Beginning WW on a budget - staples and deck plans?

[Snapback]

I'm looking to expand into Legacy after having played at FNM for 3 or 4 months, drafting and playing Standard. The various threads on this site have been very helpful in understanding Legacy decks. I want to start with a simple mono-White deck, get comfortable with it, and then expand as much as my time and budget allow. It seems like White is currently played in either UW Blade decks or Maverick, so I'd probably expand to one of those eventually.

The White staples seem to be:
4x Stoneforge Mystic
1x Batterskull
4x Mother of Runes
4x Swords to Plowshares

Q1: Am I right that these are the staples of White? What else can be considered a staple?

Q2: What should I build around these cards for a reasonable deck, under $200?

Obviously, one could add strong generic cards like Figure of Destiny. I'm not opposed to that, but I prefer to also have synergy if it's reasonable. Here are some ideas I like:

Plan A. Quest for the Holy Relic:

4x Quest for the Holy Relic
1x Argentum Armor
1x Sword of Feast and Famine
4x Squadron Hawk
4x Memnite
4x Ornithopter
4x Glint Hawk
3x Puresteel Paladin
2x Etched Champion
4x Ancient Den

The idea would be to get fast Quest counters with :0: CMC creatures and Glint Hawk bounce. A turn-3 equip and swing should lock down the game, especially if I'm destroying permanents with Argentum Armor, or getting a relevant color protection with a Sword. Of course, Batterskull or even a Jitte could be found. Additionally, when all the good :0: CMC creatures are artifacts, it seems a waste not to also play with metalcraft, so Puresteel Paladin and Etched Champion made it onto the list, too. That could be expanded with Dispatch and/or Indomitable Archangel.

Plan B. Lifegain:

4x Ajani's Pridemate
4x Serra Ascendant
4x Soul Warden
4x Soul's Attendant
4x Martyr of Sands
3x Ranger of Eos
4x Squadron Hawk

The idea here is to gain life and then use the Ascendant or Pridemate to "cash it in" with a huge creature. I've seen this work in Modern decks, especially against Zoo. My concern is whether this strategy is too slow for Legacy.

Q3: Are these reasonable ideas? How competitive could they be?

Finally, two other questions:

Q4: What other mono-white decklist or strategy might you recommend?

Q5: In general, how can I add more disruption to a White deck? (Besides adding blue, of course!)

Thanks for reading~

[4eak]

I have a WW Budget deck here (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?20587-Budget-Decks-My-Attempts).



// Lands - 21
21 Plains

// SFM Package - 7
4 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull (considerably better in Legacy than many people realize)
1 Sword of Body and Mind (a budget option, acceptably powered, decent pro's)

// Raw Beatdown - 8
4 Serra Avenger
4 Mirran Crusader (even moreso than Avenger, very bomby wth equipment)

// Control and Taxes - 16
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Leonin Relic-Warder
4 Mangara of Corondor

// Anti-Control and Tempo - 8
4 AEther Vial
4 Mother of Runes

// Sideboard
SB: 4 Mana Tithe
SB: 4 Enlightened Tutor
SB: 1 Oblivion Ring
SB: 1 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 Ensnaring Bridge
SB: 1 Serenity
SB: 1 Tormod's Crypt
SB: 1 Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 Wheel of Sun and Moon
White weenie can't be just plain beatdown. Of the many WW variants I've played, this is the best budget version I found; this is a budget variant of Death & Taxes. It lacks mana-denial elements in Wasteland and Port, and the power of Karakas. Until you go for the mana-denial package, Path to Exile is a reasonable card, btw. I think cards like Flickerwisp are more powerful than they seem on paper, but don't bring enough to the table in this deck. I don't like Jotun Grunt either. Jitte and Batterskull are the best equipment in the game; SoB&M isn't amazing, and I'd much prefer Fire & Ice or Light & Shadow.

Death and Taxes is the only decent WW deck in Legacy. It really desperately needs Wasteland and Rishadan Port to be effective.

I think WW is not the best use of your time or money in Legacy. I highly suggest UR Delver (again, you can find the deck at the above link). I think that deck is pretty spectacular for the price. You pickup some staples which will transfer to other decks as well. It isn't too easy to play, so you'll pickup some good experience and learn a lot with the deck. Try it out.



peace,
4eak

[Finn]

Budget WW/D+T should definitely have

Squadron Hawk
Stoneforge Mystic + weapons
Phyrexian Revoker
Mother of Runes

From there, I can't say for sure.

[Snapback]

I have a WW Budget deck here (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?20587-Budget-Decks-My-Attempts).



Death and Taxes is the only decent WW deck in Legacy. It really desperately needs Wasteland and Rishadan Port to be effective.

I think WW is not the best use of your time or money in Legacy. I highly suggest UR Delver (again, you can find the deck at the above link). I think that deck is pretty spectacular for the price. You pickup some staples which will transfer to other decks as well. It isn't too easy to play, so you'll pickup some good experience and learn a lot with the deck. Try it out.



peace,
4eak

Thanks for responding! I actually play UR Delver in standard right now. I had shied away from that in legacy partly because of the "entry fee" of duals and fetches. I see your list substitutes Steam Vents, which makes it more manageable, but still somewhat daunting.


Finn

Budget WW/D+T should definitely have

Squadron Hawk
Stoneforge Mystic + weapons
Phyrexian Revoker
Mother of Runes

From there, I can't say for sure.

Phyrexian Revoker seems so bad to me, coming from standard. What makes it strong in legacy?

[4eak]

Thanks for responding! I actually play UR Delver in standard right now. I had shied away from that in legacy partly because of the "entry fee" of duals and fetches. I see your list substitutes Steam Vents, which makes it more manageable, but still somewhat daunting.

While I absolutely love playing Death & Taxes, I recognize that it isn't as good as UR Delver, both in terms of raw viability and in terms of price efficiency. For the price of just the Wastelands and Ports (not including any other cards), which are absolutely necessary for Death and Taxes to be even remotely tier 2, you can buy UR Delver, and you pickup a tier 1 deck instead. Even without buying Ports/Wasteland, there is only a nominal difference in price (assuming you aren't including Karakas) between the rest of D&T's cards and UR Delver. Death & Taxes, when completed, is actually a far more expensive deck.


Phyrexian Revoker seems so bad to me, coming from standard. What makes it strong in legacy?

Revoker answers many problematic permanents which D&T can't easily deal with otherwise. Almost all decks have a non-land activated ability, usually several. Revoker is a solid tax against most decks, and it can be back-breaking to others. Revoker will be better against some decks than others, it depends on what they've got. Planewalkers are common choices, as are sweepers like Pernicious Deed, and many more. I'm not going to take the time to name that much because there are simply too many to name.

You should proxy and playtest these decks out and at least the DTB forum before you buy anything (I'd spend time playing proxied versions of most of the Established forum as well). Spend time learning the format before you drop money on it.



peace,
4eak

[wert]

Phyrexian Revoker seems so bad to me, coming from standard. What makes it strong in legacy?
Phyrexian Revoker is multi-problem solver, it is invaluable to "solving" all sort of issues, from creatures to enchantments to lands to planewalkers. It is a one-size-fits-all, how can it be terrible? What is there not to like?

[Basara]

play Mono R , 80 o 90 bucks , you have game against the "top decks" of the moment like Rug delver and u/w blade you can . crush zoo , crush goblins , crush merfok..crush u/r delver , crush maverick ,, crush lots of non-combo decks

[(nameless one)]

play Mono R , 80 o 90 bucks , you have game against the "top decks" of the moment like Rug delver and u/w blade you can . crush zoo , crush goblins , crush merfok..crush u/r delver , crush maverick ,, crush lots of non-combo decks

Actually, Burn decks can have those moments when Ad Nauseum decks have their pants down.

[sillyandrew]

that quest deck would be really cheap to build, and might hold some promise. it won't be as good as a more straight forward deck, but things like signal pest and batterskull would help that.

with most white weenies, and most aggro lists in general, you might want to run path to exile over swords to plowshares because enemy lifegain slows you down.

white also has access to a pretty good chunk of hatebears, so you might want to look into them as well.


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-4eak