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sillyandrew
04-11-2012, 05:54 PM
i've been playing this deck for a quite a while now, with pretty regular success. lists similar to this have showed up on the boros deck wins thread, and in the old R/W vial hatebears thread, but as far as i can see, no dedicated thread exists, and i've piloted the deck enough now to feel confident in writing up an intro.

first, the list:

4 mother of runes
4 stoneforge mystic
4 goblin guide
3 grim lavamancer
4 keldon marauders
1 duergar hedge-mage
1 isamaru, hound of konda

1 batterskull
1 umezawa's jitte
1 basilisk collar

2 sensei's divining top

4 lightning bolt
4 path to exile
4 lightning helix

4 plateau
5 plains
5 mountain
4 arid mesa
2 marsh flats
2 scalding tarn


card choices:
mother of runes, stoneforge mystic, goblin guide, and grim lavamancer are pretty clearly the core creatures of the deck, and just about everyone should be run as a four-of. not a whole lot of explanation here.

lightning bolt, path to exile, lightning helix are all pretty self explanatory too. PtE > StP because this deck has the ability to be stupid fast, and StP hurts that gameplan.

keldon marauders is a flex spot, as far as i'm concerned. sometimes five damage and a blocker for 1R is way too good, but he's a dead card/hiccup for some match-ups. i've run 2 price of progress and 2 fireblast in his place on many occasion.

isamaru, hound of konda is a pet card of mind (pun!) and he's the first jank to cut when you make changes to the deck, and usually gets sided out. sometimes though, five goblin guides is pretty good.

duergar hedge-mage can be pretty god-like, being a pretty consistant 2-for-1 that gets past spell snare. usually, i run one in the maindeck, and two in the board, but i could see another one mained.

the stoneforge package is pretty typical, aside from the basilisk collar which is game-breaking in some match-ups when you slap it on a lavamancer. admittedly, it gets sided out a lot, but it wrecks in the games that it doesn't.

sensei's diving top is a card i've thought about cutting on multiple occasions, but it does way to much work to really ignore. i think it's a pretty solid 2-of, as you really don't want to see multiple copies at all, and the deck still runs pretty smoothly never seeing it.

the mana base: is really simple at the moment, and while wasteland seems like an obvious fit, i was never really convinced at it's performance, although i admit the is room for 2-4 non-basics in a list like this that runs 22 lands.

the sideboard: the sideboard i've been running lately is very much a meta-game call, but i think a R/W sideboard is pretty easy to construct. pyroblasts do work all day,tariff catches just about everyone off guard, jotun grunt shrinks goyfs and knights, and so on...

looking through my sideboard at the moment, the last thing i ran was:

2 duergar hedge-mage
3 jotun grunt
4 pyroblast
4 tariff
3 mindbreak trap

so, like i said, total meta-game call.

match-ups: this section is going to start out really short, but i'm sure i'll end up adding to it as times goes on.

aggro: i've beaten G/W maverick on many occasions, and honestly, more times than not. so long as you can keep knights in check, it really shouldn't be too hard, because maverick hates seeing red. i'd consider this match-up somewhere in the 60/40 range in our favor, although if they opponent is prepared, it can still be really hard.

so long as you can deal with lackey, goblins isn't usually an issue, because our creatures are usually just as big, if not bigger, and jittie wreck all sorts of aggo all day long.

zoo is a race, it's a matter of who gets their first, and if you're batterskull/collar can gain you enough life to take it into the midgame.

control: U/W stoneblade is easily the problem match-up here, but it's not unbeatable. early guides/isamaru are the key hear, as you can usually control their resolved threats with removal. geist is a huge pain, but tariff and pyroblast help post-board. the esper version may require sulfur elementals in the board to win, even if it's counter-productive with mom/stoneforge.

combo: thankfully, my meta is pretty devoid of combo, but like most aggro decks, it's a pretty abysmal game one. game two, you bring in your myriad of combo hate and try and get there. nothing new here.

Rock Lee
04-11-2012, 06:27 PM
The crazy thing is that Vexing Devil (http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=129943&stc=1&d=1334142624) might make janky decks like this good.

Obviously you would drop the janky randoms and pick up light & Shadow.

Kich867
04-11-2012, 07:53 PM
Vexing Devil replacing Keldon Marauder is going to be fantastic.

Greenpoe
04-12-2012, 12:29 AM
Goblin Guide is not a midrange card. If you want efficient beaters, Drooling Ogre is decent.

sillyandrew
04-12-2012, 03:05 AM
The crazy thing is that Vexing Devil (http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=129943&stc=1&d=1334142624) might make janky decks like this good.

Obviously you would drop the janky randoms and pick up light & Shadow.

awesome! i appreciate your positive criticism! which janky randoms should i obviously drop?

Kich867
04-12-2012, 11:11 AM
I don't believe I've ever asked you but, have you ever thought of running creatures like:

Countryside Crusher
Mirran Crusader

Vexing Devil is going to be pretty nuts. Though I'm wondering if dropping Keldon Marauders would be the right choice. I know first hand that Hedgemage is too clutch to drop and way too useful.

I think people would overlook that card as a janky singleton, but it's a maindeck answer to a lot of shit and carries a jitte. Too much value for it's casting cost, I'll gladly pay 1 more mana for a 2/2 body to put on my Disenchant.

Keldon Marauders in your deck, unlike burn, are pretty ideal. They'll always deal at least 2 damage, often times 5 since you can clear their blockers pretty easily, or they chump / provide an extra turn to stabilize pretty often.

Isamaru I think should go, Collar can go, and 1 Marauder could go for 3x Vexing Devil. This would up your threats by a lot, and seeing 1-2 vexing devils in the first few turns of the game really piles on the pressure.

sillyandrew
04-12-2012, 12:28 PM
I don't believe I've ever asked you but, have you ever thought of running creatures like:

Countryside Crusher
Mirran Crusader

Vexing Devil is going to be pretty nuts. Though I'm wondering if dropping Keldon Marauders would be the right choice. I know first hand that Hedgemage is too clutch to drop and way too useful.

I think people would overlook that card as a janky singleton, but it's a maindeck answer to a lot of shit and carries a jitte. Too much value for it's casting cost, I'll gladly pay 1 more mana for a 2/2 body to put on my Disenchant.

Keldon Marauders in your deck, unlike burn, are pretty ideal. They'll always deal at least 2 damage, often times 5 since you can clear their blockers pretty easily, or they chump / provide an extra turn to stabilize pretty often.

Isamaru I think should go, Collar can go, and 1 Marauder could go for 3x Vexing Devil. This would up your threats by a lot, and seeing 1-2 vexing devils in the first few turns of the game really piles on the pressure.

first, i think vexing devil should really be a four-of in this deck, and if they weren't sold out everywhere i looked, i would have already pre-ordered four of them. and, i agree that while keldon is a pretty flex spot, i don't think dropping them to make room is the answer. isamaru goes, collar goes, you're right, mostly because those are the first two cards to get sided out in most matchups. maybe at that point, since the deck will have pretty much all the redundancy it could, the tops go too? the hedge-mage certainly stays, even though the tops make him less clutch.

i think that answer here may be: +4 vexing devil, -2 top, -1 isamaru, -1 collar or +4 vexing devil, +2 fireblast/price of progress, -2 marauder, -1 isamaru, -1 collar, or at least something along these lines.

mirran crusader is a card i've thought of, but never felt good enough to play-test. it'd be nice to have a big(ger) creature to act as a sort of finisher, but if that's the case, i think i'd opt for something outside of bolt range, or something with a little evasion (since the deck clearly lacks that - not that pro G/B isn't evasion itself).

i'm not really sure what countryside crusher would do. i think he'd just end up a 3/3 or 4/4 body, since by the time he really comes around (turn two i'm dropping sfm, or holding back to burn/path something out, and turn three or four, i'd much rather flash in batterskull) it might be too late, at least to get him rolling. the 3/3 body is nice, but i'd rather have a marauder stick around for a turn and a half and deal damage when he's removed, than the crusher just get bolted or something. maybe just his presence would be a big enough threat? i think i'd also rather drop a land before i attempt to incorporate a game-plan like that. i'm not sure. he's something i've never really given thought to.

maybe this?

4 goblin guide
4 vexing devil
4 keldon marauders

4 mother of runes
4 stoneforge mystic

3 grim lavamancer
2 duergar hedge-mage

4 lightning bolt
4 lightning helix
4 path to exile

4 arid mesa
2 scalding tarn
2 marsh flats
5 mountain
4 plains
4 plateau

i feel like it loses a little bit (or, a lot) of the utility/versatility, and opts for a faster gameplan while still relying on white to bring the deck into the midgame and win.