed to have enough guys in play (even with MWM) to take out Tarmagoyf and he can't even target True-Name Nemesis. The "god draw" with Warchief and multiple Piledrivers didn't materialize enough to be able to rely on. Combo was an auto-loss game one without this, and I didn't really know how to stretch my 10 sideboard slots for it correctly.

But then I found one of Gobo's more recent lists with Winstigator/Chrome Mox & the black splash for Warren Weirding/Cabal Therapy, and I knew that was what I wanted to start testing. After building and playing at a handful of smaller Legacy events at my favorite LGS, Eudemonia in Berkeley, I eventually settled into the list I sleeved up yesterday in LA.

//MANA [22]:
4 Wasteland
4 Cavern Of Souls
4 Badlands
4 Bloodstained Mire
3 Mountain
3 Chrome Mox

//CORE [28]:
4 AEther Vial
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Warren Instigator
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader

//OTHER [10]:
2 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Stingscourger
1 Lightning Crafter
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
3 Tarfire
2 Warren Weirding

//SIDEBOARD [15]:
4 Chalice Of The Void
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Earwig Squad
2 Goblin Sharpshooter
2 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Stingscourger

There are basically two main reasons to play a list similar to this one. First, the power of Chrome Mox and Winstigator effectively giving us eight chances to have a turn one play leading to an active Lackey effect on turn two. And secondly, the black splash giving us an effective game against combo without sacrificing much in mana base, or the total goblin count in the deck for Matron and Ringleader purposes. You may also notice that I switched from Goblin Warchief to Chieftain entirely, after realizing that due to having 12 "cheat a goblin into play" abilities, I rarely needed the mana reducing ability, and was almost always wishing it was the +1/+1 ability. I did run a 3/3 split of them for awhile, but when trying to squeeze in a third Tarfire and Lightning Crafter, I realized Warchief was the most expendable.

Alright, with that said, let's get to the tournament!



Round 1 vs Basil Nabi playing Sneak & Show

Game 1: I was on the play, but Basil was able to cast Show And Tell on turn two thanks to a Sol land. I had Matron in hand and tutored up a Weirding for his Emrakul, but he had a Force of Will for the edict and I lost in short order to the annihilating 15/15.

Sideboard
In: 4 Chalice, 4 Therapy, 2 Earwig, 1 Stingscourger
Out: 4 Vial, 3 Tarfire, 2 Scrapper, 1 Crafter, 1 Kiki-Jiki

Game 2: I was on the play again and capitalized upon it with a turn one Mox and Winstigator, but Basil again had the Force of Will. The following turns left him playing land after land without finding any business while I beat him down with Matron and Chieftain.

Game 3: This time I was on the draw and had to mulligan a slow hand into one with Therapy. I made a pretty huge misplay here, naming Show & Tell instead of Sneak Attack when he already had three mana up, and sure enough, he revealed Emrukal, Pyroclasm, Ponder, and two Sneak Attacks. I got really lucky here and he never drew into a fourth mana giving me time to finish him off with Piledriver and a few other guys. Basil was (understandably) a bit upset at losing while I made such a bad play, but I luckily this was one of my only huge mistakes of the day.

1-0

Round 2 vs Ryder Aguilera playing Ad-Nauseam Tendrils

Game 1: Ryder had to mull to five in the first game, but he was able to find LED, Infernal Tutor, and enough other assorted spells to go off on me with a big Tendrils on turn three.

Sideboard
In: 4 Chalice, 4 Therapy, 2 Earwig
Out: 4 Vial, 3 Tarfire, 2 Weirding, 1 Stingscourger

Game 2: I cast a first turn Therapy and snagged an LED, and followed it up with a Chalice on one, and then later another one on two, prompting a scoop before I even put a big clock on the table.

Game 3: I got fairly lucky here when Ryder had to mull to four for his second game on the play and once again my blind Therapy hit (this time I called Brainstorm after I saw him fetch up an island). There was a point later in the game while I was finishing him off with goblins where I forgot to flash back my Therapy with an extra Matron or Ringleader and he told me after the game he did have a few outs, so this was another spot where I had to thank my lucky stars for not losing when making an obvious misplay.

2-0

Round 3 vs Feline Longmore playing High Tide

Game 1: I have never played against High Tide before so this match was a bit of a learn-on-the-fly moment for me. I started with turn one Lackey on the play and used it to drop a Scrapper on her Candelabra. My clock began to get serious with a Piledriver, forcing her to attempt to go off before she was ready and she wasn't able to get there. This failed attempt gave me a crash course in the deck, however, so it was pretty helpful in the following games.

Sideboard
In: 4 Chalice, 4 Therapy, 2 Earwig, 2 Scrapper
Out: 4 Vial, 3 Tarfire, 2 Weirding, 1 Crafter, 1 Stingscourger, 1 Kiki-Jiki

Game 2: It was obvious that my combo heavy sideboard was a huge blessing for me, having to face three combo decks in three rounds. In game two, my opening Therapy was dropped by Force of Will, but soon a Matron snagged me Earwig Squad and without blockers in the way they were able to give me a peek at Feline's deck. My main choices were three Cunning Wish, one Blue Sun's Zenith, and three or four Time Spirals (draw seven's are good, right?). Still not knowing the deck that well, I decided to go with the three Wishes. Sadly, even while feeling like I was about to close it out, she made a last ditch attempt to go off and after being down to the final card in her hand (Ponder), she shuffled instead of reordering and I cut her to a Time Spiral which was more than enough for her to eventually Zenith me for my whole deck.

Game 3: This time I was on the play and I kept a great hand, giving me turn one Lackey, turn two Chalice and Warchief (via Lackey) and turn three Earwig (via Prowl). This time I noticed that she already had a Wish in her hand so I stripped three Time Spirals and she wasn't able to get there.

3-0

Round 4 vs Matt Gosler playing Jund

Game 1: I mulliganed to six and keep a hand with two Vial. My early goblin got Punishing Fire'd and I knew I was lost after both Vial's said goodbye thanks to Maelstrom Pulse and a Hymn to Tourach stripped Matron and Ringleader, leaving me with a single Mox that I didn't have a reason to use earlier. It wasn't long before I was facing down Bobs, Goyfs, and had no way to fight back.

Sideboard
In: 2 Sharpshooter
Out: 2 Scrapper

Game 2: The second game was a longer affair where my opponent didn't have much, but my deck gave me a strange combination of cards that didn't give me any way of capitalizing on his slow start. An early Winstigator brought out Kiki-Jiki (who promptly ate a lightning bolt), and then the only other goblins I drew were all four(!) Lackeys and 2 more Winstigators. Eventually, my opponent started drawing his Bobs and Goyfs again, and my army of 1/1's just couldn't cut it.

3-1

Round 5 vs Bryan Rockenback playing Esper Deathblade

Game 1: This was an interesting match because I had already defeated Bryan the day before in Standard with Devotion to Blue while he was on Esper Control. I was hoping I'd be able to take him down again to keep myself alive after my previous loss, but this time I had to fight back after a subtle yet fatal flaw game one. I used a fetchland on my turn after he played turn one Deathrite Shaman. Bryan used the extra mana to power out a turn two True-Name Nemesis. The game continued with each of us building up our boards, I had multiple Ringleaders and they found Scrapper for his Jitte, but all the while TNN was taking three point chunks out of my life total and he was able to do exactzies with his TNN and DRS the turn before I could have killed him. If only I had played my non-fetch land turn one, I'm pretty sure this game could have been mine. Doh!

Sideboard
In: 2 Scrapper, 2 Sharpshooter
Out: 4 Piledriver

Game 2: Our second battle involved plenty of goblins on my side, with nothing but land-go's by Bryan after his initial Swords to Plowshares and Snapcaster Mage. After dropping him to zero he revealed a hand full of lands and it turns out that he had kept a 5 land hand before proceeding to draw blanks the whole game.

Game 3: Bryan seemed more confident this time, but I had a killer opening with turn one Lackey into turn two Kiki-Jiki who began abusing Ringleader's CIP ability to just completely swarm the board. TNN tried to race me but my card advantage couldn't be stopped.

4-1

Round 6 vs Ross Roemer playing Reanimator

Game 1: Ross began with Dark Ritual into double Thoughseize but my hand was redundant enough to still leave me with a few guys while his Entomb'd Iona never came out to play. I assume he would have chosen red, but here's a situation where Warren Weirding could have saved the day for me, so I held a Matron back just in case.

Sideboard
In: 2 Earwig, 1 Stingscourger
Out: 3 Tarfire

Game 2: Ross mulliganed to six, but still had a great turn one with Dark Ritual into Lilliana. I didn't have any pressure early and the black planeswalker was able to plus-one three times before ultimating. My choice was a pile with Matron, Piledriver, Mountain and Wasteland, Badlands. I chose the two lands since my hand was all 3CC and above (plus, I wanted access to black mana for the Earwig Squad in my hand). Here's where things got silly. After losing his Lilly, Ross continued to rip land after land, while I drew nothing but goblins. This went on for quite a few minutes but eventually he started beating me down with Vampire Hexmages. I finally drew into some Winstigators that traded with the Hexmages, but I was at low life total as I started to mount my own offense. I was able to send the Earwig team on the prowl and tried to locate his remaining win conditions. I eventually settled on Griselbrand, his fourth Hexmage, and Reanimate, and thought I was in the clear. The next turn Ross topdecked a tutor and found a win condition I had overlooked (the black legendary land that sacrifices into a 5/5 flyer) for the game.

Sideboard
In: 3 Tarfire
Out: 2 Scrapper, 1 Crafter

Game 3: I realized that the four 2/1 first-striking Hexmages could be a problem for me, and after checking his deck, didn't see any artifacts, so I went back to the board for game three to replace the Scrappers with Tarfires. Although it ended up not mattering, it proved to be the right decision. I began with Mountain, Lackey, go while Ross just drew and discarded Griselbrand. I hit with Lackey and used Matron to reveal Weirding. Ross took a long time deciding what to do on his next turn, eventually settling on Reanimate and a Griselbrand activation. I was a bit scared, but this action already had him at five life, and his face quickly showed that he had screwed something up. Next turn I had Weirding and attacked for the win. Afterwards Ross told me that he should have cast Ritual before Reanimate on turn two so that he could have also dropped a Hexmage to thwart Weirding, but I showed him the Tarfire in my hand and he felt a little better.

5-1

Round 7 vs Joseph Loster playing Jund

Game 1: This was the fastest game I played all day. We began with a mulligan from Joseph and a turn one Lackey by me. He struck back with a Thoughseize, but when after looking at my hand of multiple goblins and double Wasteland, he scooped before I saw a third card.

Sideboard
In: 2 Sharpshooter
Out: 1 Scrapper, 1 Stingscourger

Game 2: In hindsight, I should have known that Joseph was on Jund, even while only seeing Badlands and Thoughseize, but for some reason at the time I figured he was on a strange version of goblins, so I only boarded in the Sharpshooters. His early DRS and Bobs got smoked by Tarfires, but an Engineered Plague shortly followed, and while I played a handful of turns attempting to assemble some Chieftains and other X/2's, Punishing Fire and Grove of the Burnwillows surfaced and I decided to scoop before showing him I was running four Chieftain in place of Warchief in case it mattered in game three.

Sideboard
In: Stingscourger
Out: Scrapper

Game 3: Now knowing my opponent was on Jund, I replaced the final Scrapper with Stingscourger in case I had to deal with some big Goyfs. This game began with us both mulling to six, but I kept a good hand and chained Lackey into Chieftain and Piledriver to end the game before Joseph could do much of anything. We were nearing the end of swiss, so it was obvious Joseph was a bit tilted after losing two games very quickly, even while having access to Engineered Plague in his 75.

6-1

Round 8 vs Bryan Olvera playing American Delver

Game 1: The energy at the top tables was starting to get a bit electric, and as I sat down against Bryan he informed me he was undefeated. I started getting pretty nervous as I mulled to five, and things got even worse with my turn one Vial getting Force'd, but on turn two or three I played a Chieftain via Cavern and Bryan attempted to Daze it, not realizing his mistake until a Tundra was already in his hand. A Lackey and Stingscourger soon joined the Chief and after chump blocking with an unflipped Delver, Bryan finally ran out of life.

Sideboard
In: 2 Sharpshooter, 2 Scrapper
Out: 4 Piledriver

Game 2: This game was pretty interesting. My opening Vial got FoW'd and he used a Stoneforge Mystic to get a Jitte. I tried to Tarfire the Mystic to keep Jitte in his hand but that just drew another FoW. After that we each used a Wasteland on an opposing dual land, leaving nothing but a Squire on the ground. Bryan hit for one a few times, but I drew out of the landless situation faster, quickly taking him out once I obtained RR for Winstigator who then brought Matron, Kiki-Jiki and more.

7-1

Round 9 vs Yurien Seyssel playing Goblin Belcher

Game 1: After a quick check of the standings, it was pretty certain that drawing in wasn't going to work, as there were 16 players with the ability to leapfrog us if we drew to 22 points while I was at 7th place and Yuri at 8th. I was on the play and was feeling great about my opening Mox into Winsigator, but Yuri's hand of three(!) Lotus Petal, LED, Simian Spirit Guide, Pyretic Ritual, and Burning Wish let him Empty The Warrens and suddenly I was facing down sixteen goblins to my lonely Winstigator. I do believe there was a joke or two about how we were both playing for the same team but I had to move on to game two.

Sideboard
In: 4 Chalice, 4 Therapy, 2 Earwig, 2 Sharpshooter
Out: 4 Vial, 3 Tarfire, 2 Weirding, 1 Tuktuk Scrapper, 1 Crafter, 1 Stingscourger

Game 2: Just like my earlier match against High Tide, I wasn't very familiar with this deck and didn't put 2 and 2 together (he didn't show me any lands game one) and realize this was the infamous Goblin Belcher deck (not just a storm deck), so I actually boarded out a Scrapper in favor of Sharpshooters to take out a big Empty The Warrens. I started things off with a Chalice on zero to stop the mana artifacts and Yuri replied with some free mana to empty his hand and leave him with a Belcher. Now realizing what deck he was really on I regretted going down to one Scrapper, but luckily I was able to take him to zero before he drew three more mana to activate the Belcher.

Sideboard
In: Scrapper
Out: Sharpshooter

Game 3: For the final game I went back up to two Scrappers and down to a singleton Sharpshooter. It was hard to really know how to fill my deck with everything that could be useful. Perhaps it would have been better to drop some Ringleaders or Piledrivers to get up to four Scrappers and both Shooters, but I still wanted the Piledrivers speed and the Ringleaders card advantage. This game started with Yuri staring me down and just saying, "Go." Thankful that I wasn't already dead, I contemplated what to name with Therapy, eventually settling on Goblin Belcher. He revealed his hand to show a smattering of mana acceleration, including two Tinder Wall and a Burning Wish. I was disappointed that I didn't name Wish now, but still felt safe as I could follow up next turn with a Chalice on one. Yuri drew into a Land Grant finding his Stomping Ground and turned his hand into a Warrens for 10. At this point I pretty much knew things were over. With no hand left, I skipped the Chalice for a Winstigator, with a faint hope that he could get through to drop Matron for Shaprshooter, but a Tinder Wall came down next turn to block, forcing me to hard cast the Matron. This meant my Sharpshooter was a turn late, and he got to stare down the remaining nine attacking goblin tokens while still under the effect of summoning sickness. And with that, my day was done.

7-2 for a final finish of 12th place out of 375 competitors.



Some more thoughts on the day, specific card choices, and ideas going forward:

Obviously, as we all know, Lackey, Matron, and Ringleader are absolutely essential to the deck and sure enough, each one did major work all day long. Turn one Lackey is usually our best play, and even though he often gets countered or removed, I was kind of surprised at how often he DID survive. And, of course, once he hits things start rolling and it gets us going fast enough to compete with the high power level of the rest of the field.

Which brings me to my next point: If Lackey is our best turn one play, why not run eight of him? Winstigator does require a mox to get down on the same turn, but the card disadvantage can often be made up for with Ringleader, and other times, it doesn't end up mattering since we gain so much tempo. I know I didn't specifically show it in the report, but many times throughout the day, an early Winstigator led to my favorite play: First strike trigger for Matron into regular strike trigger for Kiki-Jiki.

At first, when trying to put together my deck, I opted for Krenko as my "finisher" instead of SGC or Kiki-Jiki, partly because I thought it would be good to be able to tick my Vials up to four and then leave them there, so that I never had a feel bad moment when I topdecked Ringleader or Tuktuk with my Vial already at five. But the more I played Krenko, the more I realized (just as GoboLord pointed out earlier) he was "not needed and not wanted". If we're not running the Gempalm plan, a bunch more 1/1's aren't always really helpful, and obviously, he was a huge lightning rod that didn't always live to see his first activation anyway.

Once I started playing with Winstigator, I realized the insane power of two Lackey triggers in a row. It's not that often you don't have either a Matron or Ringleader in hand to use as your first Winstigator trigger, leaving you with many options as your second drop. But did I really want to be dropping Matron -> Krenko? It just seemed way better to replace Krenko with Kiki-Jiki, as he doesn't require a hastelord to get value on the first turn. Even if our second turn Kiki gets removed, we still get a second tutor or ringleader flip to preserve value. Compare this to Krenko or SGC: Krenko is completely useless if he gets removed right away (and even if you have a hastelord, you'll probably only have 2 or 3 extra guys). Same with SGC, 3 extra 1/1's really don't compare to the versatility of being able to get a second tutor and get the actual goblin that will be useful going forward. Of course, if Kiki isn't answered right away, we can start going to town on our opponent's end step to have even more attackers on our turn in addition to our card advantage. Once again, I know I didn't remember enough specific details to display this in the game reports, but many times throughout the tournament, Winstigator into Matron/Ringleader into Kiki-Jiki closed games out fast and also left me with many options to deal with whatever answers my opponent may have had.

I did mention it a bit above, but just to reiterate, with twelve cards that are cheating our cards into play, I never really missed Warchief's cost lessening abillity. I will absolutely be running four Chieftain in the future, as they are great with Winstigators double strike, a good way to stay alive against -1/-1 effects, help us close out games faster, and just generally make our team something more than a bunch of stupid 1/1's when facing down 4/4 Batterskulls or ⅚ Tarmagoyfs which tended to happen a lot when I was running Warchiefs and MWMs.

With two extra spots freed up from the Warchiefs, I decided to run one Stingscourger main, which I think is the right choice. Yeah, he's kinda dumb in a lot of situations, and I almost never want him in my opening hand, but having the ability to have at least something to do game one against Show And Tell and Reanimator game one when holding a Matron is worth it.

Next up we have Tuktuk Scrapper. With the popularity of equipment based decks, I think we absolutely want more than one way to deal with a Batterskull or Jitte. I didn't end up playing that many Delver/Stoneforge decks this time, but there are still a ton of them running around, and with stuff like TNN we need a way to deal with the equipment if we want any hope of racing the unblockable 3/1. With the black splash, Tuktuk is our best choice, and even in the more useless matchups we can still bash for two, throw him under a mox, plus our Vials are topping top out at four, which is perfect for him.

Finally, I'd like to mention poor Lightning Crafter. I want so badly for him to be good, but as you can see, the most work he did yesterday was as mox fodder. I have visions of him championing the Matron or Ringleader that found him to preserve value when he ultimately gets removed. I have daydreams of him singlehandedly dropping Delvers and Bobs and Stoneforge Mystics left and right. But for some reason, I have yet to have him do any of this. I may keep leaving him a slot in an attempt to see him in action, but there are plenty of other things that might also be useful. Considerations include a maindeck Sharpshooter (at least he bricks Empty The Warrens and just generally confuses opponents), a fourth Tarfire, a third Scrapper, a second Kiki-Jiki, SGC, or perhaps I could find a way to go back up to six hastelords with his absence (although, he is one of the reasons to even want more hastelords, so I'm not too sure about that).

Oh yeah, I almost forgot the sideboard. 4 Chalice and 4 Therapy are absolutely essential for the combo matchups, and since they are more versatile than more specific combo hate cards like Mindbreak Trap or Ashen Rider (yuck) they end up doing a lot of work and are never wasted space. I was previously on three Earwig Squad, but I think two is enough, as our Lackeys and Winstiagors are hitting more often against combo letting our Matrons tutor them up fairly often. The last few spots aren't as important, and are just mainly there to just slightly tweak the deck against our already solid matchups (the "fair" decks) when we'd rather have Sharpshooter or extra Scrappers in place of a Stingscourger or the Piledrivers.

Anyway, thanks for reading my report. I hope everyone can get something out of it. If you have any questions or comments, let me know, I'll be checking back. It would have been nice to top 8 (or even win) and show the world that our Gobbos are still a team of champions, but I can't complain too much. I still had a great time and, as always, this finish just has me pumped up for my next tournament. :)

[GoboLord]

Thank you for your report. Some comments:


You may also notice that I switched from Goblin Warchief to Chieftain entirely, after realizing that due to having 12 "cheat a goblin into play" abilities, I rarely needed the mana reducing ability, and was almost always wishing it was the +1/+1 ability. I did run a 3/3 split of them for awhile, but when trying to squeeze in a third Tarfire and Lightning Crafter, I realized Warchief was the most expendable.
Very good observation, Iagree with you. Although I'm not sure if cutting them entirely is correct. But, yeah, they are indeed the first thing that comes into mind when you want to tweak the list in a direction of more removal/more fatties7more shatter-goblins.



Round 1 vs Basil Nabi playing Sneak & Show

Game 1: I was on the play, but Basil was able to cast Show And Tell on turn two thanks to a Sol land. I had Matron in hand and tutored up a Weirding for his Emrakul, but he had a Force of Will for the edict and I lost in short order to the annihilating 15/15.

Don't know if that was even an option at that point, but you could also have tutored a Stingscourger in case you had a Cavern of Souls. That would at least delay your opponent'S win for a few turns.



Round 3 vs Feline Longmore playing High Tide
Could it be the case that you played against another member of TheSource? There is a user called feline who wrote the SpringTide deckprimer. Could be just coincidence though.



Game 2: It was obvious that my combo heavy sideboard was a huge blessing for me, having to face three combo decks in three rounds. In game two, my opening Therapy was dropped by Force of Will, but soon a Matron snagged me Earwig Squad and without blockers in the way they were able to give me a peek at Feline's deck. My main choices were three Cunning Wish, one Blue Sun's Zenith, and three or four Time Spirals (draw seven's are good, right?). Still not knowing the deck that well, I decided to go with the three Wishes. Sadly, even while feeling like I was about to close it out, she made a last ditch attempt to go off and after being down to the final card in her hand (Ponder), she shuffled instead of reordering and I cut her to a Time Spiral which was more than enough for her to eventually Zenith me for my whole deck.

Game 3: This time I was on the play and I kept a great hand, giving me turn one Lackey, turn two Chalice and Warchief (via Lackey) and turn three Earwig (via Prowl). This time I noticed that she already had a Wish in her hand so I stripped three Time Spirals and she wasn't able to get there.

You learn pretty fast :-D Well played. Cunning wish is a reasonable target, but usually it's their #4 to #6 way to grab a Timespiral, meaning that Timespiral should usually be your first choice.



Round 9 vs Yurien Seyssel playing Goblin Belcher
Game 3: For the final game I went back up to two Scrappers and down to a singleton Sharpshooter. It was hard to really know how to fill my deck with everything that could be useful. Perhaps it would have been better to drop some Ringleaders
Belcher is among our worst MUs, so there is no point in worrying too much here. YOu can hardly improve you chances, because the whole MU revolves around how fast they are able to kill you. I'd say that, as a rule of thumb, after turn 3 their Empty the Warrens is pretty much useless, because you can usually deal with any amount of token from that point on. So, if you happen to live until turn 3 AND you got a Therapy to cast then you should not name Empty the Warrens, but Belcher of Burning Wish.
Second, it's not unusal to board outRingleaders against combo decks, because the large number of SB cards you bring in makes them much worse. Piledriver should stay in you MD against combo to assemble a fast kill.




Some more thoughts on the day, specific card choices, and ideas going forward:

At first, when trying to put together my deck, I opted for Krenko as my "finisher" instead of SGC or Kiki-Jiki, partly because I thought it would be good to be able to tick my Vials up to four and then leave them there, so that I never had a feel bad moment when I topdecked Ringleader or Tuktuk with my Vial already at five. But the more I played Krenko, the more I realized (just as GoboLord pointed out earlier) he was "not needed and not wanted". If we're not running the Gempalm plan, a bunch more 1/1's aren't always really helpful, and obviously, he was a huge lightning rod that didn't always live to see his first activation anyway.
That confirms my thoughts on the decklist, thank you.



I did mention it a bit above, but just to reiterate, with twelve cards that are cheating our cards into play, I never really missed Warchief's cost lessening abillity. I will absolutely be running four Chieftain in the future, as they are great with Winstigators double strike, a good way to stay alive against -1/-1 effects, help us close out games faster, and just generally make our team something more than a bunch of stupid 1/1's when facing down 4/4 Batterskulls or ⅚ Tarmagoyfs which tended to happen a lot when I was running Warchiefs and MWMs.
Not to meantion that Chieftain can force your turn 1 lackey through early SFM and DRS . Instead of sitting still, you leave your opponent with the choice to either block it and lose their valueable creature, or let it connect and risk to lose right on the spot.



Finally, I'd like to mention poor Lightning Crafter. I want so badly for him to be good, but as you can see, the most work he did yesterday was as mox fodder. I have visions of him championing the Matron or Ringleader that found him to preserve value when he ultimately gets removed. I have daydreams of him singlehandedly dropping Delvers and Bobs and Stoneforge Mystics left and right. But for some reason, he never ends up doing anything and I think it might be time to admit the fact that his slot could be better used as something else. Maybe a maindeck Sharpshooter (at least he bricks Empty The Warrens and just generally confuses opponents), maybe the fourth Tarfire, or perhaps I could find a way to go back up to six hastelords with his absence (although, he is one of the reasons to even want more hastelords, so I'm not too sure about that).
I'm happy to hear some words on Lightning Crafter, even more so to see that you confirmed the conclusions I drew after my last tournament.



Oh yeah, I almost forgot the sideboard. 4 Chalice and 4 Therapy are absolutely essential for the combo matchups, and since they are more versatile than more specific combo hate cards like Mindbreak Trap or Ashen Rider (yuck) they end up doing a lot of work and are never wasted space. I was previously on three Earwig Squad, but I think two is enough, as our Lackeys and Winstiagors are hitting more often against combo letting our Matrons tutor them up fairly often. The last few spots aren't as important, and are just mainly there to just slightly tweak the deck against our already solid matchups (the "fair" decks) when we'd rather have Sharpshooter or extra Scrappers in place of a Stingscourger or the Piledrivers.

How would you like Dread of Night in the SB? I dislike SHarpshooter because he's to slow and "a huge lightning rod", as you would say.

[LeoCop 90]

Nice report and congrats for the result !

I noticed that you boarded in only stingscourger and earwig squad against reanimator. I don't exactly know what kind of deck your opponent was playing because you mentioned he also ran vampire hexmages and liliana's, but against classic reanimator chalice of the void is one of the best cards we have because,set at one, it blanks half their deck. Probably you chose right leaving them in sideboard because his mana curve seemed to be more varied.
Anyway i think you should have brought in therapies because it's good against any kind of combo deck.

[FTW]

You learn pretty fast :-D Well played. Cunning wish is a reasonable target, but usually it's their #4 to #6 way to grab a Timespiral, meaning that Timespiral should usually be your first choice.

People usually seem to target Wish/Freeze/Spiral, but why wouldn't you just exile 3 High Tides? How can they win without the mana?

[GoboLord]

People usually seem to target Wish/Freeze/Spiral, but why wouldn't you just exile 3 High Tides? How can they win without the mana?

http://gartic.uol.com.br/imgs/mural/er/erike/mother-of-god-meme.png
You are right.

On a second thought it depends on their number of lands i guess. They can even go off with a medium - high land count and only 1 High Tide, because Time Spiral reshuffles High Tide.

[FTW]

@CoolJets: Congrats on your result! Glad to see Goblins do so well!



Game 2: The second game was a longer affair where my opponent didn't have much, but my deck gave me a strange combination of cards that didn't give me any way of capitalizing on his slow start. An early Winstigator brought out Kiki-Jiki (who promptly ate a lightning bolt), and then the only other goblins I drew were all four(!) Lackeys and 2 more Winstigators. Eventually, my opponent started drawing his Bobs and Goyfs again, and my army of 1/1's just couldn't cut it.


That's a drawback of running 8 Lackeys. Sometimes you just draw 7 of them.

I'm guessing you only had Kiki off the Instigator and not Matron -> Kiki off the double trigger? Because if you had a Matron or Ringleader out with Kiki then you'd easily profit even if he gets bolted. Sucks that you had nothing else in hand.



Game 1: This was an interesting match because I had already defeated Bryan the day before in Standard with Devotion to Blue while he was on Esper Control. I was hoping I'd be able to take him down again to keep myself alive after my previous loss, but this time I had to fight back after a subtle yet fatal flaw game one. I used a fetchland on my turn after he played turn one Deathrite Shaman. Bryan used the extra mana to power out a turn two True-Name Nemesis.

I'm guessing you had a turn 1 play, either Vial or Lackey? Otherwise I would have waited until his end step to crack the fetch to deny him of the extra mana for a turn. Actually, since T1 Lackey is a weak follow-up to T1 DRS (unless you have Tarfire in hand too), I'd probably only crack the fetch turn 1 if I had a Vial hand. Multiple Ringleaders is sweet though :D

I'm wondering if Rb Goblins should switch back to its 4 Auntie's Hovel + 4 Badlands + 0 fetches manabase. We're a manadenial deck at heart. The format plays DRS. Why give them free mana? Also, decks like RUG play Stifle and we need our land drops. People don't play Back to Basics anymore and Blood Moon doesn't do much to us. The only card that gets a lot better is Price to Progress, but I'd take that risk.



Round 6 vs Ross Roemer playing Reanimator
Game 1: Ross began with Dark Ritual into double Thoughseize but my hand was redundant enough to still leave me with a few guys while his Entomb'd Iona never came out to play. I assume he would have chosen red, but here's a situation where Warren Weirding could have saved the day for me, so I held a Matron back just in case.

Sweet. Back when Reanimator was a DTB in the Mystical Tutor days and the top dog to cheat out was Iona, I loved Rb goblins because Iona couldn't shut out both Weirding and Scourger. You've got both. Nowadays I'm surprised someone would get her against goblins (which has Vial and splash colors) instead of Blazing Archon or Griselbrand.



Round 9 vs Yurien Seyssel playing Goblin Belcher

Sounds like just bad luck with the pairings. This is by far one of the worst matchups (I'm not saying worst only because Spanish Inquisition). Really sucks that you had to face this after a 7-1 streak with good top 8 potential. Belcher is designed to steamroll non-blue decks. Sounds like he actually drew badly too. Thems the breaks.

IMO, against decks that aim to win on turn 1, you should board out Ringleaders.
1) You don't beat combo decks with slow card advantage. That's how you beat blue decks.
2) Ringleader gets worse when you board in a ton of combo-hate non-Goblin cards, diluting your Goblin %.

Removal spells are typically bad too. Combo finishes (Kiki+Crafter) and power aggro cards (Pile, Chieftain) are probably your best creatures. You usually want to turn your deck into all combo hate cards and cards that let you goldfish very quickly. Although the cards you sided out are good choices too. The only thing I would have kept in is Crafter, since an Instigator + Mox + Matron hand is a turn 3 goldfish with Crafter in the deck!!

[Suitch]

That was one of the best tournament reports I have ever read; great job on the reporting.

As for a question, why did you opt to run 4 badlands instead of two or three with additional fetches? fetch lands cant be wastelanded, and the life seems irrelevant.

Also, and this is for everyone, I have been testing a one-of Legion Loyalist: this card has single-handedly won many, many games with all three parts of his ability being relevant, plus given a 1/1 hasty gobo-body.
First-Strike: least relevant ability: extremely useful against a multitude of creatures, such as Dark Confidant, with only one or two toughness; plus lacky-triggers that make it through happen before blocker damage
Trample: the initial reason for me testing it, but actually only the second most relevant: WInstigator and Piledriver with trample? OKAY!
Can't be blocked by Creature Tokens: SUPER-RELEVANT: no more Germs killing Goblins, no more Souls blocking Piledrivers, no more Thopters, no more Warrens-emptied, and no more 1/1 Knights. Stopping Batterskull alone is worth the price of this being a 1-of-75.

Tutorable, immediate, threatening, relevant: my type of card.

[Hof]

report
Nice result and report. I noticed two things in your report:
1. Wasteland mattered enough to be mentioned in only one game, and
2. Vial was countered twice in one match, and didn't seem to matter much overall.

[max_goblin]

Nice result and report. I noticed two things in your report:
1. Wasteland mattered enough to be mentioned in only one game, and
2. Vial was countered twice in one match, and didn't seem to matter much overall.

2. I was thinking on that too. Like, he could -1vial +1tarfire.

@Suitch: Please, show us your results, matches, I would love to read them.

Thanks!

[Olaf Forkbeard]

2. I was thinking on that too. Like, he could -1vial +1tarfire.

@Suitch: Please, show us your results, matches, I would love to read them.

Thanks!

It was countered, because it mattered. He wouldn't of countered it if it didn't matter.

[cooljets]

Don't know if that was even an option at that point, but you could also have tutored a Stingscourger in case you had a Cavern of Souls. That would at least delay your opponent'S win for a few turns.

Oh yeah, good call, I'm not sure if I did or not. If so then I obviously went for the wrong target there.



Could it be the case that you played against another member of TheSource? There is a user called feline who wrote the SpringTide deckprimer. Could be just coincidence though.

Yup, that is definitely her. I just realized she also wrote up primers for Reanimator, Belcher, Stax, Burn, Zoo, and Pox as well as High Tide. What a machine! She was very good at playing her deck.



Not to meantion that Chieftain can force your turn 1 lackey through early SFM and DRS . Instead of sitting still, you leave your opponent with the choice to either block it and lose their valueable creature, or let it connect and risk to lose right on the spot.

Oh yeah, I forgot about this, there are quite a few Squires running around that will only be able to chump Lackey if we're able to Mox out an early Chieftain.



How would you like Dread of Night in the SB? I dislike SHarpshooter because he's to slow and "a huge lightning rod", as you would say.

Dread of Night seems very narrow, especially when Sharpshooter does work againt stuff like Empty The Warrens, Bob, and other non-white weenies. Plus he's a goblin, of course. Honestly, besides Therapy and Chalice, I'm pretty sure I want my entire sideboard to be type - Goblin.

[cooljets]

I noticed that you boarded in only stingscourger and earwig squad against reanimator. I don't exactly know what kind of deck your opponent was playing because you mentioned he also ran vampire hexmages and liliana's, but against classic reanimator chalice of the void is one of the best cards we have because,set at one, it blanks half their deck. Probably you chose right leaving them in sideboard because his mana curve seemed to be more varied.
Anyway i think you should have brought in therapies because it's good against any kind of combo deck.

He was definitely not on a normal, streamlined Reanimator list because he was running control stuff like Lilly and the Hexmage/Dark Depths combo. I thought about Chalice but it didn't seem super good. You're right though, Therapy might have been worth squeezing in.


People usually seem to target Wish/Freeze/Spiral, but why wouldn't you just exile 3 High Tides? How can they win without the mana?

I think she had a High Tide or two in her hand already, so that wouldn't have been a very good pull with the Earwig.


@CoolJets: Congrats on your result! Glad to see Goblins do so well!

That's a drawback of running 8 Lackeys. Sometimes you just draw 7 of them.

I'm guessing you only had Kiki off the Instigator and not Matron -> Kiki off the double trigger? Because if you had a Matron or Ringleader out with Kiki then you'd easily profit even if he gets bolted. Sucks that you had nothing else in hand.

Thanks! Yeah, I had Kiki straight off of Winstigator, otherwise I could have tutored up another Matron or Ringleader before the bolt resolved.


I'm guessing you had a turn 1 play, either Vial or Lackey? Otherwise I would have waited until his end step to crack the fetch to deny him of the extra mana for a turn. Actually, since T1 Lackey is a weak follow-up to T1 DRS (unless you have Tarfire in hand too), I'd probably only crack the fetch turn 1 if I had a Vial hand. Multiple Ringleaders is sweet though :D

I'm wondering if Rb Goblins should switch back to its 4 Auntie's Hovel + 4 Badlands + 0 fetches manabase. We're a manadenial deck at heart. The format plays DRS. Why give them free mana? Also, decks like RUG play Stifle and we need our land drops. People don't play Back to Basics anymore and Blood Moon doesn't do much to us. The only card that gets a lot better is Price to Progress, but I'd take that risk.

Yeah, I had a turn 1 play with one fetch and one non-land fetch to start with. I was just on auto-pilot and used the fetch first for thinning purposes and didn't realize my mistake till he dropped the TNN. In Legacy you really have to pay attention to every detail. I have thought about Auntie's Hovel, but I'm not quite sure if it's better than the ability to go for basics when facing down a Wasteland. Plus a fetch or two before the Ringleaders start chaining can add some slight advantage.


Sounds like just bad luck with the pairings. This is by far one of the worst matchups (I'm not saying worst only because Spanish Inquisition). Really sucks that you had to face this after a 7-1 streak with good top 8 potential. Belcher is designed to steamroll non-blue decks. Sounds like he actually drew badly too. Thems the breaks.

IMO, against decks that aim to win on turn 1, you should board out Ringleaders.
1) You don't beat combo decks with slow card advantage. That's how you beat blue decks.
2) Ringleader gets worse when you board in a ton of combo-hate non-Goblin cards, diluting your Goblin %.

Removal spells are typically bad too. Combo finishes (Kiki+Crafter) and power aggro cards (Pile, Chieftain) are probably your best creatures. You usually want to turn your deck into all combo hate cards and cards that let you goldfish very quickly. Although the cards you sided out are good choices too. The only thing I would have kept in is Crafter, since an Instigator + Mox + Matron hand is a turn 3 goldfish with Crafter in the deck!!

Yeah, the more I think about it, you guys are right, Ringleader can certainly come out against Belcher, I'll remember that going forward. Should have just loaded up with 4 Chalice, 4 Therapy, 2 Earwig, 4 Scrapper, 2 Sharpshooter for my best chances to win.

[cooljets]

That was one of the best tournament reports I have ever read; great job on the reporting.

As for a question, why did you opt to run 4 badlands instead of two or three with additional fetches? fetch lands cant be wastelanded, and the life seems irrelevant.

Thanks! I think I like the full set of Badlands because while I do like fetching early for either a Badlands or a Mountain depending on what I'm facing and whether or not I need to cast something black, I don't like fetching once I've started chaining Ringleaders unless I absolutely have to. Plus, in the fair matchups, every life point IS relevant, especially if many times our only plan against TNN is to race it (when they have too many other guys around to sack to a Weirding). Because of this, I think 4 Badlands/4 Fetch is a good split.


Nice result and report. I noticed two things in your report:
1. Wasteland mattered enough to be mentioned in only one game, and
2. Vial was countered twice in one match, and didn't seem to matter much overall.

Olaf is right on this one, I didn't actually do much Vialing on Sunday, but when it was countered, it was countered because it would have mattered. Wasteland was also important in multiple games, not only did it lead to the turn two scoop by the second Jund player in round five, but left the Delver deck with no lands in round eight. I also didn't mention every single time I wasted a land, it happens quite often, it just wasn't always a key play like in those two examples.

Anyway, I like having four copies of both Vial and Wasteland in the deck, I wouldn't skimp on them.

[Hof]

Olaf is right on this one, I didn't actually do much Vialing on Sunday, but when it was countered, it was countered because it would have mattered.
I mentioned that Vial got countered precisely because it mattered. If I thought it didn't matter, I wouldn't even have mentioned it. To further clarify, except for the times that you mentioned Vial was countered, there is no indication in your report of Vial doing anything important, and your latest comment confirms that to be the case.

The deck obviously worked for you anyway, I just wanted to point that out.

I have tried playing with Vial and Chrome Mox in Goblins before, and I always found the combined card disadvantage to be too much against fair decks in general, and decks with discard in particular. And if I am going to side out Vial out against decks with discard, and against combo decks, like you did, I think there is a case to be made for playing fewer Vials, or maybe none.

[dissy]

Nice report have you been on camera with the deck?

Iam going to a legacy tournament next sunday with the following list: Its for 90% a copy of millers goblin deck

Land 23
4 wasteland
4 cavern of souls
4 bloodstained mire
2 rishadan ports
2 mountain
2 wooded foothills
2 arid mesa
2 taiga
1 plateau

creatures
4x goblin lackey
4x goblin ring leader
4x goblin matron
.. gempalm incinerators
6x hastelords
3x tin street hooligans
1x sharpshooter
1x stingscourger (extra card to take out a blocker turn 2) also it works on show and tell and it can bounce larger creatures)
1x SGC
1x Krenko Mob Boss

others
4x aether vial
.. tarfire

sideboard:
4x ashen rider (show and tell)
3x relic of progentius (reanimator, dredge, tarmogoyf, storm, DRS)
4x thalia guardian of thraben (combo and decks the play a lot of non creature spells)
3x krosan grip (Jitte, Batterskull, engineerd plague, ensnarring bridge)
1x rest in peace (reanimator, dredge, tarmogoyf, storm, DRS)

Only thing iam not sure about is:
how many warchiefs vs. how many chieftains
the same counts for gempalm incinerators vs. tarfire (iam think of 4 gempamls (the draw ability of gempalm is verry good) en 2 tarfires especially because of krenko, although tarfire takes out every blocker on turn 2)

Note: In my meta i expect a lot of delver decks next to a load of SFM decks (last tournaments 20% of the decks involved SFM).

I would like to get some feedback about the right numbers. And maby some choises that i made.

thx in advance

[Sockosensei]

Fantastic tournament report. Thanks for putting in the time and the effort.

You've convinced me to test Kiki-Jiki, the one 'Big Guy' I don't yet own. It does sound amazing with 8 Lackey effects -- and I had completely overlooked copying Tuktuk.

How often were you able to hit on both ends of the Therapy? I absolutely love Therapy with Mogg War Marshal, but in this build there aren't any 1- or 2- drop goblins I want to sacrifice to flashback; Matron could be too slow for the job. Would Thoughtseize be okay in that slot, or a 2/2 split?



Yup, that is definitely her. I just realized she also wrote up primers for Reanimator, Belcher, Stax, Burn, Zoo, and Pox as well as High Tide. What a machine! She was very good at playing her deck.Feline is a tremendous player and has won at least one SCG Open with High Tide (http://blip.tv/scglive/20121118-scgsea-lgc-t2-feline-longmore-vs-matt-pavlic-6449292). You did well to beat her, especially not being familiar with the deck. High Tide players typically board out 1 copy of High Tide to protect from Extractions and make it Wishable. But extracting the three in the deck does potentially slow them down a lot.

[cooljets]

I mentioned that Vial got countered precisely because it mattered. If I thought it didn't matter, I wouldn't even have mentioned it. To further clarify, except for the times that you mentioned Vial was countered, there is no indication in your report of Vial doing anything important, and your latest comment confirms that to be the case.

The deck obviously worked for you anyway, I just wanted to point that out.

I have tried playing with Vial and Chrome Mox in Goblins before, and I always found the combined card disadvantage to be too much against fair decks in general, and decks with discard in particular. And if I am going to side out Vial out against decks with discard, and against combo decks, like you did, I think there is a case to be made for playing fewer Vials, or maybe none.

5 of my 9 matches were against some form of combo, so I did side Vial out a lot, but I do think we want 12 "one drops" (including mox -> winstigator) in the deck. Being able to drop uncounterable goblins into play during the attack step or during our opponents turn is very good. Hands without a Lackey, Vial or Winstigator are almost always a mulligan.


Fantastic tournament report. Thanks for putting in the time and the effort.

How often were you able to hit on both ends of the Therapy? I absolutely love Therapy with Mogg War Marshal, but in this build there aren't any 1- or 2- drop goblins I want to sacrifice to flashback; Matron could be too slow for the job. Would Thoughtseize be okay in that slot, or a 2/2 split?.

Thanks! Honestly, forgetting to flashback my Therapy's was a recurring mistake I kept making, luckily for me it didn't really end up mattering. But finding the goblin to sacrifice for flashback shouldn't' be that hard. Matron, Ringleader, an extra (or mid game) Lackey, even Kiki-Jiki tokens all work out just fine. I don't think I would want to go to Thoughseize unless I was trying to jam more than 4 discard spells in the deck.

[Sockosensei]

5 of my 9 matches were against some form of combo, so I did side Vial out a lot, but I do think we want 12 "one drops" (including mox -> winstigator) in the deck. Being able to drop uncounterable goblins into play during the attack step or during our opponents turn is very good. Hands without a Lackey, Vial or Winstigator are almost always a mulligan.
See, here's where I've had trouble.
It's very easy to mull those hands and then have your six include double Mox, or even Instigator + Mox but only one other creature which you may need to put on the Mox anyway. That puts a lot of pressure on your Ringleaders to draw you back in, if you see a Ringleader to begin with; it's even more so without Gempalms. These situations have come up an awful lot for me. Perhaps Kiki is the difference here, giving you double value off of key cards?



Thanks! Honestly, forgetting to flashback my Therapy's was a recurring mistake I kept making, luckily for me it didn't really end up mattering. But finding the goblin to sacrifice for flashback shouldn't' be that hard. Matron, Ringleader, an extra (or mid game) Lackey, even Kiki-Jiki tokens all work out just fine. I don't think I would want to go to Thoughseize unless I was trying to jam more than 4 discard spells in the deck.

If you're facing Storm, Belcher, SI, or any other quick combo, you really need to *hit* with Therapy, and even that may not be enough. What is the cost of missing? Finding goblins to sac mid game is no problem, but in the first two turns it's rough as you also need to keep the clock going. I'm not arguing the power of Therapy--it's awesome--just whether it fits our needs here. What matchups are people bringing it in for aside from combo matchups?

[max_goblin]

It was countered, because it mattered. He wouldn't of countered it if it didn't matter.

Well.. this is not the case but.. that isnt always true. Just because someone cast their FoW into something, this dont means that they made the right call.

Anyway, instead of only saying narrow minded things I did some search in his report and he talked about vial 7 times. 4 of them he leaved his vials at sideboard, and in 3 situations it got destroyed:

1 against jund
1 FoW'ed agasint Delver
1 FoW'ed against Delver

Vial is relevant in this match ups? Yes ok, but so is tarfire!

I am not saying, cut vial out, just saying, Hey, perhaps vial isnt that much right now.. few people playing counters.. a lot more removal.. a lot more creatures in the table.. I guess we should really start to think about our field and not only in what we used to play.

Anyway, if I have the time to play some goblins again, I will try to cut vials from the deck and see what happens =]
if shit happens, at least, we will know.

Cya

[GoboLord]

I am not saying, cut vial out, just saying, Hey, perhaps vial isnt that much right now.. few people playing counters.. a lot more removal.. a lot more creatures in the table.. I guess we should really start to think about our field and not only in what we used to play.

Anyway, if I have the time to play some goblins again, I will try to cut vials from the deck and see what happens =]
if shit happens, at least, we will know.

Cya

...and shit will happen.
I had the same impression on Aether Vial in the past few months, which is why I frequently boarded it out, sometimes I just wanted to know how it works. In my last tournament I faced 0 combo decks and boarded out Vial every Game 2 (I must have been thinking something like, "hey, let's try it") and it was horrible. I had to re-take that lesson where I learned how Essential Vial is for the deck. Counter-proofness is admittedly the least important reason to include it. BUt with a manacurve as high as our'S we can't really afford NOT running it. Also, GOblins with Flash are much more scary than Goblin with Sorcery-speed. We are way less threatening when we are reduced to playing only 1 creature each turn (which is likely the case when you don't have a Vial online).

For reference (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=795110&viewfull=1#post795110). Also note ScatmanX's reply to my posting.

[cooljets]

See, here's where I've had trouble.
It's very easy to mull those hands and then have your six include double Mox, or even Instigator + Mox but only one other creature which you may need to put on the Mox anyway. That puts a lot of pressure on your Ringleaders to draw you back in, if you see a Ringleader to begin with; it's even more so without Gempalms. These situations have come up an awful lot for me. Perhaps Kiki is the difference here, giving you double value off of key cards?

If you're facing Storm, Belcher, SI, or any other quick combo, you really need to *hit* with Therapy, and even that may not be enough. What is the cost of missing? Finding goblins to sac mid game is no problem, but in the first two turns it's rough as you also need to keep the clock going. I'm not arguing the power of Therapy--it's awesome--just whether it fits our needs here. What matchups are people bringing it in for aside from combo matchups?

Kiki was helpful in gaining back card advantage, for sure. Hitting with Therapy is important, and I did lose to Belcher when I didn't hit one game, by the time I was able to flashback it was too late.


Well.. this is not the case but.. that isnt always true. Just because someone cast their FoW into something, this dont means that they made the right call.

Anyway, instead of only saying narrow minded things I did some search in his report and he talked about vial 7 times. 4 of them he leaved his vials at sideboard, and in 3 situations it got destroyed:

1 against jund
1 FoW'ed agasint Delver
1 FoW'ed against Delver

Vial is relevant in this match ups? Yes ok, but so is tarfire!

I am not saying, cut vial out, just saying, Hey, perhaps vial isnt that much right now.. few people playing counters.. a lot more removal.. a lot more creatures in the table.. I guess we should really start to think about our field and not only in what we used to play.

Anyway, if I have the time to play some goblins again, I will try to cut vials from the deck and see what happens =]
if shit happens, at least, we will know.

Cya

I actually like when people use stuff like abrupt decay on it, as that just means there's less removal targeting goblins. Also there are still infinite decks with FoW and Daze. Feel free to try the deck without them (or with fewer), but I'm keeping the full set.

[cooljets]

Has anyone tried Goblin Settler yet? I'm thinking about picking up a copy to try instead of Lighting Crafter. It would be a great target for Kiki-Jiki!

[max_goblin]

...and shit will happen.
I had the same impression on Aether Vial in the past few months, which is why I frequently boarded it out, sometimes I just wanted to know how it works. In my last tournament I faced 0 combo decks and boarded out Vial every Game 2 (I must have been thinking something like, "hey, let's try it") and it was horrible. I had to re-take that lesson where I learned how Essential Vial is for the deck. Counter-proofness is admittedly the least important reason to include it. BUt with a manacurve as high as our'S we can't really afford NOT running it. Also, GOblins with Flash are much more scary than Goblin with Sorcery-speed. We are way less threatening when we are reduced to playing only 1 creature each turn (which is likely the case when you don't have a Vial online).

For reference (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?19931-Deck-Goblins&p=795110&viewfull=1#post795110). Also note ScatmanX's reply to my posting.

Yes, it was a reply about some post I did, so I remember it. But one thing is just side it out, in some matches and see what happens, another thing is build it to dont rely on vial. Ok, when I say, bring vial down to 3, you dont need to build the whole deck around this, but if you manage to cut it out.. well that is a complete different story.

Oh, btw, I not saying ANYONE should stop playing vial. If you want you can play with Goblin wizard, I dont care, have fun. Just trying to look at a different point of view and see what happens, but seriosly, even if it works, dont mean people have to follow... if we had to do such a thing we should probably stop playing goblins and move to some Blade.deck or S&S, since people think that this are optimal choices for championships.

But we love the green man, so lets just try to make the best from it.

Cya.

[AznSeal]

I love the discussions going on! So quick questions. Which version of goblins is better against which decks? RW Thalia Goblins vs RB Winstigator. It seems like Winstigator is better against combo/racing where as Thalia RW is better for grinding. Is that a correct assumption? If so, then the build is metagame dependent, right?

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I had an interestin g2 versus storm a couple of days ago, and wanted to hear your opinion on it. The game started with me playing a lackey, who met an abrupt decay of an underground sea and a lotus petal. On my t2 I wastelanded my opponent, and after that I was stuck on one land and my opponent on 0 for a while. At one point I discarded a cabal therapy during cleanup, and the next turn is where things got interesting. I played a surgical extraction on my opponents abrupt decay mainly to get information on his hand. He revealed 2 preordain, 1 tendrils, 1 massacre. I had two lands, but no black source, a cabal therapy in hand, a cabal therapy in the graveyard, and a chalice, a piledriver, and a relic of progenitus in hand (those were the most relevant cards). I chose to play piledriver to flashback therapy for tendrils, since I had seen he had no other wincons, and next turn relic of progenitus would lock him out of the game. Other options included playing chalice for one, and playing relic of progenitus to empty my opponents graveyard (which had a lot of cards in it). My opponent also had an LED in play. what do you thin about this situation, what line of play would be correct?

to summarize:

Opponents hand: 2 preordain, 1 tendrils, 1 massacre
Opponents board: LED
Opponents gy: bunch of stuff
My hand: piledriver, chalice, cabal therapy, relic
My board: mountain, wasteland.
My gy: cabal therapy

[GoboLord]

Hi everyone, I had an interestin g2 versus storm a couple of days ago, and wanted to hear your opinion on it. The game started with me playing a lackey, who met an abrupt decay of an underground sea and a lotus petal. On my t2 I wastelanded my opponent, and after that I was stuck on one land and my opponent on 0 for a while. At one point I discarded a cabal therapy during cleanup, and the next turn is where things got interesting. I played a surgical extraction on my opponents abrupt decay mainly to get information on his hand. He revealed 2 preordain, 1 tendrils, 1 massacre. I had two lands, but no black source, a cabal therapy in hand, a cabal therapy in the graveyard, and a chalice, a piledriver, and a relic of progenitus in hand (those were the most relevant cards). I chose to play piledriver to flashback therapy for tendrils, since I had seen he had no other wincons, and next turn relic of progenitus would lock him out of the game. Other options included playing chalice for one, and playing relic of progenitus to empty my opponents graveyard (which had a lot of cards in it). My opponent also had an LED in play. what do you thin about this situation, what line of play would be correct?

to summarize:

Opponents hand: 2 preordain, 1 tendrils, 1 massacre
Opponents board: LED
Opponents gy: bunch of stuff
My hand: piledriver, chalice, cabal therapy, relic
My board: mountain, wasteland.
My gy: cabal therapy

Interesting!

First of all I had cast Surgical Extraction on Underground Sea, not on Abrupt Decay.
Your hand has only 1 Creature. That means: playing Piledriver to flashback Therapy, casting Relic and cracking it next turn to remove Tendrils has two disadvantages. (1) You give up 100% of your damage-output. (2) Tendrils might no be the only wincondition he has (well, that actually depends on what you saw while browsing through his deck).
Casting Chalice @ 1 shuts down BOTH of your Therapies AND you have to cast your Relic before, which costs you 2 turns. Casting Chalice @1 does not seem very attractive here. However, since you already extracted his Decays you might set it @ 1 immediately (don't know what other kind of bounce-spells you saw browsing through his deck). His only Storm engine then is Past in Flames, which doesn't work all too well with few lands and when he can only flashback Cabal Rituals for mana.

As I said, it depends on what your opponent has left in the deck.

Is Tendrils his only remaining Wincondition?
Yes: Cast Piledriver, flashback Therapy naming Tendrils. Next turn cast Relic and leave 1 mana open to react to whatever can make him re-cast Tendrils. This line of play is 100% save, because it is impossible for him to go off with 2 preordain, 1 massacre, 1 whatevercardhemaydrawnextturn in hand and only a LED in play.
No: Cast Relic. Next turn, cast Chalice @ 1 (to counter Dark Rital) and leave Relic open to counter Cabal Ritual. Both together effectively counter Past in FLames, which forces him to go off via Ad Nauseam.

Overall your opponent is in very bad shape already and it should not matter much what exactly you are going to do.

[Sandro95]

Interesting!

First of all I had cast Surgical Extraction on Underground Sea, not on Abrupt Decay.
Your hand has only 1 Creature. That means: playing Piledriver to flashback Therapy, casting Relic and cracking it next turn to remove Tendrils has two disadvantages. (1) You give up 100% of your damage-output. (2) Tendrils might no be the only wincondition he has (well, that actually depends on what you saw while browsing through his deck).
Casting Chalice @ 1 shuts down BOTH of your Therapies AND you have to cast your Relic before, which costs you 2 turns. Casting Chalice @1 does not seem very attractive here. However, since you already extracted his Decays you might set it @ 1 immediately (don't know what other kind of bounce-spells you saw browsing through his deck). His only Storm engine then is Past in Flames, which doesn't work all too well with few lands and when he can only flashback Cabal Rituals for mana.

As I said, it depends on what your opponent has left in the deck.

Is Tendrils his only remaining Wincondition?
Yes: Cast Piledriver, flashback Therapy naming Tendrils. Next turn cast Relic and leave 1 mana open to react to whatever can make him re-cast Tendrils. This line of play is 100% save, because it is impossible for him to go off with 2 preordain, 1 massacre, 1 whatevercardhemaydrawnextturn in hand and only a LED in play.
No: Cast Relic. Next turn, cast Chalice @ 1 (to counter Dark Rital) and leave Relic open to counter Cabal Ritual. Both together effectively counter Past in FLames, which forces him to go off via Ad Nauseam.

Overall your opponent is in very bad shape already and it should not matter much what exactly you are going to do.

My opponent had a past in flames left in his deck. I flashbacked therapy for tendrils and my opponent went of the next turn.

[FTW]

I agree with Gobolord in that there's enough antisynergy between lines of play that the "correct" line depends on ALL the information available, not just his hand. I would Extract and then make notes about important parts of his library configuration. Did he mainboard EtW? Past in Flames? Ill-Gotten Gains? keep AN in? any non-1cc bounce spells? Does he run Burning Wish or is he stuck with whatever is in the main? What storm engine is he likely going to use? Also, how many rituals are in his graveyard? If he topdecks LED and then Past in Flames, does he have enough gas in his GY to win with Tendrils? (EDIT: just saw your post. looks like he did)

If opponent's deck had EtW or Past in Flames or IGG or Burning Wish, stripping Tendrils seems pointless. He doesn't need it yet and if he starts comboing later he can just recur it, find another or with with tokens. I guess you can discard Tendrils this turn, Relic it next turn. But he can still win with Wish into Tendrils or EtW. This really depends on what you saw out of his deck. Hitting Tendrils would be very low priority for me unless his build was really vulnerable.

After looking at his deck and hand, the first thing I'd think about is what's the best he can do? Next turn he cannot possibly Past in Flames (needs LED + PiF off the topdeck) or Ad Nauseam (needs a lot). If he draws a mana source, he can Preordain to set something up. That's the best he can do. The scariest thing he can set up is Past in Flames the turn after. Ad Nauseam is not happening the turn after no matter what he finds (Ritual + AN is still one short). Most likely, he would just cantrip for the next 2-4 turns trying to stabilize his hand.

(EDIT: You said he played Past in Flames next turn... I think that's impossible unless you missed a card in hand or permanents on the field. Or did he play it in 2 turns?)

So I would put a bulls-eye on the Preordains in his hand. His hand is absolute garbage right now and he needs to both topdeck a land and cantrip into various resources and/or a storm engine before he can do anything. If it wasn't your only creature, I'd be tempted to Therapy naming Preordain, crippling his hand. That way even if he topdecks mana, he still can't do anything for a number of turns. But doing so gives up your only pressure, giving him too much time to lucksack draw. You can also shut off Preordains with Chalice. I'd be very tempted to do that. Chalice also shuts off all future cantrips. Those decks are full of cantrips and he desperately needs to rebuild his hand. After extracting Abrupt Decay, if you noticed he has no bounce other than Chain of Vapor (i.e. no way to remove Chalice @ 1), sticking Chalice would be my priority. The question is do you Chalice this turn and give up your other disruption or Chalice next turn?

That random possibility of lucksack Past in Flames would make me want to stick Relic before Chalice just in case.

So I would probably go:
1) Tap mountain for Relic. Go with Waste and Relic open. EOT exile if enough gas to go off with a PiF next turn, otherwise hold up.
2) Chalice @ 1. Go
3) Hold up Relic, ideally with your Wasteland. Cast Piledriver/other creature once you've drawn more lands.

(EDIT: Looks like this would have saved you since he did go for PiF right away)

[GoboLord]

My opponent had a past in flames left in his deck. I flashbacked therapy for tendrils and my opponent went of the next turn.

How did he do that? With LED in play, 0 lands and 0 cards to produce mana in his hand it's impossible to cast the Past in Flames that he most definitely needed to win this game the next turn.



What's the best he can do? Next turn he cannot possibly Past in Flames (needs LED + PiF off the topdeck) or Ad Nauseam (needs a lot). If he draws a mana source, he can Preordain to set something up. That's the best he can do. The scariest thing he can set up is Past in Flames the turn after. Ad Nauseam is not happening the turn after no matter what he finds (Ritual + AN is still one short). Most likely, he would just cantrip for the next 2-4 turns trying to stabilize his hand.


This.^

[Sandro95]

How did he do that? With LED in play, 0 lands and 0 cards to produce mana in his hand it's impossible to cast the Past in Flames that he most definitely needed to win this game the next turn.



This.^

My bad, at this point he had more mana in play, I think he had a second LED in play at this point. (maybe a land too? I don't remember.)

[Raznaak]

I mentioned I won first place last week, here's the top 8: http://blog.imaginaire.com/2014/03/24/tournoi-mtg-legacy-1k-du-22-mars-decklists-du-top-8/
Yeah, I got lucky with the pairings...

[Potdindy]

For those who are encouraging the black splash, how has Tuk Tuk Scrapper been as a 2-of? Have you been able to get him when you wanted despite his 4 cost? The black splash looks really strong in this meta but when making changes to the deck, I noticed that with 2 Tuk-tuks, we have 6-7 4 drops. Im wondering if it is possible to play jund Goblins for 2 Tin-Streets, or possibly, as I will be looking into, 1 of each tuk-tuk and Tin Street main and 1 each in sb. The only problem with that is that playing Warren Weirding means we pretty much need black as often as red so it might be hard fetching for one splash because of the need of the other. Any thoughts?

[Sandro95]

For those who are encouraging the black splash, how has Tuk Tuk Scrapper been as a 2-of? Have you been able to get him when you wanted despite his 4 cost? The black splash looks really strong in this meta but when making changes to the deck, I noticed that with 2 Tuk-tuks, we have 6-7 4 drops. Im wondering if it is possible to play jund Goblins for 2 Tin-Streets, or possibly, as I will be looking into, 1 of each tuk-tuk and Tin Street main and 1 each in sb. The only problem with that is that playing Warren Weirding means we pretty much need black as often as red so it might be hard fetching for one splash because of the need of the other. Any thoughts?

I play one Scrapper maindeck and one sideboard, and they have worked pretty well for me. They are great at fighting lategame artifacts (mostly equipments), and even an early batterskull doesn't come online until turn three or so. The black splash has a lot of great cards to offer. What I've noticed is that you want to make sure you have enough black sources in the deck, I'm currently on 7 and it feels too light in my opinion.

[Valtrix]

Im wondering if it is possible to play jund Goblins for 2 Tin-Streets, or possibly, as I will be looking into, 1 of each tuk-tuk and Tin Street main and 1 each in sb. The only problem with that is that playing Warren Weirding means we pretty much need black as often as red so it might be hard fetching for one splash because of the need of the other. Any thoughts?

Remember that caverns can help you get green for tin street.

[Potdindy]

Remember that caverns can help you get green for tin street.

Definitely, which is another reason that Caverns is so good. I haven't played any Stoneforge decks lately and not since TNN came out so I'm still wondering if Tuk tuk can hit an early Jitte or BS consistantly.

[GoboLord]

Going to attend a tourney this weekend. Here'S the list I'm planning to play:

MANA (22)
4 Caverns
4 Auntie's Hovel
1 Badlands
4 Fetchlands
3 Wasteland
3 Mountain
3 Chrome Mox

CORE (28)
4 Vial
4 Lackey
4 Winstigator
4 Piledriver
4 Chieftain
4 Matron
4 Ringleader

OTHERS (10)
3 Warchiefs
4 Tarfire
1 Stingscourger
1 Warren Weiriding
1 Tuktuk Scrapper

Sideboard (15)
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Perish
2 Earwig Squad
2 Rakdos Charm


Thoughts
* 4 Tarfire, 0 Gempalm: tuning the list towards killing Squires more consistantly
* 0 "fatties" (Krenko, Crafter, SGC) because I still don't feel the need to do so
* 2 Rakdos Charm as additional artifact hate, that can still work well enough against some combo decks.
* the rest of the MD and SB should be self-explanatory and is still the core of cards I would not wnat to change

Comments, especially on Rakdos Charm ( I dont have any notable experience with the card), are welcome.

[Lejay]

I thought about rain of gore sideboard for my own RB build yesterday against punishing fire, griselbrand, batterskull and tendrils. Test that for me.

[GoboLord]

I thought about rain of gore sideboard for my own RB build yesterday against punishing fire, griselbrand, batterskull and tendrils. Test that for me.

Nice! I will test that. Although I'm not sure if it works against Punishing Fire. Since, "If a spell or ability would cause its controller to gain life" says that it only works if I am the controller of Grove of the Burnwillows.

[Lejay]

Right. That's because I thought about vortex first, and then realized rain of gore did a lot of other things. Unfortunately they split the roles.

[GoboLord]

Right. That's because I thought about vortex first, and then realized rain of gore did a lot of other things. Unfortunately they split the roles.

Unfortunately I just heared that Lifelink is not affected by Rain of Gore, because the source of lifegain is not an ability, but combat damage. Makes the card much less attractive, because it only leaves us with countering Tendrils of Agony.

[jrw1985]

They should definitely errata that to include lifelink. That would make it almost playable. Almost.

[Lejay]

Doesn't seem right, but anyway I would probably test vortex before rain of gore in my version. I would rather have people understand punishing fire isn't good enough in a TNN metagame but that won't happen.

[ScatmanX]

Comments, especially on Rakdos Charm ( I dont have any notable experience with the card), are welcome.
Rakdos Charm is a good card because it can come up in a lot of matchups, but it is hardly outstanding in any. Still, have your go. For me, in the end, it was just not worth it, but the meta shifted a lot since it came out.
What I got from testing:
- Does not board it in against: Canadian. Keeping mana up to a Dazable spell to try to trick them in combat is not worth it; Snapcaster decks. Same reason why ReB is bad against them. If they have equipment, then fine; Goblins. Blowing Vial and dealing dmg to the face is nice, but if they Vial a Lackey in, you're screwed. UWR. Maybe bringing 1 is ok, but you'll have 2 targets, and you have 2 Tuktuks already.
- It is useful against: Equipment decks (2 at most), Lingering Souls decks (remember you can hit planeswalkers); Low removal decks (to ritual in a Ringleder from a Lackey); Lands and similar grave strategies.
- It is awesome against: Dredge (they'll always miss with Therapy), and you can either knock their grave or kill them; Elves (great if they go for the Glimpse kill); Reanimator (obviously, though pretty much all other grave hate is better); Goyf decks that have equips.
Tis is te experience I had with the card. (also, loved playing it against Lingering Souls...)

ps: moving to Europe is quite hard work. Will try to post more in the next couple of weeks. Been loving the Reports and discussions. Keep'em coming!

[Sockosensei]

I've played 10 matches with Kiki-Jiki so far and it's been every bit as good as Josiah advertised. Opponents spend their removal on Lackey, Instigator, Piledriver and Hastelords, meaning Kiki-Jiki frequently sticks around. The thing I had really underestimated is how well it works with nearly any goblin in the deck, not just the ones with CIP abilities. An opponent can chump or trade with a single Instigator, but Kiki giving you two extras out of nowhere (1 at opponent's EOT, 1 on your turn) is GG if you have anything at all in hand. Piledriver copies become similarly nuts. I'm sure this isn't news to the goblin veterans, I just wanted to emphasize how the density of threatening goblins in the Instigator build improves Kiki's quality and durability.

I've come to agree that Gempalm is frequently ineffective in this build, and will reduce to 0-1 copies.
Very happy with 2-3 shatter goblins and 2 slots devoted to Fatties.

[Sandro95]

Hi everyone, I went 2-2 yesterday with a R/B list.

R1 Merfolk 2-0
His list was a bit rogue, with Tidal Couriers for card advantage. At one point I had the board under control, and he seemed to be out of gas. Then he played his merfolk ringleader and drew three cards. I still managed to win it though, mostly thanks to Krenko.

R2 R/W Painter
I won the roll and kept a six while my opponent mulliganned to five. I lead with vial > port, lackey, and followed that up with Krenko and Wasteland. G2 My opponent had a revoker for my vial, but I played a chalice for one. He recruited for a Manic Vandal to blow it up. He later recruited for Painter's Servant, but I had a Cabal Therapy in hand. He also had an Ensnaring Bridge, but Tuktuk Scrapper took care of that.

R3 Bant 1-2
This deck was a bit different. He played Derevi, along with a Fauna Shaman package, with sweet synergies together with Squee, Quirion Ranger and Scryb Ranger.
I made a misplay here that may have cost me the game. I didn't wasteland him when he only had one blue source. Although I certainly wasn't expecting him to play a Derevi next turn I still think it would have been correct. G2 lackey connected and I quickly took over the board.

R4 Elves 1-2
G1 I was on the draw and died pretty fast. I kept a five with sharpshooter, giving me a chance if he had a slow start, but Hoof, there it was.
G2 I played a Chalice for one, Pyrokinesised his guys and went Chieftain > Piledriver, putting him on a fast clock. I made a misplay on his last turn by porting his Forest instead of his fetch, which would have kept him off black mana.
G3 My opponent got a Progenitus into play t2. I had a Warren Weirding in hand and had one turn to draw a pyrokinesis for his elves. I didn't get there.

[nudon]

I made a misplay on his last turn by porting his Forest instead of his fetch, which would have kept him off black mana.

He can fetch in response to your port and still have access to bayou.

[Sandro95]

He can fetch in response to your port and still have access to bayou.

Yes, but I will then be able to wasteland it before his draw step.

[OlegtheSuper]

I have just won a local tournament with 8 players for slot to the legacy masters liegue.

First tour life from the loam with pushfire, burning wish and devdreams main
First game he won, in second and third games he gave the chanses by keeping hands with bad lands. I took them.
Sbin 4 relic 4 thalias
Sbout 1 shooter, 1 skirk, 1 Tin, 3 tarfire and 2 smth
2-1

Second tour uw miracles with rip+field combo
First game turne 3 kill.
Second he combo out.
Third turn 3 kill.
Sbin 4 thalia, 2 grip, 1 needle
Sbout 3 tarfire, 1 sting, 2 tin, 1 skirk
2-1

Third tour uwr delver
First game I left him with no lands
Second game he did with me the same thing
Third game I mull to 3 cards, so no war, only beating.
Sbin on the draw 1 krosan, 1 kinesis, 1 sting
Sbout on the draw 3 lackey
Sbin on the play 1 grip, 1 kinesis
Sbout 1 skirk, 1 shooter
1-2

Top 4 the same guy with uw miracles
2-0

The final the same guy with uwr delver
2-0 not fast but very safety.

The list
4 lackey
4 vial
3 tarfire
1 skirk
4 driver
1 sting
2 hooligan
3 gempalm
1 shooter
4 warchief
4 matron
1 tuktuk
4 ringleader
1 sgc

3 snow mountain
2 taiga
1 plateau
4 scalding tarn
2 arid mesa
4 wastwland
3 rishadan port
4 cavern of souls

Sb
4 relic
4 thalia
1 kinesis
1 sting
2 grip
1 needle
2 confusion in the ranks

[jimmythegreek]

Is the new r/w god worth testing in a goblin build?

[jrw1985]

Is the new r/w god worth testing in a goblin build?

No. It's pretty bad.

[LeoCop 90]

Well, i think it's not worth playing it in goblins too, but people here claimed that purphoros is very good in goblins, and i think that also purphoros is pretty bad. At least Iroas has a much more immediate impact on the game ( they basically can't block your creatures ) , but i won't play a variant of Bedlam in goblins.

[FTW]

Making your Piledrivers invincible on attack might be quite relevant. Making everything invincible so you can always just alpha strike with Piledrivers might be relevant.

I wonder if Goblin War Drums+Dolmen Gate + random 7/5 indestructible might be worth it for 2RW. Probably not. Purphoros is probably better and easier to cast and animate, and Mountain is probably superior to both.

[Sandro95]

What do you think?

http://www.svenskamagic.com/redaxfiler/artpics/Eidolon%20of%20the%20Great%20Revel%202.jpg

I can definitely see this getting played in legacy, and it seems like a potential sb candidate for goblins as well!

[ScatmanX]

Eidolon is a nice card. If it's size or casting cost were more like Thalias, or f it was a Goblin, it would be awesome.
Right now think it goes into the 'Playable' category. Will get a couple to play in the SB depending on the build (he might be way better in the Mox build).

[jrw1985]

What do you think?

I can definitely see this getting played in legacy, and it seems like a potential sb candidate for goblins as well!

I think there is not a single deck I'd like to side this card in against.

So, like the vast majority of other newly minted cards, it is crap.

[Sandro95]

I think there is not a single deck I'd like to side this card in against.

So, like the vast majority of other newly minted cards, it is crap.

I was thinking it would be good against storm variants, preventing them from going off and dealing damage to them if it is removed.

[jrw1985]

I was thinking it would be good against storm variants, preventing them from going off and dealing damage to them if it is removed.

How does this stop storm from playing 9 spells with cmc 3 or less then Tendrils for lethal?

It doesn't.

[GoboLord]

How does this stop storm from playing 9 spells with cmc 3 or less then Tendrils for lethal?

It doesn't.

YOur argument is invalid, because it is unrealistic that a Tendrils-storm deck is on 20 life when it goes off.

Second: I agree with you, the card is unplayable. It's a slightly better version of Pyrostatic Pillar, which is still inferior to a lot of other cmc2 storm-hate-permanents that we alreadyhave access to, like: Thorn of Amethyst, Thalia, Ethersworn Cannonist, Chalice of the Void and Rain of Gore.

[davelin]

How does this stop storm from playing 9 spells with cmc 3 or less then Tendrils for lethal?

It doesn't.

It does when TES needs to resolve Ad Nauseum or when one of them is Probe