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TkDodo
06-02-2011, 02:25 PM
I have been tinkering around lately with a deck suited for the current metagame. The three most popular decks right now are merfolk, landstill and team america (or bug control).
The one thing they all have in comon is obv. that they play blue, and further, a lot of decks play Jace. Mental Misstep leading to the format being slower really pushed Jace over the edge, and I think it is now THE card to beat.

So what can we do against Jace and blue and, at the same time, not get overrun by aggro?

First of all, we can play blue ourselves. Having access to our own Jaces should be reason enough. I've heard Countermagic should be good too, so yeah, why not.
Second, I think the best answer to blue is: red. REB is a very good weapon against blue mages. Further, Lightning bolt is a very versatile card right now. I know, it costs 1, so it can be misstepped, but: It kills Jace. This can't be emphasized enough, so again: it turnes Jace into an unimpressive 2UU Brainstorm most of the time. It also kills almost every creature, especially those who come down early (except Goyf and Tombstalker, which is a downside). Against aggro, red further gives us the option to play grim lavamancer as a recurring removal. He is pretty much the nuts against merfolk and also good against other aggro strategies.

Blue is also pretty good at drawing cards. Standstill is one of the best drawing engines in a somewhat slowed-down format. We also already have a lot of answers to our opponents T1 plays in the form of counters (MM, FoW, Spell Snare) and removal (Bolt and Mancer), so resolving an early Standstill shouldn't be a big problem.

So now we have something to kill Jace, control aggro until we get to our late-game and draw lots of cards. So how do we actually win?
This is where it gets tricky. Of course, Jace wins us some games, and Mishra and Lavamancer beatdown might win some others, but that does not seem to be enough. So here's why I decided to include the painter-stone combo:
1) It's an excuse to play REB maindeck, so I can really beat Jace and Merfolk and other blue decks (Yes, I think it's _that_ important). With Painter, it's also not completely dead against other decks as an instant vindicate.
2) It allows me to include a Trinket Mage Toolbox. This solves a lot of problems, especially postboard, where I can bring in Needle when neccessary and Meekstone against Goyfs, Tombstalkers and the like. Maindecked, I have EE as a sweeper against aggro and SD.Top, which is pulls you ahead in the midgame.

Now, you could just replace Painter with Stifle and Grindstone with Phyrexian Dreadnought, and you would have a pretty straight forward U/r Dreadstill deck. But in my opinion, there's a pretty big difference between comboing into a 12/12 creature which needs to be able to attack twice or comboing into ... oops, I win. You could argue that Painter does less on himself than Stifle, but in this deck, I don't even think so. Stifle is primarily a tempo card. I don't see a lot of sense in stifling a fetch and then dropping ... Standstill. Apart from killing lands, stifle doesn't do much. Stifling Jace's ultimate is good, but if you let it come that far, something went wrong in the first place. Painter also has a good defensive body, can't be misstepped, turns on REB and turns off every "Sword of A and B" (which is one of my favourite moves).

A lot of the value of this deck comes from people playing badly against it. People play bad against Standstill, we already know that. Like, cracking it in their mainphase after 3-4 turns of doing nothing and so on. But they also tend to play bad against Painter (at least in this build), tending to fight pretty hard to get that Painter sworded, only to realise that I don't really need him to win. I think that's the real beauty with this deck - it's not at all dependent on the combo. In fact, I sided it out a couple of times (especially against SnT).
Why even include it then if it is not really needed? First, 1) and 2) from above (especially 1) are good reasons to do so. Second, in situations where you cannot handle a threat that slipped through your Countermagic and removal, it helps to know that you can still win by getting the combo out in the next couple of turns. It is also one of the best ways to assemble the "perfect hand" while people try to sit out Standstill to crack it on your endstep. Draw 3, discard the unnecessary, let them play their goyfs/bobs/stoneforges or whatever they believe is good right now and just kill them. The other perfect hand includes just Jace and a ton of counters, but I definitely prefer the first one. In fact, there is still a lot that can go wrong with a Jace in play, and people tend to scoop way too often in these spots (but that's another issue).

So, for reference, here is the list I've been testing lately with quite some success. Team America is still probably the better choice, because everything they have is essentially a bomb, while some cards in my build are very situational (like, it sucks top-decking a Painter at the wrong time). But if you have fun frying some fish and surprising the control player with an unusual build, I suggest you give the following list a try:


2 Island
1 Mountain
4 Volcanic Island
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Polluted Delta
3 Mishra's Factory
3 Wasteland
1 Academy Ruins

4 Painter's Servant
3 Grim Lavamancer
2 Trinket Mage

1 Grindstone
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Sensei's Divining Top

4 Force of Will
4 Mental Misstep
4 Brainstorm
3 Spell Snare
3 Lightning Bolt
2 Red Elemental Blast

4 Standstill

2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor


I would be happy to get some constructive feedback from the community.
Thanks,
TkDodo

keys
06-02-2011, 04:05 PM
Looks cool. As a former Dreadstill player and current PainterStone player, I'm interested to try it. I feel like I want to fit a Basilisk Collar in there for funsies with Lavamancer, but maybe that's too cute.

TkDodo
06-02-2011, 04:55 PM
I wanted to try a Collar too, but in the first few testings, it wasn't overwhelming. Granted, I always got it when I wished it was something else, so maybe I should give it another try, but right now, I'm not missing it. Maybe it's something for the board though.

RaNDoMxGeSTuReS
06-02-2011, 05:02 PM
This looks hilariously fun. I'm sleeving this up :) Will post feedback later.

TkDodo
06-08-2011, 09:00 AM
So, after some testing I did with the above list, I found out the following:

.) I really beat Merfolk, period. Have played a lot of matches, and I think I didn’t loose a single game.

.) I have a pretty good Matchup against blue based strategies. Team America is still tough, depending on if they are running bobs or stalkers. I feel like I have a lot more outs against bobs, since the removal package is better suited for smaller creatures. The more controlling the lists are, the crueler the matchups will be. Against Landstill or MUC, every match takes a very long time, and every mistake can be crucial. In one testing match I even won by manually grinding my opponent to death. Patience is key and it really depends on how well you and your opponent play.

.) Jace is just great. He won me a lot of matches where the board state was even, closed the deal when I was already ahead and even turned around some games I thought were completely lost.

.) I am having serious problems with >=cmc 3 creature-based strategies, especially Bant or the G/W only build. GSZ into Goyf and especially Knight of the Reliquary are tough for me to handle, since I can only counter them with FoW or remove them with Painter -> REB. Also, Thrun, the Last Troll is very annoying. The only things I can come up with are Meekstone from the SB, and occasionally GY-hate if they are also playing Terravore. Meekstone is great, especially against Team America, but since everybody is siding in Krosan Grip because of Painter anyway and Bant decks also have Pridemage, he is not a guaranteed removal. Maybe Basilisk Collar would solve the issue, but is it worth a maindeck or sb slot? As I am writing this, I realise that EE has somewhat disappointed me in this build, since with Misstep and Spell Snare, exploding @ 2 at best does not look that promising anymore. I don’t wanna fck up the mana base and add, say, an Underground Sea to EE@3. However, maybe that would be enough to play Perish in the board, which would kill all the creatures I mentioned.

Another idea I came up with is Phyrexian Metamorph in the board. I mainly used him against Emrakul and Progenitus, but it also works against Thrun. It further has nice synergy with Academy Ruins, and copying a Goyf or a KotR here and there sounded promising to me, at least on paper. And it pitches to Force (I love this argument).

For reference, here is my current board (Rack and Ruin is a pure metagame call, since we have a lot of MUD/Affinity here):


2 Rack and Ruin
2 Pyroblast
1 Pithing Needle
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Meekstone
3 Pyroclasm
3 Spell Pierce
1 Phyrexian Metamorph



So, I am really open to suggestions on how to improve the matchup against Bant and other “big” creature based strategies.

Thanks,
TkDodo

nayon
06-08-2011, 01:39 PM
I would play Welder and artifact lands so I can weld in combo pieces with standstill on the board, thus you can drop a welder and standstill, and just endstep-discard your pieces, then drop artifact lands and weld the combo in. or something like that.

TkDodo
06-10-2011, 08:15 AM
I would play Welder and artifact lands so I can weld in combo pieces with standstill on the board, thus you can drop a welder and standstill, and just endstep-discard your pieces, then drop artifact lands and weld the combo in. or something like that.

As interesting as this may sound, it doesn't solve any of the addressed problems. If I have a Standstill out, I am in a winning position already. The opponent will have to break the Standstill if I have a Welder in play anyway. Also, if you suggest to add 4-8 cards to a decklist, could you please also suggest what you would take out? Thanks.

Don't get me wrong, Welder is really strong - just not in a list with just 4 Painters and 3 other artifacts (and also, without any other way to get artifacts into the yard, like Intuition, LED or Transmute Artifact - if I wanted that, I would just play straight forward PaintedStone).

TkDodo

TkDodo
06-19-2011, 03:10 PM
I went to a local tournament today (Sunday Legacy in Spielraum, Vienna; 17 people).
I did ok, as I came in 7th (3-2), although I expected more when I was 3-1 and was paired against the only person who was 4-0, for the last round of the day, because he was on Merfolk.

The day before the tournament, I decided that I had to change something in the list. I kept loosing to Bant and similar strategies, and I wanted to be able to handle cmc 3 and 4 spells on a more regular basis. I didn’t know what to change though, until about an hour or so before the tournament, where I suddenly thought that playing [cards]Counterspell[\cards] might be a good idea. I loved it, so I took out 1 Mental Misstep and 1 Lightning Bolt for 2 Counterspell. The change turned out to work pretty well, although completely untested before today.

R1: MonoB-sacrifice-a-creature-deck (2-0)
A kid with a mono-B deck without interaction (and without a sideboard). I went for an easy combo kill both games.

R2: Belcher (2-1)
This should be a relatively easy matchup for control. I mull G1 and keep a hand on the play with only two Spell Snares, which is probably pretty bad. I can counter Manamorphose, but that’s about it. He goes off the following turn, playing Belcher and Spoils of the Vault for LED. Games 2 and 3 I find more disruption, since I also get Spell Pierces from the board. I beatdown G2 and combo win G3, having multiple Missteps and FoW and REB both games.

R3: Dredge (2-0)
I get Lavamancer out G1 very early. He had a very bad hand after I countered his Cabal Therapy on himself, so he had to slow-dredge. He takes some pain from City of Brass, and I grindstone myself to feed the Mancer, which eventually made enough damage to kill him.
G2 I found a Mancer again, and my GY-hate. He wanted to endstep-discard, but had to misstep some of my plays, so it took him some time to get the first dredger in the yard. I had Relic active and him on a 3 turn clock, which caused him to concede.

R4: Metalworker (1-2)
G1 I get overrun by Grim Monolith with Voltaic Key into Steel Hellkite and Platinum Emperion.
G2 I play Grindstone T1 and Painter T2. He wastes my Mishra and finds two more Wastelands and a Rishadan Port to deny me the 3 mana I need to go off. I fail to find a third land, so I beat him with Painter and eventually another Mishra, which is enough because he took some damage because of Ancient Tomb. Really sick round.
G3 I counter some of his Threats and Rack and Ruin two Artifacts. He has 1 card left in hand, 4 mana and a Voltaic Key out. I play Jace and fateseal him, seeing Thran Dynamo. Not wanting him to reach enough mana to play whatever he has left, I put it on bottom. He draws another Thran Dynamo, which brings enough mana to play All is Dust to kill Jace. He topdecks Steel Hellkite ftw.

R5: Merfolk (0-2)
I have never lost a single game to Merfolk so far, so I felt pretty comfortable. I had a decent shot at winning the Tournament if I went 4-1, because I had good tiebreakers.
He mulls G1 and resolves an early Vial. I find EE to kill the Vial, but get beaten by a Silvergil and a Lord. Lavamancer gets Missteped and every thing else I tried gets countered as well. Mishra got wasted, so that was G1.
G2 I mull to 6, seeing 5 lands and a Brainstorm. I keep, shuffle some lands away and find EE, Lightning Bolt and Mancer. He has a Cursecatcher and a Reejerey out. Bolt meets MM, Mancer meets BEB, EE resolves but doesn’t do much. I draw 2 Jace and 3 Spell Snare, which it not enough to stop him from beating me to death.

Pretty unfortunate ending I guess, since this deck is especially designed to beat the omnipresent fish. He admitted that he had a pretty nutty draw G2 (and he topdecked the BEB to kill Mancer), and I guess that’s what it takes for Merfolk to beat Lavamancer, Bolts, REB and Sweepers.

However, I have not lost faith in this build. Apart from drawing 3 lands off a Standstill and a sick manascrew for like 10 rounds in R4, G2 the deck played pretty smoothly. The two Counterspell are a good addition I guess, although it weakens the Merfolk matchup a little bit, given what I’ve taken out for them.

I will play the deck again on a tournament next Wednesday.